70b258 No.836603
Why would anyone oppose abortion?
____________________________
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98fb80 No.836606
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70b258 No.836614
>>836606
>Thou shall not murder.
Is ridiculous on so many levels however lets entertain this.
What is murder?
https://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=1303
TL;DR
Killing is only murder if the government says its murder. If you disagree you can call the cops to arrest everyone in a abortion clinic since its murder.
Even you must understand that there is a difference between getting abortions and your child getting shot. in the legal department at least.
With self humiliation like
>Thou shall not murder
You can go and join the vegans in chanting
>meat is murder
Any questions?
>Thou shall not murder
Is so stupid it hurts it can be simplified to
>Obey the government!
Yet you do not obey the government. How self contradictory of you.
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70b258 No.836615
>>836606
>Thou shall not murder.
With the legal out of the way because its next to impossible to defend absolute crap like
>Thou shall not murder.
Exodus 20:13
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Exodus+20%3A13&version=KJV
> Thou shalt not kill
WHOPS!
Looks like this depends on your bible version.
Did you even check the bible you are using?
Now lets debunk more crap like the auto humiliating "Thou shalt not kill" literally no one can defend garbage like
> Thou shalt not kill
This is auto humiliating on so many levels.
Lets start with the most obvious.
Do you support the army? In like the concept of having any armies?
What do soldiers do?
They kill other humans! Now explain to me how magically you sporting armies is somehow OK if these people kill however killing fetuses/babies is not OK?
You literally can not.
And in the end we will get to:
>This killing is OK because the government says its OK
And this is the invention of the idea of murder, where murder is killing that the government says is illegal while normal killing is legal (I'm simplify manslaughter into this however lets go).
And you already demonstrated that you ignore what the government says is legal or is not legal.
However the fun does not stop there. Eating meat requires killing animals so is eating mean a sin for Christians?
How about plants? You need to kill a plant to eat it?
What does that even mean? It literally makes zero sense when god says "Thou shalt not kill" no one can defend this nonsense.
This is why other bible verses change it it "don't murder" yet murder is only illegal killing that the government says is illegal.
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bf2a70 No.836622
As a Catholic, I believe in the lectures given by Catholic Exorcist Fr. Ripperger and I believe he argues that one of the most critical things for us to develop whilst we're on Earth is our fidelity to grace i.e. we do whatever grace demands us to do at any point in time.
Fr. Ripperger argues that we humans were made to replace the angels in heaven and so it's important to have fidelity to grace so that we can take the position in heaven that we were meant to. Now, if you abort a child then yes, perhaps they go to heaven (the idea that they go to limbo is ultimately a theological speculation. Truthfully, the Church has no teaching on this matter) but you ultimately guarantee that they never take the place they were designed for. With fewer people attaining the fullness of their sainthood, Christ is forced to further prolong his return.
I believe you've made a mistake, arguing that governments are the only ones that get to define what murder is and relying on a modern dictionary. You're living in a world where Church and State have been separated. Consider the fact that there was a time where Church and State were together such as France before its revolution. People lived their lives in obedience to the Ten Commandments and their government was in obedience to God's laws. What do you suppose their definition of murder was then, in those circumstances? They too, would've believed that murder was an "unlawful killing" but their laws are God's laws and so how do they know when a killing was a murder? They had to determine whether or not it was something God would accept. "Murder" then can be rephrased as "unjust killing".
In light of this rephrasing, I'll allow you to reconsider the following questions:
Is it just to kill a wholly innocent person?
Is it just for a Christian nation to defend itself?
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60bc4a No.836629
>>836614
Authority comes only from God, not from government.
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33c806 No.836638
>>836614
Nobody cares about the legal definition of murder. To commit murder means to kill someone who is innocent and poses you no threat. Children are innocent, therefore ending their lives on purpose is murder unlike ending the life of a criminal like a homosexual which is not murder.
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910c23 No.836640
>>836622
>As a Catholic
Arguably the most absurd position.
Abort child confess away 0sin and you get to go to heaven.
This is what happens if you use game thinking or Homo economicus thinking to theology. Theology literally makes zero sense.
> limbo is ultimately a theological speculation
>theological speculation
Yes yes I think everyone knows that Vatican II Catholicism is insane and basically saying meaningless words.
However I like to know what limbo is exactly. Or what it was before Vatican II. Literally every entry on it obsesses how limbo is no longer canon n he RCC.
> Catholic Exorcist Fr. Ripperger
>he argues that one of the most critical things for us to develop whilst we're on Earth is our fidelity to grace i.e. we do whatever grace demands us to do at any point in time.
What meaningless collection of words. What does it even mean?
There is 100% chance to go to heaven if you are aborted and less then 100% if you are born, truly the ones aborted are going to heaven.
This is why you need to invent special rules to prevent this from happening since religious behavior makes no sense and if you believe in a afterlife you should behave totally differently. This abortion demonstration is one of countless others.
>Christ is forced to further prolong his return.
WTF. This is humerus (first time I encounter it) and literally inserted with no explanation.
>Consider the fact that there was a time where Church and State were together such as France before its revolution
Ah yes the good old times when the RCC robed everyone blind oppressed everyone and life was a living hell on earth thanks to christieanity.
I think some rounds of torturing for your heretical teachings from the RCC would change your mind on how good the good old times where.
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910c23 No.836642
>>836629
>Authority comes only from God, not from government.
To bad god never wrote anything about abortion.
Since god is OK with sacrificing humans to him I have no idea how you can oppose killing babies.
https://invidio.us/oQQmqFsFrHI
https://invidio.us/tEDaT9JREvI?list=PLD21026A43986A252
>Authority comes only from God, not from government.
Also we get to the good old:
<Obey me! Because invisible sky man talks to me!
Or more exactly
<Obey me! Because I'm only allowed to interpret these ancient myths that feature this invisible sky man character! OBEY!
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e5ce77 No.836646
>>836603
Abortion is one big step along the way to Cthulhu.
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28ba8c No.836647
>>836642
>To bad god never wrote anything about abortion.
He doesn't have to. The very fact that a fetus is created is evidence of His will. If left to the natural unfolding of His will a baby will be born. An abortion is human will imposed upon God's will and by that nature is sinful.
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910c23 No.836648
>>836638
>Nobody cares about the legal definition of murder
What a ignorant and self humiliating thing to write.
1) By definition you wanting to make your myths into laws would require you to implement them in some form of legal framework. Unless you want to have insane laws you should care about the legal system
2) Unless you argue that your morality should never be made into law and be synonyms with never enforced you have no point.
>To commit murder means to
Source for that … your defective and uneducated brain.
This is literally nowhere in the bible so I simply assume you made it up or repeat something some other idiot made up.
However lets continue this comedy of ignorant idiots humiliating themselves because
<muh Christ retard propaganda must be true.
> to kill someone who is innocent
Interesting theological question are children and the unborn innocent? Are we not born with original sin therefore by definition sinners and not innocent?
And look at that another theological absurdity/self contradiction.
There is a reason only idiots and the uneducated are Christians/Religious. If you actually study religion and think about theology considering any of it serious or not garbage becomes more and more impossible.
>unlike ending the life of a criminal like a homosexual
Cute yet I specifically mentioned soldiers(look its another christian trying to change the subject) so lets say that the other soldier is after confession(lets go with the RCC no idea what yo uare) so ZERO sin is on him. Did you commit murder if you kill another soldier of the enemy army who is in this state?
Give me your perspective on soldiers and armies anon.
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910c23 No.836649
>>836646
Christians support the death penalty, oppose abortion.
To crazy to believe.
Me
Pro death penalty.
Pro abortion.
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910c23 No.836650
>>836647
>He doesn't have to
I'm laughign right now.
So its basically something some human made up, excuse me extrapolated from something and thinks is what god wants.
Pericles comedy.
> If left to the natural unfolding of His will a baby will be born
Oh you are going further into the theological mine field.
> If left to the natural unfolding of His will a baby will be born
So do you oppose all medicine? For example if a baby would die without medial intervention is it not exactly like abortion since
> If left to the natural unfolding
The child would have died?
>is human will imposed upon God's will and by that nature is sinful.
interesting what about all medicine?
Once you start thinking about it all of it collapses.
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28ba8c No.836651
>>836650
>So its basically something some human made up
>Reproduction
>human made up
wew
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54fcc1 No.836652
>>836649
>Pro death penalty.
>Pro abortion.
What crime has a baby committed to deserve death?
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910c23 No.836654
>>836652
>What crime has a baby committed to deserve death?
Original sin.
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910c23 No.836656
>>836651
>>Reproduction
>>human made up
>wew
I was talking about the interpretation 40 IQ man.
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49a1d1 No.836666
>Why would anyone oppose abortion?
>reddit spacing
You're jewish
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54fcc1 No.836667
>>836654
Firstly, the punishment for original sin is already death, that's why we die. The message of Christianity is we can gain eternal life through Jesus Christ.
>For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Romans 6:23
Is your view that there's no salvation? If so, this contradicts Christian doctrine.
Secondly, at what point in the gestation period does the baby commit the crime of original sin that deserves the death penalty in your view? The Christian view is that original sin is a state man has fallen into, not that each individual person commits original sin in the womb.
Thirdly, in law there are cases of diminished responsibility where the defendant doesn't, or can't, know they've committed a crime. A baby can't know whether they've committed a crime. Therefore your assertion all babies deserve the death penalty is absurd on the face of it.
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c8d91d No.836668
70b258
Because God isn't stupid. Trying to play tricks and finding loopholes is a good route to hell.
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bebf8b No.836671
Life begins at conception. Simple as.
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910c23 No.836672
>>836667
>Secondly, at what point in the gestation period does the baby commit the crime of original sin that deserves the death penalty in your view?
The nano second its born with original sin.
>the punishment for original sin is already death
Exactly and its getting killed in abortion. What is your point exactly?
>Thirdly, in law there are cases of diminished responsibility where the defendant doesn't
What law? Who of you did say he does not give a s— about real life government law? Pick your poison.
>The Christian view is that original sin is a state man has fallen into, not that each individual person commits original sin in the womb.
And these apologetic prove nothing, meaningless sophistry at best.
Nice posting christian chan with the christian hat.
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910c23 No.836673
>>836665
>Because God's isn't stupid. Trying to play tricks and finding loopholes is a good route to hell.
>>836668
>Because God isn't stupid. Trying to play tricks and finding loopholes is a good route to hell.
Where in the bible does it say that.
You are making things up christian.
Also even if I grant you this your emotions make zero sense.
for example if atheists abort their babies why are you not celebrating?
<Yes another atheist abortion!
<these children would be born into atheism and have a 99% chance to die atheists and go to hell.
<Now that they are aborted they are safely in heaven, if only all atheists aborted their babies to heaven.
Your behaviors make no sense whatsoever.
There is no way to make sense of what you do.
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79b3ce No.836680
>>836673
'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'
You assume that atheists live rent free in my head like Christians do in yours for me to be worrying what atheists are doing.
Don't know where you got the idea aborted babies go to heaven. The only person who knows and decides that is God.
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54fcc1 No.836681
>>836672
>The nano second its born with original sin.
This contradicts the Christian position. Original sin is a state of nature man has fallen into, it isn't administered at the point of birth.
>Exactly and its getting killed in abortion. What is your point exactly?
It follows you believe the legal jurisdiction of the courts should extend to include states of nature like original sin? How do you imagine prosecuting animals for following their instincts? How will you seek justice from natural events in a fallen world? It's impossible.
>What law? Who of you did say he does not give a s— about real life government law?
I haven't made that argument. You can see who posted what by their ID.
>And these apologetic prove nothing, meaningless sophistry at best.
This isn't apologetics, this is fundamentals. The reason you believe all babies deserve the death penalty is because you seriously misunderstand the Christian position on original sin, death, and salvation. The Christian understanding is that death is an unnatural event, and was only introduced into the world by the Fall.
It's outside the jurisdiction of man to administer justice for the state of sin we are conceived in. We are commanded to be stewards of nature and not to second guess what God intends. We can only prosecute crimes within our own jurisdiction, like theft or murder. Being born isn't a crime.
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60bc4a No.836803
>>836642
Authority is not based on force but on reliability. Once it needs to be enforced, it was already rejected.
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952e1e No.836826
Exodus 21:22-25
This should be all that’s needed to scripturally prove abortion is murder.
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e0df84 No.837119
>>836603
There's an infinite amount of reasons. Even the most unlikely, at first glance.
Just take these stupid racial politics going on around right now: Outlawing abortion would solve that too. Blacks make up around 13% of the population or so. Yet blacks also make up 50% of all abortions. And upwards to 75% to 80% in large cities like NYC. It's very strange for such a small minority to suffer the brunt of infant death rates. And because of this, they are kept in a perpetual state of minority status. They do not grow as a people and get to participate as others do. On top of all of this, the lopsided "3 strikes laws" since the 90s also cause the bulk of long term incarcerations of black males from minor crimes. And their children who grow up without these dads lack direction as well, and end up living dejected, degrading lives of crime themselves. In short, it all amounts to mass destruction of their families, on top of the systematic liquidation of black infants. One would be bad enough, but they can't even make up for the loss of births or prison sentences by alleviating the one. They have to suffer both of them. The net result is widespread misery and agitation - and with next to zero bargaining power in their population to ever change it.
You know what could have changed it? Population numbers. Demographics are destiny. No one would have to even do anything special. There would simply be enough blacks in the population that their concerns would matter and positive changes would come to their communities. All they have are democrats who promise things, but ignore them once they get their votes
(and are also responsible for the very abortion laws that kill them). Or Republicans too stupid to realize any of this and don't work with or promise any changes at all.
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