/fit/ - Fitness, Health, Exercise, Dieting, etc

>>139789

>Any suggestions for preserving lean muscle mass or any recommended optimizations to this process?

Keto isn't suited to preservation of lean muscle mass because it has a tendency to cause the burning of muscle tissue for energy. If you wanted to maximize the preservation of muscle mass while promoting the loss of weight, you should have avoided intake of high quantities of fat and focused on carb intake as your main source of energy. All programs which involve lifting preserve muscle mass better than ones that don't, and no diet completely stops atrophy if transitioning from lifting to sedentarism. Because you will be processing high quantities of potentially volatile fat from storage when rapidly losing weight, it is important to stay replete on vitamin E in order to keep the fat from turning into prostaglandins, creating lipofuscin, and the glycation of proteins after release from storage in adipose tissue. The rapid release of fat from storage is going to promote aging and stress. The need for vitamin E and C to partially alleviate this issue cannot be understated, and things like a small amount of coconut oil may also help lipids in storage from creating toxic byproducts—if not at least offer some additional protection for your liver. If you switch to a high carbohydrate diet, a high ratio of fructose offers increased cholesterol production which helps protect the liver, purge the toxic byproducts of polyunsaturated fats and also the environmental toxins held up by adipose tissue which you are releasing into your system.

The long term dangers of the body fat which you are purging are essentially the same as the dietary fat which you are eating except for when you eat saturated fat which has few negative qualities.

Feigelson, Eugene B., et al. The role of plasma free fatty acids in development of fatty liver. The Journal of clinical investigation 40.12 (1961): 2171-2179.

https://doi.org/10.1172/JCI104443

Leibovitz, Brian E., Miao‐Lin Hu, and Al L. Tappel. Lipid peroxidation in rat tissue slices: Effect of dietary vitamin E, corn oil‐lard and menhaden oil. Lipids 25.3 (1990): 125-129.

https://doi.org/10.1007/BF02544325

>Rats were fed for 5 weeks either 10% (w/w) menhaden oil (MO) or a 10% corn oil‐lard (COL) mixture (1∶1) in diets with ≤5 IU or ≤2 IU/kg vitamin E, respectively, or the same diets supplemented with d‐α‐tocopheryl succinate to a total of 35 and 180 IU vitamin E/kg, respectively. Slices of liver and heart from these rats were used to study lipid peroxidationin vitro. Thiobarbituric acid‐reactive substances (TBARS) were measured […] This study demonstrated that a dietary fish oil increased the susceptibility of rat liver and heart toin vitro lipid peroxidation, and that vitamin E decreased TBARS in tissues from rats fed COL to lower levels than for tissues from rats fed MO. The results suggest that there might also be an increased requirement for dietary antioxidants by humans using fish oil supplements.

Hu, Miao-Lin, et al. Effect of dietary lipids and vitamin E on in vitro lipid peroxidation in rat liver and kidney homogenates. The Journal of nutrition 119.11 (1989): 1574-1582.

https://doi.org/10.1093/jn/119.11.1574

>Rats were fed for 5 wk 10% (wt/wt) menhaden oil (MO) or a 10% corn oil-lard (COL) mixture (1:1) in diets with a low vitamin E content (≤5 mg/kg) or supplemented with d-α-tocopheryl succinate to a total of 30 or 150 mg per kg. Thiobarbituric acid-reactive substances (TBARS), conjugated dienes (CD), hexanal and total volatiles (TOV) were measured […] The fatty acid composition of liver and kidney reflected that of dietary lipids. For uninduced peroxidation, there was in general a significant inverse correlation of TBARS, CD and TOV with the log of dietary vitamin E content for liver and kidney from rats fed either lipid. For induced peroxidation, the inverse correlation was significant for liver, but not for kidney, from rats fed either lipid. The correlation was generally higher for liver and kidney from rats fed COL than for tissues from rats fed MO. Vitamin E was thus a more effective antioxidant for liver than for kidney regardless of the dietary lipid, and for liver and kidney from rats fed COL than from rats fed MO. Dietary MO enhanced tissue susceptibility to both peroxidation systems.

Spiteller, Gerhard. Linoleic acid peroxidation—the dominant lipid peroxidation process in low density lipoprotein—and its relationship to chronic diseases. Chemistry and physics of lipids 95.2 (1998): 105-162.

https://doi.org/10.1016/S0009-3084(98)00091-7

>Modern separation and identification methods enable detailed insight in lipid peroxidation (LPO) processes. […] Radicals attack any activated CH2-group of polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFAs) with about a similar probability. Since linoleic acid (LA) is the most abundant PUFA in mammals, its LPO products dominate.

Why is avoiding lipid peroxidation important? There are countless studies. Here is one that hints at the problem:

Kakkar, Rakesh, et al. Lipid peroxidation and activity of antioxidant enzymes in diabetic rats. Molecular and cellular biochemistry 151.2 (1995): 113-119.

https://doi.org/10.1007/BF01322333

>Our findings suggest that oxidative stress occurs in diabetic state and that oxidative damage to tissues may be a contributory factor in complications associated with diabetes.

A diet high in fat increases oxidative stress through increasing polyunsaturated fat in the body.

Matsuzawa-Nagata, Naoto, et al. Increased oxidative stress precedes the onset of high-fat diet–induced insulin resistance and obesity. Metabolism-Clinical and Experimental 57.8 (2008): 1071-1077.

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.metabol.2008.03.010

Milagro, Fermín I., Javier Campión, and J. Alfredo Martínez. Weight gain induced by high‐fat feeding involves increased liver oxidative stress. Obesity 14.7 (2006): 1118-1123.

https://doi.org/10.1038/oby.2006.128

Because body fat increases often involve increased oxidative stress, polyunsaturated fats are significant contributors to fat gain.

>>139797

Does it matter that I do make a point to eat a good amount of avacados and mct oil and shit for fats?

>>139794

I should probably add that I did get my lean body mass and all accurately measured, at 304 pounds total I came out to 195 pounds of lean body mass, I do labor I just used to eat like 8000 calories a day so I'm not like walking water bed status. The NEET thing was kinda a joke I actually do work pretty hard.

>>139797

Why aren't the full dietary mixtures described? Was the rest of the meal carbohydrate based? I would agree that a high fat combined with a high carb intake would be detrimental to health.

>>139794

>This guy is trolling,

I don't troll. I provide a scientific perspective. Ketogenic diets are merely a fad that is dangerous to the health of society.

Not only do high carb, low-fat diets not only reduce estrogen (which retains water and promotes fat accumulation.)

Rosenthal, Monroe B., et al. Effects of a high-complex-carbohydrate, low-fat, low-cholesterol diet on levels of serum lipids and estradiol. The American journal of medicine 78.1 (1985): 23-27.

https://doi.org/10.1016/0002-9343(85)90456-5

>During the program, serum estradiol levels were significantly reduced from 47.2 ± 4.6 to 23.8 ± 2.5 pg/ml (mean ± SE) whereas serum testosterone levels were unchanged

but low carb diets reduce testosterone

Lane, Amy R., Joseph W. Duke, and Anthony C. Hackney. Influence of dietary carbohydrate intake on the free testosterone: cortisol ratio responses to short-term intensive exercise training. European journal of applied physiology 108.6 (2010): 1125-1131.

https://doi.org/10.1007/s00421-009-1220-5

>This study examined the effect of dietary carbohydrate (CHO) consumption on the free testosterone to cortisol (fTC) ratio during a short-term intense micro-cycle of exercise training. […] Statistical analysis (ANCOVA) revealed the fTC ratio decreased significantly (p < 0.01) from pre-study resting measurement (Pre 1) to the final post-study resting measurement (Rest) in the low-CHO group (−43%), but no change occurred (p > 0.05) in the control-CHO group (−3%).

and so can dietary fat:

Meikle, A. Wayne, et al. Effects of a fat-containing meal on sex hormones in men. Metabolism-Clinical and Experimental 39.9 (1990): 943-946.

https://doi.org/10.1016/0026-0495(90)90305-V

>The fat-containing meal, but not the nonnutritive or mixed carbohydrate and protein meal, resulted in a significant (P < .01) reduction in total and free testosterone.

A high ratio of carbs to protein increases testosterone

Anderson, Karl E., et al. Diet-hormone interactions: protein/carbohydrate ratio alters reciprocally the plasma levels of testosterone and cortisol and their respective binding globulins in man. Life sciences 40.18 (1987): 1761-1768.

https://doi.org/10.1016/0024-3205(87)90086-5

>Testosterone concentrations in seven normal men were consistently higher after ten days on a high carbohydrate diet (468 ± 34 ng/dl, mean ± S.E.) than during a high protein diet (3.71 ± 23 ng/d1, p<0.05) and were accompanied by parallel changes in sex hormone binding globulin (32.5 ± 2.8 nmol/1 vs. 23.4 ± 1.6 nmol/1 respectively, p<0.01). By contrast, cortisol concentrations were consistently lower during the high carbohydrate diet than during the high protein diet (7.74 ± 0.71 μg/d1 vs. 10.6 ± 0.4 μg/d1 respectively, p<0.05), and there were parallel changes in corticosteroid binding globulin concentrations (635 ± 60 nmol/1 vs. 754 ± 31 nmol/1 respectively p<0.05).

and a lower ratio of fat to carbohydrates does as well.

Tegelman, R., et al. Effects of a diet regimen on pituitary and steroid hormones in male ice hockey players. International journal of sports medicine 13.05 (1992): 424-430.

https://doi.org/10.1055/s-2007-1021292

>One of the teams (DIF, n = 22) participated in a special dietary program including reduction in fat from approximately 40 per cent of total energy intake (E%) to less than 30 E% and an increase in carbohydrate intake from 45 E% to about 55 E%, […] Serum concentrations of testosterone, SHBG, NST and cortisol increased significantly during the study period in the DIF group and were, with the exception of SHBG, significantly higher than in the SSK group at the end of the study

A diet high in fat has the potential to have anti-androgenic effects due to the androgen antagonism of dietary polyunsaturated fat:

MITSUHASHI, NAOKI, et al. Inhibitory effect of fatty acids on the binding of androgen receptor and R1881. Endocrinologia japonica 35.1 (1988): 93-96.

https://doi.org/10.1507/endocrj1954.35.93

>The effects of long chain fatty acids on the binding between androgen receptor of castrated rat prostate and3H-R1881 were studied. The binding was not affected by saturated fatty acids such as palmitic acid (16: 0) or stearic acid (18: 0). But unsaturated fatty acids such as oleic acid (18: 1), arachidonic acid (20: 4) and docosahexaenoic acid (22: 6) inhibited the binding between androgen receptor and 3H-R1881.

(Metribolone (developmental code name R1881), also known as methyltrienolone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metribolone )

And because of how polyunsaturated fat has a tendency to accumulate in tissues, these anti-androgenic effects increase in the long term should high fat eating not cease.

>>139799

Checked. You just have to play the slow and steady game then, I've never been that size but I've seen posts on old /fit/ of really fat dudes losing their weight in the span of ~3 years with little to no hanging skin.

>>139802

Eh I'm not going to change from keto, its been effective so far. Though I likely will not continue it when I reach my low weight. I will probably just up to a 2200ish calorie normal diet or possibly try to bulk back up to 200 from 170 while lifting and try to get to a relatively low BF% 180 pounds.

>>139803

I'll just get cosmetic surgery at that point I'm not dealing with that if its an issue. I'm an engineer and I make decent money so I can afford that if need be.

Also is intermittent fasting a meme? I've been doing that too. I had a friend cut from 330 to 220 in 6 months and I just asked him to turn over all his notes and emulated his process because it was so effective for him.

>>139798

>Does it matter that I do make a point to eat a good amount of avacados

Avocados—especially their oils—are hepatotoxic, stunt growth, and cause cancer.

Werman, MJ, M & Neeman, I. (1986). Oxidative stability of avocado oil. J Am Oil Chem Soc. 63. 355-360. 10.1007/BF02546046.

>This study is concerned with the extent of oxidative deterioration and oil stability as determined by measuring peroxide and conjugable oxidation products (COP) values and AOM time of refined bleached avocado oil in comparison with refined soybean and olive oil. The formation of peroxides in avocado oil exposed to daylight at room temperature is similar to that of soybean oil but greater than that of olive oil. […] Crude avocado oil is very sensitive to oxidation when exposed to daylight and fluorescent light, in contrast to its stability in the dark at room temperature. The chlorophyll content in crude avocado oil is reduced rapidly on exposure to daylight and fluorescent light.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/226916622_Oxidative_stability_of_avocado_oil

Werman, MJ, et al. (1989). The effect of avocado oils on some liver characteristics in growing rats. Food Chem Toxicol. 27(5):279-82.

>The effects of various avocado oils on some liver characteristics were studied in growing rats. […] rats fed unrefined avocado oil obtained by solvent extraction from the intact fruit, or refined avocado oil containing avocado-seed oil, showed significant growth inhibition, an increase in the amount of hepatic lipids (identified as steatosis by histopathological examination), […] However, serum alkaline phosphatase activity was increased in rats fed the seed oil, the unrefined solvent-extracted oil from intact fruit, or the unsaponifiables, and aspartate aminotransferase activity was significantly increased in the group fed avocado-seed oil.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2744658

Here we find that elevated alkaline phosphatase is associated with a whole host of degenerative conditions involving obesity and cancer and affected tissues such as the liver, skeleton, and kidneys:

Elevated alkaline phosphatase

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elevated_alkaline_phosphatase

Werman, MJ, et al. (1991-2). The Effect of Various Avocado Oils on Skin Collagen Metabolism. Connective tissue research. 26. 1-10. 10.3109/03008209109152159.

>rats fed unrefined avocado oil showed a significant decrease in total collagen solubility in the liver, while there were no changes in total collagen, protein and moisture content. Chicks fed unrefined avocado oil as compared to those fed refined avocado oil also showed a decrease in hepatic total soluble collagen while hepatic total collagen remained unaffected. Electron micrographs and light-microscope examinations of rats' liver revealed collagen accumulation in the periportal location. This is suggestive of the early stages of fibrosis.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/21480124_The_Effect_of_Various_Avocado_Oils_on_Skin_Collagen_Metabolism

Werman, MJ & Neeman, I & Mokady, S. (1991-3). Avocado oils and hepatic lipid metabolism in growing rats. Food and chemical toxicology : an international journal published for the British Industrial Biological Research Association. 29. 93-9. 10.1016/0278-6915(91)90162-Z.

>The effect of various avocado oils on liver metabolism was studied in growing female rats. The rats were fed diets containing 10% (w/w) avocado oil for 4 wk. In comparison with rats fed refined avocado oil obtained from cored fruit by centrifugal separation, rats fed unrefined avocado oil obtained by organic solvent extraction from intact fruit, or its unsaponifiable components, showed a significant increase in total liver lipogenesis as well as in phospholipid and triglceride synthesis.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/21146157_Avocado_oils_and_hepatic_lipid_metabolism_in_growing_rats

Naveh, et al. (2002). Defatted avocado pulp reduces body weight and total hepatic fat but increases plasma cholesterol in male rats fed diets with cholesterol. The Journal of nutrition. 132. 2015-8.

>The potential use of avocado as a fiber source was evaluated. […] Rats consumed semipurified diets containing either avocado pulp as the dietary fiber source or cellulose (control) with or without 10 g/kg cholesterol and 5 g/kg cholic acid. Food consumption and body weight gain were lower in rats fed avocado compared with those fed cellulose. Relative cecum weight was higher in avocado-fed rats. Plasma and hepatic cholesterol levels did not differ in rats fed diets without cholesterol, but plasma cholesterol was greater in avocado-fed than in cellulose-fed rats that consumed cholesterol.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/11277760_Defatted_avocado_pulp_reduces_body_weight_and_total_hepatic_fat_but_increases_plasma_cholesterol_in_male_rats_fed_diets_with_cholesterol

Note that higher cecum weight probably indicates feeding of intestinal bacteria and endotoxin (from bacteria) is associated with increased cholesterol levels, because cholesterol elevates in the presence of toxins in general as a protective measure. It can therefore also probably be assummed that food consumption was lower, because the rats were ill and lost appetite from endotoxemia—not because avocado pulp is a healthy strategy for weight loss.

Feingold KR, et al. (1993). Effect of endotoxin on cholesterol biosynthesis and distribution in serum lipoproteins in Syrian hamsters. J Lipid Res. 34(12):2147-58.

>Infection and inflammation increase serum triglyceride and cholesterol levels in rodents and rabbits. Endotoxin (LPS) has been used as a model of infection and its effects on triglyceride metabolism have been previously characterized. In the present study we demonstrate that both low (100 ng/100 g body weight) and high dose (100 micrograms/100 g body weight) LPS increase serum cholesterol levels in hamsters.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8301233

Zusman I. (1998). Comparative anticancer effects of vaccination and dietary factors on experimentally-induced cancers. In Vivo. 12(6):675-89. Review.

>The antitumor effect of the olive-oil diet was connected to its content of monounsaturated fatty acids, such as oleic and palmitic acids. The promotive tumorigenic effects of other high-fat diets (avocado, soybeans) were associated with high content of some polyunsaturated fatty acids (linoleic and alpha-linolenic).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9891232

The avocado seeds are bad too, but I doubt many people eat those.

http://www.journalrepository.org/media/journals/IJBCRR_3/2016/Feb/Dambazau1042015IJBCRR23196.pdf

https://www.researchgate.net/blog/post/human-genome-shaped-by-vegetarian-diet-increases-risk-of-cancer-and-heart-disease

>>139808

Those studies are all old as fuck and sound kinda bullshit.

>>139809

This. They use a bunch of medical jargon to imply minor bio reactions so you could get grain and sugar lobbyists yelling that meat and vegetables cause cancer

>>139806

>>all those may's,could's, and potentially's

There's a reason I word it like that. The higher fat diets with a high ratio of saturated fat are better than the ones with a high ratio of polyunsaturated fat, but because all high fat eating will cause a gradual accumulation of polyunsaturated fat in tissues unless your fats are purified in a laboratory setting, high fat diets must absolutely be cautioned against if obesity, diabetes, cancer, and aging are a cocern.

All fats inhibit glucose oxidation though, which is problematic.

Randle, Philip J. Regulatory interactions between lipids and carbohydrates: the glucose fatty acid cycle after 35 years. Diabetes/metabolism reviews 14.4 (1998): 263-283.

https://doi.org/10.1002/(SICI)1099-0895(199812)14:4%3C263::AID-DMR233%3E3.0.CO;2-C

>The starting point in 1963 for the so called Glucose Fatty Acid Cycle was the realisation that the metabolic relationship between glucose and fatty acids is reciprocal and not dependent. Glucose provision promotes glucose oxidation and glucose and lipid storage, and inhibits fatty acid oxidation. Provision of free fatty acids promotes fatty acid oxidation and storage, inhibits glucose oxidation and may promote glucose storage if glycogen reserves are incomplete. […] In the authors opinion the evidence for inhibitory effects of fatty acids on whole body glucose utilization ad oxidation (predominantly muscles) is decisive and enzyme mechanisms mediating these effects are well established.

>>139810

Yeah and a lot of those looked like jewish names and I don't trust those people at all.

>>139811

Carbohydrate Reward and Psychosis: An Explanation For Neuroleptic Induced Weight Gain and Path to Improved Mental Health?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3131727/

>>139813

Are you just like some weird grain shill or some shit?

>>139814

No. I'm the guy countering the grain-shill.

Dietary glycemic load and cancer recurrence and survival in patients with stage III colon cancer: findings from CALGB 89803.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23136358

Effects of low-fat, high-carbohydrate diets on risk factors for ischemic heart disease in postmenopausal women.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9094889

Relative intake of macronutrients impacts risk of mild cognitive impairment or dementia.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22810099

>>139815

shit my bad bro I fucked up the IDs

>>139809

This is little more than bias against good science because it's old. The science hasn't changed, but society's fads have.

>>139812

If you don't want the Jewish names, do the research yourself. I can't help it if that's the first results I find when using a search engine.

>>139815

>the grain-shill.

I never said anything about grains. You are imagining things. I consistently recommend sweet fruits and milk as carbohydrate sources throughout my messages on this board.

Why does it seem like no matter what people eat there are like a billion studies saying you're doing it wrong and its going to kill you tomorrow. I don't understand why there isn't clear and concise information on this shit at this point. Always seems like someone's just trying to sell you shit when it comes to nutrition. I deal with absolutes and known quantities in my work so its very frustrating.

>>139819

I still drink milk I just don't drink too much.

>>139820

>I don't understand why there isn't clear and concise information on this shit

There is clear and concise information, but you don't know about it because you don't read the science. The general population hears things in the news which are massive distortions of what real biologists learn and teach. The news promotes observational studies. Scientists do experiments. It is safe to ignore most observational research (and many reviews) and focus on experimental results as much as possible. Occasionally there is research fraud in experimental publications due to funding biases, but if you keep looking and searching for more papers, you will eventually find the truth.

>>139819

Steve jobs got ass cancer from an all fruit diet

>>139822

>It is safe to ignore most observational research (and many reviews) and focus on experimental results as much as possible.

Especially when they do a dietary nutrition experiment on Rats compartively to humans on a 10% fat and 80% carbohydrate food source. Real solid science there.

>>139823

I don't promote an all fruit diet and never will. I constantly suggest that fruits are a good source of carbohydrates. It's hard to say Job's cancer was from the fruit he ate specifically. You can get cancer from things that aren't in the regular diet such as random radioactive contamination, and things which are carcinogenic can stay in the body for many years (such as before his fruit diet). I would say his fruit diet was certainly a failure to allow him to move past cancer and survive though.

>>139824

No the rat science is what is good. It's a lot less political and controversial when it involves rats instead of people.

>>139826

It's extremely political to spin data of biological micro-reactions in lab rats and attribute it to human biology especially if you're feeding them abnormal quantities of a specific nutrient.

>>139836

It's fine if you want to use a position similar to humans being wholly unique and risen above the weaknesses of rats, but the more I read the more I see how humanity has few special quirks to avoid directly applicable conclusions from most animal experiments. There is a degree of unreality from laboratory situations that doesn't make sense for practical lives of humans with freedom to eat what they crave, but if you think there is spin in my perspective, just call it out where you see it and I will try to find more supporting evidence to give you a broader perspective. I highlighted the previous studies because I came down from a broader perspective—which gives me the intuition to know what to look for—to reach for relevant specifics.

>>139837

There's no conclusion. You're at a theory of optimal nutrition based on medical data..

>>139819

>I can't help it if that's the first results I find when using a search engine.

You get from Google, while you demonize anons posting nutritional recommendations based on actual application. Keto is a fad like penicillin was, it fucking works.

>>139820

Ignore 650612, he shows up every fucking thread pushing his useless shit.

You're doing great, in fact the hardest thing to control is your diet. The only advice I have is that you'll likely see your weight loss slow as you shed body mass and subsequently see a drop in metabolism rate, and if you lose weight too fast you'll see stretch marks/loose skin. Don't lose motivation if that happens, it's tons better than being a fatty anyway.

Preserving muscle mass: 'cardio kills gains' isn't just a meme, cardio will wreck havoc on both muscle and fat and will kill muscle mass faster than doing strength training. But there's no two ways about it since you'll lose some muscle mass while on a cut even if you do strength training anyway.

I'd say cut to however lean you want to be before thinking about muscle mass. If bodyweight routines aren't challenging you enough anymore, you can try progressing to strength training, though do keep in mind progress will be slow or even nonexistent on a cut.

Best of luck to getting to your goal weight, fam. We're all gonna make it.

>>139838

>while you demonize anons

It's true. I'm a big bully.

>Keto is a fad like penicillin was, it fucking works.

People lose weight on keto—often quickly. I never claimed they didn't. I specifically warn that there is a greater tendency to burn muscle mass while on such a diet, because the body wants to get carbs and can obtain them from muscles. My position is that ketogenic diets are a bad influence on health and should be cautioned against. There are various reasons I see it as bad—not the least of which is the toxic burden of omega-6 fatty acids stored in adipose tissue after years of eating a modern Western diet. My perspective is that low fat, high carb is constructive and lowers stress and that high fat, low carb invites chaos and destruction. You can lose a lot of weight with some chaos. Many people will fall to cancer and diabetes that way though. That's one of the primary dangers of high fat eating by the way: cancer.

The popular way into obesity is to eat too much polyunsaturated fat, and the safe way out is to stop doing that. I know some people will be dead set on keto regardless of evidence vilifying it, so here is a safer way to do low carb:

-saturated fat—not vegetable oils

-chocolate fat (cocoa butter) or coconut oil as the main fats

-no high fat fish

-no nuts

-no chicken

-zero or few eggs

-ruminant meat

-leafy greens

-plenty of vitamin E and C

-cheese for calcium

-eat gelatin

It's a lot safer and healthier to eat a lower fat, high fructose (from fruit and honey) diet though.

>>139839

>pushing his useless shit

Why do you think it's useless? I do my best to explain the science behind it. Eating this way changed my life.

Keto is awesome. It works for the same reason intermittent fasting does. It lowers insulin. I actually started with intermittent fasting and lost a decent bit of weight. When I made my meals keto my weight loss took off like crazy. I'm not hungry and I feel amazing. I used to eat one keto meal every other day, but since I've started training and lifting again for the first time since high school, I've got back to one keto meal a day. In case anyone is wondering, my lifts are progressing just fine.

>>139840

Fruit and honey really fucks with my head, makes me feel sluggish and terrible all day. Eggs, beef, dairy, and dark chocolate are the only foods that don't do this to me. Explain that, science man.

>>139840

>coconut oil as the main fats

<processed fat better than natural fat from animals

I eat pork weekly with a mixed green salad and I bet I'm in better shape than you.

>>139845

Stress hormones can plummet when you finally do your body a favor by supplying the energy it needs. It takes time to transition to predominantly carbs or predominantly fats. The mitochondria of cells adapts to what is frequently given. The thyroid axis becomes sluggish when deprived of carbs for extended periods

and thyroid hormones are needed to process carbs with efficiency and maintain energetic wakefulness in the absence of cortisol and adrenaline which strongly stimulate alertness. Cortisol and adrenaline dominate metabolism when carbs are not available, and the body gradually loses its ability to produce youthful hormones that heal and reverse aging, build muscle, and prevent excessive accumulation of fat.

While stress hormones reliably induce insomnia, thyroid hormones in the presence of adequate fuel induce wakefulness if appropriate and alternatively sleepiness if possible. Because insulin promotes sleep, it is important to make sure your meals are not excessively insulinogenic when wakefulness is desired. Protein is insulinogenic, so a steak can make you sleepy. Dietary fat causes glucose to hang around longer making insulin more necessary. Fructose is less insulinogenic than glucose, so fruit is better than rice in this regard. If for any reason your carbs are consumed in the absence of minerals—namely potassium and magnesium—or during a deficiency of B vitamins—namely thiamine but riboflavin, B3, biotin are also important—insulin will be higher. This is why I recommend dates (high in potassium and magnesium) and oranges/orange juice and low fat milk. These come with reasonable amounts of vitamins and minerals. Starch sources such as potatoes and sweet potatoes are also good if good fruit is hard to come by, but cooking methods that use water may drain vitamins and minerals if the broth is discarded.

Some people supplement thyroid hormones when transitioning from keto. Alternatively iodized salt with selenomethionine or seafood could supply the trace minerals needed for thyroid axis function. I became a coffee drinker when I stopped eating low carb as caffeine is similar in function to thyroid hormones and can promote both wakefulness and (surprisingly) sleepiness in the right context. Caffeine is great for such a transition as it helps clean fat out of the liver which can restore the ability to make adequate T3 (the primary active thyroid hormone).

Other than sluggishness, feeling terrible may indicate excessive lactate production which is exacerbated by deficiencies in thiamine, B3, and thyroid hormones. If you have migraine symptoms though, this is usually related to serotonin excess and nitric oxide. Is what you eat gentle on your tummy? Bananas are notorious for causing indigestion and are low in fructose anyways.

>>139846

Your description of pork fat as "natural" invokes considerable scepticism when it is acknowledged that pig farmers frequently use feed divorced from nature. Common historical ingredients have included corn oil and soybeans. Pigs fed in such a way retain significant omega-6 content in their adipose tissue whereas ruminants have bacteria in their intestines capable of saturating dietary fat. It is also the case that I never said you should eat processed coconut oil (but I consider it exceedingly safe) or cocoa butter. Those fats can be obtained from whole coconuts and unprocessed, unsweetened chocolate just the same. One might even eat chocolates stuffed with coconut bits. I do.

>>139849

>Your description

I reread it, and I suppose you didn't say it directly about pork. My point is still relavent though.

>>139849

>Pigs fed in such a way retain significant omega-6 content in their adipose tissue

It's a good thing no one eats pig raw

>>139853

What do you mean? Cooking doesn't change the omega-6 content or ratio much unless you drain the fat or cook it in something like coconut oil. It's really a matter of preference. You already know if you eat lean cuts, but the premise of being careful about pork preparation is silly when pigs should be fed good stuff to begin with and other meats are available.

>>139840

Is egg custard pudding the ultimate health food?

>>139854

>Cooking doesn't change the omega-6 content or ratio much

Really? So cooking vegetables doesn't lose "much" nutritional value either I guess. Sounds like the easiest diet to go on is 3 square meals of cooked meat and vegetables.

What's the harm in taking a specific fat source if it's only in the meat, keeping in mind that the majority layers of fat are removed in standard cuts of meat?

>>139865

>What's the harm in taking a specific fat source

Omega-6 fatty acids are especially harmful and their intake should be minimized as much as possible. One of the main reasons all high fat diets are unhealthy is that unless your fat sources are purified in a laboratory, they always contain some omega-6. Here is a series of posts on the matter:

>>139358

>>139359

>>139360

>>139361