/doomer/ - Doomers Club

I'm hoping for the collapse, I am in a pretty decent situation to take advantage of a very cheap stock market. I intend on dollar cost averaging through it and hopefully when the market recovers I'll have a nice healthy portfolio and some hope about my finances in the long term. Here is to not getting sunk on the way, good luck.

>>5383

>record company earnings/profitability

Facebook, Apple, EA (DICE ?), etc. are losing money now, aren't they? Or in other words, their market value is going down.

>>5398

It is bad news if you are in a position to get fucked by a weak economy. If you are not in a position to take advantage of it, I would recommend accumulating money and shoring up your resources in case you get laid off. Having a strong emergency fund (6 months would be my minimum recommendation) will help in times of turmoil.

If, however, you are financially strong enough to ride through a weak economy and can afford to invest, the stock market will be on sale and you can get shares cheap. When the market goes up your portfolio will swing upwards and suddenly your money will have expanded much faster than it normally would have. Not everyone will be in this position, and it is a risky move, since you never really know when the economy will finally bottom and begin to reverse.

When it does crash, buy, buy, buy

Can someone explain to my retarded ass why this is happening?

>>5438

dup btfo

>>5386

Do not enter too early.

Let the market flush out the zombie corporations who have structural weaknesses. They need to be bankrupted (see Lehman Brothers 2008).

General Electric is one of those. There are many more of them in NASDAQ and DOW

Let the dust settle before you start buying and don't buy any banks or insurence companies. Future growth will be based on Chinese demand of our high tech products because they cannot produce it themselves. Focus on companies that can produce industrial high tech goods (not consumer products) and machines.

>>5398

One strategy is to wait for the crash to happen. Then after the crash you buy stocks at 50% discount compared to their all time highs. Then you wait 10 years to reach the ATH again and sell for double of what you invested. While waiting for the higher prices, companies will pay you dividends. You can use those to buy more stocks with it and get more dividends next year. and so on

The other strategy is basically betting (derivatives and naked short selling).

I will not explain this to you because you will fuck up everything and end up with infinite losses.

>>5402

Todays crash started with Apple. Basically they slashed sales forecast because Chinese/American trade war. This is the official story. Of course everyone knows already that they cannot sell any new cellphones because everyone and their mothers already has one. There simply is nobody left to buy their fancy gadgets anymore.

Then you also have those other reasons from my OP.

Many Analysts think that the 10 year bull market has ended and that now a recession follows.

>>5432

Absolutely this. Cash is the thing to have now. Because in every recession cash is king.

To be precise it will be USD currency which will be king in the next few months. Simply because all the other currencies are doing much worse and against those the USD looks pretty decent. Some people also say gold and silver will see much more demand but I doubt that will be the case. Traditionally during a recession, everything is tanking.

In recession times you get laid off pretty fast. So keep this anons words in your mind. Especially if you have wife and children or a mortgage. If you lose your job your bank will demand more cash from you for your mortgage because your credit rating goes down. Usually you have 30 days to pay the bill. I would say to keep even 1 year worth of expenses in cash because job markets are tough and you cannot know when you find a job again.

>>5433

You know how the saying goes:

Buy Low, Sell High.

You realize the profit when you buy it cheaply.

It will go up, Only a matter of time.

>>5438

In year 2008 our entire financial system was at risk because for many years since the dotcom bubble, money was given cheaply to banks and they used it not for production but for speculation. Lehman Brothers crashed as a result of this insanity. Then to boost growth and make the recession as unhurtful to normalfags as possible, Fed Chariman lowered interest rates near 0% to "stimulate the economy". However, the same shit happened again and everyone used the cheap money from the central bank not to boost production and the real economy, but to speculate. As a result, asset prices have been inflated into infinity, even higher than in the previous bubble:

>real estate prices near all time highs (especially in Vancouver, Sydney, Melbourne, SanFran and London thanks to Chinese millionaires)

>stock indices all over the world in all time highs

>interest rates for savers nearly at 0% (pension funds need to invest in risky stuff to pay the pensions of old people)

On top of that, you have the following problems

>companies in record debts all over the world

>governments in record debts all over the world

this is now becoming a nasty thing because interest rates are going up again.

So more and more of company and tax revenues is used to service their debts.

General Electric is plagued by this right now. They have loaded up so much debts that now with higher interest rates they have lost their credit rating.

They are traded as junk right now and cannot borrow short term money from the regular markets anymore.

To make it short. Since 2008 there has been lots of malinvestment all over the world. And now the mess is beeing cleaned up in a very nasty way.

>>5488

>Todays crash started with Apple. Basically they slashed sales forecast because Chinese/American trade war. This is the official story. Of course everyone knows already that they cannot sell any new cellphones because everyone and their mothers already has one. There simply is nobody left to buy their fancy gadgets anymore.

How this will have such a huge impact on world's economy? Few tech companies will crash, people will lose jobs, economy will go down a bit but can it really crash? I don't know if 2019 isn't a bit too much optimistic prediction but hey, I'm just guessing and never say never.

>>5488

Hi kike, is it true that your country banned porn?

People who play with money should be killed

>>5530

It is not Apple causing this drama. Mainly it is about Chinese economic data.

Some new data was released that indicates a contraction of Chinese economic activity. For example retail sales have been going down for years and now reached a new low.

Lately one Chinese expert said real growth in China is around 2% only. It is estimated that the regime needs at least 6% growth to survive because Chang says: My grandfather was starving as a farmer, my father was a sated as a factory worker and I will be computer engineer and rich.

This is why they are autistically flexing their muscles now. They want to keep attention away from their flawed economic model and blame America for everything.

China was responsible for some 30% of worldwide growth and now that they seem to slow down, they will take the world economy down with them. Basically the German economy is also dependent on Chinese companies buying their industrial machines. And Swiss and Swedish companies are delivering high precission technology to the Germans to build it in their machines. So if China goes to the shitter, it will be nasty for many people.

>>5533

Even if they did, we can just use VPNs or move to America

>>5569

Everything in life is speculation. There is no point in making it illegal because people will do it anyways.

Now back to thread.

There was a slight recovery last week after chairman powell ensured they can revert their policies any time. However, he said the same last September and then gave us a rate hike in December. It came like a hit with a baseball bat. I doubt he will change direction of his policy.

The next few months will be very interesting. I hope you all had a good start in the new year.

>>5398

>excuse me rabbi, please steal these thousands of dollars from me

>>5930

GE is in very bad situation and I read there was a hedge fund interested in buying their aeronautics business. I guess this would be the strategy. Split up the company in important and unimportant stuff, let the good stuff be bought by others and let the rest burn.

Deutsche Bank is also said to be the Elephant in the room. They have trillions of worthless derivatives in their books and essentially their true worth might be even negative. Their stocks are today trading lower than during the 2008 crisis. They even got a free bailout in 2010 after they lent out corrupt and broke greece billions of dollars. They didn't learn a single thing from their mistakes.

>why not buy banks

because they have been lending to companies and people who will never pay back the debts (broke governments, fantasy companies) or they have trillions in derivatives that are waiting to blow up once the shitshow starts.

>buying it from europe, mainly germany

yes but germany is industrial machines mostly. USA is still #1 in arms manufacturing and software.

For example when you run a computer system in your company, it will usually be microsoft products because the enterprise ressource programs and design programs run on windows.

Also, microsoft is making good money on their cloud services.

>dividends

check any stocks site for ROI of stocks (return on investment). It is usually a figure for dividends paid per stock/price of stock.

Usually you have a ROI figure of 2% nowadays. So if you pay 100$ for the stock, you get 2$ of dividends at the end of year.

Of course if the company is having a hard time they will not pay dividends that year.

dividends are basically profits that the company made during the year. At the end of the year they pay out a part of them to the investors.

>EUR

The euro is a failed construct since its inception. You cannot have 1 single currency if you have 27 different treasuries, 27 finance ministries and 27 jurisdictions who are competing with each other. Who in their right mind would create something like the EUR. Ah okay, it is a political project for Brussels to demonstrate their power (just like the EU army).

>worse than 2008?

much worse. why? because since 2008 we did not solve the underlying problems. We only created more debt and kept kicking the can. Now the debt piles have grown even larger.

>>So what then? revolution? civil war?

exactly. there has already been one incident where unemployed people from one region travelled to Beijing to protest the government. Imagine 50 million chinese beeing mad at their government and only half of them travelling to Beijing and trying to overthrow the government. This is the thing that keeps them from sleeping at night.

>>6000

you are right about central banks.

there is no capitalism or free markets anymore

there is no price discovery

central banks intervene at the markets and decide who will be the winners or losers.

Only one comment from fed chairman sent the stock markets 5% higher in one day.

>>6010

>gold miners

this is a smart move. part of the money will flow into gold because of its safe heaven status. And normally gold mine company stocks move multiples of what the gold price moves (in percent). clearly shown by the image you posted. very smart move

>oil

I don't understand that one. In a delfationary recession oil would get cheap because nobody is doing business anymore. Any explanations?

>crypto

I think in the long term you are right. BTC might to to 50K or 100K easily. it might also become some sort of international settlement system if today's system collapses. However, I think in the short term it is going down. Probably even below 1000$. There is just so many early hodlers keeping 1000s of coins they bought for a dollar per piece and it would not hurt them to even sell at 400$ per coin if they need cash.

Thank you for your insights anon

btw my portfolio atm is 40% cash, 60% bitcoin

I bought mine in 2011 so I can stomach the carnage

I might go down to 50/50, not sure yet. really feel like btc is going to 1K

I am waiting with 6 figures to enter cheaply for the next bubble

>>6065

it is true, trading is nothing for fragile people. ut you don't need a degree to trade. there is even demo accounts if you want to play it like a game.

>>6118

Your co-ethnics are shorting BTC into nothing. Turns out when they hear the term "automated trust" they get a little upset. Weird eh?

>>5488

>not to boost production and the real economy, but to speculate

ROFL!

>>9502

>>6139

God, /biz/ is cancer. Please don't bring that cancer here.

imagine not owning at least 50btc and only having boomer stocks

rofl

>>9515

Imagine buying low and selling high

ROFL!

>>9515

>only having boomer stocks

>expecting anybody here to play 'their' games

Tell JP Morgan to not crash crypto next time, ok? Thanks.

BTW I read the recession is postponed

fed chairman powell apparently wants to start a new money printing orgy and speculators are getting high on these news now.

I wonder how much longer this game can go until everything breaks apart.

Why work when you can just take loans from Powell and gamble on NYSE and get rich quick. Why even work at all? Let federal reserve print 10 gadjillion dollares and throw them from helicopters for the consumers to spend so companies have even higher profits

>>9523

Source. Also any type of recession is going to be timed to either coincide with the 2020 US election campaigning or occur right after the election ends. Why do you think Trump is pandering to Israel so much lately? He doesn't want them to crash it yet so he can get re-elected

>>9523

What do they mean by printing more money? All we do for years is printing more and more money, no? I remember USA, EU and Japan collectively started with this shit like at least in 2012 if not sooner.

t. not a market watcher

>money printing

the word is about Quantitative Easing 4

basically fed printing a few trillions of fresh dollars and buying worthless US govt debt so they can spend the money on bombarding the rest of the world.

and yes we have been doing this for a long time but the thing is Powell wanted to quit and instantly stock market started to weaken. Our entire ponzi is now reliant on a steady supply of fresh USD pumped into the system.

>>9526

>Quantitative Easing

Yep that's what I meant, I heard about it I think in 2012-14, I'm really not sure. And basically they said it's temporary but what I'm saying is that I don't remember they would actually stop with QE since then. I might be certainly wrong but it's a bit surprise to me to hear them saying "we will do it again" while I wasn't aware of them not doing it in the first place.

>>9527

>temporary

so is heroin addiction :)

we got hooked on cheap drugs and now they cannot let the patient go cold turkey because he would collapse completely.

>>5383

what do i read to learn more about markets. read part of the wealth of nations and slivers of communist manifesto in college but thats the extent of my economic literacy

>>9533

F.A. Hayek, the road to serfdom

Ludwig von Mises, bureaucracy

>>9711

None of these will teach you anything about economics.

>>9533

Learn from the chiefs in the game - jews capitalists. Knowing that they screw the economy up is nice and all but what you want to know is how to profit from it as well and help us accelerate the collapse. Don't forget about friends here and buy us Lambos when you be at the top.

>>9533

Honestly you will need some intro econ textbooks. Look for editions that are older than the most up to date ones. Paul Krugman's macroeconomics book is good (he might be a fuckhead but his textbook is solid).

>>9785

so we live in capitalism now xD ?

>>9873

We do, you lived under the rock until now or what? Saged for krautchan tier.

>>15023

>Stalin missed this guy's family

xD

I'm happy to see you around bro

xDDDDDDDD

those fucking boomer cucks always shitting on Japan, herbivore men and birth rates. I finally signed up for an account on Zerohedge and I will show those shitflakes the enlightenment

Fucking boomer cucks. For them everything has to be perpetual growth so they can get their pensions paid out

And just as expected, Donal Trumpsky ignores main steet and is only focused on the benefits of wall street:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04-16/trump-may-regret-his-fed-takeover-attempt

He will repeat this meme into eternity. Claiming his policies are gr8 and making hamburgerland gr8 agen. But in fact only Wall Street is profiting of it. And the tax benefits he gave out last year that was the ultimative cream of the crop for them. And what did wall street do? Did they invest in new machine parks? Did they hire more normalfags for work? Did they scale up their production capacity?

Of course not, they took their cash gift and parked it offshore. Wall Street is just a vampire that is extracing money out of the real world economy. And Trump is letting them run rampant while claiming to represent Joe Sixpack.

>>15549

On a side note: Stock buybacks were illegal until year 1982. There was a reason why this was illegal. So that companies could not artificially make themselves appear like they are doing great. When you reduce the amount of stocks available by 10%, you can make your ROI rates go up by that difference without producing anything in the real world. You just take out loans and buy your own stocks on the stock market. Example:

A company generates 10M in profits and has 100M in equity

Its ROI is 10M/100M = 10% ROI

now Mr. CEO buys up 15million in equity and the math looks like this

10M in profits divided by 85M in equity = 12% ROI

In nominal terms, this is an ROI increase of nearly 20% in 1 year, without doing any real work. It is fraudulent and misleading. The company is not creating any wealth nor producing any more units of its portfolio. Simple balance sheet cosmetics

And here some more doom porn:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04-16/where-inflation-hiding-asset-prices

>tldr: real inflation rates are between 10% per year (1980 method) and 6% per year (1990 method) but nowhere near what FED claims (2%)

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04-16/hamilton-ive-bad-feeling-us-following-footsteps-bernie-madoff

>tldr: our economic system is a ponzi scheme, central banks are fucking young people in the ass, boomers are rich already but want even more and the entire pension system will fail because people are not shitting out kids fast enough to take care of muh boomers

But no wonder, after 3 editions of QE, the S&P index grew 300% from its 2009 lows. That means it quadrupled because FED started buying all this paper on the open market. Now that they are selling this crap again everyone is panicking about it because they can't make money now by just selling toxic waste to some bagholder that happens to be the central bank

>>5930

If you're semi serious about dividends, look up the Dividend Aristocrats. They're all blue chip stocks that increased their dividends for 25 years straight or more. My advice is to try to balance growth and dividend yield. Between reinvesting your dividends to buy more shares/DRIP and increase in stock value, you'll be sitting pretty when we recovered from the upcoming recession.

>>15729

There is no afterlife.

>>15554

Do you know the breakpoint where you should stop investing in survival shit and start playing at finance? I keep a small amount of cash on hand but a lot of my savings go into guns, ammunition, reloading components, water filters, etc.

>>15740

Classic example of portfolio diversity. If you can profit from markets and use those profits to stockpile ammo and water filters, that's pretty based.

>>15742

I'm more of seeking advice as to what percentage of my portfolio ought to be my survival stockpiles. Ammunition retains value pretty well and guns are both immediately useful in an emergency, along with often appreciating in value over time although it admittedly varies by brand. Colt firearms come to mind as a boomer gold standard for retained value; FN is also a good choice. I'm more keen on investing in historical surplus- my father got me a SMLE No 1 MK. 3 for $200-300 US probably 10 or so years ago and their current price is around $650 to $800 for good examples. Once I've got a collector's licence I can have guns shipped straight to my house, saving me extra costs.

My bet is on Makarovs going up as the imports slow down. From what I understand, a lot of surplus is very cheap for around a decade until stocks dry up/imports get banned/etc. then it goes up. Great for collectors but bad for shooters.

But luckily for me, I can just reload the cartridges I want and not pay Prvi Partizan $2 for every trigger pull.

Sample text

Economic surplus

Coming world crisis

Impending catastrophe and how to plan for it

>>15854

Same problem I have Australia-san

how are you doing man?

>>5432

This is how plebs would do it. I'm practicing my short game, so when it's no longer a drill, I get to 50x my networth in a single year. If it comes crashing down, I'm ready. If not, I'm still ready.

My problem hasn't been finances in a long time. My problem is that I'm having serious trouble seeing any reason to care about other people besides myself. Maybe there isn't one. Maybe it's not a problem. Maybe it's just the truth.

>>15930

[spoiler]You can turn off the cameras yourself. Why do you think slingshot become thief's best friend? Or you can literally just like niggers in UK steal iphones from people's hands.[spoiler]

>>15930

Stop paying off the debt. Just stiff them.

Credit is a force multiplier for your networth. But if your networth is going to be zero for years, fuck it. You don't need to be paying off the debt. Take out a huge loan and invest it (not in college– I mean, actually invest it with the intention of getting an ROI). Stiff them and focus on raw networth.

Then, later, when your networth is 5 digits, get a secured credit card and run all your expenses through it. Depending on the time-frame from your last charge-off, it could take a few years to repair the credit, but that's fine. That's just more time to build up networth.

The rich will have it better when society collapses. It's a pure numbers game. Better equipment and prepared properties will always provide a higher chance of survival. You do not want to be the guy trying to rob the human skull trophy hunter.

>>15930

>1K5 in debt

Robert Kiyosaki, author of rich dad poor dad, is USD 600M in debt

Just the difference is that his debt is parked in equity that generates cashflows (stocks of companies and rental units at good locations)

Normalfags park their debts in sports cars and mcmansions and wonder why they poor

However, many CFOs are now calculating with a recession by summer 2020 so I would wait with buying any stocks or real estate. We are now at all time highs and the market must come down first.

The amerikanjin poster is right. If you don't have equity, you can always take a loan. Just remember that when you fuck up it will hurt very much.

And for investing in things you have no idea of. Gambling is the addiction with the highest suicide rate, so before you do something stupid, think 3 or 4 times about it.

Did the BO delete all the old posts by TOR users?

>>5488

>General Electric is one of those.

No fucking way burgers will let GE fall, its way too strategically important. They will probably nationalize it or just bailout it.

>or insurence companies.

Why not?

>Focus on companies that can produce industrial high tech goods (not consumer products) and machines.

Like what? ABL?

>>15729

Ask the venezuelans how its like to be in the middle of a collapse you leaf

>>16920

>Ask the venezuelans how its like to be in the middle of a collapse you leaf

He's a Canadafag. Canadafags have no culture or identity to the point they'd rather LARP as Venezuelans lol.

Anons, you know I have been talking about the Japanification of the economy for quite some time now. Today I found an interesting guy on jewtube to explain in detail what is going on in the world:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtwxhT8e7xQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YTyJzmiHGk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaNxAzLKegU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt3KdH1uk-c

Richie Koo coined the term "Balance Sheet Recession"

Basically it is just like an alcoholic that goes into hangover mode after a long drinking spree and then he is fucked for some time until he recovers:

>central bank turns rates low

>companies start taking up loans

>bubbles appear in segments of the economy

>companies all rush into bubbles, buy speculative assets for lots of money

>prices explode

>central bank steps in, raises interest rates and slows new credit injections

<a dangerous bubble is appearing in this and that segment, we don't like this

>eventually the bubble runs out of new fools to buy at new tops

<bubble pops

<gorillions of monies evaporated into thin air overnight

<awwww god please no

<Taken up 100M in debts to buy 100M in speculative real estate

<not the real estate is worth only 30M

Now begins the interesting part:

>now that companies burnt their fingers with speculation, they swore to themselves:

<NEVER EVER AGAIN

<well, at least we are still selling cars and phoro equipment

<we burnt our fingers with this new speculation but at least we are not completely fucked yet

<so we will just use our cashflows to pay these debts and eventually everything will be good again

>central bank steps in:

>this bubble is taking us into a recession, we are lowering interest rates to stimulate recovery

<yeah good for you fagget, we are never ever again loading up on debts

>interest rates at 0%

>still nobody is taking out loans to invest in new production

>even if they take up 0% free credit, they will invest it in Vietnam, Bangladesh or Philippines, not at home

>central bank: holy fucking shit, why are they not investing, money is practically free

>are they fucking retarded or what

<we will never ever again take up loans and fuck ourselves in the ass my friend

This is the downward spiral we are facing. People burnt their hands in the 2008 crash.

They will never ever take debts again.

Now the problem we are facing is that a balance sheet recession takes 15 years to recover. So companies gamble on bubbles and then they are practically for 15 years in zombie mode and sucking the economy dry just to pay back their bad gambling debts. The correct solution would be to let them all go bankrupt instead of keeping them at artificial life support. Sure, we would have 2 years horrible recession, but the companies that would sprout of the ashes of the bankrupt ones, would be productive again. And when zombie companies recover, they will never ever take on debts for new investments because they will never ever again want to repeat the same mistakes. They would rather only fund small investments with their own cash flows instead of taking up shitloads of debts and do the same mistakes all over again.

So, since 2008, we have been in a balance sheet recession. Companies have been paying back debts instead of investing. Because they all got fucked after the Lehman moment. On top of that, everyone optimized the fuck out of his company and nobody will ever again take up loans and invest in the west because demographics tell us there is no growth. Those manufacturing jobs Trump was talking about? The ones that come to america? Guess what, those factories will be fully automated. No humans will work there.

Because wages that means cost of living for workers are too high. To make us competivie with the 3rd world, we would need to lower the cost of living and with it the living standards.

Also, Koo says:

>well if private sector is not investing, govt must step in and invest to keep GDP stable

>otherwise people will lose their jobs and it gets really nasty

this is what I don't like about him. He is still a Keynsian at heart. He just tells us govt intervention is not bad per se even if central banks and their easy money start bubbles in the first way we just need to ensure that govt intervention can countermeasure the previous type of intervention that got us into this mess.

>okay but when the govt is 200 Trillion in debt, what do we do then

<well, we can deal with that problem later

he is a smart guy but he is just another boomer who just delays the problems to the next generation

>my ponzi is going good, I made my millions, you young people fuck you, make your own money, fix the problems we left you

All in all, his videos help you understand why there will be no recovery in the west but sadly he doesnt have a solution either …

>>18087

Keynesians are too retarded to get this.

They've spent the last couple years discussing negative interest rates, even. As in, you take on a loan and have to repay less than what you took out. Because that's definitely not going to end in inflation of Zimbabwean proportions.

>>18136

Argie here, can confirm this because its whats happening (not bongo-land levels tho, 25% a year) after a decade and a half of keynesians fucking things up by giving free money and printing more

>>18087

First video is just the old guy advocating for SEA countries to keep screwing everybody else with unfair trading practices.

Certainly a bright future ahead of us, right chaps?

>>18166

Anglos should be shot just for the inventing words chaps and lads. I don't know why, every time I read this knife is opening in my pocket.

>>18168

Don't cut your tights latvianon, i worry about you.

>>18169

I see what you did there, alright, you won this time, it was funny.

>>18168

Whats wrong with the word 'chap'? Lad sounds retarded, I give you that.

>>18197

some of us would rather not think of cowboys or the Folsom street fair

>>18136

>literal Austrian

>bashing Keynsians

Mein Össi Kompatriote

>inflation of Zimbabwean proportions

this gentlemen, is the real Elephant in the room.

Inflation is still low. Why is that so? Because all this newly printed money from Central banks, it never left the banking sector. The banks pumped it into stocks or derivatives but there are no companies taking this money to buy materials and land to build farms or factories for production. So the money is just sitting in the bank accounts of Wall street mostly instead of tickling down into the real world economy.

Koo had a chart explaining exactly this problem. The monetary base went from 400% (UK) to 1100% (JPN) of what it was before the crash. All thanks to money printing orgies that never stimulated anything other than speculation markets. This basically means we are facing inflation rates of up to 300% - 1000% if this money comes out uncontrolled into the real world markets.

The federal reserve is especially in a very bad position because they have unleashed a 2 Trillion QE money printing program that is now sitting on wall street accounts. For 2 years they have been trying to suck this money out of the system again because real world markets in USA started to take up loans and invest again after Trump election. Also notice the sick fixation that Trump has with the stock market.

But every time they move too harshly, the Jow Jone stock is crashing again. They are really in deep shit and there is no fix to the problem. Lately Powell was expected to lower interest rates again because the Dow was weak again. He didn't and implied they will wait and still want to "normalize" everything. Meaning they want interest rates of 5% and Fed balance sheet reduction. Of course this would instantly flush the economy down the toilet. Or what is left of the economy.

The tragic of the story is that pension funds are fucked. Interest rates are low and they will stay low into eternity. In Japan they were at 0 for 30 years and people are still not spending. On top of that, now that companies AND governments have loaded up insane amounts of debts, they are dependent on low interest rates or else the interest payments start to eat up their entire tax revenues.

We truly live in a clown world

To the people who know about this stuff, do you think it would be a good idea to stockpile some gold or silver before the possible upcoming stock crash next year?

>>18241

I am not that sure anon.

You are right, historically gold goes up in times of recessions but I think Silver will be hit hard in the next recession because demand for Silver is mostly industrial. And in recessions, industry tanks badly (also demand for all industrial metals in general). In 2011 Gold skyrocketet because of the Euro crisis mostly. But then investors found out the world is not ending and you can make more money in stawks.

I think the next crisis will be a deflationary recession where people will be paying back their debts. They will step back their own consumption, and start saving wherever they can to shrink costs (companies and private people). As a result, demand for everything will go down and prices for it will also sink. Or rather cash will appreciate because there is no work and no cash flows and everyone is desperate for cash.

In those times, Cash is king. People also say King Dollar and see it as some kind of safe heaven asset in times of uncertainity. Or to say it in another way, Cash will appreciate against everything because everyone is short of cash and needs to pay his bills. Therefore I think you are better of with Cash (Dollars) than with silver.

But of course you can keep enough cash to pay your bills for a longer time and park the rest in gold. You just need to remember that if gold market tanks, you might be forced to sell your gold at a loss. However, I don't know what currency you have in Uruguay and how stable it was in the past but gold might be better than your local currency even. And always remember, Gold is priced in USD, so if Gold goes up in USD and Uruguay currency goes up as well against the USD then you might not making any money.

https://goldprice.org/gold-price-history.html

Good Luck!

>>18241

As wise gypsy said - steal all copper wires.

>>5383

you are now my favorite jew.

even though this is probably a LARP

this is all stuff people have said since 2012.

i dont doubt this will happen. but this not a current happening. i'd say we got until mid 2020s.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtparSnQhFc

remember, its all mental conditioning.

What stocks do you suggest jude?

>>18385

You dumb nigger, this applies to everyone that trades heavily with the usa. The yield curve inverted here, and it's only a matter of time before the bubble pops.

>>18391

>it's only a matter of time before the bubble pops.

your right. but it wont happen this year.

id say mid 2020s

What do you guys think of leveraged ETFs? My plan would be to wait until after the recession and load up on 3x and 5x ETFS. So long as we get an actual recovery and not slip further down, I'd be making gains in the hundred if not in thousand percentile.

>>18385

Thank you William, I love you too

>this been repeated since 2012

and I wonder how central banks managed to keep this shitshow going on for so long. But now the signs for recession are getting stronger and stronger every day. Currently the auto inventories (unsold cars) in america have reached nearly 5 Million units. This last happened in 2007 and you know what happened then …

>What stocks do you suggest jude?

Never buy individual stocks, buy the entire index

you can fuck up with single company easily but it is unlikely that the entire index goes to shit all at the same time. But of course, wait with buying until stocks come down at least 40% from their All time Highs of Sept 2018

Remember, during the japanese real estate bust, home prices fell 87% even. So maybe we can expect price corrections of up to 60% this time. Of course then life will go on, companies will survive the recession, they will produce stuff again and they will sell, make profit and pay dividends. I am just saying that today's prices are too high to justify buying it.

Then you ride the next boom until a new ATH is reached and then you sell again. You will make double of what you paid plus all the dividends you milked for 10 years.

>>18396

Actually the recession pretty much started in late 2018 already. Companies have less orders, they are slowly scaling down their production again for heavy machinery. Soon the companies that buy those machines will be the next ones who will face lower sales volumes and scale back too.

But what you say is probably true for another scenario. In 2024 it is estimated that Medicare will run out of money to fund poor boomer billy with his medical stuffs. By year 2024 it is estimated that the entirety of new loans taken out of the US gov will be used for paying only interest on already existing loans. That means they will have to accelerate their debt creation even faster and faster.

But that will not be a 2008 like recession, it will be full blown venezuela mayhem

In any case, what uruguay-san is telling might be good idea. To load up some gold coins just in case everything goes to shit. Just so that you are not standing there with nothing while everything is burning down.

>>18397

Leverage is gambling and gambling has the highest suicide rate of all addictions. Just keep that in mind. If you are ready to fuck your entire life for those profits, go on. What ETFs are we talking about? Commodities or special stocks index funds?

>>18415

I don't know economics, I do know that I've read more or less what you claim in your post on zerohedge for the past 10 years, always reported to be just around the corner.

Why is it different this time?

you are right, central banks have been really good at keeping the ponzi alive without getting us into hyperinflation yet. This time it is different because the symptoms of 2008 are showing up again but there is nothing central banks can do anymore. Interest rates are already near 0 and QE is useless when nobody invests in new production.

>>18437

>ECONOMY STRONK

>DOW TO INFINITY

this is what makes me shit my pants most

It is exactly like the last few times (2008, 2001).

>record low unemployment

>record high stock buybacks by CEOs

>record high profitability

>record high tax revenues (especially germoney)

>record high stock markets

>record high real estate prices

I already talked about how Trump likes to fetishize the Dow and always takes it as an indicator that he is doing a gr8 job as POTUS. Lately he was bullying Jay Powell into cutting rates a few percent points to boost the economy even more. The funny thing is, When all comes to crumble, Trump will be blamed by everyone.

>>19293

Maybe its latent patriotism speaking, but I can recommend Bitpanda, as far as non-anonymous services go. It's been reliable and isn't gonna steal your money.

Just make sure to then properly anonymize the money so the state can't steal it.

Also, monero>btc, since its anonymous by default.

Ideally though, do a service for btc payment since that way no name is ever attached to the money to start with

What is your recommended method of anonymizing your transactions?

I checked bitpanda, and it asks for your name and country of residence. Do they do some kind of ID verification or can you just bullshit on it?

>>19299

Send through a mixer. Also, use TOR with your wallet, always.

I've used Bitcoin Blender before and it worked fine. http://bitblendervrfkzr.onion/

>>19300

I think you can do small transactions without ID, but anything larger needs it. Not sure because I've been verified for years.

That's why I said to buy that way and then anonymize afterwards.

>>18417

It's like the emperor has no clothes. Many people recognize it, it's not really up for debate but someone has to say it.

Those articles on zero hedge are showing you things disintegrating, but the collapse will happen quickly once it gets going. It's not an easy thing to know the exact timing. That might sounds evasive but it will come, it doesn't have to be this way (which is why people stand up and talk about it / warn about it) but the current financial and monetary system is ensuring these things keep happening. The current rosy picture is an illusion provided by loose Fed policy. Look at the recent traction about MMT, it's insane. It's denying the reality of finite existence. This is also the reason they are letting in the brown hoards. They cannot afford to have the population count decrease because the debts incurred and still incurring are predicated on productivity of the future population.

>>19293

From my experience Bitcoin ATMs are best

the people on localbitcoins are all useless. They are either homosexual flip floppers when prices go up they want to buy, next day prices fall and they shit their pants again or they are scammers.

If you don't have ATMs in your region then try to find someone in LBC who seems to have a good reputation. The last resort would be centrallized exchanges but it takes time to open an account and it might get you in trouble because banks hate crypto and they will suspect you of illegal shit just because they can.

>>19346

This is very dangerous advice you give. There are algorithms on exchanges that try to scan your bitcoins where they come from. If they see your coins come from the darknet, mixers or anything related with those things, they will flag you and report you to police. I don't want anyone to have drama with police for nothing.

Mixers are okay if you do darkweb stuff or deal person to person but not for when you want to deal with official institutions that have to follow KYC and AML regulations

Another problem is when he wants to cash out again.

>anon, where the fuck did you earn the money that you used to buy this appartement in the capital city center

>your tax report says you were unemployed the last few years

>are you a criminal or what

<gets jailed

<appartement confiscated by tax and drug police

always remember, if you plan to cash out, you need a valid receipt, where you bought the coins from, from whom and what time. Or no big exchange will want to touch your coins again. If you plan something, always plan it until the very end or else you wake up with bad dreams one day.

One final advice to anyone getting into BTC:

Don't panic. BTC can fall down 90% overnight but it will come back up. Because supply is scarce. If every single millionaire on the planet wanted to buy 1 BTC, there would not be enough of it for everyone. THis is why BTC will always have some value. Another advice: Only buy for so much money you can afford to lay around for years. I mean, don't spend all your savings on BTC if you are living off your savings. Just buy some amount you can shoulder to not have right now. Then put away your coins for a few years and forget them. Then in a few years come back and see them grow.

In 2011 my cousins told me I was retarded to get into it when prices were crashing from 30$ to 2$

In 2014 my cousins told me I was retarded not selling after prices went crashing from 1300$ to 200$

In 2017 my cousins also told me I am a fucking lunatic ratard after I refused selling at 20'000$

In my eyes, BTC will one day reach USD 250K. That is the equivalent that BTC would be worth to all USD bank notes that are in circulation (M3 money supply or how it was called). Other currencies are not included.

lately, on /n/ I read a funny term

one anon posted:

>negrohedge

lel, just wanted to let you know

>>21148

which is an apt description, back people don't hedge their claims nearly as much as white people do.

>>19531

So, from your warnings I get that you should get bitcoin to do Internet stuff? That selling them to get USD to do stuff IRL is quite hard right? I hate this nigger existence tbh. Fuck the banks and the kikes.

>>21166

>zero

>negro

the funny part is that it even rhymes

my heart was filled with childlike joy

>>21167

it doesnt mean you should not try to get affluent

it just means you need to do it correctly and in accordance to local laws to prevent any complications in the future

>>21174

Yes, but explain this to me, why can´t I just say "I bought some stuff on the internet that was worth 5000 USD each, now it´s worth 250k each, if you can do simple math you nigger you can see how I got wealthy". Fucking kikes.

yes but read up

>civil asset forfeiture

basically federales can just claim your money comes from criminal activity and they can confiscate it until you prove them otherwise

it happened in america for some guy who had a large sum in cash during a traffic control

just don't give govt a chance to screw you

there is no need to make silly tactical mistakes

>>21288

Why are albanians so clever? I knew few and all of them were into some type of financial scam.

>>21289

The only albanian I knew made me my morning espresso at an italian bakery. I would have asked her out if she liked dogs, but she didn't so I have never gotten to know much about them.

>>21288

>they transfer the deeds to their houses to one and other to show verifiable real estate assets

this is how they are here as well:

>cousin works at construction company

>Blerim joins

>after half a year there is another 3 of them there

>they bully everyone else out of the company

>or sabotage your tools and you cannot work on construction site

>get fired or leave

>they already have another guy prepared to take your vacant position

They have this jewish talent to act like they are harmless and humble people when in fact their intentions are always sinister

And that about helping each other is right. They help each other establish businesses, get contracts for work and they elbow their ways up and go over corpses if necessary

>>good income but not verifiable, lots say they are "jewelers"

ahh, yes, here they are second hand store owners, fast food restaurant owners or "logistics company" people.

we all know what is happening and what "logistics" they are doing but nobody cares enough

but that story was hilarious. yeah, this is how they operate. even when they are not into drugs and arms trafficking or prostitution, they steal or scam other. And what I hate most about Albanians, you cannot do trading with them. They show up and think the prices are like on bazaar:

>but this item is damaged no it is not

>I want discount

>and I want this and that included

go fuck yourself blerim

then there was this other story my sister told me:

>has coworker

>Squip woman

>has ugly nose

>wants surgery

>but to not pay for it

>claims "painting fell on my nose"

>healthcare insurance pays her surgery

>meanwhile honest people are paying from their own pocket

why be honest when you can cheat …

>>21289

Albanians are specialists when it comes to being criminal

We say, their children already learn how to steal in the cradle not that serbians are better in that regard, we just are not that professional to not get caught

>>21291

On one side they make 10/10 wifes and mothers, value family above everything. But her family. Well, if they happen to hate you, they will show it and never accept you ever and if necessary make life hell for you. If they do accept you, they will do anything for you. It is a gamble. The best ally, worst enemy scenario. In general catholic albanians > muslim albanians

>>21299

So get an albanian mail order bride and my life will be complete?

>>21303

50/50 gamble

either you get introduced to her family, they love you and brother Rexhep finds you a job at his company or he does not accept you, gets his homeboys Refik, Driton, Dardan and Enver to dispose you into the ocean.

>>21304

Sounds like a win either way.

>>19531

>Other currencies are not included.

REEEEEEEE!!!!

>tfw went all in on Monero in 2016 because of muh privacy

>>21334

>>tfw went all in on Monero in 2016 because of muh privacy

I wasn't all in but biggest part of my portfolio was in Monero, and guess what - I kind of regret I sold it because if there is one crypto I still trust in 2019, then it's Monero.

Gentoomen,

I think the doom porn is finally taking shape to become something big.

Today Dow Jones fell below 25K. Apparently the 25K mark was psychologically important.

One might claim that this is the beginnings of a downtrend.

Then of course there is the CHina USA trade doom porn. USA clearly has the upper hand because China needs the US high tech products but USA can substitute the made in china cheap stuff with products from other countries. In the short term this will favor USA. The panic that is going around now is basically that USA/China trade war will inevitabily ruin both economies and that it might be one of the reasons to trigger the next recession.

The rare earth minerals export ban might make a comeback but in the end, USA can produce those themselves and Australia has giantic deposits as well. They just can't compete with China when it comes to cheap prices.

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-05-29/all-major-us-equity-indices-below-critical-support-bonds-dollar-rally

courtesy of negrohedge

It will be very interesting to see how this trade war plays out.

However, the Chinese are a rising empire and USA is an empire in decline.

They will not stop China from getting stronger in the long term.

Especially when the rest of the world is demanding their products as well.

>>21690

>It will be very interesting to see how this trade war plays out.

Let us pray for a nuclear holocaust.

>>21690

>China needs the US high tech products

China produces all of the US high tech shit.

>>21690

Econ-doomer can you explain why the fuck btc is at $8600 and rising? why is the price going up? another pump?

>>21765

>implying assembling iphones is something only the chingchongs can do

Mexico makes phones too, apple could move iphone production there if necessary

>>21787

In 2018 when the price crashed on the exchange after being bubbled up, big fishes have been started buying up. I know one guy that works for a Lichtenstein investment company / private bank and he told me they are buying all the coins they can get. That was around November last year. He met the grandson of Erdogan in Stuttgart for a BTC deal. They were exchanging 500K Bitcoins.

So basically, the big fishes have been buying up this shit while the gulible get rich quick normies have been panick selling because they don't know how this market works. It always goes up because there is a finite amount of it. If every millionaire on the planet wanted to buy 1 BTC, there would be not enough for everyone.

Now there is a shortage of available coins because apparently everyone who wanted to sell to make some quick profits did sell already. I expected prices to sink to 1500 again. Apparently that happened earlier.

Basically people sold a portion of their BTC and spoiled themselves a little, but now nobody wants to sell because it is expected that 2017 happens again soon. People are getting greedy.

The new people coming to crypto hope for another 2017 and they are now buying from an ever decreasing amount of people who are willing to sell. Whales bought their coins for a few dollars per coin, they do not need the money but they also don't care if they sell at 3K or 15K. They are still set for life. And the big money people are also sitting on their coins because they know if this shit could easily break 20K without them, it can break 50K in the next bull run.

I personally believe BTC will go to 250K in the long run. But long run means 20+ years.

And I think it will become too expensive for ordinary people and instead, it will become a settlement system between countries and big corporations. Because in BTC you cannot be blocked out of your money if you piss off uncle Sam and Trump decides to put embargoes on you.

Very interesting what is happening now and I wonder if we will tank back to 1K5 in the coming months

>>21842

forgot to specify

The big fishes have been buying OTC (over the counter, not on official exchanges).

That means they wanted to get all the dormant coins that have been outside of the system to cause as less noise as possible on the exchanges.

I expect them to eventually move those coins onto the exchanges and then resell them to gullible normies for 15K per piece.

It is crashing back again

Always the same pattern, around a new 1000 mark, gamblers are cashing in their profits. One guy said the price will consolidate for a long time between 10K and 7K

Who knows, this world is a clown world anyways

>>21842

so would you recommend someone in my position (have about 5000$ max to spend) to be seriously considering bitcon?

>>21875

There are 2 scenarios:

>This is my savings account and I have literally no other money other than that and on top of that I am unemployed or on the verge of unemployment

no, better first to worry about source of income

besides, short term investment BTC is very insecure, it can always crash another 70% and if you can't stomach it, better dont play with it

>This is just some inheritance money I got from grandpa and I have a 9-5 job anyways and don't really need it. On top of that, I don't spend much money anyways so better to park this money and maybe in 20 years when I want to buy my own cabin in the woods I want to cash out

yes

and don't forget to keep receipts of your purchase

>>21877

second scenario, yes.

I already put 5000 in stocks that have lost a lot of value over the past 2 months. I feel like this was a mistake as my first investment, but going I told myself I didn't mind losing this money. So I'm sitting on these stocks for a long time.

In this case I will consider bitcoin. Is there a price you would say that I should absolutely buy if it goes down to it?

Thanks

>>21842

>They were exchanging 500K Bitcoins.

What? there's only 17 million btc in circulation

>But long run means 20+ years

>Because in BTC you cannot be blocked out of your money if you piss off uncle Sam and Trump decides to put embargoes on you.

Dunno, in less time we're gonna get actual quantum computers and those could easily break the encryption and thus double-spend thus rendering btc useless as a currency

Maybe thats why quantum computers went from being a tiny niche for IBM and dwave, to a massive new scene with everyone making a quantum chip. Bet there's government and bank money on this.

>I wonder if we will tank back to 1K5 in the coming months

What are the odds?

>>21843

>resell them to gullible normies for 15K per piece.

So the price would collapse before even reaching the last ATH?

>>21868

When you said that I was thinking 10%, still at over 8k.

>>21879

>a certain price

it is better to buy smaller portions over a few months

you might not get the best price but it gives you a balanced average.

If you are expecting BTC to shoot up to 50K then it does not matter what price you buy at anyways.

>burnt hands with stocks

I am sorry for you. Now it looks like we are entering a bear market again. But keep those stocks anyways, especially if they pay decent dividends. Maybe if the price crashes, you can buy some more stocks for cheap and get a better average price per share. Then you don't have to wait until it reaches a new all time high to sell with profit

>>21884

This is why I tell you Finex and Bitstamp are nothing

The real big fishes are OTC deals. What you see in exchanges, it is basically gullible normies buying the overpriced coins of whales. The big deals are done OTC

>quantum computers

sure that might be a thing eventually but you can ride the wave on the way there, right?

>what are the odds

my theory was that now with the economy slowing down, companies will start reducing costs and paying back debts. In this scenario cash becomes king and nobody buys anything anymore unless really needed. So I thought in the next recession, asset prices will fall again.

But now it looks like the USA China trade war is fueling BTC instead. I also read a news article where a former Chinese central banker was denied a USD 20K money transfer by the Chicom govt. The official reason was that he was "too old". Maybe people really start to look for uncucked alternatives to fiat money.

>So the price would collapse before even reaching the last ATH?

no, the art is to sell slowly. For example you buy 1000 BTC for cheap at 3K OTC.

Then you sit on them. Then prices start going up. Prices reach 15K.

Now is the time to start selling slowly.

You go to the exchange, transfer your coins. Then you sell 10 BTC every day.

Just small amounts to not disrupt the environment.

When you have sold your stuff, you wait for prices to crash again and repeat.

This is what they are doing.

How does this paper monopoly money manage to hold value still?

>>24179

It is a combination of 2 things:

One thing is like previously, boomers. They are not consuming. So all the money that was injected since Lehman, it went from the central bank to the commercial banks. But now it sits there doing nothing. The banks would love to get rid of it but there is nothing to invest it in, nor anyone to loan it out to either. There is nowhere for the money to go because nobody is taking out any new loans. Boomers are not buying yachts because they know financial situation for them is not good and they cannot spend cash on stupid stuff. So this newly created money is sitting at the banks and waiting to go out in the real world but nobody is taking out loans.

Then the second reason. Young people are broke. They do not have well paid jobs, and no job security. So they can obviously not take out loans for mortgages, weddings or cars. And as they do not move in with their sweethearts either, there is no furniture for IKEA to sell them either. Companies have seen those trends, and companies do not even invest either they do not take out loans for investments. Because they think those trends will stay like that for long time. So basically you have an environment where nobody wants to spend because everyone thinks situation is only gonna get worse in the coming years.

This is what surprised the Fed for so long.

>holy fucking shit dudes, we injected all those trillions into the monetary system, where the fuck is consumer price inflation? We barely hit 2% this year after being near 0 for years.

However, there is actually one thing where inflation does come up. It is asset prices. Be it stocks, commercial real estate or real estate for people to live in. Be it bitcoins or gold. Prices of those things have exploded in the past few years.

You can also notice it on rent and health care prices that have also skyrocketed in the past few years.

The govt just conveniently does not count those in for their calculation of inflation so they can lie better

Prices have gone up simply because of speculation. People who had access to those cheap loans commercial banks, hedge funds have used the cheap money to speculate with it. When you pay 0.1% interest on a loan, you can take out 1 trillion in debt and go gamble with this money on the stocks markets. when interest rate is only 0.1%, you can make a measly 1% return on investment, pay out your interest and you still made 900 Billions in net profits from wanking your dick to stocks charts.

But all those price increases are worthless because the underlying economy was stagnating the entire time. And when the next recession happens, all those inflated prices will crash 50% minimum. It is all one giantic bubble. Last time we had the real estate bubble in 2008. In 2001 we had the tech bubble. This time it is the everything bubble.

>>24185

In the long run I believe BTC will go to 250K. But for me long run means 20+ years. Dunno if you can wait that long.

Also keep in mind that in year 2020 the next halving happens. That means mining rewards will halve again and that should mean further upwards pressure for BTC prices as production costs are going up for miners to mine them.

The problem with BTC is that it can crash 90% any time and many people don't have the nerves to gut that and then sell at a loss instead of just waiting for the next bullrun

>>24221

On companies and investing I forgot to add

Companies nowadays only invest to optimize their own processes read: costs. So, if they can buy a machine to fire 200 workers fixed costs, they will invest. Because you know, interest rates are near 0% anyways. So they can take out 100M USD for new machines and they pay a measly 100K in interest per year while the machines lets them fire thousands of workers. But they will not invest in new production facilities as there is nobody to buy their crap as nobody is taking out loans and nobody is spending their savings to buy their stuff.

This of course only generates more pessimistic atmosphere amongst workers

>oh shit another 200 people got fired, I wonder when I am next, better save money and not buy that fancy new SUV I wished to buy for christmas

Also, this again is this balance sheet recession phenomenon that this Hong Kong guy described. I wrote about it in earlier postings.

Anons, Deutsche is back in the news again:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-07-05/expect-lehman-style-scenes-outside-deutsche-bank-offices-monday-mass-firings-begin

Could become a problem of Lehman brothers porportions …

Remember, DB was the guys who were heavily invested in greek trash bonds during the euro crisis of 2010/2011. Without Merkels bailout of greece, they would probably been insolvent years ago already.

>>25118

About that chart

1971 was when US President Nixon announced the US central bank is uncoupling the US Dollar from gold and that you cannot come and exchange US dollars for gold anymore. Ever since prices of everything measured in USD exploded. Pure coincidence.

and here a very interesting article on energy and how it relates to our problems:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-07-11/why-stimulus-cant-fix-our-energy-problems

Up until now, I only ever thought of when energy prices are too high, then it is a problem because consumer cannot afford to drive cars anymore and the entire economy grinds to a halt

But of course, you have the same problem on the supply side as well. If energy prices are lower than production costs, nobody is gonna invest in new oil fields or alternative energy systems and that is the rather more nasty situation. Because the first thing you can medicate with Liquidity injections and quantitative easing, low interest rates etc. But once companies understand that their investments are fruitless, nobody is gonna touch risky projects even with a 10 foot pole …

>>25118

>when you're internet nerd cryptography project becomes the biggest speculation bubble in human history

Iceland-san, my friend; I am in full agreement with you that 99.99% of cryptocurrencies, ICOs, and dapps are either scams, bubbles and/or overambitious failures. I am also in full agreement that there are many useful idiots, and especially con men and hope pushers in the cryptocurrency and libertarian communities who have vested interests in distorting facts and price predictions (John McAfee, Andraes Antanopolous, Craig Wright, Jeff Berwick, Roger Ver, and other libertarian and cryptocurrency public figures.) But what's going on with cryptocurrencies is the exact same thing that happens with every new lucrative industry, people get excited and con men take advantage of it. The same thing happened with the dotcom bubble, and yet, here we are, the internet didn't collapse, in fact, some of us need it far more than most others. The only thing that happened was an immense correction in the markets.

I advise of you not to throw out the baby with the bathwater and realize the applications cryptocurrency has, and will have in an innovated form. For the first time in human history, the world has the means to render the global banking cartel's fiefdom obsolete. Means of exchange used to be something only governments and central banks could dictate, and it always resulted in financial and economic serfdom and collapse, but with cryptocurrency, there is increasingly no longer any reason to use their promissory notes, especially for those living in dire economic situations. Venezuelans are turning to cryptocurrencies to preserve their wealth against hyperinflation, the Turks and Iranians are doing the same, to a lesser extent since their economies aren't as awful. They do so, not out of ideology, but because it's the best hedge they can get, regardless if there are better alternatives. Gold and silver may be almost impossible to obtain, or the government could just steal it all like Roosevelt did with Executive Order 6102. Imagine what's gonna happen when the US dollar collapses like the British Pound and other reserve currencies before it, what the economic effects of a crisis of that magnitude will be. The SDR will only be something governments can use, so where will the world turn to then?

>>25127

you're really bored, aren't you?

>>25127

>Venezuelans are turning to cryptocurrencies to preserve their wealth against hyperinflation

not really, almost no one uses cripto, people use dollars. The ones using cripto are money launderers, that´s why you see a huge spike in "cripto adoption" charts. Its BS, is only a very little group of corrupt government cronies and mafias that launder a shitton of money and use it to bypass sanctions. The exact same people that caused the hiperinflation in the first place now love cripto, go figure.

>>25127

>when a weeaboo basementfags cryptographic experiment is the worlds only hope for freedom during times of financial repression and abuse by governments all over the globe

truly we live in depressive times …

I do understand your point. But look what BTC has become. A pump and dump scheme to lure in normies, let them buy the tops, then sell the living shit out of the market to make them panic sell when prices are 30% under water. Only to go up again a few weeks later. The idea behind btc was genius tier. But as always, the people that got involved in it, corrupted it forever…

>>25128

It is not like I have anything better to do entire day, once I come back home exhausted from bombsketball

>>25155

By injecting mining scripts on piratebay

>5383

>the flag

yeah i believe you

>>25182

Again (k)countryballing? One ban wasn't enough for you?

>>5402

typical cause of .com/it/tech hype

1.becomne unproductive / uninnovative

2. bend over

>>5488

dude , no worries , pension system along with a lot other crap is a scam

just calculate for one human how much of an average income one would have to "save" for retirement to live and maintain a average lifestyle while unable or at reduced productivity, assumeing person will live a average lifespan of 30 yrs after retirement and works an average of 40 yrs before.

start work at age 20 , save 1.5k every month for 40 yrs , have 720k saved at age 60, retire , spend 720k until death…

+/- zero

majority doesnt save at least 1.5 ( if anything at all ) per month for their retirement

it is all about calculating the sum of all shorter than average lifetimes

thats why unhealthy lifestyles are promoted

if shtf the ultimate resolve will be to ramp up a decent amount of dead consumer/producer units

while hitting the emergency brake early enough to not completely waste all potential

have you ever watched saplings grow from the forest floor after a wildfire ?

amazing :-)

>>25127

>the world has the means to render the global banking cartel's fiefdom obsolete

Not really, that cartel still has resources that dwarf the biggest crypto company out there. Right now crypto is about to get ass-raped by facebook libra, why? because that shit will be accepted everywhere, it will work everywhere, and will be supported by every app. Is the problem of convenience, btc is still too complex for normalfags despite being the most popular crypto out there its barely accepted anywhere outside some places on the internet (even steam wont support it anymore). Meanwhile dipshits think that because libra crypto is going mainstream, they dont get btc and others are going to be the CP/M and Altavista of this era, the has-been that are no longer there, and anyone who bought these coins and didnt cash out on time is gonna be a bagholder. Meanwhile you can't pull this speculative shit with libra because its a stablecoin, so no GRQ schemes.

>>25138

Same here in Argentina, the btc scene is full of avivados (wise guys)

>>25140

>truly we live in depressive times …

Yep, this is the shittiest cyberpunk future ever: no actual gynoids or replicants just shitty realdolls, no cyberdecks just crap phones that track you all day, no flying cars just boring cuckmobiles that self-drive into the side of a truck.

>But as always, the people that got involved in it, corrupted it forever…

Crypto was ripe to abuse, I knew shit was shady when one of the top guys in the btc foundation was some creep who made his first million selling pics of "young models" from russia back in the 90's when you could buy a little girl in that place.

>>24474

>colossally mismanaged the greece crisis:

You can add the Argentine crisis to that list, shit going down here

>In case you did not notice yet, Trump is a sellout and the most Wallstreet president ever. Even more than Obummer.

No shit, only burgerfags fell for the nationalist meme.

>>21946

>The big deals are done OTC

>but you can ride the wave on the way there, right?

Contradiction?

>But now it looks like the USA China trade war is fueling BTC instead

Got more on that?

>>24136

>It was a very good article but I cannot find it ATM, might post later or if any of you have it saved, post is.

Did you find it?

>>24222

That explains why any dipshit with the crappiest automation startup is getting tens of millions in seed money atm

Parking lots for big box stores are filled with new Trucks and SUVs and on the weekends those same fat fucks are out eating at all the shitty restaurants, I work in construction and we have enough work to keep us busy for the rest of the year at the least and thats not including bids/jobs bossman decides to get.

>>25415

Just like 2007

keep in mind stock markets are cyclically about 1 year in advance of real life markets. When the problems in 2007 started, it took until 2010 to reach the bottom of the crisis in real world. I remember car industry was the first ones to get in trouble with Opel Vauxhall getting nearly bankrupted and Angela Merkel introducing this new system where you can go trash your car and get money for it to buy a new one.

>>25436

>Just like 2007

>keep in mind stock markets are cyclically about 1 year in advance of real life markets. When the problems in 2007 started, it took until 2010 to reach the bottom of the crisis in real world. I remember car industry was the first ones to get in trouble with Opel Vauxhall getting nearly bankrupted and Angela Merkel introducing this new system where you can go trash your car and get money for it to buy a new one.

Well at least here in the US what really kicked off the recession were the spike in gas prices, we were paying almost what Canada and Europe normally pay in some places, it got so bad people couldn't afford to drive to work, went downhill from there.

>>25437

>cannot afford to drive to work

now this is the most depressive thing I could imagine

>be norman mcnormie

>have office job in other town

>have to drive there

>all money that would be left for savings you have to spend on gas

>work for gasoline

>so you can drive to work

perpetuum mobile

>>25438

It didn't help them much that everyone was driving those shitty Hummer H2 gas guzzlers

lol, you either go full Hummer H1 or nothing

I never understood the appeal of the H2. Or SUVs in general. If it is an offroad vehicle, it does not have to mimick sedan style

hot take from undercover tranny/pol/ economist :

https://bunkermundo.wordpress.com/2019/07/19/the-coming-banking-crisis/

>Several years ago I began work at a Federal agency on a temporary basis. This agency was one of several responsible for banking regulation. It was here that I happened to overhear a conversation that struck me as incredible. Riding in the back of a black van, I found myself listening to several senior government economists discuss what should have been the unspeakable. The crux of this conversation is as follows: the de-regulation and relaxing of capital requirements for community banks had just been rolled out by the Trump administration and both the economists noted that this would put such small banks in a situation of systemic risk. The changing interest rate environment combined with this relaxing of requirements would mean that large banks would begin to unload their riskiest assets onto community banks, including CLOs (Collateral Loan Obligations, the updated children of the Collateral Debt Obligations that were at the heart of the last financial crisis). In a recession this would mean a massive collapse of community banks across the financial system. “2008 all over again,” one said. “Nothing we can do about it,” said another.

Also If I'm poorfag who can't buy bitcoin or commodities like gold itself, is it viable to buy stocks of bitcoin mining farm / gold miner/ oil refinery?

>>25524

>be Goldman Sucks

>sell worthless paper "investments" to small banks and muppet customers of course

>then actively bet that exactly those papers will get fucked in the next year

>it actually happens, who could have seen this coming like 2008

>make billions off your bet

>small banks are now fucked, the toxic waste is worthless now and in their balance sheet

>their "assets" are less worth than what is noted in the accounting books

>this is called balance sheet is under water

>meanwhile they hold other assets as well

>performing loans

>real estate

>index fund

>ETF funds

>customer liquidity

>so they are only maybe 50% under water

>the toxic crap is worthless but overall they could be solvent still

>but law requires that bank parks the balance sheet at the judge's office

>and that a new external represantative restructures the bank again

<hello local bank. My name is XYZ ABC and I work for Goldman Sucks

<we would like to buy your bank and restructure the firm

<you know, the poor employees would lose their jobs otherwise

<nobody wants that to happen, right?

<we pay you 15 cents on the dollar of your stock value

<I mean, Moody's has rated your bank to junk status and this is a good price for a "junk" tier company, right?

>they do it because no alternative ATM

>GS fires half the employees anyways

>sell out all the assets the bank had

>cut the firm in slices and sell everything for scrap values

>A 100 billion dollar company gets thrown under the bus just so they can make 10 billions in easy money

Gentlemen, this is a lesson for you. This is how the professionals make their millions

Only dilletants deal drugs or robb banks. True professionals open their own banks…

but honestly, when you buy these crappy derivatives, you deserve to get ripped apart

of course the problem is that rating agencies rate those toxic products like they are good when they don't really understand them either…

>Also If I'm poorfag who can't buy bitcoin or commodities like gold itself,

Honestly, I feel like now is maybe a bad time for buying. 12K was rejected, then 11K, now we are hoovering around 10K. Barely. I feel like we hit a dead end and we might soon be on our way down again. But I am always pessimistic though

>is it viable to buy stocks of bitcoin mining farm / gold miner/ oil refinery?

gold stocks are good for making profits. Because when gold goes up for example 10%. Then usually the profit margins of the company that mines gold goes up by 25% or more. This is why gold miner stocks usually perform very well in gold price rallies.

So if you are a gambler then this might be better than gold coins or silver coins.

However, then the price comes tumbling down, they deflate quickly as well.

And for btc. You don't have to buy an entire BTC. You can buy 0.001 if this is what you can afford now.

>>25525

yeah it's all game for (((them))). Saddest part is, no matter how salty NTaleb fans get, I really don't see them losing without bit of violence.

About current situation tho, do you really think we will hit full recession by end of this year? I kind of assumed feds will try their best to delay it during election period. Recent crop yield, brexit, Iran situation looks dire for sure but can we finally see it all undoing itself?

investing sucks. I had no problem making side income from poker game for years but the moment I want to get serious about buying anything all my guts scream danger zone

here it is boys we have our sell-off

your recession is here

So when will the market bottom out? how bad is corona going to be? financially-speaking

>>25440

Fucking this, just get a 4 banger like a corolla or something

>>25441

It was literally a cheapass chevy suv with a bodykit and sold at 3 times the price

>>25524

>buy stocks of bitcoin mining farm

<buying stocks from a "company" registered in some shitty island in the middle of the pacific under fake names by money launderers that will fake a hack and take your cash

Did nobody learn a thing from finex?

Also avoid btc, its tumbling down what with most of the mining and trading being done in china, and china is fucked

We have entered a bear market, that is probably going to last at least 10 years or more, we are never going back to pre-covid times. It's over, no matter how much QE the FED BoJ ECB etc does, its irrelevant.

Get out of your 404ks right now while you have a chance to cut your losses, dont buy the bottom, this is a bear market, sell the rallys.

Hermano

you don't understand this

the Federal reserve IS the market

what they say goes

and they have already made clear a few times already that they will not allow the markets to collapse. This year they have officially started to buy junk bonds of zombie companies. The next logical step is to start directly buying ETFs and index funds. And it will come

We have no free market anymore because there is no price finding mechanism anymore. In a free market, the price of capital is reflected by the interest you pay on loans. In our current times, we have interest rates of near 0 or even negative.

That means that capital (savings) has no value. Nobody needs capital anymore and so nobody needs savings either. Your savings have been deemed worthless by the central bank because they will just print 1 quadrillion dollars and put it into the market at 0% if necessary.

We have no capitalism anymore because companies cannot invest their profits in more productivity because there is nobody to buy more product from them. There is no growth because everyone who is not part of the 1% is fucked forever. So what do companies do instead? Instead of investing their profits in new machines, new products and new services, new employees, they just buy their own stocks to pump the values artificially into the sky.

We have gotten rid of capitalism and what we have left now is only crony corporatism and speculation in financial assets. And the worst thing is we have conditioned the young people that this was the way to go because honest work is useless in our modern times. Only cronyism pays. So our smartest people don't want to become engineers, architects, technicians, laborants, doctors or entrepreneurs. They want to be hedge fund managers, shitcoin speculators, rappers, influencers, models and soccer players.

As long as the federal reserve keeps interst rates below the fair market value, we will just continue with the zombiefication of our economies until there is only government left and companies that are sucking the government tits. Everyone else will be reduced to serf status