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For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
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File: fff4a025a723159⋯.jpg (149.42 KB, 1000x800, 5:4, crusader.jpg)

13f18b  No.844900

Can anyone give me a Biblical argument against hyper-pacifism? My readings of Scripture seem to suggest that self-defense and war are a form of vanity, and judgement upon sinners should be left to God and God alone, even if it costs you your life.

I understand there are people in the Old Testament (such as King David and Abraham) who killed their enemies, but these seem to be justified only because they were explicitly commanded by God, which rarely if ever happens in the modern era. Stories of those who are not chosen for vindication, like Samson's suicidal retribution, are punished for their violence.

The recent situation with Kyle Rittenhouse reminds me of when Judas and the Roman guards arrest Jesus, which Jesus knows will result in his death. Jesus's disciples attempt to defend Jesus and attack the guards, but Jesus commands them to stop and heals a guard's ear. If Jesus allowed himself to be killed by forces of evil, was it wrong for Kyle not to do the same? Even though he surrenders himself to fulfill Biblical prophesy, would he have done anything different if nothing was written about his coming?

Many point to the verse where Jesus says to sell your garments and buy a sword, yet when his disciples use the weapons Jesus commands them to stop. It seems that Jesus only told them to do so in order to make them appear as criminals and zealots, ensuring his arrest and fulfillment of prophesy. Hence why he tells them that two swords are enough.

I believe that all judgements of life and death should be reserved for God, even if that means the death of my kin and survival of Satanic enemies. Life appears to be a test built atop many, many layers of abstraction. And though though a sin may seem justified and beneficial to the world's overall wellbeing, it is still wrong and fails the ultimate test. Take the story of when the Devil offered Jesus control of the entire world in exchange for one act of Satanic worship. Despite the millions of lives Jesus could've saved and improved, he declined.

This is where I have ended up so far in my reading, and I would much appreciate if anyone has any refutes to the idea of Christian pacifism. Thanks for your time.

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631d4a  No.844901

>>844900

this is the third thread you've been trying to rile people up for violent crap, by strawmaning the alternative as being some total masochistic doormat.

But assuming by absurd you are legit, and for anyone else who is reading, NT pacifism is more what we call nonviolent resistance nowadays(which is not surprising. Both Gandhi and MLK got influenced by Tolstoy in forming their protests), not being some rag.

>inb4 someone gets triggered by mentioning MLK because other reasons. I mentioned him due to the way he structured his protests, not because of ideology

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13f18b  No.844902

>>844901

You can clearly attack your enemies, but only with words and Truth. There is no verse "Ye shall harm thy enemy who wishes thee death." Nowhere in the NT does it say self-defense through physical violence is iustified. All signs point to the alternative. This is why I asked for specific verses, rather than assumptions and vague interpretations that fit your desire for revenge. And no I am not larping as a pacifist to rile people up, I provided plenty of Biblical evidence for my claim. Can you do the same?

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8c55d4  No.844911

What you're looking for is coping mechanisms.

Be honest with the Spirit. Complacency to sin is a must to exist in this world.

Stop trying to justify yourself and ask for forgiveness. The latter will be accepted, the former will not.

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8c6118  No.844919

>>844911

>Complacency to sin is a must to exist in this world.

Congratulations everyone. We've successfully fully inverted the concepts of virtue and sin.

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459948  No.844927

> My readings of Scripture

Spotted the problem.

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8c55d4  No.844963

>>844919

What happened to the man who was sinless? Anyone who is not condemned to death is not sinless.

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d0c433  No.844978

I disagree, I don't think the bible is hyper pacifist at all. For example, during the last supper Jesus tells the disciples to sell their cloak and buy a sword - which in today's language - would be buy a gun. This suggests contemplating violence in self defense. Also God, who is one with Jesus advocated and even commanded war in the old testament and it says Jesus will lead armies in the end times. This doesn't 'sound hyper pacifist at all.

I think what you're doing is polarizing the issue - the bible commands against violence and condemns violent men. But that doesn't mean we have to adopt the complete opposite as a rule. It's not either or - we don't have to pick between extremes.

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