f10a80 No.15864020
So in the 6th gen of consoles between DMC1 &3, GoW 1&2, God Hand, Ninja Gaiden, there were so many shining examples of how to make an action games amazing.
But then it seems even trying a game outside this comfort zone of series names with small exception for action games just leaves you with absolute shit.
Even GoW has absolute dog shite combat now.
Like even the more basic listings like DMC 1 and GoW 1 are some how 2 console generations on in the upper area of mechanical complexity, literally show.
In the last 5 years the only game to even show attempts at breaking into to being as good from what I've found is Assault Spy.
54c93c No.15864023
>Even GoW has absolute dog shite combat now.
>now
It was always shit.
585422 No.15864024
Bayonetta 2 was great though
Yes 2014 was 4 years ago
585422 No.15864025
>>15864023
It was passable before because it had tits, now even thats gone
f10a80 No.15864029
>>15864024
Mistake on my part, I was meant to say new name (as in new property), and actually checked Bayonetta 1's release to double check that, for me just to fuck up the wording in the OP.
Sorry.
585422 No.15864042
>>15864029
Well you're lucky it's december and not August or you'd be wrong since W101 also was a thing
f10a80 No.15864045
>>15864042
I did check for W101
4587df No.15864047
a lot of devs made action games inspired by what DMC did with the genre and subsequently released flops or started working in other genres. Those that released flops couldn't really skate by much of the time and those that weren't dedicated to the genre obviously moved on with the lessons they learned. There was a lot of buzz at the time around DMC so developers all over tried their own take on its formula and style of action. It's much easier to get development for a game like that if there's a market zeitgeist around the genre already - which is why you saw so many 7th gen shooters for example.
Since most of those devs are working on different things entirely or are no longer around today, we're left with just a handful of creators that work in that genre. Platinum being the key example but they've unfortunately become pretty stale. They have skilled people that work there and creative people but they have also figured out a general formula for action games that they don't necessarily need to recreate the wheel with each new game they release. This is a real shame and it may have improved the standard of quality across the board but it has made some games feel a lot less special.
There's still games from smaller developers being produced that look very refreshing, such as Sakuna and Skylens, and even some of the ideas of the action game genre are being explored in other genres such as in Link the Unleashed Nexus which clearly gets its character movement and feel from those style of games and explores it in a type of platformer/navigation space.
bf7df9 No.15864048
>>15864020
Action RPGs are better anyways.
f10a80 No.15864054
>>15864048
>Basic mindless action game where numbers appear on top of heads
>Good
Literally just play runescape at that point.
d081a2 No.15864056
>>15864024
Try as I might I can NOT enjoy Bayo as a character. I find her incredibly annoying.
585422 No.15864060
>>15864045
Well honestly the main reason why there hasn't been a good new IP for Curazee gaymes is that the best actually need a fair amount of investment so it's limited to A and AA studios at a minimum and the only people who can make a good new one in those positions Ie Itsune and Platinum are kinda stuck adding to franchises they've made before or in Platinums case forced to make mobile games and grand jew games to keep a float
also where has Suda51 been recently
585422 No.15864062
>>15864056
So are you a smash brothers player?
d081a2 No.15864072
>>15864062
Absolutely not.
bf7df9 No.15864075
>>15864054
I'm referring to games like Dark Souls, Nioh or Bloodborne. Games with built variety, good combat and challenging gameplay instead of simple button mashing. Not that simplicity isn't fun from time to time, but it gets repetative real quick.
f10a80 No.15864097
>4 games = an entire genre
d1bfd0 No.15864101
>>15864075
You don't really need the RPG elements for any of those things, though.
b4e9f1 No.15864104
Considering how many normalniggers have told me that Batman/Shadow of Boredor have "the best combat in any action game" I'm not surprised that skill-based action is a niche now. You guys keep listing games made by either Capcom/Clover/Platinum, Team Ninja or From. The talent pool is incredibly small and I only really see doujins even attempting to break in anymore.
afb1ec No.15864123
>>15864075
>>15864048
Negative no nein fuck off
Level mechanics do nothing but excuse poor game balancing or the lack of a difficulty curve.
"oh this game is too easy" "well you're too high level" and then you have to restart your whole playthrough because you've made the game boring. It's somewhat acceptable in short games or the rare game that allows you to downscale your level, and I can only think of one off the top of my head that does this. But leveling, especially uncontrolled levelling (yes I know the souls games don't have this) can absolutely ruin a game. The biggest flaw in nier automata is the absolute bullshit of leveling up completely stripping the fun from the game, and the difficulty levels not adjusting enemy health, only making you take more damage. By the end of your first playthrough there's very little potential to enjoy all your new weapons and abilities because everything dies too quickly.
32c9bb No.15864127
Assault Spy that good? I was going to give it a shot but the system reqs seem too high and I couldn't bother seeing if my toaster could run it.
d0c2c1 No.15864136
>action games
>genre
what a stupid question tbh.
4105c9 No.15864138
>>15864123
Difficulty that scales numbers is shit in general. You should change enemy placement and quantity.
bf6fc4 No.15864147
>>15864141
Funny thing is sugar stole this for her background story and from a different one for char designs.
bf7df9 No.15864148
>>15864123
You can't become overleveled on accident. It requires hours of grinding. Grinding is basically the RPG equivalent of easy modo.
4105c9 No.15864150
>>15864148
t. guy who has never played more than two RPGs
>hey look, a side area. let me check out this cool content the devs made!
>whoops, my "reward" is that the rest of the entire fucking game is permanently in easy mode because i had the gumption to enjoy more content
d40055 No.15864151
>>15864056
This. I like game but don't like that old hag and ugly art style overall.
d0c2c1 No.15864154
>>15864148
>You can't become overleveled on accident
in most rpgs have side quests. usually people complete those side quests before moving on to the main story missions so they dont miss anything. often; side missions are enough to make you so overleveled that the main mission is retardedly easy since the difficulty was usually designed so that someone could play straight through the story and face a challenge.
afb1ec No.15864168
>>15864148
When the game is genuinely fun and has combat that doesn't get stale quickly, and you actually fight every enemy in front of you or even go out of your way to fight more, you shouldn't have the fun taken out of the game. Progress should come in the form of more gameplay mechanics / weapons, never just "number goes up". The game I referred to is TWEWY, a game with interesting combat that gives you a slider that goes up to whatever level you currently have, and you can backslide it all the way to 1 if you choose. Level progression happens independently. This is ideal for an action game with leveling. Any other system is limiting for no reason.
d07e54 No.15864193
>>15864161
First of all, TORpedo, he's not talking.
Second, he never asked why the genre is shit, he asked why it was inconsistent.
Lastly, your obsession with jews and leftists without seeing the bigger picture is what got you into this mess in the first place.
718c4b No.15864197
How can an anime be SU-tier without even being made by Trigger?
bf7df9 No.15864217
>>15864150
>>15864154
I haven't encountered that issue yet, but maybe I'm just playing the wrong/right Action RPGs.
>>15864168
>Progress should come in the form of more gameplay mechanics / weapons
Thats the good thing about Dark Souls or Nioh. You can choose what to spend your exp points on. Either items, gear, weapons or leveling up. And you can even lose them if you die twice in a row.
31b186 No.15864242
>>15864020
I call those games character action spectacle fighters because I'm a pretentious twat.
1304b4 No.15864252
>>15864242
stylish action games
d0c2c1 No.15864258
>>15864217
what rpg has a main quest so hard that completing sidequests doesnt overlevel you?
f10a80 No.15864274
>>15864259
>STILL uses the beta builds
What really, that explains why those collections are missing so much shit from sound effects and textures across them all.
998b96 No.15864276
>>15864242
They're just action games with good combat, not Platinum's fault Insomniac and WB decided to rip off Asscreed for their capeshit games.
31b186 No.15864278
>>15864252
Combo-based platinoids.
Hack & beat & slash & shoot 'em ups.
Kamiyalikes.
Twitterblockers.
Third-person stylers.
Mashpausers.
31b186 No.15864282
bf7df9 No.15864284
>>15864258
The most recent RPG I've played was Persona 5. The side quests in general were relatively easy. And the last Action RPG was Nioh. The challenging side quests come after you finished the main story.
998b96 No.15864288
>>15864282
he's still right
f10a80 No.15864290
>>15864288
Too bad all his friends are massive turbo faggots except ironically Turbo
32c9bb No.15864295
d0c2c1 No.15864336
>>15864284
i played persona 5 as well. youre right… the later bosses were still hard and the sidequests alone were not enough to make you overleveled. one of the main reasons i loved that rpg… but i wouldnt say thats a norm.
nioh didnt really have sidequests… that stuff was really just challenging post-game content.
821bd8 No.15864360
>>15864258
>>15864284
I've never had this problem with Atlus games in general. In most cases there you need to do the sidequests or you end up underlevelled for the main quest
f10a80 No.15864372
>>15864360
Levels don't mean much in atlas games, simply having a good move set lets you get over level gaps due to how potent buffs, debuffs and status effects are.
>Moves >Stats >level
b0d27c No.15864403
I fucking hate how braindead it is to avoid attacks in all these new cuhrayzee games.
Literally all you do is press a single button at the right time to i-frame dodge everything, whereas older cuhrazy games actually made it important to consider positioning, what direction you dodged in, and how you dodged it. DMC actually had you jump to avoid attacks and roll sideways, in God Hand you had to read tells to decide what direction to dodge incoming blows, meanwhile in Bayo you can stand still in one spot and press dodge at the right time as Witch Time gave you free chances to deal damage without any risk
d0c2c1 No.15864409
>>15864372
>describes the way RPGs are meant to be designed
f10a80 No.15864415
>>15864403
Bayonetta 2 even lost the "You don't need witch time" argument since there's no difficulty now that removes it now due to the dependency on it in certain fights.
d0c2c1 No.15864419
>>15864403
i hate i-frames. they should only exist as post-hit invincibility. its a lazy way to make a dodge more effective.
nier automata is probably the biggest offender with this. you can literally spam the "dodge" button and remain invincible for extended periods of time.
bloodborne handled it well, by making the i-frames static and short. and made the game nearly impossible without it but they should have just made the dodge faster and a longer leap.
1304b4 No.15864425
>>15864403
DMC has i-frames too. You could side roll a horizontal attack and jump through a vertical attack and not be hit. The window just wasn't as high.
32c9bb No.15864443
>>15864403
I think the concept of a dedicated dodge button as a whole is flawed. I think to dodge an attack you have to physically avoid it using your normal movement moveset otherwise it you end up with something like the newer Ys games where all you do is simply go up to a boss, whack them around and time your dodges to their attacks, completely removing the spacing and positioning element from the fight.
b0d27c No.15864460
>>15864425
It did, but you didn't rely on them for their i-frame properties, they were there to make dodging melee attacks on reaction feel more consistent, even so you still had to pay attention to whether an attack would be better jumped over or rolled around depending on the situation so you don't accidentally roll into another enemy's attack
467f24 No.15864533
>>15864295
No one important
952300 No.15864565
>>15864290
What about Hyper Bit Hero?
>>15864295
TheGamingBritShow
f10a80 No.15865204
>>15864565
>Fate waifu fag
>Paypigs his patreons while he doesn't make videos for massive spaces of time while also making money from his actual job
>Videos are absolute shit anyway
>Safe spaces himself from criticism
He's a massive mega faggot, will literally only talk with people if he can A. Mute you if his baby voice can't talk over you or B. have dick riders derail everything when it doesn't go his way.
afb1ec No.15865295
>>15864419
>bloodborne handled it well
the fuck you say
Bloodborne had the most egregious "5 year olds playing cowboys and indians nah you didn't hit me" iframes. All souls games have that to an extent but in bloodborne they change the roll to a quickstep, and you can literally quickstep through horizontal swings that should bisect you.
I-frames are absolute shit 99% of the time, because 99% of the time they fulfill at least one of two conditions that make them shit; first, having zero visual indication / making no goddamn sense, like above (nier automat does actually teleport, making it look proper). And second, never being explained in game. So there's no reasonable way for a player to learn "oh I can just roll THROUGH this obvious hit and phase through it like a ghost because the developers are fucking lazy and hate immersion". I-frames are lazy fucking garbage, but automat is one of the few games where at least they make some kind of sense.
952300 No.15865882
>>15865204
>Videos are absolute shit anyway
I won't argue with your first two points but I don't immediately see how his videos are bad.
>Safe spaces himself from criticism
I don't know anything about this.
21254e No.15865957
>>15864336
>nioh didnt really have sidequests
There were quite alot sidequests. Like these training missions for each weapon type and very early in the games(I think one or two missions in) there's this fight. You don't have to beat him, but he's the ultimate casual filter. Took me like 20 attempts.
500779 No.15865973
Nier automatas combat is pretty fun
f10a80 No.15866007
>>15865882
>I don't immediately see how his videos are bad.
1.They're incredibly lazy content, literally anyone on the subjects he covers can say everything he does, he doesn't bring anything to the table which exemplifies how awful his schedule is.
2. His voice is the most grating shit, he's like 1 tier above burger king foot lettuce, paired with bringing nothing to the table it's almost always better to hear it off of someone else anyway.
3. Shit editing and almost any vid with good editing has it done for him.
>I don't know anything about this.
Congrats it means you've never or barely had the displeasure of interacting with him.
ab9501 No.15866398
>>15864020
They can't all be good, anon. Studios have to try new things and fail along the way from time to time.