/fringe/ - Fringe

>>134277

Which is probably appropriate for anybody trying to give advice to anybody or teach anybody about anything.

>>134278

Why the need for scripture?

>>134280

I think that imageboards are a good placed for organized dissemination of information and such things as that, as long as there are not many shills and not much manipulation or hacking or something. However, in my experience unless you work for an I.T. company or something, the way we tackle problems and overcome questions is usually in a slow and easy-going manner.

>>134283

>Why the need for scripture?

Well you need intellect, and if you want to double check then use scripture, is what I mean.

Feelings can be deceiving, and without filtering them through intellect or scripture you can end up with, delusions to say the least. Premises that are faulty but feel oh so enchanting

I was also trying to refer to a greater point that, consulting scripture is just about the same as consulting THE intellect, so to speak; though once you form a connection it's pretty reliable. Should come back to some scripture from time to time, to be safe..

>>134282

The legitimacy of it that I know, is based on the scripture that references archangels. I wouldn't (and won't) delve into it just for fun though. I did a cursory analysis and saw that it is perfectly cohesive with, my understanding of, the holy trinity.

>>134285

Nice.

>>134284

I think the truth about God and Christendom in particular is so entirely separate from 'scripture' and 'conventional religion' that 'conventional religion' is merely a series of tests.

I'm not perfect but this is what I believe to be true since the stakes are high.

>>134287

How is one to find God and Christendom if not through the word of God?

>>133641

>Anyways, what I was wondering is how the Neoplatonists ended up talking about the same thing as the first Christians and so called Gnostics and etc…

Imagine, an entire tradition and philosophy that has nothing to do with Christiantiy or anything Abrahamic, but are using the same terms as in the bible. Nous, Logos, Christos? Just the three most perfect ideals as explained in Plato's theory of forms and expanded by the Hermetic school of thought…. I love it all, and can't limit myself to any label or flag… It's all the same to me… But if I had to pick an apt symbol….

idk, maybe it's because Monism is the most intuitive and logical conclusion one can come up with? These metaphors aren't exclusive to the West. Sufism, Vetanta, and Taoism are all intrinsically Monoist/Non-dualist, and also have metaphors for categorizing with names and forms, like "the Ten Thousand Things" in Taoism, or the classic Advaita Vedanta example of "confusing the rope for a snake," etc.

>>134290

The only places I can find the holy trinity is the New Testament, Gnosticism, and Neoplatonism.

PLEASE DO tell anywhere else that references any notion of the Trinity. After that, all I got was Zelda and the Trifoce of Courage, Wisdom, Power. Looks the same to me

However, the general theology of most all other religions and spiritual cultures tend to have some notion or mechanism that can easily be corresponded with the notion of the holy trinity.

>>134307

>New Testament, Gnosticism, and Neoplatonism.

The coolest thing is that these people literally used THE SAME TERMS of Nous, Logos, and Christos! But they considered themselves quite distinct and exclusive from one another. I find that absolutely fascinating!

It's as if these three groups of people agreed on the concepts, but disagreed on the meaning, and each of these three groups separated to spread their influence over the world, and alas these three groups are literally the cause of the results today.

We all know about Western Religion and the bible thumpers, but Western Academia sprouted from Platonism (God do I love trolling Philosophy professors by talking about Neoplatonism, they HAVE to know about it because it's their godamned job), and Western Spirituality/Magick sprouted from Gnosticism! But these three sprouted from. almost as if, the same group of people sitting at a table deciding to troll everyone, or at least each other?

>>134307

In Hinduism, you have the three principle deities Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva which correspond to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, respectively. Also, there is the similarity between Vishnu taking the form of Kalki Avatar and kill Kali, thus establishing a new Golden Age, much like how Christ defeats the Antichrist in Revelations.

In Taoism, you have the Great Triad (Heaven, Man, and Earth), which correspond to Father, Son, and Mother, respectively. In some Christian denominations, the Holy Spirit does take a feminine attribute.

> After that, all I got was Zelda and the Trifoce of Courage, Wisdom, Power. Looks the same to me

You're probably being condescending but anyway, the three pillars in the Masonic temple represent Wisdom, Strength, and Beauty. Also Leibniz, who was inducted in Rosicrucianism, had a similar concept of the divine Trinity with Wisdom, Power, and Goodness. Goodness being synonymous with Beauty, if taken Platonic sense.

>>134314

And I forgot to add this. I figured you would enjoy this since you love Zelda so much, but unfortunately, Guenon never got around to explaining the symbolism of the three upright triangles.

http://www.studiesincomparativereligion.com/Public/articles/The_Mountain_and_the_Cave-by_Rene_Guenon.aspx

>>134314

>In Taoism, you have the Great Triad (Heaven, Man, and Earth), which correspond to Father, Son, and Mother, respectively. In some Christian denominations, the Holy Spirit does take a feminine attribute.

TAO is pure wisdom and intuition, it is limited by the intellect. Or at least that's how their narrative goes?

It's not that intuition and wisdom is feminine, but femininity (and perhaps other things) is intuitive and comes from the holy spirit. aka Tao aka 'The way' or Flow

And I'm actually not being condescending… I realized a lot of Japanese games take a lot of inspiration from the Judeo-Christianity concepts, along side all the epic Eastern philosophies

I personally interpret it as Logic Wisdom and Balance, which I would correspond with Power Wisdom and Courage… Also I glossed over the fact that Demiurge and Christos can almost be used interchangeably but the Demiruge is more of the 'stage' and Christos is more of the 'play'

I'm gonna need a moment or two to really take in all of what you just said. I very much appreciate this response

>>134318

And if we are to take the Kokiri Forest from OoT as representative of Eden, you may find this interesting, though this is a coincidence since the Kokiri are based on Shintoism and fairy folk lore.

https://gospelofsophia.com/2019/02/17/legends-of-lucifers-stone/

>>134329

Maybe the Garden of Eden was influenced by Shintoism and fairy folk lore? Really makes you think

>>134329

Wait where the hell did Shintoism come from?

>>134334

>>134333

I merely brought up Shintoism and fairy tales as inspirational sources for the setting of OoT.

>>134335

Yea yea but I was reminded how Abrahamic Theology is essentially the same as… I mean Judaism developed over the course of many centuries, millennia even. It came from the ancient Canaanite religion, and was influenced by other religions like Zoroastrianism, which all came about along side Hinduism and Buddhism, which is what Shintoism may be based on but Japanese history is not my strength…

The worst one, of all time, ever, is the "there are no limits to magick".

And I've fallen for this one for a few years, it'll make you waste a ton of your time, trying to compile information, or meditate for hours on your intentions or try to find some super powerful spell online.

I've experienced paranormal things, did magick, and the ceiling of what you can accomplish with magick is really not that high.

Yes you can get out of a bad spot in life with intelligent use of it, but it won't fix the unfixable things that you might have in your life.

Magick is just a good buff for the effectiveness of your daily routines.

And I dont think there's anyone on this board that can succesfully astral project when they want to, or they would be extremely rich and succesful with the information they could receive in the astral.

>>134341

So everyone has limits because you do?

>>134341

Lucid dreaming is a thing that people do all the time…

>>134314

>In Hinduism, you have the three principle deities Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva which correspond to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, respectively

Okay I can at least also comment on this; since I know Brahman is the central source of all the other deities in Hinduism then yeah it's considered to be monotheistic…

The thing is though, the way the holy trinity is described to be unified in some way. Personally it's going to take a lot of work in deduction to make the exact comparisons with how the other so called triads that are mentioned are also monotheistic in the same way…

Surely they are all different flavors of the same thing, but I think the way the trinity is represented is actually somehow different and is itself the different flavors, as opposed to the trinity also being the exact same for all the different flavors…

Really gonna take me a while to take this in though… Like weeks or months!

>>134314

>Also, there is the similarity between Vishnu taking the form of Kalki Avatar and kill Kali, thus establishing a new Golden Age, much like how Christ defeats the Antichrist in Revelations.

This is so cool!

>>134372

>Really gonna take me a while to take this in though… Like weeks or months!

Or you can read this. It's mostly about Toaism, but it also discusses various trinities and alchemy. Guenon makes a point right away in the first chapter that not all trinities have the same import. For example, the Tao created yin and yang (Earth and Heaven), and Man acts as mediator between the two, which is different from that of Christianity and Neoplatonism.

>>134354

Astral projection is not lucid dreaming

>>134375

>Read and obey

I'd rather think for myself. No amount of reading will hold my hand to connect the premises to reach the conclusions.

lrn2think critically

>>134378

Yeah, it's better. Much more effective

>>134391

more effective at what?

>>134412

Processing stuff, figuring things out, having sort of test experiences without less consequences allowing safer learning, etc

>>134341

>or they would be extremely rich and succesful with the information they could receive in the astral.

How can you speak about what can happen from access to the astral if you've never been able to do it? What exactly are you looking for anyways?

>>134412

Thought experiments

>>134307

>>134314

>>134375

>>134372

Before we get carried away, remember that there are also concepts of UNHOLY trinities that are in the shadow of the holy trinity, so to speak.

This is what Montalk says

>These three false alternatives are not random errors, but reflections of the physical, etheric, and astral components of the debased Demiurgic system:

Yaldabaoth, Sorat, ????

>The physical component is expressed through materialism, atheism, hedonism, transhumanism, socialism, and nihilism. This matter-centric force is at the root of the Demiurge’s corruption. It ultimately leads to disintegration, entropy, and spiritual death because those are the properties of matter. Its personification was named Yaldabaoth by some Gnostics, meaning “Child of the Void.” Rudolf Steiner called it Sorat and termed its demonic agents the Asuras. Their momentum is to extinguish consciousness, freewill, and spirit, and replace it with pure machine-like materialism. The impending alien deception, with its goal of genetic and cybernetic assimilation of the human race, represents this impulse.

Ahriman, Yahweh, ????

>The etheric component is expressed through organized religion, ritualism, intellectualism, satanism, conservatism, bureaucracy, corporatism, racism, ecclesiasticism, and theocracy. This follows from etheric energy’s affinity for patterning and repetition. This component is associated with intellectual abstractions, formulas, preoccupation with laws, blind obedience within hierarchies, self-preservation, preservation of the past, plant-like expansionism, maintaining the status quo to the point of atrophy, and exploitation and discrimination against foreign patterns. The Gnostics called this force Samael, “God of the Blind”; Steiner termed it Ahriman. Yahweh of the Old Testament belongs to this category.

Sakla, Lucifer, ????

>The astral component is expressed in New Age Mysticism, Nazi occultism, black magic and voodoo, anarchism, Luciferianism, Christian Revivalism, and entheogenic escapism. This follows from the astral flitting about in delusional reveries when not held in check by Spirit. What these expressions have in common is that they seek to rebel against current conditions and escape enthusiastically into another, being lead astray in the process. It is the force of transcendence without restraint, like a rocket without a guidance system, bound for false destinations in the land of fools. For instance, this may entail escaping the dead world of matter or the restrictive world of ether, and getting lost in some metaphysical rapture. Or it may entail the opposite, falling from the divine realms into the world of matter out of misguided desires for physical existence. Gnostics called this force Sakla, the fool; Steiner called it Lucifer, in this case the bearer of false light.

With claims like these, gotta take everything with a grain of salt to say the least

>>134391

>I'd rather think for myself. No amount of reading will hold my hand to connect the premises to reach the conclusions.

That's a piss poor excuse to read a book, if I ever heard one. You are worse than cuckservatives who refuse to read Das Kapital because they are afraid they might turn into a Marxist. If you are that weak in intellect and identity that your ideology might change just from reading a book, well studying occult and esoterism is wasted on you, and you are better off sticking to playing your vidya like a good goy consumer.

>>134422

I'm here to talk to people, not offer book recommendations and fuck off.

If you know what you're talking about then talk, other wise off you go

>>134423

I was here to talk, until you started being a disrespectful and condescending little shit.

>>134424

Speak for yourself. I was talking until you dropped a book and said nothing for yourself. And now your making the lowest quality responses, might as well be a spam bot

>>134425

If you get triggered in reading books so much, you might as well live in the woods and fuck off.

>>134427

You are the one triggered here. Stop derailing the thread

>>134428

Where do you think I got all of this information on ternary symbolism from, by pulling it all out of my ass? No, I read books.

>>134435

Have you ever made a conclusion from premises? Do you know how to think for yourself or just regurgitate shit that you've read?

>>134436

I engage with the ideas therein and form my own conclusions, however. Spending too much time thinking by yourself and with yourself and only leads to inbred ideas due to your own biases. Kind of like what you are doing by trying to syncretize all trinities into one meaning, which is reductionism.

>>134439

>Kind of like what you are doing by trying to syncretize all trinities into one meaning, which is reductionism.

Syncretize? You mean reduce, in this context? Stop using big words you don't understand.

And I'm literally doing the opposite of those. Did you not see the giant block of text I pasted from Montalk about unholy trinities?

Or is that precisely what you are trying to derail? The truth of that level usually gets forces really mad. And most are at their mercy. SAD

>>134439

>I engage with the ideas therein and form my own conclusions, however.

Then do that. Share them here if you want, but for fuck's sake don't tell people to read shit especially without engaging in any real dialogue.

>>134444

Okay, but are you really going to deny everything I said before just because I read it from somewhere else, despite the fact that you were eating that shit up earlier?

>>134450

No one has been denying anything, all I said that I didn't want to read any books right now. What you want me to read an entire book and come back and post? What the fuck is wrong with you?

You've been arguing without understanding for like 10 posts now, get a fucking hold of yourself

UNRELATED TO ABOVE POSTS

"How to spot a conspiracy theory."

https://www.bbc.com/ideas/videos/how-to-spot-a-conspiracy-theory/p07j9sjk

>>133307

)interesting digits(

the biggest disinfo thing i see spread around is that some sort of ancient desert cult that is supposed to be literally thousands of years old is somehow controlling all the governments of western nations.

>>134092

I've known people with schizophrenia and that image does not describe them at all.

>>134609

The traits above do present themselves in schizophrenics, but the interpretation in the drawing is superficial and dumb.

>>133386

Can you explain number 6 further. Is the english translation where most of it gets lost or is the translation not the problem, but rather the interpretation?

>>133594

You would probably enjoy reading The Mysteries: Papers from the Eranos Yearbooks. They are the trasncripts of lectures given at the so-called Eranos meetings in Switzerland in 1933 or so. I think the meetings may still be held. In this particular volume there are a few essays on various ancient Greek mystery rites, and how some aspects of these were sort of copied into Christianity. But I highly paraphrase and the book is much more than this as well. There is a particularly thought provoking essay from Jung in here as well on the Eucharist and kind of relating it to older Greek rites etc. I don't know how to find it electronically, I found a used copy at a junk store lol.

Some things are worth having hard copies of as well, imo.

>>133307

>misinformation

>>132053 perfect example