/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>764489

>Catholic freemasons

That's called an oxymoron.

Interested as well.

(((Dan Brown))) I guess presents these guys as illuminati basically.

Is it just stupidity as all of his romances or is it based on some truth?

Never mind. I found out why.

It was the jesuits who started this meme and one of the critics is Fr. James Martin.

I guess that settles it.

>>764492

No, illuminati were an actual group that don't exist anymore.

>>764496

Weren't the illuminati a sect of freemasonry?

>>764498

>Weren't the illuminati a sect of freemasonry?

Just one of many secret society groups that were part of the Enlightenment era. Freemasons aren't as old as they want people to believe either. It's another retarded enlightenment group, but masonic guilds did exist in old europe (but this was more pertaining to the actual craft of building).

>>764499

So Masonic guilds were just the first organized labor union of sorts?

>>764489

>Catholic freemasons

Not possible.

>>764502

>>764499

Pretty much. But they were still ignorant. One easy indicator to show how these guilds didn't have "secrets" is they were dumbfounded how the Romans built domes. It wasn't until they trashed and looted Byzantium (rather than just asking for help) in the 4th crusade and gathered more classical literature (i.e. Aristotle) that the Renaissance was born.. and they learned to build domes again. But you'd think if they such a special group, they wouldn't ever need to do this. Even the Muslims could do it, simply because they enslaved Orthodox Christians and forced them to build things like the Dome on the Rock in Jerusalem.

Anyone claiming to be Opus Dei, is certainly not

>>764566

This is dumb, anyone can join Opus Dei it's not all that secretive. Plenty of members of Opus Dei are open about it, the founder is a popular saint.

Freemasons, illuminati and other secret societies of the enlightenment as the other anon said were just that, secret philosophical societies. Their philosophies were considered degenerate and corruptive for society then, but now it's the norm so there's no need for hiding anymore. Today they're LARPing clubs for rich oldfarts. Others evolved into revolutionary, military sects, like the Carbonari, that had nothing to do with freemasonry anymore. Those secret societies were coming from a huge spectrum but people sometimes dumping them all together and that's wrong. Sometimes Freemasons trying to push this narrative themselves to take credit and present themselves as the super secret society that's pulling the strings from behind the scenes sinces the ancient times. They also love to claim that they are connected with groups that had nothing to do with them, like the Templars, or claiming that well known, influencial figures were freemasons, after their deaths.

>>764609

I've heard of this "Masonic Templar" connection. Could you expound on it, anon?

>>764489

Da Vinci Code is fiction anon.

>>764610

Within the rites of free masonry they claim to be the inheritors of the Templars hidden knowledge. There is little to no evidence for this claim.

Masons like to claim connection to everything, from the Templars to the Druids. The Templars had been accused for heresy in the past and condemned by the inquisition, a bunch of fake allegation were made that they've became muslims, jews, magicians etc. The Templars were burned alive and the stigma remained. Some centuries later Freemasons tried to connect their groups with others from the past that were in one way or another persecuted by the Church, be them Cathars, Bogomils, Templars, as a way to create the myth that they're an ancient group of illuminated people, fighting forever against the "darkness". Thus the Templar-Mason narrative was created.

>>764620

It was for >>764610

>dan brown

[-]

In Spain opus dei is strong. Some former political ministers (economy, defense, etc.) And politicians are members. And as Spanish I can say two things about them:

1- it seems that there is a secret war between jesuist and Opus dei. One of them is left wing and other is right wing, the two of them have their own book editorial, schools, influence in the government, etc.

2- if you go to the day to day for them, they are more similar to an American sect: they work for the Opus Dei, they give a part of their salary to the Opus Dei, the Opus Dei gives home, work and food in exchange. It's hard to leave the Opus Dei because almost all your belongings are theirs. I find this wrong because so you force uninterested people who dislike you to do things for you and they could make things against the group if he finds that it would make him feel better.

Conclusion: IMO Opus Dei is legal and maybe their objective is good. But I don't find them or their ways good. They work as a closed group and their survival needs members that give them money and work for them almost like a sect. I find a lot better a monastical life with the Franciscans or the Carmelites before this. But yes, my vision is biased, as I distrust the people that say "viva Cristo rey" or that they are members of Opus Dei. And also I was in a Catholic marianist institute.