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/cyber/ - Cyberpunk & Science Fiction

A board dedicated to all things cyberpunk (and all other futuristic science fiction) NSFW welcome
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“Your existence is a momentary lapse of reason.”

File: cb981237ea1804b⋯.jpg (18.29 KB, 452x592, 113:148, FB_IMG_1560622879296.jpg)

 No.56473[Last 50 Posts]

Is being opposed to the capitalist class while not giving in to idpol trickery (that includes white nationalism) is most based form of punk that could exist today anons?

____________________________
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 No.56474

Proper punk is picking the elements from ideologies and systems that corrupt society. Question authority and hierarchy

If you're asking for a list of stuff to hate on without thinking yourself, you're just as bad a drone as the average wageslave and a mere poser.

You're just looking for a schway and hip stream to swim in.

You're scared to actually oppose something, so you look for a specific subculture you can blend into and show off.

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 No.56475

>FB_IMG_1560622879296.jpg

>crypto-/leftypol/

low quality thread

punk is just DIY and going against the mainstream, stapling a political position into the movement is lame as fuck.

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 No.56476

This is a bad thread and you should feel bad

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 No.56480

>>56473

>capitalist class

>not giving in to idpol trickery

You've failed your own criteria already.

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 No.56481

I guess it means something like a liberaltarian.

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 No.56483

Punk is a slur and you don't want to be one.

Clean-your-room-bucko.jpg

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 No.56485

You know who would be receptive to this post? Reddit.

Maybe you should go back there you dumb poser cunt.

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 No.56486

File: 1b6fd22be869d97⋯.png (333.63 KB, 604x630, 302:315, 1560053380597.png)

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 No.56489

>>56474

What do you do when the current authority and your hierarchical betters are the ones telling you to "question authority and hierarchy"? Develop an appreciation for authority and hierarchy as a form of rebellion?

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 No.56491

>>56473

Communists are literal garbage. Get into the dumpster and set yourself on fire, shazbot.

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 No.56497

>>56491

>communists are the only ones opposed to capitalism

are you a double-iq american poster still stuck in the capitalist-communist paradigm?

most non-meme extreme right movements oppose capitalism.

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 No.56501

>>56497

Dont be dense. No one said there aren't other ideologies opposing it, but it's communism/socialism that is the popular one right now (duh).

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 No.56502

File: a9f0964c977c5c6⋯.png (543.73 KB, 2000x2000, 1:1, cosmology.png)

(((the capitalist class)))

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 No.56503

File: 4df84b37c554a1d⋯.gif (26.76 KB, 280x210, 4:3, an_hero.gif)

>>56502

>Atheist

>Casual flouride drinker

>Media scavenger

>News watcher

>Soda drinker

>Plastic user

>Fish oil addict

>Cargo short owner

Yikes.

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 No.56505

>>56489

You should be glad that they are same people, appreciate it and follow their advice.

Rebellion needs a purpose. Otherwise it's akin to the mindless thrashing of a five year old.

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 No.56508

File: 3cf37c64b5d6f7c⋯.jpg (100.71 KB, 1024x1024, 1:1, 1556817691759.jpg)

>>56505

>this post

are we being raided by the feds?

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 No.56509

>>56508

Right. Now I'm a fed for telling people to appreciate what they can get instead of thrashing about.

Again, rebellion needs a purpose. You take what you can get (in this case, authorities that encourage you to question and think for yourself), pick your enemy (which may still be this same authority) and THEN you can rebel.

Remember LA riots in 1992? Blacks rebelling for a good cause? It quickly degenerated into mindless arson, looting and murder that had nothing to do with the original cause.

In case a rebellion gets struck down, it should leave something to follow up on. People should think "they were fighting for a genuine cause and got fucked up for it", sparking further resistance. If you just thrash about to look punk and 水, people will remember you not as a rebel, but just another criminal. Rightfully so, I might add.

Look at successful rebellions. Even if initial attempts may have failed, they encouraged more people to join up and try again. It's up to you and I to provide that encouragement this time around.

Or, you know, you can kick down some road signs, beat up homeless people and get drunk, then proceed to declare yourself a rebel and enemy of authority.

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 No.56516

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 No.56524

>>56505

Agree. Punk is kind of a stupid movement.

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 No.56525

>>56473

Rejecting mercantile globalism and embracing your own identity

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 No.56529

>>56509

Your perception of what "rebellion" means is pretty primitive.

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 No.56536

File: 0005c21f9d5ad55⋯.png (57.28 KB, 903x905, 903:905, punk.png)

>>56473

niggers. niggers would be punk now.

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 No.56547

>>56529

>I want to be a rebel, b-but no hurty pls

Translated. But if it makes you feel good, sure, complaining on Twitter, shitposting on imageboards and coloring your hair is totally rebellious.

You're very independent and special.

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 No.56553

>>56473

>>56491

>>56525

>>56536

Fascism and racism, apparently

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 No.56554

>>56553

Can you argue there's anything more rebellious? The entire world is telling us those are the things that we absolutely are not allowed to be.

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 No.56555

>>56554

Nothing rebellious about fascism

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 No.56556

>>56547

>making entire posts refuting something that no one said just to pretend that you're in the right

autism.

>>56553

>defying the postmodern notions of race and equality

>defying the postmodern notions of authority

fascism and racism are way more punk than corporate intersectionalist leftism

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 No.56557

>>56555

Except everything, in the current day and age.

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 No.56561

>>56475

Specifically, in this day and age, the establishment is left-wing as fuck and largely driven by oppressive megacorps that have done a very good job at pretending not to be oppressive.

>Sorry anon, we're demonetizing your youtube channel, you said mean things about people who chop their dicks off and pretend to be women

>Sorry, small gun store, you sell semi-auto rifles so we're killing our contract with you and you can no longer use the best sales and tracking software in the world; also your bank is closing your accounts and your payment software is revoking their license. It's ok though - it's for the children.

>You made a donation to a political campaign that goes against what Silicon Valley believes in, Mr. Eich. You'll need to step down as CEO.

>We got our hands on your social media accounts and found that you used a racial slur two years ago. I'm afraid we're withdrawing your college acceptance.

<you are here

>You were spotted at a Chic-fil-A eating a sandwich, our CloudCam(tm) recognized you and associated your face with your social media profiles. I'm afraid we're going to have to close your account.

>Your Spotify playlist has songs about a racist country known as Rhodesia, and it's linked to your Tinder. This is racist, you can either remove them and accept a 60-day penalty of only matching with people of African heritage, or we will ban you from the platform.

>We see that you picked the German side on Battlefield V 5 times in a row. Your X-Box live account has been suspended for a week, please watch this mandatory video on diversity and the holocaust.

>Your phone audio logs reveal that you refused to sleep with this person after they revealed that they were transgender. You have been reported to the federal government for a hate crime. The police will be here soon, please remain where you are.

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 No.56565

>>56497

>slightly less lefty leftism with a thin veneer of traditionalism

>extreme right

So that's how far that overton meme window has shifted these days.

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 No.56566

>>56565

Quality post.

>>56561

Ha, ain't this the truth.

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 No.56574

>>56565

The right wing isn't inherently capitalist, unless you consider monarchy and the church to be capitalism.

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 No.56575

>>56556

>the only options are either fascism and racism or corpcuck

Seriously man, it's a spectrum. You don't have to be an extremist to disagree with corporate bullshit.

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 No.56578

>>56575

We're talking about what "punk" is though. Punk is kind of extremist and shocking by definition.

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 No.56580

>>56578

>non-conforming is extremism

No it's not.

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 No.56581

>>56580

Only if you aren't a pussy.

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 No.56582

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
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 No.56586

>>56575

stop putting words in my mouth, i never said that there were only two options.

i said that fascist aesthetics (for example) are way more critical of modern society than corpcuckery, ergo they are more punk.

also, extremism is inherently punk. it's impossible to be a "moderate" punk.

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 No.56602

Get raped OP.

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 No.56654

Anything that goes against the statis quo. 30 years ago, anarchism was punk. Now, right wing conservatism is punk. No matter the label or the prefix, what’s shunned by the masses is punk.

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 No.56656

>>56654

well anarchism is still punk, leftism though is purely accepted nowadays.

also I think punk is mainly not making the default choice. like don't live in the rat race, don't be a wage slave, try to survive on different means, try be not smelly

that means punk is i'm not afraid to fight even though i'll most certainly lose

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 No.56660

File: 8a0ad0b11dc2fd3⋯.png (436.75 KB, 540x469, 540:469, 4d8.png)

>>56654

>TFW vanilla paraphilias/kinks, wanting a steady job and raise a family with a loving heterosexual spouse is now "punk"

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 No.56663

>>56502

Based and bogpilled.

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 No.56664

>>56660

how is this considered punk?

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 No.56665

File: 3f7a097d77fa5fb⋯.png (329.14 KB, 757x615, 757:615, 1556247989409.png)

>>56664

because it has become commonplace and promoted by the establishment to have no kids or family, be a transsexual wheelchairbound midget, etc etc etc.

We live in fucking clown world. All the shit that used to be antiestablishment and rebellious are now being promoted by the mainstream. It's fucking bad for society.

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 No.56672

File: e9af14b29690116⋯.jpg (37.39 KB, 480x480, 1:1, ozob (1).jpg)

>>56665

Honk honk.

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 No.56673

Punk is listening to shitty music drinking shitty beer with the same losers for decades, and the only new blood you see are underage b& who are just there for free beer.

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 No.56683

>>56660

cry more tranny freak

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 No.56688

If punk is supposed to be rebelling against the mainstream and status quo then going against the politically correct, gender-fluid, multicultural "utopia" leftists are trying to enforce on everybody would be a good place to start!

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 No.56693

>>56672

Honk Honk, motherfucker.

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 No.56700

>>56473

>what is punk now

Wearing a suit, going to church, starting a family, and having procreative sex.

It's actually quite alarming.

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 No.56708

>>56473

I am ready to become a Kid Pix Augur.

I notice that the Subgeni aren't anywhere on the list. I can't decide if that's a good thing or not. CotS is getting _old_

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 No.56709

Too many lame motherfuckers have pointed out that the leftism of the original punk movement is mainstream now, but they make the mistake of thinking that this means that a contrarian adoption of the right makes something punk.

Punk. Is. Not. Contrarian. That sort of shit is for autistic nerds. Punk is indifference in the face of looming apocalypse, even if the apocalypse turns out to not be that bad by the time it gets around to showing up.

Fuck, even Gen X had figured this shit out before the Dot-Com boom gave everyone handjobs with $100 bills. Before the dot-com there was a movement that was essentially genuinely poor hipsterism. Not as much student debt, obvs, but the Bush I recession leading into Clinton's first presidency left a lot of people high and dry.

At that point there was a sort of… something. It wasn't an awakening, because people went right back to sleep when the brouzouf came back, but call it a stirring in the sleep. People took their degrees and worked their shit jobs and stopped moping about it. There was a move away from techno-utopianism from the 80's towards a more balanced relationship with the transitional technologies of the era. People bought LP's not because they were schway, but because they were cheap and could give decent sound on shit speakers.

People looked for authenticity, just like the hipsters, but it didn't last long enough for group pressure to settle in. To some degree I wish the dot-com thing hadn't happened at all, since you were looking at the normalization of a bunch of fringe 80's punk things. People were taking zines as something other than "radical self-expression" and were seeing them as a part of life.

Mind you, what happened in real life was probably fine - technology coming along and suddenly putting the tools for self-expression in nearly every single human being's hands is nothing to shit on. The weird decade-that-wasn't would have been punk, but it would have also been a lot more elitist

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 No.56711

File: 351c5ca15b37c28⋯.png (243.85 KB, 721x480, 721:480, Ramones.png)

File: 1b36182509c2a4d⋯.gif (15.57 KB, 1039x246, 1039:246, Ramones.gif)

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 No.56712

>>56709

Expressivity relies on free speech, which is subversive to any given establishment and thus contrarian.

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 No.56713

>>56712

Sure, self expression can be contrarian, but I think you're not quite considering history. There have been multiple governments that made free expression a dangerous act - but whose populations had a culture of expression that persisted. Eastern Europe and even the USSR both had peoples that elevated illegal forms of expression.

This is all aside the point though, the point is that Punk!=Contrarianism. There is nothing to prevent overlap, but one of the foundational aspects of punk that gets overlooked is the idea of stepping out of the world as society defines it in order to forge your own.

Punks offended people to show their contempt for the world left behind. They went for DIY aesthetics to show willingness to forge a different world. Contrarianism as a political standpoint was a part of that, but it was something that arose from other parts of the punk lifestyle.

The "punk" part of cyberpunk-as-lifestyle is pretty easily accessible. If you have friends, you can build a private set of worlds with ease, taking what you want from the detritus of the real and transforming it.

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 No.56717

File: dd122989f00e338⋯.jpg (134.66 KB, 750x1033, 750:1033, IMG_20190622_235417(1).jpg)

File: 7940853e331e54e⋯.jpg (129.25 KB, 744x1039, 744:1039, IMG_20190622_235419.jpg)

>>56660

Most people are getting married and starting families tho. You just believe they don't since you can't and no one in your immediate circle of NEET friends has one but if this was the 80s you still wouldn't be able to start a family so…

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 No.56718

File: 97c26d2853f12c9⋯.jpg (125.39 KB, 1080x720, 3:2, Fat Kike.jpg)

File: 66a1c157cb82365⋯.jpg (157.02 KB, 770x978, 385:489, New York Dolls.jpg)

File: a5d2253d028665b⋯.jpg (62.36 KB, 800x450, 16:9, skater DIY.jpg)

File: 44a686d734a5990⋯.jpg (75.75 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, hot topic.jpg)

>>56713

>>56713

The meaning of "punk" depends on context: music, sports, fashion, social order (eg, prison). If we're looking at what was the most common features across contexts, I'd have to say being a total fa᠎ggot is right up there, at least as much as DIY or contrarianism. I mean, punk was DIY until it wasn't: Hot Topic, Epitaph Records, X-Games.

"cyberpunk" is contextualized by an oppressive society, which today is Big Tech, which is staffed by the blue checkmark army. Leftism is the current orthodoxy. Hijacking a major TV station signal and broadcasting over an encrypted line "It's OK to be White" or "A man can't be a woman" or just live feeding the murder of an unborn child, is about the most cyberpunk thing you could do right now.

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 No.56721

File: 5de3b6955fce9e2⋯.jpg (83.34 KB, 633x950, 633:950, bern-foster-pin-up-no-33-t….jpg)

>>56718

You are so precious. Politics weren't punk when they were left-wing, and they aren't punk now that they're right wing.

The "blue checkmark army" only matters to people on the rightward side of the culture of academia and the things associated with them. In the real world, about half of the people in the US still get their news from TV and church gossip. All the power that checkmarks have is being used right now as strongly as it can, and all it's doing is ruffling the feathers of the internet-facing parts of the left-wing middle class. Performative right-wing politics as a vehicle for contrarian identity mongering is old fucking hat at this point.

I've found myself stuck in the same spot regarding lefties, where I just want things to go badly enough for them that I don't care what the politics look like. So, I get the idea of LARPing traditionalism as a way to freak the straights, but it's shallow as shit to call that punk.

I feel like you must be someone who came of age after 9/11. It's always weird how you folks see things.

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 No.56725

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>56721

>Politics weren't punk when they were left-wing, and they aren't punk now that they're right wing.

…what? It's the most politically charged genre I can think of.

>The "blue checkmark army" only matters to people on the rightward side of the culture of academia

You've got some serious blinders on if you don't see the pattern of deplatforming happening across the cultural spectrum, and the dividing line across which it lands.

You're just a washed up boomer who no longer has his ear to the tracks.

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 No.56727

File: 1d6cd01cebbc838⋯.gif (60.44 KB, 818x445, 818:445, Untitled-1.gif)

>>56717

>gee where have I head that before

>>56605

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 No.56738

>punk

Okay, you are assuming the -punk in cyberpunk means rebel. It does not. The term "cyberpunk" comes from a short story named Cyberpunk (duh) by Bruce Bethke. It was about a bunch of kids breaking computer systems for shits and giggles. They were not fighting "The Man", unless you consider their parents "The Man", but their defiance comes out as simple juvenile pettiness at best. Basically bratty spoiled kids being bratty spoiled kids, so to speak. Thus, this -punk refers to the "thug" meaning of the word, not the music nor anything related to anarchy and anti-system people.

This -punk particle later on became its own thing. Someone explained it more succintly than I could ever do in >>>/tg/422504. The tl;dr is that -punk is about a cynical vision of humanity, represented in settings corrupted by the greedy human nature. It never had anything to do with music, nor being a rebel (no cyberpunk protagonist has ever been a hero; only postcyberpunk soyboys do that), and above all, it has never had nor will have anything to do with communism, nazism, nationalism or whatever fucking dumb shit any of the /*pol/ flavours are trying to inject. Fuck you, you monothematic shazbots.

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 No.56739

>>56738

>thug

Specifically, the girly twinky kind who sucks dick for brouzouf.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punk_rock#Etymology

>From the late 16th through the 18th century, punk was a common, coarse synonym for prostitute

https://www.etymonline.com/word/punk

>probably from punk kid "criminal's apprentice," underworld slang first attested 1904 (with overtones of "catamite"). Ultimately from punk (adj.) "inferior, bad" (q.v.), or else from punk "prostitute, harlot, strumpet," first recorded 1590s, of unknown origin.

>For sense shift from "harlot" to "homosexual," compare gay. By 1923 used generally for "young boy, inexperienced person" (originally in show business, as in punk day, circus slang from 1930, "day when children are admitted free"). The verb meaning "to back out of" is from 1920.

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 No.56758

>>56738

Thanks for the link. Very nicely put.

One of the things that people forget about Cyperbunk is that the originators of it as anything related to the real world were the early form of the Bay Area Big Tech people that cause the people in this thread to engage the REEEEEEEEE!-engines. Like, I have a copy of the print edition of BoingBoing! and copies of Mondo 2000, somewhere. It was all nerds in leather jackets with disposable income.

Fuck I'm old. I think I saw the film in question in 1993 or somefuck.

Anyway, maybe we should all close this discussion off with the following. Cyberpunk isn't political in the sense of politics as practiced these days. Outside of the literary movement, it was always about LARPing a particular image of the future that just straight-up came to pass where the reality of medical science didn't just LOLNO the whole idea.

These days it's about a particular aesthetic and LARPing that instead. Like all of the rest of the -punk aesthetics. Steampunk is "Fat Goths discovered earth tones", Cyberpunk is "NEETS discover HRT and neon". There's nothing spectacularly wrong with either of those ideals, or even going full Diamond Age and combining them.

Punk itself is still dead as a genre and everyone does DIY now. No matter what your politics or aesthetic, there is a radical self-reliance movement for you to align with, including aspects of this one.

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 No.56759

>>56725

>You've got some serious blinders on if you don't see the pattern of deplatforming happening across the cultural spectrum, and the dividing line across which it lands.

What the fuck that does that matter to people with real jobs? Yeah, there's a lot of bullshit hypocrisy out there. Like, all of it finally made it to the tech sector after twenty years or so.

Unless your plans depend on you being someone in independent media using the big platforms, there is fuckall that the bluechecks can do to you. Yeah, it's annoying to watch good creators get fucked over by the politics of respectability, but having those kind of people adopt left-wing political language doesn't make other politics punk by default. That's not how ANY of this shit works.

I'm probably twenty years older than you, and am going through the same issues of determining my political outlook now that I realize that I care more about making assholes unhappy than I do about the specific stylistic aspects of culture that politics has the most effect on. I mean, the biggest difference between us is that I have twenty years of being pretty far left-of-center political inertia and am old enough to remember how dysfunctional trad culture is when people actually use it.

It's still contrarian/metacontrarian to support this stuff rather than any form of "punk". If you want to be punk, you ignore all of it and do what you want without caring about what's respectable or brave politically.

> You're just a washed up boomer who no longer has his ear to the tracks.

You're right about the tracks, but wrong about the generation. Boomers are between 60 and 75 now. I'm from the young edge of Gen X. If you want to insult me, tell me to go helicopter some more kids and force participation trophies on them.

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 No.56764

>>56709

>Nationalism is just a contrarian adoption of the right

then leftism is simply a temper tantrum

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 No.56765

>>56711

Johnny Ramone is a staunch Republican lol

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 No.56766

File: 599141291e892fd⋯.gif (3.4 MB, 600x338, 300:169, oh how punk gif.gif)

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 No.56767

>>56759

>If you want to be punk, you ignore all of it and do what you want without caring about what's respectable or brave politically.

Let us imagine it is the 90s again, and someone, from the core of his soul, wants to be a corp-man, wears his armani suit to bed, never speaks in anything but buzzwords, works 20 hour days with ten meetings a day over lunch at a nice Italian place.

Is that guy punk? After all, he's doing exactly what he wants, it just so happens to be what society says is schway too.

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 No.56769

>>56475

>stapling a political position into the movement is lame as fuck

No it's not. It's lame as fuck to have no political position.

Punk is anarchist, which means far left.

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 No.56771

>>56767

>Is Leave it to Beaver punk?

HAHAHAHAHAHAAHA, no. There's no need for corp-man to construct a separate world to be yourself in.

I feel like there's something you're missing, and I think I might have an idea of what it is. When I talk about "constructing a different world", that used to be a lot harder.

Let's see if a parable works here: When I was young, about 16, I was in a punk rock club being bored. I did that a lot. There were, I think, maybe 10 people in the building I knew. This was really-really pre-internet, even though this particular club was probably only a couple months away from being the first cyber-anything-the-fuck-at-all in our city.

I perked up when I thought about a few of the people there because we were part of a secret world. Everyone else there was limited. If they knew people in other cities it was because someone traveled. If they wanted to communicate with them, it was either $.20-something for a letter or about that much per minute for a phone call. Not us, though, we were from the future and could sent letters

and talk with people all over the world for free.

Everyone else there was… local. They met people in bars, talked to their coworkers, and their interests were pretty much all the same as one-anothers, even in a punk bar, because there was no way for weirdos to find each other except by talking to strangers face-to-face.

It was 1992, and a few of us in the bar were members of a local collective that paid ruinous amounts of brouzouf for a dial-up internet connection to scarf down a limited selection of USENET groups and then distributed them among ourselves via UUCP store-and-forward. That's how I read and posted to alt.cyberpunk. We had our own community that only interacted with the world at large when we needed brouzouf or groceries.

We weren't even really special in that regard. My town was seen as generally shit in terms of music scene-ness and nightlife, but there was communal housing groups, a gay militia, and all kinda of half-assed organizing propping up the fairy tales of independence people claimed to be living.

Ok, I guess that was more of an old-man ramble than a parable. Sorry about that. I dunno where you are, Anon. Maybe Young Republican _is_ the kinda lifestyle that you need to build your own secret world to experience where you are. If so, there are a lot of place where it's pretty normal.

On the plus-side, you can do the same thing weird kids have been doing for hundreds of years and move to where the scene is. On the upside, small towns in the Midwest and south are cheap, if you can find work.

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 No.56775

>>56727

And you didn't get the message the first time, lol

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 No.56776

>>56473

Being punk has always meant going against the media and showing the world you don't need them. So being a nazi is punk. Being a pedo is punk.

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 No.56786

>>56776

>So being a nazi is punk. Being a pedo is punk.

Ehhh, kinda? I mean, 70's punks wore swastika as a way to freak the straights, and if you drill deep enough into any outsider subculture you eventually strike perverts. But 70's punks were also happy beating Nazi's to keep them out of punk shows.

Skinheads, even/especially the anti-racist ones, were a pretty dumb subculture. I hung around with a lot of them at various times. There were three kinds: The rejected - who ended up being skinheads because they were weird but got rejected by the local lefty subculture, usually for being raised poor; The aficionados - who came into the subculture because they started out liking one aspect of the aesthetic and now all their friends are skins; and, the brain-smashed - who ate fucking lead paint as kids and the skins were generally tolerant towards. The rejected, the lonely, and the broken - all with a subculture that considered drinking beer to be _the_ proper activity, and street-fighting to be good fun/self-defense/community-defense.

It's funny. All of the former skins I kept track of generally grew up into centrists and stayed that way until Hillary Clinton decided to run. No, I have no clue what any of this has to do with cyberpunk. I'm just old.

Ok, back to nazi/pedo=punk bullshit:

Pedos are sex-perverts who are probably not going to ever graduate to folks-like-anyone-else status, When there is a subculture, it's generally like any pre-acceptance sex pervert culture, big on emotional support and discussions of common interest. I don't know anything more about it, because you only hear about these people when they get caught.

Nazi's, like neo-nazi skins and other weird Reich Roleplayers, can be counter-cultural as a group, but the thing they're trying to experience is itself strongly conformist. Now, that doesn't tend to be an issue with groups like this because it's rare to see a group get over Dunbar's number in size. So, everyone knows everyone else as an individual and any acts of non-conformity to the ideal will be treated as a personal failing rather than a violation of the culture. That's just how people work.

Both of these groups are generally their own thing, and pursuing them can require the same sorts of organizing and community-building that punk is good at, but aren't punk themselves.

They're better than straight contrarianism, but neither is any good at world-building as activism. Most punks were shit at it too, mind you, but they worked as patrons and partners for the (usually woman) people who got off on organizing things and having meetings.

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 No.56788

>>56717

>zero upboats

Oof.

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 No.56789

>>56786

OH! To continue my own bullshit, there's one thing that has changed in the west that's had the biggest impact on _anything_ being punk. Parents are generally less likely to kick their kids out for being weird these days. Some still do it, but it's no longer seen as being acceptable in the slightest.

It has to do with the weird shift in public morality that happened in the last 15-30 years. Previously, public morality was a matter of conforming to public expectation. You dressed right, looked right, were a member of the same groups as the crowd, and you were OK. Almost to the exception of anything you actually thought or did.

Not conforming was an offense that made you open to ridicule and abuse, and that status could infect your family as well. Being gay, or being fucked up for some reason like being raped, or even just having strong convictions that didn't match up with the expected ones was enough to endanger you and possibly your family. Actual danger was rare, but little bits of social pushback and a lowering of community assistance wasn't.

These days, a growing part of the country thinks that compassion is the important core of public morality. It doesn't matter who you are or how you express yourself as long as you extend that same celebratory apathy to others and shit like that. Having preferences and opinions about other people's lifestyles is the equivalent sin under this system.

It's part of the hardening process for some of the alt-right. They'll just be the type to have an opinion about something that other people are doing and they'll get socially rejected for it. A cycle of expounded views being met with rejection happens, until the proto-altie is isolated and has adopted "having standards" as part of their identity.

It's the same process that produced some of the world's best weirdoes, actually. Cycles of rejection are really only good at getting people to double the fuck down.

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 No.56792

>>56769

Anarchism is not strictly far left.

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 No.56794

>>56769

70's Punk was nihilist. Everything would die in nuclear fire, so it didn't matter what kind of government you had. Same with a lot of them in the 80's.

After the end of the Cold War things got weird.

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 No.56795

>>56776

>Being a pedo is punk.

i take it you are speaking for yourself. no, being a pedo is being depraved, there is nothing political about it. its not expressing discontent with your current society. fucking antifa shazbot

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 No.56796

>>56717

www.reddit.com/user/amnsisc

cringe

Are you posting your own reddit posts anon? 2 day old post with 0 updoots and you're flaunting it around like it has some sort of authority here. Sad.

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 No.56797

>>56769

Anarchism is inherently apolitical. It literally means "no rulers". It emphatically does not mean "the nomenklatura take away 99% of my income and force me to starve".

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 No.56798

>>56786

>>56789

Pretty insightful posts. Nothing to add but here have a (You).

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 No.56813

>>56796

It was posted on r/conservative so… Basically the same cucks here

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 No.56824

File: e316b667f207644⋯.png (603.75 KB, 470x504, 235:252, 8f7kndp9a9a31.png)

This is the modern punk. You may not like it, but this is what peak punk looks like.

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 No.56833

>>56824

>modern punk is a kike influenced soykid who was absolutely consumed by his subversive college "teachers". A useful idiot.

I feel sorry for that kid just looking at the photo. Punk goes against the norm, not with it. Modernity is today's norm, "post-modernism", extreme feminism, the sexualizing of minors, violent opposition to average people, that isn't punk, it's zombie-like herd behavior. A child being wielded by the opinions of their teachers and the brotherly ignorance of their classmates.

At least the alt-right you know damn sure isn't being taught, encouraged, or even questioned in any way within university circles, a minority maybe, but that's ultimately the plan. "Just give us your parents brouzouf so we can teach you more Marx, goy. Don't listen to those bad nazi's, goy." One could have more respect for an ACTUAL Commie, living in a commie country, trying to survive under a shitty commie government. At least that guy is really doing it, really enduring it (still wrong though), these kids are being gradualy molded to pretend to be commies. It's real easy to say "I'm a commie" living in a cozy ass society where even the poor are kings compared to 3rd worlders.

What a shock it will be to them when the real commie government comes into being. When their Starbucks is over, their parents 3 homes are collectivized and replaced with a shitty little wooden house next to a ghetto ass building, they run out of tooth paste, deodorant, toilet paper, pads, tampons, paper towel, clean water, they have to resort to boiling water, they're waiting at a bread line, they're running out of fuel, basic resources, common meals they enjoyed. When the local stores are brought down from thousands of products, to hundreds or a handful, and the only stores with somewhat decent choices are government approved, when the medicine is depleted from the pharmacy, the doctors and scientists are leaving the country because of low wages, while these kids dream up a free socialized hospital, in practice the hospital for tourists will be much better and they'll be forced to pay way more for decent/even urgent service, as they run out of anesthetic, and woman in labor are screaming their eyes out at the socialized hospital, and there are no disinfectants or antibiotics to deal with tearing after giving birth, the elderly are dropping like flies or experiencing symptoms they would never have had to endure under a sane economy, the kids are dying from common colds, lack of insulin, and starvation, if not having their growth stunted. ("their kids" >implying their feminist gf's wont simply abort)

They'll find themselves turning to their occultism and it will fail them, their kids will turn to prostitution as foreigners come into the country to exploit them, not to mention the multicultural locals who they can barely trust, now eyeing their kids, either to rape, recruit, or turn them on to drugs, alcohol, criminal behavior, or absolutely useless religions, and occultism, or they're home simply blindly watching sports and dropping out or worse, actually believing in the party as their whole world falls apart, and being forced to serve the shit government for an education. What a tragedy their sheltered lives, a tragedy their indoctrination. They can forget their precious internet, the government will control and tax the shit out of that too, knowing you're poor, knowing you simply want access to information, knowing the infrastructure is in place to make it accessible to everyone for free, they won't give a shit.

Newsflash from someones who has actually experienced Communism in practice.

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 No.56835

File: 35b4ee55f44409f⋯.jpg (134.92 KB, 960x595, 192:119, antifa the nothing.jpg)

>>56833

none of them are actually FOR anything. they are simply against anything strong, moral and successful because they are not any of those things which is why they seek "equality" aka taking your legs out so come down to their level. for years I have been waiting for some logic or vision to come out of the left, but thats just it, they are the nothing, a consuming force that will lead to nothing. this is why they need to be killed.

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 No.56836

>>56835

They need to wake the fuck up is what they need to do. We all go through phases, but there comes a chronological moment in time when life becomes more transparent. Life today couldn't be more transparent, ignoring obvious signs is futile.

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 No.56838

>>56833

If your children fall for mysticism bullshit it's because your genes are are bad and gave them low IQ, not because of the government.

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 No.56840

>>56473

😍👠💃 YAAAS QUEEN 👏💄💅

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 No.56843

File: eccd64b8ff9fa75⋯.jpg (95.23 KB, 960x952, 120:119, D0L_0kqXgAAtErr.jpg)

>>56473

>What is punk in this day and age?

Me.

/thread

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 No.56845

>>56798

>>56789

>>56786

Obvious samefag.

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 No.56846

>>56833

>Punk goes against the norm, not with it. Modernity is today's norm, "post-modernism", extreme feminism, the sexualizing of minors, violent opposition to average people, that isn't punk, it's zombie-like herd behavior.

Boom.

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 No.56849

hey it's our token bitch shill. How you doing you rat faced jew?

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 No.56879

File: cccacf846041f29⋯.jpg (44.69 KB, 466x379, 466:379, f810758fbf03ca564dedb3a53c….jpg)

neofascists are the true punks of todays day and age, face it kid, you wanna be schway? you gotta join the bad boiz club, and right now were the baddest boiz in town according the MSM

for real, cyberpunk was always fascist, it will always be fascist, even if it doesnt know it. deal with it.

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 No.56890

File: 3a6a37873c43d86⋯.jpg (1.31 MB, 2602x3567, 2602:3567, 41v3hglxymb31.jpg)

>we're the counter culture now

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 No.56891

>>56879

You can be neofascist punk or anarchist punk. It doesn't really matter, I love you all.

Hilary made the right a place for deplorables, you gotta love her for that!

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 No.56918

Leftists are so detached from reality they're practically retarded. They make good fodder for verbal abuse though.

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 No.56931

>>56845

Indeed. I'm not really trying to hide that, though. Should I be?

Like, the existence of a 40-something guy who ironically called himself "cyberpunk" in the 90's on this thread doesn't really mean anything, does it? I'm not going to start using whatever it is people use to establish a consistent ID. My writing's distinctive enough if someone is so bored as to try and de-anon me.

Actually, does it matter? Serious question.

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 No.56932

File: 08464700ecf5993⋯.jpg (47.88 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, Nothowthisworks.jpg)

>>56879

>conformity culture is the REAL nihilistic nonconformity culture!

Yeah…… Ohkay.

Just so you're clear, there are no conditions under which "punk" and "conformity/traditionalist cultures" are the same. If the overculture becomes atomic to a fault and left-wing, that just means that nobody is punk.

Colored hair was an indicator of a probably-interesting personality from the 50's through the late 90's. Conformity for women was _so_ important, that a little thing like weird hair was a serious indicator that the woman with it didn't care about mainstream culture at all.

That horrid trope of sci-fi worlds showing that they're sci-fi by having normal women with purple hair being _true_ doesn't mean that most women live entirely outside the surrounding culture any more. It just means that colored hair doesn't mean shit.

If one thing exists in opposition to the mainstream and the mainstream adopts it, the thing dies. That's it.

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 No.56943

Ok shizo 👌

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 No.56944

File: f3088e8703ff3f8⋯.gif (99.08 KB, 631x655, 631:655, 428784336412951088.gif)

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 No.56954

File: a9c3f59e19dceeb⋯.jpg (482.38 KB, 1000x1343, 1000:1343, decency_is_punk_now.jpg)

>filename

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 No.56972

File: 229629d975370ad⋯.jpg (73.89 KB, 794x793, 794:793, il_794xN.1488193608_76ek.jpg)

Tfw Nazis were punks the whole time.

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 No.56985

File: 4aaae4cbc595c65⋯.jpg (39.14 KB, 500x500, 1:1, 1413525861393.jpg)

>>56932

Dude, that's the thing. Punk was never really about being anti establishment or of a particular ideology, though many early punks were pure anarchists who believed that governments and social systems were simply holding people back from pure freedom.

What punk has always been about is going your own way. Doing what YOU feel is right for yourself, not what anyone else says. Want a country farmhouse? Fuck it, do it. Want a Nuclear family and a white picket fence? Fine. Do that. Want a run down tenement house and a fuckload of smack? Fine, do that. It was about doing what you wanted to do and not letting anyone else tell you not to. This was part of why in the mid to late 80s you saw a lot of people like Henry Rollins going against the punk grain and growing their hair long and integrating elements of jazz and funk into their music and why you saw the rise of the Goth subculture by mixing punk with glam rock: The punk norm of short spiky hair and the same shitty clothing as everyone else became a uniform, the musical formulas of 3 minute songs played without technique became boring and overdone.

I say this as someone who still considers himself to be a punk and/or goth at nearly 31 years of age. Punk became a formula, and that formula has been morphed into something leftist and authoritarian around the same time that the mass media started learning they could profit off of it.

At this point, being punk can simply be relegated to liking punk music and not doing the shit the TV tells you to do.

I'm certainly no christian right winger, but politically I have a hell of a lot more in common with them than I do with modern liberals. I consider myself a libertarian more than anything else, and if the NAP wasn't such a stupid fucking idea I'd be all for anarcho-capitalism.

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 No.56994

File: e611fea9e94b560⋯.jpg (151.86 KB, 1024x775, 1024:775, robocop.jpg)

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 No.56995

File: 68bb7c5f98ca6fd⋯.jpg (26.2 KB, 444x250, 222:125, revolt.jpg)

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 No.57039

>>56985

This is the most lucid I've read on this in over 2 years of lurking.

Doing what you want, figuring out things for yourself from what to eat, read, do to what to believe morally or spiritually, that's what I understand as being punk. Sure, the mainstream created and sold a product made out of this, but it doesn't mean it's "over". Also, punk is just another piece in a long string of thought that values individualism, curiosity, and questioning things. Two names that come to mind are Seneca and Thoreau.

The majority of people are conditioned to jump through hoops. Our education system is joke. Getting a STEM degree doesn't make anyone a scientist, getting an MBA doesn't make anyone a leader/entrepreneur, getting an english degree doesn't make anyone a poet. All of this is about jumping through hoops and playing at X appreciation, eg. an MBA is a study in business appreciation, humanity degrees are humanity appreciation degrees etc. Getting a degree in music won't help you create good music.

I'm rambling a bit. What I mean to say is that the most important thing to be is a doer. Labels of any kind are stupid. If you interact with your world, are part of a community, solve problems, avoid getting sucked into meaningless academia, and ignore all the bullshit tribal politics, you're winning.

From this vantage point, everything that's happening is a bunch of peasants shouting and throwing shit at each other like monkeys. What matters is doing. In a world full of obese, lazy people, exercising, reading, investing, creating anything, organizing a community is revolutionary.

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 No.57058

>>56473

>capitalist class

Who isn't part of that class anyway? are you writing this from a soviet-era PC assembled in a state-owned factory OP? do you pay brouzouf for everything you have? do you own anything at all? then you're a capitalist

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 No.57063

>>57058

What? That's not how this works, buddy. You don't get to

say 'IF YOU OWN THINGS YOU'RE A CAPITALIST!' That's absolutely retarded beyond words. Capitalists are those who own the means of production. This is so painfully basic.

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 No.57064

"Capitalism" maybe a leftist conspiracy theory. Every western political system and the culture is full of other ideas and ideals and non-profit oriented companies also exist. On the other hand human greed and economic interests exist independent from anything related to capital.

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 No.57094

>>56789

>These days, a growing part of the country thinks that compassion is the important core of public morality. It doesn't matter who you are or how you express yourself as long as you extend that same celebratory apathy to others and shit like that

Literally nobody thinks like that. There's a simple litmus test, and that's the line where they tilt and become intolerant, invariably claiming that they are being intolerant of intolerance, which is of course a contradiction. It turns out that relativism is bullshit and everybody knows it, but some are lying to themselves and eachother. But nobody tolerates anything.

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 No.57110

File: 369a0e6a1d6f144⋯.png (100.39 KB, 1080x863, 1080:863, Screenshot_20191231-021300….png)

>>57063

<Capitalists are those who own the means of production.

>Capitalist

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 No.57116

>>57094

Stupid cunt detected.

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 No.57119

>>56489

Support your own hierarchy the problem is not it exists but that the current one is weak. Hierarchys are needed but it should be the strong leading the weak not vice versa. Even Hitler viewed revoultion as a duty if the state was leading the nation to it's death as it is now.

Smash the system, Save your race!

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 No.57129

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 No.57132

>>56489

Then you try to figure out, in which way they are being full of it. Having an idea of the real power structures and pecking order is a prerequisite for this (Moldbug did most of the work on high level, but it's not set in stone).

But yeah, it's funny how the fake underdog thing got stretched so far, it created trigglypuff and trigglyprof, yet the dead horse is still spurred on. "Be the Tru Rebel, party with ONE Foundation", lol.

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 No.57134

Race matters now, in terms of genes and such, but maybe not in a cyber future. Interesting to consider where the millienia deep human instinct of race loyalty will manifest when gene editing and functional body modification becomes common. Sounds crazy, but that's near future shit.

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 No.57135

>>57134

Assuming gene editing had reached a certain proficiency, I think it could be easily redirected by designing persons that appeared to be a certain race by superficial characteristics, while the rest were anything but.

It seems sorta simple and primitive, but consider that this instinct itself runs so deep because it is simple and primitive, and is so widespread because it was a beneficial trait.

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 No.57136

What's punk today? That's easy.

>wanting a gf/wife of the same race as you

>wanting 2-3+ kids with her

>wanting a stable future for all that

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 No.57143

>>56473

punk was originally a derogative term which meant outsider, or one who is outside of the status quo.

the status quo which is pushed by the federal government, big corps, big tech, colleges etc is: inclusion, LGBTQ+, diversity, open borders, anti-gun, anti-free speech, consuming soy and/or bugs, living in an urban environment, pro abortion, anti-Tradition, anti-White, anti-Man etc

the left is mainstream, Ethno-Nationalists are the only punks left. Antifa is fully supported by CNN, RT, Pepsi, the federal government (none of the inauguration day antifa rioters were prosecuted, instead only nationalists are being hunted) and cancel culture is specifically one way = anti-White.

The culture jamming/creation of White nationalists is the most widespread example of cyberpunk in current year. read it and weep shazbots

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 No.57144

>>56709

>Punk is indifference in the face of looming apocalypse

the sex pistols weren't thinking about apocalypse, they were upset about the economy and how detached/cruel the ruling classes were. they had no other voice but to rebel on the local level.

now, the ruling classes have realized THEY WANT radical individualism, because individuals are easier to rule/round up. they are afraid of homogeneous unified militant GROUPS. hence there constant push for diversity and demonizing of ethno-Nationalism.

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 No.57145

>>56721

>I feel like you must be someone who came of age after 9/11. It's always weird how you folks see things.

ok boomer

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 No.57155

File: 88f981df6dcdba5⋯.png (20.45 KB, 500x560, 25:28, 1578026973695.png)

>>57145

<hate your elders, goy

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 No.57221

>>56664

It's not. A bunch of losers wanna think themselves special snowflakes for behaving the way 90% of the population has behaved since forever. They've spent so much time being brainwashed in their internet echo chambers they think there's anything the least bit rebellious about being straight, having kids and not getting a tattoo. Of course none of those things are bad, but trying to say that's the counterculture is like saying drinking Coca Cola is counterculture. As if the "conservative is the new punk rock" people weren't dumb enough, there's the "fascism is punk rock" idiots. Sure buddy, punk rock is all about sucking up to authority and conformity, as long as it makes you unpopular with tumblr user translesbiankuriboh.

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 No.57224

File: 1365aaa608afea9⋯.gif (2.68 MB, 400x225, 16:9, brackets.gif)

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 No.57225

>>57221

Other than the fact out of touch boomer lefties are now in power and won't leave people alone that is. It's all about who actually holds the power in a society, not whether or not x thing has a history of being accepted.. To put it simply, when "the man" has made it their duty to crack down on shit- anyone who opposes that is the quote unquote counterculture. Parading around that label however, is retarded as fuck though. Just live by your convictions even if the corps and feds decide you doing so is inconvenient for them.

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 No.57228

>>57225

>Other than the fact out of touch boomer lefties are now in power and won't leave people alone that is.

Lefties aren't in power. Republicans have the presidency, the supreme court, and a majority of legislative seats. There may be a tiny handful of Democrats who are knocking on the door of leftism, but the vast majority of Dem politicians are Republican-lite. Our police and military sure as fuck aren't lefty. And despite putting on the facade of being progressive, most of the Hollywood and tech elite prioritize capitalism above all else.

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 No.57229

>>57228

Uh huh.

Reality is, most "right-wing" politicians are at best lefty-lite- with their globalism and neolib/neocon tendencies barely even being bothered to be hidden. Getting a politician that falls out of the center-left/nanny state bubble DC has become is quite a rarity these days. At best you get a guy who acknowledges surface-level nationalism or gun rights issues- but then promptly forgets about them.

As for the media, they sometimes put on a half-convincing facade of caring about brouzouf- but they're so idealogically driven these days they've forgotten the basic purpose of a business and lost brouzouf as a result. Things would be much better if the megacorps were remotely interested in profit anymore- instead of playing social engineer in an attempt to bring about one of many failed utopian ideals.

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 No.57231

>>57221

holy shit someone on this board doesn't have soykaf for brains

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 No.57240

>>57221

>implying things didn't change

>literally 2020

It's clear that you are the one out of touch with reality.

Look around, fucker, the world is different. Women have priority at everything, if you don't let foreigners enter your country you're a nazi, it's common for people to mutilate themselves because "muh true body".

Wake the fuck up, samurai. We're heading to the cyberpunk future we've always wanted and it just happens that one of the tribes present there are true conservatives.

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 No.57242

File: e02ce710ef563d8⋯.png (13.42 KB, 450x205, 90:41, bs.png)

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 No.57251

File: c0defdad8460a1c⋯.jpeg (61.84 KB, 1024x695, 1024:695, 9403490A-8B20-4FD1-BB83-0….jpeg)

>>56489

If you were actually punk and believed in destroying authority and hierarchy, you’d be glad comrades are promoting it as the mainstream, otherwise you’re just a soulless contrarian without substance and deciding to be a conservative bootlicker just because it’s not the most mainstream thing (even though it is, look who’s president).

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 No.57252

>>57240

>hurr durr conservatives are the true oppressed one look at my flawed talking points, also, dickride the state

He’s right though. Also, No mainstream democrat ever called for literal open borders retard. You conservacucks are the flip side of the same “sjw’s” you claim to hate, the only difference is political orientation.

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 No.57253

>>57242

You conservatards lack any self thought that you would all easily pass as bots programmed to relay reactionary talking points which are all flawed. Go back to facebook politics and the country club, conservative bootlicker

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 No.57254

File: 0d7c3cb1cd5c1f7⋯.jpg (266.48 KB, 650x810, 65:81, 1579042115076.jpg)

>yOuR'rE a BOotLicKer

>yOuR'rE tHe ReAl SJW

We deserve better bantz.

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 No.57256

The more I argued with them, the better I came to know their dialectic. First they counted on the stupidity of their adversary, and then, when there was no other way out, they themselves simply played stupid. If all this didn't help, they pretended not to understand, or, if challenged, they changed the subject in a hurry, quoted platitudes which, if you accepted them, they immediately related to entirely different matters, and then, if again attacked, gave ground and pretended not to know exactly what you were talking about.

Whenever you tried to attack one of these apostles, your hand closed on a jelly-like slime which divided up and poured through your fingers, but in the next moment collected again.

But if you really struck one of these fellows so telling a blow that, observed by the audience, he couldn't help but agree, and if you believed that this had taken you at least one step forward, your amazement was great the next day. The lefty had not the slightest recollection of the day before, he rattled off his same old nonsense as though nothing at all had happened, and, if indignantly challenged, affected amazement; he couldn't remember a thing, except that he had proved the correctness of his assertions the previous day.

==Sometimes I stood there thunderstruck.

I didn't know what to be more amazed at: the agility of their tongues or their virtuosity at lying.==

Gradually I began to hate them.

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 No.57257

>>57251

Lol that sandnigger doesn't even have a a missile range greater than the Persian gulf

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 No.57259

>>57251

Authority and hierarchy are not bad in of themselves though. It's mostly a matter of how and who uses them. Lashing out without purpose is dumb shit.

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 No.57260

>>57259

That’s subjective and shows you’re not really part of an actual punk subculture.

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 No.57261

File: 8e314f5f879b73e⋯.png (369.17 KB, 800x420, 40:21, ClipboardImage.png)

>>57260

I don't particularly care what groups I are or aren't part of- but I believe the phrase "those who call themselves punk are the least punk of all" has become a bit a cliche by now.

As for subjectivity, it's really telling you're making a supposedly objective judgement on something that is itself quite arguably a very subjective matter.

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 No.57262

Ok smoothbrain

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 No.57276

File: b4c9f92362c962b⋯.png (418.34 KB, 815x892, 815:892, Screenshot_20200121-170349….png)

Cope shazbots

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 No.57279

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 No.57280

>>57279

If it's worth you making a new post, then at least say something you haven't said before. Though that may require a bit more intellectual ability than what someone stuck ascribing a genre of literature to a specific tribe in the worthless pursuit of politics can muster.

No one owns cyberpunk, and certainly punk itself has no owners either.

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 No.57281

>>57280

Based.

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 No.57282

>>57252

>if you disagree you're a conservative

Top zuz!

Totally desperate.

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 No.57289

>>57280

I just pressed new reply on accident and didn't bother to write what i wanted after.

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 No.57353

>>56473

Yeah, too bad most punks have become the lowest form of chickenshit neolib-bootlicking idpol fans

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