/liberty/ - Liberty

Luckily, the ancoms at least are used to dealing with this.

I assume the ancaps will just bounce back and forth between calling you the glory of capitalism while claiming real capitalism has never been tried, while worshipping you because your gunpoint raids are "the free market." I mean, they didn't exactly stand up to the last not-really-capitalism, so it's all the same…

>>94152

> your gunpoint raids are "the free market."

[citation needed]

>>94157

This board would be a good start.

"Oh, look, this entrepeneur is so great, they managed to get regulatory privilege and money from the NSA in an economic system where the state just prints money and hands it to whom they want to win! ~swoons~"

New boss, old boss - I assume the same response.

>>94161

I think you're confusing us with the publicans

>>94163

ye. The pizzafaggots would have to live like ancaps or join the commies in trying to state their way out of poverty.

>AnCaps create their Stateless Bioshock LARP bullshit and dissolve the federal goverment of *Insert Country*

>With the Social-Democratic and Social-Reformist measures collapsing overnight an almost immediate workers Strike / uprising occurs

>AnCapistan collapses in days and is replaced by a new likely much more left wing if not Narxist state

I'm beginning to support AnCapism

Pretty good form of Accelerationism

>>94177

No AnCap group is going to attack the Government directly. If we settle away we'll stay where we are. As long as we are successful, others might copy it, if they wish. Nothing's going to get "accelerated." There is no world agenda for AnCaps. Our first and main concern 100% of the time would be to not get invaded by Statists.

>>94178

Sssshhh, let the commie believe his only option is to establish ancapistan to own the pigs

>>94152

There's been 3 times the norm of leftist projecting in this post.

>>94178

And yet we spent the 1500s through the 1800s raiding the world's strongest naval power, hanging the captain and building employee-owned enterprises out of the remnants of the enemies' fleet.

Have you considered y'all are just a bunch of pussies?

>>94185

I've considered that you guys have your panties in a twist and project too much. You really don't like it when we don't play within your narrative. There are no porkie dragons to slay here and you're not the main character of a story.

>>94177

Sure. I'm very sure that wouldn't happen, but if you actually want your commie utopia, ancap is the way to achieve it (given that people want to achieve it, which I think isn't the case).

>>94211

>if you actually want your commie utopia, ancap is the way to achieve it

>implying any of you shitheads will ever back anything up except the "mass murder" memes.

All we need from you is deregulation of buying and selling. That's ALL that's needed to start moving a little bit more into worker-owned and controlled enterprise.

You had ONE. FUCKING. JOB.

>>94178

>No AnCap group is going to attack the Government directly. If we settle away we'll stay where we are.

>Our first and main concern 100% of the time would be to not get invaded by Statists.

This will literally never happen as all islands are already either claimed (Or WOULD be claimed for any of you seasteaders out there) under National Waters

the only option available to you is to literally move to the middle of the fucking Atlantic where you would have to import all food and clean water anyway

>>94185

>We

So you want to take credit for pirates despite not even being alive to pull all those works off?

>>94250

TIL am ded.

>>94256

So you're a real life pirate then?

>>94264

The last well-documented on-ship pirate democracies were in the great lakes in the war of 1812. It probably led directly to the civil war, as persons from confederate states would lend slaves as crew for their share of the profits. This gave them a full and equal vote on every matter of the ship, and probably created the events which led to the south deciding it could kidnap anyone it wanted from the northern states for profit… which is going to lead to war.

The northern states themselves also operate as a pirate republic - the town meeting democracies. This basically predates the war of 1812 by literally tens of thousands of years. It also continues. Similarly, my credit union, my neighborhood association, et cetera also operate on this single, ancient concept.

So, what… you're convinced that someone named "anonymous" on the internet hasn't committed enough crimes for your liking? And you're sure about that?

I know enough to know where our lands are at war.

I really hate SJWs!

>>94177

>goverment is destroyed

>AnCaps create their Stateless Bioshock LARP bullshit and dissolve the federal goverment of *Insert Country*

>With the Social-Democratic and Social-Reformist measures collapsing overnight an almost immediate workers Strike / uprising occurs

>AnCapistan collapses in days and is replaced by a new likely much more left wing if not Narxist state

>marxism leads to the people self-destruction

>(real) men step in, kill the weak and impose fascism

>civilization is retored and flourishes

>life gets easy

>people get weak

>people want leftism

>the cycle repeats itself

>>94273

>Communism destroys "Humanity"

If your talking about Muh death toll then I'll just talk to you about Muh Birth Rates

Unless your talking about Muh Culture or whatever in which case stop being spooked

>Fascists Crush Communinsts and society flourishes

LMAO Has literally never happened

>>94314

>Communism destroys "Humanity"

Name one time communism has worked has not destroyed the country and people it was applied to

>Fascists Crushing Communists and society flourishes never happened

Now you are baiting, sissy.

>>94341

I could explain to you the advances made to the living standard of peoples during the USSR and other socialist states but to use to current existing examples

The DPRK and Cuba

>>94341

>Now your baiting

No I literally can't name a Historical scenario of Facism overthrowing a socialist state

The closest I could think of may be the Greek goverment immediately after WW2 to the 70s and even that eventually collapsed and gave way to Social-Democrats / Communists re-entering goverment

>>94145

>I will lead parties to raid libertarian and ancom settlements to take their shit and rape their women.

This is why there are no NatSoc who see the truth and go Libertarian.

There are only Libertarians who see the truth and become NatSoc.

–/pol/

>>94349

Comparative to nations with similar levels of Economic development (In Cuba's case Jamaica Haiti Dominica etc) (And in DPR-Korea's case most African states also Haiti / Other shitholes) the Standard of the population remains high comparatively

>>94314

Literally had your capital cities shelled and overrun by a nation half the size of Texas while that nation half the size of Texas was fighting 3 empires simultaneously.

>>94178

> No AnCap group is going to attack the Government directly.

You won't do anything but watch a shitskin's pulsing cock dump his poisonous seed into your family tree - losing everything that matters - or get dominated by fascists and keep everything that matters.

>>94359

>implying I'd tolerate coalburners

The fact that you describe cuck porn with such vivid detail says more about yourself than it does about anyone else.

>>94163

>edgy /pol/ nigger who can't even understand basic economics

Don't boast about knowing how to play the debt game and how well you have polished your servitude to kikes.

>>94360

> describe cuck porn with such vivid detail

It's my horrorcore to scare the Nazi into kike slaves.

>>94361

It's amazing that you've managed to twist financial illiteracy into a form of pride. Your tactical use of rhetoric is positively Yiddish, friend.

>>94361

No libertarian favors debt game business retard. The only poeple that would likely involved into massive debt are the natsocs because they're incapable of logic thinking when it comes to economy. Thread related >>93534

>>94145

>I will lead parties to raid libertarian and ancom settlements to take their shit and rape their women.

Fucking degenerate.

>>94361

>Literally runs his entire economy by taking out massive debts from both domestic and foreign lenders with the MEFO program to quick and EZ rebuild the economy and has to invade country after country to steal their gold reserves to convince the lenders that Germany was still able to pay it back thus keeping the loans coming in

The NSDAP's German economy was literally a Ponzi scheme

Just look at the Volkswagen scam that was pulled on effectivly every member of the DAP

>>94359

>Important shit that matters to NEET"Sucs" is making sure people of different haplogroups don't have sex

Absolute fragility of /pol/flakes

>>94362

>"I…It….It was just for RESEARCH!!!!!"

Sure sure

>>94145

but we can use our recreational nukes and legions of mercenaries.

>>94726

>he thinks all fascist posters are one guy

>he thinks /fascist/ is tsundere when they are actually just bullying.

We can literally have both you know.

>>94681

>>94360

You'd be surprised(or not) by how many NatSocs have really degenerate shit going on in their private lives. For a group of people that go on about degeneracy and racial purity, I've seen plenty of NatSocs and fascists unironically admit to getting off to bbc cuck porn and there are plenty of sodomites hidden amongst them as well. I suppose to some extent that would expected as no group can really claim to be squeaky clean when their roots are so closely aligned with image boards.

>>94752

That has been going on since the 70s with pedophile Frank Collin, the homosexual goat dancers that got anthrax on their cocks, the aliens people, redneck personal lawsuits, perjury in capital cases, and dudes that scammed troves of donations to speed off at the dead of night.

The wife beating, weird divorces, drinking, strange behavior, and motherfucking is just current year stuff we know about.

Fascists pick up a certain kind of people who have bizarre anti-social habits that burn through their social capital, resources, and time until they die. They pick up toxic people with poor habits and offer them ideology in place of leadership.

>>94765

>Most veterans are Libertarians.

why?

>>94765

>most people who volunteer to fight in interventionist wars are libertarian

Right-leaning, sure, and there are definitely a few libertarians in their ranks, but most? Don't kid yourself, they're normie conservatives through and through.

>>94770

Because after being in a total government situation for an extended period of time they realize that the government usually just makes things unintentionally worse.

>>94774

They usually tend to come from conservative families I agree but after reflecting on their experience tend to become Libertarian.

I was in a unit that saw combat in Afghanistan and yes I remember most people being Republican. Interestingly enough I considered myself a Democrat(Obama ran on false principles) at the time. We all keep up with each other on Facebook and while yes again, most were Pro-Trump supporters in 2016 but on individual levels they are very Libertarian and anti-government intervention. Also most conservatives I've met and talked to tend to be very Libertarian except on Border issues but I live in Texas so that's a big issue here. Cruz in his debate with Beto said that he's Libertarian but runs Republican because he's reactionary to the Democrat party and their policies.

>>94781

>except on Border issues

Open borders isn't a libertarian ideal.

>>94187

>kevin spacey

>not fucking boys

>>94782

>Open borders isn't a libertarian ideal.

Correct, but there's a lot more to unpack there.

Open borders is meant to represent that America is a land of opportunity. Currently America is a land of promise. Illegal immigrants are entitled to welfare, food stamps, public education that they never paid into and won't pay into because they work under the table. For instance an illegal-immigrant can get more from the government than my 82 year old grandfather can. On top of public money they also receive free money from hospitals. How? Because currently there are laws that prevent Hospitals from denying people at the E.R. So when illegals go to the E.R. they get treatment for free because they can't exactly be held liable for the money because they're illegal. So the money to pay for their problems gets added on to your hospital bills that either you or your healthcare ends up paying for.

So yes, Libertarians are open border but no Libertarian is in favor of giving money away to everyone in the world.

Security Issues aside most people Libertarians & Republicans agree that taking control of our borders is the first step toward anything. Open borders with free money is the worst idea ever but Democrats have to buy votes some how(muh gibs). Libertarians didn't create this current issue but they can absolutely fix it.

>>94803

It's not just gibs, it's freedom of a(di)ssociation. Even if they're not leeching of the public treasury I might not want to encounter certain groups of people on public property, for no other reason besides my own preferences. And since the state has illegitimately expropriated my wealth to construct that public property, I theoretically have some say in how this public property is used, including who uses it. Further, even if you remove gibs, the civil rights act is still there, and that prevents me from discriminating and using my property the way I wish, so if I want to legally discriminate someone they have to be stopped at the border. Therefore, controlling immigration provides some second-degree control over how my property is used, to which I am forced to resort because the state has robbed me of first-degree control.

>>94807

This may be the worst pro-segregation argument I've ever heard

>"I theoretically have some say in how this public property is used,"

No you literally don't that's never happened in history to any considerable degree as far as I know

This is literally a "I PAY YOUR SALARY WITH MY TAXES SO IM. YOUR. BOSS!!!!!!!" Tier arguement

>>94810

>greentext and quotations

Go back to reddit your degenerate piece of shit

>This is literally a "I PAY YOUR SALARY WITH MY TAXES SO IM. YOUR. BOSS!!!!!!!" Tier arguement

According to taxation justifications you thieving scum have it's a service provided to you so you have say in how its organized. So the only "tier argument" here is communist tier, as always.

>>94813

>"Go back to reddit your degenerate piece of shit"

Internet shitflinging and Moralism isn't an arguement kid

>According to taxation justifications you thieving scum have it's a service provided to you so you have say in how its organized.

No you don't

No one who isn't stupid even says that

Just because your tax money is used to fund a service Dosent mean that you personally get to decide how that service is run

Public / State property is not some sort of communal property held by all people it is literally the property of the state

That's true with most services actually not just the ebil goverment or whatever

If you buy shit at a Woolworths do you personally get to decide how the Woolworths is run?

>>94815

>isn't an arguement

Nor is anything you can say

>Moralism

Muh oppression

>No you don't

You do

>No one who isn't stupid even says that

You would

>Public / State property is not some sort of communal property held by all people it is literally the property of the state

Except it's only justification is faking it as a communal one, you stupid dipshit.

>>94817

>>Moralism

>Muh oppression

You don't know what Moralism means do you?

>Except it's only justification is faking it as a communal one, you stupid dipshit.

what justification? A Moral one?

In that case whether this is moral or Amoral depends on the individual

Obviously most libertarians (like you) will be opposed to it

While most of the population seemingly dosent

The mass acceptance of the state of things is what gives it its legitimacy

And no one is even attempting to "fake" this

No one is claiming that public parks and swimming pools are literally owned by the public

According to all Legalism it is owned by the state

So no you personally don't have a right to decide how a state function is run

>>94817

>You do

>you would

Maybe if your talking about higher stage Communism then one could say that the services that make up "Public services" would be managed collectively on a localizaed level but certainly not under the Liberal-Democratic and capitalist structure we exist under now which clearly marks public property and state asserts as property of the state

>>94822

>You don't know what Moralism means do you?

You don't

>what justification? A Moral one?

a statist one

>And no one is even attempting to "fake" this

They do, their justification is that state represents people's will.

>>94823

>higher stage Communism

Hahahh, there are still alive people left, you stupid fuck

>>94825

>a statist one

i don't want to get into a whole Statist v Anarchist shitfuck here but basically immediate devolution to Anarchy has never worked and a state must be used as a transitional period between the two

>They do, their justification is that state represents people's will.

>State represents people will

It's here your tripping up

While it is a Liberal claim that a state represents the will of the electorate that says nothing about the state and its hold on certain properties

No one claims that the state and the goverment institutions themselves are directly controlled by the people

And this once again goes back to my arguement of the population giving this credibility as most of the population votes for parties that believe in some public utilities at the very least

I don't see anyone voting for "voluntarists" or whatever in my country that's all I'm saying

>>94827

>i don't want to get into a whole Statist v Anarchist shitfuck

Of course you wouldn't you thieving scum

>While it is a Liberal claim that a state represents the will of the electorate that says nothing about the state and its hold on certain properties

Yet this claim is the main justification used.

>I don't see anyone voting for "voluntarists" or whatever in my country that's all I'm saying

So you like diseased, unwashed and unshaved colored fags instead, trannypol?

>>94828

>Of course you wouldn't you thieving scum

Not an arguement

>So you like diseased, unwashed and unshaved colored fags instead, trannypol?

And not an arguement

>>94829

>Not an arguement

Not an argument

>>94245

For the state to be abolished, the majority cannot passively support it, as that is the lifeblood of the state. If the majority oppose the existence of the state, a bunch of bento muslimi fans won't have the required support and/or apathy towards its predatory behavior that it would need to survive as a parasite.

>>94827

And how would someome vote for a voluntaryist? Surely not through the ballots, as that voting is idiotic at best, despotic at worst. You vote for voluntaryism by having your interactions with people be voluntary. You don't vote for voluntaryists, as there is no position to be voted into.

>>94827

>basically immediate devolution to Anarchy has never worked

Worked for Cospaia and Moresnet

>>94830

not an argument

Didn't fascists receive a massive holocaust of war causalities, decades of slavery, totally fdisarmed, and further war reparations? They keep killing themselves.

>>94356

NatSocs are collectivists. Why would a collectivist go Libertarian?

>>94925

Why not? I know I did. The other way around is much more improbable, Libertarianism is a one-way road when you start to understand it.

>>94877

We'll then that goes to prove my point further

Nowhere on earth do we see some great uprising of Voluntarists and Agorists etc deciding to op out of society and go live on some farming Commune

>>94245

>>something something muh economy will fix everything (for me) and prevent violence (against me)

No; through the market I am allowed to solve problems and protect myself, instead of being prevented from doing so by the state, as things are now.

>>94273

>workers have no bargaining power in a free market.

Wew lad.

>impose fascism

>civilization and flourishes

This is what stormniggers actually believe.

>>94347

See >>94349

>>94357

>Comparative to nations with similar levels of Economic development

>In Cuba's case Jamaica Haiti Dominica etc

>in DPR-Korea's case most African states also Haiti / Other shitholes

Do you not see how this severely damages your argument? Like, the whole point is that communism fucks your economy in the ass and you're stuck comparing yourself to "civilizations" that haven't invented the wheel.

>>94359

>No AnCap group is going to attack the Government directly

>this means black cuck porn scenarios

You do realize there are other ways to bring down a government than splashing your guts against the state's war machine, right?

>>94361

Weird; nobody else was talking about blacks and jews. Maybe you shouldn't watch your weird porn while you debate online; you're crossing your fantasies into the conversation.

>>94393

Also this. Can I get a trillion reichsmarks?

>>94770

Because nothing shows you how bad the government is at managing things than experiencing the systematic retardation first hand.

>>94774

>>most people who volunteer to fight in interventionist wars are libertarian

They're not veterans when they go in. You join the military a Republican, and you get out without much faith in the government you sold your knees to.

>>94807

Well this just shows that public property is a bullshit idea that doesn't deliver what it says on the can.

>>94815

>Public / State property is not some sort of communal property held by all people it is literally the property of the state

True, but I think he was talking about the justification given for public property in schools. In theory it's supposed to be the property of the community, but the reality is that these notions of communal property can only ever be a smokescreen for the fact that the state owns it all.

>If you buy shit at a Woolworths do you personally get to decide how the Woolworths is run?

No, because you're not buying shares in the Woolworths, you're buying the stuff they sell there. Once you buy it, yes, you have every say in what's done with it. That's just a bad comparison. It'd be a better comparison if you were a shareholder, rather than a customer.

>>94822

>No one is claiming that public parks and swimming pools are literally owned by the public

Except the public schools that teach you what to think about the government. This is absolutely the official state-sanctioned line taught in school. Yes, it's bullshit, but it's the justification they give to the public. They tell a completely different story in court, yes, but that's reserved for the people who actually try to cash in on the promise the state makes to them in school.

>>94827

> immediate devolution to Anarchy has never worked and a state must be used as a transitional period between the two

>to get from a state to anarchy, we have to have a transitional state, which is a state

Do you not see the infinite recursion, here?

>No one claims that the state and the goverment institutions themselves are directly controlled by the people

Except that's literally, exactly what is claimed and used as a justification for the entire American system. The Declaration of Independence says that all governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed. That's the founding document that establishes their territorial sovereignty, and thus their right to ordain and establish a constitution in the first place; their entire legal structure rests on it.

Again; it's not truly observed, but it's the exact and official reason which is given for why we can even have a government in the first place.

>>94955

>Nowhere on earth do we see some great uprising of Voluntarists and Agorists etc deciding to op out of society

Do you think it'd be a big unified movement that makes the news if such a thing did happen? You don't have to move somewhere and plant a flag to practice Voluntarism. Kind of the whole point is that it's quiet.

>>94955

First of all, there are such movements, they are just not large and are usually shut down by the gov't. Second of all, not everybody wants to live in a commune, practising voluntaryism can be done anywhere, and agorists would be stupid to move together in such a way. Third of all, there aren't many of us at all, just like there aren't large places without a state at all.