/christianity/ - Christian Theology & Philosophy

>>10197

nor*

>>10197

We've already concluded this discussion. You are not a literalist, so you can not answer for literalists. I have no interest in discussing the historical-grammatical method, I already understand why idiots do that, I have no questions to ask you.

I think a lot of it boils down to common sense and reading passages in context.

Obviously some things are hyperbole or metaphor, but there are too many people who like to take verses with direct meaning and try to twist them to suit their own means.

>>10219

It seems much more like it is just a refusal to understand the bible, and a deep desire to cling to the incorrect and absurd understanding they gained through pop culture. Like how some of them will insist that Adam and Eve ate an apple, because that's how it is portrayed in pop culture.

>>10104

itching ears

>>9864

You are a heretic. A random homeless person in your community isn't some negro who comes in and wants to loot and act as a massive parasite leeching off the community.

>>9864

>whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine,

John 1:12 NASB — But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name,

>>9792

The mixture of Christianity and politics is toxic. You are using your faith to advance interests of avarice and lust. In this sense, you are placing your self-interest above God. One's faith should be separate to their political decisions, decisions of which should be following Realpolitik.

>>9792

>>9802

These are the same kind of churches that later come out in support of LGBT or have gay pastors, deny core tenets, etc.

You will know them by their fruits.

checks out to be honest

>>9853

Hurray for legalism and all the ways to find work arounds!

>>10000

YOUR GET HAS NOT GONE UNNOTICED

>>10000

quads

>>9806

>Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts

No idea what that means, but luckily I found a non-archaic translation

<When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.

>>9928

Romanism is a false pagan religion that damns millions of souls to hell that's something wrong with it

>>9740

Separation of Church and State – one should not use their religious beliefs to advance political aims because that would be using your faith to meet selfish interests, primarily interests of power. "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's." National Socialism is secular and compatible with core Christian tenets. The two work together where the other lacks like yin and yang. A National Socialist state would influence the Church as much as the Church would influence the state, and there would be harmony between the two as long as the state does not intentionally meddle in the affairs of the other.

>>10159

>Separation of Church and State

Was invented by "Enlightenment" degenerates. In medieval Christianity, and in all traditional societies before that, they were inseparable, religion legitimized the state, and the state (army) protected religion. From Vedic India, over ancient Mesopotamia, to the Greco-Romans the hierarchy was always clergy > army > everyone else, though the clergy did not meddle in state affairs. I approve of National Socialism for the most part, but it isn't the be-all-end-all, and if we want to live in accordance with our natures a more refined solution is needed, for me at least. Fact is also, Hitler was an atheist.

>>9750

>>9891

So what, because you disagree with their politics then regime change in Germany ought to have been the primary objective of the vatican in your mind? They should risk the ability to reach German Catholics and refuse to carry out one of their primary duties (administering the sacraments) if a German Catholic was also a member of the armed forces (which was often compulsory)? By that logic high ranking members of the church should refuse to ever meet with any government official, and priests would be prohibited from administering mass for any servicemember in the western world; or actually make that the whole world since some combination of usury, sodomy, heresy, and other grievous sins and errors are codified into secular law literally everywhere.

Sounds like you just worship at the altar of worldly power and are more concerned that they pursue your favoured Jewish political goals than if they save people's souls and foster faith in Christ.

>>10102

>So? That doesn't mean the ages of creation are days.

Those are the kind of days Exodus 20:11 is talking about.

>"Everyone knows" is meaningless nonsense.

I'm saying everyone knows in the sense that everyone agrees it's wrong. I could have said everyone here knows. And so to say or pretend that's my position (which I ask everyone in this thread not to do) is a strawman. That is the point of me saying this. But it seems like you missed that.

>Suggesting that knowing the meaning of words is redefining them is simply a lie.

You have an incorrect teaching of what these words in question mean and are using it to spread false doctrines about. This is one of the main methods used to create new false doctrine. See it all the time.

>No, it says the years he ages were nine hundred and thirty.

The Bible says in Genesis that all the days of his life were nine hundred and thirty years.

>You are clearly not concerned about the truth of the bible, you are only concerned about the interpretation one translator gave of it.

It's funny because Genesis 5:5 literally says all the DAYS of his life, and that has to include starting from the first day he lived. Meanwhile you haven't presented a single reason to think why this isn't so, all you've done is try to redefine words.

>It stops giving ages when people are born.

You're just disagreeing for the sake of it at this point. My explanation already shows exactly how you can get from the geneologies of Genesis 5 and 11 through to Cyrus in 539 BC with no gaps.

If you'd like to actually get into that, I always can, and I am glad to get into specifics with you on this Biblical timetable. But you aren't bringing any specifics, but are just disagreeing with me for the sake of appearance. Just to say that the Bible is somehow wrong and to posture on every point as if you had a reason when you donPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>10122

>Those are the kind of days Exodus 20:11 is talking about.

That's your premise, not evidence to support it.

>You have an incorrect teaching of what these words in question mean

Then explain why your beloved and perfect translation agrees with me? The word yom is translated as several different words in every single english translation. You do not have a logically consistent position. If the word yom must mean day, then your translation is wrong by your own standard. And Paul clearly states that God's "day" of rest is still happening in his time in Hebrews 4. We're still in the Lord's "day" 7 right now.

>My explanation already shows exactly how you can get from the geneologies of Genesis 5 and 11 through to Cyrus in 539 BC with no gaps.

But your explanation ignores the fact that you don't have any such genealogy. The same word is used for both son and descendant. Most of the lineage given it is unclear as to which meaning is intended.

>Not a single, solitary example.

Words used for yom in NASB:

afternoon* (1), age (8), age* (1), all (1), always* (14), amount* (2), battle (1), birthday* (1), Chronicles* (38), completely* (1), continually* (14), course* (1), daily (22), daily the days (1), day (1115), day of the days (1), day that the period (1), day's (6), day's every day (1), daylight* (1), days (635), days on the day (1), days to day (1), days you shall daily (1), days ago (1), days' (11), each (1), each day (4), entire (2), eternity (1), evening* (1), ever in your life* (1), every day (2), fate (1), first (5), forever* (11), forevermore* (1), full (5), full year (1), future* (1), holiday* (3), later* (2), length (1), life (12), life* (1), lifetime (2), lifetime* (1), live (1), long (2), long as i live (1), long* (11), midday* (1), now (5), older* (1), once (2), period (3), perpetually* (2), present (1), recently (1), reigns (1), ripe* (1), short-lived* (1), so long* (1), some time (1), survived* (2), time (45), time* (1), times* (2), today (172), today* (1), usual (1), vPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>10138

>Words used for yom in NASB:

>afternoon* (1), age (8), age* (1), all (1), always* (14), amount* (2), battle (1), birthday* (1), Chronicles* (38), completely* (1), continually* (14), course* (1), daily (22), daily the days (1), day (1115), day of the days (1)

Spot the outlier

>>10139

If the word only means day, then the list should read "day". Every single english translation renders it as multiple other words based on context. Every hebrew dictionary and scholar that has ever existed also says it means multiple things. So the premise that it must always mean day and nothing else is obviously false.

>>10138

>That's your premise, not evidence to support it.

You already admitted that the sabbath day is a day. I'm supposed to assume you take that admission back now?

>The word yom is translated as several different words in every single english translation.

You still haven't given me a single example, and it shouldn't be hard for you to get one. Until then, what's the point in going back and forth when you should be able to bring an example.

>And Paul clearly states that God's "day" of rest is still happening in his time in Hebrews 4.

What verse? Hebrews 4:8 says it's talking about "another day." That again is a specific day, not an aeon-length mystical "seventh day" that continues until now.

>But your explanation ignores the fact that you don't have any such genealogy. The same word is used for both son and descendant.

Genesis 5 and 11 state exactly how old each of the men when the child was born and exactly how many years beyond that they lived. It goes on like that in a closed chain from Adam to Terah. There is no gap here, your point isn't even relevant in the face of this level of information in the first place.

>Most of the lineage given it is unclear as to which meaning is intended.

Doesn't even matter because it says how old each one was when the next one was born.

>Words used for yom in NASB:

The NASB removes the words "without a cause" from Matthew 5:22. It also removes the words "for them that trust in riches" from Mark 10:24. It is a bad translation, I'd never use it.

The NASB also changes Isaiah 63:16 where it says "thy name is from everlasting." In the NASB the words are changed to "from of old is Your name."

"Of old" and everlasting are not the same thing. I don't accept their supposed translation that was likely influenced by the exact same guys. Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>9997

But Christ is a new Adam, in the sense that all Christians are the mothers and brothers and sisters of Christ, as we are all the children of Adam. Christ being a sinless new Adam bringing Christian unity is part of Christ's message.

>>10046

When I have seen Eastern Orthodox talk about theosis on 8chan they always talk about it in one of two ways, either 1. Mormonesque apotheosis (damnable heresy, blasphemy), or 2. Like the doctrine of sanctification in our tradition; we only "become gods" inasmuch as we participate in the divine nature, to "become gods" is simply to become like God.

>>9989

i’m not googling. effortpost and provide a brief description for each and a link, each, for more info.

>>10154

It's neither

1)Mormonic doctrine is impossible, due to God being omnipotent, Omnipresent, omniscient and generally having infinite attributes that are beyond limits. There exists the indestructible barrier between God and Human beings that cannot be avoided, so man can never become God and I am sick of people comparing Theosis to Mormons, since it has absolutely nothing in common with it due to different backgrounds and different fundamental doctrines.

2)what you describe isn't Theosis in its fullness. It's merely one part of it: catharsis.

>>9989

Ransom or Sacrifice, because these are the words Jesus himself uses. Although all the rest do have scriptural support obviously, so I would hope not to totally ignore them.

If you have to ask…

>>9570

God loves a good barbecue.

>>9570

>Why did the omnipotent creator of the universe need middle eastern people to sacrifice goats and animals by cutting their throats and burning their bodies to obtain their blood for so long?

Galatians 3:22-25

But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Hebrews 9:18-23

Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.

For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you. Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry. And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.

>Perhaps god had no choice in this matter and there is some law of the universe that forces him to need blood?

You have to put this in its bigger context. God created the very existence of blood in the first place. Everything has been given its purpose with his thoughts and purpose in mind. And his ways are much higher than our ways, his thoughts than our thoughts. Whether or not you realize this fact, this is simply the reality around us. That's simply how it is, and God is also willing for us to come to the knowledge of the truth of his Son if we shoPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>10073

>were how the priests were fed.

Wait I thought the whole point of animal sacrifices was that you'd burn the remains as a symbol of your sacrifice for the sake of your belief? Did they really just eat the animal after "sacrificing" it?

>>10141

It depended on the type of sacrifice. A lot of the time the owner of the animal got to have a good feast along with the family.

>>9570

>>10073

This, and the fact that livestock was worth a lot back then. Sacrificing the best of your livestock was a big sacrifice in general, and by burning the body, you're rendering the meat inedible to salvage.

>>8337

His work was brilliant. shame globohomo is so afraid of any inquiry.

It's all about accepting their narrative without any questioning. they are kind of like Papists.

>>10020

>Papists

Fuck off protnigger.

>>8349

the main reason it’s not removed is it’s translated falsely by kikes.

>>10024

Whoa there Papist, you made a wrong turn. This is /christianity/, you're looking for /christian/.

>>10024

There is a Catholic board

>>>/christian/

>>9146

>>9168

By grace, through faith, not of works. True or false?

>>7645

As a lifelong depressive I can assure you it's almost certainly down to your thinking.

Stop practicing being miserable. stop each crappy thought as you think it and replace with the opposite thought. Its a choice. I was out of depression within a year and tbh it could have been half that if I'd not been so self indulgent.

Even non Christians can do that. I think its called CBT?

think about these verses where the Christian is encouraged to change their thhinking:

Philippians 4:8 - Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable if anything is excellent or praiseworthy think about such things.

It's a command to Fill your mind with good wholesome stuff instead of darkness and misery … this may require a break from the chans lol

2 Corinthians 10:5 "…take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ."

This verse is telling you have authority and control over your mind, so exercise control to make it holy.

God doesn't just wave a miracle wand over us and make us perfect, any more than your earthly parents waved a wand over you and made you walk, talk and potty trained.

This is a process that the Christian must be active in.

>>7958

>remembering that verse about fornicators not inheriting the kingdom of heaven

>remain single and addicted to porn

You're literally justifying your sin.

Have you never considered that if by looking at a woman with lust you commit adultery in the heart, then by looking at pornography you fornicate with her in your heart?

Ever considered that the Greek word translated as fornication is actually PORNEIA and means sexual sins, so probably pornography too.

Get help now to overcome or you will not inherit the kingdom either /nofap/

>>7891

Look for young women. If you're actually devout; working hard, earning a wage for your work, staying sober,etc., then there won't be much social stigma opting for a young woman. It'll be there, but not as bad.

>>9795

I have no interest in a polemic, your mutilated Word of God (66 books) and your man-made religion, that wasn't even an inkling of a minutia of extant thought during the time those dogmas I just posted were defined. You follow Luther.

>>9799

Furthermore, St. Augustine famously stated that he would not believe the Scriptures themselves had the authority of the Church not proposed it to him. There is required a supernatural formal motive of faith and this rule of faith must be an infallible one and not rooted in private judgment. Let's say you have a missionary who teaches some dying savage about the Holy Trinity and Incarnation. Said savage them embraces these truths and is baptized.  He has no knowledge of the Church or authority of the Church. In this vague state of mind, he has the bare minimum to be saved as a Catholic. So, if you had someone growing up in a schismatic region who had this same very simple and confused view of the faith, then it's possible that this person remains a Catholic. But non-Catholics cannot be saved. That is DEFINED DOGMA. If they are saved, it's because they are Catholic and have not fallen into schism.

>>9799

>>9800

I'll take that as a "no".

>>9345

What is BoB and LoT

>>9800

Augustine was a Manichaean (celibacy, gnosticism, pseudo-buddhist) faggot who only "converted" right around the time Theodosius made it "illegal" to be pagan.

Please read the ANTE-NICENE fathers, AKA, the actual Apostolic Christians.

>>10034

I don't know why he would call that "Protestant banter" considering the reformers recognized the Franks as the 'good guys' in their historic dispute with the Greeks

>>8660

>I'm about finished with this level of blasphemy against God's word.

Oh, like ripping 6 inspired books out of the Bible? You literally follow a twentieth century movement (KJV-onlyism).

>>10049

strawman

>>10050

What did I say that was false? Please elucidate me.

>>10051

you're dodging an argument by attacking an unrelated position that you're ascribing to your debate opponent.

Polytheism.

>>10021

I doubt they know about it enough to have an opinion on it, anon. It's a uniquely EO doctrine that even Catholics and some Oriental Orthodox don't know about, so everybody just misinterprets it.

It isn't a question that has ever been raised to us, so we don't know what the formulation is, but about our theology proper, we have always agreed with Thomism about God, and for those of us in the Reformed tradition 'Thomistic' theology proper has often formed the bedrock of our beliefs. And a relevant side note, in the 17th century one of the minor issues the remonstrants made a fuss about was the filioque clause. They wanted it removed from the creed (though not on any theological grounds, they simply felt it was not taught in scripture and should consequently be left to freedom), and the response of the Reformed leaders of the day was to reassert the validity, orthodoxy and biblicity of the filioque clause.

>>9908

this. The more they ban, the less your post will be seen by someone genuinely interested, and not reported by some butthurt catholic.

Just focus on driving this board's traffic. We will overtake them soon enough with good recruitment strategy, good modding, and good posting. No need to go fucking with their cesspit.

>>9952

This. So much this. If the ridiculous Catholics want to create a total hugbox with no discussion of doctrine, let them. This board should be your place to post, boards on 8chan typically die due to word filters, but bad moderation kills them just as good. We just have to be patient and stop posting on /christian/.

>>10010

amen

Honestly the mods on /christian/ are doing a fine job of bringing people over here. I lurk both on here and /christian/ and my first thread I had about questions regarding doctrine was deleted.

>>9905

But that's not the limit of the bans and deletions though, it's indiscriminate, there's no rhyme or reason to them, they come for cats and non cats here there and everywhere, the other thread testifies to that.

>>9968

>>9968

Christian was bad from the time Alex strated to get new mods, but it was still usable.

I think what destroyed the sub was discord. After discord there came to be a tightly knit group on the discord server and it seemed like arguing with that any members of that group would result in mod action and members of that group would carry a lot of weight in asking for bans.

I think a sub becomes unusable through moderation when moderation becomes so strong that it starts to be like a powerful third person in any debate or discussion and the people start changing their discussion style to fit moderation - you see this a lot on reddit where people argue a certain way to provoke a certain resposne and then request a ban. And Christian is certain in that league

>>9981

I am sad that the board seems to be rapidly dying out with far few PPH and such. Oh well… and I agree they are a bunch of loonies in the discord. I posted one small thing and that tutor guy send literally a massive three paragraph statement. I can tell his idiotic theology he believes that you should kiss the feet of where priests walk (some saint said this so he thinks this is so true) and you shoudln't be on the internet and just read whatever he sanctions as good reading (tutor sanctions). He thinks he's some sort of pseudo pope almost and his spiritual advice is the right way to go. We shouldn't look at news, we shouldn't discuss theology that interests us, we should kiss the ground that the priest walks on, obey literally anything a priest says, literally anything as long as it isn't abject sin. So if a priest says to walk 10 miles and use a public toilet 10 times, you should do it according to His Holiness Tutor. And if you don't like it, BANNED. The guy is delusional and power has gone to his head. And sadly he is killing the board.

>>9870

Post count has been rapidly dropping since even a few months ago. The mod team is getting crazier and crazier