/sw/ - Star Wars

>>20017

>no source links/bad OP

>4chan meme

Please lurk more.

>>20021

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/fascism-in-star-wars.50049893/

whats your username?

>I'd rather not have Star Wars be a refuge for actual fascists.

>This is also why, for example, I get uncomfortable with people who suggest, IRL and for reals, that the Empire or First Order is the best way to go, as opposed to people just being fans or whatnot.

>Yes, I found the "First Order is awesome" roleplay hilarious…until I realized actual Nazis were joining the fandom to say it.

>Then I backeddddddddddd the hell away.

>the Fel Empire is problematic

It's funny because the Fel incarnation was written to turn the Empire into a true protagonist faction that could roll with the other good guys against the Sith and the Dark Side because it systematically eschewed everything "problematic" about the Galactic Empire before. No speciesism, gender equality, and a Force-User order sworn to uphold the Light-Side. The only way it could be a problem anymore is if somebody just finds it really offensive that a legalistic, orderly society governed by a monarch can be heroic.

It was shit too. Darth Krayt did nothing wrong

>>20030

Sloane could have been a decent character. In her debut appearances she came off as a classic Imperial officer archetype just painted over in estrogen and melanin but not in a way that was finger snapping and hip checking in your face. When Wendig and the other soylaacs started writing her in stuff, though, that potential was ruthlessly smothered.

>WTF are RL white supremacists even

People who recognize that Moff Panaka was something their nu-nigs could never hope to be.

>>20032

They're also making shit about the First Order's lore.

>Eliminated all differences between its members

It's a stratocracy highly divided by rank with many noble aristocrats and independent capitalists in its apparatus.

>completely state-ruled economy

It depends on trade and collaboration with corporations outside of First Order space

>Imposing the FO's ideology on the entire universe

Technically true but we aren't told exactly what that is or how it's going to get near as far as the Empire which controlled maybe 65% of the Galaxy at its peak.

>>20037

I never had a beef with Sloane and Randd, they seemed like typical imperials even though I did get a suspicious urge that Disney was pandering a little, but they were decent enough early on. Then comes Chuck Wendig and turns them into the most obnoxious nig-tier stronk man/woman of color no one asked for who are now better than even fucking Thrawn. Might as well make everyone a Grand Admiral or Grand Moff at this point. Chuck Wendig and the majority of Marvel's writers are honestly even worse than Rian.

>>20037

>They're also making shit about the First Order's lore.

No fucking shit. They're just trying to find ways to inject politics into the forums even more by claiming that playing as the FO drew in literal nazis into their sessions and they can't enjoy SW because of such obvious bs. They're just playing the victim card to gain sympathy to get asspats and ideological circlejerking.

>>20037

>usurper supporter

Krayt was the ruler of "Edgy Empire", for fuck's sake. His rule was shitty, problematic, invited open rebellion.

Fel was deposed by a coup, not a popular rebellion, one could even consider that the majority of the populace wanted to get rid of the GFFA at the flimsiest excuses.

>>20041

They also seem to think that the Fel Empire were a "good fascist" organization. They seem to not understand ideas like absolutism, constitutional monarchy, or oligarchy and just think if something isn't democratic or representative it must be fascism. Brainlets RP'ing as educated pop culture critics.

>>20043

When Darth Krayt assumed his rightful place on the throne of an Empire aspiring to govern the galaxy, the vast majority of the Imperial population and its officers of state recognized him as their Spiritual Liege. It's just the nature of Imperials to bend knee and serve the Sith. It's their place in the great design of things and is only right and proper!

>>20037

>Darth Krayt did nothing wrong

the rule of one was autism and he was chewed out for it

>>20017

lad, theforce.net has always been a cancerous shithole, i knew that back in 2008 when i posted on there and some retard spewed out about how the nintendo 64 has the best graphics of all time.

>>20026

>Yes, I found the "First Order is awesome" roleplay hilarious…until I realized actual Nazis were joining the fandom to say it.

Nobody likes the First Order. I'm a fascist and I think the FO is fucking retarded and makes no sense.

>>20049

>something isn't democratic or representative it must be fascism.

I think its more simpler than that. If it looks like Nazis or resembles something else that vaguely resembles a nazi, then its a nazi.

>>20050

>how the nintendo 64 has the best graphics of all time.

I think I know the faggot you're talking about. Some smug Nintendo-obsessed ideological elitist with an IG-88 avatar right?

>>20071

fuck if i know man, i haven't been to that pit of soy since i read that post back in 2008.

>>20050

>theforce.net has always been a cancerous shithole

JCF is basically the neogaf/resetera of star wars. Is 8ch /sw/ really the only non-compromised star wars discussion board on the internet?

>>20136

>JCF is basically the neogaf/resetera of star wars.

That's pretty harsh. Is there any site outside of major social media so bad it deserves to be compared to resetera?

>>20136

There was a major pro-EU forum someone linked here once that focused around SW game modding and space combat. I think the link was posted in one of the Battlefront threads.

>>20136

Found it (I think): http://thrawnsrevenge.com/forums/index.php?topic=7471.0

This shit reminds me of half's /swg/. It's got obvious shills in there who bitch and moan any time anyone brings up the Empire favorably and they always bring up xenophobia or fascism, then claim they just want a politics-free SW and totally aren't marxo-cryposters.

>>20032

It's hilarious when SJW types paint communism as a good thing because muh equality and fascism as bad, when even in their narrative communism is several nightmare-leagues worse than fascism ever was.

Yeah, you're equal under communism, either equally dead or equally miserable or equally dying and miserable. I remember reading some slavposters on some other board where they were wanting pro-com Antifas to come visit Eastern Europe and preach about how good communism is, because they'd get the everloving shit beaten out of them for it. Slavs know how bad it truly was.

>>20188

>they'd get the everloving shit beaten out of them for it

ha, more like they'd never return because azov would kill them

>>20136

I don't like neogaf, resetera. the last time I went on either of those sites it was filled with a shit ton of racist antisemitic retards, never closed a browser tab faster then that moment. yikes 😨

>>20188

You can watch youtube videos of college kids lecturing former soviet citizens about how they didn't experience real communism and don't know what it is.

>>20244

>being this leftypol

Russians missed the Soviet Union, meaning they missed being a superpower. Most Russians disagreed strongly with letting the satellites go. If you look at your own poll you see this breakdown: 4 of the 9 former Soviet countries have all groups below 50%. As to why the elderly would have higher support, it's because their pensions were tied to the soviet system and they lost everything.

The question isn't 'was communism good?' It's 'was the dissolution of the soviet union good.' This has nothing to do with missing the retarded economic system everyone agreed was broken and everything to do with national pride and retirement pensions.

>>20246

Beat me to it.

>>20244

>>20246

This.

Older people in the Bloc don't like the Soviet Union because they miss communism, they miss being a superpower and miss the culture they had. It wasn't until the USSR dropped communism ala China in the 1960s that their economy exploded and began to rival the US.

The most ardent anti-communists are ones who lived through it, especially people in the Soviet satellites (conditions were great in Russia, sucky everywhere else) and people who lived during the Stalin years. Ask any of them, and even if they miss the USSR, they don't miss communism.

>>20246

>Russians missed the Soviet Union, meaning they missed being a superpower.

It isn't only Russians in the graph, and it's purely speculative as an interpretation, especially when speaking as if this feeling is the only feeling and entirely representative the demographic as a whole.

>As to why the elderly would have higher support, it's because their pensions were tied to the soviet system and they lost everything.

As if the security of that system and the USSR had nothing to do with each other. No, it's entirely coincidental that their pensions were destroyed when capitalism was introduced. Not only that, but a good part of the age range was too young for pensions to be so dominating their thoughts when the Soviet Union fell.

>This has nothing to do with missing the retarded economic system everyone agreed was broken

It's disingenuous to speak of an "everyone" with no evidence (or even a remote possibility) that "everyone" agrees. Statements like these about "everyone" are merely repetitions of cant, thoughtless and performative rather than true.

>The question isn't 'was communism good?' It's 'was the dissolution of the soviet union good.'

You believe these questions aren't tied together at all now? You can't use life in Eastern Europe under the Soviet Union as your major example of communism as a "nightmare" reality, then, when contradicted by evidence, go back and say, "Well, it wasn't communism they liked, but the USSR," even though this was the very same "nightmare" reality of communism you were referring to. It's utterly schizophrenic argumentation.

>>20252

>It isn't only Russians in the graph, and it's purely speculative as an interpretation, especially when speaking as if this feeling is the only feeling and entirely representative the demographic as a whol

Which I addressed. 4 of the 9 former Soviet countries are below 50%

>As if the security of that system and the USSR had nothing to do with each other.

The security is what bankrupted them. The CIA believed the Soviet Union GDP was 50% of America's and they spent 33% on defense. The numbers were closer to the opposite: it was 33% of America's GDP and 50% was spent on defense. It was unsustainable.

>No, it's entirely coincidental that their pensions were destroyed when capitalism was introduced.

Because the money system was totally fake. This is why there was a massive barter based secondary economy. It was inevitably going to fall apart and those people were the unlucky ones.

America is going to have the same problem with social security - too few workers to support the old. Those about to retire will be angry when the system fails.

>Not only that, but a good part of the age range was too young for pensions to be so dominating their thoughts when the Soviet Union fell.

And were too young to have lived under communism also, but lived under the after-effect period

>It's utterly schizophrenic argumentation.

Well no, it isn't, and I explained why. Are you going to argue the Soviet system was a good one? Why did it dissolve? Why did the military coup to prevent its fall fail? Why was popular support so low? You're in cognitive dissonance because you want to support communism so you're arguing that the Soviet Union was great and perfect but fell apart but if there were any problems that is not communism.

That is schizophrenia

>>20252

>>20244

A FUCKING BLUE FAN

>>20244

>>20252

My family grew up in the Soviet Union, I can confirm you're full of shit.

>>20256

>The security is what bankrupted them. The CIA believed the Soviet Union GDP was 50% of America's and they spent 33% on defense. The numbers were closer to the opposite: it was 33% of America's GDP and 50% was spent on defense. It was unsustainable.

Actually, according to Yuri Maltsev Soviet GDP was closer to 5% of the US's total. Polite sage for doubleposting

>>20271

>Pic

Was that poll taken during the USSR? There might be a bit of bias if that was the case.

>>20263

I mean, the USSR had a lower per-capita economy due to the poverty of the satellites, but their actual economy was strong as shit. It died during the Arms Race. Hell, Reagan incurred more debt than any other President himself, our economy would've died too without plenty of Eurobankers and Chinese dudes to borrow from.

Still though, >>20271 is completely full of shit. There's no source to that poll, and the question itself is loaded.

On topic try listening to the podcast in the first post of the thread linked >>20024 if you want to test your soy tolerance. I can hear how skinnyfat the hosts are.

>>20282

They've all got the soy vibe, there's no denying that lack of masculinity or physical strength. Soy aside 1 of them sounds biologically normal, the second is faking a nerd accent (that had better not be his real voice), the third is gay or at the very least has fag sexual tendencies. I think only that one sounds curable.

>>20278

Fascistposter here and massive anticommunist.

60s and 70s USSR economy was actually very good. They were growing rapidly and by the turn of the 80s had come to be the second largest in the world and only about 30% smaller than the US economy, which considering their building in only 35 years was very impressive, though the US had just gone through a terrible recession in the 70s.

But the best part of this is their economy only grew when they went the way of China, de-Stalinized, and embraced free market concepts.

>>20272

>Was that poll taken during the USSR?

It was taken during the Gorbachev era, shortly before the restoration of capitalism. Do you suppose he and the bureaucrats who largely supported him were trying to falsify the results against their own prerogatives? What a curious theory.

>>20273

>you could demonstrably prove that soyviet GNP was significantly smaller than GDP

There's nothing obtuse about pointing out that the measure being used wasn't GDP. It was simply one small falsification among many.

>the monetary system was so hopelessly inflated and dysfunctional people were forced to stop using it and resort to barter

You're describing what occurred mainly during the Perestoika era, due to economic liberalization. The problem of black markets and barter economies actually worsened during the 90s; capitalism didn't improve this.

>The pensions being given out were practically useless because the money they were printed on was useless. "Capitalism" insofar as you can even refer to voluntary exchange as some kind of corporeal entity, far from destroying pensions, improves the quality of life for everyone and allows for more wealth to be invested into retirement.

The latter statement isn't even true in the West (government pension plans are on the whole much better than market-based retirement solutions), let alone reflective of what happened to Russia. You're also contradicting either your own or the other person's point about the older people being angry over pensions destroyed: why would they be angry if more wealth was being invested into retirement under capitalism?

>Friend, I have a timeshare in Siberia to sell you. No need to pay for it either, you'll just work it off when you arrive.

This is mere bluster. Do you suppose everyone in the USSR lived in a Siberian gulag?

>It does however put me far closer to primary sources than you have ever been

I hope you are aware that anecdotes are not data. Personal stories are not overall historical trends, nor are they necessarily representative of the population as a whole. I'm surprised you don't know this.

>I'd call a senior advisor to Gorbachev a credible source any day of the week.

I'd rather use historical consensus on analyses of the economic data rather than the say-so of a single advisor to Gorbachev, but that's just me.

>>20277

>There's no source to that poll, and the question itself is loaded.

You know, you can look up the referendum and its results yourself. It's not an obscure event. I shouldn't have to baby you. Of course you're going to reject it anyway.

>>20278

>I think it's very fitting that the commie chose a cringe thread as the best place to sperg out about the USSR. It's really poetic.

You guys have been the ones sperging out about "muh pinkos" even before I posted a response, making shit up that I never said or that you have no evidence for, along with being triggered by the Hapes Consortium flag. I only started by posting a single image with one sentence. It's ludicrous how many responses have been composed of sheer invention, anecdotal evidence, and raw assertions backed by nothing but hot air.

>>20287

>shortly before the restoration of capitalism

The Soviets dropped Stalinism (which wasn't even what lefties call "true communism") in the fifites and instated free market capitalist reforms in the early sixties.

>>20290

>Traviss

I've learned there's no quicker way to trigger leftshits.

>>20294

Ironic considering her views. But I guess "glorifying" war and battle is just too much for these pacifistic faggots to handle.

>>20017

Holy fuck it's bad there. They literally say that Chuck Wendig is better than Timothy Zahn because Zahn portrays the Empire semi-positively sometimes.

>>21552

Remember when Jedi Council Forums used to be politically incorrect and complain about Jaina being a Mary Sue? That was back in 2004 but even back then the site was semi-shit and full of pretentious ass hats.

>>21553

I've actually never been on there before. Before I discovered this board, the only Star Wars related part of the internet that I frequented was Wookieepedia. But I can't believe the gall of those fucking cucks. Imagine liking unironic stereotypical bugman Wendig more than Timothy fucking Zahn!

Also, I'm kinda pissed that this thread get derailed by people arguing about communism. I posted here to keep the thread to it's true purpose: mocking leftist normalfags and nu-wars fans

>>21553

TFN had some shitty posters, but it also had a good amount of cool people partly because the internet in general was better back then. Every site has shitty posters, but even the worst TFN posters back then couldn't begin to compare to some of those other sites, which were arguably the prime breeding ground for the SJW infestation we face today.

>>21554

It's gotten bad on a lot of the interwebs. Halfchan's Star Wars talks on tg are usually infested with dweeby cucks who gripe and moan that Disney's fine and it's only the /pol/boogeyman complaining about politics ruining SW.

Bring up the Empire doing anything good and see how quick you trigger the tism.

>>21578

Sounds like refugees from the /co/ general that got killed by the mods.

>>21578

>>21579

>halfchan

Stop being a battered housewife.

>>21580

It's difficult anon. It's more active than we are at /sw

>>21579

Self-admitted /co/ refugees and antifascists. The thread's been infested by them for months now and they've pretty much driven out anyone with a dissenting opinion, and Force help you if you dare to criticize the Jedi or the Rebels.

>>21726

>It's difficult anon. It's more active than we are at /sw

Indeed it is worrisome considering the amount of influence 4chan has (although its a far cry from what it used to be). /tg/ is in a sad state these days, and the tabletop scene is becoming more infested with casual 40k fans rather than actual 40k lore experts and its only helping to kill the fantasy part of it. Bring up classic D&D and you actually get laughed at for it being "kiddie shit". Happened to me irl

On the bright (or weird) side, a lot more sites outside of 4chan are going against Disney thanks to the Resistance cartoon. Even the faggots on shitholes like IGN and Anime News Network are on our side now. https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3086583

>>21731

>Bring up classic D&D and you actually get laughed at for it being "kiddie shit"

the fuck

i'm a casual 40k fan who only likes dawn of war, but even i think this is dumb as fuck.

>>21733

The problem is the majority who dominate the scene now on half of 4/tg/ **and in the areas I frequent" are newfags, with most oldfags now remaining in niche/exclusive groups to avoid the casual newfaggotry infesting things. Its not as easy to join up with these niche groups irl which is the real bummer. Sure I could easily join up with a group online, but there's something about being there playing with others irl that has a nostalgic affect on me. Its been a long time since then. I just hope this is only a major problem on 4chan and in my areas rather than everywhere. It would just be a hope killer if otherwise.

>>21726

>Force help you if you dare to criticize the Jedi or the Rebels.

I'm not one of the full-blown "muh empire was the good guys" people, but to act as if the Rebels and especially the Jedi were beyond criticism is as retarded as it gets.

>>21731

>the tabletop scene is becoming more infested with casual 40k fans rather than actual 40k lore experts and its only helping to kill the fantasy part of it.

I don't get the how and why of this. Wouldn't those people just stay with Dawn of War and not bother with the tabletop stuff?

>Bring up classic D&D and you actually get laughed at for it being "kiddie shit". Happened to me irl

Fucking faggots, tabletop wouldn't even have been a thing without D&D. I hope they get mauled to death by dragons.

>>21743

The recent trend has been them chimping out anytime the Empire's brought up positively or Rebels are brought up negatively. They go off on tirades calling them /pol/fags or shitposters or Putin fetishists. It's some seriously cringe shit to read and I unironically think some kind of infiltration has occurred, either from half/co/ when its general got nuked or from one of the falling giants like Neofag, Tvtropes, or Resera, all of which have had definitively provable posts talking about getting into 4chan and which boards to go to, /tg/ being one of them, and with Disney's huge push for esjaydubya bullshit in Star Wars, it seems like they'd be flies to dog shit on that.

>Wouldn't those people just stay with Dawn of War and not bother with the tabletop stuff?

40k's pretty intimidating in all honesty if you're a total newcomer. The games can help you branch out into it. The problem with newfags is they play one campaign of DoW and then assume they're a Lore Master™ and everything they say is law. A lot of them are also your cancerous Chaosfags who play along with GW's game of making Chaos as bullshit overpowered as it possibly can be.

>>21746

This. We've lost the "survival of the fittest/git gud" element. And 40k and tabletop is getting plagued by newfags who are just in it because its mainstream or because they heard about it in the Big Bang Theory or about that 40k cameo in Ready Player One. I think Alfabusa's TTS series has helped to introduce a lot of casuals into 40k much like Disney's faggotry has invited wokefags into SW or made wokefags out of old fans. Shit's getting fucked all around.

>>21749

Don't let paranoia get the best of you, anon. It's more likely the fallout of that faggoty Rogue ddirector spouting off about the Empire being a white supremacist organization (despite all the "diversity" seen in the Disney version of both Empire and First Order) for the virtue signaling points. This is more likely to be the standard leftist call-and-response. Bring it up the next time someone tries to shout you down. Make them look stupid. React as if they are stupid. Watch and enjoy the fireworks, and stop despairing.

>>21735

>Sure I could easily join up with a group online, but there's something about being there playing with others irl that has a nostalgic affect on me.

You might not have a choice except to join or start a group online if the faggotry is as bad as you say. Whatever you do, you need to be the one to curate the content, not some random retard on YouTube. The GM has the final word on content in all /tg/-related things, so you need to show everyone that your content is better.

>>21746

>It doesn't help that everything is fragmented into generals nowadays, so there's no overall community (or board culture or gatekeeping or whatever you want to call it) that makes people adapt or fuck off.

There's only one way to solve this. You'll just have to build something up from scratch.

>>21759

Thank you brother. We'll all get through these dark times.

>>21768

Always remember, these antics and pure rhetoric are your primary tools, together with a knowledge of both continuities. Contrary to what some boards would have you believe, infographics are mainly for consolidating a foothold (and only after you're sure you've got one). Also, no sperging out at people. Be as caustic as you like, but the moment you lose composure is the moment you lose the argument to these bottomfeeders.

>>21731

40k has always been full of cancerous little twerps who shit up everything they touched. If you attended any sort of club you met a lot of those /co/ types. They followed the mainstream like it was their only purpose in life. Bought the latest movies on DVD, watched normie TV and spent a fortune on 40k.

These people aren't foreign elements they're the same piss weak betas who have been around /tg/ shit for decades now. It's the same way most of id software turned into cucks. The libertarianism of most /tg/ communities shifted towards commie as the mainstream started to push equality bullshit which they agreed to on libertarian grounds (they're not smart to figure out the difference).

>>21735

We're not even in niche groups any more. We simply left and walked away from many communities. Even the niche groups don't like racism or sexism so the old guard get booted the moment they say women don't belong in male communities or you're sick of niggers.

>>20188

The thing about leftie communist wannabes is that they have a very distorted idea of what communism is. They focus on the muh equality angle to the exclusion of everything else (most of them don't even understand the economics of it) and think that it was some kind of paradise for fags, feminists and degenerates of every kind. When in every communist country under the sun, fags and assorted degenerates like trannies were executed or imprisoned and feminism only extended insofar as women were forced to work. Other than that, they'd be surprised at how traditional many Soviet families were.

>>22178

How much of this is booted and how much is just plain walked away from it all? I don't want to deal with these fags any more so I left.

>>33362

True but also false. The USSR revolution flipped status so high was low and low was high. Which gave them a bunch of high status jews to genocide people. This system collapses rapidly because of obvious reasons. To prevent that they reflip the status around to build health families again and gulag all the trouble makers and tranny types. Once their usefulness is over they get rid of them to prevent another revolution.

>>20026

I have no idea what these people are talking about. The only time I ever saw /pol/ be the slightest bit positive towards the First Order was one time TFA was streamed and they were laughing about Starkiller Base firing holocaust lasers at the (((Republic))).

>>33362

There's something very interesting in how many of the lefties states of the XX century tended to behave more right wing sometimes than the west.

For example when you study the hippy movement during the soviet union I was suprised to know they didn't survive long since they were clamped down very early on and many of them forced to do conscription or jailed.

There's also the fact that during the stalinist era experimental art was heavily limited since most of the russian artist during that time were obssesed with "socialism realism" an opportunity that the CIA took to fund the modern arts to prove that the west was more "pogressive" than the USSR.

>>33567

I've been thinking about similar things recently—namely how much of the USSR was based on Russian chauvinism, in spite of the internationalism pushed by its intellectual forbears and the commies around today. My conclusion is that the subversives who would have pushed such xenophilia and self-flagellation were killed off in the Revolution. I imagine it went something like this:

>Comissar Sergei, we are of finding a bourgeoisie

<Bourgeoisie? Whatttaya talking about? I'm Intelligentsia, we're just like you goy-I mean proles! My ancestahs were oppressed by the bourgeoisie six million times harder than yours! Unhand me!

>he is having much gold in this chest, Vlad. And his house is of being better than mine. Be of getting the Mosin, comrade. He looks Bourgeois to me.