/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

You can display sin to push a Christian message. The Bible does this, it's not damaging to read the wickedness of the people in the Bible.

Naturally the same follow for a lot of secular texts, movies, etc. Dostoevsky comes to mind.

But you're looking for an excuse to watch ecchi anime because you go to church and follow a prayer rule, you should rethink your whole life. I'm not accusing you of this, but be wary of yourself.

>*but if you're looking for an excuse

Sorry, I'm retarded.

Check out St. John Crysostom's sermon, "Against the circuses and the theaters": http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/chrysostom_against_theatres_and_circuses.htm

>>752655

> Why do I talk about the theatre? Often if we meet a woman in the marketplace, we are alarmed. But you sit in your upper seat, where there is such an invitation to outrageous behaviour, and see a woman, a prostitute, entering bareheaded and with a complete lack of shame, dressed in golden garments, flirting coquettishly and singing harlots’ songs with seductive tunes, and uttering disgraceful words. She behaves so shamelessly that if you watch her and give consideration, you will bow your head in shame. Do you dare to say you suffer no human reaction? Is your body made of stone? Or iron? I shall not refrain from saying the same things again. Surely you are not a better philosopher than those great and noble men, who were cast down merely by such a sight? [275] Have you not heard what Solomon says: “If someone walks onto a fire of coals, will he not burn his feet? If someone lights a fire in his lap, will he not burn his clothing? It is just the same for the man who goes to a woman that doesn’t belong to him.” For even if you did not have intimate relations with the prostitute, in your lust you coupled with her, and you committed the sin in your mind. And it was not only at that time, but also when the theatre has closed, and the woman has gone away, her image remains in your soul, along with her words, her figure, her looks, her movement, her rhythm, and her distinctive and meretricious tunes; and having suffered countless wounds you go home. Is it not this that leads to the disruption of households? Is it not this that leads to the destruction of temperance, and the break up of marriages? Is it not this that leads to wars and battles, and odious behaviour lacking any reason? For when, saturated with that woman, you return home as her captive, your wife appears more disagreeable, your children more burdensome, and your servants troublesome, and your house superfluous. Your customary concerns seem to annoy you when they relate to managing your necessary business, and everyone who visits is an irritating nuisance.

>>752652

>But you're looking for an excuse to watch ecchi anime

Well naturally anything with images of a sexual nature that cause lust are a no-go because one cannot stop themself from feeling lust, especially if the medium is visible. I was thinking more along the lines of uttering of profanities or taking of the Lord’s name in vain in media. Take almost any classic film for example, even older ones, and it most assuredly has these things in it. My question is whether watching such a film is sinful, even if the message of the film is not to promote sin and it is characterization? A few Christians I know say it is, while others say it is not, while still others lay conditions about intention on it.

>>752660

Can you provide me with an example of a movie that is this way?

I don't watch movies that much, usually written novels don't have profanity.

I've watched some movies that push Christian messages that do have explicit sins in them, though. Taxi Driver, for example has a porn scene and some swearing. Not to degenerate into a discussion of what sin is, but I think it can be self destructive, which is what I think of sin as, to revel too much in the darkest corners of humanity like commonfilth used to do. It can also be self destructive to not know what's going on around you.

>>752645

I had asked my father about this in the past when I had the same question and he said that it’s not what enters a man that defiles him, only what comes out. Idk what verse that is, but if you want more info you should look it up. I could be mistaken

>>752666

The message isn’t explicitly Christian, but take The Godfather as the first example to come off of the top of my head. The movie has profanities uttered, taking of the Lord’s name in vain, and plenty of violence and murder. None of it is gratuidous though. It’s all intended to deliver the messages of the movie such as the cruelty of people, the false veil of “class” in the criminal world of the mafia and the meaning of family. Is one committing sin by ‘’watching’’ this film?

>>752673

*watching

What about fantasy media? Such as something that uses "magic" but with no witchcraft or other explanation? Or non-human beings that are sentient, be they aliens/monsters/machines/whatever? Or fictional settings that have fictional religions but do not go into depth? How do we address these?

>>752694

>Magic

The problem with Magic in reality is that humans are incapable of performing it without divine aid. Barring miracles, 100% of magic comes from the Devil, and that is why it is sinful to use it.

In contrast, usually magic in fantasy settings comes from within the user, without outside influence. This is not any more sinful than lifting weights, because in that setting, it is something intrinsic to the user.

>Fantasy races

I can't find any problem with it as long as the distinction is made that it is fiction and not reality. Perhaps you could make an argument that as these things behave sentiently, then perhaps they have souls as humans do, but I don't think you could really make that argument successfully given that it's a fictional universe and plays by different rules.

>Fictional religions

Consider that a pantheon of gods in a fictional world might very well exist, given that it is fictional and the author can do whatever he pleases with it. There is nothing stopping a writer from writing that a pantheon of gods created the world, rather than a single God. It's a completely different universe, and so it would play by different rules.

I avoid anything glorifying demons and magic.

I think the biggest issue is whether or not the sin is simulated or not. You can fake murder, theft, etc., but immodesty, blasphemy, and many other things simply cannot be portrayed without actually committing the sin. To the extent that the movie/book/whatever contains actual, unsimulatable sin, it is offensive to God. The audience, by continuing to expose themselves to it, are playing a part in assenting to this sin.

Of course, even where things do not approach sin *per se*, we ought to remember that pleasure inclines us toward the things from which we receive that pleasure. So if you're spending a lot of time taking pleasure in, say, slasher films, you're allowing yourself to be desensitized to those displays of sin. This isn't an absolute thing, but it does call for moderation and self reflection.

>>752652

Yes, it’s the how more than the what in this case…even if a Christian should avoid crass representations of those sins in media and art. One thing is, for example, nudity or even eros, another is lewd faux “art” and pornography.

>>752745

>>752694

To elaborate a bit on non-human beings/fantasy races, what about any being in the media work that was artificially created? Is that a problem?

bump

>>752645

>>756361

Upon further consideration the narrative has switched from heroes PWNing villains to pathetic White Knights and abusive thugs.

We therefore shouldn't consume such toxic content and should instead work on our novels including music, programing, Chess or any other creative and intelligent endeavors.

>>756361

>With movies you imagine you're the main character and you do everything the main character does

Ridiculous.

>>757014

This is an interesting idea. Narrative media with good themes and messages. Could be both enjoyable to make and helpful for both the writer and the consumer. If subtle enough, might promote Christian values to other people too.

The dangers to avoid would be slipping into secular and other sinful themes, or forgetting the reason for producing the media and doing it primarily for fame or profit instead.

>>752645

As with everything ask yourself

>Does this separate me from God

If it does i.e. straight up pornography then probably

>>757976

>The problem is Non-Christians identify with the villains. So the villains have been getting better and better treatment as time goes on.

I thought of two possible ways of writing villains in the hopes of avoiding this. The first would be writing villains that are horribly grotesquely evil that no one would sympathize with them. The issue with this would be that today people are fascinated with even some of the most evil of characters.

The other way I can think of would be instead of straight villains, using antagonists that go through redemption to become morally better people. The problem here is running the risk of people empathizing with them too early, before the redemption occurs.

All that being said, as much as I like this idea of producing media that promotes Christin values, I don't want to derail the main topic of this thread.

>>757976

Maybe we ought to recommend more proper media for christians here?

>The problem is Non-Christians identify with the villains. So the villains have been getting better and better treatment as time goes on.

Quite disagree, if anything, they're making religious people the villain in some of the media, like if thrusting god and the church is some kind fanaticism.