/redland/ -Soviet imperialism?

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File: c76d4ff9830f393⋯.jpg (32.22 KB,514x471,514:471,1618268169785.jpg)

Soviet imperialism? Anonymous 04/13/21 (Tue) 16:03:14 No.6

So recently I learned that the Soviet Union forced ultimatums upon the baltic states. These ultimatums led to the loss of sovereignty of the baltic states, and caused resentment towards the Soviets whose effects can still be felt today in the hostility towards socialism and Russia.

Was it imperialism? To me it seems like a typical example. Nation occupied, populace grows to resent their occupiers. Even though the baltic peoples became Nazi sympathizers I can't really blame them - I would instead blame the Soviets for this tragedy.

____________________________

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Anonymous 04/13/21 (Tue) 16:14:47 No.7

File: 2d054e3d9784db5⋯.png (48.38 KB,420x420,1:1,1616314990079.png)

no it isn't imperialism

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Anonymous 04/13/21 (Tue) 16:26:57 No.8

File: 221c7502209f270⋯.jpg (86.78 KB,960x941,960:941,cd77b695ec98fead0858a8ccdd….jpg)

>>6

this is true imperialism you homo faggot the soviets did nothing wrong America did everything wrong.

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Anonymous 04/13/21 (Tue) 21:03:33 No.10

Pole here.

Yes it was. It had nothing to do with Lenin's self determination of nation and was just a plain, imperialist act of conquest. The nations of those countries and my own were freshly out of a century of (Russian) tsarist occupation, as was mine. A few years later those same Russians came over with a different banner, but did the exact same thing, only with NKVD replacing Okhrana.

And yes, zey ver zee baddies.

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Anonymous 04/14/21 (Wed) 10:50:12 No.11

>>10

How can you be certain there where no proof of this being the case and there certainly was no banner to the way Russia changed its views when they took that land so again how can you be certain.

Simple answer you can't in fact the Soviets went back before stalin took over it was a conquest I'll give you that but it was a system replace at the end of the day and less destructive one at that so no it wasn't imperialism stop lying to yourself fucking Yiddish asshole.

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Anonymous 04/15/21 (Thu) 20:35:03 No.13

>>11

>proof proof proof

>something something

>Yiddish asshole

Hi Sasza :D

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Anonymous 04/15/21 (Thu) 20:51:38 No.14

>>6

Balts were NEVER Nazism sympathisers. That's always been Russian propaganda. The balts were nationalists

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Anonymous 04/19/21 (Mon) 21:10:01 No.15

File: 7257807484de8c2⋯.png (422.9 KB,996x701,996:701,Soviet_Baltic_Republics_2.png)

File: fa24fb84e917f88⋯.png (139.28 KB,470x708,235:354,Soviet_Baltic_Republics.png)

File: 25b7158bca768a0⋯.jpg (62.52 KB,1078x1224,539:612,soviet_occupation_of_Balti….jpg)

Not this shit again. For a board that wants to avoid going the route of /leftypol/ you're well on your way there.

As for the subject at hand: No it was not imperialism of any kind.

See https://leftypedia.org/wiki/Baltic_states* for some details.

To summarize, the governments of the Baltic states of 1939 were extremely nationalistic and pro-fascist, and their government was generally unpopular due to its oppressive behavior (imprisoning jews and socialists) and its ineffectiveness at defending their national borders (ironically). It took Soviet diplomatic authority to halt a Polish invasion that resulted in the taking of Vilnius, and VIlnius was only returned after joining the USSR.

The deposed nationalists of 1939 were given light treatment initially, even as the populace greeted the USSR openly outright voting to join it. This let them become the Forest Brothers of WW2 who were active primarily during 1941 and 1944-45, acting solely against the Red Army, and ignoring the invading Germans in 1941-43. This appropriately received harsh action from the side of Soviet authorities and if you actually read the atrocities the Forest brothers committed (including but not limited to slaughtering entire villages that weren't explicitly against communism) the measures taken were appropriate. The Baltic areas under the USSR were the most well off in the entire Soviet Union and were subject to a lively economy. However in the 90s, as Glasnost of Gorbachv let all the Nazis out of the woodwork to lie on television and the Perestroika's intentional economic failure, the Baltic nationalists took this as an opportunity to muddle the minds of its people with rhtoric of being "independent" of "le russkies". It was all a load of codswallop, but the situation at the time and the disbelief of Soviet news that told of capitalist shittiness led to the modern russophobia, which has become an economic asset for the Baltics today.

TL;DR: Not imperialism, Perestroika and Glasnost let nationalists come back and trick people into revolting over bullshit.

*The wiki needs contributors so feel free to sign up and help write.

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Anonymous 04/19/21 (Mon) 21:15:47 No.16

File: 0568760517c08c7⋯.png (585.63 KB,737x605,67:55,Poland_Himmler.png)

>>10

>Pole here

Massive cope incoming.

>The nations of those countries and my own were freshly out of a century of (Russian) tsarist occupation

The Baltics and Finland blonged to Germany for centuries and belonged to the Russian Empire for several centuries more. Poland was no innocent either and it attempted to capture Russia, as Russia tried to capture it. In the end Russia won and several centuries of Czardom later Poland was free, only to be overtaken by nationalist expansionists like Pilsudski and his generals.

>those same Russians came over with a different banner, but did the exact same thing, only with NKVD replacing Okhrana

Bull fucking shit. Should I even point out how Poland was buddy-buddy with Nazi Germany and is complicit in the beginning of WW2? The only reason Poland isn't mentioned in such a capacity is because of Cold War Geopolitics, with the USSR not wanting to antagonize the Polish population by focusing on their actions in aiding and abetting Hitler, and the USA wanting to stoke the seeds of rebellion by pretending to be their ally.

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Anonymous 04/19/21 (Mon) 21:31:42 No.17

>>14

>Russian propaganda

>nationalists

>Nazis are literally nationalists

>Baltic Forest Brothers didn't do shit against Nazis but constantly fought the Red Army and suppressed anti-German partisans, getting appropriately punished for it.

<Timothy Snyder, well known anti-communist and pro-Ukrainian shill "historian" writes, "Entering the lands that they had conceded to Stalin in 1939, the Germans used NKVD crimes as a propaganda justification for the bloody massacres of Jews in summer 1941, in which LITHUANIANS, Ukrainians, Poles and others took part."

But yeah sure, "NEVER!"

Oh and FYI the anti-German nationalists (Pērkonkrusts) were banned for their policies. Somehow I don't think it was for being nationalist but rather because their ideas stepped on the toes of Nazi German beneficiaries.

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