/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

Here's a better question for you, OP.

If you went to heaven but your lover went to hell, would you give it all up to be down there with them?

>>746367

You would be with pure Love, something beyond what we can even contemplate.

I do not know if you'd miss her at that point. I don't think you'd be upset over it while you are in Heaven.

No, you will be too busy glorifying God an praising Him for all he does and is, including condemning a wretched sinner such as your family member to hell. Sounds harsh, but you will be too busy praising God for His perfect justice than to lament over your family member.

You'd also get the knowledge to understand why it had to be that way.

>>746367

In the strict sense of the terms, absolutely not, because the question compares a mere created good to the very definition of Good, which is uncreated and the ground upon which everything that exists necessarily depends. Their difference is like that between a single natural number and infinity. No amount of natural addition to the former is going to get you to the Infinite.

But in a different sense, it will still fail to be the case, because when all is said and done everyone will get not only what they deserve, but what their heart most desires, and as C.S. Lewis once pointed out, the choice is between only two things: 'those who say to God, "Thy will be done," and those to whom God says, in the end, "Thy will be done."'

When i was a christian i believed that god would erase our memories of fallen loved ones. Near the end of revelations it says something about god wiping away peoples tears. The idea of that is kind of horrifying to me now.

>>746616

>everyone will get not only what they deserve, but what their heart most desires

I hope so man.

>>746782

By 'heart', i'd say he means ethereal heart, not carnal heart, so you know, i'm not sure 'desire for waifu' counts.

>>747139

>not carnal heart, so you know, i'm not sure 'desire for waifu' counts.

What if it's not just sexual desire?

>>746367

God's will should be held in higher regard than your own feelings about the retribution of your loved one.

>>747139

>>747258

What I mean is, acknowledging that:

1) Sexual desire is one component of spiritual marriage, not the entirety thereof but still a legitimate component,

>Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency. (1 Corinthians 7:5)

>For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. (Ephesians 5:31)

>Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge (Hebrews 13:4)

2) There is nothing intrinsically sinful or wrong about desiring to be married,

>But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry. (1 Corinthians 7:36)

>Let thy fountain be blessed: and rejoice with the wife of thy youth. Let her be as the loving hind and pleasant roe; let her breasts satisfy thee at all times; and be thou ravished always with her love. (Proverbs 5:18-19)

>Whoso findeth a wife findeth a good thing, and obtaineth favour of the Lord. (Proverbs 18:22)

Furthermore, while it is 'good' to remain unmarried if possible, that is not a binding commandment,

>Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. (1 Corinthians 7:1-2)

>I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, it is good for them if they abide even as I. But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn. (1 Corinthians 7:8-9)

>Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you. (1 Corinthians 7:27-28)

There is nothing sinful about desiring a wife and desiring to have sex with your wife. This means that, for a man, the desire to be married (entailing, among other things, sexual intercourse within that marriage) and the desire to please God can coexist. Therefore, if >>746616 is true insofar as the heart's desire will be granted, and the desire for a wife is a God-pleasing and non-sinful desire, why should it be impossible?

>ID changed

>>746367

It is a question i myself struggle with, giving that my father is an avowed atheist.

Thomas Aquinas argued that the suffering in hell is good to those in heaven:

"Nothing should be denied the blessed that belongs to the perfection of their beatitude. Now everything is known the more for being compared with its contrary, because when contraries are placed beside one another they become more conspicuous. Wherefore in order that the happiness of the saints may be more delightful to them and that they may render more copious thanks to God for it, they are allowed to see perfectly the sufferings of the damned."

(http://www.newadvent.org/summa/5094.htm)

Now this to many people may sound horrifying, how can they be happy seeing the sufferings of those in hell? Of their family and friends?

St Silouan the Athonite was once told by a hermit that "all atheists will burn in everlasting fire" Silouan replied to this man and said "if you saw someone burning in everlasting fire, would you be happy?" to which the hermit replied "It couldn't be helped, it would be their own fault", Silouan replied sadly that "Love could not bear that, we must pray for all".

I think what we must do is to constantly pray for them, pray for them to convert in this life and if not then pray for mercy in the next.

>>746367

>you go to heaven and that person goes to hell

>Heaven and Hell are separate places where people are sentenced to be either being punching bags or eternal singing automatons

No, end this meme.

>>747537

This is the best answer.