/v/ - Video Games

I don't know any platformers quite like dustforce, so even without getting into any details about the specifics of controls, I'd say you're justified having a hard time to get into it on that principle alone. It's a very precise platformer that requires more planning, memorizing and muscle memory than improvisation.

>>16649784

Why aren't there more platformers that utilize Dustforce's formula of having a lot of movement options, but also making almost every surface have spikes to force the player to utilize those options to their fullest?

>>16649841

Guaca controls are really shit

>>16649804

>levels have no down time or breathing room and are just 100% challenge all the time

I'd prefer something like mario where the levels flow, have pacing and are actually fun. I could see enjoying some of the platforming in dustforce if it was broken up with easier sections and checkpoints or had branching paths sometimes, though I could see how autistic memorization robots would like it as is.

>>16649838

Okay, but what about the reddit memes though?

The way Dustforce's controls work essentially makes it so that, at any given moment in time, you have a certain amount of x-axis momentum and a certain amount of y-axis momentum, meaning that any given input isn't necessarily going to feel like it's immediately going through. Once you get a feel for the characters' weight and how moves can be chained or canceled, it's not going to be as bad, but yeah, it can be hard to adjust if you're used to completely instantaneous acceleration in platformers.

>even though I managed to get up and out before I now seem to be stuck in the pit the tutorial levels are in, feels bad man.

You just have to do a wall run on the left and then double jump, don't overthink it.

>>16651990

*wall run on the right

It's been a while since I was down in that pit

I liked Dustforce more until I found out the optimal way to play was to spam dash when running. I found it really tedious and took a lot of the fun out.

>>16651980

You don't pay attention to reddit being retards. Similarly, you don't pay attention to dialogues being reddit-tier retarded. You're here to play games. Guacamelee isn't a fourt the game Dustforce is, but it did qualify to the question anon asked, it's all there is to it.

>>16661191

Okay, you now have to unlock your broom as the janitor, the other characters, double jump, dash, both types of attacks and your super-attack. You get cutscenes every time you finish a level of the other characters telling you how terrible the dust invasion is and how the entire world is doomed if you don't clean everything.

You've got ADD and normalfag-tier game design knowledge. Please go to Reddit and spare us your abysmal posts.

>>16649804

Because they're a niche genre within 2d platforming. They're more like puzzle games.

Rayman's newer games do pretty much the same thing but with more forgiving on mistakes. They're designed to be absolutely perfect on the timing of everything. If you fuck up for 1 second you lose the timing and flow. They even get it so tight it plays music in DLC levels, real music not shitty game music.

>>16661310

Even though I disagree with his "new powerups" sentiment, I'd say the rest of his points hold up, take Super Meat Boy as an example.

>>16661191

you're not supposed to grind a game like dustforce, you're supposed to play it on and off, like Tetris.

>>16661385

I disagree with all his progression and exploration points. Something I do think though is that the combat is very shallow, and what's there is barely utilized, and yeah, maybe the game could use a bit more gimmicks like the lab enemies which will hit you back if you don't get them at the correct angle. Only in my third playthrough I actually bothered to try something else instead of stunlocking and found out how launching enemies in the air with a downward light/heavy attack let's you do some pretty okay juggling.

>Super Meat Boy

It did some things better and others wrong. The cutscenes break the flow of the game, and the mission structure is better in Dustforce, also the bosses in Super Meat Boy are all shit except for Brownie, and even then that's just a race. Little Horn is such a shit boss fight it drags the game down. The stages are more varied though, and the exploration is better in that it introduces things like secrets in stages and secret stages.

>>16652002

I agree with this very much. I didn't even get to play the game very much, because I watched a replay on a level, and then I realized that the game is supposed to be played with dashing. Such a shame. I really like the music, the general idea, and the visual style. The challenge seemed fun as well. Dashing just ruined the game for me completely.

>>16649804

Because N+ was a gimmicky flash-like game. It was fun for a few minutes before the novelty wore off.

>>16661191

I haven't played Dustforce, but I can tell you already that you are a retard, if you think that getting better at the game itself isn't sensible progression.

>>16662341

Another ADHD-ridden nigger. How about you actually try and get good at the game? And I don't mean earn some shitty in-game stats that improve your performance, I mean your knowledge of what you can do, what enemies do, how levels look and so on. Actual skill.

>>16649804

There is literally a whole genre based around using that idea, hell there's even a subgenre within that genre focused entirely on spikes and hard jump and then another subgenre within that subgenre with an even tighter focus on that.

https://delicious-fruit.com/ratings/full.php?advanced=1&tags=L_Game

The Eternal Castle has the least responsive controls I've ever seen in a game

The world and levels are interesting enough, but the controls are absolute dogshit and take about a solid 2 seconds in some cases to respond

>>16661191

<waah me want big numbers on the screen

<why don't big numbers appear on the screen

>>16662934

>big numbers appear on the screen in megaman/mario/contra/meatboy

???

I think I've given up on Dustforce, but I grabbed N++ a few days ago and love it to bits. Never been that big on platformers but it's really good fun fuck the levels with huge clouds of gold.

>>16673534

My biggest problem with N++ is most of the challenge from a level comes with collecting all or most of the gold, but the timer isn't nearly short enough(even in hardcore mode) to justify not skipping the gold and blazing through to the exit a good chunk of the earlier levels. I honestly haven't gotten to post 10+ levels so the level design might have changed later but I just wasn't having much fun. Collecting gold isn't my idea of it.

>>16673563

The main challenge is going for good overall times, if you want to complete levels/episodes with as much time left over as possible (and hence improve ranking) you generally need to collect all the gold and clear the level quickly, though on some of the levels with really scattered/tons of gold you can get a better time without collecting it all. The intro levels are somewhat bland for the most part, once you get into the meat of the game they're more interesting. After that there are apparently challenges for levels that require things like activating all toggle mines while avoiding all gold, etc.

Though I can see why the game would be kind of boring if you had no interest in ranking whatsoever, trying to find little tricks or routes to take to clear levels faster is part of the appeal to me, I generally try to rank top 100 on any level before I check top 10 replays to see what routes/tricks others are using manged to get 1 top 10 and handful of top 20s.

>>16673534

>>16673563

The thing about gold is that it's meant to give score primarily, or for completion, or unlocking new colour schemes. I've completed all normal levels in all three sections, most X levels and some hidden ones, so if you guys have an issue with any I can show you what to do.

>>16673602

>Apparently

Nigger, you better know what ? or ! levels are.

>>16649804

Like this?

>>16673610

Only played the game for ~30 hours, not unlocked that yet.

>>16649804

Here's an idea, let's give the player a ton of freedom in what he can do, and then design levels that absolutely restrict what he can do to one or two options at most.

>>16674907

>penalized for navigating the level incorrectly

Yes, that is the point of platformers.

>>16662325

>It shouldn't be a revelation that a game built around speed is supposed to be played quickly.

Never fucking said it was.

>It's not spamming

It's still tedious.

>>16674918

Honestly not really a fan of platformers to begin with, but I think there's a lot of difference between "penalized for playing badly" and "there is only one correct way". The latter is never good, but it's especially bad when the key selling point of the game is the number of ways to do things.

>>16674927

That's fair, one might argue that a game with only one correct way to play it is just a rhythm game without a beat.

>>16674927

What other ways are there? Either you make it over the pit or you don't.

>>16673561

It is.

Imagine having shit and cum shoveled down into your throat for a millennia because kikes like you want it. This is the way the white race dies.

>>16675918

How do you read this? Have you spent 8 days and 8 hours in menus, or 808 hours?

>>16675981

>that image

Somebody please explain to me how the fuck you can manage to get 16 as a result

>>16676363

Order of operations gives us 20/20. You get 16 if you don’t use order of operations and parse left to right without any consideration.

20/5=4

4*2=8

8*2=16

Of course, there’s always the possibility that there’s something even more fucked going on, but let’s not imagine what.

>>16676363

It's neither the old way nor common core. It's just a different order of operations. Most of the used order of operations put multiplication and division in the same precedence, but some of them will put multiplication before division. It's further confused because they don't explicitly specify the multiplication sign between the 5 and the parenthesis. Regardless of order of operations, you get 20 / 5 * (2 * 2) = 20 / 5 * 4. If multiplication has precedence, the 5 * 4 is done first, giving 20 / 20 =1. Otherwise it's 20 / 5 * 4 = 4 * 4 = 16.

The woman in the picture is misrepresenting it, because the "old way" uses PEMDAS in a way that groups MD and AS as the same precedence, and so would also give 16.

>>16676374

>Order of operations gives us 20/20

There are many rules for order of operations that vary based on fields of mathematics and programming, particularly in fields where there are multiple kinds of multiplication (like linear algebra). In common arithmetic (and up through algebra and calculus, consequently), multiplication and division are at the same precedence, so it should be 16.

The important thing to remember is that Order of Operations is not a rule of math. It's a rule for interpreting a written equation in a way that groups things that are commonly intended to be grouped to reduce the number of parentheses required to be explicit. Without order of operations or with one that is badly-constructed, you have to use a lot of grouping symbols to express the correct intent.

Sage for off-topic post.

Common core doesn't change order of operations, though. It's a bait image.

>>16674960

That's why there's an emphasis on the leader boards. There's obviously more than one way to play the game. As you get better you use more advanced methods to rank up. You can beat many of the levels without slope diving for example. But god damn if it isn't fun as fuck. Same goes with spike jumping.