No.9915 [View All]
I really hate his appearance in The Clone Wars. He works best as a silent assassin type and they basically took all that away in the show. Why the hell did Lucas even demand they bring him back?
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No.16959
>>10115
You're stupid then.
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No.16960
>>16941
This is objectively the right opinion. Him coming back to life adds nothing to the franchise and cheapens everything.
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No.16963
>>16960
Agreed. His whole "he's back" storyline was clearly just a cheap gimmick to drum up ratings and bring in viewers who like cheap cameos. That, and Filoni had a ridiculous hard on for the Old Wounds comic and wanted to make it canon. He even fucking adapted it into Rebels. It was just a "what if" storyline from the Infinites storyline for fuck's sake.
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No.17001
I'm as big of a Maul fan as you could generally get (read every single thing related to him in the EU) and honestly, the TCW treatment was not bad at all. I didn't ask for it, but the damage was done, they did it, they brought him back to life and how did it go? Well it could have gone a lot worse. They handled his mentally corrupt state believably when he was in that lair with those spider legs, it was all very appropriate and not any less absurd than Anakin having a padawan. Luceno smoothly retconned his Dathomir background in Plagueis and everything kind of clicked back into place. Did they do it for the views? Of course they did, it was an expensive show and the whole idea behind TCW post-mortem was clearly about being as outrageous as possible and to try and find stuff to explore that hadn't been done in the comics yet (i.e Padme episodes). My only wish is that we would have gotten a proper EU ending for Mauls clone wars arc, but unless you're going to disregard TCW altogether (which even a lot of eu fans wouldn't dream of) we'll just have to use Old Wounds. At least it's not as cheesy as his ending in Rebels. I like how gritty and impersonal Old Wounds actually is, it's somehow fitting for Maul, especially after his long and funny clone wars drama. I like how Owen puts him down like an animal, it's so unceremonious. And yes, Maul kind of felt like a different person after being brought back to life, but I unironically blame the voice actor for this. Just go back and compare Peter Serafinowicz's and Sam Witwer's voice acting for Maul, they don't match up at all. Serafinowicz sounds like a stone cold killer like Darth Maul should. It's the same thing how Anakin seems very quippy in TCW, but then you think to yourself "What if this were live action and what if Hayden handled this scene".. But I get it, it's probably a stylistic thing. At least we can be sure that this wasn't a case of them misunderstanding Maul as a character. If you read Maul: Lockdown (a pre-tpm novel released after TCW), you'll find he's written just like in all the other old TPM-era novels like Shadow Hunter. This reinforces what TCW shows you; that this version of maul is really just a heavily corrupt state of his former self. He's a mad dog. A has-been. He has no happy ending, because he's essentially zombie that's been transported into the wrong timeline. I think there's some value in all this, in terms of pure craziness. I'm honestly glad they handled it the way they did.
>>16963
>Filoni had a ridiculous hard on for the Old Wounds
This is what I don't get, because I thought it was George that actually suggested they bring him back (and I'm saying this as a Lucas fan). On top of that, I don't remember Filoni even bothering to credit Old Wounds or the EU at all when they first conceived his TCW appearance. It was just one of the many things that was pissing me off about Filoni, him pretending to be an EU pro even though he was acting very dismissive toward it.
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No.17002
>>17001
>>16963
Did Rebels actually adapt Old Wounds? I can only imagine how hammy they must've set that up considering the other meh deaths in that series.
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No.17003
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>17002
>Did Rebels actually adapt Old Wounds?
they used a little bit of it. basically, maul discovers kenobi is on tatooine and goes after him. they fight in the desert at night, and ben kills him. no uncle owen, and the spider legs were removed back in the clone wars.
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No.17012
>>17003
Wow, that was terrible. I've heard people describe this as a great moment before, how is it possible to have such shit taste?
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No.17015
>>17003
Wow, that ending was sappy as fuck.
>Obi-Wan rests Maul's head on his lap
I don't even
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No.17017
>>17012
>how is it possible to have such shit taste
easily impressed retards that don't know about Dark Times or any post-rots EU.
I'm marathoning rebels right now as I'm typing this and I can tell you it is fucking BORING as shit. It's too offensive to be considered canon and not offensive enough to hold your attention. I just want to get it over with since it's the only form of epilogue out there for TCW (which I do actually like in retrospect). Does anyone know if the Ahsoka novel fits into the EU?
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No.17035
>>9915
I read somebody yesterday talking about how George Lucas genuinely listened to his fans and gave them what they wanted, in the context of Yoda going ham with a lightsaber something he had actually been told (by some) they wanted to see, so it's conceivable that he took the "fan consensus" that Maul was underused to heart and elected to bring him back the only way it was feasible to do so: in a cartoon.
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No.17089
>>17017
>Does anyone know if the Ahsoka novel fits into the EU
i'd disregard it, it kills off ventress in a sappy way.
>>17035
don't forget solo fully confirmed his return, they gave him the robot legs and all.
>>17012
>>17015
they circlejerk to it because of the build-up prior to the episode itself. it's the arc of maul coming to a close (despite literally being a 3 second fight) and it gives his character some form of closure, provided you just ignore most of tcw.
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No.17106
>>17089
>some form of closure
He gets killed by the same guy who already killed him decades ago. Making his entire "rebirth" totally and utterly pointless. It's very possibly the worst way they could have ended his story. There was no reason to ever bring him back to life, they could have just told stories about him set Pre-Phantom.
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No.17112
>>17089
>i'd disregard it, it kills off ventress in a sappy way.
haha I read Dark Disciple years ago and I remember Ventress dying in that book. Maybe it was Vos that died instead, I don't know anymore.
>>17106
the pre-phantom stories of Maul that are out there are pretty good. Like, really cinematic even though they're novels. Maul: Lockdown was a real page-turner for me. What I like about the Maul novels too is that they all connect to something else (other books, short stories etc) they work really well for chronological reading. In fact, I'd say the pre-tpm era of the EU is incredibly underrated, particularily thanks to Lucenos autism with Plagueis. At the very least, I don't think we were necessarily lacking decent pre-tpm Maul adventures. He had a pretty good run. The only real fuckup about Mauls return for me is that he dies in a non-canon disney show (and like most would agree it's a shitty death)
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No.17129
>Maul returns
The whole premise is flawed. He was bisected and fell in a giant chasm. Nobody survives that, even for a space magical knights movie that is too stretch the suspension of disbelief too much. He would be dead before hitting the bottom. What sense makes Maul surviving that and 3 jedi "masters" dying by superficial cuts or even a stabbing (Which were much more feasible to someone survive)?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgRLAI02Tow
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No.17131
>>17129
Which is why I'm convinced Rian Johnson is going to bring back Luke and Han as cyborgs in the next trilogy, so he can ruin them further.
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No.17132
>>17129
And they keep acting like only his legs were cut off. Guy lost half his fucking digestive system and then just put on a pair of robo-scorpion legs from a junkyard. Even if the whole "his hate kept him alive" reasoning is somewhat valid, there's a limit to how far you can take such a bullshit explanation. Sure, bisecting would kill most instantly, and I don't doubt a master sith lord could keep himself going on hate-fueled sith power alone for at least a day or two, but he not only survived, but he was able to grab onto an air vent, make his way into a trash compactor, survive, and then travel halfway across the galaxy, all the way to the outer rim no less, get dumped on a hazardous junkyard planet several days later, found a fucking derelict robot spider torso that only gave him the ability to walk but apparently no mention of it serving as a substitute for his missing organs, and to top it all off, just barely living without food and water for many years and subsisting mostly on hate-fueled force power. Even if I were to take Disney and TCW's explanation seriously, this is something I'd expect from a very aged, wizened and very powerful sith lord that either modified himself through sith alchemy or had years of dark sagely training in solitude to master this kind of survival bullshit specifically, but Maul didn't and he was nothing more than a living killing machine trained only to hunt down and kill jedi with very little hint of higher spiritual awareness or intelligence, since it was just battle after battle. Also in Disney's canon he was apparently born with tattoos.
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No.17153
>>17112
>The only real fuckup about Mauls return for me is that he dies in a non-canon disney show
The fuckup was bringing back to life. There is objectively no reason to do so.
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No.17154
>>17129
Emperor is still alive, boyo, if Maul can survive having no anus, and Phasma can survive being on an exploding planet, then Sheev is definitely still alive. Death no longer exists in Star Wars, everyone is alive.
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No.17167
>There is objectively no reason to do so.
No there wasn't, but what else is TCW good for? the book was pretty much nearly closed on the original clone wars timeline by the time they made the show. TCWs biggest gimmick is the novelty of its outrageousness while padding the 2-3 year war to the brim with additional conflicts. Retcons like Barriss Offee being a terrorist all of a sudden or Quinlan Voss' personality change feel more offensive to me than robo-Maul or the zillo beast. I just feel like they should have commited themselves to finishing what they started with the show and not making the audience watch a crappy low budget disney follow-up.
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No.17202
>>17132
>he was able to grab onto an air vent, make his way into a trash compactor
Just to add to this pile of bullshit, what exactly are air vents and trash compactors doing in a completely automated mineshaft for extracting plasma?
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No.17204
>>17202
No reasons given. It was just there.
>through his hate and will to survive, Maul used the Force to grab an air vent as he was tumbling down the reactor shaft
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No.17225
>>17154
sheev fell into the power source of the death star, he was vaporized.
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No.17226
>>17132
>Also in Disney's canon he was apparently born with tattoos
wow, nobody bothered to read up on pre-sale iridonians or dathomiri?
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No.17232
>>17132
>>17226
nah
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Maul
the canon page shows he wasn't born with tattoos, they were given to him.
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No.17233
>>17225
If Phasma can survive the Hoth Star going kaboom I'm sure Sheev can handle a few radiation burns.
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No.17250
>>17225
And Maul got sliced in half then fell into the exact same thing that Sheev did, but they ignored that fact so Sheev being far more powerful than a chump like Maul is obviously still alive.
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No.17253
>>17225
>>17154
>Ep IX plot twist will reveal that Snoke and Sheev are the same person
How likely is this scenario?
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No.17258
>>10115
>Kenobi wasn't interested in killing Maul or having a rematch with him in any way
>Maul just had to be slain because he would have blabbed about Luke to the Empire
>it was literally nothingpersonnable.jpg
Now that's just a kick in the teeth. As far as shadow play casualties going, being murdered for accidentally learning crucial information is pretty low on the totem pole.
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No.17318
>>17017
>I just want to get it over with since it's the only form of epilogue out there for TCW
…
That's like saying The Farce Awakens is a continuation of return of the jedi
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No.17323
>>17318
well, a "non-canon/what if?/infinities" epilogue then
It's not that I'm a total masochist either, considering TFA is the only nucanon film I've seen. I just want to check if there's anything I can extract from Rebels due its loose connection to TCW. Sort of the same reason I read Dark Disciple–I just want to know what they were thinking (even if I don't like it or consider it canon). TLJ and all this other nonsense, I really have no reason to investigate.
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No.17386
>>17233
phasma was picked up by an imperial shuttle or some shit, i forget the official statement, rian johnson also made her the kenny of star wars, in that she always escapes seemingly impossible situations
>>17250
maul didn't fall into a nuclear power plant
>>17253
it would be better than the stupid snoke alien species that hung out on the edge of the unknown regions. apparently the background info made for snoke in 7 was retconned by rian.
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No.17431
>>13643
>>13643
>Come to think of it, R2 knew a lot of things
B4 the mind wipe at the end of episode 3 for him and golden boi
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No.17432
>>17431
The mind wipe was only for 3PO. R2D2 never had a memory wipe
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No.17433
>>17432
i'm like 95% sure it was "make sure to wipe these two droids"
>actually look it up
"and wipe the protocol droid"
fucking bearstein all over again
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No.17454
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No.17455
>>17433
>>17454
I don't know, I've always remembered that it was 3PO. Maybe I'm a native to this reality.
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No.17470
>>17433
you're retarded, it's always been c3po that got the wipe. r2 never got a wipe after he left the queen's service. there was a story, dark horse comic i believe, where r2 played a recording of anakin choking padme to luke.
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No.23893
>Darth Maul surviving after Episode 1
That story is retarded and the fact that it's been picked up as nu-canon is even more brain dead.
Storytiming some pre-TCW Maul backstory.
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No.23896
>>23893
I miss the days when his backstory was simple, he was just a Zabrak who was taken on by Sidious to be used as a tool for the dark side. None of the Dathomir stuff or his evil brother or him having robolegs. Even Darth Plagueis is guilty of using that shitty retconned backstory. Fuck Filoni.
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No.23899
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No.23902
>>23893
>>23896
>>23899
Agree 100%, him surviving his death actually fucks up the theme of Palpatine's apprentices being disposable tools. Maul and Dooku dying like dogs is important set-up for Return of the Jedi when Sheev tells Luke to kill Vader. We know then that Sheev is serious, he never valued Vader for anything more than a puppet.
Fortunately, the CGI show doesn't add up with the actual movies or the superior parts of the EU so it's easy to disregard. For me, the only movies and cartoons that are canon are the 6 Lucas films, and then the Genndy Clone Wars series. Thematically they all blend together perfectly, while everything from the Mouse and Filloni feels like fanfiction, even when Filloni was working for Lucas his work still felt like fanfiction.
Maul was sliced and diced, and then he was splattered when he hit the bottom. If Obi Wan did ever fight a specter of Maul on Tattoine, it was nothing more than the physical manifestation of his own doubts and demons, perhaps a living embodiment of the dark side which resided within him. A desert hermit fighting visions like Saint Anthony is far more interesting to me than the schlock that Rebels gave us. Maul coming back to life serves literally zero function when it comes to storytelling, he adds nothing and subtracts quite a bit.
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No.23933
>>23893
What species is Silus?
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No.23935
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No.23955
>>23902
>him surviving his death actually fucks up the theme of Palpatine's apprentices being disposable tools
His resurrection doesn't do anything of the sort. The way he was treated and used doesn't interact with his, for lack of a better term, hateful immortality. From what I recall, Sideous just wanted him dead when he realized he was still living anyhow so that only serves to support the presupposition that Sideous sees everyone as tools of convenience, instead of undermining it as you've asserted.
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No.23957
>>23955
So what does his resurrection add to the story? What's good about it?
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No.24398
>>23902
Perhaps we can have a Separatist version of Old Wounds. A short story where an older Obi-Wan, egged on by the spirit of Qui-Gon must confront a vision of the man who killed his master in the desolate sands of Tatooine.
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No.24401
>>24398
I would love to write a story about Obi Wan on Tatooine in the vein of the Temptations of St. Antony by Flaubert. There's so much space for interesting storytelling and character exploration with that premise.
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No.24453
>>24401
I'd love to read it, anon! Seeing as there is a push by some, myself included to build upon the EU with a Separatist fanon, I think it's a good place to focus time and effort into.
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No.24635
>>13696
>TCW show began in 2008
>over 10 years ago now
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No.24637
>>13696
TCW was always terrible. Takes a massive diarrhoea dump continuity and established characters, just so Dave could do his waifu-centric CGI show.
Say what you will about the old true EU, but it never ruined continity and characters like TCW did.
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