No.18963
Right wing iterations of Neo-Paganism almost invariably fail as viable and meaningful resuscitations of the old ways for the same reason; they habitually fail to really include genuine spiritual content. This is because this scene on the whole has an overwhelming aversion towards "the occult", and this would seem to be born of a desire to not seem too unpalatable to atheists and even Christians, and is symptomatic of deep internalization of these worldviews (which actually share a great deal in common)
I already know many of you reading this are internally wincing. "The fucking occult? Seriously? Get outta here with your degenerate satanist/wicca/jewish shit!" Well here's the thing - genuine European Paganism is not neatly separable from the occult. In fact its very much a part of it.
As far as I can tell from six or so years of participating in online communities dedicated to reviving the ways of our ancestors to countermand Christianity as part of the broader European ethno-nationalist resurgence, pre-Thulean Perspective Varg being my entry point, I've seen little to nothing which could be described as genuine spiritual discussion, practice or instruction for potential converts. What I've seen plenty of is vague speculation about history and purely materialistic rationalizations of Paganism was supposedly all about, but no hands on spirituality. At best, the Gods are treated as real, but vague and distant like the Christian god. Any occult Pagans out there certainly keep quiet about it, likely to avoid attracting ire, thus leaving new entrants without content to follow.
This is all seems to be because the scene/movement at large only draws on historical (or pseudo-historical) and political/philosophical material as its sources, rejecting occult literature with atheistic/Christian reasoning that such things are irrational and/or morally corrupt and certainly alien to our people.
The thing is, the sorcery of our ancestors was and is very much real, and its only through practices associated with, for lack of a better term, "the occult", that we can have real first hand relations with our Gods. It doesn't necessarily matter if those practices aren't exactly the same ones used in antiquity, for example calling upon Aesir and Vanir to empower sigils. But the important thing is that this works, extremely well, and puts us in direct communion with the Gods themselves.
The fact of the matter is we need to start approaching Heathenism as a spiritual system, not just a causal worldview or philosophy. It will always fail because Paganism without magic and spirituality is ultimately empty and meaningless, a fraud, a larp. I understand your apprehension, the occult scene is full of types who don't necessarily seem very palatable to right wing people, but consider the fact that they are interacting with real Pagan gods and undergoing spiritual alchemy whilst rightists are busy speculating about this and that based on scant historical records. We need to get real here. Otherwise we'll only let this problem deepen, and the spiritual wellbeing of our people will never recover.
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No.18964
This is all true. Christianity has had such a damaging affect on people, like cultural trauma. But even Christianity is just as larpy as it too is has gone the materialistic route to cater towards atheists. Christians celebrate holidays but don't believe in magic, they just hive mind with their church and highly liberal facebook neochristians.
Anyone that's "into" any form of heathenism but is not into magic doesn't really make sense, aside from the literalists that think magic is "unmanly" but this is more due to honor face-to-face fighting being of high social importance to ancient Germanics than magic itself being unmanly. Magic is only unmanly in the same way that rifles, missiles, and death rays are unmanly, so there is this belief that people should be truthful and avoid subversive actions. Which means, it would be of poor character to be doing something low like casting curses over petty shit or using magic for crime and other evil deeds. Times have changed, so there will never be an exact return to the ways of the past. Which is funny though because people tend to use this as an argument to dissuade people from returning to pagan ways, as if it has to be perfectly replicating the ancient path in order to be legit. This is why I believe neopagan is a bullshit term that modern society felt the need to event to try and not admit that modern paganism is possible.
Over the years, I've noticed it in occasional conversations, mostly random places online, that people absolutely cannot handle the concept of modern paganism. It's almost as if it drives them mad on a deep psychological level. Even people like professors, which are supposed to support all cultures and religions, start getting aggressive with the idea of nature on the spiritual level, shamanism, and paganism. Modern scientific attempts to study such topics as psychic abilities seems to flip people into getting mad as well. Like remote viewing, an ability studied by PhD physicists for the government, and people just get angry about this as if they are offended at the idea that anything close to spiritual is real. I can understand people being tired of new age frauds, but I doubt this has caused the mass Stockholm Syndrome in people to attack anything magic like if we're still in the days of the witch hunts. I grew up Christian and found it fascinating that so many people from my church did not believe in magic, while the bible was full of magic and they claimed to believe in magic. I'm not talking about miracles either, I mean like when the Egyptians were able to perform magic and had a dance-off with Moses, or the spiritual gift of prophecy. Also fascinating to me is that church had some of the most dark and toxic people in it, while also behaving like a hivemind network of liberal cucks, and then these people claim magicians are evil.
I really don't know if there is much you could do to change the views of people on this. You can lead them to good sources but they have to deal with the years of the damage caused by their upbringing and other social pressures. I think it's easier for Christians to become pagan than for atheists though since atheists tend to be more strongly opposed to the occult as Christians at least had some spiritual upbringing. Many atheists I know even seem somewhat soulless, as if they have a harder time finding inner joy. If you're talking about /pol/ then I really can't say, as they're in their own world, not to put them down though as they work wonders.
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No.18982
I agree current "Paganism" is more a political/philosophic vehicle than anything, productive as a method of rebelling against foreign influence and discovering the past. Herein lies the issue, a complete void of viscera and mystery inherent in authentic spirituality. I'm not sure if I classify as "Pagan", I have beliefs but they do not fit into in anywhere. They are somewhat syncretic, but mostly originate through search, prayer and ritual. The past has some answers but I am finding more in the present and future through innovation and discovery.
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No.18983
>Believe seidr/galdr/sorcery is used to have first hand relationship with the Gods
>Not understanding the inherent spiritual nature of the universe and the Gods as kin
>????
>PROFIT!
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No.19007
>>18982
In a sense, you're right. Pagans today need to become more practicing pagans rather than pagans in name only. The only difficulty with this is how much Kabbalah and other kike shit has infested what is supposed to be European occultism. If we could sort that out, I'd think we'd have a solid foundation for kickstarting European paganism once more, the way it used to be, where people actually interacted with the gods and spirits and asked for their aid and guidance.
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No.19009
>>19007
Half of that kike shit was probably stolen anyways from Egypt and Mesopotamia. Hinduism is worth looking into because there are similarities, even if long separated over time and space. Then don't forget to look into folk magic and fairy tales.
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No.19010
>>19009
I'm not completely sure, but there may also be something of value to be found in Wicca and other forms of pagan witchcraft (not the New Age fluff bunny garbage that roasties seem to love so much, but actual traditional witchcraft). As long as we make it our own thing as traditionalists, I think it could work.
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No.19014
Everything starts at communal rituals. As long as heathens practice their faith between 4 walls of their home and not public there won't be much progress. Not to mention the modern aversion towards animal sacrifices and similar harsher rituals. Everything has to be PC and acceptable to modern palate.
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No.19015
>>19010
I don't really know anything about wicca, besides wiccans basically being larping atheists that don't even believe in magic. I sometimes hear that it was completely made with no real history behind it. Wicca books and websites look like garbage, so that's probably true. I've never been fond of wicca, it's like every wiccan I meet just makes it worse, dropping it to a new low.
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No.19020
>>19015
Wicca is even worse than just simple Atheism, it is apart of the Semitic two-pronged attack of being the force to create the problem but also the force to provide their own "solution" to the problem. You can find this tactic even in the Christian Old Testament, in "Bel and the Dragon", the simple caved-in-head Christian take is just "idolators are stupid lmao" but a more closer read which is what the Protestant's finally did brings out a notation a Christian cannot accept, in that throughout the story where Daniel is convincing the Persian King to kill his priests and destroy the altars to the gods, there is no conversion moment or respite unto the gentiles, its just basically YHWH wants you to die and the jews are his people to do it. A similar notion is within 2 Maccabees about Antiochus IV, and was a book Martin Luther heavily detested.
This whole Semitic tactic could be the basis of Christianity itself, not with Jesus but with Saul either out of the need to "save Judaism" from the Christian sect or "part of the plan" to prevent the Romans from destroying Judaism entirely, in any case it is probably not a coincidence that the oldest work in the New Testament is attributed to Saul, likewise not a coincidence that most of the New Testament is made up of the works attributed to him, and finally Saul's whole mission is focused unto the gentiles.
This is why even though "christcucks" and "wiccagay" are terms and fights to be had, as much emphasis should also be placed on, that without the jews themselves, there wouldn't be Christianity or Islam in the first place. And also most likely without jews being around, Christianity and Islam would fall apart, Augustine of Hippo understood this, "By their own Scriptures Jewish survival is a testimony to us that we have not forged the prophecies about Christ.".
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No.19023
With that being said, any paganons know of any occult books or resources that teach various magic techniques or rituals without using Kabbalah?
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No.19024
>>19023
Do you have anything specific in mind, like what do you want to achieve with magic?
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No.19025
>>19024
I suppose guides to techniques like spirit invocation and evocation, hexes and blessings, divination; that sort of thing. I think enlisting the help of spirits and gods especially would help in the fight against white genocide and Marxism.
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No.19026
>>19025
I don't that much about spirit work but I need to get into it. A common practice around the world is to create a shrine or alter to focus your thoughts at and make offerings like food and incense. If you live near a forest, you can just find a secluded area you like without having to build a shrine. I've tried to make telepathic connections with gods and elves but I haven't felt much connection. I once had a very realistic dream of being with elves. For whatever reason though, I've been having many signs as if Anubis is connecting to me and I'm not even into Egyptian stuff.
Divination is mostly about interpreting signs, which can be from specific tools like tarot or runes, or interpreting signs out of everything you see like when traveling through the city. I can't think of any books on this subject but practice is good.
Hexes and blessings can be done through galdr and bindrunes. Sigil magic is a good place to start.
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No.19027
>>19026
Thanks for the tips, this is helpful to get started.
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No.19029
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>19027
I don't know how accurate this is but I use this as a source when making rune sigils: http://esotericawakening.com/understanding-the-galdrabok
Look up videos on Megin, Hamingja, and Fylgja.
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No.19030
>>19023
Kleine Runenkunde published in Germany in 1941.
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No.19031
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
Posting that video made me think more about faeries. We need more faery tales. According to the author Katharine Briggs, faeries and elves are the same or closely related. Like how elves can be divided into different groups, so can they, so the two may not align fully as there might be some types only found in some regions. Then some may be more distant from this reality than others.
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No.19032
>>19031
Be careful around elves, many early Christians with Druid training often invoked that it was the elves themselves who guided their coming.
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No.19033
>>19032
I think that's one of my lesser concerns. I should be worried about getting kidnapped to another dimension and forced to be a fairy slave.
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No.19034
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>19033
From that old song, Sir Thomas de Ercildoun didn't seem to mind, perhaps the endless tiring struggle for the folk in Wall-hall is a bit overrated, like the lack of struggle in anyone in Hefonan, so Fair Alfheimr is where to go, a "new" middle-ground like our own middle world.
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No.19042
>>19034
I could barely understand the Irish accent but I listened and it sounded good for the half I did understood.
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No.19043
A little update; I spoke of innovating rituals and these are a couple practices I've been doing: Try to enter a trance state and listen to dissonant music or noise, the intended effect is to let go of conciousness and try to embody and understand chaos at a less human but more primal level. Another is prayer to WOTAN=Will Of The Aryan Nation, which I will do awake or through lucid dreaming while asleep to try establishing connection to the racial family to draw/give strength from/to.
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No.19054
>seem to be born of a desire to not seem too unpalatable to atheists and even Christians
Nope, you missed it by a mile.
Occultism is avoided because religion is a tool, and occultism looses sight of that. Religiosity correlates with high birthrates, happiness, societal cohesion, etc so religion seems to be a valuable practise. European pagan religions do a better job at promoting family, honor, nature, strength, hard work and a grounding in the real world than Semitic religions, which advocate the opposite - apathy, subservience to authority, unreality of existence and focus on a world hereafter. Christianity specifically teaches that one must love all equally, and put the needs of the stranger and the enemy above those of ones own kin. Occultism risks forgetting the above reasons for adherence to paganism, and simply pursuing mysticism for its own sake.
This is why the right looks to paganism, and why the occult is frowned upon.
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No.19055
>>19043
Do you ever wonder if the gods still walk among here in Midgard? The Norwegian royal family traces their lineage all the way back to Freyr. Imagine if Wotan is secretly part of some Norwegian high government council, using a different name.
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No.19056
>>19055
Where ever we go, the Aesir follow, "ungraspable and yet my kinsman". I know, thou hung from the windy tree, nights of all nine.
Just in the etymology of the word "hung", you can see a history stretching from Hittite to Sanskirt.
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No.19059
>>19055
> The Norwegian royal family traces their lineage all the way back to Freyr
That's unsourced horsehit but i want to believe it
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No.19060
>>19059
I looked at the wiki for the prince of Norway one day and kept clicking on predecessor out of curiosity to see how far back it goes, and after clicking ten to twenty times more after reaching Harald Fairhair I eventually found the end of the line which was the god Freyr. The Japanese royal family also traces their lineage to gods too.
I want to marry Norweigan princess Ingrid, loot at this qt https://www.royalcourt.no/seksjon.html?tid=28797&sek=28432
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No.19071
>>19055
Haha, that is quite the speculation, bittersweet if true. To your question, I do believe among a select few of our folk, the flame of divinity does burn. In the most indomitable and fanatically committed warriors of our Rahowa. It is not manifested through lineage, but by the spiritually pure who incarnate its light, the ones who leave the deepest footprints upon the Earth.
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No.19113
>>18963
what do atheism and christianity have in common?
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No.19114
>>19055
Wotans original name, Ohr. Probably pre ascension name.
The Western half of the Danish and Northern Germanic royal lineages original family name Ohr. Coincidence?
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No.19122
>>19060
The current Royal line doesn't go back to Harald though. Its a different dynasty.
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No.19125
>>19122
Oh shit, you're right, I was clicking on the wrong link.
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No.19160
>>18963
That's a very distorted worldview.
Paganism doesn't have to be Theistic in the same sense as Christianity; and that's where you're making a mistake in calling rightwing paganism "Empty".
Paganism is like language. If you grew up speaking English, then you use English words. If you grew up without language, then you speak no words; it is relevant ONLY within the scope of our cultural background; this is why Tacitus likened Our English god Woden (Norse Odin) to Mercury, because they were essentially the same God in how they were revered. Mercury basically meant "Odin" in Latin, at least on a cultural level. When a language like the Na'vi language (Off of the movie Avatar) is spoken, it's unnatural to our own ears culturally, because it's not a real ethnicity, nor is it YOUR ethnicity. Likewise, practicing paganism outside of what is relevant to your own culture, is unnatural.
It's not about the profane time/date belief system of Christianity, where you find a specific chronology, or find a specific location to worship. Paganism is different in that way, because "Sacred" is time immemorial and has no physical space except by what is revered.
Whether it's "Real" is not the question, You can believe in the gods being real if you want.. Or you can be an atheist. The purpose of paganism is that you practice reverence. I'm a fisherman, for example; and as a fisherman, at least in this part of the season, i've been catching lobsters, and I've been throwing garbage in the water, and throwing the shells on the land somewhere. But because of paganism, I revere the Ocean as a god ("Aegir" in Norse, but I call him "Sea"), and due to the worship, I feel PERSONALLY guilty for wronging Sea with pollution and taking without sacrifice. So I do make sacrifice. I give Sea bones and lime.
Paganism is about practicing reverence. And we do so within a religious-language that we understand, one that is culturally relevant. You CANNOT be pagan without being rightwing
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No.19190
>>19160
>But because of paganism, I revere the Ocean as a god ("Aegir" in Norse, but I call him "Sea")
You've got it all wrong m80, amateur mistake, Aegir isn't just simply the sea, he's a metaphysical/spiritual being you operates and influences our world via the sea, the jist is that our reality is a reflection of the divine
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