eafdaf No.15852824
What’s the point of making the villain right if I can’t side with them in the end?
fec630 No.15852828
She wasn't right though. She just had control issues.
eafdaf No.15852833
>>15852828
>she isn’t right
She was, the force takes away a persons free will so in the end the Jedi and Sith are no different.
fec630 No.15852837
>>15852833
How does the force take away your free will?
cd3a83 No.15852847
>you can date the villain of the first game in the second game
Any other series do this?
2e8b5a No.15852853
A villain is very rarely truly right. At the end of the day, these threads are always cherry-picking interesting arguments and completely ignoring both the flaws in them and the villain's general antagonism against you and/or the world.
I mean, it's a fun thought experiment, but there's a world of difference between "hey, let's shoot the shit about villains being cooler dudes than the lame assholes in the camp of good" and actually, legitimately complaining you had to put down who was clearly your enemy.
eafdaf No.15852867
>>15852837
The dark side corrupts you like a drug, the light side takes away your desire. Every person and event is influenced by the force and the force determines the fate of the galaxy. Everything that happens in Star Wars is because the force wills it.
ea5f57 No.15852874
>>15852837
It doesn't unless you actually grow your connections to the force
But simply being connected to the force causes all your actions to be negated by equal parts, which is what Kreia was trying to solve
b0a42b No.15852877
>>15852824
It tells you who you're supposed to like and why that's a good thing.
53d05b No.15852882
>>15852853
>who was clearly your enemy
>implying
Sometimes the villains are objectively right, anon.
745c36 No.15852883
>>15852824
>side with
You played her hand to the very hand, jackass. Good job missing the point.
fec630 No.15852886
>>15852867
I don't think the force determines everything. As for the darkside corrupting you, and the light side taking away desire that was the weakness of the dark jedi and the jedi teachings respectively.
>>15852882
Correct.
e27143 No.15852887
>>15852824
Because Obsidian can't write for shit.
98c72e No.15852906
>>15852833
There's nothing inherently wrong with the force, it's just that the two ideologies/philosophies are both flawed. Kreia's wish to holocaust all force users isn't really a solution either, she's just moralfagging because of seeing and experiencing the error of both sides first hand and wants to 'spare' the rest of the universe from further influence of the force.
But force sensitivity isn't just carried on through genes so it's an impossible task and once the PC dies, who is going to go around and murder all the force sensitive babies?
It's canon that the PC is very charismatic and subconsciously manipulates everyone around them with the force. So clearly the best thing to do is start a new cult order of force users and fuck the black and white mentality that the sith and jedi apply. Almost every party member is force sensitive and can be turned into an actual force user so just expand from there.
>>15852867
>Everything that happens in Star Wars is because the force wills it.
Its not stated anywhere that this is canonically the case, just some people choose to believe in it in such a way.
a23015 No.15852911
>>15852867
>The dark side corrupts you like a drug
No, it doesn't. It's your own fault how you use the power that the Dark Side gives you, trying to scape goat it to the Dark Side is just "I dindu nuffin" by other words.
You can use your power for good, you can even fight against other Sith if you disagree with them. Nothing in the Dark Side requires you to murder babies, just have an unwavering convinction in whatever the fuck you set out to do.
>the light side takes away your desire
Again, it does not. The Light Side only works based on your detachment from the current world. You can still care about other people or ideals and even fight for them, but you must do so because those things are genuinely important or good. You can still use the Light Side to capture the guy that killed your wife, you just can't kill him with that, you're not expected to just "but the level of happiness in the galaxy rose up" the situation.
If many Jedi Masters and Jedi Knights don't seem to be very proactive, it's not because they don't give a fuck or have no desire, but rather because they understand how futile or immature some people are, that they'll demand a Jedi come right in, brandishing a light saber to solve a situation that could be handled with some diplomacy instead. Jedi know better than to play gods with the Force but that's not the same as having no desire.
>Every person and event is influenced by the force and the force determines the fate of the galaxy.
Because the Force is the cosmic balance of everyone's actions, you affect the Force just as much as it affects you. It's not the Dark Side that makes you get mugged, it's the fact your dumb ass went into a dark alley at night. Every single time the Force is shown affecting the Universe, it's not through something entirely incorporeal but rather by an individual doing something that changes the course of history. In the end, it's still up to your free will, with the force adjusting things accordingly.
2a065a No.15852919
>>15852837
She's not a villain she's someone afflicted with a condition she never asked for exploring all sides of the experience to try to understand how to stop/kill it. Totally understandable, Kreia needed head pats.
>>15852837
If you're Jedi your free will is directly affected cos fuckers dropped spaceships in your back garden and hauled you off to a temple at age 5 and groomed you good for 15 years. Then rule over your ass with an iron rod and throw you out with nothing if you fuck up. Turning dark usually means the person is going unstable and that will to power tends to feed on its wielders as we see in Scion and Nihilus and to some extent with the Emperor. they just can't stop cos the bad is so good.
a23015 No.15852927
>>15852882
>>15852886
Fuck off, Dagoth. The Wheel is gonna spin, wether you sit on it or not. We're fucking waiting for you to just stop being childish so we can move on to the next kalpa, so get off your fat ass and stop pretending you're a Pillar. I swear, when Alduin sees you, he's gonna throw a bitchfit.
Oh wait, what's that? Alduin died in Skyrim? Oh… Then who the fuck is gonna end time now? FUCK.
98c72e No.15852942
>>15852919
>Jedi […] dropped spaceships in your back garden and hauled you off to a temple at age 5 and groomed you good for 15 years
>Turning dark […] power tends to feed on its wielders […] they just can't stop
So it's the weird ideologies and strict man-made rules that makes people suffer because of the force, not the force itself?
And power can corrupt unstable and egotistical people making them commit horrible acts in order to fulfil their own power fantasy?
Not really seeing how the force itself is bad rather than plain old human nature and (((socially constructed))) rules and hierarchies.
eafdaf No.15852945
>>15852886
It’s literally explained that the force controls and wills the galaxy
>>15852906
It does. The more force sensitive you are the more you have to cut yourself from desire or be corrupted by the dark side. You literally aren’t supposed to care about your own loved ones because that leads to the dark side.
cd3a83 No.15852946
>>15852919
>hauled you off to a temple at age 5 and groomed you good for 15 years
That always seemed creepy to me, plus the rules against feeling emotions. Why are the Jedi considered the good guys again?
1c3669 No.15852953
>>15852867
>not understanding the force
>pretending like you do and posting this shit
The light/dark sides of the force are more ideologies than anything.
light side
>favors indirect conflict resolution
>only engage when absolutely necessary
>keep the peace
dark side
>might is right, only the strong survive
>violence is used to resolve most disputes
>the strongest maintain their order over everyone weaker
eafdaf No.15852961
>>15852953
They are far more than ideologies and if you knew anything about star wars you would know this. The dark side is literally something every Jedi has to fight to some degree. Simply caring about someone leads to it.
eafdaf No.15852969
>>15852961
>>15852953
Also the ideology of the dark side wasn’t even codified until Kotor so if we consider what it says cannon than the part about the force being no better than brainwashing is cannon too.
e0d17e No.15852971
>>15852945
>force controls the wills of the galaxy
No. It's intertwined with all things living. It's basically the will of the spirits. The force on its own does nothing, it is simply there. It's not some mystical being that has an agenda.
>You literally aren’t supposed to care about your own loved ones because that leads to the dark side
Once again has nothing to do with the Force and all to do with the rigid Jedi Code. Even then they still allow marriages under extremely special circumstances. Kyle Motherfucking Katarn put it best when he says that the Force is a tool to be used for good rather than something to worship.
2a065a No.15852981
>>15852942
Pretty much, the far extremes of wrongheadedness gain access to the most power that's the problem, the worst people (from whichever perspective) get the most bang for their buck so following one of those tracks is a no-brainer unless you get sick of it all and go Jolee Bindo on the universe and live in a swamp.
>>15852946
They're much like the Judges of Megacity One, they're bred to be moralfag police and that's a nasty tightrope, the ones who fall off make them all look even worse.
02ea07 No.15852986
>>15852824
>What’s the point of making the villain right if I can’t side with them in the end?
So George Lucas can just render the story non-canon anyways :^)
03d425 No.15852988
>>15852824
When you think about it, Kreia is just a fictional character who takes issue with the fact that the authors of the stories told in her franchise use war and death as the primary source of conflict in order to keep the reader interested.
I doubt she'd care as much if the Star Wars universe was all about high school drama dating sim fluff.
It sounds all serious with the veneer of The Force and all, but really it's just "fuck you, why do NPC have to suffer for the consumer's entertainment?"
a23015 No.15853000
>>15852961
>The dark side is literally something every Jedi has to fight to some degree.
Because the Force gives you powers far above those of regular people. You can read minds, sense emotions, see into the future, perform incredible physical feats and become incredibly proeficient in combat or capable of bending minds to your will.
You have the power to do all this so you being to question when is it okay to use it? How far can you go with it? That's what "fighting against the Dark Side" truly is.
A Jedi could rule over an entire town alone, just bend the minds of everyone that disagrees, brainwash all the criminals so they stop being criminals too. And he can easily find criminals or dissidents since he can see the future and read minds. But at this point, he is a tyrant with good intentions, he has turned to the Dark Side because of that, not because some dark force subverted his mind. Greed and Ego did it.
>Simply caring about someone leads to it.
Because you're likely going to do some pretty dumb shit if something ever happens to your loved one. Maybe you'll seek revenge if she's ever killed and you end up murdering the criminal instead of taking him to be judged. Or maybe you'll mind bend that person to love you back. Or maybe she dies and you're stupid enough to try and raise her from the dead.
Point is, it's not caring that leads to the dark side, it's all the bad decisions you'll make because you care that do so. Marriage is still allowed, provided the other Jedi Masters believe you can be trusted not to go on a fucking rampage if something happens to your loved one.
98c72e No.15853002
>>15852945
>The more force sensitive you are the more you have to cut yourself from desire or be corrupted by the dark side
No. Higher sensitivity just means higher potential. Any kind of power (not just the force) can corrupt people and it often leads into a hunt for even greater power.
There are different ways to control the force, the jedi practice a less forceful method, where they attempt to see how the force flows and gently draw at its strings in order to manipulate the physical plane.
The easier method is through raw emotions as opposed to a meditative calm. The strongest and most easily to muster up emotions tend to be negative such as wrath and sadness. This leads a powerful force sensitive person looking to become even stronger to rely on these techniques. Constantly needing to conjure up these negative emotions will have a toll on your psyche and make you fucked up and egotistical (to reiterate, your own thoughts corrupt you, not the force in some weird roundabout way).
>You literally aren’t supposed to care about your own loved ones because that leads to the dark side.
Again we see that the issues lie with the philosophies rather than the force. Jedi's are so scared of people using their emotions to control the force that wish them removed completely. This can easily be seen in the jedi code.
e0d17e No.15853014
>>15852988
War and sex sells which is why Talon is best girl.
eafdaf No.15853021
>>15852971
>>15852971
Watch the movies. They even have the stupid prophecy chosen one. The force chose Anakin to become evil so he could kill the emperor.
>>15853000
The dark side is treated like a drug in the movies that you become addicted to. Any strong emotion or care brings you closer to it. Why are you having to rewrite the movies to defend Lucas?
e0d17e No.15853041
>>15853021
It's not a prophecy of the Force though, it's a Jedi prophecy. They just had the notion that some extra super special Jedi was going to wipe out the Sith completely, but what they didn't see was that he was going to go nuclear on the Jedi as well. Anakin's fall was very much his own doing and had nothing to do with some sort of interference from the Force.
98c72e No.15853042
>>15853000
Also this. I feel like OP took almost everything presented to him at face value and didn't read between the (very obvious) lines.
>>15853021
>Watch the movies. They even have the stupid prophecy chosen one. The force chose Anakin to become evil so he could kill the emperor.
Just because some in the jedi council believe so, doesn't make it so.
>The dark side is treated like a drug in the movies that you become addicted to
All power can corrupt.
>Any strong emotion or care brings you closer to it
The force can be manipulated through emotions. It's easier to do that than to learn how to gently manipulate it by pulling its strings through meditations.
Also what >>15853000 said.
9eea2e No.15853081
>dude just murder the force lmao
I agreed with nearly everything she said up until this point. You’re going to potentially murder almost everyone in the galaxy just for the slight chance that you might finally have “free will”? Bear in mind that you only know of one single person who survived getting cut off from it.
It’s the Star Wars equivalent of a nuclear apocalypse.
2a065a No.15853092
>>15852824 (OP)
In my recent replay of Kotor 2 I stayed grey, I saw the extremes as too comical, really irks me there's no way to be pals with Kreia in the end.
>>15853021
>The force chose Anakin to become evil so he could kill the emperor,
Hang on pally. That's a bold and wonky statement
First The prophecy was a Jedi construction which was misinterpreted so much that it got the Jedi killed off. They thought the darkside was more powerful and that Anakin could solve that, thing is it was the Jedi who were too powerful (and blind to their own failings) turning Anakin dark, really it was Palpatine's scheme which balanced out the Force leaving only Obi and Yoda, Vader and Palp.
Secondly, Anakin had turned back by the time he killed the Emperor and his dying left the force out of balance with Luke being primed to fuck it all up again.
98c72e No.15853094
>>15853081
Also I don't believe force sensitivity is purely genetics either. Is the PC going to spend the rest of their life murdering force sensitive babies? Then what, who is going to take over that job once the PC is dead?
2a065a No.15853102
>>15853092
This is of course on the assumption that there's not more of the fuggers out there which there inevitably is.
4cfb69 No.15853112
You can't "side with" Kreia because she wants you to kill her. She's a bit unconventional but she's still a Sith and views killing your master as the ultimate test of a student's worth.
e0d17e No.15853119
>>15853112
Ultimately this as well. When you last meet her, she isn't Kreia, she's Darth Traya, leader of the Sith Triumvirate.
98c72e No.15853126
>>15853102
>>15853092
I don't really believe that the force necessarily needs to naturally balance out. It's more about the inevitability of power structures and ideologies to eventually crumble and fall, either from within or with the help of an outside force overthrowing them.
d68f46 No.15853127
>>15852853
>A villain is very rarely truly right
Because very rarely do we get well-written villains.
fec630 No.15853134
>>15853092
Anakin brought balance to the force by greatly reducing the jedi numbers, and with killing palpatine put an end to the sith rule of one. Luke isn't going to screw it up so long as he keeps training jedi since the sith no longer control their numbers.
a23015 No.15853136
>>15853021
>The dark side is treated like a drug in the movies that you become addicted to.
The Force is treated like a religion. It's effects are not treated like a drug but far more like "blind faith".
In case you never picked it up, the Dark Side is basically what satanism preaches (might makes right, indulge in whatever you want and kill those that opose you, etc). Falling for the Dark Side doesn't mean you're addicted, you don't consume Dark Force or anything like it.
You merely adopt a different religion alltogether, corrupting you in the same manner that a nun would be corrupted if she started wearing a goat's head and taking part in orgies. Is she "addicted" to satanism, or she's just hedonistic as literal fuck?
Same shit in the movies. Luke doesn't talk to Darth Vader like they're in an intervention to try and break his bad habit of binge Forcing, he tries to sway his way of thinking back towards the Light, away from his dreams of conquest.
Meanwhile, Vader isn't "addicted" to the Force, he sees the power it granted him as a tool to conquer and eventually pacify the whole galaxy, to civilize all the barbarians and put an end to all conflict. For most of the movies, he truly believes he can do this with strength alone, the Force being the tool to do so. It's only when he sees his master torturing his fucking son in front of him that he realizes "Shit, maybe I'm the bad guy here?" because at that point, the cost of what he wants means losing his only son.
Again, it's not a drug. It's an ideology, a religion, a way of thinking. And that can be far more addictive and insidious than any drug.
9eea2e No.15853139
>>15852881
>create an endless meat grinder cycle of wars for economic growth
>control every aspect of humanity
>nothing wrong
Solidus was the one who did nothing wrong
2a065a No.15853143
>>15853094
Killing the kids off wouldn't do it, it's a grander notion than that, the functions of the 'energy field' its self would need to be stopped. Kreia never got that far in her actions, just seeing the void in the Force within the Exile was enough to get her hopes up that it could be used to consume everything, which it kind of does in the Exile wiping out every significant force user left outside of his cadre and maybe Atris.
>>15853112
She also seems to be genuinely sick of it all and with the her failed students dead there's nothing left.
>>15853126
The human/alien element always fucks everything up.
2a065a No.15853156
>>15853134
But training Jedi unchecked could lead to another imbalance which, provided the Force has this will could see more Sith-like types appearing.
98c72e No.15853162
>>15853143
>it's a grander notion than that, the functions of the 'energy field' its self would need to be stopped
Yeah but that's even dumber. I don't remember if Kreia brings up this possibility but since everything is touched and connected by the force, if the exile actually succeeds in this it might extinguish all life in the universe.
'But at least people will no longer be puppets to it' would be her take on it I guess.
fec630 No.15853166
>>15853156
With the sith no longer under the rule of one that problem should sort itself out.
e0d17e No.15853178
>>15853166
*rule of two
Rule of One was Darth Krayt.
a23015 No.15853185
>>15853126
You can chalk it up to hegelian dialetics or something similar if you don't want a supernatural explanation.
It's not so much that there's an invisible force that manipulates all, but rather that the Force is an abstract concept that represents the will of every being.
The second you have too much of something, a reaction will naturally popup and that will be seen as the Force acting because that's the religion they go by.
Say a bunch of Sith gather up and start shooting the shit. Well, some people are not gonna be very happy and will rise up against it, making more jedis.
Let's say that Jedis are cockblocking an entire planet's economy with their ideas and the people are sick of it. Someone's gonna fall to the Dark Side and do something dumb because of that.
Both will be balancing acts. And what's more, you can pretty much have future reading and prophecies here with a simple explanation. What Jedi Masters see as "possible futures" is just their mind projecting the current path of what the present is. They'll see unbalance and understand that a corrective measure will happen in the future to "fix" that.
It even explains why their prophecy backfired. They couldn't predict the Super Sayan Jedi would turn on them because they did not see themselves as being too large or too powerfull. All they saw was an enemy they overestimated and the result was dropping a rebounding tactical nuke on the Sith, with the logical conclusions they'd see coming if they weren't egocentric autistic fucks.
98c72e No.15853191
>>15853166
The entire sith ideology is 'might makes right', there will never be a lack of people attempting to lead and people following them in order to attain greater power and eventually overthrow their own master.
I still believe that the force doesn't have a will of its own and it 'balancing out' is just jedi's reading too much into the imagined spiritual side of things.
>>15853185
I agree, that's pretty much the thought I was trying to convey with my post.
2a065a No.15853194
>>15853162
It might well but if we extrapolate into the EU the Yuuzhan Vong didn't have a force connection so it *might* not kill everything, just leave them forcepowerless, if that turns everyone into self mutilating pain obsessed warriors that might make things more interesting.
>>15853166
Again maybe or maybe it mutates into them co-operating somewhat and becoming even more of a problem. Their rules changing may make them more adaptive.
a23015 No.15853201
>>15853166
But he has a point. To balance things out, roughly for every Jedi Knight Luke trains, somewhere in the galaxy a Sith will pop up.
He'd need to do some proper balancing on his part and make sure he only trains as many Jedi as necessary for the current Sith population (since they can also train guys on their side)
What's worse, Luke can't rule out training Jedi since that'd mean leaving the Galaxy defenseless against Sith. But at the same time, as long as there's a Jedi, there will be a Sith too. Quite the dillemma.
I just realized this makes for an interesting gameplay mechanic too. Have a special unit that's very costly to make but quite strong on it's own.
However, it's cost goes down sharply depending on the advantage your oponent has over you. In dire times when you're losing a battle, you could spam a metric fuckton of them to reverse the game, but then your enemy would likely be able to do the same thing as well.
fec630 No.15853218
>>15853194
>co-operating
Sith and jedi don't want the same thing so even if they work together it will extremely temporary at best.
2ff91d No.15853232
>>15852847
>Can't cuckqean the villain
Shit game.
dc6f1a No.15853263
>>15852824
She was wrong the force is not the problem only force users are.
Moff Trachta did nothing wrong.
2a065a No.15853281
>>15853218
I mean the nu-sith cooperating with each other, tenuous as those bonds are due to inevitable ego struggles/scheming they're still dangerous for as long as they last.
e4110d No.15853289
>>15852847
There was a thread about it a while ago, which incidentally had the same Kreia image in the OP. https://pastebin.com/gvGJM3aP
6de200 No.15853311
She's not right retard
Fuck Kreia fags are as bad as the fags that think this little shit is good because
<b-Buht you did everything they's a good boy they didnu nothin
79e85b No.15853322
>>15852867
>Food takes away my free will to live without eating, so it is inherently bad
baedc0 No.15853323
>>15853311
>I'l vomit some nigger speak to prove others are fags
Way to go nigger.
6de200 No.15853330
>>15853323
Kreia was using you, you stupid faggot.
baedc0 No.15853341
>>15853330
She basicly admits it if you talk to her at all, if you think people dont know that you're the stupid one here.
The real question is why should I care? I would've done the same in her position.
Post some more nigger speak while you come up with more shitty reasoning if at all.
6de200 No.15853352
>>15853341
>Be some sith bitch's puppet
>It's ok because like the Jedi are actually the bad guys and the force is bad, and she totally wants to for real get rid of the force
Whipped harder than Johnny Test
baedc0 No.15853373
>>15853352
>Be some sith bitch's puppet
Dont have to project your problems on me pal. Seeing as you instantly assume I have a problem with the jedi is pretty telling about your loyalties. You're as much a slave to them as you think anyone is to kreia.
MC can confront kreia right after peragus about what she truly is and she will tell you to take as much as you can from her to become stronger.
Thats as good a reason to follow for a time as any. If thats not enough by doing so you avoid becoming a slave to retarded ideologies like the jedi or sith code.
But I'm sure a person like you without any drive of your own doesnt understand such things, dogmatic as you are like horseshoe theory fags and lightsaber wielding jihadists that the jedi and sith basicly are.
6de200 No.15853393
>>15853373
Nigger her entire shpiel about not being a slave is to confound you into thinking it's a decision of your own volition while leading you into agreeing with her, you got fucking mind tricked, the lowest of low level force abilities, by a piece of literature being presented from a fucking 3D model of an old woman
4d7e3e No.15853431
>>15853352
>Whipped harder than Johnny Test
People watched that shitty show?
baedc0 No.15853465
>>15853393
Except you do get stronger by following her, you dont actually end up helping her complete her goal and you get to murder her and any one that crosses you. Thats some "I was merely pretending" tier shit if you actually think she fooled anyone but you.
2a065a No.15853838
>>15853465
>you dont actually end up helping her complete her goal
In a way you semi do in killing off the Jedi masters who fucked her and you over and her failed apprentices, the Exile is the only one who could do it in the end. Kreia also knows she's a failure, with all that and her death the Force at least gets a good tidying up.
>>15853330
She tacitly admits she's trying to manipulate you and will continue to do so early on, also it's blindingly obvious right off the bat to everyone that she's a wrong-un in plain sight, it's the nature of her wrongness that makes her much more interesting than virtually any other SW character though so going along with her shit is both unavoidable and the best part of the whole game.
b00796 No.15853853
>>15852837
The Force amplifies your emotions towards the point where your Will and Fate is connected to the side of the Force, stay Light side, you are blinded by the Light as you are to everything around you, while the Dark side can shroud and consume you, making it so you have corrupt and destroy.
0c973e No.15853896
>>15853127
Is that that faggot Jackal from Farcry 2? The same one who smuggled 1000s of refugees out of some African shithole? The one who wiped the main characters ass on one hand and regarded all the other mercenaries that where identical to the main character as trash with the other?
e0d17e No.15853915
>>15853853
That's not true at all. There are many times where Sith hated the constant backstabbing and scheming and saw the need for change lest they be wiped from the galaxy such as Bane or Marr and Jedi who saw that life isn't as black and white as the order would tell you and that sometimes you need to make hard sacrifices to protect a vulnerable Republic such as Revan. Now his fall hinges on whether you believe the horseshit about Vitiate brainwashing him but his intentions were quite pure but radical in the eyes of the Council. And Luke's order is just an order of Gray Jedi who were taught that the Force is a tool and not a crutch. Luke's motto can be summarized into "you can do whatever as long as you're not a huge cock."
0cf32f No.15853943
>>15852828
It's time to put away the video games and go to sleep billy.
184b36 No.15854164
Should I use that Sith Lords Restored Content mod?
e0d17e No.15854169
>>15854164
If you have already played the game vanilla then 100% yes.
184b36 No.15854177
>>15854169
I haven't played this game before.
040174 No.15854181
>>15852824
Because you're a slave to the Force as much as she is. Free will is an illusion and you're fucked, the end.
e0d17e No.15854186
>>15854177
Best to start vanilla and play through it how you see fit then go with the cut content mod on subsequent playthroughs to get a feel for how much was removed or changed.
f52354 No.15854196
>>15852853
>A villain is very rarely truly right
Wrong!
040174 No.15854202
>>15854186
Isn't that an argument for doing it the other way around? See the full ending then experience the cut up mess of the original?
e0d17e No.15854205
>>15854202
It's always better to play a game vanilla first. I thought this was common knowledge.
>>15854197
Aye.
2a065a No.15854209
>>15854164
I'd play one side then put the mod on and play the other. My recent replay with the mod made me ache for a time machine so I could go back and give the devs another 6 months to actually finish the game.
e0d17e No.15854213
>>15854209
It's surprising how much is cut from games. Even KoTOR which was given a full development time and a high amount freedom (relative to Star Wars) has a shit load of cut content.
040174 No.15854227
>>15854205
When it's a mod, sure. But this is cut content and literally half the ending is missing, if not more. If you really think about it you can work out what they wanted to do in vanilla but it's still fucked.
I played it vanilla first like the rest of you back in the day but I can't be sure if that's better for the first time.
e0d17e No.15854235
>>15854227
I wouldn't say better but that it makes more sense. If you install the cut content mod then want to play vanilla you have to uninstall it then reinstall it once you did the vanilla. Unless you installed two different KOTOR II's on your machine, that's way too much hassle for a video game.
a935ed No.15856696
>>15854202
eh, The cut content doesn't add much other than the hk factory and endless swarms of hk-50 units FUCKING EVERYWHERE. and their extra lore basically entails that they are the only real threat that exists in the galaxy and are the grey goo scenario and the extra dungeon added on to the end FOR 1 companion to do on his own, make sure that you unequip companions b4 you park them in the hawk because you do not have the components to spare to make upgrades for everyone's kit. as highlighted in this dungeon if you fail to have HK as one of your main bois.
There is like one character cut from dantooine you meet for a lightsaber/lightsaber pice.
They unlock some doors on narshadda but there is nothing behind them of note. BUT they do add in the gap between the exile getting snagged in the jec jec tar and them getting the ebbin hawk's id changed as they go genocide grand and go full on hate crime on some HK-50s (lots of exp but little loot)
ondoron/duxon is mostly unchanged, or i didn't notice
koriban is the same… there is the droid planet mod that is supposed to be attached to it but its not part of the restored content mod and iv'e only heard bad things about it.
And the final area has a cut seen of real main villain saying "that you can either high tail it to the FINAL BOSS FOR MAXIMUM EDGE or save your friends, but be weaker for it." but the prison section just has 3 cages for your main "bottom-bois" (handmaiden/disciple, visas, and atton?) that are empty.
most of it is cut dialog that is thrown back in for extra flavor. kinda gives the games a "special edition" feel but instead of CGI shit added in its all the scenes that ended up on the cutting room floor. some of them belonged there
<tldr… yes play with extended content first unless you want to play multiple times.
13ac72 No.15859644
Star Wars is a shitty setting with shitty lore.
e4110d No.15861540
>>15859644 (check'd)
The only good lore in Star Wars was the Expanded Universe which got retconned by Disney. The original trilogy had aesthetically pleasing lore, the prequels corrupted said lore to the point of being irredeemable.
e436ab No.15861661
>>15861540
>The only good lore in Star Wars was the Expanded Universe which got retconned by Disney
They retconned everything, except for the mainline films. Honestly the decision should just be ignored.
e4110d No.15861667
>>15861661
At this point it is by the majority of the fanbase. Every movie Disney release flopped harder and harder. Disney's say in the Star Wars universe is only on paper at this point.
1a7131 No.15861671
>>15852824
Why side with them in the end when you can side with them from the start and skip the entire godawful boring game?
e436ab No.15861741
>>15861667
Pretty much. It's just such a weird board-room like decision to make.
>Wait, what do you mean there are games, books, shows and comics?
>And these are tied into our Disney© Star Wars© universe?
>Nah let's just bin 98% of the Star Wars© lore, it's too confusing for the consumer.
919f28 No.15861755
>discussing star wars
>discussing ideology in star wars and the force
>discussing american military industrial complex deep state propaganda
>discussing something that was made as superficial propaganda for the cattle in the cold war
>just because some autistic lore expansion because of the success of the first movie
Come on, star wars was just a CIA meme that got too far because autistic people.
768792 No.15861779
>>15852833
thats a very specific and incorrect point of view
2a065a No.15861816
>>15859644
I'll grant that the fact that The Force is called 'The Force' is retarded. I mean that's some fucking unimaginative shit right there, my kid nephew could do better.
ff54e1 No.15861854
>>15852927
>wether
There's something infuriating when I see people mispell basic wurds.
2a065a No.15861871
>>15861854
What if he'd spelt it 'weather'? Just a different variety of seething anger?
ff54e1 No.15861914
>>15861871
He'd still be wrong, whether is the only word he can use.
30daf0 No.15861925
>>15861854
People like you are a diamond dozen
e4110d No.15861959
>>15861755
>CIA funds a propaganda movie
>Everyone roots for the Space Nazis
70e8a1 No.15861971
Villain is a matter of perspectives
11d779 No.15862004
>>15861959
Were they talking about Star Wars, or Starship Troopers?
036895 No.15862008
>>15861661
>>15861741
It got even better when they ended up retconning the other films, including their own film with TLJ. Amazing how that movie shat on every portion of the fanbase; OT, PT, EU, and Disney fans all got a massive fuck you from the movie. Rian is a master at fucking things up.
a8953c No.15862019
>>15861971
How many perspectives
45103f No.15862116
>>15861671
total missed opportunity not letting you go his route
45103f No.15862125
>>15861925
the dumb dick should of used spell check
2a065a No.15862647
>>15862008
None too subtly either what with Yoda going: "Fuck it!" and having Luke toss all their ancient writings in the shitter. They might as well have thrown a library of EU novels on the pile with them and had a little Satan dance around the flames.
2a065a No.15862659
>>15862008
The worst thing about TLJ is still that anachronistic unnecessary undying asian hoor, she was the fucking Jar Jar of that hot mess, oh and Laura Dern hamming it up was jarring too, that character was terrible.
127ade No.15863210
>>15854197
You're a big guy.
55354b No.15863260
>>15852837
"A Jedi can feel The Force flowing through him."
"You mean it controls your actions?"
"Partially, but it also obeys your commands."
06afaf No.15863323
>>15852824
>Get to the final boss
>"Join me and together we'll rule the world!"
>Ok [*] No Way [ ]
>"Oh…alright then. I guess half the world is yours."
>The End
63ee11 No.15863390
>Dumbasses attacking Kreia not only because she represents a deconstruction of the entire star wars universe, but because muh good guys can't possibly be wrong
>Despite that literally being a major theme of the entire prequel trilogy
e0d17e No.15863450
>>15861971
From my point of view the Jedi are evil!
d183ac No.15863512
>>15863323
IIRC that is a reference to the original Dragon Warrior where the last boss tries the same thing
589665 No.15863787
>>15863323
This is one game I wouldn't mind getting a port, either to PC or Switch or both. It does not deserve to be forgotten.
7719f2 No.15863790
>>15852833
>people have free will to be taken away
I would laugh at you, but I understand you can't help being wrong.
2a065a No.15863866
>>15863790
So I was always fated to call you a huge faggot?
Das deep brah
ff54e1 No.15864719
>>15862125
dunno if you're referring to me or not but if it was to me then I did that on purpose
442d8d No.15865023
>>15852824
>What’s the point of making the villain right if I can’t side with them in the end?
It's called ironic tragedy. You as the audience/player know the villain is right, but you're still forced to opposed them because either the character doesn't know the villain is right - or is forced into conflict through other circumstances - bringing about the bad ending.
d00d38 No.15865064
>>15852882
Since I've never played the game, can you spoonfeed me?
305db9 No.15865498
>>15865064
>dwarves that look like jews try to make a god using the heart of a god
>yellow elves fight them because it'll obviously go wrong
>megajew teleports to another dimension/erases his entire jewish race via a fuckup while messing with the heart
>leader of yellow elves tells his thot, friend and teacher to not to mess with the heart
>gives tools to mess with heart to his best buddy for safe keeping
>thot, teacher and friend of the yellow elf leader kill him to use the tools
>best buddy get irradiated with god heart stuff while keeping the tools away from thot, teacher and friend
>they kill him (not really) and use the god heart and tools to become living gods (ALMSIVI)
>daedra they worship turns them into niggers
>time passes
>imperials invade Morrowind
>loser ALMSIVI cuck out after getting outplayed
>agree to have imperial forts everywhere
>best buddy that wasn't really dead gets more radiation from the heart and kicks ALMSIVI ass
>wants to use his power to free Morrowind from the imperials and share his power with his people
He did nothing wrong, play the game.
ce6862 No.15865530
>>15865498
>He did nothing wrong
Dagoth Ur may have good intentions, but this doesn't change the fact that he is completely nuts due to not-Undead.
And then there is this whole business about his followers having their faces cave in so they can grow elephant trunks out of them.
305db9 No.15865563
>>15865530
>he is completely nuts
I've yet to see this ALMSIVI propaganda proven true.
>his followers having their faces cave in so they can grow elephant trunks out of them
I'll give you that, but they don't seem any worse for it, Dagoth Gares can see and talk perfectly fine and all of them are immune to disease and ageing, an easy price for living forever if you don't become a corpus beast.
bccab0 No.15865624
Didn't George himself get really mad about this game and the grey morality? I heard that was the reason they were not allowed to finish it.
>>15863323
How was this game? I usually hear positive things about it.
Whatever happened to that one PC cube adventure game? Is it still dead?
b45181 No.15865808
>>15852833
>exaggerated one dimensional moustache twirling villains that just go around murdering people all day are the same as autistic monks that sit around reading and circlejerking all day
Your brain on horseshoe theory
>>15859644
Star wars is a mediocre setting with good worldbuilding and god tier aesthetic
ad0449 No.15865860
>>15865624
>it's unfinished because george got in the way
I wouldn't even be surprised.
>darth icky
>darth insanius
73a37c No.15865872
>>15852837
The force is established to able to allow people to see the future, and create prophecies, the very nature of this takes away free will.
7719f2 No.15865875
>>15863866
Dubs don't lie.
de09fb No.15865917
>>15865872
Plus it's always balance itself out, which means it doesnt matter what you do in the long term the Force will always fuck you and your buddies in the ass.
48e6a2 No.15869367
>>15852886
>>15852882
>>15865498
Dagoth was doing nothing wrong, if you consider only the existence of the Dunmer - and that, with the asterisk "those Dunmer which agree with him, and are willing to have their flesh transformed and their will overwritten by his own". It's not the worst gig, but it's understandable why a solid 95% of Tamriel might not exactly consider it the ideal option.