/fringe/ - Fringe

This audiobook will help you: https://christianaudio.com/absolute-surrender-andrew-murray-audiobook-download

You are saved by Grace through Faith. Your works as a saved man will give you everlasting rewards in Heaven. These rewards you will reap over there. In that sense your works are very important but they do not save you. Only faith in Jesus Christ sacrifice and in the redemptive power of his blood will save you. There is nothing you can do to go to Heaven. Jesus Christ is God (the Son, the Word) just as much as God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. All three are one.

Stop beating yourself up for not being perfect. You cannot and will not be perfect. Christ is perfect for you. Pray without ceasing and ask for guidance. He will not forsake you. You may not see his hand working in your life but the Lord Jesus Christ is the author and the finisher of your faith. Worry for nothing, Trust. Keep studying the Bible, strive to walk in the spirit, shake the dust of your feet when you fall, and praise the Lord always.

God bless you and guide you in all things dear brother.

>Christianity

That was a mistake. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all creations and vessels of the entity we can call YHWH or "god". This entity is neither holy nor God, but some form of malevolent entity that has learned how to reproduce asexually, like a virus of sorts. It feeds off of the misery of its adherents, and hollows them out from the inside. Have you not seen how empty and sterile its slaves are?

Reject it and your life will improve a thousandfold, both in a spiritual and material sense. Or go die in some spiritual and mental tomb. It's your soul, do as you please.

>>127753

This, minus the stuff about YHWH, I dunno where he got the asexual reproduction stuff from. YHWH or Jehovah is just some butthurt deity who wants a monopoly on religion where all his followers become hopelessly and totally dependent upon him, turning them into his drones. He's a jealous piece of shit that deserves no following. Only reason he has any is because of (((certain people))) spreading the cancer throughout the Western world.

Of course, OP is just some faggot trying to fill up this board with bullshit, but just to inform any lurkers out there.

Why does Christianity lead to obsessive-compulsive behavior?

>>127766

[citation needed]

>>127753

Mennonites aren't very empty and sterile. The masses of Christians are but that just argues for me to pay more attention to the people who keep Christ in their heart the most.

Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

I have a theory right now called "works of faith".

I am discussing it with various Christians but I think I will have to ultimately write it all down and support it with scripture.

What I'm looking for is the "salvation minimum". What is the absolute minimum required to be saved, to "receive the seed of salvation which shall grow into fullness".

I don't mean this in the attitude of doing the last to be saved out of laziness or love for vice or such not at all. It just feels like to be saved requires a mountain of belief/faith in so many different things.

Apparently I have to believe in JESUS CHRIST as my LORD and SAVIOR. I have to believe and know all the different things about him. I have to call upon his name, the name of JESUS. The list goes on and on and makes me filled with doubt and sorrow.

I intuitively recognize and love god. I accept the holy spirit, the christ-consciousness, and I know and recognize the attributes of God.

Now the Bible does say that to the greeks Christ is foolishness. It may be that I am the greek. My philosophy is all greek (hermetics, neoplatonism, stoicism, etc.) and I have knowledge as a central motivator.

Jesus Christ is "The Way, The Truth, and The Life" I keep telling myself. I love this. I have zero resistance in me to embrace The Way, The Truth, and The Life. There is a way, there is truth, and there is life. The whole story of Jesus however, that whole drama of the cross, and having to apparently confess it all… it doesn't make sense to me and becomes a stumbling block for me.

I ask Christians about how people in the Old Testament were saved. I am told they were indeed saved. They have to confess any of these things, they didn't have to know the name of Jesus, they didn't need all this stuff to be saved.

Why am I burdened to have to know all these things before being saved? It's not that I don't want to study the word of god and know about and verify and see the worth in all these things. I won't give up reading the Bible because I'm saved or walking in holiness. It's just the idea that I have to know all these things to be saved.

What did the thief know about Jesus? Hardly anything. He was there dying beside him. He didn't have a Bible to read. He didn't have a complex creed or doctrine to understand. Yeah he saw Christ crucified, one of the things that I am apparently supposed to believe in / have faith in, that it somehow saved me. Yet what about Abraham and the others in the OT? They had far less to know and yet were saved.

Is it not enough that I know and love god? Is it not enough that I have faith to seek him all these years? Again, don't get me wrong, I am not suggesting people not read the Bible or become lazy and stupid.

To me, a lot of The Bible is a manual on how to live your life here on Earth. God will uphold us if we live in holiness and shall bless us in so many ways. If indeed "once saved, always saved is the truth"… and it makes sense to me, I think a saved person can still suffer terribly here on Earth, and make many mistakes and that for the sake of glorifying God and for the sake of the self-interest of that man, he should do more than merely ask to be saved, but should be wise in the ways of God, and make less of a mess of his time on Earth. So that is to me what large sections of the Bible are about.

However I get this impression from Christians like I've got this gigantic, near impossible struggle to know and confess so much about the Bible, before I can be saved. It's far-fetched and runs counter to the narratives I've heard where people get saved who never knew the Bible or whose mental and physical capacities were significantly impaired and yet they are saved too. I hear that it is supposed to be a simple faith, child-like faith, which saves.

So surely it could be boiled down to some formula, to something very simple, and easy to understand. This prompts Christians however to say not to put limits on God and such.

Christians seem to contradict themselves also in making it like this incredibly high standard where people rarely get saved unless they persevere through a very tough and life-long struggle and the vast majority of people all go to hell. Yet supposedly there's kids getting into heaven. Kids that barely know anything.

And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive. Matthew 21:22

Now the above applies to a lot of things. It's about prayer in general, manifestation, mental or All is Mind, and much of what we deal with here on /fringe/. But it could be applied to salvation. So here is my "salvation minimum".

God save me.

That ought to do it. If not that then "God save me from my sin." or if it has to be more specific "God save me from my fallen nature."

Original sin is our corrupted nature wherein we are led into sin. To be fallen, to have "original sin", is to be of a tendency towards sin. Admitting that we are sinners.

Now the fact I have to explain this suggests prerequisite(s) so here they are:

1. Sin. Sin is falling short of the mark, imperfection, error. We need or perhaps I should say "ought" to understand sin. This we probably achieve by being who we are, there is no work to be done here at all. If we weren't born sinners we wouldn't be able to be saved because how can you save that which is not needing of being saved? For the sake of clear thinking about this however we need to know the definition of sin which I have given here. This allows us to proceed to the next step. Admitting our sin.

2. Sinfulness. We are sinners. We are prone to error, we are fallible, we are not perfect. Everything we do falls short of the glory of the God. I don't know why some Christians say it's so hard to admit they are sinners. What are they blinded by? It is easy and straightforward for me to admit I'm a sinner. I only need look upon myself. It is blatantly obvious. My sins are very grievous and are written in my features. Theoretically there might be someone on this Earth who is tremendously beautiful, whose mind is incredibly clean, who has hardly anything to point to as evidence of his sin. However I am convinced that such a person would be extra sensitive to the slightest evidence of sin, that the most minor defect would be apparent to them, and that their exceptionally exalted mind would see it all the more clear. Whether you are such a great sinner that it is obvious even in the eyes of men, or a sinner such that only you know your sin (I would say "only god knows" but God can't stand the presence of sin so in a certain sense he doesn't know your sin but in another sense, mainly because of his wrath, he knows you're a sinner) know that you are a sinner.

3. I AM THAT I AM. We must recognize God. God is perfect; without error, incorruptible, eternal, infinite, omnipotent, omnipresent, etc. All these characteristics we can learn from metaphysics but also which are shown in the character of the God of the Bible, so you could say that necessitates studying the Bible, but I knew all these things before I read the Bible, so I DON'T THINK SO. If anything the Bible only introduced me to his love and his grace and his promise. I suspect I could theoretically learn these things outside of the Bible too though simply through working as I always have with the Holy Spirit and also from being in a world in which many are doing the same and god's hand is in everything.

Every man has three parts, well, NPCs/p-Zombies aside. The I AM (spirit), The Mind (soul), and The Body (body). Even the NPCs kind of have the I AM in that they being in the world are upheld by god but they don't have divine spark aka individualized, divine, consciousness in them. They aren't to be saved as there is no individuality to be saved there. To speak of them needing salvation would suggest may an arbitrary chunk of the air would need salvation too then.

The I AM is recognized the moment we realize we are neither body nor mind. So the first prerequisite is, minimally, to recognize that I AM THAT I AM. Having done that the rest will come later, all you need to know is I AM THAT I AM.

Now there's a lot of other things we could know but I don't think they are prerequisites. They might be helpful but I'm trying to outline the bare minimum. An example would be the consequences of sin, the fullness of god, etc. we ought to learn these things but they aren't necessary to our salvation.

Boiled down to a formula or prayer:

I know sin, imperfection. I am a sinner, fallen. I know that I Am, and I trust that I Am can take me away from sin, and will do so.

This is something I believe and can say without any doubt. The first two sentences are incredibly easy, you can figure this out in minutes, just from me informing you, if you haven't figured it out on your own already. The last part is pretty easy too, to know that I Am, but some contemplation of the I am will lead you to have just enough of the outline, just enough of a glimpse of your divinity, to be able to trust in I am and know his grace and his love.

THAT IS IT. In my view. You don't need to know the whole story of Jesus. I don't think you even need to know of the supposed necessity of a messiah or that such a messiah would ever have to be crucified or do or go through anything at all here on Earth, it would be a nice thing to know and realize and confirm, but it shouldn't be part of the bare minimum. Knowing about Jesus would surely be helpful but not ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY.

When I say "I don't know if I'm saved" I only mean by this that I don't know if I'm saved "according to Christians". Heck I am not even sure that I am saved "according to the Bible" but I suspect I probably am (I have read the whole Bible). But in terms of recognizing that I have need of God, that I am a child of God, that I am in good hands, that my god is a very capable God, and knowing that he is drawing me to him, and knowing that I yearn for him in all the things I do, and that I live as to increase my faith and bring glory to God, and that I will not be willfully led astray by any books, doctrines, my own theories, etc. I am golden.

I owe my allegiance first and foremost to the principles which I know to constitute the character of The Most High God. It is my intuition and my metaphysical training that allows me to evaluate a text like the Bible or the Quran and see its worth. I have a functioning spirit, I know that I Am, and I am not blind though I am often weary.

It is my feeling that many Christians are creating an unnecessary despair in me by making me doubt myself and making the faith too damned complex. It is not a hard thing for God to save me, for him there are no obstacles. So why must men make it so hard??

I am often left wondering what there even is to be saved. What do I want of body and of mind? The way I see it, and I have told, that I may as well be caste into the lake of the fire. They look at me in terror. That's how God sees it, that's how I Am sees it. Do I want to be with my parents or my Earthly friends and acquaintances? Do I want of my memories? Should I wish to have this body that I have no forever, so full of pain and weariness?

I don't care about these things. I fear not the lake of fire, the second death. It pays the price of sin I am told and I believe, but our savior the Christ has also paid for us, that we might have another way to the Father. I am perfectly fine to be saved too, but what is the difference in the end? The two war with the one, and the one is victorious, and a new and glorified body is received, and it is the same with the mind. The whole man is regenerated.

9. For first must it war against its own self, and after much Strife and Dissention it must be overcome of one part; for the Contention is of one against two, whilst it flies away and they strive to hold and detain it. (Corpus Hermeticum, The First Book)

I am not sure I know the difference at all. If it can be said there is a difference, it appears to me, that those thrown in the lake of the fire, might endure to live in the world again, in ignorance and sin. It is not made clear to me by the Christians what exactly follows. Indeed all they can tell me, both of heaven and of hell, sounds equally terrifying. Empty. Dead. Boring. At few can speak to me about Hades and a few as well simply know of the World in a greater sense than the common man does today, and includes in that definition of "the world" so much more than our physical plane. For the most part they don't seem to glimpse that God has so much more in store for us then this short life and don't seem to be all that curious about it, actually they seem rather fearful.

I struggle also with the idea that we might ever "find rest in eternity". It counter that notion with this; I am here now in eternity as ever and always. The eternal is the bedrock of existence.

I suspect personally that only NPCs could ever be hell-worthy in that they have nothing in them to be saved, no spirit, and that maybe the whole Christian thing is nothing but a big attempt to inject spirit into NPCs so they can be saved.

If that is the case, there is really no need to save anyone, for nothing is lost when a robot falls apart.

Real spirited beings are saved for the simple reason that they are divine sparks and must be recalled into God. Whether that is by the lake of fire destroying their personality or by a gradual drawing into the light which is what I assume the Christ path brings, it is the same. Just one suffers the whole way there, having to burn and be "annihilated" before unsheathing the spirit from substance, the other finds his way back to God through compassion, gently, graciously.

OP, there is a lot of misconceptions in your conclusions. Your are clearly desperate and the christians you are talking to are not helping at all. If you are willing to listen I can help you and clarify some of your doubts, like I tried to do here>>127761.

Are you willing to listen? Answer "yes" and we can talk.

I think that truly altruistic people will not give "Christianity" or "Abrahamic religion" 'the benefit of the doubt' without sufficient evidence.

Even if there is 'evidence' dogmatic Christianity is real, to ally oneself with Bible dogmatism is a betrayal of altruism.

The Bible really kills it for the rest of us. It is up to God to actually come through and demonstrate that He is the ultimate Judge and ultimate Righteousness.

t. long-time believer in "Jesus"

I think that many people who speak favorably of Christianity do so because they can afford to do so.

It is easy for the rich to be Christian.

It is easy to believe anything if you are fortunate enough to be able to do so.

>>127757

Going to read your book tomorrow if I get the chance.

>>127788

Yes I am but just so you know I am always have a backlog of stuff I'm reading, discussions I'm having, and a lot of thinking I'm doing; and I also have to eat/sleep and occasionally work or do other things. So I may be absent from the thread a few hours or a few days at times.

Also yes I am exceedingly desperate and the people around me are really not helpful. For many years I put off reading the Bible and "tackling Christianity fully" until I felt the time had come and it's only been a few months now since I decided to prioritize the Christian thing and it's turned into this epic struggle like I've never had dealing with the other religions.

>>127793

I've seen a variety of people at the churches. The Rich & Comfortable (who easily feel the love of god it seems but aren't particularly tested, so they haven't really gone through shit that would actually test their faith seriously, and of course many people abandon god the moment things aren't going so well for them, proving how shallow their faith was all along), The Parasite (Welfare types, just there for gibes or to pass the time or cause trouble), The Socialite (people there for muh community who don't actually comprehend a thing being said but like to sing and to be around people and make connections and friendships), the really old (and thus haven't figured out how computers work and were raised with this stuff), and the Earnest Truthseeker (people who seriously want to know god and higher realities and such). Oddly those "Earnest Truthseeker" types are usually ones who've been through the most shit, who've been seriously traumatized. Also little children and babies that play around but whatever I'm more concerned with the adult personality types.

I count myself as the ET type (Earnest Truthseeker).

As of yet I haven't quite got to the point of dropping the Bible or finding anything that proves once and for all that the Bible is definitely fallible (in which case I'd still consider it a great source of wisdom but foolishness to put all your trust in it alone). It does almost feel like dealing with a Nostradamus prophecy, that is to say, the tricky parts of the Bible are sufficiently vague that I might never confirm or deny it. Maybe something will come to light however where I am able to say definitively, "no way, that is just completely bullshit".

I can say that so far my struggle with the Bible and with Christianity has led only to intense and deepening confusion so far and that if I had not other texts which I've read before I would not be able to make sense of the Bible. This makes me question anyone who would claim the Bible is plain and simple to understand.

I am now focusing my attention on this thread.

May the righteous be justified.

>>127797

If you are too weak you will.be taken captive by the "Christianity Control Paradigm" and such mind constructs.

It is duping you into committing acts of evil and living a lifestyle of evil while lying to you, with the spiritual forces of that sect tricking you into thinking that you are, "doing the will of God".

If reading the Bible can "whip up" that potential and enthusiasm inside you for your existence…. then you should see to it that you use that already-existing potential and enthusiasm inside you to so the right thing and to not be duped into a bunch of nonsense just because those 'spiritual forces' have more "capability" in the physical realm.

For all we know, the end game of Divine intentions for Christians could be a "literal lake of fire" where people are "tortured forever and ever", lol.

Emancipate yourself from evil.

Emancipate yourself from error.

¶ Enter ye in at the strait gate, for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which goe in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way which leadeth unto life, and few there be that finde it.

15 ¶ Beware of false prophets which come to you in sheepes clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

16 Yee shall knowe them by their fruits: Doe men gather grapes of thornes, or figges of thistles?

17 Even so, every good tree bringeth forth good fruit: but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evill fruit.

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit, is hewen downe, and cast into the fire.

20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

>>127798

Why is your mind evil so as to pass judgment on those others whom you know not? What caused your mind to be evil instead of virtuous? You should spend your limited time learning how to be virtuous.

>>127745

I've been there. You need to back off the Christianity and just focus on the bible.

You need to talk directly to God. Formal prayer on your knees is good, but He's listening all the time so just talk to Him. Tell Him whats going on. He made you. He knows how many farts your going to have in your life, and what they smell like. Your not hiding anything from Him, and just talking to Him is pretty cool. He listens.

Your saved through faith. That means trusting in God to handle things. To quietly lead you by His Spirit communicating directly to your spirit. It's intuitive knowledge, not head knowledge.

Head knowledge is your intellect. That's why you have to be careful of Christianity. People confuse head knowledge with being led by the Holy Spirit. Head knowledge is all ego/no life. Being around it just drains you.

Christ is your connection to God, by the Holy Spirit. God communicates to your spirit through the Holy Spirit. Christ enables this connection by having died and standing in your stead.

So when you read the bible you need to have that faith active. You don't need to absorb knowledge and become a theologian, you just need to know what God is communicating to you right now, in the moment. Not head knowledge. This is where you get the Living Water, where you get things that you end up sharing with others that gives life to them, in that moment.

It is a spontaneous living process.

Religion will try to constrain you, limit you and shackle you with fear and doubts. Faith sets you free. It's measurable because it produces actual happiness, especially when shared with others.

You'll still have hard times. Things out there hate human beings who are alive, and give life.

>>127745

eyyo have you heard about Tartary? its this whole conspiracy about history and the real christians.

the sheople get the king james bible whereas that is inverted, the snake, kundalini and enlightenment is demonized and its rewritten to condone group think and weak mentality, whereas the freemasonic bible actually outright states they worship lucifer, enlightenment, in place where the official condemns it.

You've been taken for a ruse smiles.

>>127818

>posts with "chaos magick" flag

>writes paragraphs reiterating Christian dogma

>>127820

>dogma

You either didn't read what I wrote, or didn't understand it.

I'm not religious, but I do believe in Jesus Christ. I don't really believe the bible (as a historical document) but I do believe God uses it to pass on information and that it has its own power because of that.

Religion will get you nowhere fast. Lots of distracting teachings to occupy your mind. Traditions to make you feel like your doing something. But it's all time wasting b.s.

Faith is immediate, active, spontaneous, and affects our world in the moment called right now. Dogma just lets you win an argument.

>>127786

>What I'm looking for is the "salvation minimum".

The great work.

"I'm sorry, please forgive me. I love you, I thank you".

When meditating or contemplating, ask the Universe for truth and don't stop.

>"I'm sorry, please forgive me. I love you, I thank you".

>>127822

Anon, are you saying that this is what you say to God?

>>127823

That's some Hawaiian Kahuna stuff. You do it with someone in mind that you may have wronged or just want to heal/help.

Kind of opposite of the Huna death chant.

>>127823

If you know who god is, directing it to the right destination is not a problem.

>>127824

Wow, is there more indication that it is "Hawaiian" in nature?

>>127827

>>127824

>>127822

Sorry guys, just trying to understand the intentions in an honest way.

>>127829

Ask the universe for truth and don't stop. Even if you think you know the truth, keep going.

And realize the truth not by finding the truth, but by removing what is false.

>>127828

"Ho’oponopono: How to practice it in 4 simple steps"

"Have you heard of Ho’oponopono and the Hawaiian therapist who cured an entire ward of criminally insane patients, without ever meeting any of them or spending a moment in the same room? It’s not a joke. The therapist was Dr. Ihaleakala Hew Len. He reviewed each of the patients’ files, and then he healed them by healing himself. The amazing results seem like a miracle, but then miracles do happen when you use this method, or Dr. Len’s updated version called Self I-Dentity Through Ho’oponopono (SITH). I had the pleasure of attending one of his lectures a few years ago and started practicing immediately. The results are often astounding. Do you need a miracle?"

>https://www.laughteronlineuniversity.com/hooponopono-4-simple-steps/

>>127832

Also, don't forget to visit /christian/, talk to an actual priest (apostolic, not protestant), read the Church Fathers and the Creeds if you want to know Christianity and how it works.

Brother, I suggest you read Bhagavad Gita, it's worth reading even if you don't plan/want to become a hindu/vedicist.

Catholics and Protestants are just about equal in all of their nonsense.

>>127819

Give the real copy of the Bible.

>>127920

>You use Christian terminology for esoteric concepts that are known in Eastern philosophies. Break free from your programming and study other schools

I don't think you understood the goal of my post. Since OP is a confused christian, I simply wanted to clarify some aspects of christian doctrine.

>I ask of the Universe to take away your man made illusions and convictions so that you can learn of the law before you teach it

Ironic. You don't even understood my motivation, yet you speak as if you know "the law" (whatever you think it is, since you were not specific), and assume I am ignorant simply because I used christian terminology and wrote from a christian perspective.

>>127973

>shitting on another religion

>think's he's actually helping humanity

ISHIGYDIGGY

>>127973

Wait the book you posted seems to be trying to talk about some sort of original corrupted Christianity, I think. I'm not so sure honestly.

If you know how to communicate, why not just say that one needs to find the original messages and that today the messages have been corrupt.

>>127745

I've been down a road similar to yours when I was a child.

>church sucks.

>the stupid songs get stuck into your head despite their repetitiveness.

>all that standing, kneeling and sitting was a pain, why can't I just sit?

>sunday school is boring as hell.

>confessional feels like a mental torture room instead of releasing pain and sin like it was intended.

<Crazy bible beater throws a shitfit in front of mom about us putting our books on the ground outside because "Somethging something putting god on the ground", when the reality is she's just a crazy old bitch.

We never went to church again after that except for weddings or funerals. I found magick, and found my faith years later on my own. I found it all without need of a church. Church has uses, but you can have faith in whatever god you may choose even all of them if you really want.

>>127766

Communal desire and habits, less religion, more human stimulation. >>127798 explains the stereotypes quite well.

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Biblical_longevity

[redacted]

Mod note: attempting to incite cross-board raids

>>128046

>ARYAN PAGANISM

<Egypt

<Sumer

<Peru

<India

I think that sin is that which does not serve life as a whole.

I also think that sin is ignorance of god.

I am not sure that this "original sin" thing is a useful concept. It just makes everything tremendously confusing.

I've been reading for days now and getting terribly sad. I liked the Bible when I read it for myself. It just falls apart completely when it gets picked apart by others.

https://biblehub.com/kjv/2_corinthians/3.htm

Ministers of a New Covenant

1Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you? 2Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men: 3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

4And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: 5Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; 6Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

The Glory of the New Covenant

(Exodus 34:29-35)

7But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: 8How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious? 9For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. 10For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. 11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

12Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: 13And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: 14But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. 15But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. 16Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. 17Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

I feel like I am able to understand and benefit from the Bible because I have a good sense for what the important parts are and what the essence of its teachings are.

My agenda when I read the holy book is to know god and his ways.

Other people have other things in mind and because of this it all goes to shit.

Sigh.

>>128087

>lel charts

Facts are racist I guess

I do agree that "feminazi" (which btw is never used on /pol/) is a retarded term that should be erased from the Akashic Records of human history. It is clearly the brainchild of Boomer Conservatism and it implies that nothing can't be evil if it doesn't resemble National-socialism

>>128103

can* ofc

I talked to a Catholic priest today and liked what he had to say more than the Protestants I've been hanging around with:

1. Pro-Science. No enmity between science and theology. All creation is testament to God.

2. Cleared up some questions I had about "saving faith".

3. Told me that works are the way we express our love for Christ. Also told me that some of the stuff that happened before where Catholics were given certain prayers or told to touch some object or whatever and they get saved is wrong, so there's certain kinds of works that are worthless, but there's others that show our love for god.

Gave me a lot more hope and was clearing things up rather than making things more and more confusing. I didn't get to talk very long to him and wanted to talk more but I got his email.

>>128103

Being a "nazi" about something usually means being very devoted and caring about details. This is your own boomer mind speaking when you think it's negative.

Example:

>grammar nazi

Does not mean an evil language advocate, it means caring a lot about details.

>>128126

strawman

>>128169

Shill

>>127753

This statement, devoid of irony. You're just laying on your chest with your rectum raised in the air, to be pounded by Abraham's degenerate filth.

>Slave of Allah

>Servant of God

Its all the same crap

>>128187

What are you talking about?

>>127832

> Take a look at Judaism and Islam, for example: The first has the Torah as its central text, but it also has the Talmud, The Qabbalah, The Mishna and The Zohar to give you a solid foundation to help you understand the faith in its fullest; the Torah alone is insufficient for us to understand judaism. In Islam we have the Quran as the central text, but we also need (the quran itself tells us this) Hadith and Sunnah to fully understand the message of Allah.

Holy shit you are retarded

>>128072

As far as I've understood, sins are simply mistakes people make in life.

Humanity has its share of assholes, and in the past, it's always been worse because of 1. Lack of long-range communication and 2. People don't understand how important it is to care for the emotional well being of your children.

Original sin is an abuser's tool at best, and at worst, a truely demonic invention. People learn from sins and mistakes, which as such is their purpose to learn and repent from them. Original sin is not a real sin because there's nothing to learn from it but something dickish your anscestors did, and because it's "attributed" to adam and eve, you cannot repent this "original sin". Original sin is no sin at all, it's a witch-hunt label.

People pick the bible apart because they want to make a name for themselves and make mountains out of molehills in the process. People back then talked, used language, and and acted very differently than we do now. On a special note, the Revelations shitters act like Revelations is a Nostradamus prophecy, which is fucking stupid because the quotes paint a picture of what was going on back then not right now.

>>127753

>>127754

>It feeds off of the misery of its adherents, and hollows them out from the inside. Have you not seen how empty and sterile its slaves are?

Have you been feeling miserable lately for no reason?. You describe perfectly the average N.E., there's probably one following you around, making you think bad things.

(((Everyone's 'favorite' peddlers))) don't care about god, they just care about what serves their ends, hell, many of them may be demon-worshippers and hypocrites at the extreme. They'd be straight up lolcows if they weren't politically shitting in everyone's cereal.

>>128192

no u fgt.

Just become Gnostic brah

>>128202

Thinking about it. No self-described Christians / church goers are like me anyways and I feel like they don't want my presence, like they'd tolerate openly anti-Christian and degenerates as long as they're stupid, but a questioning and bible-literate person… nah.

I might just be paranoid though but I feel this tension when I ask too many questions.

>>128215

Oh thanks for these. I got to go to a theology group right now but I'll read the probably tomorrow or when I get back.

>>128198

FYI, the Talmud says Jesus is the son of a whore

>I feel this tension when I ask too many questions

Maybe they don't know a lot and feel challeged in a way they don't like. Which denom is this church?

>>128227

>judaism has nothing to do with christianity

blow your brains out

>>128228

It was just me being paranoid…

>>127754

((certain people)) Christianity was propagated mainly by Roman, Greek, Ango-Saxon, French, Spanish, and Slavic whites. I'm an ethnic Jew (but I guess somewhat Buddhist in faith), and many of us view Christianity as being stolen from us as well as a weird bastardization.

Jesus is not the Jewish Messiah though, because he did not restore the Kingdom of Israel. Which is the most important part of the bs prophecy anyway, yet all these Christians ignore that part.

Islam just added him in there to cover all their bases imo.

The Abrahamic God is just the Canaanite/Sumerian God El but edited so that ancient Jews could feel special about themselves.

>>128226

Well yeah she claimed he had no father. Of course 5th century Jews were real butthurt about Christianity

>>128253

Can you link me to what specific part you're talking about concerning this Kingdom of Israel thing you mention that proves Jesus wasn't the Messiah?

Also does it say Jesus had to do it in his lifetime or is it okay for him to just do it later on when he comes back?

>>127745

Myadvice to you be not to try so hard. Also don't talk to Christians. Most of them are not saved, are going to Hell and are either possessed or of their father the devil. Hope this helps.

>>128253

>I'm an ethnic Jew

I have a question regarding jewishness. If in the Torah you have to have a hebrew father to be hebrew, why do modern jews inherit their ethnic identity from their mothers? By this criteria wouldn't people like Solomon be considered non-jews?

>>128254

No. Christianity wouldn't exist without Jews converting. The ones that did not convert were the ones that followed a corruption. The Talmud is that corruption. But yeah so you're correct because there are no real respectful Jews, except for perhaps Messianic Jews! And this retard here apparently has no knowledge of any of this

>>128274

>I only said the talmud is a tool to understand judaism, not christianity.

So how is it a strawman? Your lack of ability to reconcile this obvious paradox where you treat judaism and christianity differently yet say they are related shows how retarded you are. If they are related, then the talmud is related. If the talmud has nothing to do with christianity then why aren't judaism and christianity unrelated?

>>128358

What do you think you're trying to talk about?

>>127745

Hey, I remember when I wrote this. Right about that time I was reading that guy who said he did it all to be a famous writer. Get off the chans, goat molester. Stop fucking yourself in public. Disgusting.

>>128362

Another refutation.

In this arid wilderness of steel and stone I raise up my voice

that you may hear.

To the East and to the West I beckon. To the North and to

the South I show a sign —

Proclaiming, "Death to the weakling, wealth to the strong."

Open your eyes that you may hear, O! men of mildewed

minds and listen to me, ye laborious millions!

For I stand forth to challenge the wisdom of the world; to

interrogate the "laws" of man and of "God."

I request reasons for your Golden Rule and ask the why and

wherefore of your ten Commands.

Before none of your printed idols do I bend in acquiescence

and he who saith "thou shalt" to me is my mortal foe.

I demand proof over all things, and accept (with

reservations) even that which is true.

I dip my forefinger in the watery blood of your impotent

mad-redeemer (your Divine Democrat— your Hebrew Madman)

and write over his thorn-torn brow, "The true Prince of Evil — the

King of the Slaves!"

No hoary falsehood shall be a truth to me — no cult or

dogma shall encamp my pen.

I break away from all conventions. Alone, untrammelled. I

raise up in stern invasion the standard of Strong.

I gaze into the glassy eye of your fearsome Jehovah, and

pluck him by the beard — I uplift a broad-axe and split open his

worm-eaten skull.

I blast out the ghastly contents of philosophic whited

sepulchres and laugh with sardonic wrath.

Then reaching up the festering and varnished facades of

your haughtiest moral dogmas, I write thereon in letters of blazing

scorn: — "Lo and behold, all this is fraud!"

I deny all things! I question all things!

And yet! And yet! —

— Gather around me O! ye death-defiant and the earth itself

shall be thine, to have and to hold.

What is your 'civilization and progress' if its only outcome

is hysteria and downgoing?

What is 'government and law' if their ripened harvests are

men without sap?

What are 'religions and literatures' if their grandest

productions are hordes of faithful slaves?

What is 'evolution and culture' if their dead-sea-fruit is a

caitiff race, with rotteness in its bones.

Might is Right, all chapters

One of the greatest occult books to ever be written, the anti-bible to free you from christianity

>>128423

The Old Testament may as well be subtitled "Might is Right" though.

>>128645

Can you not? Have some respect for Jesus. Why does everyone attack Jesus like this?

>>128671

probably in an attempt to evoke a strong negative emotional reaction from his strongest adherents, for the types who find Christians as a general group to be insufferable.

>>128722

That last bit at the end of the bible probably ruined Christianity the most where it said you can't add onto it. At least Hindus aren't so damned scared of other religions.

>>127745

Is that Cher's tranny daughter?

bump

And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see mee, and live.

>>128750

Why must mundies always spread ancient copypasta they don't understand, always out of context? What do you think you're accomplishing?

>>128253

I don't really care whether the kike on a stick is the real "Jewish messiah" or not, the point is that this one Jewish sect that emerged was all one big psyop with the goal being the political subversion of the Roman empire, which is why it was "open to anyone" as they went all over the place and spread it. The psyop ended up working pretty well after the leaders of the empire (particularly various emperors) began to adopt it thanks to some (((folks))) influencing them. From there, it spiraled downhill, and spread across the Roman empire into the rest of Europe. Afterwards, not being a Christian made you a "savage", and the Catholic Church eventually gained enough power to basically kill anyone who didn't accept the beliefs (assuming they had even escaped the indoctrination from birth to begin with, which was practically impossible at the time for the average person since the Church didn't allow people to read anything or for any information to spread either). From there, the virus spread and has continued to infect the West to this day, to the point where people grovel all over the place and go out of their way to suck the kike on a stick's circumcised dick 24/7.

>>127752

Faith without works is dead.

The original Christians were gnostics.

Here is a perfect example from Psalms 3. Note that wisdom is sophia and that is specifically refers to SHE aka Sophia.

https://biblehub.com/kjv/proverbs/3.htm

Trust in the Lord

1My son, forget not my law; but let thine heart keep my commandments:

2For length of days, and long life, and peace, shall they add to thee.

3Let not mercy and truth forsake thee: bind them about thy neck; write them upon the table of thine heart:

4So shalt thou find favour and good understanding in the sight of God and man.

5Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

6In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

7Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.

8It shall be health to thy navel, and marrow to thy bones.

9Honour the LORD with thy substance, and with the firstfruits of all thine increase:

10So shall thy barns be filled with plenty, and thy presses shall burst out with new wine.

11My son, despise not the chastening of the LORD; neither be weary of his correction:

12For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

Blessed is He who Finds Wisdom

13Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding.

14For the merchandise of it is better than the merchandise of silver, and the gain thereof than fine gold.

15She is more precious than rubies: and all the things thou canst desire are not to be compared unto her.

16Length of days is in her right hand; and in her left hand riches and honour.

17Her ways are ways of pleasantness, and all her paths are peace.

18She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.

19The LORD by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

20By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew.

21My son, let not them depart from thine eyes: keep sound wisdom and discretion:

22So shall they be life unto thy soul, and grace to thy neck.

23Then shalt thou walk in thy way safely, and thy foot shall not stumble.

24When thou liest down, thou shalt not be afraid: yea, thou shalt lie down, and thy sleep shall be sweet.

25Be not afraid of sudden fear, neither of the desolation of the wicked, when it cometh.

26For the LORD shall be thy confidence, and shall keep thy foot from being taken.

27Withhold not good from them to whom it is due, when it is in the power of thine hand to do it.

28Say not unto thy neighbour, Go, and come again, and to morrow I will give; when thou hast it by thee.

29Devise not evil against thy neighbour, seeing he dwelleth securely by thee.

30Strive not with a man without cause, if he have done thee no harm.

31Envy thou not the oppressor, and choose none of his ways.

32For the froward is abomination to the LORD: but his secret is with the righteous.

33The curse of the LORD is in the house of the wicked: but he blesseth the habitation of the just.

34Surely he scorneth the scorners: but he giveth grace unto the lowly.

35The wise shall inherit glory: but shame shall be the promotion of fools.

>>129815

Where is the pain in your body? What's it affecting?

t. might just pray for you but want to know if it's your muscles, certain specific regions, or what exactly I got to pray for

>>127745

I'll take a more unconventional approach to this and say that Christ is attempting to communicate with you on a level that normalfag christians probably wouldn't get, which results in dissonance.

>Christians also always discouraging me from reading anything that isn't the Bible or taking an interest in anything that isn't the Bible, even though I feel an intense desire always to look into the mind, into psychic powers, into all the things that make me feel and appreciate the reality of god and the majesty of his creation

Looking into the mind would be a good place to begin, it's likely where Christ himself interfaces with you.

>but Christians say I can't just worship God it's got to be all about Jesus

Call me ignorant, but isn't Jesus just God interfacing with humanity?

>besides I asked them if Jesus was a beautiful man and they quoted me a part in the Bible where it basically says he wasn't

>how can a perfect man not be beautiful

Christ may be infallible, but his followers surely aren't.

>>127745

>read books and Bible…

By lying you are only hurting yourself.

>by faith not by works

This proves you're lying because Jesus says otherwise only about a million times. "Feed the hungry cloth the poor" "Do unto others" "Don't have slaves" "Honor thy father and mother" "Don't commit adultery" "don't murder" "take care of your mind and body" etc etc etc etc

These are all works not faith.

"I help those who help themselves"

"The way way heaven is through me"

Don't be a pussy, either you want to be a better person or you don't but the path to salvation is by becoming Christ like by following his advice.

>>130000

>This proves you're lying because Jesus says otherwise only about a million times. "Feed the hungry cloth the poor" "Do unto others" "Don't have slaves" "Honor thy father and mother" "Don't commit adultery" "don't murder" "take care of your mind and body" etc etc etc etc

When did he say any of that stuff?

Btw the law becomes a message of "thou shalt have no tendency to" under grace instead of condemnation under wrath.

>Don't be a pussy, either you want to be a better person or you don't but the path to salvation is by becoming Christ like by following his advice.

Won't make a difference if you don't have Christ in you.

What a waste of a GET.

Humility bump

>>134622

I would also consider looking into Catharism and Valentinian Gnosicism.

http://gnosis.org/library/valentinus/Brief_Summary_Theology.htm

http://www.cathar.info/cathar_beliefs.htm

>>130016

Warmane, Lorderon. Already multiple 4chonners there.

t. 4chon