/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

Pride.

All forms of anti-Trinitarian heresy hate Christ, in one way or another. While some heretics over-spiritualize him to the point that his earthly life didn't matter (such as Gnostics), the Oneness types do the opposite and over-emphasize his earthly life and focus on the flesh. Most of them are especially Jewish fetishists/Sacred Namers/Messianics who also dismiss the Holy Spirit's work and chalk up the Trinitarian doctrine to "pagan" or "Greek" origins (not even realizing that the Trinity existed in Hebrew scripture itself, as well as early commentaries like the Targums).

They imagine the Church got it all wrong for 2000 years and it's only them with their Jewish fetish that has come to "restore" the true faith. Anyone who thinks that the Church has been lost for that long not only despises the Son, but despises the Holy Spirit as well. They must think the Spirit of God can't keep the reins on anyone, is completely incompetent, and that Jesus was a liar when he said the Spirit would "guide us into all truth". But that's exactly what their narrative demands.

>>799689

Curious what you guys think of this article?

'The Trinity Doctrine Is NOT In The Bible'

>https://biblicisminstitute.wordpress.com/2015/05/10/the-trinity-doctrine-is-not-in-the-bible/

This website puts on a very compelling case for the duality of God, including addressing many arguments that people would use for the Trinity, frankly I'd like to hear what Christians more knowledgeable than me might say to some of his points?

But read it all, I've been on that website for some weeks and i'm utterly confounded by some of the knowledge there. They have a lot of knowledge and points that I've never encountered before.

>>800089

Here’s what I think of this article:

>19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

>>800092

They address this verse in the middle section:

>Therefore the Fire of the Word of God became flesh in Jesus the Christ, Himself the Truth.

>“I am the Truth!” John 14:6

>The Spirit of Truth, as Jesus called Him, is a Spirit who belongs to the Truth, and as such has been tasked to carry the Fire of God’s Word of Truth, which He embodies, and to deliver it to the believers.

>” ‘Is not my word like fire,’ declares the LORD.” Jeremiah 23:29

“>The appearance of the living creatures was like burning coals of fire or like torches.” Ezekiel 1:5

>Thus the Spirit dispenses the Holy Fire of God’s Truth (Jesus) by placing it (Him) inside the believers.

>“Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?” 1 Corinthians 6:19

>“If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.” Romans 8:10

>However, the Spirit doesn’t just convoy and supply the Fire and then leaves. He is with the believers always, and as such maintains and cultivates the Fire within them to the point of total consumption.

>“For our God is a consuming fire.” Hebrews 12: 29

>>800089

>wordpress

I trust the saints more.

>>800098

I trust the Bible which demonstrates that the Holy Spirit accepts worship and is a separate person from Christ.

>>800099

That's not an argument,

>>800102

Then you have to provide those verses.

Guys, if you keep putting forth a non-arguments, then people are going to assume the website is correct. Personally I am Trinitarian but I'm still confounded by the points that website presents, if you guys are struggling with this too, it shows that I have to investigate further or that that article is correct.

>>800105

I don't need to argue with heretics. God has spoken through the prophets, the saints, the Scriptures and through the Church that He is Three in One. No amount of semantics, nitpicking and human rationalisation can change this.

>>800109

Acts 5:3-4 is the only thing there that matters there, the article DOES NOT dispute the power of the holy spirit. In fact they call the Holy Spirit the most powerful weapon God has ever unleashed thanks to Christ's New Covenant:

>However, this time around, thanks to the New Covenant in Christ’s blood, God was about to unleash His most powerful weapon, the Spirit, for the benefit of all believers.

But let's look at Acts 5:3-4.

>3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?

>4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.

>5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.

However, this is not concrete, if God sends a messenger, and if you lie to that messenger, that does not mean that the messenger is God. If God sent us a helper, that doesn't mean that the helper is God, but an extension of his will, just as God uses Angels, which we're not to worship.

Suppose one could also link Job 33:4 to the trinity, but as the article points out:

>Nowhere in the bible does Jesus or anyone say that The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one. However, the Holy Spirit carries the power of the duality.

>“…stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.” Luke 24:49

>“…the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. And God said, ‘Let there be light,’ and there was light.” Genesis 1: 2-4

>God speaks and the Spirit executes.

Guys, this website put forth one heck of an argument.

>>800110

Then why bother replying? If you don't want to quote the word of truth then stay quiet. Let others argue on your behalf, at this point you're just adding noise and wasting your own time as well as everyone elses.

>>800116

>Guys, this website put forth one heck of an argument.

No it does not.

3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?

4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart?

Thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.

The Holy Spirit is God.

From NewAdvent:

Many other texts declare quite as clearly that the Holy Ghost is a Person, a Person distinct from the Father and the Son, and yet One God with Them. In several places St. Paul speaks of Him as if speaking of God. In Acts 28:25, he says to the Jews: "Well did the Holy Ghost speak to our fathers by Isaias the prophet"; now the prophecy contained in the next two verses is taken from Isaiah 6:9-10, where it is put in the mouth of the "King the Lord of hosts". In other places he uses the words God and Holy Ghost as plainly synonymous. Thus he writes (1 Corinthians 3:16): "Know you not, that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?" and in 6:19: "Or know you not, that your members are the temple of the Holy Ghost, who is in you . . . ”