No.13171
I want to emulate Mishima's death, but I live in the states, and am a nobody. What would the American version of his death be?
Also Mishima general discussion thread.
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No.13176
>Be a fag.
>Be a boat driver for the army (kek).
>Be a novelist.
>Be a screenwriter.
>Be an essayist.
>Have sex at every opportunity, and don't forget Youtube (TV being passé).
>Cruise parties to the very end, putting cunts in their place left and right.
>Drenched alcoholic suicide.
>E.L.G. Vidal.
Closest American experience?
Das it mane.
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No.13182
Mr Nobody, wouldn't it, rather, be more fulfilling to emulate his life?
Truly, if you're interested in discussion on Mishima, I'd suggest beginning with a worthwhile contribution on his works yourself or your perhaps views on his ideology instead of just clapping your hands and expecting to be entertained
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No.13186
>>13171
>he thinks that who watches matter in the way you live or die.
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No.13194
Lead a traditionalist uprising, and when if fails, blow your brains out. Seems pretty straightforward to me.
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No.13195
>>13194
So would you say that shooting oneself in the head is the American suicide? The gun does echo the speed of the American character, and guns are a long standing American tradition.I'm thinking the AR-15 would be a good choice. But perhaps to accurately emulate Mishima a musket would be a better choice echoing his use of a historical weapon rooted in the warrior tradition of the culture.
>>13182
I doubt it. I've had a fairly comparable life so far, the only major difference that's kept me from being a western mirror to Mishima so far is the poverty of my childhood, and that Mishima was self conscious about being less than average height (5'1, vs the average 5'3"), while I am average height, and so have not shared the same experiences. I've incidentally shared many of the same experiences and whatnot, but that's really only the surface level of mimicry. Sure I could try to emulate the rest of his life and become the American version of Mishima, but I rather think it's the core that matters more and where better seen is that than in his death. I would more than likely fail at replicating the more fantastic elements of his life anyway.Also I don't like hookups, and I don't think I could find a woman to marry me while I go and fuck guys on the side. Besides clapping your hands is essential to the American character and not to do so would interfere with my larping. Just help me die my meme death please.
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No.13197
>>13195
Double barrel shotgun in the mouth like Hemingway.
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No.13198
>>13197
I like it. Hemingway was mediocre though
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No.13201
>>13198
How about a .44 ~ .50 caliber woodstock revolver?
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No.13207
1) If you're going to copy his entire style, I hope you're embracing his vitalist, bodybuilding ideals. If you're just some lazy, skinnyfat NEET who shoots himself because you feel like you missed the boat to success, you've missed the point entirely.
2) The way things are looking these days, a cause worth dying for may appear in your lifetime. Democracy's days are numbered and the "great causes" he spoke of will return sooner than you think.
Mishima was merely unfortunate to have been born in a time when those forces were waning. His "revolt" was a last resort to die the death of a samurai. If there was any realistic hope of reversing the democratic order in Japan, he would've gladly given his life for it.
>"I don't want to revive hara kiri itself, but through the vision, a very strong vision, of hara kiri, I wanted to inspire and stimulate younger people. And through such a stimulation I wanted to revive some old, traditional sense of order, or sense of very strong responsibility, and such a sense of death in order. That's my purpose."
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No.13230
thanks for the vid, annon
I assume you've seen the Paul Schrader 1985 movie, Mishima: A Life in Four Chapters. The production was assisted by the Mishima Foundation so I expect the viewpoint presented in the movie is a reasonably accurate depiction of Mishima's views. It contains dramatised episodes from his life, a lot of readings of his writings, documentary footage … in all, a fascinating take.
My personal response to the film was how Mishima's death was an act of ultimate despair. After a lifetime of eminent achievement he could do no more to demonstrate the sincerity of his views other than through this act. Without having produced this lifetime's work, his death would have been utterly insignificant and no doubt largely unreported.
In Japan today, none the young I've spoken to there who'd heard of Mishima (no one had read him) knew of him as some sort of amusing freak, rather like US gun nuts, but for samurai sword fetish instead.
The story of his final volume of writing, The Decay of the Angel, in my opinion reflects his sense of futility as to his ability to influence Japan towards returning to it's former traditional culture. Mishima became a very bleak writer reflecting the bitterness of the ugly cold war period, in which for many there was no future.
In retrospect, it was his life's work and not his death that his his real legacy although for illiterate, (how did you put it?) "lazy, skinnyfat NEETs" seeking social media recognition, it's easy to see why that has obsessive appeal.
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No.13232
>>13176
>Be a fag.
Nah, Mishima's a classical fascist/warrior ethicist, so it's not gay if it is in the mannerbunde.
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No.13237
>>13230
My first point was aimed at anyone who thinks that they can follow Mishima's example merely by committing suicide. Mishima's death was the conclusion of a life and body of work that reflected his idealism. He knew full well he would not succeed, but only by trying could he know for sure that the samurai spirit was living or dead. He risked his life for whatever sliver of hope there was left in a revolt against the modern world. Failure meant suicide, but this was an act that was fully in line with his principles.
Being suicidal and killing yourself in some nationalistic manner because you want to be like Mishima only reflects your weakness as a person. You haven't lived for anything greater than yourself, and you haven't forged your body and your mind to accomplish your goals. Your death has no meaning in the grand scheme of things. Whatever your ideals are, you've merely called it quits; no fundamentally different than another heroin overdose or alcohol-induced sclerosis statistic.
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No.13248
>>13237
>Being suicidal and killing yourself in some nationalistic manner because you want to be like Mishima only reflects your weakness as a person. You haven't lived for anything greater than yourself, and you haven't forged your body and your mind to accomplish your goals. Your death has no meaning in the grand scheme of things. Whatever your ideals are, you've merely called it quits; no fundamentally different than another heroin overdose or alcohol-induced sclerosis statistic.
I have a very nice physique, but other than that you're right. I just don't see any way to make an impact with my life, and so I thought perhaps I could do so with my death.
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No.13347
>>13195
So you're a manlet that wants to die and hasn't written anything of importance. You'll just be another body in the morg. If you wanted to be close to Mishima you'd need a quasi-cult that will follow you to the death and a fucking intense work ethic. But I don't blame you for wanting to imitate him. Try to be more constructive with your aspirations. It was not his death that was beautiful, but rather his death as the culmination of his life's work.
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No.13351
>>13171
>the American version
shooting to death the English department faculty of your nearby state college with a .308 battle rifle
but honestly, you would just waste yourself, and give fuel to the shitlib media establishment.
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No.13355
Mishima as a gay writer
disclosure: homo here
Just as Mishima's death inspires the vacuous, his novel Confessions of a Mask seems to be the work that defines for non-readers his putative "fag writer" reputation. Actually, among all translated works I do not think Confessions of a Mask is either that significant a novel of his, nor (other than the title) a gay book. Admittedly if that's what one is seeking Confessions has a slightly homoerotic scene in which the adolescent boy is watching a wartime parade of passing firemen … rather slim pickings.
Having spent a year in Japan it's my view Japanese are far less obsessed than westerners about the role of sex in one's self definition. It's very low key in their society, for which reason most young adults can't be bothered, according to what one reads.
Much of Mishima's greater works focus on power, and the role of tradition, religion and social prestige in projecting control over others. His book Forbidden Colours tells of how a handsome young man is subverted by an old author to destroy both women and men through sexual treachery. Of his translated books, this is the only one portraying the Japanese gay world.
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No.13371
>>13351
>shooting to death the English department faculty of your nearby state college
No doubt someone would write an essay comparing it to game of thrones.
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No.13579
>it's not gay if it is in the mannerbunde
Our German friend raises an interesting point that's intrigued me over the years - whether Mishima was really a fag at heart or not? It's not at all clear to me where this legend of Mishima's promiscuity derives and the only corroboration of his interest in the subject I've come across was in an essay or review (I think the one by E.L."G." Vidal but cannot check as my library is at present in commercial storage) in which it's stated that Mishima was somewhat of an identity on the Ginza gay bar circuit.
But maybe he was doing field research? Love between males is not at all a great theme of his works overall, and other than its being a hot button topic it's not obvious to me why this is attributed to him at all
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No.13580
As taken from an essay of Vidal. The part in brackets was edited for clarity and brevity.
"Mishima's suicide had a shattering effect on [Japan, which is better understood as a family than as a nation-state]. For one thing, he was a famous writer. This meant he was taken a good deal more seriously by the nation (family) than any American writer is ever taken by those warring ethnic clans whose mutual detestation is the essential fact of the American way of life."
Later on:
"When I arrived in Japan journalists kept asking me what I thought of his death. At first I thought they were simply being polite. I was vague, said I could not begin to understand an affair which seemed to me so entirely Japanese. I spoke solemnly of different cultures, different traditions. Told them that in the West we kill ourselves when we can't go on the way we would like to: a casual matter, really—there is no seppuku for us, only the shotgun or the bottle."
Eerie that last, about which Vidal earlier suggested some writers, Mishima most certainly, were predictive of their own future in their writing.
More to the point these speak to the essence of OP's question:
>What would the American version of his death be?
I think it a waste of time crafting an exacting mirror image to Mishima's death within the framework of Americana. The more exacting the match in detail, the less similarity there would be for the reasons Vidal describes. This is also why I suggested the best American counterpart in OP's sense was Vidal.
>>13579
I was quoting from Vidal's "The Death of Mishima" in part one of "United States—essays, 1952-1992." This may be what you are referring to. Be it so or no I recommend it.
As for Vidal's opinions as to his faggotry potential, I'll leave you this truncated sentence, all but the last few words of his essay: "I only regret we never met, for friends found him a good companion, a find drinking partner, and …"
And … just (re?)read the essay. The reliability question of Vidal's own gaydar be damned; I think you'll enjoy his take.
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No.13614
Random Mishima related question.
What was his schedule of work like? I know that he'd write late into the night and then sleep through the mornings. How much did he write on an average day? His output is incredible, not to mention his other passions (film, starring in/directing traditional theater, bodybuilding).
tl;dr how much did Mishima write on an average day. I've looked online and haven't found a thing.
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No.13622
>>13614
There's a documentary about mishima you can find on youtube that goes into this.
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No.13650
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No.13653
>>13650
Not that guy, but he's probably referring to an old BBC documentary called The Strange Case of Yukio Mishima. I don't think it mentions anything related to your question, though - at least not in depth.
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No.13669
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No.13778
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>13614
I've got a lecture by Daniel Flanagan that I think goes into his writing schedule. I forget what exactly is said in this lecture but what I do recall is that he was obsessed with time and schedule. He was never late for a deadline and disassociated with those unable to fulfil mutual deadlines.
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No.13780
>>13778
Listened to that Damian Flanagan lecture and found it very disappointing. For an academic, his spoken language skills are poor, full of umms and errs, extremely repetitious, unstructured and overall, dull.
Within the dross, however, was a tiny worthwhile lode and Flanagan's insights into Mishima's obsession with time were indeed interesting, along with a number of observations (gossip and speculation I suspect) about his life.
I've just this week finished rereading Spring Snow which is a wonderful novel and leaves me saddened at the loss Japan suffered through the concluding weeks of WW2.
Perhaps in accordance with ineluctable progress, it was inevitable that they would have to be bombed into submitting to democracy. Sad, nevertheless.
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No.14459
bout time this thread was freshened up …
collection of Yukio Mishima's books
magnet:?xt=urn:btih:7f608fa3f75fa5fd77b6a4aff9cc107338cfdb13&dn=Yukio+Mishima+book+pack&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.leechers-paradise.org%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fzer0day.ch%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.demonii.com%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.coppersurfer.tk%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fexodus.desync.com%3A6969
recommended biopic - Mishima - A Life in Four Chapters (Paul Schrader, 1985)
magnet:?xt=urn:btih:82a095ab4b52cd863f2f7c80a908b64b8d120c19&dn=Mishima+-+A+Life+in+Four+Chapters+%28Paul+Schrader%2C+1985%29&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.leechers-paradise.org%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fzer0day.ch%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.demonii.com%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.coppersurfer.tk%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fexodus.desync.com%3A6969
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No.16694
>>13171
>American
Write some books then dome a rando with a musket and die of diabetes.
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No.16817
>>13171
>What would the American version of his death be?
Showdown at high noon
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No.16888
>>13171
>In total, Mishima wrote 34 novels (including some entertainment novels), about 50 plays, 25 books of short stories, and at least 35 books of essays, one libretto, as well as one film.
He only lived to be 45, how the fuck did he get so much done /lit/?
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No.16893
>>16888
Japanese spirit
Weak gaijin can't comprehend
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No.16894
>>16893
>Japanese spirit
That must be code for a helluva calendar
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No.16910
>>13355
>has a slightly homoerotic scene
nigger I'm reading the book right now and he's literally getting a hard on from his boy crush in school and jerking off to the sight of hair growing in his own arm pits, not to mention St Sebastian.
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No.16912
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No.16960
Let's see if I can get this to work - first post on the new 8k incarnation
Don't know whether anyone noticed but last week was the 50th anniversary of Mishima's big day …
https://asia.nikkei.com/Editor-s-Picks/Tea-Leaves/Yukio-Mishima-in-the-21st-century
pic related
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No.16963
>>16960
I did a hundred push ups in his honor
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No.16995
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No.17013
Mishima? I’ve read his Forbidden Colours. An interesting look at the homosexual underworld, and the contempt homos have for breeders. Mishima himself was homosexual (respectably married to a woman) but shows well how homos form a parallel society inherently antagonistic to familial society.
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