/k/ - Weapons

>>687334

>you mean hunting human beings which are soft easy prey.

>Millions niggers goes banana for human meats.

That's a very grim future for the poor americans. I hope they stock their fertilizers and seeds up somewhere extremely remote and cold.

>>687336

>Do the math, that's still 23 people per deer, for four months

Still freaking out. I ran the number on the 'census' in California and proved to my husband that they were lying about the data and that the population was twice as high as they said because they don't count any of the immigrants. Then while visiting AZ I noticed in a nice semi upscale open air mall that I was the only person in stores who spoke English. Everyone else was some piggin English and hand signs to communicate because there were so many different nationalities present and no one could understand anyone elses butchered accents. These were fresh off the boat peoples from literally ALL OVER THE PLANET. I would have been surprised if there was two peoples from the same nation in that store.

So cut your scenario WAYYYYY down in terms of the time frame if you want to know the truth about the way things 'go down'.

>>687337

I fear you will have the same problem with bug people, anon.

>>687336

What's your first language? You've had quite a few of these fuckups across a few threads, that lead to hilarious misconceptions. "mouths" does not equal "months", much less whatever random assumptions you jumped to with your math. If you're saying SHTF, it's pretty safe to assume refridgeration is off the table, so you're gonna have to make essentially a tribe for hunting and gathering. A deer could feed an entire group for the day, or a preserved deer could probably feed one person for a month. You'll still need to supplement with grains and veggies, lest you get malnurished, so only applying meat to your dietary math is flawed.

>>687336

>vegetarian, it would require the cutting down of all forests and destruction of all ecosystems, because a mixed diet has a lower footprint.

What about vertical farms though? It don't take up too much lands. Cities will probably be empty after many people died out so it's a ideal place to turn the empty cities into mega vertical farms.

>>687341

Vertical farms don't work without power, strelok. You need to pump water up to the top of the stack, to have it filter down back into the pond to aerate the water for the fish. If you go hydroponic instead of aquaponic, then compound the need for working civilization further.

>>687339

Nah, we will be fine because there is plenty of animal meats to eat but I want to be a vegetarian one day. Australia have plenty of lands to fertilize the soils and create permacultural co-op farms. There is 25 or more million people so it is much fewer than your country.

>>687342

There is a steam engine on some property that I am looking to by and the mennonites set everything up for gravity water power already. It just needs some TLC also there are more technical ways to transport water uphill without power. It involves waste but it is still workable.

>>687344

I thought you guys were having a massive drought and the livestock were having to be mass slaughtered due to the lack of fodder and them starving.

>>687346

A sterling or steam engine is one viable fix, but automation is critical for those setups. I've looked into making my own tiered greenhouse for a while now, but ultimately decided against it, as any hiccups like a power outage will kill all your fish in less than an hour in a typical setup, and without proper equipment, you can't monitor and adjust the ph levels which would quickly kill crops. The system has never taken off, because it's too expensive of a system to set up, regulate, and monitor. You can get a lot done in a very small area, but 5 acres will grow far more food, with much less overhead and supervision. I would recommend looking into underground greenhouses if you really want to get into cheap and effective year round growing. Not to say such a setup as what you're describing as a bad one, it's just super rare to get water rights, to have a watermill generating power, or even a water ram. I'd say though if the price is right, go on it.

https://archive.is/rHd4L

Australia's livestock feed supplies in precarious position due to drought

It is probably crap. :(

I can never tell what is fake news and real news anymore. However, China is also having a bad year with Fireworms, environmental damage, pork livestock failure and have cut their exports of grain off (no more rice for the African negro who was completely dependant on China; they will have to feed their billions elsewhere). You will get a lot of pressure from China when things get rough; you saw them sail their battleship right into your harbor. like they owned the place and all the bug people met them cheering.

Here in the USA the breadbasket of the nation hast something like a 80% failure in crops this year due to flooding.

You can print money but you can't print food.

>>687348

Yeah I know, only the drug dealers can afford the nice greenhouses and equipment where I live. I grow outside for now but I am probably going to renovate a building myself so that I can grow partially indoors and things like mushrooms and fish need no sunlight so that is a positive. Man I would KILL for access to a good cave system.

I am trying to drag the husband kicking and screaming (not really, he is just overwhelmed by the idea of dealing with all that archaic equipment) into the situation. I don't think

>>687353

>vertical farming

CRINGE!

>terrace farming

BASED!

>>687353

>so in what way is my original claim that wild animals aren't enough to feed people…

I was clarifying that your numbers are so off the hip that 10 to 50 thousand deer per state was off by 780000 to 750000 in just ONE state, you're probably way off in the rest of your bullshit math. For example how indians killed all the antelope (pronghorn), killed all the buffalo (bison), killed all the horses (no, that was white folk, and it was strategic to stop the indians migration patterns with the buffalo) and then white man killed all the buffalo yet again. You have no clue what you're talking about, and all your math is made up numbers.

My original point was you're not be believed on any level, with my next point being it's not even worth the time having a discussion with you, because you can't even understand english.

There is also some pretty cool aquatic power systems that use water upstream to downstream pressure to power homes.

>>687358

It's honestly bizarre to hear someone else saying the same shit I've been telling everyone for years. No one takes production into account for alternative energy. I know what I do, because I've been planning my homestead out for over a decade, and I looked into many different options for many different price points. Solar is the least efficient form of energy you can get. whether it's the battery bank and cells failing, the panels degrading and needing replaced, the panels being damaged from hail storms, to the convertor needed to ramp the system from 12v to 110.

I have a book I converted to epub about underground greenhouses that's much better than vid related, but this is a good example of the basics. This guy spent way too much money on this setup. If you can keep it without a grounded structure, most counties can't tax you for a roof, laying over a hole. Just food for thought if you're really interested.

>>687347

Yes we are still suffering from the droughts but not everywhere is affected.

>>687351

Maybe you can do the herbs? Herb pots is a easy thing to do.

>>687360

I love Walipinis (autism moment)! I have so much info on them and even more ideas about new systems of airflow to prevent molds and fungus (all untested thus far).

Now check this out because you mentioned hail. People are having severe problems with hail ruining their greenhouse poly or glass (recycled windows etc) but there is a hail netting that you can install above the Walipini (or greenhouse) that is designed to grow under and will protect you from any breakage due to inclement weather as well. I haven't wanted to build my greenhouse until I was able to solve the poly damage issue because the expense to replace it was too high (I have seen whole greenhouses done in completely by the last couple years insane hail). Here is web site (there are others as well; most in partnerships with ag schools) on hail netting that will protect your investment.

http://www.smart-net-systems.com/agricultural-nets/crop-hail-protection

Also, have you seen Citrus in the Snow website with passive thermal air systems? You can use that for heating and cooling your house as well if you install a heat pump. I can tell that you are going to get a kick out of this guy! I think he is a frigging genius that is going to be a household name in the future. I love passive thermal which uses all the principles of the Walipini as well.

It is really nice to find another ag/prepper online. :) Fun. I hope this thread continues. I have so much information to share; years and years of stored alternative energy resources just tucked back in my head. I hope you get a kick out of Russ Finch…this increases the viability and northerly survival index for our people if we need to migrate to an environment that takes brains and strategic planning to get away from the zombie hordes of invaders appear on our doorsteps looking for "Brains" …

I am going to watch the video now! Thanks…you can never have enough new ways of seeing people experiment before you are ready to build. You are so lucky that you are building the sort of 'final phase' I am on my third permaculture food forest and I keep getting better at it, but it is a learning curve since things never work out quite like we plan.

>>687365

>herbs

Yeah…I just registered my own website that is probably going to deal with exotic spices and herbs grown in the greenhouses as well as wine and hard liquor (I am still learning to make these; my wine keeps on turning out with such high proof that it is basically a hard liquor; going to have to research that one; puzzling) and tobacco (I just planted 50 of these today for the first time ever; exciting) and perfumes (so putting that hard liquor distillery to good use as well doing double duty). Since it is slightly related I would still like to learn how to make basic pharmaceuticals/chemistry like insulin and other things that would be beneficial for our people in an emergency. I guess I could be an 'herbalist'.

So the drought is not as bad as they are saying? That is very good news. I swear that the 'weather channel' is worse than the tabloids at this point. We had some insane fodder prices here last winter/this winter due to flooding, something like $80 dollars for a square bale of fodder (no one can make money on that; it would push the price of meat through the roof; like several hundred dollars for one steak or something; I haven't done the math yet). Cattle are an atrocious ROI compared to fish which due to weightlessness is a much better ROI in terms of feed/meat production.

I liked the guy who posted the Guinea Pig video earlier in this thread as well. Those seem low maintenance and high meat to feed ratio as well and it would beat eating rat; if you had to eat meat.

>>687367

>heating

I'm going with embed related. I picked up a 10' dish for free off CL, and plan on putting mylar all on the inside of the dish to reflect it up to a copper tub with an inlet and outlet that feed into the wall of water tanks in the walipini to keep temps hot enough during the winter nights here. If the system turns out to be too efficient, and the dish is off more than it's on, I'll consider running a line into the house for radiant flooring. There's libraries already set up for solar trackers, you just have to follow the build instructions and download the software and you're good to go.

>>687368

didn't finish my thoughts, but instead of guinea pig, consider rabbits inside the cool section of the walipini. The book I mentioned goes into details on why they're a great combination within an underground greenhouse setup, and if you go with angora rabbits, you get the additional benefit of having good wool producers.

>>687368

That is excellent thinking anon. Top notch! I learned about parabolic mirroring from Frank Gehry's buildings where he literally vaporized birds (exploded them) in mid flight due to unintentional parabolic mirroring. So that is going to be an immensely powerful resource for you. I used to have a salad bowl I got from Smart and Final that was a perfect 2' parabolic mirror and you could set things on fire if they were the correct distance from the parabola. I used it for cooking since it outperformed any solar oven on the market by several hundred degrees. I never thought of using it to heat the water.

Great idea.

I have a 'thing' about rabbits (though it is a good idea). I grew up on a mini farm and we had five hundred rabbits. I think my rabbit raising time might be over. lol…no goats either. Sheep are much better, more amiable and well behaved. The last rabbit I had I kept under my ash tree to keep it healthy and alive so I know that they are one of the best fertilizer potentials out there…just eww rabbits again…you know?

>>687331

>There's over 800000 deer in New York alone, and there's enough meat for quite a few mouths.

That's assuming people will know how to properly store and preserve it.

>>687427

Your comment reminds me of that movie Into the Wild where he kills the moose and almost the whole thing spoils right in front of his face because he has no idea what he is doing.

I thought this guy was pretty interesting, he says at the end that he can do the whole thing in 5 minutes when he is not filming.

Also that might help them the first year but it would only prolong the cannibalism, lawlessness, disorder and murder.

>>687427

If you check the reply chain, you'll notice I already mentioned that I'm assuming preservation is off the table, but honestly it's not that hard to smoke meat, and not particularly easy to fuck up in a way that you wouldn't realize your mistakes and correct them.

>>687427

>That's assuming people will know how to properly store and preserve it.

Even assuming that, 800k deer can't feed 19m people for any significant length of time. Even assuming one dead deer per year, how many bulls and does do you need to survive each year to provide enough fuckenings for the next generation? Sustainable is not 23 people per deer, it's 5-10 deer per person.

That dude >>687331 complained about me being a few percent off but he was 200 plus times off the mark.

Zombie apocalypse won't happen because of some weird virus. It will happen because there's no other source of food, and the zombies will be well armed, as smart as you, and working as a team to hunt you down and cut pieces off you for food. Every time food got scarce humans have turned on each other and created a weird religion about it, it's not an exception it's a rule. Most people will choose not to die.

>>687367

You have too much fermentable sugar in your wine. And if it stopped where you wanted it to it would probably be horrendously sweet. The range from 8-14% abv is standard though I don't think most are at 14%. It's been a while since I looked at those numbers but I recall picking up a bottle every once in a while and seeing that it was high. I tried to make some sparkling mead at close to 14%, messed up on the math by just a little (yeast efficiency and so on) and ended up with 15% still mead. Can't carbonate it the natural way with that.

In any case the yeast is suffocating in it's own excrement instead of starving like you want.

Many people are tards so they will eat any wild animals instead of their animal farms. After few months they will start to starve to death so their choice is to rob the food resources from self sufficient people or eat the human meats to survive. It is a survival instinct so that is something we can't ignore because niggers are on welfare and can't into taking care of themselves. There is many videoes on niggers looting when government help become inaccessible to them. The nightmare will be even more hellish for the Americans when USA collapse.

>>655344

Rice, sago, Sago can go fucking old and be 20 years old and you can still eat it. IDK what they call it by you, we call it froggy eggs but it's like a type of pudding.

>>687560

Based on your local name, I'd guess tapioca pudding. Since tapioca is basically just a ball of starch, I'd believe it you when you say it lasts a long time.

>>687533

The leaf is a meme and should be ignored. The biggest issue with a SHTF situation is almost purely contained to big cities/surrounding sprawl. Once you go rural, everyone stops being retarded and understands how to take care of themselves and their families. Water would be an issue, but all of my neighbors have generators that'd last us until the fuel runs out. I've considered getting a flo-jack a couple times, but am not planning on getting one for a couple years still. I think the biggest thing in a SHTF situation would be for my state's militias to block the highways coming in, and mining the surrounding area to keep the fucking californians/texans/etc out. If you can keep out of staters from getting in, I just about guarantee we wouldn't have any issues with riots or people killing people for their food. We'd probably go back to trading goods and services, and I have a decent enough of a setup to have meat everyday (eggs, you stupid fucking leaf. chickens alone could keep 80% of americans fed for years), I have the ability to can my own veggies and grow my own food. Positive my neighborhood would be completely self sufficient, with a neighborhood watch keeping any unwanted people out. It's good not to live near useless people who are too lazy and retarded to feed themselves.

>>687579

>Once you go rural, everyone stops being retarded and understands how to take care of themselves and their families.

Niggers will never stop being tard. They don't care about your live nor everything. All they think during shtf happening is to live, eat and fuck just like in Africa. You need a crazily big amount of ammos to keep them at bay for long time until they are gone. Feeding the niggers endanger everyone lives so whip them if they do that.

>>687592

>that no more brudda wars tier image

peak delusion, when yuros arent hating burgers theyre constantly shit talking each other and hoping everyone else dies

before world war 2 there were near constant wars being fought in europe for more than a millennium

when shit eventually pops off over there every single one of those flags will be covered in blood

>>687579

Yes m8, that's the one. I cooked some that was 10 years past expiry date, not out of choice but out of laziness. After my loved one passed away I decided to go through the cupboard and I was fuckoff hungry. Internet said it was doable but I had my reservations. Turns out you can do, it just takes long to cook, but regardless, I read somewhere that somebody had eaten it 60 years after the fact and it was still good.

I can not believe that for cheap food, food storage and survival no one mentioned the OG or actually OS Survivalist Kurt Saxon who wrote the Anarchist Cookbook. He also had a survival newsletter that he eventually put into books. Here's free copies of his first four here.(Boy are you guys lucky you know me).

https://archive.org/details/KurtSaxonSurvivorVol.2/mode/2up

The first one has a lot of good eat cheap and storage for bulk foods. This is stuff that people learned during the depression. How to bake bread with stored grains, how to sprout wheat to make nutritious meals with lots of vitamins.

Here's a web site someone put up that has some of his articles(thanks someone). Look very carefully at the survival food link. His articles on thermos cooking are brilliant and could save you a fortune or your life in an emergency. Thermos cooking uses boiling water, food placed in a thermos and slow cooking to use every bit of energy to cook.

https://www.survivalplus.com/

Combine thermos cooking with the site "21 DIY Rocket Stove Plans to Cook Efficiently with Wood" and you can boil water the most efficient way as quick as possible and then put in the thermos to make water safe or to cook. Most of these are made from really cheap and mostly thrown away cans. You can even use concrete blocks. With a rocket stove if there is a serious melt down you can boil water very fast when it's safe and do your cooking when the time is most appropriate for you and safest. You won't have to have fires all day to watch and masses of fuel to burn

https://morningchores.com/rocket-stove-plans/

It has always been my understanding that pemmican, rendered fat and dried powdered beef, will last for decades. Wrapped in animal hides anyways. I'm assuming that they would do the same in jars or other containers. Does anyone have absolute facts about this? The wiki link " At room temperature, pemmican can generally last from one to five years, but there are anecdotal stories of pemmican stored in cool cellars being safely consumed after a decade or more."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pemmican

Link for Pemmican ration nutritional value

https://academic.oup.com/nutritionreviews/article/3/10/314/1908394

Another forever food is hardtack. Flour, and salt baked biscuits. These have been known to last forever. There's a picture of one intact from 1862.

>>655344

>is there something far more versatile and worthwhile for SHTF

Trail mix. I just bought 30 or so lbs of it. It has nuts (fat) dried fruit (fiber / sugar) and chocolate (sugar) it's extremely energy dense. Doesn't require heat. Simple to pack and carry. I also purchased almond butter. Extremely energy dense and much better for your heart than peanut butter.

>>689232

>no one mentioned the OG or actually OS Survivalist Kurt Saxon who wrote the Anarchist Cookbook

He must've been a fed then, because that retarded book only existed to bait people and throw them in jail for 20 years

>>689288

"…that retarded book only existed to bait people and throw them in jail for 20 years…"

Please explain the mechanism for that. Was the book bugged? Maybe it was psychic and screamed out what was read in it??? Please explain.

>>689307

The author of the AC was an angsty teen (iirc 19y/o) who plagiarized a bunch of military manuals even though he had no idea what he was writing about, because he wanted to be an edgelord and give weapons information to the people on par with the government.

Turns out the revolution he was trying to support or whatever never happened, and the only people who used it were rednecks and school shooters, which he hated because he became a teacher to help troubled youth. The ironic part was in his last years of life, he wanted amazon to stop selling his book, but the publisher bought the rights for a few grand, and 20 something year old him did not forsee that.

He ended up dying regretting writing the book, and the publisher told him to STFU when he wanted them to stop publishing it. There are also plagiarized versions that are even more bastardized than the original. All of them are disregarded within the professional weapons and ordnance community.

>>689380

>who wrote the Anarchist Cookbook

You're right. I goofed. I originally said Kurt Saxon wrote the AC but it was "The Poor Man's James Bond" that he wrote and also the "Survivor" series of books.

>>655372

If you don't have subterranean temperatures low enough, then cooling your food is a potential area of interest.

Since keeping your food cool then involves as little invasion of heat as possible, then that presents you with another challenge: insulation.

Thus, finding the most element-resistant and cost-effective and thermally resistant method of insulation becomes important. Just throwing thick layers of foam around something is the most no-brainer method.

Cooling it to a desired temperature range and keeping it there will very in cost depending on how efficient it is and how well-insulated your storage is.

None of this is that difficult. You just have to balance your cost of rotating your rations at a much lower rate due to just-above-freezing temperature of storage, or rotating them more quickly if their storage temps are higher.

>>655344

hard tack. stores indefinetly with moisture absorbers.

Canned fat like lard or butter. can it yourself its cheaper

dried peanut butter with O2 absorbers

vitamins

>>689764

Oxalate.

>>687335

> there is probably 600 million people

You only think everyone's an immigrant because you are.