/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

no

>>537169

Nope

>>537169

No.

>>537169

Yes

>In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the down payment of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.

>>537169

Yes, if Christ himself told you that you are saved, like the thief on the cross.

>>537197

Like this?

>Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live

>>537169

I really wish you could but, no.

1 Corinthians 1:18

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

>>537286

Bait?

>>537286

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Matt 7:21

>>537286

Why do Baptists always quote Romans and ignore the Gospel?

>>537169

No. But isn't that even more reason to live your life as holy as you can ?

It's beautiful actually.

God bless

negatory ghost rider

Yes

1 John 5:13

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

>that ye may know that ye have eternal life,

>>537289

>Matt 7:23

>And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

>I never knew you

>NEVER

>John 10:27

>My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.

>I know them

>>537289

>21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

>22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

>23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

I hope that was just ignorance and not malicious in intent.

>>538420

>>538417

Doesn't prove OSAS at all.

>>538458

But it says Jesus knows his sheep and that he will tell people he never knew them. He can't say that to people that were his sheep because he did know them. Also it says when you get saved you won't get blotted out of the book of life so he can't ever remove you.

Only after you died.

>>538402

Came here to post this. It is this assurance that keeps us strong when Satan accuses those close to death. Our FAITH in God and His promises save us.

>>538458

This isn't about OSAS. Apostasy and a loss of faith causes a fall from grace. But with that faith and with the Sacraments, we can be sure of salvation.

>Death you cannot end my gladness: I am baptized into Christ! When I die, I leave all sadness to inhereit paradise! Though I lie in dust and ashes, faith's assurance brightly flashes: Baptism has the strength divine to make life immortal mine.

>There is nothing worth comparing to this life-long comfort sure! Open-eyed my grave is staring: even there I'll sleep secure. Though my flesh awaits its raising, still my soul continues praising: I am baptized into Christ; I'm a child of paradise!

>>537169

Apparently only by special revelation, according to the Council of Trent.

>>538402

>>538403

>>538543

>>538598

14 And this is the confidence which we have towards him:

That, whatsoever we shall ask according to his will, he heareth us.

So we are as sure, as we are sure in our prayers.

>>538598

Those that Jesus will turn away will be certain of their salvation. Just because you feel certain does not mean you are on the path of salvation.

what is this guy ( >>538798 ) trying to say?

>>538858

Tha we are as sure of our salvation as much we are sure that our prayers are done - i.e. we have certianity but no absolute. For if we were, Paul would no call us to "work ou salvation with fear and trembling" and we would not be "saved by hope" for hope is "of things uncertian". To Romans Paul wrote bout election - but out of them all, he called elected ONE person.

>>538872

>Tha we are as sure of our salvation as much we are sure that our prayers are done

how in the world are you getting this from that verse?

tangentially related:

is there a site that has verse by verse commentary from catholics?

sort of like biblehub?

>>538881

>how in the world are you getting this from that verse?

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God;that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. And this is the confidence which we have towards him: That, whatsoever we shall ask according to his will, he heareth us.

John wrote his letter that they may believe and know that they have eternal life. And he gives level of this certainty - certainty of prayer

>is there a site that has verse by verse commentary from catholics?

I would say Haydock one from 1899 but it's not verse by verse. It's still good though.

St. Thomas wrote commentary on most of NT and some of OT, but not all is in English nor he wrote about 1 John.

A Lapide wrote the best Catholic commentary on entire of Bible but it's massiv work that was not translated to english as far as I know.

John Chrysostom gave many homilies on NT also. As well as many other fathers.

Augustine wrote about First Epistle of John but never finished it.

It's all that I use for I am poorfag and have not money for whole commentaries and even if I were not I would not buy english ones.

But you just google modern commentaries on this and others topic.

>>538798

Two can play at this game:

"…we have confidence before God; and whatever we ask we receive from him, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him. And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us." (1 John 3:21-23)

Scripture interprets Scripture, and 1 John 5:14 does not imply that assurance is wavering, soluble, or uncertain for as we pray to God for salvation and true faith, He will give it to us.

>For if we were, Paul would no call us to "work out salvation with fear and trembling"

But it is not us alone who works or us who starts working, but "God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. "(Phil. 2:13)

>we would not be "saved by hope" for hope is "of things uncertian"

An unfortunate translation of Romans 8:24. We are saved in "this" hope which is written to be "not seen" not "not certain". Not seen because, while it is certain, more certain the sun rising again tomorrow, it has not yet been revealed fully to all. But what is "this hope"? "And not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies," the resurrection or the consummation of the promises of God. And faith in the the God of those promises, or "in this hope," is the thing 'by which we are saved. That same God is God who gives full, blessed assurance as He gives eternal life to those He has chosen to save. (John 10:28, Hebrews 10:19-25)

So no, 1 John 5:14 does not come close to proving against full, blessed, certain assurance.

>>538968

>John wrote his letter that they may believe and know that they have eternal life.

i disagree.

the "these things have i written unto you" in 1 John 5:13 is talking about the immediately preceding verses 1 John 5:6-12.

just like the "these things" in 1 John 2:1 is talking about the immediately preceding verses 1 John 1:5-10.

and the "these things" in 1 John 2:26 is talking about the immediately preceding verses 1 John 2:18-25.

the stated purpose of the entire epistle is in 1 John 1:3-4.

<so what?

i think he's reached his conclusion on the topic of assurance of salvation in 1 John 5:13 based on the use of "these things" and is talking about something new in verse 1 John 5:14.

but even if that weren't the case, i still don't see how the second bolded part would make one lack certainty.

>That, whatsoever we shall ask according to his will, he heareth us.

why would anyone doubt that He would hear our petitions that are in accordance with His will?

i don't understand.

>But you [could] just google modern commentaries on this and others topic.

i tried for like 2 minutes earlier and couldn't find one that's verse by verse.

>>538854

>Those that Jesus will turn away will be certain of their salvation. Just because you feel certain does not mean you are on the path of salvation.

Some will. And you're right, a mere feeling of certainty is not enough to mean anything. We need certainty in the word of God and of the Holy Spirit behind us to have security in salvation. To know that it is true.

Hebrews 6:17-19

Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:

That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil;

Ephesians 1:13-14

In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.