/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

Those who reject the teachings and commands of our Lord and our God really don't need anything, do they?

Jesus gave you a church, you reject it.

Jesus gave the apostles His divine power to forgive your sins, you reject it.

You're done. Have a nice mortal life cuz eternity is lost to you.

We are fallen so corruption is a given, there will never be an utopia church on earth.

The very first leader denied Christ 3 times and fled from the crucifiction.

Then he was ashamed of being seen eating with gentiles even after he himself had instituted through his God given dream that the gentiles were to be brought into the church and that there are no unclean foods.

And he probably did more blunders which arent written.

>>848923

> Those who reject the teachings and commands of our Lord and our God really don't need anything, do they?

How exactly do you infer this from my post?

> Jesus gave you a church, you reject it.

Jesus gave us his teachings not a dogma, tradition, corrupted bishops/popes, contrary to heart of the Teachings.

Will you tell me without hesitation that Jesus would condone or would have been happy with the Catholic churches history, done under his Name?

>>848926

The church doesnt bring Salvation but Christ does. Its simple as.

>>848929

You can't save yourself. You need the power of Jesus our Lord. That's why Jesus established a Church. If you won't accept the narrow path to salvation that the Lord so graciously has given you through his great sacrifice and arrogantly believe you can do it yourself, you're a lost soul.

I know you don't want to, but you have to go to a real Mass.

>>848928

Another Sola scriptura false believer. Do you really think Jesus gave us a Church in vain? That Jesus was just muttering or talking to himself?

>>848932

>Do you really think Jesus gave us a Church in vain?

We excommunicated Mensurius and Caecilian, so no the church has indeed continued without catholicism.

>>848931

>You can't save yourself. You need the power of Jesus our Lord. That's why Jesus established a Church.

Yes exactly. Become a baptist. Start believing the Bible. No need to have anything to do with the false church that was created by Constantine.

>>848917

Just join the primitive church, OP. We still exist just as in the early years before state church even began.

>>848923

>You're done. Have a nice mortal life cuz eternity is lost to you.

Can you honestly imagine one of your church fathers saying something like that?

>>848946

They do it all the time. You either accept Jesus as Lord and follow his instructions, or you're damned. Our Lord gave us a Church, and didn't say we could start our own. Sorry, I really can't sugar coat that for you as the Protestants do.

>>848951

Eternity is lost to OP because he dared question the Roman Catholic Church? I don't recall questioning the Church being an unpardonable sin. A loving Christian who genuinely believed that the Roman Catholic Church is the one true church would attempt to explain why this is the case. If you just respond to everyone who has questions about the church with "ur going to hell", no one is ever going to convert. That isn't fruitful behavior.

>>848946

Welcome to imageboards I guess.

>>848917

>Can the teaching of Christ ever be free from dogma and the corruption of Men (religion, traditions etc).

Religion and tradition doesn't necessarily mean corrupted

>Can't we just hold our faith in Christ, live Christ-like, and through Him gain the mercy and forgiveness from the Father?

If by "just" you mean "merely", no you have further obligations by God, like missions or observing the ordinances

>Do we need religious middle-men interpreting the Word of God?

The correct role of a preacher is to help you understand what the text is saying itself. In a word " expositing"

>Is it enough to read the Word of God and take into to heart and practice it in our daily lives?

Not forsaking of the assembling of yourselves together

>Did Jesus really intend for the development of RCC and its vile histories of corruption?

God is honored through shutting up corrupt churches like the rcc just like he was through the Pharisees

>Is the heart of the teachings enough to bring us to Salvation?

Yes, and the bible is perspicuous

>Do we need men in fancy dresses and charismatic pastors to reach feel the love of Christ?

These things are only harmful

>Basically I'm looking for minimal Christianity, as is and practiced by early followers of Christ before the Council of Nicea.

That's called handicapping yourself

Why dont you just read the Nicene creed, read scripture, then decide if the Nicene creed is orthodox (it is)

>Anything after the Council of Jerusalem seems dirtied by man

Anything after the council of Jerusalem is or isn't Orthodox based on what it says relative to the bible.

Most of us accept the three creeds and four councils.

Thanks for reading my opinion. Your objectives would get along well with a conservative baptist church.

>>848917

You don't need minimal christianity, you need the one true church that was founded by Christ, the Catholic Church.

>>848984

This is great. I'm sure this will make Catholics look very smart. I'm certain many Protestants were persuaded.

>>848989

lel

>>848989

It wouldn't matter. I could go into the history of the early church father's recognizing non-explicit aspects of the faith that emerged from a time before the bible was complied and it's canon set in stone, like the aspect of the Trinity and the supersubstantive bread of the Eucharist. I could go into detail on how Mary truly is the Queen Mother of God, as she is the redemptive Eve and, being the Mother of God, makes her co-regent with Christ, the King of the New Israel. I could also mention how the office of the Pope is tied to the Prime Minister of the Kingdom of Israel, with the symbol of the keys of the kingdom passing into his hands, i.e. Simon Peter, giving him the authority to rule over the church until the King (Christ) returns, passing along his authority with his death or resignation. I could talk about the theological importance of the sacraments, how much of the practice of their usage predates the new testament and is in fact only strengthened by the new testament, on how the only flesh and blood that saves us is the body and blood of Christ and without it we cannot be saved. I could go into the history of the church facing the persecutions of the romans and Jews who felt christians were a dangerous cannibalistic cult, and how even after they had established themselves as a legitimate religion, they were constantly having to battle one heresy or another that threatened to tear the church apart over one misunderstanding or another, many tied to the improper reading if scripture and leading to confusion (this should sound familiar to any Protestant whose been to different denominations or even non-denominational churches, they don't always agree with one another on the interpretation of passages).

inb4 tl;dr muh Mary muh Pope muh kjv

>>849006

Yes what a list of presuppositions

If it doesn't matter why post at all? Or why not post somewhere else like a papist board?

>>849006

I don't think Roman Catholics have much right to complain about persecution after what they did to Protestants.

>>848989

The problem with flags is that people abuse them to s— post.

>>848928

>Whatever you bind on Earth will be bind in Heaven

>Jesus did not give us a church

If you read the gospels without the prejudices of 21st century, you will see that he did. You're right in trying to stay to the teaching of Christ, but his teaching is the church.

>>849483

Already answered, see >>848933

>>849008

the percution was FAR lighter than under Protestants. The Spanish inquisition killed 5000 people over a period of 350 years, MOST of whom were NOT killed by the Church, but by civil authorities. Protestants, however, killed about 100,000+ in the are time frain. also the Protestants were BIG on witch hunts, while the Church thought true witches were very rare, and that most accusations were mere superstition.

>>849493

>Protestants, however, killed about 100,000+ in the are time frain (sic)

what are you referring to?

>>848917

No. Proper worship of God has always been complex from the OT to the Orthodox Church today which is a continuation of the OT liturgy. That's how God wants it or he wouldn't have set it up this way from the earliest days. The type of minimalist Christianity you're talking about is only acceptable if you don't have any other option.

>>849507

So EOs are judaizers, got it

>>849515

Trolling is a sin

>>849507

>The type of minimalist Christianity you're talking about is only acceptable if you don't have any other option.

What do you mean here by minimalist? You mean not obeying two or three different masters at the same time but only following one? not dealing with those who set themselves up as intermediaries for God that have no real claim to it at all while deposing Christ?

>That's how God wants it or he wouldn't have set it up this way from the earliest days.

Read the book of Hebrews. Those were all shadows of heavenly things meant to signal the future appearance of the Messiah. And Christ, the one mediator between God and man, is the mediator of a better covenant made upon better promises. Hebrews viii. It debunks the things you are talking about. The only way you can get out of it is by pretending it is complex and hard to understand. It is clearer than day in its statements on this matter, Christ is the mediator between God and man - God is not the author of confusion, while the commentaries you rely on and seek to make others to (though you can never nail down what they are) are obtuse, fallible and self-contradictory, the exact thing I often see men accuse the Bible of.

>>848989

>I'm certain many Protestants were persuaded.

Protestants are literally hell bent on sin. All protestants go to hell. I can't "convince" anyone. What I do is pray they wise up, because faith and grace are gifts from God. Everything in this world comes from our Lord.

>>849551

I can't imagine being this obsessed

>>848934

>We still exist just as in the early years before state church even began.

Wrong. Your church is founded on The Bible and The Bible didn't exist until 393 AD or at least until Saint Athenasius compiled his reading list that would later become The New Testament.

>>849556

You realize, I hope, that the 27 books of New Testament were written before 393 AD.