Open theism?

Email
Comment *
File	Select/drop/paste files here
* = required field	[▶ Show post options & limits] Confused? See the FAQ.

Embed	(replaces files and can be used instead)
Options	Do not bump (you can also write sage in the email field) Spoiler images (this replaces the thumbnails of your images with question marks)
Password	(For file and post deletion.)
Allowed file types:jpg, jpeg, gif, png, webm, mp4, pdf Max filesize is 16 MB. Max image dimensions are 15000 x 15000. You may upload 5 per post.

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

Open theism? Christanon 03/02/18 (Fri) 04:11:53 b7ccd4 No.611941

What do you guys think of open theism as an answer to the challenge of Calvinism?

I find myself oddly drawn to open theism, mainly, to be frank, because it is a great solution to the problem of evil, and it makes my attitude towards God much better in respect to my shitty life…

However, I'm concerned that it's heresy. James White destroys the open theist Bob Enyart in video related, and I haven't been able to find a debate where I thought the open theist won. Thoughts? What about an open theism where God can predict the future with high, but not perfect accuracy?

From Wikipedia:

>In short, open theism says that since God and humans are free, God's knowledge is dynamic and God's providence flexible. While several versions of traditional theism picture God's knowledge of the future as a singular, fixed trajectory, open theism sees it as a plurality of branching possibilities, with some possibilities becoming settled as time moves forward. Thus, the future as well as God's knowledge of it is open (hence "open" theism).

Christanon 03/02/18 (Fri) 05:52:20 70039b No.611972

No. Unadulterated, unconditional free will makes no sense at all. By the way, I'm Eastern Catholic so I'm gonna lay that baggage at the door.

Calvinists and pre-determinists are correct in placing limits on human free will. But they are wrong in saying that we have no free will at all. It is more like we are lesser creatures who are bound by rules and limitations, but we still behave "freely" within our limitations.

Think about it: there is only one agent who is truly Free, and that is God. Everyone who is a servant of God must of needs be less free. So from the beginning, Catholic idea of "free will" was always with a lowercase "f", not a capital "F".

Open theism seems to jeopardize God's divine knowledge, and it is not good to lower your understanding of God just to feel good.

Christanon 03/02/18 (Fri) 06:04:05 9f0e8d No.611974

>Answer to the challenge of Calvinism

That;'s Thomism. Or Molinism.

Christanon 03/02/18 (Fri) 06:04:44 40d4c5 No.611975

>>611941

As >>611972 said, that is bad.

We simply do not have absolute freedom, and never will. What we have free is our wills, desires, pursuits, aversions, thoughts, emotions, etc (I contain all this in the will). That is all up to you. Not even your body is a free thing (do not take this as that sins are not yours). God has given you that great thing, no more is needed, no more should be desired, and no more will be given.

Christanon 03/03/18 (Sat) 08:55:31 b7ccd4 No.612526

>>611972

If our will is not truly our own, and God knows what we will decide at every juncture at our life, how can that will truly be called free? It's completely illogical.

The problem is, the traditional view makes no sense for me, so I'm torn between open theism and Calvinism.

Christanon 03/03/18 (Sat) 17:42:12 421f0a No.612687

>>611941

It's heresy. Try reformed molinism instead.