No.12487
Has anyone noticed how fucked everything is. There's some serious indoctrination going in the artist community, even here people are seriously blind. The way people are taught are to draw over and over again till they get it right, lose their imagination and their ability to think freely, lose what makes people happy, the controlling class either want you to kill yourself or put you in a wheel of despair that is getting hooked off the dopamine hits off twitter, either way they want to turn you into a docile sheep.
Like of course drawing over and over again will help, but forgetting your imagination, visualization, child like wonder will drain your soul.
People here don't seem to understand why they don't draw, and it's because you don't care about anything, you can't because they've already sucked your dopamine dry with the internet, games, etc. That would otherwise fuel your imagination.
If you look at someone like kim jung gii, his addiction is drawing, but he's still a man with the mind of a child, he draws what he's wants and gets told off, rather than mindlessly obey, that's the reason he's happy and not a soy man child, that wonders why his drawing give him nothing. The reason he's able to do what he wants, is because when someone told him to stop daydreaming, he did it anyway. There's nothing unique to his mind, that's what the controlled media wants you to think. He's just a person that never conformed from his instincts.
You need to understand that you'll never improve as long as your life force is being zapped from your electronics, you can't be happy if you lose your ability to wonder. I hope someone gets black pilled anyway.
____________________________
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No.12489
If you have a way to stop getting lonely and depressed when leaving the internet then I'd like to hear it.
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No.12490
>>12489
"The Internet" or in the only way that our mind cares, dopamine addiction. Has always been our only way to sustain our existence, because a child's mind needs to learn to let it go, of course we were never taught how, and as adults, it's very difficult to learn how to do something new. So how do we learn the skill to fight our dopamine addiction as an adult?
You need to deal with low doses of dopamine, so you have do nothing, you might call it mediation, regardless, do not think while doing nothing, because thinking is fun, you have to focus on being bored. It's obviously hard to do something very boring, but you'll learn to appreciate the smaller things much more, suddenly drawing something small like drawing a house will make you feel ecstatic like a child, or imagining being a super hero will seem epic. Unfortunately who knows how long it will take, but it will be more fun the longer you do it. If you let everything go, all at once, it will work quicker. If you're feeling really bored, you're doing good.
Other option is obviously psychedelics, you need mind drugs to regulate your mind, who would have thought, just don't take them near anyone who might want to brainwash you.
Once you're off your addiction or really any time, the more you're addicted, the less you care about other things, the reason everyone likes the same thing, is because we all get high releases of dopamine while we enjoy entertainment, why everyone seems to be a apart of a fandom. Eventually you can start making other connections, if you can't make friends in reality, to stave your loneliness, start making stories, or characters, make your mind, your best friend, you will enjoy everything you are, rather than enjoying something you'll never have.
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No.12491
>>12490
That's a rather long winded way to say "no".
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No.12492
>>12491
It was an honest way of saying no, something you can work off, and make logical decisions from, rather than just do it.
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No.12569
Can you fucking prove it? Oh, I guess not. Stop thinking you are the next Freud and pulling shit out your ass and start basing your arguments off of something.
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No.12570
>>12569
Arguments go both ways, can you prove me wrong? Unlikely because you've probably never considered that your way of life could be wrong and you're already assuming you're right, so then you're not a position to take in anything I say. So what's the point me trying to prove that everything I say is right, to deaf ears?
This thread is really meant to enlighten people at the cusp of awareness, not wake someone up from his deep slumber.
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No.12573
>>12570
>Arguments go both ways, can you prove me wrong?
How do you think burden of proof works? You started making assertions, so it's on you to prove them.
>Unlikely because you've probably never considered that your way of life could be wrong and you're already assuming you're right, so then you're not a position to take in anything I say. So what's the point me trying to prove that everything I say is right, to deaf ears?
Except I have considered this many times. I still think about going offline, but ultimately there's probably no point. I could be wrong, but I can't imagine it would do anything aside from cause me great inconvenience. The web is dead and there isn't anyone in meat space who matters either. A big part of that problem is there isn't even a disconnect between the two anymore. My one point of contention is faggy, pseudo-intellectual, pretentious bullshit like
>if you can't make friends in reality, to stave your loneliness, start making stories, or characters, make your mind, your best friend, you will enjoy everything you are, rather than enjoying something you'll never have.
Proof you are a mediocre human being. I'd rather suffer with ambition than be 'happy' with no greater expectations. Where is the beauty and romanticism in your soul, loser? I hate people like that more than anything.
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No.12574
>>12487
Is this a /ic/ pasta?
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No.12575
>>12573
>How do you think burden of proof works? You started making assertions, so it's on you to prove them.
Fine, you threw out the buzzword first, what exactly do you need proof of?
>I'd rather suffer with ambition than be 'happy' with no greater expectations. Where is the beauty and romanticism in your soul, loser? I hate people like that more than anything.
There's no beauty in feeding into what your slave owners want you to do, an unyielding desire for merchandise, money, power. I pity these people and the people they create, at what point can you ever be a winner if you're always trying to gain something you've lost.
>>12574
A /loomis/ original.
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No.12576
>>12575
>There's no beauty in feeding into what your slave owners want you to do
Do you have a bank account, you nigger? Then you are a fucking slave, what now? All we want here is to get good at art, why are you talking about slavery?
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No.12577
>>12576
Not him, but I kinda am in a sexy slave/slaver relationship with my art, the kind that involves whips and ropes and other interesting accessories.
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No.12593
>>12576
Chill, stop taking your trauma out on me. I haven't said I'm not a slave, and you're taking my slavery comment out of context, as if you have to make up some way to defend against me.
Regardless, people need to understand that they're being conditioned in wasting their time drawing, when they, themselves aren't in a capable state of mind to do so. They don't want people to think imaginatively, they want to destroy your brain with gaming and a thoughtless form of drawing, that is drawing females and macho me over and over again, to further everyone's unending lust of the other sex, that they'll have to keep buying useless shit over and over again. Making passive, depressive, consumerist sheeples.
You guys aren't learning how to get good at art, that's I'm saying.
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No.12594
>>12487
I think you're overthinking everything. You're right in that the general mentality of
>Practice and getting more tactically proficient is all that matters
But I think you're going about it wrong. What matters is using your skills to better create what it is you want to.
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No.12595
>>12594
I'm not sure who you're quoting, but my thoughts is that artists draw what they're told/conditioned to draw, and they'll never be able to draw anything else.
Where as good artists draw from wonder and excitement of trivial things, that seem lame or cringe to us because our soul has been sucked, but in the end they're learning how to spin all these ideas into something interesting, and actively enjoy their creations. That eventually turn into something great.
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No.12596
>>12595
>that seem lame or cringe to us
Who is this "us" you speak of?
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No.12597
>>12596
If you don't find inflation or capeshit cringe, then that's up to you, but I'm talking about me and assumption that people here may share some similar thoughts.
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No.12599
>>12597
Is this argument a way to defend strange and unusual fetishes?
Because some of them are indeed very interesting.
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No.12600
>>12487
Universities stopped teaching and were just places to collect money from idiots. There's no master apprentice systems anymore. They cant justify failing all the useless "artists" that want to take pictures of their dildos on their heads and call it art because that would lose them too much money in the current post-secondary scam system they have going.
From here, the failures that went through these programs failed upwards to positions of powers. They further destroyed the programs to the point anyone looking to learn actual animation, painting or other artistic techniques have NO ONE to learn from except these idiots that dont even know the basics and 'draw what they want' and call it "art".
You are literally advocating this retarded practice of feel good art and everyone gets a gold star because of fee-fees. Bringing out the beauty of this world requires knowing how to fucking draw. If you dont want to build muscle memory, technique and build a mental library of textures, shapes and knowledge of anatomy and so on, then fuck off to your manga and calart tier garbage. If you are too lazy to be bothered to actually learn, it wont matter how much imagination you have because you are too lazy to even learn anything, let alone put your imagination to work. No one is stifling imagination by telling you to practice and perfect your technique. Its people like you that put shit on a wall and ask for a gold star because your feelings say its art and we just dont understand your imagination.
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No.12602
>>12599
Sexual addiction is harmful, and finding different ways to visualize the penis going in and out a hole, can only go so many ways. So no.
>>12600
Yeah capitalism ruins everything, but these hipsters don't have imagination either, they don't actually like what they're making, they just want the pat on the back, they'll never get doing anything else. But there's a fine balance between inhaling loomis, and the desire to see your creations come to life. Which clearly from the work I see here and most other place, is devoid of any alternative thoughts, and it's no coincidence it is this way.
Especially when you seem to be implying that you are only able to see the beauty of this world, and not the potential worlds that could exist. Sure you can abuse someones emotion with a perfectly drawn picture, but if there's no good ideas, they'll never bother looking again.
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No.12607
I just want to draw android lolis. I don't know what you're issue is,
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No.12608
>>12607
A simple man, of simple pleasures, when you no longer get that dopamine fix from drawing android lolis, be sure to come back here for more inspiration.
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No.12609
>>12602
>capitalism ruins everything
Garbage art is propped up by glow in the dark cia government ops-funded galleries when its only merit is to serve as a tax dodge for the extremely wealthy.
Art schools rely on government loan guarantees and grants as a stepladder in order to arbitrarily boost both their tuition fees and their prestige. If you took all that nonsense away you'd see a great resurgence of practical commercial art instruction very quickly and/or you'd at the very least see a return to sanity when it comes to tuition. A lot of schools would downsize which would be a very good thing all things considered.
By the way is this you?
(https://boards.fireden.net/ic/thread/3095484)
>regards, OP of that thread and creator of half of the anti-art school boilerplate on both this board and /ic/
Reunited at last (sorry I was kind of a jerk heh)
The fact I still see the anecdote from the Animator's Survival Kit and the Artist's Report Back pictures being circulated across a multitude of tangentially related boards to this day makes me happy.
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No.12614
>>12609
I'm not that person, I stopped posting on 4chad 7 years ago when it became just another media brainwashing hub.
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No.12615
>>12487
If you wanna spin conspiracies somewhere, /pol/ seems more your speed. We're just here to draw, bud.
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No.12627
>>12615
/pol/ shouldn't have a monopoly on thinking, understanding is how we can improve ourselves in all ways of life, including that of drawing, and personally I came here to create, drawing is just the tool to do so.
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No.12628
>>12627
Then drawer somefin' instead of flappin' your're gum's figgit.
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No.12638
>>12628
>>12627
A picture is worth about a thousand words after all.
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No.12990
>>12593
what is "Getting good at art" then, dickweed
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No.12991
Kim Jung Gii did exactly what you criticized. He drew over and over again, even now he draws all the time even during interviews. Tha's why he can do what he does. He does not need construction lines because he has drawn everything a million times, he does not need a reference because as as soon as he sees something interesting he draws it a million times.
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No.12993
>>12991
The key point I'm trying to get through, is that constantly drawing by it's self is not going to give you success like him. He heavily uses a memory palace/visualization and an active imagination fueled by the ability to care about it. Without that, you'll hit a barrier of creativity or skill.
>>12990
Being able to make a picture that expresses everything you want it to.
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No.12994
>>12993
He doesn't use a memory palace/visualisation. He just has drawn things so many times and so often that whatever thought comes through his head he can automaticity put it to paper as whatever he would need to draw to do that he would have drawn preciously numerous times.
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No.12995
>>12994
He said he could see perspective since he was 7, he said he draws in his head, when he doesn't have a pen, he visualizes his picture before he draws them. Everything points to you being wrong for me. There's people who can only draw one thing, then there's people who grow their visualization through drawing.
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No.12997
>>12995
Perspective has nothing to do with it.
>he said he draws in his head, when he doesn't have a pen, he visualizes his picture before he draws them.
Yes, because he has drawn it all so many times before. That is what I am saying, there is no wall of any kind between what he thinks and what he draws, because he has done it so many times it is like breathing.
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No.12999
>>12997
So clearly you must agree that by drawing over and over again, reinforcing it all into his memory palace, he has become one with drawing. Unless you're trying to say he draws with his muscle memory?
You know drawing over and over again isn't special, no matter how good you are at something, someones better, someones drawn more. We should be arguing about what that difference is. This guy fought against teachers and parents conditioning his imagination away, and used it to his advantage, that's what I think. If drawing is all that matters, where are all these other kim jung gi's.
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No.13000
>>12999
>So clearly you must agree that by drawing over and over again, reinforcing it all into his memory palace, he has become one with drawing. Unless you're trying to say he draws with his muscle memory?
Yes but without the memory palace meme.
>You know drawing over and over again isn't special, no matter how good you are at something, someones better, someones drawn more.
Yes, Kim. Nobody draws more than him.
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No.13001
>>13000
>Yes, Kim. Nobody draws more than him.
Now you just sound like a fan girl. Well you've made your personality clear to me, I hope you can defrag all the brainwashing from your brain someday.
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No.13002
>>13001
I've been drawing a picture or so a day since late December… Even by your definition I don't think that is being brain washed.
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No.13705
>>12487
Op, I guess I'm the minority in regards to what you consider an unimaginative, I still dream up things in my head every day really, granted I haven't been drawing for long, and really I don't care for drawing the more boring style of art, and instead want to draw more fun interesting things, sure I learn the "Realistic" side of it, but I never plan to fully invest in it, I prefer the weird abstract ideas we can make, all I ever wanted was to just have my worlds in art, and even if their not good, it's what they mean to me and not someone else.
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No.14136
>>12487
I like looking at my older art when I had less skill and embracing the "schizophrenic" tendencies of media culture. Channeling the infantile or abnormal are ways in which we displace ourselves into new forming new venues for creativity. You can see why at the turn of Picasso's career, for example, he began looking to children's and African art. While this is neither a solution nor always helpful, it's inspiration practise.
While the problem you pose is pervasive today, some of its root causes stem from Western Antiquity. At least some of the attitudes towards art as your diatribe is geared towards aesthetic philosophy. It may be flawed, but art makes for better philosophy than word.
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No.14137
…. cannabis is the solution
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No.14161
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No.14167
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No.14168
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No.14172
>>12487
I have noticed that some people are quick to belittle beginners and to give them "advice" that's either generic or written in a discouraging tone.
Take solace in knowing that people seeking to belittle others are often trying to make themselves feel better about something. At the same time, always consider what they're saying and try to evaluate your work as objectively as possible.
Practice will bring improvement, but not if practice makes you startlingly miserable. Work hard, but towards something you'll be happy you did. You could become the world's best portrait artist and hate yourself because you really wanted to be the world's best cartoonist. Focus your forces on what you actually want, not on what you think you should want.
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No.14175
>>14172
If practice feels that abhorrent you should start considering whether you really want to become a better artist or not.
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No.14176
>>14175
Nah. I know what anon's talking about. Studies and "practice" kill any desire I have to draw. I get better at drawing by drawing what I want and improving a little bit every time.
>you need to spend two hours a day drawing bodies from reference.
I'd rather eat a bullet.
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No.14177
>>14176
Really? I like drawing figures from reference and the occasional perspective practice.
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No.14184
>>14172
I don't know what I want, either in life or in art.
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No.14186
>>12490
>>12490
This is the best explanation of why to meditate and why without all of this mumbo jumbo self help crap. Mindfulness is okay, but your comment is much more down to watch and to the point.
Best thing I've read on internet in a while
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