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/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

File: 88eee5be3b544c3⋯.jpeg (408.21 KB, 665x768, 665:768, C926AD2B-AFDF-4A4A-83E1-C….jpeg)

67bf35  No.760067

Can someone intelligently explain Christianity to me, specifically Original Sin and repentance? Why should I feel guilty just for existing? My whole life, ALL I’ve ever wanted was the best for myself and others. I’m a perfectionist and hold myself to a higher moral standard than I do anyone else. I already find myself constantly forgiving others. Why do I need Christ’s work on the cross?

Btw I believe in God and value revelations concerning the coming New Jerusalem, pic related.

003ab2  No.760074

>original sin

Our first mother and father strayed from God, and humanity was cursed with a knowledge of good and evil that was not licitly given. Thus, we have "free will", in the sense that rather always being one with God's will, we are left with anything outside of His Will, which is always sin. God Himself is Truth, Goodness, Light, and everything good.

>repentance

You must acknowledge your sins and change your ways.

>Why should I feel guilty just for existing?

No clue, why should you?

>Why do I need Christ’s work on the cross?

Because your own works are good for nothing, to reject Christ's work is to reject repentance and God.


05ec3e  No.760076

>>760067

>Can someone intelligently explain Christianity to me, specifically Original Sin

Lets be real, no one winnie the pooh knows. The only people who aren't vague and bullshitty about it are the people who say original sin is subhuman genes from Eve winnie the pooh some kind of ancient tigger. Everyone else claims it's unsubstantiated philosophical bullshit or uses obtuse obfuscated language to hide the fact they don't know either.


05ec3e  No.760080

Same thing with the Holy Spirit too. Everyone who says it's something specific and understandable gets called a heretic on this board while the pseudointelectual meaningless borderline new age bullshit goes unchallenged.


f34df5  No.760083

File: cb5112af5010cdf⋯.jpg (885.03 KB, 1700x2009, 1700:2009, virgin-mary11.jpg)

>>760076

she burned the coal and we payed the toll. but its okay because we have a new mom now who's pure and trad


003ab2  No.760092

>>760076

>>760080

over-enthusiastic Orthodox or /fringe/ spotted


003ab2  No.760098

>>760093

>hh, how do I KNOW that my free will doesn’t dovetail precisely with God’s own will?

Read the Scripture, follow His Church. He left it behind for a purpose.

>they are also MINE.

Prove it! God's commandments are part of this truth, goodness, and light, for God Himself is truth, goodness, and light. He is the creator outside of creation, and the objective truth.


05ec3e  No.760099

>>760092

/fringe/ tier stuff is what every normie (clergy or layman) says when describing religious concepts, lots of obtuse obfuscations, void pseudointellectualism, and nothing of any meaning or substance.


f34df5  No.760100

>>760093

>Uhh, how do I KNOW that my free will doesn’t dovetail precisely with God’s own will?

God doesn't want you touching yourself to chinese cartoons, anon...


003ab2  No.760101

>>760099

That's a silly claim, we have over 2,000 years worth of Tradition and philosophical writings on the subject. Feel free to read St. Aquinas for a meeting between Greek philosophy and the divine revelation of God, revealed through Christ. :)


98e11e  No.760109

>>760093

Will is not a matter of desire, it is a matter of conduct. All men desire truth, goodness, and light, yet without God they will inevitably search for those things in the wrong places, leading to harm to either themselves or others. If you truly willed goodness, you would be spending all your time on earth aiding the poor and correcting the errors of the world, and the simple fact is that, even while idolizing those who follow that path, very few of us do that ourselves. Will is not desire.


003ab2  No.760111

>>760107

Catholic schools are notorious for not having the very best catechism, but the Catholic teaching on the subject is the correct one.

See, when Adam and Eve fell, we all fell from God. Rather than doing the Divine Will, we followed our own will, which is always imperfect, because it is in itself not part of that Perfect Will, being God Himself.

Man, being separate from God, cannot reach God on his own. God Himself had to meet man again, and all of the OT is a prophecy of this. What made the Jews chosen? They were literally the "chosen", because God would send His only Son, the second-person of the Trinity, to come on Earth and die for our sins, that through this holy and unblemished sacrifice, we may once again reach God.


02485c  No.760112

>>760109

>All men desire truth, goodness, and light

I desire no goodness, nor light. In fact, I think I hate the light.

Will is definitively desire. Stop trying to redefine things. Will is the force behind action, not action itself. Actions cannot be will.


003ab2  No.760114

>>760111

oh kinda got ahead of myself, the Jews were "chosen", because God would send His only begotten Son through the medium of the Jewish people. Once Christ arrived, lived, died, and resurrected into Heaven, all of man-kind was redeemed, and no longer was God only meant to be the God of the Jews, but all man-kind.

>>760112

>I think I hate the light.

are you a member of KoRn?


f34df5  No.760115

>>760107

> I want an intelligent defense of the necessity of Christ’s work

no, you just want to be a false witness faggot


98e11e  No.760116

>>760107

>Will is definitively desire. Stop trying to redefine things.

This is the definition that has been used philosophically since the time of Plato. Desire is the aim of an action, not the action itself. Will is the force, i.e. the action itself.

>I desire no goodness, nor light.

Then what do you desire?


98e11e  No.760117

>>760115

Maybe don't drive a lost sheep away from the flock, tying a millstone around your neck in the process.


f34df5  No.760120

>>760117

if he wanted to understand christianity, he would buy a bible or read some stuff online and not shit up a christian imageboard full of retards who have no idea how to do christianity right. he's just here to shitpost


98e11e  No.760124

>>760120

So he slaps your right cheek, and you believe Christ wants you to slap him back?


003ab2  No.760128

>>760123

>In every moment I feel I obey Christ’s greatest commandments perfectly (Mt. 22:35-40).

You're probably lying, you shouldn't make grand sweeping claims you cannot back up :)

Perhaps, you should list them out one-by-one and re-affirm them for us? The greatest commandment is to love God with all your heart and soul, but you seem to love yourself the most!

>Therefore I don’t feel guilty for his crucifixion or for what Eve did.

You don't need to necessarily feel guilty for the crucifixion, but you should love God with all your heart. The sorrow for your sins shall come afterward.

>I’ve been studying Christianity in-depth since late 2016, alongside Judaism and Buddhism. I’ve devoted all my mind to God, alongside my entire soul and heart. I STILL DON’T UNDERSTAND.

Because you refuse to understand! All you have said before is "I do everything right!". Who can take this seriously?


f34df5  No.760130

>>760123

>I’ve devoted all my mind to God

try devoting your heart to him and stop being overly autistic

>>760124

what, you want me to suck his dick instead?


98e11e  No.760133

>>760123

>So the whole of Christianity boils down to the “children in Africa could be eating your compost” concept? Rly? Disappointing.

If the true means of willing truth, goodness and light is disappointing to you, then that says a lot about what you truly will. Unless you have obeyed not just Christ's greatest commandment, but every one of his commandments, then you're simply lying to yourself. And if you don't even understand that you aren't supposed to feel guilty for Eve's sin, then I have a hard time believing that you've been devoting your entire heart mind and soul to God for over two years.


891e4a  No.760135

File: 386e5a8fdfd30ef⋯.png (1.31 MB, 1178x952, 589:476, v32cdps3yeqy.png)

>>760112

>I think I hate the light.

What did photons ever do to you anon?


98e11e  No.760140

>>760130

Generally speaking, you don't win over Christ's enemies by calling them faggots and autists. Breaking pride is one thing, mockery is another.


f34df5  No.760147

>>760140

>you don't win over Christ's enemies by calling them faggots and autists

yes you do, ever heard of peer pressure?


e3a0b0  No.760151


003ab2  No.760152

>>760150

>It’s notable that nowhere in the Bible or CCC is self-love (alongside love of God) a sin.

Where did I call self-love a sin? You just keep saying you are perfect, you are perfect, over and over! That isn't self-love, this is narcissism!

>I’m not here to prove my righteousness.

Because it's impossible for you to, but you claimed you were righteous anyway!

>if I’m a perfectionist and give life (=Jesus?) my ALL, where is the need for Christ’s atoning work?

What you think you are means squat. You're only perfect if God, who is outside of yourself, says that you are "perfect". It's impossible for man to reach God, man cannot reach outside of himself. Man is only playing catch-up with God.

>am well raised with a strong Presbyterian cultural inheritance

explains a lot, sounds like you are dealing with the illogical doctrine of calvinism.

>If I can’t find any specific thing that requires Christ’s atoning work

Look in the mirror!


003ab2  No.760158

>>760156

you can try to do air-mail to Thomas Aquinas in Heaven


98e11e  No.760159

>>760150

>It’s notable that nowhere in the Bible or CCC is self-love (alongside love of God) a sin.

But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power. Avoid such people. 2 Timothy 3:1-5

First among these sins is narcissism.

>What part of “all the laws and the prophets hang on these two commandments” don’t try understand?

The part where "hanging on" means negating.

>Also, it is my understanding that Original Sin merits repentance per de, at least in theory.

The three effects of original sin are the introduction of death and suffering, the introduction of disordered, sinful appetites, and the loss of sanctifying grace. We have never claimed that the guilt of one person's sin should be felt by another, merely that the effects of the introduction of sin into the human race have been catastrophic beyond measure.


98e11e  No.760160

>>760156

Threads are super slow to die here, you should be fine.


003ab2  No.760163

>>760162

>I’m not saying I’m perfect, I’m saying that nothing else has ever occurred to me.

Which is saying that you are perfect. Who is God? What is perfection? You say you follow the greatest commandments, but if you loved God, you would follow them all.


98e11e  No.760167

>>760162

Have you never had/encouraged an abortion, never committed adultery, never insulted God or used God's name in vain, never cheated, never committed acts of violence, never lied, never stolen, never committed perjury, never worshipped any other than God, never raped, never murdered, never gossipped or detracted from, another's reputation, nor encouraged another to do any of the above? If so, then other things have certainly occurred to you.


003ab2  No.760177

>>760174

>and yet have converged towards the seam connecting Christianity and Judaism

there is no seam connecting the two. Christianity is built upon the Word of Christ, whom the Jews reject.

we share the same "old testament", but they do not understand their own teachings without Christ.

>Sorry I wasn’t baptized in the Catholic Church as an infant!?

Which is fine with me, but you need to do your research into what the apostolic Churches actually teach.


5bb283  No.760182

>>760083

Satanist like fan fiction.


98e11e  No.760184

>>760174

>But 2 Timothy 3:1-5 doesn’t prove that self-love is a sin. Are you prepared to argue that the Trinity doesn’t love itself?

Moving the goalposts isn't going to convince anyone that narcissism is a good thing, or that sarcastically boasting of a flawless moral character that nobody here (especially when you poke fun at God three times in this post), even you on the inside, believe you have, is self love.


98e11e  No.760190

>>760187

>and I hope you don’t think I would come to a Christian board to boast of my works. :)

I'd hope you wouldn't, I just have to watch you do it anyways.

>I was accused of loving myself, and I don’t see that as valid.

You were not accused of self love, you were accused of narcissism, in that you refuse to admit any fault in your own moral conduct whatsoever. How is that not narcissism?

>Love loving itself loves all things — basic Trinitarianism.

There is a world of difference between God, the infinite and perfect, loving the infinite and perfect, and you, loving the inherently flawed and chronically imperfect. Self love becomes a sin when the good in yourself causes you to turn a blind eye to the good outside you and the evil inside you. If you're comparing yourself to the Trinity while claiming that you do nothing but love God and neighbor that's indicative of some serious narcissism.


ffa2cc  No.760194

>>760174

<never lied

I’ve told white lies to protect others’ feelings as per Jesus instruction to treat others as yourself. Never gratuitously lied, no

<never lied

>I HAVE “played along” with gossip, as a part of fitting in with a highly gossipy culture (East Coast Canada), as a conversational courtesy to my counterparts, so as to create awkwardness (again, Mt. 22:39). It’s NEVER something that would spontaneously arise in my mind


d0443d  No.760200

>original sin

https://www.reddit.com/r/Christianity/comments/aeq95l/orthodox_catechisms_on_what_we_need_to_be_saved/

>repentance

https://www.reddit.com/r/Christianity/comments/aid25i/orthodox_catechism_pt_8_what_is/

>dude leddit lmao xd

I posted these. I translated them from French Orthodox catechisms. It's better to link to them than to try to reword it myself.


98e11e  No.760201

>>760197

>FALSE. I don’t refuse. I WANT TO BE CHRISTIAN. That’s why I started this thread.

Very well, in that case, to end this discussion, why don't you start by listing off any sins you are comfortable with listing in this thread.

>You do understand that the primary revelation of Christ is the spirit of the law, right?

Not the Mosaic Law, correct, because the Bible is clear that the Mosaic Law no longer applies to jews or gentiles.

>If you will accuse me of processing something factually incorrect for with my mouth for the sake of preserving others’ feelings that I will accuse you of violating the 613.

He...can't. It dosen't apply to Christians.


d0443d  No.760202

>>760200

And feel free to read the other threads that are linked, particularly on Baptism and the Eucharist. It's relevant to what you're asking.


4d215a  No.760207

>>760197

You realize gossiping is a form of lying right? If you "play" along with their gossip all your doing is being untruthful what you believe in. Unless you believe in gossiping as a proper thing to. To call me a Pharisee over this is laughable.


5bb283  No.760211

>>760210

Yes, but you are not absolutely perfect. Nothing with any imperfection can aver approach perfection, how any number, now ever large, can never approach infinity. All are worthy of the wrath of God, the absolutely perfect being.


d0443d  No.760213

>>760093

>Uhh, how do I KNOW that my free will doesn’t dovetail precisely with God’s own will? Call me cocky but I have every reason to think it does. If truth, goodness, and light are God’s priorities, they are also MINE.

If you say so. But if you openly brag about it, you've already proven yourself wrong.

>In every moment I feel I obey Christ’s greatest commandments perfectly (Mt. 22:35-40). It’s unfathomable to do anything else, it’s just how I operate. Therefore I don’t feel guilty for his crucifixion or for what Eve did.

We are not guilty for His crucifixion (it was His victory anyway) or for Adam and Eve's sin.

But read the stories of the saints. If you feel you are doing well, good! Keep doing well. But do not let it rest in your heart and turn into pride, because you "possess" nothing, everything is a gift from God and your own "merits" can do nothing.

>I will truth, goodness, and light in every moment.

Are you poor in spirit, that is, do you tolerate the fact you have more belongings than your neighbor does? Do you mourn for a suffering humanity? Are you meek? Do you hunger and thirst for righteousness? Are you merciful, pure of heart, a peacemaker? Are you persecuted, be it by the infidels or by the demons, for the sake of Christ?

Do you reject idolatry, that is, do you put God absolutely above all other things? Do you worship anything other than the Lord Jesus Christ? Do you speak His name in vain? Do you remember Easter and therefore go to Church to receive communion? Do you honor your parents? Do you reject killing, including hating, which is killing in spirit? Do you reject fornication, including lustful thoughts, which are fornication in spirit? Do you steal, which also means keeping your goods when they properly belong to others? Do you covet anything that your neighbor possesses?

I of course do not wish to disparage you, but have you seriously thought about these questions? Remember Luke 18:9-14:

>Also He spoke this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other men—extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.’ And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me a sinner!’ I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”

Again note I am not saying this to accuse you of sins I would not even know, or worse, to imply that a Christian necessarily cannot be righteous. But read the Scriptures more carefully. Read the Psalms in particular, maybe. But read also about the saints, our forefathers who have finished their race. You will find that only very few of them, such as St. Paul, recognized that they were holy and righteous people, and even Paul himself is able to say that he is the king of sinners and that he is not justified until he finishes his race.

>>760150

>>760174

You're mistaken. "The Trinity" is not a monad. Our God's name is not "Trinity". "Trinity" is a description of the eternal relationship between the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Is it correct to say "the marriage loves itself"? No. In the marriage, the husband gives himself up entirely for his wife, loving her unconditionally, and the wife does the same for her husband.

The idea of an eternally loving God who really just loves Himself as a monad is not Christian, but Muslim at best.

>>760203

Linked at the end of the first thread. I'm not done sharing the catechisms for all the sacraments, but at least read up on Baptism and the Eucharist.


98e11e  No.760222

File: cbeb41fa6458a81⋯.png (29.22 KB, 421x470, 421:470, Untitled.png)

>>760203

>If I’ve sinned, it’s the sin of submitting to the will of Satan for the sake of curiosity alone.

So we've established, after 15 posts, that you, in fact, have sinned. By the laws of any kingdom, willingly sumbmitting yourself to a rival king, especially one who has the polar opposite intentions and values as yours, and who has contributed nothing to you but ruin, is cause for death. Even if you did so out of curiosity and jest alone, that implies an openness to whatever consequences you signed up for, and as a man you have to abide by your actions. This treason, at best, is deserving of death.

Now, clearly you are more concerned with sins that you view as benign, such as lying to preserve anothers feelings. In short, we consider lies for the sake of preserving the good to be venial sins, meaning they are not so abhorrent that they cut one off from God. It is worth noting that protecting one's feelings is not necessarily good, as it may be causing them harm or be motivated simply out of selfishness, and it is always a sin regardless, yet your example is not what God would find hellworthy. Let's, then, say that you lied purely to cover your own wrongdoings.

>Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me. Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to thee? Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me. And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting. -Matthew 25:41:46

As we see here, the clearest takeaway from this verse is that God loves each person as he loves himself. In that regard, if you were to lie to anyone, it would be tantamount to lying to God himself. Now, if you lie to a person, then the action, the one you acting towards, and the law violated (presuming it is a crime, as is the category of action we are dealing with) itself, are all temporal. As such, the punishment is temporal too. Mankind lives and breaths in the temporal, and it only takes true religion or philosophy to see beyond that in even an intellectual sense. If, however, the one offended is eternal, then his laws are eternal, and the action, to one outside of time, is eternal to him as well. In that case, in lying to God, you have eternally marked yourself as one who's will is contrary to the eternal and ultimate good. What do you think that kind of a crime is worthy of?


4d215a  No.760223

>>760210

Playing along with gossip isn't being truthful to God and you know it.


98e11e  No.760228

>>760224

>If I agreed with you, would I have been so casual about admitting it?

Well then why don't you believe that treason against the highest and eternal source of good for the source of all evil is worthy of death.

>It’s controversial, I know, but in an informal, poetic sense (the only sense I’m using) letting yourself be vulnerable to evil is possible in whilst still IN Christ, and if you disagree you aren’t thinking big enough.

If by that you mean suffering then yes, it is the most laudable thing imaginable. If by that you mean submitting yourself to evil, which is what you did, then what the hell are you talking about? Christ submitted to the cross so that he could pay for all of the sins of mankind, and utterly obliterate Satan's will. Satan attempted to drive Christ away from the cross in the desert, not drive himself to his own defeat. If you are a prospective christian then you have absolutely no reason to be defending yourself here, and you never will be a christian until you stop.

>But I didn’t say that?

Yes, obviously, I'm taking a hypothetical example.


003ab2  No.760231

>>760197

to assert that you are perfect, over the claims of God, is self-love over love of God. which is a narcissism, to be quite clear.

what you don't seem to understand is that when you accept you are a sinner, that you are not perfect, then you can finally comprehend the love of God, even up to the foot of the Cross.


4d215a  No.760232

>>760224

>jovial banter

Is not the same as "gossiping"


4d215a  No.760239

>>760234

Your mom is a sinner as well all are.


4d215a  No.760245

>>760242

>Ok, cool. If that’s the best you can do, I’m out then, I’m switching from Christianity to mother-worship. See you in Hell

Right.

I'll be there only in your thoughts.


4d215a  No.760248

>>760246

Hell will never be tolerable.

>Is there anyone you would consider Heaven to be incomplete without, like my mother?

What?


98e11e  No.760251

>>760246

Asserting that your mother is sinless is asserting that you are in the position to know both everything about her moral character and everything about morality in general. The simple fact is that you do not, and if you were to neglect the simple task of bringing her to Christ out of reverence for her, then you would be committing the single most harmful act anyone has ever committed against her. If, as you say, you believe in God, this is not something to mess around with on the basis of emotion. You would not get into heaven if you were negligent in getting her in as well, and if, against all reason, she chose not to follow you and resisted all God did to save her at the behest of your prayer, then that is her choice and, as God respect's all choices, you must as well. It is not easy to say this; for me, knowing that my mother is a sinner, she is greatest fear and my greatest task, and you will not understand it until you truly come to love God, but the pain of that love is knowing that not everyone around you will follow in it.


4d215a  No.760254

>>760250

> Is there any non-Christian in your life, perhaps someone with a Marian-presence if you are a Catholic, that you would consider God unjust for condemning to Hell, the same as I think of my mother?

No.

>She IS sinless, divine, truly pure.

She isn't.


f34df5  No.760259

>>760258

mary wasn't born in the 20th century


4d215a  No.760260

>>760256

You're a troll.

>How do you get off uncritically affirming that my mother has a mean bone in her body

Never said she did.

>and not it not occurring to you that you might be a brain dead moron?

Grow up.


4d215a  No.760262

>>760261

Enjoy your ban retard


4d215a  No.760265

>>760263

Moral perfection may be achieved by grace. But once sinned always sinned even if God forgives.

You're a troll.


4d215a  No.760267

>>760264

>Mother Mary is a lying whore and Christianity

You speak out of spite and hate, you love no one but you and your mother Mr.Oedipus


4d215a  No.760270

>>760268

I literally said it's possible. You're being ignorant or you don't have the ear to hear truth, either way you're a fool.

We are born with a sinful nature.

Do you have a father?


98e11e  No.760271

>>760253

>I can only go by my conscience? I can’t imagine improving her moral station in any way.

What you need to understand is that human beings, even the best of us, are fundamentally broken morally as a result of original sin. All of our faculties are given over to wild variation from what they were originally intended to be, and as such even those who are able to maintain a relatively straight moral compass, which is only after years of discipline and an understanding of either natural law or divine law, are subject to this variation, which we call concupiscence. None but the fixed point of God and submitting to his unbending moral standards can orient one towards a total good. You know nothing of your mother's interior life, and, if we're being blunt, the fact that she was willing to have sex outside of marriage, which resulted in your father, who was uncommitted to her, being able to leave her (his crime, and a far worse one, but one she failed to account for and protect you from) is sin in and of itself. I take absolutely no pleasure in telling you this, but as such you should be man enough not take any anger in accepting it.

>By the way, “bringing her to Christ” would be laughable. She grew up in a picture-perfect 1950’s upper middle class WASP family, white gloves on Sunday and all. My grandmother was a hyper-religious Christian when she was alive, and my mom was the one sibling to care for her in old age and see her to death. All her siblings roll their eyes at Christ, but my mom doesn’t. But I wouldn’t be able to “bring her to Christ” even if I tried. It’s LAUGHABLE.

How on earth is that laughable if she's even closer to being a christian than most moms?

.


98e11e  No.760272

File: d59682587fc8b81⋯.png (38.59 KB, 300x168, 25:14, ClipboardImage.png)

>>760266

Ok YOU are just acting like an inconsiderate jerkoff.


4bba2f  No.760274

Stop speaking ill of other people's mothers.


891e4a  No.760285

>>760274

Are their fathers fair game?


0974f4  No.760382

>>760067

Read "Mere christianity" by C.K Chesterton

It's a short book and literally answers all your questions and more.


0d307f  No.760391

>>760382

>C.K. Chesterton

C.S. Lewis? Or G.K. Chesterton?


5bb283  No.760402


dfed34  No.760426

>>760067

Original sin doesn't mean that you feel guilty for existing, it means that we know we are imperfect, that our imperfection is our own fault, and that as a result, whether the story of Adam and Eve is literally true or not, we must be reconciled to God because we are imperfect. Original sin is a verbal shorthand for this state of affairs.


f73974  No.760598

File: cd2af09333ec05b⋯.jpg (176.93 KB, 623x702, 623:702, 1546319741721.jpg)

>>760274

ur mom is a fagot




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