d1cd3a No.670063 [Last50 Posts]
let's have a discussion about modern land army doctorines
(pic unrelated)
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3367e0 No.670069
>>670063
The most intelligent doctrine going forward is to have mass-produced, standardized equipment while wearing no uniforms. Essentially, using surplus weapons/ammo/off-the-shelf civilian products in wartime.
So terrorism.
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20a090 No.670098
>pic unrelated
What are you talking about? Fire has everything to do with my doctrine.
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d7dc31 No.670127
>identify keypoint with largest enemy presence
>pummel it with all you got – artillery, missiles, bombing runs, napalm, anything goes. Strike needs to be massive and QUICK. No day-long artillery barrages like in the olden times, instead fire it all in under an hour so that the sky can't be seen over all the projectiles
>rush in with tanks supported by motorised infantry as quickly as possible; don't give the enemy a chance to get his bearings
>crush the resistance and carry onwards with classic Blitzkrieg
>result: keypoint captured, enemy lost its strongest element, rest of the front having to deal with a very rapid blitzkrieg
Of course, you need to make sure you have a sufficient amount of ordnance to carry this out
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fe9061 No.670133
Something like >>670127 but I'd add that everything should be standardized and multi-functional, with most of the focus being on firepower. The point is that you always have more firepower than the enemy, and you always have something to throw at them. Just look at the Eastern Front of ww2 for a good example, because both sides tried to make up for all of their shortcomings with more raw firepower.
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c901f4 No.670137
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e3a235 No.670143
Defensive trench warfare, let them come and bleed them dry.
Granted, that doesn't work anymore but whatever.
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1c1860 No.670149
>>670143
If that counts, then line battles. It's the most gentlemanly form of warfare that lets you match wits with the enemy and have some good sport all-around with little fear of death unless you're a trooper
The clean formations salve my 'tism-riddled brain.
Sadly, the colonials had to ruin this.
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d7dc31 No.670150
>>670133
>The point is that you always have more firepower than the enemy
Yep. It won't work if the enemy can out-dick you. If that happens, you need to switch to a different doctrine. Personally, I would try combining guerrilla warfare with mass firepower:
>find a natural chokepoint like a mountain passage or even just a road leading through a forest that you knew the enemy will pass through
>hide everything; dig yourself underground if you need to, just make sure enemy sentries don't discover you and wait for the main force to start passing
>fucking unload with all you've got from all sides, shower them with RPGs, mortars and bullets, set off the remote charges you readied beforehand
>after they're all dead, clean up the sentries and vanguard and move onto another chokepoint
The key is attrition. High attrition reflects really badly on the enemy leaders and political pressures at home will make them much more willing to negotiate.
Alternatively, get nukes. The ultimate deterrent.
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8d80bd No.670200
The bombing of Dresden was pretty fucked up, but I'm not gonna lie the thought of air raiding the absolute shit out of my enemies to the point that their cities turn into huge self-sustaining infernos has some appeal.
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c901f4 No.670203
>>670200
In total war all citizens contribute to the war effort in some way. They are legitimate targets.
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aca663 No.670208
>>670203
doubly so if said civilians are legally allowed to own weapons, they become vile baby-eating insurgents that deserve nothing but excruciatingly painful deaths.
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d7dc31 No.670461
Streoks, I got an idea.
>accept nuclear waste from all over Europe (getting paid mad dosh for it), stockpile it for a while
>work the waste into artillery shells as payload
>go to war
>whenever enemy creates a strongpoint, just shell it with this – strongpoint becomes dead point that nobody can stay in lest he'll suffer radiation sickness after a while
>blitzkrieg through the land as all the enemy fortifications become useless dead zones that cannot obstruct you
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861148 No.670473
>>670461
Why not just mini nuke the strongpoint?
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d7dc31 No.670474
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d7dc31 No.670477
>>670474
not to mention nukes aren't nearly as easy to acquire as nuclear waste. Nobody is going to pay you billions to take their nukes. They will pay you billions to take their nuclear waste, though. The enemy is PAYING YOU to take their payload and repurpose it into a weapon to be used against them. You'll probably run at a profit too, and get to get some tanks and stuff on top.
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c901f4 No.670485
>>670208
Don't want killed by your conquerors don't get conquered.
>>670461
>can't take strongpoint
>contaminate it for the next few millenia
This idea greatly pleases the /k/ube.
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53f270 No.670608
>>670485
Vae victis was the most chad thing anybody has ever said and it perfectly sums up warfare.
>>670063
My favorite doctrine has to be STEEL REHN
pic unrelated
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7b7edf No.670612
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5cda53 No.670881
>>670063
Mobile/Maneuver warfare doctrine.
It's the most realistic doctrine for any modern war as there is more land than there are men to garrison it, so you simply keep moving and outmaneuver the enemy. They can hunt you all day long but they have to sleep sometime, as long as you can keep out of reach when it benefits you, you can bleed them. Iraqi's used this to great effect during some war using trucks and rpgs to assfuck tanks.
Go read infanterie greift an, it's main points are:
>gotta go fast
>deception
>overwhelming concentrated firepower
Things like that, and you can overcome most enemies, just don't get shot and your good.
The only time this shit does not work is in an RTS type situation, where there are so many faggots everywhere that they will just swarm you, which thankfully is uncommon thanks to ATGM's, cluster munitions, HMGs, etc.
Just don't get cut off, cornered, or immobilized, once you do, ammo runs out quick and then your fucked.
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5cda53 No.670883
>>670477
This does no good if the place your dropping it is the same place you want to occupy, literally shitting where you eat.
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886e50 No.670886
>>670063
Against a civilized country, Armored Warfare with heavy guided rocket artillery. Heavily armored IFVs, Bradleys and the like. Against third world savages, cooperate with the good ones and completely destroy the enemy militarily and by winning the favour of the populace. Think what the bongs did during the Malayan Emergency. A fuckton of air support in both, of course.
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e5e9aa No.670889
>>670608
>posting weeb shit
This is why A.H. shot himself 74 years ago today. You Germans are so easy to be subverted, and weak-minded is what you are for engaging in anime.
>>670063
My favorite army doctrine is surprise attacks, especially at night (yeah, yeah, guerilla warfare, that sort of thing. it's not a fair fight, but there is no such thing as a fair fight)
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2cccc8 No.670921
First you do armored car rush. If it works, the enemy doesn't have time to mine the roads or set up ambushes, and an armored car going 100kph on interstate can cover a lot of ground. You basically set up disruptive units within your enemys area of operation within a couple of hours. You keep pouring in armored cars until the enemy wises up and sets up roadblocks, mines, ambushes, fortifications etc.
Then you go in with tracks, over farmland, very rarely using roads. Tracks bust up fortifications and ambush locations set up to stop the armored cars. All the meanwhile more armored cars pour in through every hole the tracks make in the enemy lines.
That's basically how you do proper warfare.
The problem today is everyone thinks there's no chance the enemy will be surprised, so they just ignore cars and build tracks. End up using tracks on roads like Americans in Iraq, using tracks to do what cars should do, and losing tracks by the hundreds even though one track is worth like 64 cars.
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167413 No.670933
>>670063
WAIT A SECOND!
That's my picture! I posted it on imgur some 10 years ago!
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2cccc8 No.670939
>>670143
Why do people think trench warfare doesn't work anymore?
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a71b12 No.670994
>>670889
>>posting weeb shit
>This is why A.H. shot himself 74 years ago today.
Nobody tell him…
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ae6d77 No.671012
>>670883
Well, if you plan to occupy the place, you don't do it, naturally. But if you just need a place taken out, or you want to make certain enemy cannot occupy some place permanently without needing to garrison it, this would be the way to go. It's essentially a terrain changer. Do you need to hold a narrow valley against superior enemy? Litter it with nuclear waste and it's as good as plugged, without needing to actually have your own army there to hold it (save perhaps a squad or two keeping it covered in case enemy had some hazmat suits on him). Alternatively, you could litter it with nuclear waste covertly and laugh as the enemy army marches through it, knowing they will be shitting their guts out in under an hour and will all painfully die within the week. Sure, the environmental damage to the valley is great, but greater sacrifices are made in war. There would be no defense against this – the enemy would simply be forced to take another path. Sure, hazmats exist, but there's no way he'd be able to equip an entire army with them, and even if he somehow did, can you imagine fighting in a hazmat suit?
It's an excellent way to utilise your nuclear capabilities without actually triggering MAD (unless you start dropping that shit on enemy capital or something; that might trigger MAD, but you wouldn't be so stupid as to do that, right?)
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1ca547 No.671022
>>670889
Anime is chan culture.
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c07b58 No.671031
>>670921
>Fucking_mechfags.jpg
Armoured cars are for riot control and occupational forces behind the lines - not 100km deep into hostile territory, beyond the reach of resupply or support, and flashing their arses at every RPG/grenadier team the enemy has.
>Step 1: Establish front line
Include IADS and anti-tank in your design from the ground up. Ideally do this before the war starts.
>Step 2: Advance until you hit the enemy line
>2a: entrench
>Step 3: Artillery plays counterbattery and hits the enemy line until it's weak enough to assault.
>Step 4: Infantry assault, drive hostiles off their line, continue advancing until you encounter organised resistance at which point revert to 2a
Armoured cars would be useful as a harrying force in step 4 but you'd still take heavy losses against a trained enemy with AT weapons.
<But muh blertskreeg!
Wehraboos need to pull their heads out of their arses. The German advance on France would have been stopped dead in its tracks if the Frogs more likely their commie government at the time had organised a proper defence and extended the Maginot Line then this mobility bullshit would never have started.
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c901f4 No.671034
>>670939
Because planes were invented. Trenches are good for situational/short-term situations for protection from enemy ground fire, but long-term you're just a stationary target asking for a UAV to come blow your ass to hell.
>>671012
Hazmat won't do anything to stop gamma radiation like it does beta and alpha. Just use primarily gamma emitting waste sources.
>>671022
Checked. Probably a post-'16 goon.
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20cb19 No.671037
>>670889
>calls Germans weak
>he likes pussy footing around like a skank in an alley.
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001e43 No.671107
>>671031
>Maginot line stopped at the border maymay
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2cccc8 No.671127
>>671031
How do enemy grenadier teams distribute the ammunition for their launchers? How do they distribute the grenadiers themselves? There's no teleporting, everything happens by truck, which means a single enemy armored car with a 20mm can strafe and ruin an entire column full of hundreds of grenadiers stuck in trucks. Besides accepting necessary casualties is step 1 to winning a war, how far would Germany have gotten into Russia if they feared molotovs at every street corner?
>Step 1: Establish front line
You only do this if both sides are aware a war is about to begin. Most of the art of war is preventing the other side from expecting this, usually by forming an alliance with them.
>>671034
Actually trenches got obsolete multiple times, but each time a countermeasure was developed. They still work fine if you have the time to dig in.
1. Top fired or fused artillery made trenches obsolete. Helmets and counterbat was developed to counteract it effectively.
2. Tanks were invented to drive over trenches. But then that was fixed by inventing tank mines and RPGs which prevented tanks from just driving over a trench.
3. Airplanes finally could just drop bombs and strafe trenches… but now we have interceptors and AAA and MANPAD and SAM.
What is it now? UAV? OK we just put in jammers, forget about UAV.
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281d9f No.671228
>>670921
>End up using tracks on roads like Americans in Iraq, using tracks to do what cars should do
What did he mean by this?
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c07b58 No.671242
>>671107
>French/German Border
<Concrete Bunkers, tank traps, trenches, presighted artillery with extensive on site ammunition stockpiles, and the best signals/communications infrastructure the period could provide
>French/Belgian Border
<A few infantry posts with maybe a phone line to central command every couple of miles
Yeah, total meme, what was I thinking.
>>671127
>You only do this if both sides are aware a war is about to begin
So you don't trust the competence of your intelligence service or the paranoia of your general staff?
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4ba023 No.671243
Televise degeneracy, make it seem mainstream. Propagandize everyone against degeneracy as racist, bigoted, homophobic, xenophobic, x-y-z-aphobic etc. etc. until the mass surrender of freedom loving peoples. TV is the most effective modern weapon off all time. Actually the people who control TV programming.
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91e607 No.671258
>>671242
The Maginot line used to properly extend into Belgium's borders along the Albert canal and Meuse river (pic related), but Belgium threw a political shitfit at the French government for some reason in 1936 and ripped up the Franco-Belgian treaty, kicked out all the French troops stationed on the Belgian portion of the Maginot line and just completely abandoned the defenses.
The memey infantry posts on the French-Belgian border was not intended to be part of the Maginot line, it was just the border, hence the lack of defenses. The Belgian portion of the Maginot line was supposed to be inside Belgium, not on the border, but the papist swampniggers fucked everything up like usual.
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c07b58 No.671264
>>671258
Still supports my point, the Maginot defences north of Schengen were abandoned and the French government allowed a gap around their front line practically inviting the Krauts to repeat the exact same move they had pulled in the previous war.
The shitfit the Belgians pulled was motivated by a desire to reinforce their image as a 'neutral state' in the growing tension caused by Hitlers growing rearmament and general contempt for the Versailles treaty. Fine, fair enough, neutrality hadn't defended them in the last war, but the Belgian government has every right to be as retarded as it wants to be - the French government was retarded not to immediately beef up their defences along the Belgian border though.
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c40767 No.671304
>>671258
>>671264
Please tell me, what's the point of Belgium? Would anyone even notice if France annexed it?
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91e607 No.671306
>>671304
>what's the point of Belgium
To be Dutch but Catholic
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ae6d77 No.671344
>>671304
>what's the point of Belgium
being the HQ of EU
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c07b58 No.671375
>>671304
>Would anyone even notice if France annexed Belgium
Probably not even the Belgians.
>What's the point of Belgium?
As far as I can remember the country of Belgium was created by Britain after the Napoleonic wars in order to annoy the French.
Some nations believe that they have a kind of destiny, that they were placed on earth by the gods themselves to preform a certain task in perpetuity. Belgium - however - knows that it was put there by dickhead politicians as an international dick move, and they do their best to live up to that heritage every day.
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273846 No.671377
>>671304
Belgium is rightful french clay that was separated by the Anglo after Napoleon 2.0 in1815 and meant to be a buffer state between France, Netherlands and Germany.
It sort of worked in WWI but clearly didn't in WWII it should have been re-integrated after it (in fact France should have invaded the minute they proclaimed neutrality).
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a423ac No.671378
>>671304
What's the point of italy?
>>671377
Nobody wants to be under the garlic-smelling bootjack of french faggots. And Belgium was never a rightful part of your shitty arab country.
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20cb19 No.671379
>>671258
>>671264
>>671304
Based Belgians,
I'm glad they stuck it to the degenerate frogs.
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c07b58 No.671382
>>671378
>What's the point of Italy?
By that logic the region that is now Belgium should be part of the Spanish Netherlands and recognised worldwide as rightful Hapsburg clay. Also Germany and Middle-Europe in general should be a few hundred separate counties rather than a handful of countries.
>>671379
So apathy, weakness, disarmament, and wilfully taking your place as useful idiots is based now? Does that word even mean anything anymore?
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8739c7 No.671386
>>671378
>What's the point of italy?
The same as Germany: you have all these closely related peoples in a single country, so you don't have to deal with a dozen garden varieties of them as a dozen separate entities. And it kind of works, unlike in e.g. Yugoslavia.
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ae6d77 No.671388
>>671382
>Also Germany and Middle-Europe in general should be a few hundred separate counties rather than a handful of countries.
Stop, anon, I can only get so erect
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c07b58 No.671390
>>671388
Look at this map, this cartographic and political clusterfuck, and remember that this is a simplified vision of a relatively uncomplicated period of Imperial history. Tell me how much you love it you little Czech minx. : ^ )
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ae6d77 No.671393
>>671390
100% unf, look at that fucking Bohemia jamming its cock among the german minors. This is some graphic geographic loli hentai.
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281d9f No.671402
>>671304
Belgium is NATO's strategic reserve of waffles and machine guns.
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2801eb No.671449
Maneuver warfare with combined arms.
The best still remains the best tbh.
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c07b58 No.671457
>>671393
>graphic geographic loli hentai
They really did earn their reputation as the dirty, dirty, sick fucks of the continent; didn't they.
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2cccc8 No.671483
>>671228
The armored doctrine is completely reversed though, the cars are being used behind the tanks instead of in front of them. The tanks themselves are the first over borders, over bridges, the first to enter cities, the first to see enemy bases… it's retardation at its finest.
If armored doctrine was done correctly - armored cars going first and scouting, removing enemy rocket teams, demining - we wouldn't have lost so much as a single track link in the middle east. The insurgents had ZERO way to bust through an armored car shield to get to our tanks.
>>671242
>So you don't trust the competence of your intelligence service or the paranoia of your general staff?
No I don't like being surprised.
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2cccc8 No.671484
>>671483
Also humvees are to armored cars what inflatable pools are to watersports. Let's be serious here, there are zero armored cars used by America at the time. LAV and Stryker are the closest and they're eight wheeler trucks, you lose one of them you either lose a dozen guys or as much equipment as a track carries around, thus defeating the entire point of expendable force recon.
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042e0b No.671485
>>671484
>>671483
The american has money to burn on airplanes, but cannot even offer armored transport for its troops.
It's truly a shit show.
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2cccc8 No.671488
>>671485
This is because Sky Knights and Semen have more fanboys in congress. Literally every retired pilot, muhreen, naypee and air farts, goes into politics and somehow makes it into congress or a state legislature at least. So these branches have ridiculous power. Meanwhile coast guard, national guard, and army might as well not exist in terms of budgets, even if they're useful in a day to day sense as well as if Americans ever plan on defending the country.
Also for some reason Americans hate efficiency. Humvee was designed as a sort of battle taxi, with light canvas doors you could remove so you could get in and out of it quickly as it drives you around base. It was meant to carry 2,500lb and weigh no more than 7,500lb fully loaded with crew, weapons and a full 2,500lb load. That was the maximum cap, in reality they were shooting for about 6,100lb. First time a land war crops up they're shooting for 9,000lb and having 10,000lb for the upper limit of the UAH variant family.
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2cccc8 No.671489
Although JLTV is closer to a well designed armored car. Still a lot of compromises and outright graft, but Oshkosh is a lot more fair and experienced than Gaytheon or LockFart would have been.
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c07b58 No.671527
>>671483
If your general staff are ever not assuming that they are going to have to every single neighbouring nation and several other major powers then they don't deserve their posts.
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37b757 No.671585
>>671022
Das rite every single board and every single imageboard shoehorned revolved around anime.
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ba288b No.677050
>>670203
this is why i say there are no such thing as civilians, only supply-side soldiers.
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ae105f No.680678
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
My favorite doctrine is what I like to call, "Call inna A10."
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5c8769 No.680681
>>670200
> The bombing of Dresden was pretty fucked up, but I'm not gonna lie the thought of air raiding the absolute shit out of my enemies to the point that their cities turn into huge self-sustaining infernos has some appeal.
I usually have reservations against bombing civilian centres, especially after hearing my grandfather's accounts of the fire bombings in Tokyo, but I tend VN to agree. Bombing civilians as well as their means of production works surprisingly well.
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928a4b No.680691
>>671304
>>671377
Ignoring the fact that as Belgium gets pozzed, the Walloons (French larpers) support getting nigged by refugees and EU more, while the Flemish have just elected to half the seats in their parliament an openly white nationalist party (Vlaams Belang) and another pro sovereignty Flemish party.
Seems like the Flems just want it more.
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6cd9c5 No.680753
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8b4f9c No.680759
>>671031
>Wehraboos need to pull their heads out of their arses. The German advance on France would have been stopped dead in its tracks if the Frogs more likely their commie government at the time had organised a proper defence and extended the Maginot Line then this mobility bullshit would never have started.
still, all that was needed for blitzkrieg was to pierce the line in only one point. and since they could easily concentrate power in one place due to everything moving by machine, they STILL would punch throught eventually and then ride to paris or buttfuck the rest of the line. it would just take more lifes and time
>>671382
>By that logic the region that is now Belgium should be part of the Spanish Netherlands and recognised worldwide as rightful Hapsburg clay. Also Germany and Middle-Europe in general should be a few hundred separate counties rather than a handful of countries.
that would be ideal, this is natural state of that region
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b67e49 No.680765
>>680759
>all that was needed for blitzkrieg was to pierce the line in only one point
I can see your point there, and that the French reserves at the time weren't mobile enough to counter Germany's faster units. However, even if you look at the best equipped WW2 Panzergrenadier outfits at that point in the war the overwhelming majority were still riding trucks that couldn't handle off road driving. A column of a few thousand men in those trucks, stuck to known roads, are an artillery and CAS units dream. Maybe 'stopped dead in its tracks' is an overstatement, but at least in theory France could have slowed the Germans down enough to kill their momentum and drag the fight out long enough to give the Frogs more of a chance.
>this is natural state of that region
Don't worry, I'm pretty sure that's the plan after the EU has castrated national governments and begun to implement their new Eurokommissariats.
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a6bc35 No.680766
>>671243
so the best doctrine is to just throw jews at your enemy
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9f6844 No.680772
>>671127
>What is it now? UAV? OK we just put in jammers, forget about UAV.
No, it's time for artillery to shine again. If the enemy seriously sets up an old school trench system, then use bigger cannons that can fire bigger shells further away. And those shells should be either thermobaric or seismic. Mind you, when I say big I do mean big, like 16" or bigger.
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9868f8 No.680811
>>680765
>CAS units dream
God I fucking love CAS.
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15aca3 No.680829
>>680772
As a friend put it to me, having thermobaric dropped on you in a trench isn't that bad, its ballistic missiles that scare the shit out of him given you don't really hear them until they vaporize the factory 400 yards behind you. Imagine turning an entire trench line into crater city, almost like filling a rabbit warren with oxy-acetylene and letting it go bang.
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c18a50 No.684071
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c18a50 No.684072
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