f33a7c No.16943485 [Last50 Posts]
>I'm completely new, where do I start?
Learn the Kana. Start with Hiragana and then move on to Katakana. Yes, you need both, and yes stroke order is important. Use Realkana or Kana Invaders for spaced repetition. Alternatively, you can use the Anki deck, but I'd recommend the first two. Tae Kim has a Kana diagram on his website, and you can use KanjiVG for pretty much any character.
>Alright, I know the Kana. Now what?
You have to learn vocabulary and grammar in order to speak and understand the language. Studying both simultaneously will get you understanding things faster. Vocabulary can be learned through just studying words, although some people like studying kanji on their own too. There are grammar guides such as Tae Kim that can get you started quickly, but they won't have everything you need so consult multiple sources as you go.
>Well this is great and everything, but I still need more help
Ask in this thread.
Threadly reminder:
YOU CAN LEARN JAPANESE
Don't come to tell us about Duolingo, we know that it exists and it is generally frowned upon for using a contrascientific new-aged didactic philosophy, and is designed feel as effortless as possible, even at the expense of actually learning anything.
>[Resources]
>DJT site, this is a great place to start:
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/index.html
>[Anki and Decks]
Anki: https://apps.ankiweb.net/
Core 2k/6k: https://mega.nz/#!QIQywAAZ!g6wRM6KvDVmLxq7X5xLrvaw7HZGyYULUkT_YDtQdgfU
Core2k/6k content: https://core6000.neocities.org/
Anon's Japanese Learner Anki package: https://mega.nz/#!14YTmKjZ!A_Ac110yAfLNE6tIgf5U_DjJeiaccLg3RGOHVvI0aIk
<This is a .zip file with a number of Anki decks and a number of books on grammar, including Japanese the Manga Way, Tae Kim's guide to Japanese Grammar, Remembering the Kanji vol 1, 2 and 3 (mnemonic exercises), A Dictionary of basic, intermediate, and advanced Japanese grammar, An Anki deck that contains the Visualizing Japanese Grammar video series, a deck for Kana, a deck for Kanji and vocab, and a deck version of the DoJG book
Kodansha's Kanji Learner's Course deck: https://ankiweb.net/shared/info/779483253
>[Websites, Apps, and Books]
Jisho: http://www.jisho.org
RealKana: http://realkana.com/
Kana Invaders: https://learnjapanesepod.com/kana-invaders/
Genki I and II (2nd Edition): https://mega.nz/#!aBF1TJYJ!D7Lkamt_oa6QlkMX4k0e7nDRu3qwacyyuoyxvbSego8
<The zip's password is "cant"
Forvo.com: https://ja.forvo.com/
Mainichi.me: http://mainichi.me/
Rikaichan: http://www.polarcloud.com/rikaichan/
GoogleIME: https://www.google.com/inputtools/try/
KanjiVG: http://kanji.sljfaq.org/kanjivg.html
IMABI: http://www.imabi.net/
Tae Kim's Guide to Japanese: http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/
KANJI-Link radicals: http://www.kanji-link.com/en/kanji/radicals/
Japanese Audiobooks: http://how-to-learn-any-language.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6241&PN=1&TPN=1
All Japanese All The Time: http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/blog/all-japanese-all-the-time-ajatt-how-to-learn-japanese-on-your-own-having-fun-and-to-fluency/
Erin.ne.jp: https://www.erin.ne.jp/en/lesson01/index.html
R.A. Miller's A Japanese Reader: https://mega.nz/#!aNoHDBRa!1q_JZWZnktl16rWZsSz1PHUxQbTvi5UU_VpSIogzxO8
Japanese Google Dictionary: https://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/
KanjiTomo is a program for identifying Japanese characters from images: https://www.kanjitomo.net
>Basic Kanji Books and grammar(remove YOU WILL NEVER LEARN from the links
Volume 1: https://mega.nz/#!YOUGOQAyIhJ!gqFr8gWILL7vVyybIlvsIxUNEVERuz7klyzV57_AZLEARNxaN1WZwSkA0
Volume 2: https://mega.nz/#!SYOUOBmjSSK!fReQzyhQGWILLWlaepuSfdA2aaM5KNEVERDX0wYBiymK3LEARNOHUsW3I
Verbs and Essential Grammar: https://mega.nz/YOU#!ie5HUazJ!LRT5SWILLDAE8aSdNEVERsH8_LZ4gJdSIhbyzsLEARNJPfeoLw5ge73kU
>[YouTube Videos]
Namasensei: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqJ5wU4FamA&list=PL9987A659670D60E0 (entertainment purposes only)
JapanesePod101: https://www.youtube.com/user/japanesepod101/videos
KANJI-Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOXuIYVzyL4&list=PLE6S_Q0SX_mBtzG17ho7YER6vmzCPJ3B4
Japanese Ammo with Misa: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSyd8tXJoEJKIXfrwkPdbA/playlists
Japanese VideoCast: https://www.youtube.com/user/LingoVideocast/videos
KawaJapa Cure Dolly: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkdmU8hGK4Fg3LghTVtKltQ/videos
____________________________
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06705a No.16943486
Nobody is going to be learning japanese if you choose this shithole as a place for your threads.
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3f199c No.16943487
Kanji still gay
It's fuckin pretty, and I kinda can see the appeal of the pictography.
But it's gay and retarded as a writing system.
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f33a7c No.16943488
previous thread
>>16853608
I'll be using this thread to glean the intrest for the subject among those that still post or lurk here. If this thread gets pruned without getting close to being bumplocked then I won't make another one.
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000000 No.16943528
Fuck off weebshit, this is /v/-video games not /v/-faggots
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c34826 No.16943533
>>16943487
kanji is a problem that could be solved with a spacebar
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f33a7c No.16943556
>>16943533
spaces are a problem that can be solved with Kanji
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85f6c4 No.16943712
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ba35f2 No.16943894
I am gonna start the Grammar deck today, is it like the video grammar deck where I just take in all the info and then mark it as "good"?
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ba35f2 No.16943896
>>16943488
Then I will make sure that I steal all the links at least. Thanks for you service.
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af3820 No.16944067
Is this an error? Do I need to download some new font to get this to work?
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af3820 No.16944068
>>16944067
Well, it's clearly not an error since it appears like this later, but what does it mean?
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f33a7c No.16944069
>>16944067
it means "で is acceptable here, and it is not clear if Ø (Zero-particle) is acceptable or not"
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f3f22f No.16944071
Thanks man. So the sentecne could be structured Boku wa kega de da?
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f33a7c No.16944072
>>16944069
>>16944068
for more information, this is standard linguistic notation for giving examples of unnatural speech.
* is prefixed before a word or sentence to indicate that it is unacceptable (grammatically incorrect)
?? is prefixed before a word or sentence to indicate that it is either ambiguous, highly context dependent, unknown, or marginally acceptable (not natural sounding, but not necessarily 'wrong') (Depending on what the point of the example is. The actual text preceding the example should make it clear which is meant)
Correct samples are unmarked.
/ is used to compare multiple options of interest in one line, instead of having one line that says
>僕はけがでだ
and one that says
>??僕はけがØだ
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f3f22f No.16944073
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f33a7c No.16944074
>>16944071
could and should use で, and almost certainly should not use Ø.
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f3f22f No.16944075
>>16944072
I see, that clears up basically everything, I have never seen this form of notation before.
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f3f22f No.16944083
The grammar deck seems a lot less scary than the readme made it sound.
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861bad No.16944477
how do I download all the novels on itazuraneko just in case the site ever goes down?
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3ceacf No.16944573
I'm way too ESL to understand all these english text book words like "inf" and shit.
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1d40a0 No.16944575
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883eba No.16944597
>>16944573
do you mean inf as in infinitive? Where are you encountering them exactly?
>>16944575
and yet these threads have been here longer than you have.
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fadd1b No.16944621
>>16943556
>implying spaces are a problem
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400e08 No.16944628
>Download succubus affection
>The patch supposedly translates the game
>It really doesn't, only a very minor things
>I still want to play the game really hard
>Try to read japanese at first but since I've never tried to do so outside of practice, it's a bit slow
>Getting into it and understanding more and more
>mfw I can read japanese
When they say 大きなおちんち you already know where things are going.
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57d44d No.16944654
>>16944597
The grammar deck, it uses a lot of phrases that I have never encountered before like the /?? notation that was explained up above.
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883eba No.16944666
>>16944654
For things that are abbreviations like 'inf' try this table: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_glossing_abbreviations
If you can't find it there, try searching for it on wiktionary (may have to add a period), e.g. https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/inf.
For full words, try looking them up on Wikipedia (linguistics articles are usually good quality and free of (political) bias), e.g. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infinitive
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9be6aa No.16944669
>>16944666
Thanks man, i'll read up on it as it appears then.
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24a36e No.16945226
>>16943485
i'm doing RTK.
can anyone please explain to me why 旭 means "rising sun"? the combination of 9 and sun doesn't make any fucking sense. heisig explains it using baseball of all things, and koohii users say that in 9 am you can see the rising sun, but that's fucking bullshit because by 9 am the sun is way up in the sky. if it was 4 or 5 and sun it'd make more sense, but 9? where the hell in the world does the sun start rising in 9 am? that's ridiculous.
i know i should probably just go along with it and keep studying, but i will not let this go so easily. please help
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87d374 No.16945236
>>16945226
The 九 has nothing to do with the meaning; this Kanji is a phonosemantic compound. 日 indicates meaning and 九 indicates pronunciation (in Chinese, so they indicate on-readings). So you should break it down as "means something related to 日; sounds something like 九 (for on-readings)"
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514e79 No.16945456
>be a Jap-Eng-MysteryLanguage translator in your company
>grab the morning Japanese newspaper
>immediately greeted by a Japanese coworker who've known you for 4 months
<"あれ、アノン君、それ読めるの？
>はい
<どれどれ・・・これは何と読む？ *points at a part of the newspaper headline*
>急財要請
<すげえじゃん！
I was speechless for 2 hours. Not that I was disturbed or anything, I was just wondering why people do this. It's like seeing a physician and saying "whoa doc, you can heal people, that's great!"
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fe328c No.16945490
Can someone help me with this? Every single time I asked about this it makes less sense.
>それに…ご一行様が楽しんでいる姿を絵に描き留めたり句にしたり書にしたり、触ったものをご利益があるって言って売ればもしかして…
Does the passage supposed to read
>Besides… I can take pictures of everyone enjoying themselves or turn it into a poem, or sell whatever they touched as a souvenir for profit.
I have no idea what the passage means by writing something into a phrase. Does that make sense?
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87d374 No.16945494
>>16945490
I'm missing context, but I translate it as
>besides… I can do things like paint pictures of everyone enjoying and hang them up, or making them into a haiku, or writing a book, and maybe if I can sell things they touched and say they have the grace of God…
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3f199c No.16945495
>>16945456
EFL with extra languages are a profound rarity.
Especially if it is something like Japanese which is aggressively contrary to how the linguistics of english work
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883eba No.16945496
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3f199c No.16945497
>>16945496
いいえ、日本語があまり上手ではありません.
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3d5aed No.16945783
Why does the grammar deck bring up classical music so much, do japanese tryhards get into that?
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883eba No.16945922
>>16945783
I'm sure it's just the one tryhard who made the deck
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c34826 No.16945930
>>16945495
honestly I found Japanese an easier language to learn than spanish and other euro languages
the altered grammatical structure forced me to think in new ways while most romance languages are a matter of learning a set of similar synonyms and any minor special syntax rules that go along with them, then trying to remember exactly which of these 5 similar languages a given phrase belongs to
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ee7023 No.16945936
What's the benefit of speaking a non-Aryan language? At least with Indo-European languages, you have superior grammar and lexicon. Japanese is directly based on Chinese and other simplistic logographic languages of east Asia.
I'd say go learn Sanskrit. It's one of the most impressive and fundamental Indo-European languages, and allows you to read the Veda's naturally.
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883eba No.16945939
>>16945936
>There are more practical benefits to learning an Indian religious language than learning the language of the third largest economy and the fourth largest cultural exporter
>Japanese is directly based on Chinese and other […] languages of east Asia
The Japonic language family has no known genealogical relation to any other language family nor any language that is not part of the Japonic family, and the written history of Japanese predates any Chinese cultural influence by several hundred years.
>Japanese is simplistic
<The language with one of the most expansive, expressive, and complex verbal and adjectival inflection systems in the world
>Japanese is based on logo-graphic languages
<Japanese is known to have existed as a spoken language before the adoption of Chinese characters, and even when written exclusively in Chinese characters, Old Japanese primarily used them as phonetic markers instead of logograms because they were not designed to express Japanese grammar
>Implying that logographic-(morpho)phonological mixed scripts aren't superior writing systems
>harping on Indo-European language purity when they all derive from a proto-language that was closer to Chinese in inflectional expressiveness than Japanese has ever been
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88491d No.16946640
The newest version of Anki's media player can fullscreen and pause and stuff now. Fucking amazing.
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cfc2e3 No.16946930
fuck it I'm retiming all the subs on kitsuneneko for conan
From the feeling I get looking at it it's really good for learning, different from anime with autistic empty messages and artsy garbage which are truly shit tier for learning. really just looking for extremely basic shit to get me out of beginner
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cfc2e3 No.16947052
>>16946930
(this was basically just a vent post and the retimed subs are for personal-use, not good enough to upload, just so everyone knows)
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a0e73b No.16949496
I just wanted to come by and tell you all not to be me. Next month is the two year anniversary of me giving up learning Japanese. I feel for the Anki meme and hit memory overload at close to 2000 kanji memorized. It was like flipping a switch, one day I passed my deck with the normal stats, the next day I failed almost every item in the review. Make sure you do more than just memorizing Kanji. Put your knowledge to use and read easy manga or listen to simple shows. Anything to reinforce it so you aren't just memorizing squiggles
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a96a8f No.16949522
Are there any resources like this for learning Russian/other Slavic languages?
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4807da No.16949544
>>16949522
Here's a thread for Russian on a small board on anon.cafe; that's the closest I've got for you.
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4807da No.16949545
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962699 No.16949805
Are there any threads like this but I can make small translation requests, or should I just use this thread?
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4807da No.16949818
>>16949805
The general policy has historically been that if you post a translation request, anons in the thread will either translate it for you or tell you to fuck off as they see fit. It usually depends on why you're asking, if you tried to translate it yourself because you're learning, how hard it is, if you're spamming or acting entitled, the temperature outside and the current exchange rate between ETH and Argentinian pesos. If you want to try your luck here then go ahead; there probably isn't anyone still here that knows much Japanese. If you're interested in trying it on another site then check 8chan/v/ and the webring. There's also 4/jp/'s DJTs. I have no confidence in their ability to grasp Japanese nor contribute positively to a conversation, but on the bright side there's literally no way your request could make the thread any worse than it already is.
There's also this dead thread on anon.cafe/lang/, give it a try too, I guess https://anon.cafe/lang/res/71.html
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962699 No.16949826
>>16949818
It was just this image here and nothing else, if no one here minded a try
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e56657 No.16949828
>>16943487
It is great as writing system you uneducated barbarian.
It would be harder to learn Japanese without it. I can roughly understand a sentence by looking at the kanji alone.
||then again I studied Chinese||
git gud.
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ac514b No.16949830
>>16949828
>うらにわにはにわにわにはにわにわとりがいる。
>庭には二羽、裏庭には二羽、鶏がいる。
Damn, I had to cheat on this one.
Sentences like this are never used, though, just to teach people about the importance of 漢字. Nevertheless, now it's confirmed for me why japanese is shit, lack of punctuation, articles and, sometimes, plural.
I'm still going to learn it, because 日本ゲーム without political agenda.
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4807da No.16949836
>>16949830
>lack of punctuation
<literally two kinds of Japanese punctuation marks in your own post
>not having articles makes a language bad
<Latin is a shit Language apparently
>sometimes, plurals
That's almost all the time, and, if you want to get technical, some people would say literally all the time in a grammatical sense. This isn't rare for languages and it's why counters exist; it doesn't create any ambiguity because deixis adjectives and quantifiers every, as do particles.
Never ceases to confuse me which random features of a foreign language people pick out to determine if it's better or worse than English.
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ac514b No.16949839
>>16949836
Punctuation is mostly optional. I rarelly see any 「、」 on mangas and other texts.
I also forgot to mention spaces, it also is optional and is mostly ignored even when lots of text is in ひらがな.
I'm complaining about japanese, but it's most for venting, I'm still going to study it.
>if it's better or worse than English.
English isn't my first language either, it's portuguese and by itself it is harder than english, because of a fuckton of special cases with stuff like a/à/ha, ss/ç/s and u/ü(not used much)…
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7cf034 No.16949840
>>16949828
HEY BRO
CHECK IT OUT
🌳👨🦱
CLEARLY I'M TALKING ABOUT RESTING, BECAUSE IT'S A MAN AND A Tree AND YOU SLEEP UNDER TREES SOMETIMES, WHAT A GREAT WAY TO DO IT???
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4807da No.16949842
>>16949840
The fact that you can't immediately guess the meaning of most Kanji from their radicals doesn't matter because that's not what's good about them.
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eacd7e No.16949933
>>16949840
Kek.
Saved this. I'll post it to all japanese learning threads I'll see from now on.
Thanks man.
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fd7a25 No.16949999
>>16943487
Kanji are literally cheat codes for reading and understanding Japanese extremely quickly.
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718d33 No.16950002
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e9e0e4 No.16950115
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f1af41 No.16950144
>>16950115
Learn a real language, you damn builder
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4807da No.16950166
>>16950115
Chinese is a legitimately ugly and simplistic language. I have no idea how German came to have a reputation for sounding harsh when Chinese exists and sounds like a retard screaming a bunch of syllables that start with harsh consonants and putting a different weird vocal wiggle on them each time.
And writing in all Hanzi is awful too. The beautiful thing about Kanji-kana majiribun is the way it naturally aligns semantic and visual density and easily separates words without physically spacing them. Writing in all Hanzi is just a cluttered ugly mess that had all the purported downsides of Kanji without any of the benefits.
I legitimately hate seeing or hearing Chinese.
Not to mention that despite having a continuous 3000 year history it has the same or less complexity and expressiveness as your average pidgin or creole that was created 200 years ago by people who resorted to caveman speak because they couldn't understand each other.
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3d4426 No.16950680 
>>16950002
The R.A. Miller's A Japanese Reader mega link is also dead
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4accf8 No.16950682
I want to start with some basic stuff, any simple retro games I can use to gauge my progress? Like something on the famicom or super famicom?
First I'm supposed to start with hiragana, then katakana and then finally kanji right?
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4807da No.16950693
>>16950682
>First I'm supposed to start with hiragana
Yes
>then katakana
Yes
>and then finally Kanji
No. Kanji are a long term thing that you should do while learning vocabulary and grammar; you can't learn "the Kanji" the way you can hiragana, katakana, or the alphabet.
After katakana, start studying grammar and vocabulary, and you can choose to either start Kanji at the same time or wait until you've learned more vocabulary.
Also, just so it's clear, hiragana and katakana are an introductory thing you should be trying to get over with as soon as possible; spend a maximum of two weeks on them together before moving on. If you don't have them entirely down by that time it's fine, just review them as needed.
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dd44a1 No.16952336
What's the best japanese to english translator currently? I know DeepL is supposedly very good with spanish/french/english, anything similar to that but with jap?
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42c273 No.16952345
>>16950002
Bump, would really like these as well.
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f6462e No.16952349
I literally can't hear the difference between Z and S sounds. I am also struggling with intonation.
Is this a problem everyone has or is it just because my native language uses neither that makes it hard?
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42c273 No.16952351
>>16952349
>Is this a problem everyone has or is it just because my native language uses neither that makes it hard?
This, how well you define the difference between sounds is dictated by your native language to a great extent. Many native English speakers can differentiate between an unaspirated P and B sounds for example. Your
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42c273 No.16952352
>>16952351
*you're just going to have to have to learn how to differentiate the sounds. Some minor IPA knowledge could help.
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f6462e No.16952354
>>16952352
Shit, well I guess I will learn quickly once the difference starts being important. So far I have run into no confusion with S and Z.
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961213 No.16952380
>>16952349
Not with s and z specifically, but almost everybody will have trouble with some sounds when leaning a new language, and with Japanese specifically intonation is a common problem. And yes, these problems are conditioned by the languages you already speak, especially your native language. I'd be interested to know what languages it is that you speak, because I'm not familiar with any that don't use /s/ nor /z/.
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e5cc86 No.16952399
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f33a7c No.16952404
>>16952399
Ah. Looking into Swedish phonology, it seems that it never contrasts voicing in fricatives at all, and that all fricatives are always phonetically voiceless. Since /s/ and /z/ are the only fricatives in native words that contrast voicing, it makes since that they would cause you the most trouble.
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1cd971 No.16952699
can someone pls recommend tell me what anime is like the following (I think they're centered on gag/comedy and harem, minor ecchi but not entirely sure how they should be categorized)
I'm starved for anime I actually have interest in to learn jap and I loved these
boku wa tomodachi ga sukunai
to love-ru
eromanga-sensei
kore wa zombie desu ka
hajimete no gal
konosuba
monster musume no iru nichijou
rosario to vampire (2nd season only)
prison school (not harem nor actual ecchi but extremely good)
Boku no Kanojo ga Majime Sugiru Shojo Bitch na Ken (lol - but yes)
For all I know the above is an unspeakable load of shit that I should get crucified for, but conversely I find commonly recommended shit unbearable. In line with this, I barely understand japanese but managed to read 15 konosuba volumes and found it irredeemable shit at times (extremely unstable/uncanny balance between self-awareness and not, between gag and serious), yet I love the anime which I think turned up the gag factor to 200%. Was I just unable to read out the mood in text?
I tried using mal or some shit before to find related anime but ended up with something completely irrelevant, so I'm hoping there's someone who happens to have similar taste as me
btw kore wa zombie second season surprised even me in how well it managed the harem aspect without somehow feeling unnatural
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1cd971 No.16952700
>>16952699
actually never mind that; I'm trying some mal user recommendations again and there's probably not too many choices to pick from after all
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c34826 No.16952710
>>16952699
just watch Ranma 1/2
martial arts, comedy, harem minus harem cliches (from before the cliches were codified), characters who are complex and interesting and have lives outside the protagonist
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000000 No.16952791
This shit isn't video games, delete it gookmonkey you incompetent faggot
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fcb414 No.16953290
I have just finished the 下 part of the grammar deck. And I want to start testing the waters a little bit. Is there any fun non porn game I could try?
>>16952791
It's for the purpose of games though.
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37274f No.16954448
Is there any kanji or radical that you hate for any reason? I dislike the kata radical because I can never get it to look good when drawn.
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de1aa9 No.16958720
I have issues remembering which is which between words like 移す and 移る is there any better way than just grinding in the memory for every similar instance?
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77b2a0 No.16958762
Hey friend. I've accidentally noticed this thread here. You know, when I was learning English I read many blogs in this language. They definitely helped me to improve my skills and enrich my vocabulary. Take a look at an article about idioms and phrases in English https://preply.com/en/blog/2020/06/06/let-s-dance-10-interesting-expressions-in-english-that-relate-to-dance/ I was reading. So, maybe it's a good idea to search for interesting and simple Japanese blogs?
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4a87bb No.16959194
to memorize a large amount of new vocabulary very quickly
make a bunch of flashcards for the words that you are working on
shuffle them and deal them out in some sort of organized fashion
for each hand of flashcards, aim for a 50% recall rate, not 100%
shuffle the ones that you remembered back into the deck
retain the difficult ones in your hand
deal more cards to fill up your hand again
continue this pattern until the language is learned
i learned this from a very small language book
i think it is called "How to Learn Any Language"
i have lost the book, unfortunately
but it was written by a WWII military translator
and despite its very short length
it is the best literature available on the subject
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30de53 No.16959467
>>16959194
This is honestly pretty close to what we are doing with Anki decks.
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49212f No.16959843
This thread is dead, but I wanna try asking either way. Is there anyway where I can read up on english grammatical lingo. I can't remember what things like "Subjunctive", "Past perfect" and other stuff means.
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