/liberty/ - Liberty

I like to think the term "capitalism" is more of a specification/ideology (since it was originally used in contrast to "socialism"), whereas "the free market" refers to the actual implementation.

>Capitalism is a nice idea

vs.

>Let the free market decide

Capitalism is philosophically defined as free market economics. In the strict sense, it refers to the private (non state) ownership of capital goods (the means of production, ex: factories).

The prevailing cultural understanding of capitalism from the Jew media is the communist strawman: capitalism means greedy wealthy people exploit poor people. They also look at our cronyist current system and conflate this with capitalism.

So in our use, the two terms should be interchangeable. You could theoretically have a primitive society with a free market but no capital goods, like cottage industries, but specialization of labor inevitably wins out because it's more productive.

>>103630

In the vernacular, nothing. When people say they are for capitalism they generally mean they are for the free market. This is the definition most dictionaries hold.

Outside the vernacular, some people, mostly leftists, use the term to describe an ideology centered around capital. This is effectively a strawman argument, an attempt to imply that the free market is to the benefit of capital, and to the detriment of laborers. Ironically, the closest thing to true "capitalists" in this sense are extremely wealthy leftists who use the state to line their own pockets on the dime of taxpayers.

>>103645

why do leftist distinguish between capitalism and free market if they think "free market is to the benefit of capital"?

>>103647

It's all pilpul. Words have power when used effectively. "Free Market" sounds neutral and relatively benign, especially since most of us associate positive things with the word free. "Capitalism" sounds like it's about capital, and the people who own capital. It's a more divisionary and confrontational word, which if you're a lefty is to your advantage because muh worker/bourgeoisie dialectic. Just like how the left insists on calling illegal aliens undocumented immigrants or asylum seekers. It seems subtle on its surface, but this kind of language control aids in molding public opinion.

>>103630

As we understand it, there is no difference. We're aware that "capitalism" has a bit of a problematic etymology and definition, but it's the most convenient term for what we are, as "free marketism" sounds retarded.

Also, listen to Confederate Fag, he knows his stuff.

>>103662

but there are leftists who are pro-free-market right?

>>103749

A couple, ostensibly. But all of them that I've seen either want a market that is slightly less than free (e.g., market anarchists who define certain voluntary interactions as coercive), or are ignorant as to the market's implications (e.g., libertines under the impression their actions won't have consequences). The free market is, if you understand its implications, fundamentally a right wing ideal.

>>103671

what is the difference according to lefties?

>>103846

Capitalism big bad, grrrr

>>103846

For mainstream lefties, it's not a difference in definition but in usage. "Capitalism" invokes images of capitalists, the greedy moneygrubbers who get fat at the expense of the poor, oppressed working class. For less mainstream lefties, there are certain groups who see a distinction, such as the market anarchists and mutualists. Such types will usually say that interest rates and capital accumulation are "capitalist" and wrong, but other sorts of exchange are fine because they aren't exploitive. This is also the where the you start seeing arbitrary distinctions between "private property" and "personal property," with the former being capitalist and the latter not.