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/co/ - Comics & Cartoons

Where cartoons and comics collide!
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<BOARD RULES>
You're still here? The show's over....

File: 9dca01895f81c7c⋯.png (246.67 KB,1136x640,71:40,Black and White world.png)

 No.1072807 [View All]

http://archive.is/jJWCo

After being attacked by twitter morons for having rules where he had the audacity to respect customers and hire people with talent, they made him cuck from providing a cover for Doug TenNapel's kickstarter Bigfoot Bill 2: Finger of Poseidon because of his anti-trans views. Now they want him to end his relationship with Blake Northcott for CG with the usual guilt by association. The comic industry is small as it is but can an industry survive under 6 degrees of alt-right purging? Can people of differing ideologies work together anymore as just business or is this how it's going to be for a while? I'm afraid I already know the answer to that question.

26 posts and 18 image replies omitted. Click [Open thread] to view. ____________________________
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 No.1072925

File: 2cd2b959505811d⋯.jpeg (728.22 KB,1250x1250,1:1,https_pbs_twimg_com_media….jpeg)

That Van Sciver shits on guys like TenNapel for actually putting out finished comics, on top of competently running crowdfunding campaigns for them, tells me all I need to know about Ethan.

That said, is anybody else bothered by the overemphasis on crowdfunding? From what I've seen nobody ever mentions the possibility of just doing a webcomic. Crowdfunding's fine but for every creator that actually delivers what they promise. there are dozens that either run into a brick wall with their campaigns (poor budgeting, no plan, unforeseen complication, etc) or just take the money, run, and let backers know about it months later.

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 No.1072931

>>1072925

Yes. I think it's because webcomics are tougher to market, monetize, and they require work upfront and possible revenue later.

Another disturbing part is how many people who deliver just do the crowdfunding and that's it. Putting the comic out on comixology or gumroad would be trivial, readers would have a chance to get it even after the campaign is over, and it would be some extra revenue for the creator.

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 No.1072969

I consider myself a "member" of CG, though I didn't even know about most of this internal drama. Last bit of that I remember was when Vox Day tried to copyright the name for his Alt-Hero crap. Wasn't he doing a Qanon comic, too? I'm still subbed to Ethan and Zack on the tubes but I rarely watch their videos anymore, it's just the same shit over and over.

Can't people just make fun comics?

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 No.1072984

File: 0696577db2a2db3⋯.png (82.63 KB,1337x182,191:26,Screenshot_2020_03_11_Comi….png)

File: ff197b480c773ba⋯.png (940.53 KB,1229x714,1229:714,Screenshot_2020_03_11_Comi….png)

>>1072903

Just going off this post alone its obvious this sperg doesn't really care about anything. I'll leave some of his stuff up but I'm going to clean most of his thread bomb. I don't know much about CG nor do I ever want to, I just want to clean up the thread and having a faggot sperg out like this isn't helping anyone. I'm not going to delete the thread but if you honestly want to shit on the guy, just don't act like a sperg from /cow/.

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 No.1072996

This kind of faggotry is exactly why weebshit and knockoffs thereof is overshadowing Western comics and animation and devouring its market share globally.

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 No.1072997

>>1072925

>That Van Sciver shits on guys like TenNapel for actually putting out finished comics, on top of competently running crowdfunding campaigns for them, tells me all I need to know about Ethan.

Why does dougs fanforce keep shilling here no one cares about your gay ecleb fued bro talk about comic pros being socjus fags not two indie faggots fighting

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 No.1072998

>>1072996

Did you seriously edit this anon's post?

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 No.1072999

>>1072984

Good shit janny I know these faggots crosspost on twitter and wanna use /co/ to ecleb hatejerk when doug and evs are both questionable in different ways imo

One sperg for doug legit asked for gibs because his wife had cancer and begged evs to unblock him after doing the same /cow/ shit the banned guy did here.

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 No.1073000

>>1072838

Tom king is a hack

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 No.1073001

>>1072997

>>1072999

Keep the tribalism on the down low or spoiler the more cancerous/spergy bits.

>>1072998

Once in the full moon, either to make a slight grammatical change (like giving a post an extra space) or salvaging a post if it had spergy elements, bring it to the meta thread next time.

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 No.1073004

>>1073001

Imma just avoid it outright now that its offtopic

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 No.1073009

>>1072901

>(What in the ever loving hell is a "Ya Boi Zack"?)

The guy in the video. His youtube channel used to be Diversity&Comics, but he changed its name to ComicsMatter with YaBoiZack. Name comes from people back in the day claiming that his real name is Zack.

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 No.1073010

As a GG veteran, CG is akin to Roguestar hijacking the movement and making it all about him by shilling his own subpar product. Yes, modern capeshit is terrible, but the alternatives aren't better. Ya Boi Zack unironically likes Liefeld and hired someone who aped Liefeld's edgy 90s style terribly. Even the mexican artists on Boom or Oni color within the lines and arranged their compositions perfectly so each panel's readable. EVS's Cyber Pepe looks busy and the faces look creepy as if traced from porn.

TL;DR support manga and not this shit

(>>>/a/)
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 No.1073011

>>1073010

EVS was always one of the better capeshit artist he was employed by DC. The biggest problem with Ethan from what I know (aside from the e-celeb faggotry he's a part of and instigates) is that he had several crowdfunding campaigns for the same damn comic and then shipped the comic late anyway on sub-par paper. I also wish more of these niggers would make their comic available through something other than the initial crowdfunding place. For all their talk of creating an alternative market, they sure make it hard get their comics once you get the window. You shouldn't just name drop a GG e-celeb and expect people to know what you mean. Many people (if they were here in the first place, and not one of the numerous cuckchanners come here) don't even remember that time wannabe e-celeb got angry because no gamergayter liked them, and spammed every board in the top ten in their anal pain.

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 No.1073016

>>1072931

>Putting the comic out on comixology or gumroad would be trivial, readers would have a chance to get it even after the campaign is over, and it would be some extra revenue for the creator.

I suspect some creators are deterred by the possibility of digital piracy. That and/or they want as many people pitching into their campaigns as possible, since offering digital copies might cut into that.

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 No.1073025

>>1073016

>I suspect some creators are deterred by the possibility of digital piracy.

Most of them are still obscure enough to where this is barely a problem. The only ones I know for sure whom got their shit uploaded are Matthew Weldon (who I am unsure is CG or not, he may be just adjacent) and Rags (who burned out on CG). Even when their shit got uploaded, I recall it was weeks after their shit was uploaded anywhere.

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 No.1073039

>>1073011

Yeah, EVS was solid at DC, but cyberfrog is a clear step down compared to his previous work. It just feels like since VanScriver became a youtube celeb, actual comic book work took a backseat to streams and youtube videos.

>>1073016

>I suspect some creators are deterred by the possibility of digital piracy.

That's pretty stupid. What's stopping people from backing the campaign the lowest possible amount and then scanning the comic anyway? What about media piracy research that EU commissioned and then tried to suppress once it turned out that piracy did not hurt sales, and in cases when they had an effect it actually bolstered popularity? I suspect that there is a reason as to why Marvel, DC, and scholastics did not join the comics piracy hysteria going on social media a few months back.

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 No.1073040

>>1073036

I agree with you that EVS is a fag, but you really make it obvious you don't belong here. You should go back to twitter nigger.

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 No.1073042

>>1073010

>As a GG veteran

>Just give up comics to the woke crowd and don't support independant artsists

As a fellow GG "verteran", neck yourself.

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 No.1073043

>>1073042

to be fair, CG if far from the only anti-woke comcis guys in town now. Alot of people who left CG remained aint-woke and still make comics. So he doesn't neccesarily have to support CG to support independent artists.

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 No.1073044

>>1073043

>>1073042

Well, a lot of independent comic creators are woke as hell, so supporting independent creators doesn't mean you are against woke artists.

Saying that supporting independent creators is anti-woke or pro-woke is pointless.

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 No.1073082

How do we make ComicsGate a success? It's not a very rewarding industry and it's hard, thankless work. A modern day artist cannot survive unless they bend the knee to corporate suits, propaganda and pornography. Either that or serve Starbucks lattes forever.

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 No.1073084

>>1073082

There's no saving the industry as it is. It needs total reform similar to the manga industry.

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 No.1073087

File: c181aac2c2bd9a2⋯.jpg (91.98 KB,1200x1194,200:199,daria.jpg)

>>1073084

> It needs total reform similar to the manga industry.

Either you're fucking stupid or extremely naive the manga (same extent with anime) industry literally runs on pennies and is bound for a literal collapse if things dont change. The only reason it hasn't is because the people working within it love what they do, and don't mind getting paid below minimum wage and work 50 hour weeks to the point of literal death.

https://archive.is/wW1Xj

https://archive.is/MDNmW

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 No.1073088

>>1073087

I never said the manga industry was perfect. But the format of storytelling is what's made it successfully blow up in the west while american comics have been dying hard.

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 No.1073089

>>1073039

>What's stopping people from backing the campaign the lowest possible amount and then scanning the comic anyway?

Effort and demand? You'd have to be pretty crazy to put down money to preorder a comic in the hopes of disassembling and scanning it for everybody else to enjoy. Not saying it's not impossible, just rare.

>>1073025

>Most of them are still obscure enough to where this is barely a problem

I agree, but that doesn't stop some creators from getting rattled over the very idea of someone reading their work and not paying for it.

>>1073082

Actually support and spread awareness for indie comics you feel are actually worth your attention and/or money. Don't need no hashtag or a Twitter account to do that.

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 No.1073090

File: 9d4efb3cd3dbf53⋯.png (47.43 KB,890x710,89:71,1430367355458_2.png)

>>1073088

>But the format of storytelling is what's made it successfully blow up

What made it "blow up" was because theres nothing fucking worth reading from the big two (Batman till recently always outsold manga in the west). The mid-tier guys are stuck doing IP comics like Sonic and Power Rangers and the Indie scene is either made up of rainbow haired dykes or legitimate people trying to make a living but cant because no one buys shit.

The problem with comics is the duopoly created by the mouse and the lack of NATIVE competition.

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 No.1073092

>>1073090

If it was merely just having nothing good to read from the big two then indie comics would be more successful. The simple matter is that manga volumes, creator owned stories, & actual story structure on top of consistent creator teams are what make manga so popular.

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 No.1073093

File: ff6950175de7615⋯.jpg (160.33 KB,1000x750,4:3,DC_Walmart_1000x750.jpg)

>>1073092

>big two then indie comics would be more successful.

Kid, its called a duopoly for a reason. Whether its soda, operating systems, or comics the little guy is never going to match the big two, because the big two always use their weight to push them out in some manner. It takes a literal separation by governing powers, a complete collapse of the market or just plain luck for a small indie company to make some decent cash.

>creator owned stories, & actual story structure on top of consistent creator teams are what make manga so popular.

All that shit you listed is not unique to anything and has been done over and over for decades. That shit is still around in comics, but nobody fucking buys them, so the damn thing goes under. Put stories in traditional magazines, news stands, hell even in the trading card section of Walmart; new shit does not sell because they can't compete with the duopoly. It doesn't help either that most decent writers never stick around because they can be making 10x the money shitting out scripts for television or movies.

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 No.1073094

>>1073093

Again, no one buys them because they're still not on that same production level as manga. Never as good art. Stories that can have story structure but still require tons of books to read on series that are ultra successful like Hellboy. Consistency? Forget about it. Indie books that go beyond just one shot volumes don't have consistent teams either. DC & Marvel existing doesn't inherently make these indie creators unable to sell. That doesn't make any sense when no one's buying DC or Marvel comics anymore.

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 No.1073095

>>1073092

>the problem with comics is the duopoly created by the mouse

I'm nitpicking, but it's not accurate. Duopoly began long before Marvel and DC were bought by Disney and WB. In fact, DC had near monopoly once Fawcett started faltering, but then Marvel took off.

>>1073090

>>1073090

It's combination of multiple factors

>American comics tend to be of lower quality than manga

>Floppies are overpriced

>Comics still have 'it's for kids' stigma and are not taken seriously

These are the big ones. All of them can be blamed on big two, who are basically dictating the prices, drove quality down, and actively worked towards sabotaging non-cape and smaller publishers.

Other contributing factors are:

>Marvel's and DCs online services are lackluster

>On Comixology they have to compete with self-published indies, European translation, and manga

>Printed periodicals are declining and on top of it only retailers carrying them are comicbook stores and some bookstores

>Antiquated publication model

>Marvel's practices back in the 90s crashed the market and permanently altered it

>Limited amount of genres and types of stories compared to Japanese and European comics

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 No.1073100

File: 9346f92c4795aa2⋯.png (924.02 KB,1181x1071,1181:1071,_2000_commission.png)

File: 01862b6da14a97e⋯.jpg (518.19 KB,1600x1230,160:123,7756b8e52b5342f84c9b132dad….jpg)

File: a8cf2ca5b94d8e8⋯.jpg (354.6 KB,900x664,225:166,untitled.jpg)

File: aba88354a8231c1⋯.jpg (52.81 KB,901x650,901:650,tmg_article_default_mobile….jpg)

>>1073094

>that same production level as manga

Manga doesn't even print in color (unless its a special edition). The paper used in the typical JUMP magazine is worse than toilet paper, and for individual releases its cheap as hell just to bulk buy black ink. Unions are different (if they even exist for a Mangaka in a small company), laws are different and what sells is utterly different.

>Never as good art.

Now you're just bait posting. Also good artists cost money and you make more money doing commissions for furry porn.

>Consistency? Forget about it.

Not many people are willing to stay decades working on one story but on the flip side if one person worked on Batman; The Long Halloween, Killing Joke or any of those specific tales wouldn't be a thing. Also just wait till Akira Toriyama kicks the bucket due to heart failure from over working, it'll be the first in their industry where JUMP decides to continue their cash cow after the creator dies.

>Indie books that go beyond just one shot volumes don't have consistent teams either.

Because it never pays well.

>DC & Marvel existing doesn't inherently make these indie creators unable to sell

Here's a crash course in Business 101, when there's a shop selling all sorts of products the company with the most money pays to be in front. When Anheuser-Busch (beer company) wanted to break into the snack business they bought a little snack company to make shit (Eagle Brands). They wanted to use their established brand recognition to kickstart this new venture, people always have snacks with beer so why not have them buy snacks directly from them. Frito-lay and to the same extension their owners PepsiCo didn't like that. They saw it as a threat and a slap to the face even though they dominated the snack industry; they didn't care when the bought company was on its own, they had no monetary muscle but when they got bought the capital available to them was beyond the imagination. So what happened? PepsiCo declared jihad for the shelf space of the grocery store on Anheuser-Busch. Using their connections Frito-lay did all types of shit; they declared a price war and sold at a loss, they threatened to take away their product from stores that sold Anheuser-Busch snacks or placed their product in easy to see shelf space, they made exclusivity deals with stores to push out Anheuser-Busch snacks and ultimately got lawyers involved just to fuck with the main Anheuser-Busch company. In the end after losing millions on the venture Anheuser-Busch sold their snack division and never looked back.

I had a great business strategy professor back in my college days

How does this apply to comics? As noted here >>1073095 these companies play dirty. Have you ever since an Image comic or a Boom comic in Walmart. Ive seen Archie comics and Garfield comics, they typically always hang around the register or deep within a store's magazine section. I've seen Jump issues once in a full moon but they typically disappear after a while, sometimes they come back too or not. DC recently ended their partnership with Walmart yet Archie and Garfield remain. Why? Because that is their territory along with newsstands, anyone tries to get in that isn't some diet fad book gets fucked with. The only place that sells all sort of comics shit outside comic shops are Barnes and Noble and hipster stores like FYE. Yet the first comics you see there are either Marvel or DC; everything else is in the back gathering dust, unless its IDW doing a popular IP. Even with comic shops, the big two keep dumping and dumping books on them whether they want them or not. The shops are forced to get rid of those books as quickly as possible, plastering all them across the front of the store, if they don't then they won't get the weekly release of the new Batman story or whatever Spider-man is doing or something to this extent.

Its a dirty business.

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 No.1073106

>>1072807

Doug Tennipples is an Objectivist, I'm pretty sure that doesn't count as "Alt-right", that's just plain old "redneck that read Atlas Shrugged".

And if Murphy does the cover or not is his own choice, twits and Tumblrs can't force the little bitch to do anything. Maybe it's Nipples' fault for being a fucking transphobic redneck, maybe that's why the salty old fuck can't get anyone to work with him.

(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS OBVIOUS BAIT)
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 No.1073110

>>1073106

>>1073108

also:

>Maybe it's Nipples' fault for being a fucking transphobic redneck,

Where do you think you are? You should go back to twitter like the other nigger.

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 No.1073115

>>1073090

>The problem with comics is the duopoly created by the mouse and the lack of NATIVE competition.

Pretty much its why most artists are pozzed they dominate the schools and or get them right off tumblr

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 No.1073118

>>1073087

>>1073100

manga in Japan is easier to distribute since it is a smaller country.

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 No.1073119

>>1073118

Its a fucking book, one of the easiest things to distribute. No excuses.

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 No.1073121

>>1073119

Harder, not impossible.

And that means it is more expensive, specially if you want to make the same volume of content like the japanese industry every week.

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 No.1073123

>>1073121

Then it must be a pain for newspaper companies to shit out crap for decades or new york best sellers as they hit nationwide sells within a day of their release.

I can find manga the day the translation is released within hours, its fucking books, you can print that shit anywhere for pennies especially if the product is only black and white. Distribution isn't a problem as long as there's demand and a safe place to advertise.

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 No.1073179

File: 926cd130a900019⋯.mp4 (5.84 MB,1280x720,16:9,sUA3JCw0eBz7MmqX.mp4)

File: 8da5beedea277cc⋯.jpg (583.06 KB,1280x1943,1280:1943,ETV39N4WAAIJ_I_jpg_orig.jpg)

The absolute fucking state of Marvel. Meet Safespace & Snowflake.

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 No.1073180

File: e984626461df31d⋯.png (1.11 MB,1211x881,1211:881,newwarriors2020newkids_sno….png)

>>1073179

Their designs are so generic. They look like bad minibosses from a Megaman ripoff.

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 No.1073183

Invidious embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>1073181

Here's the full trailer video.

This could potentially be the next Hellcat.

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 No.1073220

>>1073118

The Big Two of manga OWN distrubution companies and, I beleive, large shares in convenience store chains.

The UK is also a small country, but our "big one" of comics (and teetering on the edge of the abyss at that) are dictated to by the distributor, not the other way around. The distributor also has a monopoly, one shop that sells 10 copies of The Beano one week, but only 1 the next week because it rains all week, will only ever be sent 1 copy from the distributor forever after. , Also the shops charge "rent" to the comics, bumping their prices up to absurd levels.

The size of the country has nothing to do with it. But it does mean that anybody with sufficient capital behind them to start up their own convenience store chain and distributor could easily monopolise the comic industry overnight, and sell them much cheaper, too (you don't charge rent to yourself, after all).

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 No.1073328

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

Cyberfrog coin revealed to be nothing but a piece of paper on a 50 cent piece. Evs is now guilty of fraud.

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 No.1073334

>>1073328

That's a terrible video but yeah EVS is legitimately in trouble if this is true.

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 No.1073533

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

Last Week in #Comicsgate : Schadenfreude

Mar 27, 2020

The event dominating the news was the Coronavirus shut down and quarantine. Diamond Distribution halted its comic book distribution operations, which prompted many in #Comicsgate to speculate that this was the end of Marvel and DC Comics as ongoing companies.

Ethan Van Sciver took particular glee in telling his fans to respond to Marvel and DC artists on Twitter with the "#pencilsdown" hashtag. He characterized #Comicsgate as a lifeboat which could take on a few new talented industry professionals, but, according to Cecil, they would need to self-identify as #Comicsgate.

Martina Markota / Lady Alchemy was declared "Queen" of War Campaign by Ro. Seemingly, in an effort to fit in with her new tribe of people, she posted the two artists formerly working on her Lady Alchemy as engaging in a male sodomy orgy.

Donny Cates was doing his best to allay fears of the end of comics and used some of Stan Lee's old phrases. This prompted Peter Simeti to comment that Donny Cates was not Stan Lee; he then bragged about it on Ethan Van Sciver's livestream. a virtue signal to the #Comicsgate crowd.

(Shilling and shitting all over the thread like some kind of incontinent Bird Man)
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 No.1073571

>>1073328

Alright, I'm really out of the loop on this. How is putting a sticker on a 50 cent coin fraud? Did someone advertise custom made metal coins or something?

Keep in mind, those penny-souvenir machines at museums were ruled legal in the US, and those destroy the coin in question.

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 No.1073578

>>1073571

>Alright, I'm really out of the loop on this. How is putting a sticker on a 50 cent coin fraud? Did someone advertise custom made metal coins or something?

don't follow CG much, but some resaerch does reveal he overhyped the coins. From(emphasis mine, forgive me if i fuck up the fromating. never used anything besides spoiler and redtext before):

>I'd like to offer you the chance to acquire this new set of collectible Cyberfrog coins, a JFK silver fifty cent piece with a _hi-tech art overlay_ of your friends from CYBERFROG BLOODHONEY! There are six to collect!

>The Art Process Official Term: Colorization Infused Legal Tender Coins - Colorizing coins involves the _application of special inks directly to the surface of a coin_ using a unique multi-color printing process. The result is an _everlasting colorized coin_ collectible of ultra-high quality. We are using America’s largest manufacturer and the creators of both colorized U.S. coins. This colorizing process achieves a _level of detail, color saturation, and durability that is #1 in the industry._

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 No.1073579

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 No.1073599

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