b18115 No.16884365
Let's talk about games that criticize or shit on societies from which they hail.
>Spec Ops: The Line
Criticizes the way that Americans think of war, thinking of their actions as clear-cut heroics in incredibly gray conflicts, as well as criticizing USA's interventionism.
>Persona 5
Criticizes the idea of Japanese "Saving Face", shitting all over the idea of having to put up pretenses, of singular mistakes tarnishing your entire life, and the Japanese approach towards shaming others and personal reputation as well as the idea of giving respect towards the authorities, prevalent in Japanese culture.
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a4a9d8 No.16884375
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0dbf34 No.16884470
Really? Persona 5 must be pretty interesting, then. They could also shit a bit on their extreme collectivism and workaholism
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b18115 No.16884482
>>16884470
I've only started the game, but there is definitely a criticism of collectivism in there, the themes are very visible. Not so sure about workaholism.
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af6efe No.16889304
>>16884365
>Criticizes the way that Americans think of war, thinking of their actions as clear-cut heroics in incredibly gray conflicts
This was very much the idea of Metro 2033 from two years beforehand as well, although the sequels toss it out the window.
Although, come to think of it, Metro 2033 might not be the best fit for the actual thread topic since what it was doing was criticising the design and storytelling of military-themed media more than it was criticising society per se.
Anyway, here's this big analysis from a few years back that goes in-depth on what I'm talking about: https://spacebiff.com/2012/09/06/metro-2033-the-index/
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a6eeb3 No.16889404
>>16884365
>as well as criticizing USA's interventionism
Wasn't the game about U.S. soldiers deserting the military and trying to actually SAVE the populace of Dubai, meanwhile Walker is suffering from a mental breakdown in some half-assed attempt to make a "modern day" adaptation of Heart of Darkness (With the book actually being a criticism of the British empire's exploits in Africa)?
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2c3aea No.16889415
Its clear with P5 that they focused far more on the social commentary and far less on the characters, given half the cast is recycled from P4.
>>16884482
Wait till they start citing statistics about the Japanese criminal justice system.
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60369c No.16889508
>>16889404
The book is more than just a criticism of British Empire's exploits, it's mostly psychological in its themes, not so much political (although it has political themes too). The plot is true, but at the same time the whole situation very much mirrors the way that USA is criticized for doing war.
>Walker's approach mirrors the typical "American Hero" approach.
>The CIA being involved to fuck things up in what is a rough but generally a pretty stable region
>The U.S soldiers who were sent on a mission stayed there creating their own rules to keep order in a destroyed city, with Walker basically acting as the invader getting into an alien (from the outlook of the story by then) environment and sticking his hands where they don't fucking belong, trying to solve the 33rd's and CIA's problems for them.
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168cc5 No.16889511
>>16889404
Actually, according to the dipshit that wrote the game, in a kotaku interview, it's about people playing violent videogames without giving them a second thought or feeling anything about them.
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4ea177 No.16889519
>>16889415
> given half the cast is recycled from P4.
They're less annoying than the rimjobbing faggots from P4. Not to say that they are all that great, though.
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60369c No.16889520
>>16889511
Again, this is true, and it's the shittiest part of the game, but it is not the only thing that the game is saying.
The best message comes from aping Heart of Darkness' message of "Humans can do evil without realizing it". The meta shit of "muh violent videogames" is best just ignored to focus on the other themes.
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b47cae No.16889526
>>16889511
Yeah man if I play Doom long enough I'll start moving at super sonic speed and punch concrete with nothing but brass knuckles and a black first aid kit. And if I play Eternal I'll gain the ability to dash, a space watchtower and every weapon I get my hands on will have jack shit for ammo.
This is always such a fucking retarded viewpoint. People enjoy violent video games because they make the violence fun and purely for entertainment. Make a fun puzzle game like Talos or Speebot and people will play that. Replace shooting bad guys with fucking bad girls and people will play that as long as it's fun.
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60369c No.16889530
>>16889526
That's why I believe that Spec Ops misses what should be the criticism of modern shooters.
It's not that modern shooters are americanized trash-tier propagandist depictions of violence that's the problem. The problem is that tha this americanized trash-tier propagandist depiction of violence is not fun to go through.
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168cc5 No.16889542
>>16889520
Yeah, but the game is terrible at that too. You show up in Dubai, encounter a group of random armed civvies on the outskirts who instantly get mad at you and attack you, you hear about some American soldiers under attack, you find a dying guy who sends you to his friends, who also instantly attack you. They set up the CIAniggers as the "bad guys" in that situation, but they're literally the only people in the entire game that don't shoot at you on sight. If the game gave you an actual choice, however small to actually fuck off and not do the bad thing, or if they even tried at all to hide the fact that there abso-fucking-lutely were other options in nearly every "there's no other choice Lugo DDDD-:" situation in the game, I'd excuse it. Instead you get railroaded into doing something bad, then the game goes "Ameriga bad, you bad, videogames bad".
It's telling how shitty the game is if it makes the message of "America World Police is bad" seem retarded and annoying.
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60369c No.16889561
>>16889542
Agreed, I hate the fact that the game plot's basically works on everyone misscommunicating, because the whole situation happened because Radioman was a dick to Walker for no fucking reason than "You're not a part of this."
He won't even tell his men "Hey, don't shoot this guy, he isn't from here, he is trying to seek for survivors, explain the situation to him", instead for no other reason than to act evil, he stops communicating with Walker and sings along to classical music while making his men fucking SHOOT THE GUY FROM A HELI like a fucking anime villain.
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a6eeb3 No.16889569
>>16889542
>It's telling how shitty the game is if it makes the message of "America World Police is bad" seem retarded and annoying.
I'd say the more retarded part is that they think this message can be conveyed in a shooter. Why not make some L.A. Noire/Way of the Samurai teir game that deals with an American official being a part of the police and having to enforce law in order in one of the dozens of backwater countries the U.S. has occupied over the years and tried to turn into a democracy, like all the fun times that were had in Asia, South America, the Middle East, and post-war Europe.
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168cc5 No.16889574
>>16889569
>I'd say the more retarded part is that they think this message can be conveyed in a shooter.
Because that's not the message they were trying to convey primarily. The writer was just a self-hating burger, so that's the first thing that came to mind. He probably wasn't even thinking of the message beyond "violent videogames bad".
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18223f No.16889579
>>16889511
>Actually, according to the dipshit that wrote the game, in a kotaku interview, it's about people playing violent videogames without giving them a second thought or feeling anything about them.
That's so disappointingly shallow compared to anon's interpretation. Plus Drakengard already did that ages ago but 10x better so it's not even novel or improving upon any existing idea.
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3649b3 No.16889584
>>16884365
Spec Ops in overrated
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12d2a5 No.16889592
>>16884365
>Spec Ops: The Line
>DUDE, VIDYA VIOLENCE BAD, JUST TURN YOUR GAME OFF LOL
It's as smart as a random script of The Big Bang Theory.
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2c1893 No.16889593
>>16889584
>>16889592
>Niggers who didn't read the thread.
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b15ef7 No.16889692
>MGS2: DUDs of Liberty
While he points out that society is a battle of information and proliferation of memes, Kojima is still wrong about the subjectivity of truth.
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4ec4bd No.16889708
>>16884375
If that game actually gives criticism on SOCIETY, give more info, homo.
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c278a6 No.16889713
>>16889569
>A game similar to SWAT 4 where you have to be a Marine in post-911 Iraq/Afghanistan, trying not to get blown up by roadside IEDs and sweep random houses, making decisions on your targets within a second or less
That would be fucking amazing, but it won't get made for another 10 years at least because boomers and their wives' veteran sons would write them angry emails about "belittling their service to the nation."
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d26e56 No.16889727
>>16889692
Wasn't Snake afraid his cigarette would go out?
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7fcf11 No.16889738
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ac8b8b No.16889762
>>16889692
Can you explain the difference between a truthful statement and a factual statement?
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693055 No.16889770
Killer7 is an odd case, though I don't know if it's criticism or just pointing out the insanity of modern society.
>years before the game starts, in order to stop terrorism, they destroy all missiles, make flying illegal and disable the Internet, along with connecting the world through highways
>bad guys are literally demonic terrorists that explode
>unless they change form, they look human
>the story is based around a hitman working for the US government trying to uncover his past, while also killing enemies of the country
>the biggest threat is Japan no longer wanting to be under the boots of the US and wants to become the dominant power of the world
>turns out the main character is on his second reincarnation, being born in Japan the day the first bomb dropped, and died the day the second one dropped
>first reincarnation had him training to be an assassin since birth, going to a high school that was used by the Japanese government to indoctrinate children to vote for pro-Japanese candidates and policies
>his final decision is to determine whether the bad guy he's been hunting, a Japanese politician who is ready to attack the US, should live or die
if he lives, he destroys the US and Japan once again becomes a dominant power
>if he's killed, Japan is wiped off the face of the Earth
>the game ends hundreds of years later in China, where nothing changed
Part of me think it's symbolic of whether it's worth appealing and/or doing what the West wants if it means destroying part of your identity. Part of me think it's saying that China wins in the end. Part of me thinks I'm looking 2deep into it.
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d26e56 No.16889775
>>16889770
After seeing China's terrible MREs I don't think they can really win a war.
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c0884f No.16889789
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003dc1 No.16889812
>>16889708
It's a meme, you dip.
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2a7eec No.16889817
>>16884375
FUCKING GAYMERGAYS
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2a0773 No.16889825
>>16884365
>games that criticize or shit on societies from which they hail
Specs Ops was developed by Germans you massive retard
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3cf362 No.16889827
>>16889770
Killer7 is more critical of one culture overtaking another (American/Western over Japanese/Eastern) than of the proto-fascist-mafiosi Japanese cabinet. In fact for 99% of the game the fact you're hunting Nip Mein Kampf pieces is irrelevant compared to getting US influence to overtake any remnant Japanese influence in the world.
Even your final decision is meaningless, whether Battleship Island is destroyed (and presumably the Lollipop Chainsaw universe comes true) or Japan cripples the US (and presumably the No More Heroes universe comes true), both point out how you just wasted your time achieving nothing when another culture can overtake yours in a matter of a few years (China wins no matter who comes out on top).
I say this because the parts where the cultures merge are the most iconic ones (the Mahjong lingo casually thrown around by a baste negro or how, inexplicably, one of the diet duo is an old Japanese man reading an English script while the other is a purely American actor playing a Japanese man), but at the end of the day you're either an Asian killing an American or an American killing an Asian, and the protagonist is both at the same time.
A more accurate example would be Ace Attorney, which basically shits on the Japanese justice system.
>>16889775
Kun Lan, which is a "God of the East", is implied to just really will people into living on as zombies, so it's more of a matter of whether he feels like it.
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34a35e No.16889936
>>16889827
>Kun Lan, which is a "God of the East"
not exactly, though he is. Kun Lan is just a name. In the story he is an incarnation of Mara Papima, a temptation demon in Buddhism, and aspect of Angra Mainyu (the great evil spirit in Zoroastrianism)
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0a7bd1 No.16890000
>>16884365
>Spec Ops: The Line
>left-wing war bad retoric that shits on military soldiers who spill their guts to fight imbred sandniggers whose religion actively encourages terrorisim
>Persona 5
>the director was assblasted that people bullied him over some embarrasing incident in his past, also he is mad at authority figures because his parents spanked him
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d26e56 No.16890097
>>16890000
Can't argue with those quads
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2ea8b5 No.16890179
>>16889825
Germany is an American satellite state.
>>16890000
>left-wing war bad retoric that shits on military soldiers who spill their guts to fight imbred sandniggers whose religion actively encourages terrorisim
*spill their guts in artificially created wars for Israel
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cdd05a No.16890185
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0a7bd1 No.16890200
>>16890179
That doesn't change the fact that islam actively encourages terrorism
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12a1f0 No.16890232
>>16890200
Can you fault a lion for what it does when a zookeeper lets it out of its cage?
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0a7bd1 No.16890291
>>16890232
mudslimes aren't lions, but yes
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f1c083 No.16890324
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>16889404
>"modern day" adaptation of Heart of Darkness
Half right. It's a modern day adaptation of Apocalypse Now which was an adaptation of Heart of Darkness and it's a terrible adaptation of both. Vid related invidious is shitting on me and I suck at ffmpeg currently
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50b5b2 No.16890331
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2c1893 No.16890363
>>16890000
I hope that you're baiting, but if you aren't, you have no fucking idea how shit Japanese culture is.
And that comes from someone who actually really likes it
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3649b3 No.16890368
>>16889404
> half-assed attempt to make a "modern day" adaptation of Heart of Darkness
Thats just Apocalypse Now too. They literally had the perfect template to just copy from, but change it from Vietnam in the 60s to The Middle East modern day. The whole thing just comes across as really pretentious and tryhard. At the end of the day, you the player are engaging in this fake war for fun, and then the game just wags its finger at you and tries to make you feel guilty for killing fictional video game characters.
This is something MGS2 did, where the both the in game main character and by extension the player, is manipulated into doing something in a war scenario, much better and less condescending.
I fucking hated seeing this game praised EVERYWHERE when it first came out with people pretending it was this super smart and deep game because it was just Call of Duty: Youre the bad guy.
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d681af No.16890447
>>16890324
>This video contains content from Studiocanal, who has blocked in your country on (((copyright grounds)))
Just make a webm.
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