/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

God isn't omnipotent in the present understanding of the word. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Sometimes each option has some evil to it so even if God chose the path with the most good there will still be evil.

>>841629

God is omnipotent anon he doesn't intervene much until he really should.

>>841631

>omnipotent

I said he's not omnipotent as modernists understand the word.

>intervenes

He mapped out the entire destiny of the universe. He is intervening at every point in space and time.

>>841632

>I said he's not omnipotent as modernists understand the word.

Mind explaining because I seen where you are coming from.

>>841633

God doesn't go against His nature, which entails non-contradiction and all that can be derived from it.

>>841629

>>841631

>>841632

>>841633

>>841635

still doesnt answer the question really. i guess you could argue what is omnipotence all day.. but I thought you were christians? the bible clearly states that god is all powerful in every sense of the word. there is no place where it states any limits to his power..

my question is if you would still love him if he severely and irreparably damaged injured or hurt your family, the person closest to you.. the most disgusting unimaginable thing happens to them.. would you still love god? and why?

hard to think about i know, sorry. but this is my question.

I have read the book of job, and I am no job..

but, i most CERTAINLY am no job who has to live through his loved ones taking gods wrath instead of him.

not to mention the book of job was a completely and utterly different world, its hard enough to have faith and love god in the 21st century, but if the person in my family closest to me is severely hurt, i know i wouldnt love god.

so i guess this kind of makes me question my love for him at all.

>>841636

Lol, it says He couldn't win a battle because of winnie the pooh iron. This board likes to make massive claims about the Bible when it's obviously never read it.

>>841641

Again, not really here to debate the extent of gods power.. we all know the bible is all over the place in many aspects.. but I thought we could all at least agree that the general story is that he is a literally the creator of heaven and earth.. i think if this is true, he has power to not hurt our family members if he wanted.

i know, "we cant understand his will, his plan" etc.. im just asking if you would still love him.. i know i wouldn't.

>>841642

>that he is a

he is * sorry typing too fast.. didnt think i would have to explain my question so much in so many different ways. is it hard to answer? maybe. not for me.

I mean, natural death is one thing, old age death.. after a long life of "learning" i get it.. kind of.

but im talking about a tragic putrid.. event, or accident, or just winnie the pooh horrific thing happens out of nowhere.

>>841632

> He couldn't win a battle because of winnie the pooh iron.

You misread that part he could've easily destroyed the iron chariots, but I think it was the person who was running away from the iron chariots and he couldn't pierce it not God.

One thing about the problem of evil is that it is not solved by rejecting God. The problem of evil is a human problem, not a Divine one. No God and suffering in the world stays the same, all that changes is an acquired vague `sense of mental consistency. This is a choice between apparent consistency and hope of salvation. I, for one, will always choose the latter.

The Lord has given, the Lord has taken, let the name of the Lord be praised

Anytime someone brings up the "problem of evil", I think I need to point a mirror in their face. It's a question only for people with no self-awareness or a high opinion of themselves (which is all atheists). And anyone posing as a Christian, but asking this stupid question, is a liar. Especially to themselves. The first condition to even becoming a Christian is to acknowledge the evil within oneself. You don't seek out a physician if you believe you're free of sickness.

>>841650

Dismissing the problem as illegitimate is bad apologetics. It doesnt help someone in extreme anguish.

>>841645

>the Bible actually means the opposite of what it says

I'm getting real tired of this.

“And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.”

‭‭Judges‬ ‭1:19‬ ‭

>>841649

what does this even mean? you didnt answer the question in the OP

>>841648

>>841650

>>841656

why is no one answering the question? I am OP btw.

>>841663

It means read Job

>>841664

I already addressed your question. Sometimes evil is unavoidable if you have a God who doesn't contradict Himself, which is worth it.

I wouldn't hate God as it wouldn't be his fault. It would be the fault of the fallen people who committed the act. I would still align myself with what is good and what is true and hate what is evil and false.

John 15:18-21:

>18If the world hate you, know ye, that it hath hated me before you. 19If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. 20Remember my word that I said to you: The servant is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you: if they have kept my word, they will keep yours also. 21But all these things they will do to you for my name's sake: because they know not him who sent me.

The biggest misconception is that if you a Christian/“good person,” then nothing bad will happen to you. Christ promised the opposite though. Expect horrible things to happen to you because the world and satan hates Him and you for following Him. Read about some of the horrible ways many saints have died or the terrible things they endured through their lifetime. Don’t fall for the trap of believing that nothing bad is supposed to ever happen to you or people you love.

>>841664

No one’s answering your question because of their spiritual weaknesses. People on this board do not know our Father in heaven.

This exact situation in your original post was one I struggled with personally for more than a decade. I couldn’t love God while not knowing the answer to this question you posted. I’ve told God many times I can not love Him if certain things happen to my loved ones.

Those certain things were the exact things your referring to. I decided to cling to Him as long as those “certain things” never happened to my loved ones. Yes, my love for God has conditions. Just like His love for us has conditions. He let me know who He is and why He lets those things happen to some people. I also used the words “I’m no one special”.

Till this day I accept that there are things that would make me lose my faith if they happen. I don’t feel the need to get into detail because since you’re OP is so eerily similar to my words then you know what those things are.

God understood my reasoning. In fact He appreciated it and cherished it. It showed Him that I’m paying attention to what I’m being taught about Him. He doesn’t like it when people say they love Him while they simultaneously believe that those things can just happen to their loved ones because He would just allow them to happen without a reason. Those things you mentioned are “punishments” not “trials”. God allows “trials” to the ones He loves. Never “punishments”. You can rest easy.

Those things have never occurred to a single soul in existence who wasn’t evil or who wasn’t ignoring a blatant danger surrounding them. Such things do not occur out of nowhere for God, and He is in full control of all forces in existence, and He shepherds the actions of free-willed individuals away from His loved ones if they are evil to the extent you are referencing. The Father has never allowed such evils to fall on a righteous person. Trials by evil people do reach the righteous at times but what your afraid of are not trials, they are destructions.

The anons on this board are uneducated about evil and good. God creates good, satan creates evil. God shepherds the evil satan plans and none of it ever reaches a righteous person without God seeing it before hand. Some fallout of evil may hit a righteous person, but because God shepherds the amounts, it will always be a tolerable amount of evil, not the potent form you are worried about.

You need to read Job carefully, you seem to lack a full grasp of what Job is going through and why. Christians on this board don’t read Job carefully. They use it as an excuse that God destroys the lives of righteous men. That is not what’s happening in Job. In that book Job’s life is being filtered of the unrighteous members of his family and the unrighteous people around him. God deals personally with all of His worshipers. God deals personally with all peoples. You’ll never get the answers you seek if you don’t read the Bible with a detective’s mind. Because I lack the ability to properly put my thoughts into words this is hard to simplify. Simplest I can put it is this, there are countless “Freudian Slips” in the Bible. You need to find/recognize these slips. The answers you seek are in there and hidden yet right there.

There are three rape accounts in the Bible. All three paint a picture of the type of people such things happen to. The cucked out nature of today’s Christians does not want to accept what those three accounts are teaching. What they are really teaching is something that can clear this subject up for you. And once you see God’s true nature and the reasons He allows certain thing you will be able to find peace about the subject. As well as other subjects, because once you know your Father in Heaven, you know what to be anxious about and what is a trial and what is something you are protected from supernaturally. It’ll take a while, your gonna need The Holy Spirit’s guidance when searching for the answers. But just like you I will not worship God if He allows certain things. I learned He never allows certain things to righteous people, and that means I can love Him genuinely, not blindly. Because He is a “Just and Holy” God, those that love Him blindly and those that love Him genuinely are both right to do so. But, God likes to show Himself to those that have self-respect, those that don’t say things like, “God! I will love you even if you do these horrible things to me!”

Would you want to be around people who say they love you but believe you can hurt them at any time for no reason? Would you not ask those same people why they love you if they think you will just hurt them at any given time, the most disgusting hurts? Would you not lose respect for such people and refuse to be around them? God is the same, or should I say, we think the same as God thinks.

>>841626

I believe in the Final Judgement, God will "close the book" so to speak on the story of Creation. It is at this point that God will reveal how he used all the good and all the evil men have done and repurposed it for the sake of His greater goodness, at which point, all of humanity will come to see God's goodness. I have faith in this and so I have faith that even if God allows bad things to happen to me, provided I do the good I can with my own life, then all is in accordance with God's great plan.

Ultimately, I know I don't know everything. I don't know the colour, shape and velocities of everything out there in space but I know He does so, keeping this fact in mind, I don't think there's anything wrong with submitting to God.

If you think it's cucked to accept God despite knowing He could allow something terrible to happen to your family then I think that means you've failed to internalise the reality of your situation as a Christian which is that you don't actually own anything. Your wife and children weren't made for you. God made them for Himself. God simply let you care for them as part of your growth towards Heaven. Jesus Himself even says in the Bible that you have to love Him more than your own father and mother and of course, God reveals in the Ten Commandments that one is to honor their father and mother. People already love the mothers and fathers and yet, God commands that, when loving Him, one goes even further then that. Are you being cucked when your wife abides by what's requested and loves God more than you? Your wife was never truly yours. The only one who can be said to truly own anything is the Almighty Himself.

It's only once you internalise that you own nothing that you can accept that yes, every day you have with the things you cherish is a gift that, as of yet, has not been taken away and so you should be grateful rather than take it as something basic. If it were just any other man to whom submission was not necessary then perhaps I could understand the sentiment but this is God we're talking about. The penalty for rejecting submission a mere human King in our fallen world is simply death in this life but the penalty of rejecting submission to Christ is a penalty only He can impose: eternal damnation in the next. I think you've just got to look inwards into your pride, consider the consequences of your disobedience and ask yourself: "Is my ego really worth it?". You can make this calculation. Ultimately, you can make the decision of whether or not the wound on your pride is really something deserving of retribution. You can decide that the wound isn't as important as your feelings would tell you and that's that.

To call submission to God "cucked" is to shame someone for the most natural thing: submission to one's Creator.

Here's a prayer I'd like to recommend. It's called the Litany of Humility. Do not worry, there's nothing relating to Mary in this prayer. I recommend praying it every morning and every night and then seeing how you are in a month.

https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/devotions/litany-of-humility-245

Video also related but not necessary. It's just on-topic.

>>841667

you didnt answer it though, thats ok

>>841669

hard to answer i guess

>>841673

thanks for your post.. thanks for writing all of that. unfortunately, it seems like you've spoken to god? i have yet to do this.

>>841680

hard to answer i know, still.

>>841694

To answer your question directly, since you couldn’t figure out my stance, I would still love God if this happened to me because I do not have the misconception that if I am Christian/“good,” then I will not suffer.

>>841626

I will answer your question sorry if I went off topic, but to answer it anon there is always going to be suffering and they are people who are going far far much worse than you are right now like nigerians being killed right now for what ever they believe none of this is God's fault is is mostly what man have became and how fallen and the state to we are in, they are tragedies all over the place because we are not living in a perfect world, but in a sinful world.

>>841664

My answer is yes. Do you have problems with inferring meaning?