/christianity/ - Christian Theology & Philosophy

Not sure how migration plays in the last judgement, but if anyone doubts that the end isn't near then they're blind to the seasons.

>With mass migration on the rise

Punishment for miscegenation, as the bible said would happen.

>the middle east falling apart

So, the same as the last 1000 years?

>climate change

Are you retarded?

>do you think we're approaching the end of the world?

No. This heretical rapture idiocy has no basis in scripture.

>>8470

You don't really know shit about the Middle East do you… Look up videos of Baghdad from the 60/70s, though I doubt the knowledge will help your chronic retardation.

>>8480

>some of the camel piss drinking goat raping mongrels wore modern clothes in the 60s

>this means the middle east was great

I will pray for you.

>>8493

1. Iraqis north and east of Najaf have never seen a camel in their life, except maybe either in a zoo or on the internet.

2. In North Iraq even the farmers don't own goats.

3. "Mongrels". Calling them names does not alter my opinion of them. Indeed, I find them as a whole more admirable than atheistic depressed nordicucks, even though they are prejudiced, lazy, on occasion cold blooded and with a tribal mindset. Go talk to one from a village and learn, loser. If you don't stumble upon one of the extremists you will be surprised. A lot of them are just like rural Greeks. It's uncanny really. Nice chaps, as long as you aren't a skin tone darker than them. You would have been surprised more back then, but after America starved literal millions to death via embargoes on behalf of the Kuwaiti Wahabi snakes, after the Saudi funded and American supplied ISIS ran through, after their country was polarised between Shias and Sunnis due to the Iraq-Iran war, after Saddam and recently the West fucked the Kurds, after Saudi funded radical imams started preaching in the Sunni mosques and Iranian funded ones in Shia mosques, they have become slightly less hospitable. Blood ties no longer matter. It used to be Christians and Muslims would die for each other if they were descended from the same tribe. Now religion is what they identify themselves with. Alas. This is what a society looks like when Muslim fundamentalists go wild. At least it isn't 100% fucked. There are multiple Christians, Catholics and Nestorians, in parliament after all, even if they are token members. Christians fleeing ISIS were harboured in Islamic holy shrines in Najaf. There is still hope despite how Iraq has been kicked while it is down.

4. The Iraqi economy at the time was completely stable and the Iraqi Dinar was worth more than the US Dollar. Come on. Iraq and Syria were great, Lebanon is ok, Egypt was great before the Muslim Brotherhood took over for a single year, and Jordan is doing ok. I need not mention the Gulf countries and Saudi Arabia. However they are doing well only because they decided to play ball with the Americans. You all think too lowly of the Middle East. Most of the problems are there due to foreign intervention and due to the Sykes-Picot agreement, look it up ignoramus.

5. More of them wear modern clothes now compared to back then, lmao.

I will pray for you in return.

>>8654

1. So?

2. So?

3. Read the bible you filthy sodomite. Mongrels are damned by our Lord.

4. Why are you so obsessed with a weird fantasy version of Iraq?

>>8670

1. So? Maybe stop using slurs based on something that does not exist.

2. So? Maybe stop using slurs based on something that does not exist.

3. Whether they are damned by the Lord does not matter to me. That is their problem to deal with after death. Not mine to deal with or even care about during life or death.

4. Why do you think reality is fantasy? Do you have an actual mental disorder? I cannot help you if this is the case. Go read up on the Iraqi economy and come back after learning something.

>>8670

>>8480

>>8654

>>8672

>ad hominem (retard, loser, "do you have an actual mental disorder")

>condescending "I'll pray for you" (retaliatory)

>>8493

>>8670

>ad hominem (you filthy sodomite)

>condescending "I'll pray for you"

Why are each of you still posting when the other one is obviously not listening? What do you gain?

>>8672

It does exist. Just because a tiny group in the middle east don't have camels and have to import their camel piss, doesn't mean there is no camel piss drinking in the middle east.

>>8673

Why don't you go back to reddit where you can get imaginary points for crying about fallacies that are not being used?

>>8676

I wonder if you really believe non-Bedouins drink camel piss. Are you serious? I know that it is a thing among Bedouins, but Bedouins are a small group confined to the deserts (outside of Arabia at least, the Saudis have a large amount of legitimate camel piss drinkers however). You cannot seriously use them to justify your opinion of literally everybody else in the Middle East. The best analogy I can think of is saying all the Irish are thieves and drug addicts because Irish travellers exist.

The reality is that most so called Arabs outside of a very defined desert region in and around Arabia have never even seen a camel in person, much less drank it's piss.

>>8673

I gain nothing. Neither do you by asking questions to people who you will never meet on an anonymous message board, so welcome to the boat. We all have nothing better to do, so here we are.

>>8695

I'm here because I learn from the discussion. You and your partner here are hindering that by being vitriolic.

I'm just asking for some reflection from you, you're not going to get anywhere like this and you'll only get bitter. The other guy is even more jaded than you.

>>8692

>we don't drink camel piss I swear

>our holy book just says drinking camel piss is saintly for no reason at all

Sure thing Mohammad.

>>8670

If you look in the dictionary for the definition of "I have no argument" you will find a picture of this post of yours.

>>8700

Are you trying to be retarded or do you just lack self awareness?

>>8716

The irony is overwhelming.

I am not really sure

>>8467

>do you think we're approaching the end of the world?

If you were a Christian, it wouldn't matter.

Every generation thinks they're in the end times.

Think about all the European Christians during WW2 and how many of them were convinced Jesus was coming back within the net year or 2.

Nobody knows but God. Jesus will come like a theive in the night so be preprade at all times.

The Bible also says to pray that it doesn't happen in winter, so Christians have the power to delay the end.

>Why would Christians want to delay the coming of Jesus?

Because it isn't time yet. There's more souls to save.

>>8747

>Every generation thinks they're in the end times.

It has also never been nearly as bad as now

>Jesus will come like a theive in the night so be preprade at all times.

He will not return until there have been three and a half years of tribulation.

>Because it isn't time yet. There's more souls to save.

That's for God to decide.

>>8748

>It has also never been nearly as bad as now

Sure it has. It's been far worse!

>That's for God to decide.

That's the point. Christians have the power to delay it… Christians are Gods people through Christ Jesus.

>>8748

I really must emphasize how the world has been in far, far worse conditions than it is now.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

>It has also never been nearly as bad as now

I honestly can't believe you think this to be true.

>>8751

>>8752

>>8756

You wouldn't even know about this if it were'nt for the internet. The amount of unkown things that have happened throughout the histroy of mankind far outweigh the known histories.

I want you to understand that as horrifying as that is the concept of it is not new.

What would far more infuriate God is vile acts commited against children, which is happening today and has been happening for centuries.

You are convinced that this is the end times and say so with conviction and assurance even attempting to provide proof to favor your claim but yet say it's for God to decide when somone claims otherwise.

>>8470

No one brought up the rapture but you. I do agree, however. It has no basis in scripture.

>>8467

only God knows

It may feel like it sometimes, but I get the feeling things could get a LOT worse then they are now before God decides it is time.

One one hand, the longer God holds off, the more time we have to save souls and improve ourselves as followers - however marginally.

On the other hand, the sooner the end comes, the less opportunity there is for us to sin and keep offending God (though us choosing to sin while we live is our responsibility, not His).

The western viewpoint on the end times (mostly in america) has changed radically since the 1830. Read up on John Nelson Darby, the father of modern dispensationalism. He actually got his ideas from Augustine, who came to his results by means of integrating greek philosophy into the Christianity of the time.

Honestly, most of the disagreements I see about the end times are a result of people interpreting the bible through the lens of dispensationalism. It gives them a sense of certainty about what will happen, but almost none of their presuppositions are supported by the bible. Instead, it causes them to become hyper focused on a couple of nearly irrelevant biblical ideas.

For example:

The mark of the beast. - They take this to be literal when there is no reason to take it in such a way. In Rome, and in many other countries slaves would have the mark of their master branded on their hand or forehead. The listeners at the time would understand that this simply meant that a certain person could be identified as being owned by a certain master. This slaves actions would be centered around serving and improving their masters lot. So a person who serves the Lord, or conversely who serves darkness could be identified by their actions; not eveni requiring a physical mark. Your hands are the tools through which you work in the world; hands that serve darkness may as well bear physical marks of ownership by darkness, even though they don't actually. The state of a persons mind, their thoughts, and inner thoughts may as well be signs of ownership by either the Lord, or darkness. Although physical a physical mark on the forehead need not exist.

The rapture. - Not supported in scripture unless you read through a dispensational lens. The rapture is an extremely new idea.

Modern Israel having a special role in the end times. - Again, one cannot come to this conclusion unless they read through a dispensational lens. In fact, the Jews rejected the Christ and as a result the old covenant (which was conditional) passed away. No reasonable person could look at isreal and believe that they are holding up their end of the covenant. They were divorced by god, but he still held up his promise by bringing Christ into the world to form his church. The church is the new isreal that is supposed to serve as the kingdom of priests to the world. Catholics think that they are the only true church, but again this is just bad doctrine.

The building of the new temple as a good thing. Even if they built a new temple it wouldn't do them any good. When the temple was destroyed by Rome in AD 70, this was gods way of judging isreal and destroying their old religion. They clung to the old ways, which were inferior to the new ways.

The number 666 being significant. Nero. Why is this even a question?

Dispensationalism is a massive deception that has resulted in splits and divisions in the church, and has also led to unnecessary speculation and fear-mongering about the impending nature of the final judgment. Yes, it will happen. No, we can't know when.

If you want to get spooked a bit, read up on Darby. Maybe take a look at all the other great deceptions that popped up in the 1830s as well. Those were very spiritually active years for some reason.

I hate to have to point to a particular teacher, because then I know i'll face accusations of just getting my theology from just one guy but whatever. Take the time to listen to this lecture and you'll probably understand what i'm talking about.

http://www.thenarrowpath.com/topical_lectures.php#When_Shall_These_Things_Be

It's a ton of listening, so I would download and just listen when driving. It's worth the time.

>>8758

Agree wholeheartedly.

From what I've heard, the doctrine of "The Rapture" was first visualized in the early 19th century by a Scottish girl. Will look up a link …

>>8778

>In fact, the Jews rejected the Christ

Jews are the minions of Satan, they can not be saved.

>and as a result the old covenant (which was conditional) passed away.

The old covenant had nothing to do with jews, and is still active with God's people. Levitical law was fulfilled by the Christ, that does not terminate the old covenant.

>>8796

>Jews cannot be saved

Explain Paul

>>8470

>Punishment for miscegenation, as the bible said would happen.

is there actually anything against miscegenation? there are verses against marrying outside the religion but where does it mention race?

>>8778

My original post.

>>8796

I've thought about this, and it seems that Jews are like any unrepentant person. A Jew unrepentant, who rejects Christ will be rejected the same as an unrepentant gentile.

Now it is not as though the word of God has failed. For not all Israelis truly belong to Israel. (ISV Translation.)

So then the Isreal becomes a fluid entity, and the church is the whole of Israel.

The funny part being that Isreal the modern nation might be called Isreal, and might be made entirely out of ethnic Jews (pro-tip: it isn't) but despite this it wouldn't be called Israel spiritually. Revelation suggests it is called Egypt or Soddom spiritually.

Israel is in fact the total body of true believers who obey and follow Christ. It is a designation that transcends borders, ethnicity, and denomination. Basically, Fucks "Jews" they aren't even Israel in spiritual terms unless they follow Christ. Practicing Talmud-ism, or modern Judaism is rejection of Christ, and a slap in the face to God.

The second point, You're right. I misspoke. I could have better said that the Jews at the time broke the covenant and were put out. That covenant may apply to Christians now, although there are a lot of different ideas about this.

>>8799

>>8470

Christians are told not to marry non-believers.

People from outside Israel could become Jews and live among them, even marrying them. The verses that anti-racemixing ideas come from have much more to do with maintaining the purity of spiritual Israel (the church, the body of believers) than with maintaining purity of racial lines.

Objectively, racemixing has more downsides than positives, but it isn't actually forbidden in scripture. A white christian who marries a Chinese christian is fine in Gods eyes.

A Korean christian who marries a white Muslim is in trouble. They might not be sinning, it isn't clear, but they are making their life much more difficult that it needs to be.

>>8799

>>8806

The very premise of God creating separate people by design is reason to not transgress that design. That's the argument EMJ uses against the anus as a sex organ, it's natural theology.

>>8810

I agree to a point. I've often thought that when God confused the languages he may have also divided the races as well in order to prevent man from ever again being unified.

However, with that work already being completed, with people being scattered across the world, and with so many different counties and cultures already being extant. It seems that different races mixing doesn't matter.

I hate to use meme-theology here but we are all descended from two people. We are all the children of man, we are all human. In fact, all the races came from Shem, Ham, and Japeth. We all share a common origin, and if we accept Christ then we all share a common destination. Even if in paradise there are difference races, we will all be together in our devotion and love for God.

When people make arguments against race mixing from the bible it seems carnal, and entirely missing of the reason for which the scriptures were given.

I'm unfamiliar with EMN. Google doesn't know either apparently. If you could provide a QRD to help me understand where you're coming from i'd appreciate it.

>>8812

>We are all the children of man, we are all human. In fact, all the races came from Shem, Ham, and Japeth. We all share a common origin, and if we accept Christ then we all share a common destination. Even if in paradise there are difference races, we will all be together in our devotion and love for God.

None of this is contrary to the anti miscegenation position. It's even said right alongside the Biblical affirmation of the reality of race:

>He made from one, every nation (ethnos, not nation-state) of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times, and the boundaries of their habitation, (Acts 17:26 NAS)

Here's an article arguing the position: http://faithandheritage.com/2011/05/the-moral-status-of-miscegenation/

>with so many different counties and cultures already being extant. It seems that different races mixing doesn't matter.

What do you mean? That doesn't follow.

>I'm unfamiliar with EMN

EMJ is E. Michael Jones, basically catholic Jordan Peterson on youtube. There are a lot of stale forced memes about him around the imageboards.

>>8778

>He actually got his ideas from Augustine

That's a weird way to spell Schlomo

>>8778

>He actually got his ideas from Augustine

No he didn't. There's no way someone could understand dispensationalism (especially classical dispensationalism) and think that. Dispensationalism is a genuine theological novum, there is to my knowledge absolutely no precedent for it before Darby.

>Honestly, most of the disagreements I see about the end times are a result of people interpreting the bible through the lens of dispensationalism

Then I'd say you know nothing about church history, dispensationalism, or even eschatology.

>They take this to be literal when there is no reason to take it in such a way.

I would say that the statement "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man" indicates far greater significance than you're giving to it

>Not supported in scripture unless you read through a dispensational lens

If by this you mean the secret rapture (often simply called the rapture) then I agree completely agree, but scripture is absolutely clear and explicit that the saints will be taken up to meet Jesus in the clouds when He comes.

>Modern Israel having a special role in the end times

In the way that dispensationalists expect, yes, that is unbiblical and based on dispensationalism. However, throughout church history there have been a multitude of theologians that were convinced that the Jews would reconvert in the end times, and become a bulwark of Christianity, and their ideas seem to be supported by scripture.

>Nero

I despise this interpretation. It seems to be the opposite of the wisdom John called for. Not only was Nero quite dead when Revelation was written, but it is based on the erroneous notion that Revelation describes events that were far in the past, when its scope is clearly apocalyptic. There's also the significant textual variant which must be taken into account, what we all think is 666 may very well be 616 in reality.

>>8467

invasion of your nation by foreigners is a "lesser" judgement or precursor to the main forms of judgement, which are: famine, pestilence and war

When Christ was here that was also considered the end times, and the antiChrist was said to be in the world back then as well because it is a spirit.

since Christ left there have been people who have constantly called their present time the "end times" for the last 2000 years.

there are really always "wars and rumors of wars" and "signs in the heavens" the past few years we had an astonishing amount of blood moons that also coincided with jewish holidays.

personally, i assume things can get much worse, and that Christ wont return in my lifetime. however we are told no man knows the hour and that we should eagerly await his return.

thats my understanding at least

>>8469

Millions of people flooding into the first world. Increased demands on the power grids, resources to fuel the grid, food supply, water supply, increased transportation, increased oil demands, increased pollution. The porky scam to import more consumers will push this planet past the breaking point.

From a more /pol/ point of view, whites are slated to become a minority in the US by 2045. That's not even considering open the southern border. What this means in the long run is that Hispanic / Latinos will become a Global Military Super Power in the next 20 years and have access to the worlds largest arsenal of nuclear weapons. Uncle Sam will be handing the BIG RED BUTTON™ to Pedro.

That said, Hispanics are overwhelmingly Catholic (good for us) and have a strong connection to heritage and tradition. It's almost a certainty that whites will be absorbed while blacks and muslims are systematically cleansed from the Americas. With a military that powerful, Canada will fall to the US within a matter of a few years.

This is all assuming that nature doesn't purge us all first due to the shock that uncontrolled mass immigration will inflict on our environment. The US as we know it probably does only have about 12 good years left, as loony AOC says.

>>8865

>Hispanics are overwhelmingly Catholic

Until they get here. The vast majority of Hispanics fall away from the faith within one generation of arrival.

>It's almost a certainty that whites will be absorbed.

Over my dead body.

>This is all assuming that nature doesn't purge us all first

You write like a Gaia worshipper.

>>8867

>This would be our world's way of controlling it's population

The earth is just a big rock. It doesn't *do* anything.

>>8467

People have only been saying this non-stop for the last 2000 years. We're not that special.

>>8731

Locusts can be an analogy for mass immigration.

>>8964

Maybe you're not, but many are. Things are coming but only God knows when.

>>8978

Do the immigrants look like what is described in Revelation?

>>8700

1. I am Catholic

2. Most people in the Middle East do not drink camel piss, just like most so called Christians do not actually, really, "turn the other cheek", or whatever else.

>>8708

I have been to Iraq. Have you been anywhere near Iraq? Have you ever even met anybody from it? I wonder. But I will not assume anything like you did, wrongly.

>>9048

>I don't understand "turn the other cheek"

>that means nobody does it.

>>8673

>>8672

>>8654

>>8493

You guys clearly deserve eachother - i guess God really is Just.