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/liberty/ - Liberty

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Ya'll need Mises.

File: ff0f470f7563727⋯.png (250.44 KB,600x600,1:1,d05.png)

 No.99009 [Open thread]

So I finally got my first job in California and now I honestly have a obligation to vote for someone without a D after their name, Long story short I pay close to FIVE HUNDERD DOLLARS a month in taxes for no good reason. Where does my money go? And for who? Why are THEY or the GOVERNMENT entitled to my hard earned money. I work in a factory mind you, before this I actually voted for the Green Party… Not making any o this up, has coming out of my NEET habits and growing up really made me understand what is what in this world. Any place I can start with ebil gapitalism?

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 No.99012

Don't vote

Move away and don't bring any Californian practices with you.

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 No.99022

File: f2c532188445b87⋯.png (3.18 MB,1920x1081,1920:1081,61c485c2f437c79c4fd8b51914….png)

>>99009

It's made you understand that being left to your own devices, you'll invest your money where you need it, or malinvest and suffer the consequences. The next step is realizing that even the most retarded members of the population are capable of learning that you must invest your money wisely. A mentally handicapped man will understand "if I spend my money on a candy bar, I can't ride the bus home, and I'd have to walk five miles in the snow" so it's not a leap to suggest they realize hardship and come out more careful with their money in other areas (or hire a poor man's accountant/family member to do it for them). The age/advent of 3D printing and other technologies means even a cripple can have a plastic arm to perform simple tasks for about $100-$500 depending on how much functionality they want.

>>99012

You should bully anon for using normalfaggot memes, not for realizing he was indoctrinated.

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 No.99028

>>99022

>>99012

California is a shithole, sadily. Meanwhile the immigrants get their checks slipped to them by the supervisior :(

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 No.99592

>>99028

Report him to ICE.

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 No.99672

>>99009

>He thinks the Republicans are any better

>He thinks voting can solve the problem

Either be poor and avoid the taxes, or become rich in spite of them and then pay lobbyists to fight them.

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File: 0dd1179c4900199⋯.jpg (40.44 KB,444x444,1:1,Karl-Marx1-d9076c70d7110a8….jpg)

 No.99220 [Open thread]

Capitalism is a Marxist strawman that was designed for failure and you guys gobbles it up. Marx coined the term Capitalism and gave it his own definition which was a strawman. Everyone just believed that the opposite to Marx's system was the strawman definition he gave. Numerous schools and politicians have gone on defending a Marxist strawman. Marx created division and a false dichotomy that you must choose one of two radicals. Marx was evil

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 No.99222

In the us, capitalism just means free market economics, regardless of the spurious origins of the term.

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 No.99266

>>99220

>Marx coined the term Capitalism

When will this meme end?

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 No.99268

>>99266

It was coined by proto-Marxist socialists, however. Regardless, it's been pretty successfully coopted as a denotative term for free enterprise, rather than the pejorative it was originally. I still do my best to avoid using it on principle, however.

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 No.99542

>>99268

https://www.etymonline.com/word/capitalism#etymonline_v_27665

>1854, "condition of having capital"

Note that this is 18 yeasrs before:

>Meaning "political/economic system which encourages capitalists" is recorded from 1872, originally used disparagingly by socialists.

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 No.99665

File: 41b5ac5d7cfe8ba⋯.jpg (523.06 KB,1672x1196,418:299,imgID134154083.jpg.gallery.jpg)

>>99220

Doesnt matter, marxism is a dead ideology anyway. And any "marxist" you see today are simply critical theory zombies wearing the corpse of marxism over themselves for LARP purposes

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File: 6582f7133eae5f3⋯.jpg (330.35 KB,1200x1003,1200:1003,1547158206994.jpg)

 No.99560 [Open thread]

Is there any book, tesis, article computational analysis, whatever aside from marxian theory that understands capitalism not from a moral point of view, but from a deterministic pov, as in the current state of things isn't the result of some ideological or social manipulation scheme but rather that, capitalism is the only way to actually organize a society? Below I share a video I watched the other that got me thinking about the possibility of perhaps capitalism, or rather markets, being the common rule of law today due to the fact that a more elaborated system like communism wouldn't be able to compete.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOFws_hhZs8

>In artificial intelligence, an evolutionary algorithm (EA) is a subset of evolutionary computation, a generic population-based metaheuristic optimization algorithm. An EA uses mechanisms inspired by biological evolution, such as reproduction, mutation, recombination, and selection. Candidate solutions to the optimization problem play the role of individuals in a population, and the fitness function determines the quality of the solutions (see also loss function). Evolution of the population then takes place after the repeated application of the above operators.

>Step One: Generate the initial population of individuals randomly. (First generation)

>Step Two: Evaluate the fitness of each individual in that population (time limit, sufficient fitness achieved, etc.)

>Step Three: Repeat the following regenerational steps until termination:

>Select the best-fit individuals for reproduction. (Parents)

>Breed new individuals through crossover and mutation operations to give birth to offspring.

>Evaluate the individual fitness of new individuals.

>Replace least-fit population with new individuals.

also don't post boomer shit like USSR propaganda because it was doome due to geolpolitics and so on. I am taPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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 No.99570

>>99560

you can apply evolution theory to it

you try different things and the fittest socioeconomic system survives

however breaking nap is ok in nature

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 No.99574

>>99570

>however breaking nap is ok in nature

That's actually not true, though it wouldn't matter if it was. In nature when a creature fights another creatures, the attacker risks injury. Retaliation is inevitable except in the case of creatures which are either so fragile or so cowardly (for lack of a better term) that they can't or won't fight.

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 No.99576

The closest I can think of is Rothbard's article on Chaos Theory.

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 No.99601

>>99574

male lions kill offspring of female lion to make female lion be able to get pregnant sooner

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 No.99605

File: 6f3c304b3603c7a⋯.jpg (1.31 MB,3150x4085,630:817,kobayashi13.jpg)

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File: 63266c922237a6f⋯.jpg (126.49 KB,786x855,262:285,Snip20190207_1.jpg)

File: d6496340948d3ff⋯.png (1.47 MB,1200x891,400:297,Dx16ndTVYAAILhk.png)

File: 1273cdb513d2acb⋯.jpg (132.68 KB,1024x615,1024:615,article-2092529-117A790C00….jpg)

 No.99565 [Open thread]

http://newslanc.com/where-descendants-of-former-soviet-rulers-went-to-live/

Does /liberty/ have more great examples of rich commie kids, living the good life, enjoying their parents hard-stolen wealth, or otherwise moving as far away as possible from the socialist utopia their parents created for everyone else?

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 No.99577

Lol, all modern Russia

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 No.99582

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 No.99583

Isn't that what Marx himself was?

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 No.99585

>>99583

No because Marx never lived under a communist system. He did scam Engels out of money since his father was a factory owner.

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 No.99590

>>99583

that was wngels

>>99566

she a liberal

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File: a1d63b0103ef224⋯.png (228.9 KB,580x570,58:57,values-map.png)

 No.97154 [Open thread]

is the west really going to fall? what will it mean?

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 No.99402

>>97182

Do you have anime?

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 No.99412

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 No.99433

What imagen of "the fall of the west" do you have in your head? all europeans die?

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 No.99527

>>99433

the west being outcompeted by less cucked civilizations e.g. chinks

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 No.99586

>>99527

Won't be the first time western civilization isn't at the forefront. Maybe the world will be better off for it anywya.

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File: 445ec4ac1a93dd8⋯.mp4 (813.25 KB,1280x720,16:9,Glory_to_Imam_Felix.mp4)

 No.99381 [Open thread]

In case you haven't heard yet, some /pol/ack in New Zealand decided to go full Siege and shoot up a mosque, making a post to 8chan shortly before the event, and making a few references to the site in his livestream. There's a non-zero chance that 8chan wil get Zucced as a result of this. On the off-chance that happens, it may be in our interest to designate some other imageboard as a "bunker" in which we may congregate should this place go down. Any initial candidates? Livebunker.rocks is the only one of which I know, but it's more chatroom than true imageboard.

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 No.99410

File: 826f38784626d27⋯.jpg (1.57 MB,3357x2350,3357:2350,e248c158588c57ac85ad11a2ab….jpg)

https://meguca.org/nya/

Get in here, nya~!

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 No.99494

Is there an option to create a board? Or do you need to contact an admin?

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 No.99517

>>99406

I want an imageboard webring.

I'll start:

Endchan

https://endchan.xyz/

s6424n4x4bsmqs27.onion

Sushigirl

https://sushigirl.us/

Meguca

https://meguca.org

Wizchan

https://wizchan.org/

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 No.99524

>>99517

>>99406

>an imageboard webring.

I hope the time for giant imageboards like 8gag for 4cuck will be over. I want it to be like the olden days again where various niche imageboards dangled dicks together and shared users.

It's also easier to protect yourself from cianiggers that way.

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 No.99581

>>99383

fuck you. i never knew my headphones could be so loud

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File: 69c1ff63679ead9⋯.jpg (63.73 KB,220x316,55:79,Intimefairuse.jpg)

 No.98665 [Open thread]

This movie (In time, 2011) supposedly should be anti-capitalism, but it ends up being a pro-capitalism movie when read using economics as a framework.

The premises are that people are engineered to never get old, but they have a timer and when the timer expires they die. So, they use time as money since they can exchange it with other people. From the movie it's implied that there is an unlimited amount of time available, in theory, and the scarcity is artificial and probably created by the government. Yet, this is an anti-capitalism movie. You see where this is going?

But even if time was a scarce resource, why the hell would someone use time as currency? It doesn't make sense because when you have to pay your last two hours for a bus fare, the price is automatically too high and not worth it. We know that the currency isn't necessarely valuable because of its possible applications, but it's mostly a system to represent value and exchange it with other people. So, stability in currency is something seeked and time is certainly not stable as currency since its value change greatly base on how much you have of it. Nobody would really use time as currency, certainly not to the point of risking their life. Other things would be used as money, unless of course it wasn't the government to force people to use time as a currency, which is something that is happening in the society depicted. Forcing people to use a certain thing as currency is not capitalism.

Then we have the prices for goods that soar and the rich girl telling the protagonist something along the lines of "we do up the price so that people die". It seems that we have a central planning board choosing prices, which is absolutely not capitalism and not free market. I won't even discuss it firther here since this is literally chapter fucking one of basic economics of Sowell.

Then there is the problem of "if everyone had infinite time we would die of overpopulation". No, we wouldn't. If property rights were used, people would just not create new humans because it would be too expensive to mantain them. Also, there would be privatized incentives to get sterilized or at least have your fertility put on hold. Truth is, we already live in a situation where nothing is stoPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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 No.98718

>>98666

I can't spend all day watching lectures about liberty and history. I could, but it would be weird.

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 No.98750

>>98718

read book then

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 No.99547

File: 1cb31bde293ee08⋯.png (5.24 KB,116x116,1:1,download (4).png)

>>98665

In time does not represent a Capitalist dystopia but rather the Keynesian Dystopia of Central Banking in todays society.

If you relate time earned with money printing, inflation, and rising intrest rates then its quite easy to see what the movie was really all about.

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 No.99551

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>2011

They stole this idea from David Firth

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 No.99553

>>98666

Those who already made it big don't want things to become cheaper, since that would enable competition. They can already afford it and don't want anyone else to be able to.

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Invidious embed. Click thumbnail to play.

 No.99192 [Open thread]

What do you do to distract yourself from the fact that every year the economic control of the State is going to get worse, that the younger demographic is very socialistic, the threat of the default of the entire financial system, and the threat of nuclear war and/or other apocalyptic events that always loom on the horizon?

I watch shitty Japanese cartoons, play videogames from the mid-90s, and then remember I'm just distracting myself as I listen to vaporwave in a depressive stupor.

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 No.99304

>>99192

I don't know what to tell you, OP. I basically feel the same way, except I want to at least profit off the industries that are abused the most in order to travel the world before the collapse. I can't because of Nepotism and cash limitations though.

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 No.99305

>>99275

Some of us are already dead. Not everyone is "holding back" and can "live a little" with any effects.

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 No.99311

>>99305

If you're truly dead, go get a credit card from the bank and make an impromptu trip to Tijuana. Blow it all on cocaine and hookers.

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 No.99317

File: 253ff47ea5d46c6⋯.jpg (13.42 KB,217x255,217:255,6ee4404368f0cf6dadd639563b….jpg)

>>99311

First time i've seen a good suggestion from a christian tbh. Well done.

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 No.99525

>>99311

>Not everyone is "holding back"

<Okay so just really get crazy

Was my post really so incomprehensible or are you illiterate?

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File: 56efa2082d01f95⋯.jpg (45.9 KB,542x535,542:535,spook_buster.jpg)

File: e7a2136d5c958e8⋯.png (117.83 KB,960x390,32:13,ancap_virginstatist.png)

 No.99234 [Open thread][Last50 Posts]

Over time, after becoming anarcho-capitalist, I've began to realize that Max Stirner is right. I started out as a deontological anarcho-capitalist, but over time, I realized that morals are spooks. I realized many truths along the way.

1) Being deontological is an oxymoron. One of the most famous deontologists is Kant and Kantian Ethics defines rules as what would be most beneficial if everybody followed them. What's that? Rules are only good if people benefit from the consequences? Wow, it looks like you are actually a RULE CONSEQUENTIALIST. Anyone who is truly deontological for truly "moral" reasons is entirely devoid of logic and instead creates morals purely out of "feels." It's a petty disagreement, but an important note to make.

2) Deontology leads to ridiculous conclusions. According to deontology, morality is objective. What if I were to trespass on another's property in order to save someone's life? Would I be wrong to save someone's life? Would the owner be wrong to defend their property? Are we both right? Are we both wrong? Us being both right implies this is a moral grey-zone, meaning morals are not objective.

3) Traditional consequentialism is retarded. No-one can know the true consequences of their own actions for certain. Consequentialism is just gambling with ethics thrown in. Consequentialism sounds good on paper, but the consequences of this philosophy is collectivism. That one can be sacrificed for the good of the many. It fails by its own principles.

4) Morals are spooks. Moral rules are implemented in the form of laws with the purpose of stability and because they are most beneficial to each individual. Personal morals are simply pleasing your own "ego;" your desire to feel good about yourself. For example, to an anarcho-communist, no-one can own property and they do nothing wrong by robbing others of their property. From their perspective, property rights is the aggression. The problem with communists is that a communist society is not beneficial to the individual, as force is used to steal and because communist societies inevitably collapse under authoritarianism and mass-starvation.

5) Being an egoist does not mean you don't believe in human rights. It's just that human rights are derived practically instead of "morally." Any intelligent egoist can recognize, thatPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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 No.99378

>>99377

>I-I I totally don't care at all you guize!

I do care about this board, but not enough to put more effort in it that shitposting, especially when it comes to discussing these questions with your type of people.

>You nigger.

Pots shouldn't call kettles niggers. By your words. Lack of cultism is not a cult.

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 No.99379

File: 25b850de17a780c⋯.jpg (51.51 KB,600x800,3:4,25b850de17a780c2978309de8d….jpg)

>>99378

pic i guess

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 No.99380

File: cfce20937aee960⋯.png (170.89 KB,668x1405,668:1405,1537583395525.png)

>>99377

though you did remind me about one thing - during such discussions regarding different ideas it's a lot harder to not think in morals because the whole topic is what we wish things to be, so judging them comes from one's very own perspective and worldview. I couldn't denote your position as faulty without making what basically is a moral judgement, something that's not that hard to remove from your position during observation. I guess i got carried away, as making the type of argument i should have would just repeat what i already had said before. Weird. I guess i'll have to think about that later.

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 No.99395

>>99296

Note that I never stated nor implied that people are any better at determining what's best for anyone else than they are at determining what's best for themselves (in fact, they're demonstrably much worse at it). My point was that "doing what's best for yourself at all costs" almost always defaults to "doing what's worse for everyone else at all costs," even when it results in even you getting fucked over in the end. Egoists are the kind of people who always defect in the prisoner's dilemma, even with infinite iterations.

>>99299

It's possible to acknowledge solipsism and whatever other implications to Egoism without actually adopting the mindset. It's basically the same as acknowledging that it's highly unlikely that free will actually exists, and yet understanding that it's better to believe in the fiction that you're in control of your life than to give up your agency and merely let things happen to you (not that you really have control over whether you believe in free will or not, anyway).

Or for another example, take Yoda's wisdom: "do or do not, there is no try." On the face of it, it doesn't actually make sense: of course it's possible to try and fail. But if you go to perform a task for which your statistical chance of success is 80%, and you resolve to try to complete that task but accept that there's a 20% chance of failure, then what you actually get is 80% of an 80% success rate. It's only when you absolutely won't take no for an answer and will do whatever is necessary and still fail that you know that you gave it a proper try. It's actually kind of magical when you see someone give up on something partway through and declare that they simply can't do it and you chew them out until they go back and do it and realize how much more they're capable of than they ever thought possible. I'm not advocating ignorance, I'm merely suggesting that due to the human condition there are reasons why it may be beneficial to act as if things are different than they are.

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 No.99405

File: 323afd0f26488bb⋯.jpeg (6.45 KB,255x191,255:191,0f6cadbeacfdc19daebc84c3f….jpeg)

>>99395

>My point was that "doing what's best for yourself at all costs" almost always defaults to "doing what's worse for everyone else at all costs," even when it results in even you getting fucked over in the end

Kind of an empty assumption of a point.

>Egoists are the kind of people who always defect in the prisoner's dilemma, even with infinite iterations.

If you actually studied prisoner's dilemma you'd know that from perspective of game theory all participants in it are already complete, absolute egoists. Here's an example - you walk into a shop where you can buy or steal something, while the shopkeeper can refuse to offer you an item. The item is valuable to you. If you steal the item you get it for free but cannot use the shop now, while if you buy it you can do it later. From that it's a slightly modified prisoner's dilemma, as well as an example of an RL event that proves you wrong.

(Shop/you) Steal Pay

Offer -1/2 1/1

Refuse 0/0 0/0

>it's better to believe in the fiction that you're in control of your life than to give up your agency and merely let things happen to you

Seems like your understanding of determinism is just as lacking.

>80% of an 80% success rate

Technically, these things aren't randon, they just have variables that we cannot immediately conceive and acknowledge.

>It's only when you absolutely won't take no for an answer and will do whatever is necessary and still fail that you know that you gave it a proper try

Yes, humans are very much animals and acting based on their instincts may prove beneficial short term, yet developing ability and skills to act rationally allows not only to not make mistakes long term, but to even remove this irrationality, albeit partially, like we've done now. One day, when man's mind will become a machine, there will be this Android level of random jankiness in us no more, allowing us to gain full control not just of our body, but our mind. PPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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File: 5444784c00095fc⋯.jpg (74.41 KB,850x400,17:8,quote-democracy-cannot-exi….jpg)

 No.98873 [Open thread][Last50 Posts]

Another forced trannypol meme that is owed a measured response is the Universal Basic Income. It needs to be put down wherever it rears its hyperinflating head so here's some information I was able to put together.

Estimated current US Population over 18:

254,046,000

Cost of $1,000/mo ($12,000/yr) per 18+ individual per year:

$3,048,552,000,000

Current Total Federal Budget:

$3,422,000,000,000

Estimate total gross revenue of 10% VAT (https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/what-would-rate-be-under-vat):

$712,000,000,000

>but people already receive benefits

True, but this proposal still involves much more spending; let's look at some of the bigger ones and maybe exclude the lesser ones:

62 million people currently receive Social Security benefits receiving an average of $1,200 monthly, so that group of people would add a substantially lower number versus what is already collected, 148,000,000,000 instead of 892,000,000,000 were they not already receiving benefits of some sort.

42 million SNAP beneficiaries receive an average of $253 a monthly so they would cost an additional 376,488,000,000 on top of the 127,512,000,000 they already receive (504,000,000,000)

All told that is a decrease of about 367.5 billion, but still leaves a 2.7 trillion dollar deficit unaccounted for

At best a 10% VAT (i.e. increasing the cost of all goods and services produced or offered throughout the entire country) will only help fund the UBI by around 25%. You would need a VAT of almoPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

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 No.99384

File: 11e5e1ac9aebe2d⋯.png (956.63 KB,1328x2216,166:277,1510343533594.png)

>>99369

Good luck not being branded a murderer and having mcpolice killing you and siezing your property.

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 No.99386

File: a84806c21a17e63⋯.png (173.78 KB,300x240,5:4,ClipboardImage.png)

>>99384

>moving the goal posts

>that far

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 No.99390

>>99369

I'm not sure why you think I'm arguing that Ancapistan or private courts or whatever else are a bad idea. I'm not a statist, I don't believe government courts are good or effective, and I don't think that there is really any sense in which Ancapistan *wouldn't* be a utopia compared to the current situation. All I've been saying is that I think you're still thinking of property like a statist, and haven't fully explored the consequences of stateless society. I happen to think that the unimaginable levels of wealth that exist at the highest echelons of society are a result of the state, and that without the interference of the state, there is a practical limit to the amount of wealth that any entity, whether private or corporate, will be able to amass.

Thus my original post was suggesting that because unimaginable wealth is a result of the state, it's not actually a bad idea for the state to make at least a token effort to balance things back out. Not only is it ethical to try to make some money make it back to those it was stolen from, however ineffectively, but UBI is also practically a more effective method than the systems it replaces: not just defective means-tested welfare programs that keep people poor, but also things like minimum wage and medical bills accrued and defaulted on by those without the means for preventative care.

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 No.99396

>>99390

>UBI is also practically a more effective method than the systems it replaces

Really? Here: >>98902

UBI won't replace anything. It will be another layer of statism.

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 No.99400

>>99396

Yeah, I agree that Yang's proposal is terrible. I admit that most UBI proposals will be terrible. I hold that UBI as a concept is not a terrible idea (or at least not more terrible than any other law or government program). I also think that blowing it off as "it's wealth redistribution, therefore it's evil" as in >>99230 is misguided, since it works directly opposite wealth redistribution programs that are built into the very concept of the state.

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File: b1bd8eaa3ba032b⋯.jpg (77.8 KB,809x569,809:569,Screenshot_20190313-232934.jpg)

 No.99278 [Open thread]

what's the cause of this house debt and student loan debt crisis? why is student loan debt and household debt skyrocketing? why are people buying less houses? is it the government or a side effect of the free market?

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 No.99279

>>99278

>house debt

federal reserve low interest rates

>student loan debt

government laons

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 No.99280

For future reference, the QTDDTOTT is here: >>97996

The answer to your question is the result of the degree industry getting subsidized from both sides. Widespread financial aid programs increase the ability-to-pay of every student, which causes the price to increase, similar to why inflation causes prices to increase. However, direct financial aid is relatively small when compared to tuition cost, so it's clear that there's more happening here. The other contributor on the consumer side is that even "private" student loans are almost all bought up by the government even if a private institution gives them out. Since the government will buy them up immediately, banks assume next to no risk when giving out student loans. This means they'll approve almost every application for a student loan, which increases the demand for student loans, and an increase in demand causes an increase in price.

On the supply side, private and public universities alike receive a healthy amount of government funding to subsidize their costs. As the government has an effectively infinite willingness-to-pay, any subsidized university can't go bankrupt, and there's no longer any incentive for universities to minimize cost. As a result, programs, departments, and hiring decisions which would be considered useless waste in an unrestricted market are approved without question, and university operating costs begin to balloon to ridiculous proportions. Further, government interference in other forms actively encourages universities to waste money on useless, nonproductive overhead. Thanks to Title IX and the flagrant abuses thereof, every university now spends millions on hiring diversity officers, setting up an evaluation system to deal with Title IX reports and similar accusations, gender studies departments, and other such subversive nonsense. And that's only scratching the surface of the subsidies provided.

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 No.99292

>>99278

maybe milenials take gender studies degree and then realize they dont earn money so they cannot pay debt

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YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

 No.99042 [Open thread]

Should chicagoans and other non-misesian libertarians even be called libertarian?

<Economist Milton Friedman considered Mises inflexible in his thinking:

>The story I remember best happened at the initial Mont Pelerin meeting when he got up and said, "You're all a bunch of socialists." We were discussing the distribution of income, and whether you should have progressive income taxes. Some of the people there were expressing the view that there could be a justification for it.

>Another occasion which is equally telling: Fritz Machlup was a student of Mises's, one of his most faithful disciples. At one of the Mont Pelerin meetings, Machlup gave a talk in which I think he questioned the idea of a gold standard; he came out in favor of floating exchange rates. Mises was so mad he wouldn't speak to Machlup for three years. Some people had to come around and bring them together again. It's hard to understand; you can get some understanding of it by taking into account how people like Mises were persecuted in their lives.

based Ludwig

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 No.99244

>>99243

Caplan is a liberal who is mostly annoyed the (neo-)liberal program isn't being instituted radically and fast enough for his liking FYI.

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 No.99245

>>99241

>Bryan Caplan

isn't he the guy who tried to "debunk" Austrian economics?

>>99243

>As for Milton Friedman, I would not call him a libertarian. Same with Hayek. They were classical liberals, perhaps, or whigs, but not libertarians.

Milton and Hayek both wanted UBI.

milton is believe is a self professed neo liberal. Hayek also believed there should be a central bank. I think you're right about Hayek being a classical liberal though

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 No.99246

>>99245

Hayke had plently of radical policy proposals .e.g denationalizing money but he's still regarded as the more "respectable" Austrian.

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 No.99249

>>99246

I have to wonder whether Hayek actually believed the shit he said about things like the minimum wage, or if that was tactical counter-signaling on his part to keep him well-respected in academic circles.

>>99245

> Hayek also believed there should be a central bank.

You have a source on that? It's the first I've heard of this, and considering his work on ABCT I find it hard to believe he'd ever advocate for a central bank.

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 No.99290

File: d53ef7c17fa66e3⋯.jpg (65.86 KB,1065x800,213:160,pinochet_reaction.jpg)

>>99042

>Milton Friedman: "some economists… like me [advocated for a progressive income tax*]"

*context is correct and there is no exaggeration

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File: 90e6c9e5e7b6e09⋯.jpg (538.53 KB,720x540,4:3,liberty_gang.jpg)

 No.99152 [Open thread]

What is the best ethical justification for libertarianism? Mises used a utilitarian defence and argued that libertarianism ought to be adopted because it produces the most happiness and prosperity in the long run. This justification isn't particularly strong however, because many people have endgoals which they prioritize over liberty or prosperity. There is Hoppe's argumentation ethics, which essentially says that any action which infringes on the rights of others cannot be argued for without a contradiction, and thus that action is irrational. He also has the position that libertarianism is the best means of avoiding conflicts between people. Then there's Rothbard's view on the matter, which he explained in The Ethics of Liberty. The basic jist of this view is that it is natural for humans to exercise control over themselves and their justly-acquired property, and thus wrong for someone else to infringe on someone else's person or property and inflict their own will. There are probably other justifications which I am forgetting or unaware of as of yet, but which is the most concrete.

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 No.99223

File: aa6f05f10ddf984⋯.png (117.25 KB,960x390,32:13,ancap_virginstatist_meh.png)

>>99209

Where my fellow Chad Rule Consequentialists (basically deontology, but with a different underlying thought process) at?

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 No.99224

>>99223

statists are drone state worshippers.

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 No.99226

>>99218

>still identifies with his own mind and thinks that he is his own thoughts

You can't even say what you've said without implying you're a fucking idiot for saying it.

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 No.99267

Libertarian ism is the passive stance. The onus is on the active stance to justify the initiation of force.

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 No.99277

File: db81eb773853c1e⋯.png (985.63 KB,800x600,4:3,troof.png)

>>99160

>"Okay, but what about people who choose violence instead of argumentation?

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File: b2bc5d96f9731fb⋯.jpg (90.59 KB,600x1006,300:503,download_20190310_180627.jpg)

 No.99135 [Open thread]

is pic related a good way to destroy competition in a free market?

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 No.99217

>>99194

What does Rothbard propose?

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 No.99221

>>99217

Not the guy above you, first of all. Concerning such regulations as "drive on the right lane", Rothbard believed that such rules are either customary, or enforced by the owners of the roads, who will have an interested in enacting uniform rules. In a way, we have that in the computer business. Every programmer tries to make his program run on Windows, because that is the standard. Some also make it for Linux. Very few eschew these options, and write a program for some extreme fringe operation system. It is legal to do so, but few programmers do, most follow the standards, simply because the customers expect that. It would be the same with road owners.

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 No.99227

>>99221

God, I wish we had at least private roads.

>having a beer with my boomer dad

>discussing politics and current events

>say that roads should be privatized

>owners will have an incentive to mainain them to raise the property value

>"son, we already have that shit in countries like saudi arabia"

>wut

>"yeah, the prince would own some road and get people to pay for it, it fucking sucks"

mfw

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 No.99231

>>99227

is a private community a good idea?

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 No.99232

File: eaf6aba98fc0286⋯.webm (741.19 KB,768x576,4:3,Youre_Illogical.webm)

>>99227

>the prince would own some road

>privatized

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File: bacce701719e643⋯.jpg (68.59 KB,540x532,135:133,domino pizza.jpg)

 No.98935 [Open thread]

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 No.99103

>>98945

The Vast Vast majority of the Cuban population continues to support the Communist party and the massive leaps in development it has made on the Island (With Cuba far outranking pretty much all of its immediate neighbours in terms of its quality of life under most metrics)

I can't imagine that the "Cuban Mises Fellowship" or whatever it is has that much traction over there

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 No.99124

File: 945e2f61a0caef2⋯.jpg (59.43 KB,612x613,612:613,945e2f61a0caef25bb928a7ce4….jpg)

>>99103

>the massive leaps in development it has made on the Island

Yeah, by forcing abortions on women who carry children that would drag down the statistics:

https://www.pop.org/abortion-and-infanticide-in-cuba/

If that is development, then thanks, I want none of it.

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 No.99126

>>99103

>>99103

>I can't imagine that the "Cuban Mises Fellowship" or whatever it is has that much traction over there

For a country that kills and imprisons dissidents, I doubt there would be many people overtly joining the group either.

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 No.99139

>>99126

The last pending death penalty's in Cuba were Commuted last year iirc

>>99124

Ignoring the fact that he is refusing to even use his real name and credentials thus putting this articles reliablity into immediate question

Just teaching people that how to use condoms and that Abortion is an option if they get pregnant isn't "Forcing women to get abortions"

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 No.99215

File: 831a239c541d553⋯.png (37.24 KB,394x370,197:185,shigs.png)

>>99139

>Ignoring the fact that he is refusing to even use his real name and credentials thus putting this articles reliablity into immediate question

From the article:

>(Dr. Jose Marti (a pseudonym is a physician practicing in Cuba. He has asked Population Research Institute to withhold his real name for fear of reprisals. — Editor.)

You know, as happened to Dr. Óscar Elías Biscet: https://stream.org/castro-regime-tortured-doctor-for-protesting-abortions-infanticide/

>Just teaching people that how to use condoms and that Abortion is an option if they get pregnant isn't "Forcing women to get abortions"

And yet, the article:

>Dr. Carlos Ciro Machado, a doctor who arrived from Cuba as an immigrant just a few months ago, related to TV Marti last July a case he himself witnessed. Dr. Machado said he saw a premature baby in a bucket and called the doctor in charge. He was told to let the baby die because it might die in spite of medical care and raise the infant mortality rate. Dr, Machado then called the head nurse and she said the same thing. Despite their opposition Dr. Machado gave the baby medical care, but the baby died anyway six hours later. Cuba is more interested in its international image than in caring for the health of its people, said Dr. Machado.

I am pretty sure throwing babies into trashcans qualifies as infanticide.

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