/liberty/ - Liberty

>>92484

>So tell here, why do you think I'm "evil" just because I'm Jewish?

Actually, I don't. The Jews aren't per se evil. It's not even like they had no good traits. I'm sure modern Europeans could learn some things from them, but I don't want none of that zionist shit in my house, thanks.

>>92484

>le whites are all conquerors and probably evil XD

>Yeah, goy! Ignore the fact that every other people in the world did the exact same things, only whites are guilty of anything!

Everyone in the world had empires. Every people in the world has held slaves. Euro empires only appear "worse" becasue they were better at it and more creative than everyone else in the game. And there's one other, significant difference between Euro empires and the rest, namely how they ended. Every other empire that has existed in history fell because they were conquered by another power, or simply fell apart due to internal strife. The European colonial powers on the other hand had a crisis of conscience, and chose to give up their holdings voluntarily because they thought they weren't being fair. Further, the Euros did their best to civilize their colonies and turn them into bearable places to live, at great expense to themselves. Other empires have never taken such steps, more often than not they just slaughtered the conquered people and replaced them. Also, let's address this real quick:

>Anglos conquer, rape, kill, pillage, and enslave for centuries

Anglos were among the first to outlaw slavery, and actually used their naval power to try and disrupt the slave trade. Meanwhile, the poor oppressed innocent brown people living in Libya maintained an open-air slave market until 2007.

>jews learn to game the system after a millennia of religious persecution and acquire their share without use of force

Not their own force, sure, but sending gentiles to die on your behalf isn't exactly better. And while I wouldn't call myself a full-on antisemite, the fact that Jews were persecuted by everyone who met them for a thousand years begs the question: why were they so consistently hated? You are the common denominator after all, perhaps the reason everyone hates isn't their problem, but yours?

>So tell here, why do you think I'm "evil" just because I'm Jewish?

I don't, there have been a couple tolerable Jews and I'm not inclined to hate every single one. But every time you assuming this isn't bait trot out pilpul like this I'm tempted that much more.

>>92485

>They totally didn't ask the Romans to persecute the Christians.

<complaining about whites persecuting sectarian Semites

Oh yeah, no other religious group ever wanted to persecute a sect in the history of the world. Jews are so evil for doing something 2000 years ago, grrr, evil Jews. hold your reply and read first what I wrote below after the 4th quote

>And their "gaming the system" didn't involve pushing some of the most destructive ideologies the world has ever seen, like communism and - as I talked about above - racialist nationalism

No, it didn't. What does Communism has to do with a millennia of acquiring trade experience and learning to live as a persecuted people? You're mixing unrelated things here. I'm not even denying Jews are (partially) responsible for communism or racial nationalism - not really sure why they're the first thing to come to mind about the latter tho, we just copied from Europeans - but you're grasping at straws if you somehow think they're related to Jewish success.

>And the modern state of Israel and its shenanigans?

As opposed to every other state that exploited, betrayed and attacked weaker ones? Do you mean like every other one in the 20th century and the millennia before?

>your thesis that the Europeans are cruel and evilbad and that the Jews never did anything is fucking stupid

You would have a point had it been something I actually said. If you want a disclaimer #notallwhites then sure, there you go. But you gentiles always get buttblasted if anyone points anything so much as slightly bad about your histories, RIGHT after going on a tirade about how Jews or niggers or whatever are the bane of the world, and then you go on and on ad nauseam about how your empires were actually totally humane, cool and awesome. It's mind boggling how a board of libertarians turn into statist bootlickers whenever it suits them despite that on any other topic they're pretty confident that the state is bad in every aspect. This double standard is the same with "Israel bad hurr," you excuse whatever happened in Europe as "everyone did it, we just did it better, success breeds jealousy :)" and then whine that some other state in the middle east did the same things to whatever extent - and I'm totally sure it had NOTHING to do with the fact it's Jewish, yep, you're just principled libertarians.

>It's called feudalism

And it was so brutal in Russia that it was signaled out by essentially every historian throughout the centuries. Or were Russian liberals Jews, too, and I'm just "pilpuling" you?

>>92488

Refer to the above.

Other than that, if you're actually going to make apologia for imperialism you should probably take off that flag.

>pilpul

lmao

I literally only ever hear gentiles using this term, it's practically nonexistent in the Jewish community. It just shows how paranoid you are about anything a Jew says.

>>92446

This is a very noble thing to say, and it would be nice if we could apply it universally through life, but this statement is a perfect example of the reasons why jewish supremacists have subverted so many institutions/nations of the past with corruption, nepotism, and exacting jewish influence.

>>92499

>Refer to the above.

You didn't actually refute anything I said. Whites had empires, but so did everyone else. Empires may be bad, but Euro colonialism was objectively more humane than the other empires out there. Other empires held on to their banana republics until the bitter end, Euros voluntarily abdicated their colonial supremacy.

>and then whine that some other state in the middle east did the same things to whatever extent

If Israel did anything on its own you might actually have a point here. But Israel couldn't have accomplished shit were it not for billions in Western aid money subsidizing your entire military, and even with all that support the US military ends up fighting your battles for you anyways.

>>92488

>>92485

>>92484

Anglos did x, y, and z terrible things.

The most important part to notice is, in the Jewish view, its Jews vs whites. Always. Everyday, most white people go through their lives not even thinking about Jews. But the opposite is seems true.

>will this benefit jewish interests

>is this good for the Jews

>will this hurt whites so that our competition is hindered

This thought process is ruining the world.

>>92499

>pilpul don't real

>while pilpulling

>>92502

Now the based libertarian jew is going to cry about

>u didn't decolonize north America or australia yt

And bragging about the IDF which can barely hold its own against Arabic rock throwers.

>>92502

> Empires may be bad, but Euro colonialism was objectively more humane than the other empires out there.

So far Israel outdid all of you. If the Palestinians would just accept us they could live in prosperity. Israeli Arabs live good lives and get every right Jews get. But it's true, the racial nationalism is a problem here in the populace, luckily we're so good at subverting we even do it even to ourselves. And I believe that within a few generations and progressive education we'll get a post-zionist one state solution.

Sadly Arabs are a monkey-see-monkey-do kind of people and will fight to the bitter end until all the Jews here are ready to accept a multicultural state.

>>92504

>>while pilpulling

you're paranoid if you think every Jew learns Talmudic rhetoric

>Now the based libertarian jew is going to cry about

>u didn't decolonize north America or australia yt

>And bragging about the IDF which can barely hold its own against Arabic rock throwers.

You ARE paranoid lol, I don't have anything against whites and I don't hold them accountable for history. I just think it's hypocritical to have these double standards that I pointed out here >>92499

>>92505

>So far Israel outdid all of you.

Except again, you didn't do shit. Britain gave you the land and the US-controlled UN authorized the claim. Assuming for the moment the entire region is as civilized as you say it is, the Anglos did all the work setting it up for you, and you moved in like spoiled brats and claimed it was all your doing. And I'm far from about to take your claims about the Palestinian paradise that is Israel on faith alone, I can name a few busfulls of dead children that would object to that idea.

>>92507

>the Anglos did all the work setting it up for you

That's fucking bullshit. 1st and 2nd aliyahs (what we call immigration to Israel) laid the foundations for Israel and it was the kibbutz that was the game changer. The only significant thing the British left was their code of law, even the 19th century German Templers (that the Brits exiled to Australia later) did more for the foundation of this country than the British.

>and you moved in like spoiled brats

We were here before the British. Sure, the majority arrived after them but it's still nothing.

>And I'm far from about to take your claims about the Palestinian paradise that is Israel on faith alone

Israeli Arabs - that wasn't a misnomer - get the same rights, employment opportunities and protection as any other citizen. Palestinians (the ones living in Gaza and the West Bank) are in shit. You gentiles always make me laugh whenever you harp about the plight of Israeli Arabs (Palestinians within Israel) despite that you don't know anything about them, but whenever some SJW says "hey, maybe blacks aren't treated equally in the USA, maybe there's discrimination you start screeching how it's totally not true and all made up.

Also

>paradise

lol, and you say I'm "pilpuling"

>I can name a few busfulls of dead children that would object to that idea.

Yeah, I can name a few busfulls of dead citizens on our side too.

>>92505

>you're paranoid if you think every Jew learns Talmudic rhetoric

Why would you have to learn something that comes to your kind naturally?

>>92510

>Israeli Arabs - that wasn't a misnomer - get the same rights, employment opportunities and protection as any other citizen. Palestinians (the ones living in Gaza and the West Bank) are in shit. You gentiles always make me laugh whenever you harp about the plight of Israeli Arabs (Palestinians within Israel) despite that you don't know anything about them, but whenever some SJW says "hey, maybe blacks aren't treated equally in the USA, maybe there's discrimination you start screeching how it's totally not true and all made up.

>uses the same sort of rhetoric that apartheid South Africa used

>we totes aren't like them tho

>>92511

>>uses the same sort of rhetoric that apartheid South Africa used

well, we used to support them

I guess just like the leftists are the real fascists

the Jews are the real white supremacists

In seriousness tho, Israeli Arabs don't get discriminated against and get to enjoy the full fruit of Israel (and your taxes, lol). I'm not lying that they're having it good, if you don't believe me feel free to have a trip to the Holy Land.

>>92518

There are a few people that'd forbit africans to breed in their country, though, including hard neetsocs.

>>92518

>Nazi complaining about sterilizing Africans

The lengths antisemites will go to in order to vilify Israel…

I'm not denying this was evil, and I didn't deny there is racism in our society, if you actually bothered to read my previous posts you'd know that. But that's the actual difference between me and you, I acknowledge the shortcomings of my country and my kin.

And about that article, you'd be surprised to know that no one actually cares or talks about it anymore. Not even Ethiopians. So please, save your phony indignation.

GAS THE KIKES.

>>92511

>used

current south africa is the epitome of apartheid

>>92499

>Jews are so evil for doing something 2000 years ago, grrr, evil Jews.

It's not about whether that makes you evil, it's about whether you were the boy scouts that you painted yourself as. And the answer is "no". You stopped asking for persecutions when that stopped being an option, it's not even like the Jewish people had a change of heart, like - you know - the Europeans had about slavery.

>No, it didn't. What does Communism has to do with a millennia of acquiring trade experience and learning to live as a persecuted people?

I talked about that in my wall of text above. Cosmopolitanism + materialism + victim identity.

>racial nationalism - not really sure why they're the first thing to come to mind about the latter tho, we just copied from Europeans

On the contrary, we got it from you. Gobineaux was the first to create a political ideology based on the concept of race as a core tenet, but he thought the semitic races were highly developed. His ideology was also more an apologia for monarchy and aristocracy as institutions, not nationalistic yet.

The person who introduced but antisemitism and nationalism to scientific racialism was H.S. Chamberlain, along with Richard Wagner. Chamberlain studied the Talmud, which contains some strong ideas about the relation between the "chosen people" and the gentiles, and of creating a nation exclusively for this chosen people. To me, that sounds like the Nazis learned a little from you. The Czech Nazis weren't rabid racialists yet, so, that's something we got from the Jews.

>As opposed to every other state that exploited, betrayed and attacked weaker ones? Do you mean like every other one in the 20th century and the millennia before?

Not every state is as crooked as Israel, sorry. Here in Germany, we don't spit on Jews and Muslims, we don't take money from Jewish or Muslim countries so we can spit some more on them, and we don't send death squads into neighboring countries. We do sponsor religious massacres, yes - by backing Israel. And yes, Germany had a shameful past. Israels "shameful past", however, has never ended, you were belicose from day one and you never got better. Israel has never attempted to bring peace to the Middle East. This is not about a strong nation bullying weaker ones, it's about an asshole nation bullying everyone.

> and I'm totally sure it had NOTHING to do with the fact it's Jewish, yep, you're just principled libertarians.

If it's any condolescence, I despise a whole bunch of nations more than Israel, Saudi Arabia and China for example, but you're still pretty far up, I'd say even with the US federal government (local governments are a different matter, as is the population at large). Not because you're Jewish, but because you fuck everything up, on a global stage. Furthermore, your government spits on my religion, extorts and insults my people, and committed grievous crimes against the Christians in the Middle East, including Lebanon, where the women I love lives. So yeah, it's personal, too. If I made you pay for the bombs which I dropped within hearing distance of your loved ones, then I assume you'd be pretty pissed. And don't tell me that's just your government, you let your fucking schoolchildren scribble on these bombs.

>And it was so brutal in Russia that it was signaled out by essentially every historian throughout the centuries.

>essentially every historian throughout the centuries

>experts claim

I rate this between 3 and 8 out of 10 on my vagueness-scale. And let me remind you, you did not single Russia out for how bad serfdom there was, but for serfdom itself. What do you expect me to do? Substitute a slightly better argument for your terrible one? Not gonna do that, put in some effort to begin with.

>>92539

>it's not even like the Jewish people had a change of heart

Are you suggesting Jews would persecute Christians given the chance?

>On the contrary, we got it from you. Gobineaux was the first to create a political ideology based on the concept of race as a core tenet

>The person who introduced but antisemitism and nationalism to scientific racialism was H.S. Chamberlain, along with Richard Wagner.

A French guy said Semites are cool, and a British-German historian and Wagner studied some Jewish rabbinic law. Ergo, Europeans learned these ideas from the Jews! In fact, it didn't exist or germinate in Europe or anywhere in the world before these three did their thing! In fact, there wasn't even a chance for it to happen if it wasn't for Jews!!!

I'm sorry, but you haven't actually put forward an argument. You just listed 3 people and said that they're somehow responsible for huge European movements.

>Israel has never attempted to bring peace to the Middle East

That's a lie, we offered peace deals several times. Read up on Yitzhak Rabin specifically.

>it's about an asshole nation bullying everyone.

refer below

>Not because you're Jewish, but because you fuck everything up, on a global stage

Somehow a tiny sliver of land is responsible for world catastrophes

>Furthermore, your government spits on my religion, extorts and insults my people

Another lie. Christians aren't discriminated here.

>committed grievous crimes against the Christians in the Middle East

Such as? We used Lebanese right-wing death squads to massacre Shiites, that's as close as "Christians" and "massacre" come in the context of Israel.

>you let your fucking schoolchildren scribble on these bombs.

Oh my God, you are pulling things out of your ass. Let me guess, that one photo where you have two girls writing something on a rocket? That happened exactly once. Or do you think kids are taken here on school trips to decorate bombs? Either way it just shows how shortsighted and superficial you are, these sort of sentiments arise in people and particularly kids because there are constant threats from Hamas, Nasrallah and so on. Any kid in any country would have negative attitudes towards a country or group if they were constantly threatened, so I don't really blame the Palestinians either. However, the only people that actually go out of their way to harm Arabs are settlers who are religious extremists.

You talk to me as if I'm personally responsible and have the power to do something. Sorry buddy, but I was left out of the global Jewish Cabal and can't do shit. Maybe you can do something on your end tho, ask your girlfriend to ring up Nasrallah to stop threatening to "peacefully remove six million Jews" back to Europe.

And look, you've got strong feelings here, I understand that. But to quote a great Jew and Zionist: facts don't care about your feelings. Everything you know about Israel and its social dynamic is from the internet or clickbait headlines. I'm not excusing Israel for what it does to Palestinians, but your characterization of it is completely disproportional and detached from reality.

>>experts claim

Yes they do. Do I need to cite any experts if I say "most historians agree the Holocaust happened"?

>you did not single Russia out for how bad serfdom there was, but for serfdom itself

You're being pedantic and hanging on some minor point because of how I worded it. I'm not going to continue arguing over something so minor.

bad religion, good race. just like ancap. bad(actually ok) religion, good people

>>87559

How do slaves feel about chains?

>>92545

>Are you suggesting Jews would persecute Christians given the chance?

In fact, I am suggesting they do this now. It isn't remotely genocide, and might never become one, but still, it's oppression. Barring Christians from visiting their holy sites sounds like pretty bad oppression to me.

>A French guy said Semites are cool, and a British-German historian and Wagner studied some Jewish rabbinic law. Ergo, Europeans learned these ideas from the Jews! In fact, it didn't exist or germinate in Europe or anywhere in the world before these three did their thing! In fact, there wasn't even a chance for it to happen if it wasn't for Jews!!!

What you did now was to repeat my argument in a bastardized form, and you have been doing this since our discussion started. You omitted that the ideas Wagner and Chamberlain introduced to scientific racialism were present most strongly in a certain Jewish book they studied, and that is pretty good evidence that yes, they took them from the Jews.

>huge European movements

They weren't huge. Eugenics was huge, and that is on the Anglos, and scientific racialism has existed for a while, but not in the distinct form it took in the Nazis.

>That's a lie, we offered peace deals several times. Read up on Yitzhak Rabin specifically.

I should have been more specific, that's on me.

Overall, Israel hasn't brought peace to the region, but war. Rabin may have made some serious efforts later on (he did sign some of the original expulsion orders several decades before). In the meantime, Israel sent death squads to Lebanon, exploded several car bombs there, and attacked a Hezbollah leader with an attack helicopter. It conducted assassinations in Belgium, France, and Malta, among others, and in Norway, where it killed a Norwegian citizen because the Mossad agents in charge made a little oopsie identifying their target. It was involved in around ten wars, give or take. And whenever I read Israeli news, they are provoking and bloodthirsty as fuck. I am not saying other countries are better, but I am quite sure that Germany is (and I despise my government too, don't be mistaken).

>Somehow a tiny sliver of land is responsible for world catastrophes

Are you serious? Israel cannot cause much harm, because it's geographically small? Your government owns, what, two hundred nukes? These things don't care where they're launched from, they still mess you up. Not to say Israel intends to use them, but my point is, your argument is shit. Countries don't need a huge area to destabilize the region they're in.

>Another lie. Christians aren't discriminated here.

Again, you keep Christians in the Middle East from visiting their Holy Sites. That's kind of a big deal, and enough for me to make up my mind as to whether Israel is really our buddy. Other than that, there is the practice of ultra-orthodox Jews of spitting at Christians, and so far, the authorities have turned a blind eye to that:

http://imemc.org/article/75889/

>Such as? We used Lebanese right-wing death squads to massacre Shiites, that's as close as "Christians" and "massacre" come in the context of Israel.

I wasn't talking about massacres. Dropping bombs in their neighborhoods is already grievous enough.

>Oh my God, you are pulling things out of your ass. Let me guess, that one photo where you have two girls writing something on a rocket? That happened exactly once.

Point taken. I hope someone slapped these two brats, but point taken.

>And look, you've got strong feelings here, I understand that. But to quote a great Jew and Zionist: facts don't care about your feelings.

Certainly, but I'm not arguing from my feelings here. There are many nations that are far worse than Israel, but I have no personal grudge against them. That doesn't mean I'd judge their inhabitants or their governments less harshly, just that I don't see it as my business to the same degree.

>You talk to me as if I'm personally responsible and have the power to do something.

That wasn't my intention, but I can see why it came across that way. That tends to happen in these discussions. I only hold you personally responsible for downplaying how shitty Israel is. I know you did not personally kill anyone, that's why I'm only judging you as a shitposter, not as a murderer. Big difference. Had you told me that you have killed ten Palestinian children this week, trust me, I'd have been a lot more outraged.

>Yes they do.

That may well be the case, but see below.

>Do I need to cite any experts if I say "most historians agree the Holocaust happened"?

Well, you kinda do, this is the internet after all. But point taken.

>You're being pedantic and hanging on some minor point because of how I worded it. I'm not going to continue arguing over something so minor.

I can only respond to the argument you presented, not to the argument you actually had in your mind. That's how these discussions work.

>>92539

>ancrap is a muslim rapefugee living in Germany

>>92545

>still pilpulling

>>92481

This is a very wise post that mirrors much on what I believe about Jews and marxism

To give another example if you are walking down the street in the day and see your black neighbor who you know and have decent relations you should greet him.

If you are walking down the same street late at night and see a bunch of black niggers who you don't know acting in anymanner you don't like your defense radar needs to ping hardcore.

This is really just common sense

>>92615

The whole "you disrespect my religion" bit. I have heard islamists use that phrase before.

also

>don't worry, im not a muslim, I just fugg someone whose arab

lol

Walter Block on Jews if anyone's interested:

https://russia-insider.com/en/it-permissible-criticize-jews/ri22297

>>92677

Lebanese are mostly Christian as far as I know.

lazy guy's explanation of all bad

>>87630

>Jews by and large possess in-group preference

>only Jews practice in-group preference

>the only reason Jews are more successful than average is because of in-group preference

lol

>>92807

Whom are you paraphrasing?

>>92794

Being a Christian doesn't change their arabic genes.

>>92807

>only jews practice ingroup preference

Literally no one said that. What WAS said is that they are far more extreme about it, because, to quote Kevin MacDonald, it is their "group evolutionary strategy".

>>92856

You stupid fucking nigger, in your post you said that because you are fucking an Arab, you automatically become a Mudslime:

>don't worry, im not a muslim, I just fugg someone whose arab

I corrected you by saying that Lebanese are Christians, I never said anything about genes changing while worshiping the dead Jew.

>>92856

> What WAS said is that they are far more extreme about it, because, to quote Kevin MacDonald, it is their "group evolutionary strategy".

where is the proof?

>>92887

I was saying that he was a racemixer, as if that is better then being a muslim rapefugee in Germany. They both will result in the same thing: arab genes entering the german genepool.

>>92906

The past 2000 years of jewish history.

>>92907

>The past 2000 years of jewish history.

epic.

>>92907

>Past 2000 years of Jewish history

Nice citation

>>88195

Don’t feed the Jews

>>87630

There obviously is a jewish conspiracy but it is disorganised, yes. That doesn't mean they themselves aren't aware of it or do not conspire with each other. It's not a bunch of heebs in one room trying to figure out how to destroy the white race, but many jews are working exactly on that and more.

>>93239

<There obviously is a jewish conspiracy but it is disorganised, yes

>but it is disorganised

It almost like Jews have both lefties and right wingers like anyone else, but it's easier to blame outsiders than admit your own people are shit as well.

>>93239

Nice necro