/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

Isn't this the sort of thing you should already know or are you just coming over from /islam/ to pick a fight?

>>774530

I'd recommend St. Aquinas' Summa Contra Gentile. There's a section dedicated to refuting Islam.

>lie of Islam.

Well, private revelations are always fishy to me. Contrast that to Christianity, where everything was "out in the open", so to speak, i.e. there are witnesses to what happened.

I could go on for a long time, but I need specifics.

>>774530

I saw a good book chart a while ago on this board that had books related to the Trinity in it's islam section, there were sections for judaism, atheism, and paganism as well. I don't know where it is though.

>>774555

>there are witnesses to what happened

Who witnessed Jesus' temptation in the desert?

>>774555

>Well, private revelations are always fishy to me. Contrast that to Christianity, where everything was "out in the open", so to speak, i.e. there are witnesses to what happened.

This, and especially where all the miracles muhammad supposedly did were recorded by hadiths, which are common sayings attributed to him that were collected 200 years or more after his death, and the only sources for those sayings were the people who compiled them, and not the people they compiled them from, so any myth about muhammad in an area could make it into a hadith. The other miracle frequently claimed by muslims is the quran itself and that its supposedly impossible for a mortal of making anything like it, but what constitutes anything like it is extremely vague.

>>774650

Because that's really the most important part right?

Let's forget the miracles and the resurrection witnessed by hundreds.

>>774661

I'm just sayin'. There ain't always a witness. Nobody witnessed Moses getting the commandments and that's pretty important.

>>774662

Except all the tenets of Islam are based on the private revelations of Muhammad and no one witness his miracles if there were any at all.

>>774662

And we are just saying that those are not crucial parts. We do not claim taht literally every single event happened with a crowd around, but the apostles and manyothers were personal witnesses to the most important, that is the fulfillment of prophecies, the miracles, the ressurection etc.

The same applies to the OT. People witnessed Moses doing plenty of miracles, and other public things that mark them as prophets.

>>774530

>sources for the Trinity

Biblical sources that he won't accept. I'm really not sure what kind of debate you want to have.

>>774773

>Christ's miracles

Muslims accept a bunch of those. Not the ressurection, tho.

>>774530

Point out to him that Islam teaches that Allah is incapable of changing and that he talked to Mohammad. Then ask who he was talking to before creation. This is usually enough to at least get a good conversation going.

Beware: He might flip back and forth between Sunni and Shia and claim only the other one teaches that Allah is unchanging.

Also note that the Muslim views this as polytheism. Make sure to explain to him that the trinity is not three distinct beings but rather three persons in one being.

>>774530

whats the point of the debate, is he open to being converted?

>>774658

>impossible for a mortal of making anything like it, but what constitutes anything like it is extremely vague.

Could you expound on this point, anon?

>>775063

Basically, the writers of the quran challenged anyone to write anything like it, with the implication that its supposed poetical genius is proof of it coming from God. I've never come across a good explanation why the quran was poetically impressive.

>>775144

The Quran has grammatical errors and there have been plenty of better poems written.

>>774996

>Point out to him that Islam teaches that Allah is incapable of changing and that he talked to Mohammad.

Allah never talked to Mohammed, not even once. Allah talked directly to Moses and Abraham and everyone but not Momo lol, he always had to send Jibril the delivery boy.

>>775144

Someone told me that it sound very beautiful, like a song, but only in Arabic.

>>775513

Tales of the beauty of the Qu'ran were wildly exxagerated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oB14FKhqDwA