/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

We all have to become masters of our carnal desires. The church teaches us that sex just for pleasure is the sin of Onan. No contraception and sex must have a chance of conception to be justified.

Similarly to those Paul verses, there was this saint(forgot who), who had terrible sexual temptations and prayed to God to be rid of them and God answered: "If I take those away I'll have to give you something else" (disease, pain, persecution, other temptations, etc).

We need the cross for our sanctification.

The catholic catechism is irrelevant. If you are a homosexual you are not saved.

1 corinthians 6, leviticus 20, romans 1.

>>853494

The bible condemns the act and the perversion. Looking to lust heterosexually is sin just like actual adultery, but homosexual lust is more egregious because it is against nature. You have to be perverse to even have the issue.

Catholics being soft on this issue is part of the reason why there is a homosexual clergy epidemic in the roman church.

>>853497

Homosexuals are those who act on it.

If i have raping temptations im not a rapist, only if i act on it.

"If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman,

"Men committed shameful acts with other men, "

"nor abusers of themselves with mankind,"

Nowhere there does it say - those who have these temptations, it condemns those who do them.

>>853498

If i have a temptation and block it rather than dwell on it i havent sinned regardless of how egregious. Demons can put thoughts into your head.

Not having lustful thoughts is impossible (without some special grace that is), what we can do is not feed them, purge the thought. Again, spiritual warfare.

>>853498

I agree with not having people with same sex attractions as priests though.

>>853500

The bible makes a distinction between lustful temptations and lusting, or looking to lust.

>Matthew 5 But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Romans 1 tells us that to do those things (homosexual acts) one must already be given over to a depraved/reprobate mind. OP said he has the homo, which means he's a reprobate. Lusting after men is a sin in the same category as lusting after women, there's just the additional detail that it's against nature.

Reprobates can be redeemed. Homosexuals are listed in the "such were some of you" in 1st Corinthians 6. If OP were born again the Spirit would remove his spiritual illness. What is impossible is to be born again and a homosexual or reprobate. 2 Corinthians 13 shows they are incompatible.

>>853487

If you want to get answers from catholics, post in the catholic general, or get retarded answers like these >>853497>>853498>>853502

If you're not larping there's your answer: stay celibate, don't become a priest, and if you want to start a family you can ask God for it. Also, you didn't say anything about pornography. How did you find out you were gay exactly? Are you sure this was not induced by external causes, i.e. relationships, porn, movies etc? You should also know that there are homosexuals who redeem themselves, I've even talked to one who is no longer attracted to men. Don't lose hope, God is not asking you the impossible, so if He doesn't want you to be gay that means you can overcome it.

>>853504

OP here.

Sure I just felt this board was more active. I have no time for Steven Anderson-tier bulls— anyway, fortunately there is not a single Prottie church in a 200 km radius from where I live.

>if you want to start a family you can ask God for it

Could you elaborate on this? I guess adoption as a single parent is wrong? You mean asking God for a woman to marry? That implies changing my desires

>porn

Well that's how I found out about my homo desires. I was really young, too. Like 12. I feel bad about it but I was basically a child so I'm not sure how responsible I am for it. But I still feel bad.

It's twisted that someone that young can look at porn so easily, even if they turn out with a normal sexuality.

>there are homosexuals who redeem themselves

Well I certainly wish there was a path for me to do that, I wish I could change it. I don't see how that could happen at the moment. Through God all things are possible I understand that. So technically it's not impossible.

Even if I can't change those impulses, I would never act on it, I understand it's a sin. I already came to terms with not having sex ever a long time ago. It's easier when you're a virgin I guess.

>don't lose hope

I try to be in line with God's will. But I still care what other people think of course, that's why I made this thread

>>853506

I'll talk to my priest about adoption and family. But I want lay perspectives too.

>>853494

>The bible condemns the acts, not the temptations.

Just want to talk about the line between temptation and the sin of an impure thought.

According to Saint Aquinas, who is to be followed according to Papal and ecumenical councils, so much as looking at a woman can be a mortal sin. This comes from Matthew 5:28

Matthew 5:28

28 But I say to you, that whosoever shall look on a woman to lust after her, hath already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Looking with lust is the actual act of sin, not just a temptation, unless the look was not done willingly e.g. Some naked lady pops out of a cake and you look without thinking about it, but drive the though from your mind as soon as you realize it.

The (liberal) ISCCB says looking at Porn (pictures of people having sex) is a mortal sin related to adultery or fornication. https://www.usccb.org/topics/natural-family-planning/pornography

>>853498

When baptist want to engage in a particular sin, they just split off and form a new church.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominational_positions_on_homosexuality#Baptists

There are 7 different flavors of Baptist on this issue ranging from Supporting homosexuality to absolutely forbidding even the inclination as you do.

Then you throw stones only at the Catholics for having a position that isn't absolute.

>>853506

I don't know what you're referring to but if I can clarify I'm not an andersonite and what I'm saying is against what anderson teaches. The anderson position is what you floated in the OP, that gays should just be killed.

>>853509

Don't get me wrong pro gay protestants are obviously worse off than soft on gay catholics. Do you have an issue with what I actually said?

I'm going to keep asking you I'm every thread by the way, speaking of throwing stones, are you a confirmed member of a church where you do good works?

>>853509

Also what was your point with this link? It clearly states that the baptist witness it solidly anti gay. When a baptist wants to be pro gay they have to leave and start some irrelevant gay denomination.

What exactly do you expect us to do about that?

>>853515

The Biblical view is not quite either of the two views you have described.

It is true that sodomites are going against nature as you said according to Romans 1. But you were incorrect about ascribing them to 1 Corinthians 6:9. That says "abusers of themselves with mankind." It's about prostitution generally. That is why you see it combined with whoremongers and menstealers in the only other place it occurs in 1 Timothy 1.

The reason we know nobody in the church has been given up to this, what Romans 1 describes, is because Paul also says in 1 Corinthians 10:13 that, "there hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man," and we know that sodomite lust is not common to man, it is the opposite of that because it is, as you yourself said, unnatural. Hence none of the Corinthians Paul was writing to were taken with unnatural lusts, thus disproving the false teaching you brought in for back in 1 Corinthians 6.

Furthermore, it is also written in Hebrews 4:15, again writing to the brethren in Christ, that: "For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin."

Now obviously the high priest being talked about in this passage is Christ. Hebrews says he was "in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin." Notice it says "as we are." Clearly, the writer of Hebrews is aware that sodomite lust is not something any of the brethren in Christ were ever tempted with. Because if they or any of them were, as you suggest, then this passage would be implying something unconscionable about Christ.

>The anderson position is what you floated in the OP, that gays should just be killed.

His position goes farther than that, because he outright tells people to commit suicide. That isn't the same as our ancestors who simply allowed the death penalty to exist for such crimes as sodomy when proven in court. They never told anyone to commit suicide, which is more of an ridiculous shock value statement than anything else.

>>853517

I'll defer to the experts on that translation choice. I have no intimate knowledge of greek but homosexual seems to be a fair translation. It also says effeminate which makes my point. Homosexuals will not inherit the kingdom. Former homosexuals may.

Faggots are reprobates, so you cannot be saved, there is no hope for you. If you truly want to do any good for God, I'd suggest you kys so that way you'll never molest any boys.

>>853515

>I don't know what you're referring to but if I can clarify I'm not an andersonite and what I'm saying is against what anderson teaches.

I was refering to the Andersonite Baptists and how you differed from them, appears to be two andersonite baptists. :

Here >>853519 and here >>853521

I did mention the 7 different flavors of Baptist is this post >>853509

>There are 7 different flavors of Baptist on this issue

It's part of the hardship of trying to convert Protestants; there is only one error that they all share. Any other error gets the response "You're wrong!" from another protestants. It seems hopeless to engage them, as the devil intended, I guess

The Church says we're all given a cross to bear and and will be given the grace to bear it if we pray humbly, sincerely and with penance for that grace. Homosexuals have their cross. I have mine; I've been a oversexed and full of heterosexual lust and corrupt desires since I was five years old, before the age of reason! I still struggle with it, and God has granted me graces to resist the thoughts.

>>853506

>I guess adoption as a single parent is wrong? You mean asking God for a woman to marry? That implies changing my desires

You certainly can't adopt a child, no. But yes, the first thing to do is to change your desires, or rather ask God to give you that grace, after you have repented for your sins. It may take a while, perhaps a lifetime, but what matters is your perseverance, not the results.

>Well that's how I found out about my homo desires

Well I guessed right then. No one is a "born" homo. The cause is external to you, so stop telling yourself that you were born like this as an excuse. You took the wrong path, but there is a right path and you can always come back to it, no matter what the retards itt have to say about it.

>I would never act on it, I understand it's a sin.

That's great, ygmi. Never forget that God will give you all the grace you need to be saved, so it's impossible that you go to hell for being gay while trying your hardest to change.

>>853521

So suicide is not a sin when you're a homo? shut the winnie the pooh up heretic. Suicide is a sin and you should not do it even if you choose to be a tranny and basically bring it to yourself.

OP you should NEVER engage in homo activities it's a grave sin. You can't adopt either since you might turn that child into a homo. But I would say as long as you're aware of that you're fine. Keep in mind however, many homos think the Church teaching can be changed no it won't. Reject LGBT bulls-. Don't be effeminate because that's a sin too. Be a man.

Basically don't let your deviant tendency define you. Humans are so much more than their desires I'm sure you can find good things to do in this wicked world.

Also this might not be popular on /christian/ but don't hate yourself too much. Hate your sin but not yourself as a person. You have a sinful tendency just like someone who has a tendency towards gambling or alcoholism or any other sin.

Just don't act on it and talk to a priest or find someone to talk to if you are having a rough time with your tendency. Someone who upholds the Church teaching of course. But they should be empathetic too.

I don't hate someone who struggles with porn or gambling and I don't hate someone who struggles with homosexual thoughts, I don't get it but why would I hate you for it. You can live a good life, as long as you are not proud of your sin there is hope for you.

>>853572

I didn't know profanity was banned but my point stands

>>853521

I don't think anyone born such that they cannot be saved, but we all get crosses to bear of different weights.

The fact is, I think being attracted to men is genetic. There have been claims of finding the gene for it; women become more prolific at the cost of their male children being almost taken out of the gene pool.

>>853573

>I didn't know profanity was banned but my point stands

Funny how some people find that out while others don't. I thought you were a Winnie the Pooh fan for a moment, kinda … gay.

>>853506

If porn was what caused the corruption of your mind, then you've discovered the problem. Quit pornography and masturbation if you haven't already and let your mind and soul heal.

>>853579

>There have been claims of finding the gene for it; women become more prolific at the cost of their male children being almost taken out of the gene pool.

Propaganda from the same people that think we're all animals.

They of course promote sodomy, as well, due again to being antichrist. They are not scientists nor experts.

>>853627

People have genes, Anon. Not much point in disputing how God made us.

>They of course promote sodomy,

You're hopeless. How did you get from people have genes to genetic scientists promote sodomy and are the antichrist and not scientist.

>>853625

Porn and masturbation are mortal sins, and most be given up but I don't see how they cause homosexuality.

>>853653

OP here. Thank you for all responses. I especially appreciate >>853572 's kind comment.

I agree with this statement. If porn were the cause of homosexuality then the more you watch the gayer you become which is just not true.

I understand the topic of how someone becomes gay might be of interest to you because it's hard to "get" homosexuality from your perspective.

I've wondered this myself plenty of times, probably more than most of you as I live with this 24/7. There are so many factors and variables (father and mother figures, behaviour of the mother during pregnancy, hormone levels both of the mother and of the child, sexual abuse) and not even the science is clear. And there's real science and also politically motivated "science" of course which just tarnishes everything.

It's a very complex topic. At this point I've given up trying to find an explanation. I just want to live a good life with what I know and have.

All I want to know is if I can be a good Catholic. Which I think I can if I am celibate and reject LGBT ideology which I always have for many reasons both religious and secular. Hopefully at least some of you will agree. Not easy but it's worth it.

>>853663

I admire your courage, of course you can be celibate. God will never forget all your struggles, and I think He will reward you even more because of what you have to go through.

>>853652

>and are the antichrist and not scientist.

Not THE antichrist, just antichrist in general. As it says in 1 John 4:3, "And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world."

>People have genes, Anon. Not much point in disputing how God made us.

Ok, what does what you said have to do with genetics? It's literally just a bunch of demented people who have a predetermined goal to justify the sodomy of their sick culture. It has nothing to do with science.

>>853499

>>853500

>>853672

>>853670

These are good bros with inspired words OP. I would only disagree, and only in part, with some of our cathbros on you joining the clergy. If you do it, maybe you shouldn't join the secular clergy, I'm honestly not sure. As for religious orders, they come in every flavor, and there is certainly a good cause waiting for you.

Most who would advise you against becoming a priest would do it for the sake of children (and yourself), and they may be right. Have you ever thought it the other way round, though, about the holy works you could do for the elderly?

There are religious orders that follow the specific charisma of caring for our retired clergy, good men and women who die in hardship as we talk, after a lifetime of service the Lord, and in spite of the Church's best efforts. You don't even have to join the clergy to help organizations such as the Catholic Health Association of the United States. Not shilling for anything, though (you're not even in the US). I was just thinking about the "manifold grace of God" (1 Peter 4:10). Pray and the Holy Spirit will guide you.

BTW the OP expressed that he has no interest in discussing the causes of his deviant desire, which makes them irrelevant to this thread.

>>853494

>The bible condemns the acts, not the temptations.

>whoever lusts after a woman has sinned in his heart

>lustful image of Christ

It's so tiring. No wonder German peasants went mad and started babbling in tongues.

You are mentally disabled.

skitzos and bi polar people don’t know they’re crazy but they are.

Gay/Trans is the same thing. There’s just no cure yet. Either one day we will find a cure or people like you will have to self manage until then. s—, we should have gay anonymous groups like for drugs and alcohol.

Your only solution for now is noporn and nofap.

Good luck bro.

>>853786

Lusting after a women entails entertaining the thought not just having the initial temptation.

If not then Jesus would have sinned for having temptations in the desert.

Paul says:

"take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ."

So there, we are to deliberate over our thoughts and purge the sinful ones.

Having temptations/thoughts is outside our control, deciding what to do with them is under our control.

>>854483

Bad thoughts are only sins if you entertain them. You cant prevent a thought from entering your brain, even demons can give you thoughts, saints themselves are barraged with wicked temptations.

As Paul says - "take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ."

So no, the initial temptation isnt a sin.

And your citations refute nothing, the next sentence refutes your position ' men with men working that which is unseemly,' -> acting on the temptation.

Why resuscitate a homo thread, let them vanish.

>>854483

based urasawa poster

>>854488

It may not be sinful in and of itself but homosexual urges are disordered whether or not they are acted on, and there should be no respect for them from Christian people. There ought to be help for these people to cure their affliction and restore natural affections, but I fear there may be no cure apart from divine intervention. The psychological treatments which have been devised over the previous decades and which are now persecuted seem to help curb deviant behavior and help the homosexual "fake it till he makes it", but the disorder itself seems to remain. We should pray for them

>>854483

ok cultist