/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

This is what happens when you treat Christianity like some man-made ideology.

>I like many aspects of Gnosticism (I.e. reincarnation, pacifism, vegetarianism)

You sound like a retarded hippie, OP. Maybe you should spend more time studying theology and the teaching of the Chur h instead of thinking about "vibrations and energy and stuff dude weed lmao"

>I like many aspects of Gnosticism (I.e. reincarnation, pacifism, vegetarianism)

>reincarnation

Who in the hell would want to live in this world again?

>vegetarianism

GAAAAYYYYY!

>>668827

>>668826

Right, because that is the most important part of my post.

Why do I even bother coming here? The people here are not at all helpful or charitable. I’m deleting this thread if no one is willing to give me helpful advice. winnie the pooh you all.

>>668823

Anon, now everything in scripture is supposed to be historic fact. Much of it is parable, metaphor, poetry and etc. Of course you don't understand it yourself, because nobody really understands it all by themselves. If you have questions, then look to reputed Christian scholars and priests who can answer them in whatever fields they specialize.

Like just recently I still had doubts about Abraham's line and Exodus. Then an anon old me about the doc Patterns of Evidence: The Exodus. Set me back on the path again.

>>668835

Thanks for the advice. You were very helpful and respectful. And you two twats (i.e. >>668826 >>668827) should take lessons from him! Is this how you guys deal with everyone who has doubts and questions? Get some social skills, please.

>>668823

>Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

>And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

These verses are the ones that make me, a lukewarm Christian (basically Jeffersonian, I love the philosophy of Christ but can't bring myself to have faith) fear meeting Jesus more than anything. Something tells me you might learn from them, OP.

>>668823

For this, you have to research and come to your own conclusions.

Believe me, I know appearances of other faiths are very tempting, and this coming from a man who routinely cycles between belief and non-belief. Things like aesthetics, at times, can do most of the work of conversion for the faith.

My best word of advice on your problems with certain, let's just say, less believable Christian teachings is that God speaks in parables, where even though they aren't true where they happened, they are true that in the messages they convey are completely true.

Nevertheless, I hope you find your faith, whatever it is (even though I hope you return to the church).

>>668839

you skiped the middle verse man. That proves if you believe you need works you go to hell.

>>668839

I don't get what about that verse is so bad, He hates hypocrisy.

When I hear that verse I think of Joel Osteen burning in hell. I don't see what's wrong with that.

Do you have a solid foundation for belief in God, first off? If no then you need to work on that before approaching the bible and committing yourself to Jesus, imo. Once you're solid in faith in God as he's classically been conceived and how the other conceptions of God/the ultimate reality are deficient then the incredulous bible stories you mention become incredible and credible due to the possibility of miracles.

>>668823

Basically, you don't need to believe manna fell from heaven or a world flood happened to be a Christian. See >>668851

Basically you have think like a storyteller and not like a scientist, the people who wrote the Bible didn't have science. This isn't to say that for a Christian, that the sciences can't be a new sort-of retelling of the story of the Logos. This is why physicists tend to have interesting spiritual ideas even when they are not Christian.

>>668854

Simply throwing out part of scripture or pretending it didn't happen because modern "scholars" want to interpret it that way isn't Christian. Christ taught that those events truly happened, and contradicting Him is not of God.

>>668853

>Do you have a solid foundation for belief in God, first off?

To be honest, I’m not sure. I “converted” back in 2013, but that was solely due to weird things happening to me during the summer. I was under a lot of stress, so I might have had a slight episode. Started hearing voices and became really paranoid. I listened to testimonies of “witches and warlocks” who converted to Christ. Scared the hell out of me. But my faith wavered continually.

In short, I think I only converted out of fear.

>>668855

>>668854

My post wasn't intended to preclude the possibility of those stories being just that, some sort of stories that didn't literally happen (as ultimately, i don't know, although personally I am inclined to a literalism of sorts in most cases) but the point was is that once faith in God is given, OPs problem with these stories really should be a non-issue and isn't a valid excuse to jump off the boat. One needs a more fundamental objection than he can't see these OT stories in the bible being true (objection to the story of the ressurection in the NT would count as a fundamental objection).

Also re: physicists, anecdotal but nonetheless it's been my experience that they're some of the most close minded lot you can find, where anything metaphysical doesn't count as an explanation for thembut then I live in Godless Blighty. Also do not put faith in science, the best science can tell us about anything is that 'we haven't proven this false…yet ' Theories change to fit new data accrued, to put faith in that is to build your house on sand (note I'm not dissing science, only the faith that some people put in it)

>>668857

Ah well mate, everyone has their own reasons for converting and different paths they took to get where they are, but whatever the case once we've arrived (or if you don't think you have properly yet, before you arrive) it's important you exercise your spiritual and, to an extent, intellectual muscles (just don't make the latter the foundation) to understand what you're getting into and try to put any mustard seed of faith you have into practice to allow the opportunity for God to water it and make it grow. You have a lot more research and enquiring to do which will be a great journey of discovery. Keep praying for faith and hope and it will be given to you.

Let me dreg up a few posts made in the past few weeks that might help you along the way

(Sorry the first lot a so bleddy waffly)

>>662297

>>662298

>>662311

>>662312

>>653550

>>653598

>>668664

>>668858

Physicists are an interesting lot, I imagine that a lot of them are closed minded, but the best ones usually are not. Einstein is usually cited because he was fond of Spinoza, and really tried to push his theories to reflect the divine simplicity one would expect of a naturalistic God. Usually they get stuck on theological naturalism though, whereas we have a supernatural God.

>>668838

Look hippie, all that information is available in a million sites for people who actually want answers, and not tlak abput how the truth is uncharitable.

You seem unable to deal with anything that contradicts you. Get some social skills, and some actual proteins.

>Mainly because so many stories in the Bible seem incredulous to me (two people populating the earth, mana falling from the sky, a world wide flood, etc). I have tried my hardest to believe in those passages, but it seems too ridiculous to me.

St. Augustine had the exact same problem vis a vis the concubines of the Hebrew Fathers and anthropomorphize of God in the OT, and it's the reason he was a manichean for so many years. The Bible is ludicrously difficult text to unpack; so my advice to you is to read up more on the Church Fathers and strive for a deeper understanding of the Faith.

>There’s also the issue of how salvation is dispensed. It seems like people are screwed if a missionary doesn’t get to them in time. It wouldn’t make sense for god to automatically save people who hadn’t heard the gospel because that defeats the purpose of evangelism. But it isn’t consistent for god to say that he wants all men to be saved, and yet doesn’t give all men the resources to get saved.

The Church has always held that if one is not introduced to the divine law, they will still be saved if they live according to the natural law. In other words, if they follow the good as informed by their conscience and avoid evil, they can still be saved. The problem is that even among those who have the divine law, very few choose to actually follow it, renounce the world, and live for God, despite how light his yoke is. People tend to have a very distorted view of, say, the middle ages, wherein they think that everyone was perfectly pious and basically born and bred for heaven, when in reality they were, on the whole, just as dismissive of the truth then as they are now. Many are called, but few are chosen. Everyone gets the graces necessary for salvation, but few, even those with the sacraments, choose it.

>>668866

crap did I not clarify I was laughing at you and not OP, mb

>>668830

The people are both helpful and charitable if you're a Christian. What they aren't is your feel-good counselor to make you feel better about your failings.

Rather, they want to purge them out of you and save you. That takes you acknowledging harsh realities.

You're luke-warm man. You have no conviction. You're on a path to eternal hell. It doesn't matter what's instinctive to you- if you devoted your time and energy to reasoning the truth you'd realize Christianity -is- the truth

Anyway, get saved, or enjoy your nihilism.

>>668847

What it means to me moreso is he seeks a personal relationship which in my mind is impossible since I'm such a piece of shit I'd never want to ever see him face-to-face. If he's real I dread the day I meet him, thats my point.

>>668823

Christians could believe in reincarnation, veggie, and pacifism. I somehow agree with reincarnation but this isnt really about that. Its about finding the truth and that is Jesus Christ.

>>668823

> but I’m at the end of my rope, spiritually

Not yet apparently. You are still looking clarity in your quest for Christ.

>There’s also the issue of how salvation is dispensed. It seems like people are screwed if a missionary doesn’t get to them in time.

Not really, the law is written upon all our hearts. For those who seek righteousness, at the hour of their death they will be given a chance to witness, repent, and believe. Our Lord accounts for all.

>It wouldn’t make sense for god to automatically save people who hadn’t heard the gospel because that defeats the purpose of evangelism.

Hearing the word of God means more chance of not going to the eternal BBQ-pit. There were people whom did not received the gospel yet given the chance because they seek righteousness by the laws written in their hearts. But those who did not follow in law in their hearts nor have heard of it, they NEEDED the gospels, hence evangelism. Again, our Lord accounts for all.

Yeah, I know that I did not back those up with theology, philosophy, etc. It is not that those are worthless or anything; they are means to understand the nature of our Lord but not absolute nor complete. The only proper method is through faith. I have faith our Lord is righteousness and goodness, whose mercy is infinite and He accounts for all of His children.

Gnosticism treats spiritual things as science and craft, one would as well measure sound with a ruler. That is why it is treated as non-sense, a dangerous non-sense which promotes hubris and pride in which one would thought to outwit the Lord.

>>668869

You don’t have to be an asshole in order to be stern and truthful. Plenty of people in this thread have given me their advice without being disrespectful. I’m so sick of this “tough love” meme.

>>668864

Why don’t you kiss my @ss and get the fu¢k out of my thread, okay? Why waste your time if you aren’t going to be helpful?

>>668865

Huh, that’s an interesting take on the matter. I’ll have to check our more Patristic writings.

>>668864

>and some actual proteins

>eggs, milk, and beans don’t have protein

Look at this retard

>>668823

13 For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;

Romans 2:13-15

>I started liking transsexuals, grannies, and little boys. I also developed a muscle and sub fetish.

>I like many aspects of Gnosticism (I.e. reincarnation, pacifism, vegetarianism)

I wonder if this correlation implies a causation

>>668823

>I like many aspects of Gnosticism (I.e. reincarnation, pacifism, vegetarianism)

>reincarnation

trash and abominable. I cant believe that someone actually likes this

>pacifism

ok, thats not at all bad

>vegetarianism

they were vegetarian, not because they loved animals, but because they hated them and considered them and any living creature and anything connected to recreation to be impure and evil. This also meant that they looked down on vaginal sex (because, you know, recreation, the main purpose of this process) and instead preferred sodomy.

>>668914

Procreation anon, recreation is something else.

>>668823

I don't know for certain if the Book of Genesis is literal or not. But I do know that what it contains is still true in one sense or another.

Sometimes it's okay to not know.

>>668923

Yeah the gnostic boogeyman. I can argue against and for gnosticism btw.

>>668823

You need to look into why Christians believe evolution is a lie. Start with Kent Hovind on YouTube.

>>668847

This post made me laugh, and now I feel like I shouldn't be laughing at this.

OP since this seems like an emergency situation I think I would recommend http://assets.press.princeton.edu/chapters/i10685.pdf The Lily of the Field or Bird of the Air discourses by Kierkegaard. Very short and easy read.

Don't trust internet anons to give you solid sprirtual advice. Some of these people could even be trolls.

>>668951

The greatest evil is not violent at all, and violence does not have to be violent. You are revealing a disgusting, hedonistic, leftist mindset filled with degeneracy.

Also, stop talking about how logical you are when you know nothing abojt logic and the resr of the words "" enlightened"" leftists love to parrot

>>669033

>you know nothing about logic

B-But I know the law of non-contradiction :’(

Seriously, I don’t know why you would say something like that.

>>669022

Well you're doing a terrible job with either.

>>668824

this, i think.

>>668892

>>668889

You realize IDs are on and everyone can see your samefagging, right?

>>668823

In regards to salvation for the ignorant, there is a passage in 2 Peter that addresses this.

2 Peter 2:21

For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

Also, I can't remember it off the top of my head, but there was a part where Jesus says that those who have heard His word and seen His works ought to know better than to turn away from His teachings.

>>669389

Where did you get the impression that I was trying to pretend to be two diffferent people??? Did it ever occur to you that I overlooked that part of his post, and decided to critique that as well? I hate how so many people on this board just assume the worst about you without just reasons. You can go fu¢k yourself too, motherfu¢ker!!!