No.755584
And so it begins, the great bullying of our time.
Two chapters are out, as of now. Here's the link (hazardous levels of smug, proceed with caution):
https://pocket.shonenmagazine.com/episode/13932016480029136187
Not translated yet, obviously.
Here's the game from the author himself, if anyone wants it.
https://anonfile.com/D9r6T1c8ba/kouhai.zip
No.755595
Well it's definitely bullying my eyes.
Why do web manga always have such shit resolution? Is it to get you to buy an actual print copy?
No.755596
>>755584
Really? Awesome. Made these awhile back, take em.
No.755605
>>755584
Oh no.
I'm excited for this and will read every chapter that gets translated. But part of me wishes that such pure evil was never created to begin with.
No.755612
Fucking again with the image scrambling. If someone can solve this problem for me, I'll translate this immediately.
Hint: https://pastebin.com/ntdVWerR does this for Comicgum.
No.755614
>>755612
>image scrambling
What is that
What the HECK is that
No.755616
>>755612
Are you trying to rip the source? Just use something like ShareX to screencap, it's not like it's in good quality to begin with.
No.755622
Here's the translated chapter "0", a short extra.
No.755624
Isn't this from that sadpanda imageset where she kicks the guys balls a lot and bullies him? I don't get this kink.
No.755627
>>755624
>she kicks the guys balls
He wishes.
No.755632
>>755624
I don't remember any ball kicking. Now, ass/leg kicking, that I do remember.
No.755636
>>755624
Yes, there are multiples of them. Sadly, unlike in the first one, he doesn't stand up for himself one bit.
Perhaps he draws the line at NTR, like you should
I wonder if the success of Karakai Jouzu no Takagi-san paved the way to this, since it is about really soft bullying. This though is kinda tame so far.
No.755637
Is this a part of it?
Nagatoro is getting tamer every year
No.755638
>>755612
Okay, figured out every (?) image is just a simple flip of rows/columns. (i.e. first row, second column is now second row, first column and so on.) Gonna play around with ImageMagick and see if I can do this on my computer in shell or with a Python script.
No.755655
>>755584
THIS FUCKING BITCH
No.755664
>>755638
Got it. Was tooling around with crop stuff and stumbled upon the answer. Once you have the raw .jpgs properly named,
for f in *.jpg; do
convert "$f" -crop 960x1376+0+0 "$f"
convert "$f" -crop 240x344 \
-set filename:tile "%[fx:page.x/240+1]_%[fx:page.y/344+1]" \
+repage +adjoin $f_%[filename:tile].png
montage -mode concatenate -tile 4x $f_?_?.png finished/$f
done
Fortunate that the pattern is simple and the same for every image or I'd be fucked.
No.755671
>>755622
Prefect. I hope she'll stay in control like this, even if their relationship proceeds. There's just too many stories in which their roles get reversed once the guy shows only the tiniest bit of courage.
No.755700
>>755624
>>755636
Wait, people actually liked those? They just made me feel sad for the guy and despise the girl.
No.755707
>>755584
>first pic
Can't even image the kind of bullying that would go on while pregnant
No.755711
>>755700
I haven't read any of it but what I heard always made it sound like she goes beyond simple fun teasing.
I'm all for Takagi-san type teasing, but I don't see the appeal in outright insults or in violence, especially if, as the images earlier in the thread suggest, it sometimes ends up reducing the guy to tears.
No.755723
>>755700
The reason you don't understand is because it's a humiliation fetish, and is in the same fetish family as cucking.
Your response to it is completely normal.
No.755725
>>755707
Best case:
>I'm going to teach this kid mommy's ways
Worst case:
>get ready for divorce and alimony you loser
If you get the worst case, the answer is lock her up in the basement until birth and tell the kid she died during labor if the kid asks. Even if she is joking.
No.755772
>>755584
>Here's the game
Truly at times like these I wish I could read Japanese.
No.755778
>>755700
>not taming the monster
No.755791
The only way this could be anything but hot garbage is if it ends with senpai either snapping and strangling her to death or telling her to fuck off for good.
No.755814
>>755637
>>755622
Why is this so vanilla? I remember reading a few chapters of the original and it was way more fucked up, like an abusive relationship. Why she kicked him in the ass of all places? Is that a Japan thing?
No.755817
>>755814
Part of the reason I like this devil is that in the beginning there was that teasing but it was from a dominant role, then you had the second one where she showed off a bit of sadism with her teasing, going full pelt and kicking him in the butt.
Now though? It's like a romantic comedy instead, there's still smug and teasing but Nagatoro doesn't project that dominant stance she once had.
What I mean is, she teases senpai to make him embarrassed here but in the older ones she embarrassed senpai to put him in his place. It was her teasing that eventually made him confess, remember. And he went along with it because he's just like that.
No.755830
>>755700
I'm sorry, Anon. Your shit taste is terminal.
No.755835
>>755814
I feel like the basic premise is the same, but the meat is gone because they're only short 3-page extras. The basic premise is "fake dere -> stabbing in the heart -> twisting the knife -> surprised/regretful/satisfied dere", pic related.
If you keep it short, it feels like a romantic comedy, if you make it a 50-60-panel CG like the originals you get a S-M relationship, and I'm sure if you dragged a single arc out to a 150 page manga it'd look like borderline NTR. Hopefully the author realizes this and keeps the "knife twisting" portion as long as possible. Regardless though I'm going to read it purely for Nagatoro's joyful S faces.
No.755858
>>755857
Please, cancel your omission ASAP.
Thank you.
No.755863
>>755830
>borderline NTR
>accusing others of shit taste
You can like whatever the fuck you want but try developing some self awareness.
No.755864
>>755863
>accusing others of NTR
Just because you have shit taste doesn't mean everybody else has it too.
No.755866
Just looking at that girl, I get the feeling she'd break down if you forced her to have a short haircut.
No.755873
>>755864
There's no point denying his accusation when the scenes from the CGs have already been posted in this thread. What do you think >>755835 and pic 3 of >>755817 are if not NTR themes?
You cannot like that shit without liking NTR. People who like NTR like it for the betrayal and emotional devastation, and the scenes that have been posted show exactly the same thing. Having an apology at the end doesn't change the fact that the entire point of the scene is to invoke the exact same feelings as any other NTR, and no apology can undo the disgust you should feel towards her. If you really detested NTR you would have dropped it hard before getting to the apology anyway, which is what I would have done if I hadn't learned about the scene from this thread and known not to waste my time getting there in the first place.
No.755875
>>755873
Are you unironically from /pol/? You might want to acquaint yourself with this anime/manga character archetype called "tsundere", because this girl you're memeing about falls under an extreme variant of that archetype, and it hasn't a single thing to do with NTR. I'm sure there are enormous faggots such as yourself that read this looking for the betrayal and emotional devastation and then find themselves disappointed and angry that they haven't actually been imaginary-cucked, but for the rest of us there are other ways to read the events in this.
No.755877
>>755873
How is it NTR if they were never in a romantic relationship in the first place? She's just making fun of Senpai.
No.755886
>>755875
>literally showing him a picture of herself with another man and telling him it's her boyfriend
>"she's just being tsundere"
You're delusional. If that's not NTR themes nothing is.
>>755877
>How is it NTR if they were never in a romantic relationship in the first place?
They clearly were though. He certainly thinks they are, and she specifically mocks him for thinking so, which when you translate her sadism obviously means she does too. They're not dating perhaps, but that doesn't mean they aren't in a romantic relationship.
No.755889
>>755886
>awkward autist confesses to bully and verbally rips him apart and only pretends to go along with it to have more excuses to abuse him
>they were clearly in a relationship
This is some high level shit.
No.755891
>>755886
I don't want to be like everybody else and accuse you of being from /pol/. I'll accuse you of being from /r9k/, or more likely /monster/ instead.
No.755892
>>755889
Well, as I implied, I haven't read it, I assumed it was like a more hardcore Takagi-san, where she does actually like him. I didn't disagree with >>755875 that she's an extreme tsundere, just with the claim that fake NTR can be dismissed as having "not a single thing to do with NTR" because of it.
But if she genuinely doesn't like him that obviously puts a different light on things. I don't see how that could be the case given her reaction to him asking her out, though.
No.755893
>>755891
There is absolutely nothing wrong with /monster/.
No.755895
>>755638
But why though? Why transpose it?
No.755896
>>755893
>Well, as I implied, I haven't read it
You could have read it twice in the time that you spend sperging. Instead you sit here, while being an armchair psychiatrists and accusing 2D characters of 3D behaviour.
>>755893
>There is absolutely nothing wrong with /monster/
I'm so sorry, Anon.
No.755897
>>755896
>You could have read...
I assume that was for >>755892
>>755896
>>755894
Pure love best love.
No.755898
>>755897
>Pure love best love.
Wrong
No.755899
File: 0e83d4188b35cd0⋯.png (Spoiler Image, 870.82 KB, 800x990, 80:99, 0e83d4188b35cd0901475253ba….png)
File: 1bb2c9be0cfba24⋯.png (Spoiler Image, 643.58 KB, 700x870, 70:87, 9a22c627567b0f1d23d343d4e7….png)
>>755898
>that artist
Good taste. I really mean it, I love that artist's stuff.
No.755909
>>755896
>accusing 2D characters of 3D behaviour
2DPD exists.
>>755897
Correct, it is best. So it's too bad that /monster/'s slogans about romance aren't often held up by the actual content. Far too often they start with sex at first meeting and worry about love afterwards.
No.755927
>>755671
>Not wanting to de-bitchify a confident woman with the power of cock.
>not wanting the woman to realize that if she keeps pushing her rape fantasized might come true.
Pleb. Not even worth a redtext.
No.755928
>>755877
>>755875
Where do you people come from?
No.755929
>>755928
A mysterious land where people think about things instead of having kneejerk reactions and screeching about things they have half the facts on.
No.755931
>>755927
>Not wanting to de-bitchify a confident woman with the power of cock.
In this case I sure don't want. There's like a million stories like that out there, the same artist did many of them. Just give me some variety is all I'm asking for.
No.755932
>>755892
If it's fake NTR and you as a reader are aware of it being fake NTR, then how is it NTR?
No.755934
>>755932
The girl attitude is simply despicable, and you're not expected to be aware of the fact that is fake NTR, and even when you know, reading it is just terrible.
No.755935
>>755929
Strange, since that's very different from what I'm reading.
No.755937
>>755934
>the joke she made hurt my feelings, not matter what the reveal was
Being a little girl isn't an excuse for acting like such a massive faggot, Anon.
No.755938
>>755937
Not everyone likes NTR.
No.755941
I do like the idea that eventually the protagonist breaks down and rapes her and she still doesn't stop bullying him (even during the rape)
No.755943
>>755941
Now that's something I could get behind
>The more she bully him the harder he rapes her
No.755944
>>755932
For one thing, it's not shown to be fake until the end, and anyone with taste would have left before reaching that point.
I haven't seen anything to suggest she wouldn't do it, given how vile she is. Half the people are claiming she didn't really like him at that point so I don't see why it wouldn't be assumed to be real until you were told otherwise.
Out of curiosity, what were the things she said she would show him that were "even more amazing"?
No.755945
>>755940
>Girl cheating on you is a joke
It is a joke if it actually is a joke in the story that you have should read by now.
No.755947
>>755934
>you're not expected to be aware of the fact that is fake NTR
I'm pretty sure you are, as it's not chronologically or release-order the first panel ever.
Also maybe your problem is that you self-insert, because I don't, I see it as a girl pretending to be a disgusting slut to get a reaction out of the typical faggot protagonist, and I don't see anything wrong with that. She's not a slut and she doesn't actually behave the way she pretends to behave, that's kind of the point of her character, same as the pure gyaru archetype.
No.755948
>>755945
I know it's not real, idiot, but that doesn't make it a good joke, specially since I'm not fucking laughing. Don't know about you, but I don't find the idea of cheating particularly amusing.
No.755949
>>755947
>Another I don't self insert faggot
I bet you justify NTR because you don't self insert too, like others of your kind. Kill yourself and stick to normalfag hobbies where you don't self-insert either.
No.755950
People will never stop liking Nagatoro even if you "mix" it with the new definition of NTR so why try
No.755951
>>755947
>I'm pretty sure you are, as it's not chronologically or release-order the first panel ever.
Knowing what she's like makes it MORE likely to not be fake.
>>755948
Don't expect to have the same sense of humor as people who like to read humiliation and sadism from the POV of the victim, I suppose.
No.755953
>>755949
>like others of your kind
No.755955
>>755950
Only pathetic faggots like it, and they deserve to be bullied.
>>755951
>Don't expect to have the same sense of humor as people who like to read humiliation and sadism
It's just hard to grasp there's people that legitimately find this funny, but then again, they are probably into ballbusting as well.
No.755956
>>755955
>Only pathetic faggots like it
No.755957
>>755949
>not self-inserting makes you a normalfag
Kill yourself.
No.755958
>>755953
He's right though. "I don't self insert" is exactly what NTR fags often claim to justify their shit fetish.
>>755950
>new definition
The ones making a new definition are the ones who enjoyed this case of NTR but don't want to admit the implications of having liked it.
They're the ones saying complete nonsense like "it's not NTR for another guy to be her boyfriend if she's tsundere".
No.755959
>>755955
>literally "Why are these people having fun?"
No.755961
>>755959
Close, but not quite. It's actually "Why do these people find NTR fun?"
No.755963
>>755961
It's not even NTR.
No.755964
>>755961
But where is the NTR?
No.755965
I generally found Karakai Jouzu no Takagi-san to be better than what I've seen in this bullying comic. It might just be because it is childish and innocent.
No.755966
>>755961
Why do people find lolis attractive?
We're all perverts. Drawing arbitrary lines to determine what is "acceptable" or not in a fucking fantasy is stupid.
No.755967
>>755957
>Implying it doesn't
I don't see a lot of normalfags self-inserting in porn. They just "watch it because of the girls dude".
>>755959
More like "how can people enjoy NTR "Jokes"". There must be a reason, anon and that reason is you being a low-key cuck
No.755968
>>755966
>Why do people find lolis attractive?
Because they are cute. As simple as that. How is this in any way cute and not despicable?
>I-it's ok because we are all perverts guys
Kill yourself. Guro and scat are also acceptable because of that? The line is called common sense, and even though it might vary, the amount it varies for you specifically means a lot.
No.755970
>>755966
lolis are innocent and simple, and often dumb. Also a lot of people really just wish they had a daughter and things are mixed up in their heads.
No.755972
>>755961
>Nagatoro: Hey, I'm fucking this guy.
>Guy: Is my little sister telling lies again? Plaese take care of her, even if she is a weirdo.
<it's NTR
No.755973
>>755968
>Guro
Guro is 100% acceptable and you are the most tasteless of all swine.
No.755974
>>755972
You don't know that until the guy reveals it. I think I can see the appeal in that shitty girl, but she is still shitty and will never stop being shitty.
No.755975
>>755873
>>755877
You retards should actually read the whole thing instead of just the two images posted in the thread.
First of all, it isn't NTR. They were never in a relationship, if she was leading him on she might be a cunt, but it's still not NTR.
However, she wasn't even leading him on while staying with another man. She actually likes the guy and bullies him because she's a shy insecure tsundere. She actually gets nervous and hesitates a bit when he shows his love and the "boyfriend" she showed him was actually only her brother or something, he was showing the pic to make him jealous.
No.755976
>>755967
Just because normalfags do X doesn't make the inverse of X a non-normalfag thing to do. Stop being retarded.
No.755978
>>755975
>if she was leading him on she might be a cunt, but it's still not NTR
>Inb4 you need to be in a relationship for it to be NTR
This is the most retarded things I've heard. If she is leading you on, you probably have feelings for her, and that alone qualifies as NTR. There's NTR where you're cucked for wanting to fuck your sister but being unable to and so on with said sister getting fucked, of course
>She actually likes the guy and bullies him because she's a shy insecure tsundere
I knew this was it. Doesn't change that Tsunderes are shit and this girl somehow manages to draw all the good aspects of NTR.
No.755979
>>755976
This. There's more than enough normalfags that consume /a/ material.
No.755980
>>755978
>I knew this was it. Doesn't change that Tsunderes are shit and this girl somehow manages to draw all the good aspects of NTR.
Kinda moving the point there.
No.755982
>>755976
But it's not about doing the inverse, retard, is about doing the exact same thing normalfags do because you're a normafag that dissociate itself from the media you see/read, probably because you actually have a normalfag life.
No.755983
>>755978
I though she just gets off on ibullying the guy, not that she actually likes him
No.755984
>>755980
Sorry, I meant the to draw all the bad aspects of tsunderes.
No.755985
You need to realize that you were the one with the 3DPD goggles on, making the assumption that she's probably a slut NTRing the MC. Everyone else read the same panels and thought that she's lying, because that's her character, she pretends to be a slut but is pure, ala the old cliche. The fact that you assumed 3DPD behavior over 2D behavior on a 2D girl makes you a tremendous casual.
No.755986
>>755968
>>755970
I wasn't actually looking for an answer because I know damn well why I like lolis. The point is if you try explaining how you want to fuck 8 year olds to a normalfag you might get some weird looks at the very least, yet to our minds there's nothing wrong with it. If you start frothing at the mouth about people liking NTR just like the normalfags do about people liking loli how are you any better? People clearly have different standards of what qualifies as "common sense".
I'm okay with people jerking off to NTR just as I'm okay with being vored by furries then shat out because I don't want them to not be okay with me jerking off to lolis. I find it hard to see this kind of judgmental attitude towards fetishes as anything but the kind of arrogance and desire to exert power over people that drives the people who want to stomp out anime because it's "that sick filth where they have sex with kids".
As long as none of it is real and nobody's forcing you to come into contact with it, what are you even complaining about? Just that you don't like it?
No.755987
>>755975
>they were never in a relationship
>She actually likes the guy and bullies him because she's a shy insecure tsundere
>...when he shows his love
So he loves her, and she loves him, and they are in a relationship where they both show it in their particular ways, but they're not in a romantic relationship? Right.
If you show this dialogue to anyone who has heard of NTR but doesn't know the source, they will tell you that yes, this is NTR. The only reason you lot are denying it is because you like the source and admitting it's NTR would mean you liked NTR.
Tacking on an apology at the end is like a loli comic where at the end the loli mentions she's actually 22. If you read far enough to find out it's not loli, it means you liked it while it was supposed to be loli. If you got as far as the apology here, it's too late.
>>755965
It's because Takagi-san, along with most of what people call bullying, is actually just teasing. Plus Nishikata is actively trying to get her back, not whatever this MC is doing.
No.755988
>>755978
> If she is leading you on, you probably have feelings for her, and that alone qualifies as NTR.
That's not what NTR means. It's not even what cuckolding means. She's manipulating him, not cheating on him.
No.755989
>>755987
An active protagonist really does matter in the end. If it is just bullying a blank face it isn't fun. Watching Nishikata make up plans, getting flustered, giving up, redoubling his efforts, etc. is half the fun.
No.755990
>>755982
Yeah I'm probably a normalfag too because I dissociate myself from my shit and piss, probably because I actually have a normalfag life. Thank you for showing me the light.
No.755991
I read everything, rereading the first 2 galleries for the first time in years, and the second one has really fucking obvious NTR vibes. It doesn't end with NTR but it even has a line about Senpai being self-deprecating. You have to go through a lot more hoops to justify this stuff not having any implications of NTR than you do to say it does.
Nagatoro is this guy's worst work, both Nagatoro and senpai are pretty shit. His vampire manga is much better, even his Illya doujin is better.
No.755992
>>755986
>The point is if you try explaining how you want to fuck 8 year olds to a normalfag you might get some weird looks at the very least
But this is something you don't need to explain o anyone. So just ask yourself, "Why do I like this?" or "What's good with this?". It's not about normalfags judging you, is about peers and even yourself judging you. If you think NTR is somehow good, you have fucking problems or you just a terrible excuse of human being.
>I'm okay with people jerking off to NTR just as I'm okay with being vored by furries then shat out because I don't want them to not be okay with me jerking off to lolis
>M-muh kinkshame
If someone is not ok with me masturbating with lolis I bring up facts and defend why there's nothing wrong with it regardless of who that person is specially since lolicon is not illegal in some states. I just don't cry about it or try to justify it with it not being loli like NTR retards do.
>As long as none of it is real and nobody's forcing you to come into contact with it, what are you even complaining about? Just that you don't like it?
NTR is a plague that needs to be eradicated.
No.755993
Disregard anons with shit taste, post bullying.
No.755994
>>755978
>If she is leading you on, you probably have feelings for her, and that alone qualifies as NTR.
NTR implies you have a relationship, if it's just some cunt leading you on without having any real relationship it's not NTR. It's shit and so is the girl, but don't go on changing labels and taking the meaning out of words because you don't like it.
>There's NTR where you're cucked for wanting to fuck your sister but being unable to and so on with said sister getting fucked, of course
Not NTR if you're not in a relationship. I don't read NTR mango on purpose because >NTR, but the few I've read had the girl kiss the guy and get into an innocent relationship with him while getting fucked behind his back.
>I knew this was it.
Then what the fuck are you arguing about? If she's just trying to get the guy jealous, it doesn't even fit your definition of NTR.
>Doesn't change that Tsunderes are shit and this girl somehow manages to draw all the good aspects of NTR.
>tsunderes
>shit
Violent tsunderes are shit, but actual tsunderes aren't as bad.
>good aspects of NTR.
>good aspects
>NTR
NTR is shit. Her bullying isn't NTR tier because she doesn't want to actually hurt him, she's just toying with the guy she likes, and there's nothing wrong with that.
>>755987
>So he loves her, and she loves him, and they are in a relationship where they both show it in their particular ways
If that's an relationship then I guess the couple in Tomo-chan is already in a relationship for you.
>If you show this dialogue to anyone who has heard of NTR but doesn't know the source, they will tell you that yes, this is NTR.
>if people read this out of context quote they will think it's NTR, therefore it's NTR!
Are you retarded? Which part of she's only bullying him and the "boyfriend" in the picture is only her brother did you not understand?
There is literally nothing wrong with legal loli.
No.755995
>>755992
Swap out some terms in your "arguments" and you'd be right at home on tumblr.
I forget why I even try to argue with you dense faggots.
No.755996
File: 44dfcf5ff995724⋯.png (Spoiler Image, 820.92 KB, 1578x702, 263:117, 44dfcf5ff99572453f885532b5….png)
>>755988
That just show how much ignorant of the subject you are. It's not even manipulation either, because there's nothing of interest for the girl, playing with YOUR feelings is pretty much the point of NTR as a fetish. NTR is not always the same as cuckolding, retard.
>>755990
If you dissociate yourself from your piss and shit while reading waterworls and scat, then yes, you're a normalfag and also an idiot for reading something you're not into.
No.755997
>Stop liking things I dislike!
>No! You stop disliking things I like!
>NTR NTR NTR NTR NTR
>cuck cuck cuck cuck cuck
Excellent thread.
No.755998
No.756001
>>755996
So you posted that image and not even bothered to read it before posting?
>Netorare is genre where the main character has a woman taken away from him by someone else.Focus is usually on the discovery and loss.
How exactly Nagatoro relate to that? Not his woman,no discovery,no loss, literally the "i have a boyfriend,are you jealous?" brought a bit to the extreme.
No.756002
>>755994
>NTR implies you have a relationship
>Not NTR if you're not in a relationship
No it doesn't. NTR implies you have feelings or at the very least an interest in the girl, just to be shattered in front of you. If you are about to confess to a girl only to find her fucking other guys on purpose, then it's NTR. And I know because there are dozens of mangas with this fucking scenario.
>Then what the fuck are you arguing about? If she's just trying to get the guy jealous
Again, you don't know that until much later and before that it might as well be a NTR manga.
>Violent tsunderes are shit, but actual tsunderes aren't as bad
This girl is like the very definition of violent AND shit tsunderes. Not being able to express your feelings is one thing. Shitting in others feelings because of it this badly is fucking shit.
>>755995
I'm not the one that needs a safe space, anon. NTR is welcomed here, but it will always be bullied and ridiculed, you like it or not, because I have the balls to do something against something I don't like and that is spreading like cancer.
No.756003
>>755996
>NTR is not always the same as cuckolding, retard.
NTR literally means cuckolding. It's an abbreviation for ねとられ which comes from 寝取る which means to steal another's wife (husband, lover). Look it up on classic.jisho.org and stop showing off your stupidity to everyone around you.
>If you dissociate yourself from your piss and shit while reading waterworls and scat, then yes, you're a normalfag and also an idiot for reading something you're not into.
You completely missed the point. I'm not talking about scat and watersports. I'm talking about going to the bathroom. Is it normalfag to go to the bathroom because normalfags go to the bathroom? This is literally your argument:
If A is a normalfag, A doesn't self-insert.
B doesn't self-insert.
Therefore, B is a normalfag.
You're affirming the consequent. Surely you can see where your logic is wrong when I write it out like that?
No.756004
>>756002
>because I have the balls to do something against something I don't like and that is spreading like cancer
I'm amazed that there are "people" who can actually type this.
No.756005
>>756001
>literally the "i have a boyfriend,are you jealous?" brought a bit to the extreme
Pretty much because of this. "I-it's a joke!". Here is the thing, if after that you keep reading without knowing she is actually joking, then you're a cuck. I dropped the first time I read, just to find she was joking days later, and even reading it again is hard because of how much of a cunt she is.
No.756007
>>755994
>There is literally nothing wrong with legal loli.
Never said there was. The point was that if you like legal loli you shouldn't pretend you don't like loli.
>Which part of she's only bullying him and the "boyfriend" in the picture is only her brother did you not understand?
As has been said over and over, you don't know it's her brother until the end. Until then you have every reason to believe it's real, and that's what matters.
And that quote IS the context. I said to isolate it from the source because the source is the only reason anyone here is claiming it's not NTR is because of the source.
As for Tomo-chan, if Tomo maliciously told Jun she was fucking another guy, I guarantee you the thread would unanimously condemn it as NTR.
>>755997
I'm not here to say "stop liking what I don't like" any more than telling people they have shit taste is ever that. But the number of people in denial in this thread is ridiculous.
No.756008
>>756003
>NTR literally means cuckolding
And RPG meand Role Playing Game and that isn't always the case, does it? Are you really going to argue semantics, faggot?
>I'm not talking about scat and watersports. I'm talking about going to the bathroom
If you go to the bathroom you're acknowledging your need for shitting and pissing, because it's a need you can avoid nor choose, but you know you have to do. But of you DECIDE to read scat, then you're into shit. Not to mention, comparing a fucking need to something like reading porn is stupid. Normalfags don't self-insert because they don't have the need to, if you don't have the need to, you're a normalfag.
No.756011
>>756007
>I'm not here to say "stop liking what I don't like"
>I'm just here to say that they enoy the wrong things and I'll keep saying this until every single one of the agrees
No.756012
>>756011
You say it as if there's something wrong with that.
No.756015
>>756011
Telling everyone else on the board they have shit taste is a time-honored tradition, and if you don't like it you might find yourself more at home in a place like Reddit or Tumblr.
No.756016
>>756002
>寝取られ
>people taking away something which is not yours from you
That's retarded. If you're in a relationship with the girl and she's turned into a cumslut either by choice or by rape, that's NTR. If you like a girl but she's already fucking guys, that's not NTR, that's just a slut. If the girl is toying with the guy's feeling, she's a massive cunt, but it's still not NTR. She's not being taken away, she was never his in the first place. If she was pretending to be in a relationship with the guy, then it'd be NTR, but if it was a one-sided mistake, it's not.
>Again, you don't know that until much later and before that it might as well be a NTR manga.
A NTR manga that only reveals itself to be a NTR manga in the end is still NTR. There's no reason why the opposite shouldn't apply.
Besides, it's revealed he's her brother like 8 pages after that, which is far from "much later".
>This girl is like the very definition of violent AND shit tsunderes.
She's a bit violent, sure, but by violent I mean the "jump kick you because you looked at her breasts" kind.
>>756007
>The point was that if you like legal loli you shouldn't pretend you don't like loli.
Fair enough.
>As has been said over and over, you don't know it's her brother until the end. Until then you have every reason to believe it's real, and that's what matters.
Read my other reply.
>As for Tomo-chan, if Tomo maliciously told Jun she was fucking another guy, I guarantee you the thread would unanimously condemn it as NTR.
My point is, they are not in a romantic relationship in any way, they are just friends. It wouldn't be NTR, she'd just be a massive cunt.
Besides, there's a big difference between fucking a guy and telling it to the guy that loves you and pretending you fucked another guy to get the guy you love jealous because you're an autistic fuck.
No.756017
>>755995
I'd expect your arguments from any leftist shit hole. That's their shtick, twist words until you convince people that up is down and down is up, hiding behind possibility and obscurity to not prove points but to prove to yourself and not others that you're right.
The creator very clearly intended the very strong impression of NTR.
No.756019
What the fuck did you faggots do to this thread? The anon promising translation hasn't delivered and this whole discussion went to shit.
Can somebody tell me what the fuck is going on in these two chapters? With my pure knowledge of japanese I can only make out that she asks him if he knows the pleasure of being cummed inside
No.756022
>>756021
When you involve another man it stops being S&M unless you're a cuck, fag.
No.756024
>>756019
I too am disappointed in everyone
No.756027
>>756008
>And RPG meand Role Playing Game and that isn't always the case, does it? Are you really going to argue semantics, faggot?
So because some people misuse a term that means that it's permissible to misuse another term?
>comparing a fucking need to something like reading porn is stupid
Okay then I'll take something that's about as necessary as reading porn. How about eating your favorite food? You don't have to do it, but you like to do it. Now if a normalfag tells you that that's his favorite food too, does that make you a normalfag?
>Normalfags don't self-insert because they don't have the need to, if you don't have the need to, you're a normalfag.
You've changed your argument but whatever. I'm assuming you're trying to tell me that you need to self-insert? I don't see how this relates to my point, you're going to have to state it more clearly.
No.756030
>>756027
>How about eating your favorite food? You don't have to do it, but you like to do it. Now if a normalfag tells you that that's his favorite food too, does that make you a normalfag?
I think you're misunderstanding the point he's trying to make. He doesn't seem to be saying that liking the same things as normalfags makes you a normalfags, but rather that sharing your outlook on those things does.
And since the normalfag outlook is part of what defines a normalfag it's a valid claim to make.
To give another analogy, you can like sports without being a normalfag; there's plenty of room for autism in following baseball, for example. But certain ways of watching sports make you a normalfag, to the point that sports are a stereotypical example of normalfaggotry. Likewise, certain ways of reading porn can make you a normalfag.
No.756031
>>756016
>people taking away something which is not yours from you
More like
>Taking away something you want from you
That's the fucking difference, idiot, ownership doesn't mean a lot, and, in fact, taking something you want is as hurtful as well.
>If the girl is toying with the guy's feeling, she's a massive cunt
That's exactly NTR, faggot.
>A NTR manga that only reveals itself to be a NTR manga in the end is still NTR
This is a NTR manga that reveals itself not to be NTR at the middle of the story while the girl is still shit.
>She's a bit violent, sure, but by violent I mean the "jump kick you because you looked at her breasts" kind
Psychological violence is worst than physical violence. If you're a man you can withstand physical pain, but human beings break mentally easily.
>>756027
>So because some people misuse a term that means that it's permissible to misuse another term?
Yes, that's why gay meant happy in the 50s and means you're a fucking faggot now. It's semantics. The meaning of a word is determined by the use of the people.
>Now if a normalfag tells you that that's his favorite food too, does that make you a normalfag?
Eating is still a necessity and not something you can't completely avoid, so your argument is still retarded, but let me fix it, just because you eat the same food the normalfag eats doesn't make you a normalfag, but in this case is more like normalfags only eat that food because he doesn't need to eat better food, and you're in the same position of the normalfag, which makes you a normalfag.
>I'm assuming you're trying to tell me that you need to self-insert?
Yes, it's called escapism, the fucking pillar of fantasy.
No.756035
>>756031
>Yes
I never self-insert. Not that I have anything against it but I never do it in any medium. Why should I do it in this case? There's tons of stories in which it wouldn't make any sense.
No.756041
>>756031
>That's the fucking difference, idiot, ownership doesn't mean a lot, and, in fact, taking something you want is as hurtful as well.
>That's exactly NTR, faggot.
Except ownership does matter. That's literally the definition of NTR, taking YOUR girl from you. Liking the girl doesn't mean shit.
Having something you don't own but want taken might be hurtful, but bitching at the guy who took it it's just SJW tier.
>This is a NTR manga that reveals itself not to be NTR at the middle of the story while the girl is still shit.
It's a manga that implies it could be NTR but reveals itself NOT to be NTR.
I guess all those gag mangas with jokes about characters dying are brutal murderfests for you.
>Psychological violence is worst than physical violence. If you're a man you can withstand physical pain, but human beings break mentally easily.
Except she doesn't actually want to hurt him. She's toying with him like a little boy bullying a girl he likes because he doesn't know what to do.
You might not like it but I find it rather cute. Even more so when he does something unexpected and she gets flustered.
No.756042
>>756030
I think I'm getting it. His argument is that the way, not the action, is what makes you a normalfag. Still, I don't see why self-inserting is the only non-normalfag way of enjoying porn.
>>756031
>Yes, it's called escapism, the fucking pillar of fantasy.
You can enjoy escapism without self-inserting, that's how I do it. For example, when I watch anime I don't try to pretend like I'm the MC, I just let myself get immersed in the show and forget about other things. I become interested in the characters and the plot. I don't think you need to self-insert to enjoy escapism.
No.756043
>>756041
>I guess all those gag mangas with jokes about characters dying are brutal murderfests for you.
A manga that focuses entirely on the death of a character and addresses the grief and loss of those around him, then at the end reveals he was only pretending to be dead, would still be manga focusing on grief and loss, and the people who read it until that point while be people who like reading stories about grief and loss.
No.756049
>The NTR shitstorm is now in /a/
Hopefully it doesn't branch out to other threads like with previous cases.
No.756050
>>756043
Good. So you agree that Nagatoro isn't NTR? After all, she only tells this lie in one halve of a single part of the entire series.
No.756051
>>756035
Just how? That's the whole point of literature. When you read a novel you're expected to live the emotions the main character is going through, that's the point of telling an story, that's what make stories realistic and enjoyable, even when told in a third person perspective, they detail feelings and environments so you can immerse in the world these characters are in, not just to be a mere observer.
You're doing it wrong, anon, and that's exactly why it makes you a normalfag. Normalfags just ignore this, they don't need to self-insert because they are comfortable with the lives they live with, they dopn't need other worlds, they don't need more emotions, they just judge these things by "It was fun" or "It was sad".
>>756041
>Except ownership does matter
Except it doesn't and there are dozens of mangas to prove you wrong. Sadly I wouldn't find them easily because I'm not fan of NTR mangas. Liking a girl makes her an objective of you affection and emotions, and NTR deeply involve emotions. You can be married to a girl and don't feel shit for her, and her being taken away wouldn't count as fucking NTR because of that, and in those cases the tag used is cheating for that very same reason, there are no emotions involved.
>It's a manga that implies it could be NTR
Thanks, all you needed to say. This is not a gag manga, it's obviously made to make the reader feel bad.
>Except she doesn't actually want to hurt him
But she does, and she even states on the state of the MC's mind whenever she does a hurtful comment, and she does it a lot. As I said, I could find it cute, but this girl is pretty much completely autistic in her approach.
>>756042
>I don't see why self-inserting is the only non-normalfag way of enjoying porn.
As stated about, normalfags don't think about what they are consuming, which is why the big majority of normalfags don't mind NTR. If you actually take a moment to process what you're reading or watching, it might change your opinion of it. Blame shitty porn plots that everyone ignores, that conditioned normalfags to skip that and concentrate only in the in and out. If you do that with mangas, you might as well just look for fucking pictures in boorus.
>For example, when I watch anime I don't try to pretend like I'm the MC
There are varying degrees of self-inserting and means to it. There's this thing called blank slate, which also tend to vary. Did you ever saw "Blue's Clues"? The protagonist is supposed to be "YOU", which is why all characters talk to the camera while talking to you, just like this manga did. This manga objective is yo put you as the other end of the conversation, that's why you're supposed to self-insert, if you can't do that there's something really wrong with you in a narrative point of view.
No.756053
>>756050
It's 50% NTR, then.
>>756049
>Implying you're not in an imageboard that outright despise NTR
You're being delusional, faggot.
No.756054
>>756051
Normalfags sel-insert all the time. They do it in games, movies and books.
No.756055
>>756054
But they don't do it on this kind of media. Normalfags barely read manga.
No.756057
>>756053
>Implying you're not in an imageboard that outright despise NTR
>You're being delusional, faggot.
I hate it as well, it's just that in a previous case the argument spread to multiple threads and would restart every couple of days. Ended up getting tired of shitting on it overall with how frequent it popped up.
No.756059
So, anons who are arguing about whether or not this scene qualifies as NTR, tell me this...
If you were to read a doujin, the contents of which were clearly NTR, of a man being forced to watch the woman he loves get ravaged consentually by another man, the contents of which were hardcore NTR through and through all the way to the last panel of the last page, which revealed that the entire doujin was actually just a fantasy, would you or would you not classify this doujin as NTR?
No.756060
>>756055
>But they don't do it on this kind of media
That wasn't the point and it is, sadly, untrue.
No.756063
>>756051
>As stated about, normalfags don't think about what they are consuming, which is why the big majority of normalfags don't mind NTR. If you actually take a moment to process what you're reading or watching, it might change your opinion of it. Blame shitty porn plots that everyone ignores, that conditioned normalfags to skip that and concentrate only in the in and out. If you do that with mangas, you might as well just look for fucking pictures in boorus.
I agree with you here. I find most of the enjoyment from a good doujin is the story and the build-up more than the actual payoff itself.
>There are varying degrees of self-inserting and means to it. There's this thing called blank slate, which also tend to vary. Did you ever saw "Blue's Clues"? The protagonist is supposed to be "YOU", which is why all characters talk to the camera while talking to you, just like this manga did. This manga objective is yo put you as the other end of the conversation, that's why you're supposed to self-insert, if you can't do that there's something really wrong with you in a narrative point of view.
Yeah I remember watching Blue's Clues. I guess you are right about the image collections, that they are meant to make you self-insert. I guess if I think about like a visual novel where you are playing a character from his perspective and interact with girls and date them and such. Still, it's not exactly like Blue's Clues where you are the main character, it's more that you are look through the eyes of the main character. Oftentimes the main character does things or thinks things that you wouldn't. I guess it is still self-inserting though in a way, but I just think of it as seeing the events from his perspective. For example, I can't control how this guy reacts to getting bullied by Nagatoro just as I can't make decisions in a VN when I'm not given a decision.
No.756064
>>756043
>A manga that focuses entirely
Except it doesn't. It only addresses NTR for a few pages before the guy goes "oh no, I'm her brother".
It'd be like having three 4-komas where they address a character's death only to have him appear back in the last panel of the fourth one for the punch-line.
>would still be manga focusing on grief and loss
Yes, but not one focusing on death. The manga could focus on the effects of emotional abuse without being NTR, which it doesn't. It's just a manga about bully in a relationship.
Like me and other anons said a fuckton of times already, 寝取られ, taking YOUR girl away. First of all, the girl is not his, and second, she is not taken away. Stop being a retard.
>>756051
>Except it doesn't and there are dozens of mangas to prove you wrong.
Something like
"I like you."
"But I already have a boyfriend."
"How could you betray me!?"
is not, in any way, NTR. People misuse terms all the time, which is why some retards make their manga about futas jerking off and then say it's a girl masturbating.
>You can be married to a girl and don't feel shit for her, and her being taken away wouldn't count as fucking NTR because of that
Are you retarded? That's the definition of NTR, your woman being taken away. Whether there's emotional pain or not, that's just stuff degenerates put on their manga for extras.
>Thanks, all you needed to say.
If a gag manga implies there's going to be an epic battle then doesn't do it, it doesn't just fucking turn into a shounen battle manga because of that. Implied NTR that turns out not to be NTR is exactly that, NOT NTR.
>This is not a gag manga, it's obviously made to make the reader feel bad.
It's not, I never said it was. I was just using gag manga as an example.
It's a manga about an autistic girl bullying a guy she loves, it's meant to be an emotional rollercoaster and it does just that.
She says she already has a boyfriend, then you feel like shit, but then the "boyfriend" comes out and turns out he's just her brother, she was just trying to make you jealous and gets immensely flustered in the process, which is pretty cute.
She never tries to hurt him in the process, she's just doing whatever she can do get him to notice her and be proactive, because she doesn't know what to do otherwise.
>but this girl is pretty much completely autistic in her approach.
That's the point of the whole thing, or else it'd be a manga about a couple dating. It's like tomo-chan, a manga about autistics who want to date each other but don't do it because plot reasons.
No.756065
>these idiots getting baited like mad by a simple "bullying = NTR!"
I can't even congratulate the fisherman, cause the bait is super poor and the fishes are retarded.
Stop replying to the samefag talking or asking about netorare.
No.756067
>>756059
So, you mean kinda like this?
https://exhentai.org/g/1026959/1c86aa4af7/
https://exhentai.org/g/1123161/7160d65ad7/
Because then the answer is yes. The author knows the audience he made it for.
This doujin is kinda fucked up, because the MC's mental state is clearly shattered. It would be an interesting concept to explore, but the author chose it to just make NTR porn, so you know what this is. If it were done with a serious note as a character piece on a psychologically broken paranoid man I probably would think differently.
No.756069
>>756050
>Aah you must be that senpai
She already told her brother, bet she has some photo of senpai with hearts all around in her room.
No.756070
No.756071
>>756069
>>756050
In this context it does seem like she at least has a crush on the protagonist. Brother already knows of him and accepts him taking care of little sister.
No.756073
>>756059
Since nobody is getting NTRd it doesn't really qualify but it is an NTR fantasy and would be tagged and classified as such but it is pointless if you take it to such an extreme just to make a point. Let me ask you this.
If you were to read a doujin, the contents of which were clearly a vanilla hetero relationship, of a man making love with the woman he loves, the contents of which were vanilla sex through and through all the way to the last panel of the last page, which revealed that the entire doujin was actually two guys, would you or would you not classify this doujin yaoi, males only and trap?
No.756074
>>756070
>I can't conceptualize more than one person having an opinion on something
No.756077
Jesus Christ, you people racked up like 100 posts of this shit in a couple hours.
No.756079
>>756070
It could be baiting or just an actual retard. Anyway I like to yell at people on the internet.
>>756073
>would you or would you not classify this doujin yaoi, males only and trap?
I would.
It's like those trap ass pics. Even if you can't see the dick, it's still a guy, that's why it's called a trap.
Things are what they are, not what they seem to be.
No.756080
>>755778
>that weak as fuck bitch of a protagonist
>taming anything
No.756083
>>756074
>I'm too retarded to see the obvious samefagging and the lack of poise of the baited fools
>>756079
>It could be baiting or just an actual retard.
Same thing, really.
No.756086
>>756079
>I would.
And rightly so. Fuck.
I wanted to write "would you or would you not classify this doujin as hetero and vanilla" but I botched the whole post instead.
No.756089
>>756073
That'd be a pretty massive ass pull.
No.756090
>>756067
So you're of the mind that NTR content does not necessarily constitute the material being about NTR, as the story can actually be telling something completely different regardless of the fact that NTR is a large portion of the content?
>>756073
I'd probably consider it vanilla, maybe even genderswap depending on the context. If it was the couple having anal and the viewer not knowing it was a guy the whole time I'd probably consider it trap, but if it showed a female the whole time as well as vaginal but it turned out to be a fantasy or some such I'd consider it vanilla. I see it sort-of as what the average person goes to it for.
A person looking for yaoi probably wouldnt go to a largely vanilla doujin simply because the end turned out to actually be yaoi the whole time. A person going for a trap doujin would probably like the twist at the end depending on how it was written, like "Surprise! I have a dick!"
No.756091
>>756073
If a doujin had a character drawn as a woman with breasts and a vagina until the last page when they're drawn with a dick, it should be tagged as having a female character and a trap, and probably gender bender or something to explain that change.
If it was only assumed to be female obviously no tag.
We're dealing with the first case, where it is explicitly NTR until the reveal that it's fake. And thus this should be tagged NTR.
No.756094
I can't believe that people are even arguing this. This is the only piece I know of that straight up REJECTS NTR by having the MC draw a clear line that it's not okay. This is ANTI-NTR, and less NTR than vanilla shows that don't deal with this problem at all, because in vanilla things you really can't know what the situation would be if NTR does get brought up, but here it was clearly denied so we know where we stand. If anything this should be it's own tier called the "anti-NTR" tier.
No.756098
>>756094
Don't worry, it's merely anons with the tism' getting baited into 100+ posts.
The usual.
No.756101
>>756094
>An story which is largely about NTR is anti-NTR
It doesn't work like that, faggot. Drawing the line is one thing, but the girl teases the MC with cheating on him, it's just that you don't know she is teasing until you pull the assault riffle and start an school shooting.
No.756104
>>756101
>The fishes liked that one before, let's just throw it in again.
No.756106
>>756101
>it's just that you don't know she is teasing until you pull the assault riffle and start an school shooting.
Jesus Christ, Anon, you might be onto something.
>she's trying to bring him to the edge so he can shoot the school for her
The absolute madwoman, what is the next step of her masterplan? Is the Yakuza involved? It's all for vengeance, maybe?
We must go deeper.
No.756107
>>756104
>bait by calling out imaginary bait
No.756113
>>755835
>*snicker* *snicker* *snicker*!
What kind of self-respecting writer reread this shit and thought "yes, this is suitable"?
No.756114
>>756113
The absolute madman Himself.
No.756115
>>756113
Japs really like onomatopoeia
No.756116
>>756113
How would *you* translate クスクスクス?
No.756119
So do they hold hands in the end or not? I demand some lewd stuff by the end!
No.756121
>>756094
Merely pretending to be NTR is anti-NTR in the same way merely pretending to be retarded is anti-retard.
No.756122
>>756116
"Hihihihi!" It might not correspond to the exact sound but this is clearly the intent. This isn't fucking rocket science.
No.756128
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>756122
>Hihihihi
Instantly thought of this.
The bullying would not work, I'd fall on the ground in pain from laughing so much while she just gets mad and flustered.
No.756131
>>756128
>he can't be bullied
I'll pray for you, anon. One day we can cure your disease.
No.756145
>>756131
I-I swear I can be bullied, just not by a girl that laughs like "hihihi" or by anyone that doesn't have the willpower to keep the bully going for long enough to notice I'm actually embarrassed despite my stoic face,
No.756148
>>756059
Yes because you're classifying the content of the doujin not the overall story.
No.756155
>NTR discussion
This is not how I wanted to come back to the thread.
>>756128
I thought of Asterix & Obelix laughter.
No.756161
>>756155
I just woke up and saw this, so yeah... Thing is, it's not the first time these two retards have gone at each other. Towergirls thread (80+) posts deleted because of that idiot and multiple threads on /htg/
No.756165
Translation when? I only have baby moonspeak abilities but the parts I can read are very nice.
>Senpai, why are you shaking?
>It's polite to look people in the eye when they're talking to you.
>Right!?
I want to tell Nagatoro to fuck off.
No.756166
>>756161
It's not the same people. I've been one of the people stating why it is NTR, and I've never touched any Towergirls thread.
No.756175
And here >>756170 we see the real danger of this thread: it was fast enough throughout the day that it probably appeared on the 8chan front page's list of threads, and would have consistently been high in the nerve center.
I'm perfectly happy arguing all day about why that scene is NTR, but unfortunately it's exactly the wrong topic to allow to gain the attention of other boards. Fortunately, the discussion wasn't deleted to preempt that attention, and it doesn't look like it got much aside from one or two obvious posts like this.
No.756180
I hated this and i'll still hate it. She's a bitch and he's a spineless wimp.
Until I see the stupid bastard call her a fucking cunt who should go eat shit, slap and/or punch her sorry bitch face, or knock her down and rape her then it'll still suck.
No.756183
>>756180
You're missing the point of this then.
No.756184
>>756165
Soon, Anon. Soon.
No.756185
Imagine if your kouhai bully had psychic powers. She could torture you endlessly with fake reality nightmares or just project herself doing lewd things in your head at all times. Or jerk you off telekinetically in the middle of class presentations.
Just to see the stupid face you make of course.
No.756186
>>756180
There is payoff in this. That's what matters.
No.756198
>>756184
Are you working on it? I was planning on doing it tomorrow when I have the time but if someone else is already working on it on here then I probably won't.
No.756200
>>756198
I have the first chapter cleaned and outlined. I'll probably have it done in a couple days.
No.756221
>>756219
I want her to smugly shlurp on my dick and tease me about every little detail.
No.756225
>>756059
Yes Cathead imako is fucking NTR.
No.756227
Everyone keeps reporting this and asking me to 'fix' the thread, but I don't think it's possible at this point. What I can tell you is the hyper-aggressive posting style used by multiple posters here is utter shit. This is not taking it easy, especially where it descends to the autistic line-by-line deconstruction of others posts. Something similar happened in the OPM thread, perhaps banning everyone who does that would resolve the issue? My instincts say we're dealing with crossboarders, but I wouldn't know where from. Maybe we need a new rule mandating the whole taking it easy aspect. I'm open to suggestions here, turning this into a meta thread wouldn't make the situation worse as things stand right now.
No.756230
>>756227
>Maybe we need a new rule mandating the whole taking it easy aspect
Maybe not "take it easy" because argument and banter can be fun, but something that applies to cases of this sort of undignified sperging would be desirable.
No.756231
>>756227
>Maybe we need a new rule mandating the whole taking it easy aspect
I wouldn't be against it. It's, obviously, somewhat subjective but I assume that most /a/nons would understand the intent behind the rule.
No.756232
>>756227
I don't think anything like that is needed at all. It was an argument, not unadulterated shitflinging. For the most part it stayed on the topic under debate, and even when it turned to insults it wasn't just insults. It's important to keep shitposting in line, yes, but I don't think shutting down every discussion that gets a bit heated is the way to go. As things stand, the posts that are still in the thread at this point are by and large legitimate discussion.
And like the banner implies, a little autism is part of what makes /a/ /a/.
No.756233
>>756227
Against my better judgement >>>/v/13760068 it is happening elsewhere. I don't think it needs special treatment though as it's just a spate of the topic, not a running sore like trap semantics.
No.756235
>>756227
A lot of the garbage in this thread stems from not only people baiting, but people taking the bait. There's no rules against baiting nor are there rules for taking the bait per se, until it devolves into shitposting.
Which turns into a grey area. Most of this thread is outright shitposting, yet none of it breaks any of the rules specifically. Meido fiat is required, but on what grounds? /a/'s legalistic foundations are part of the reason it remains a mostly unsullied island in a sea of complete fucking shit, but the stringency of those rules also tends to lock the meidos into only following the rules.
Maybe more rules are needed but I'm not sure what they could be. I have no useful answers, only a wish to see obvious shitposters purged from the board but with no useful suggestions as to how they could be without creating an uncomfortable level of meido overreach.
No.756236
I really don't understand the situation I am in, nor do I understand the appeal others have for it. I am absolutely disgusting and angered by this thing that is calls itself a girl, yet I find myself continuously reading it through it.
No.756237
>>756236
I read through it in the vain hope for some kind of catharsis where the guy snaps and knocks her down a couple pegs. He doesn't in any of the content that's been released that I've found though.
No.756239
>>756227
I've been feeling that overall board quality has been on the decline recently. It's hard to measure or quantify and even harder to diagnose what's causing it but I know I agree with your instincts.
>turning this into a meta thread wouldn't make the situation worse as things stand right now.
That's the real shame. Nagatoro is fun and a thread for her should have also been fun.
No.756241
>>756235
Bona fide disagreement on a controversial topic is not "baiting". Even the most heated posts that weren't deleted under the current rules were still talking about the nature of NTR and whether the scene qualified.
I don't want this to turn into Reddit any more than I want it to turn into /v/. It's important to be able to argue once in a while.
No.756242
>>756235
Just let autists be autists. I'd rather long retarded arguments than 50 (1)s in a thread.
No.756243
>>756242
>50 (1)s in a thread
We don't have ID's.
No.756245
>>756227
Taking it easy should be a goal more than a rule. You can't force people to take it easy but if they have somewhere that they can take it easy then they will take it easy. If you build it they will come. This is where the no shitposting rule comes into play. Yes, the argument was pretty stupid but I wouldn't call it shitposting. Let sleeping dogs lie. A few autistic arguments never hurt anybody, though if every thread becomes filled with nothing but shitflinging arguments between two posters then it's time to step in. Hopefully the next thread can be more fun.
No.756248
>>756243
I think (hope) he was just referring to how this thread is still much higher quality debate that most other boards usually see.
>>756245
>shitflinging arguments between two posters
I think that's also a relevant point. There were several people on both sides of the issue, not just two autists going at it. When two people are ruining the thread for everyone else it's one thing, but it seemed to me that there were quite a few different posters here.
No.756255
>>756243
>We don't have ID's
/a/ doesn't, yes. It's very distinct when a thread has a lot of single reply posts. A lot of replies that don't reply to a specific post number nor the op and only contain irrelevant shit.
>>756248
>much higher quality debate that most other boards usually see
Pretty much.
>>756245
If it's two idiots yelling at each other I don't see why it's not ok to just watch them fight. It's more fun if you have some chaos on the board.
No.756256
>>756230
>because argument and banter can be fun
This is true. Being able to argue with Anons is fun and should always be allowed. Even if it's over stupid shit. The problem here is that it was taken way too far and shat up an entire thread because of it. However I don't see anyway to make a rule to prevent the latter while still allowing people to argue and call each other cunts. I think we just needed a Meido to tell them to knock that shit off when it starts getting out of hand. Though I realise that requires some pretty active moderation.
No.756257
>>756242
Meta-meta-posting, but not only does this thread have no IDs (because /a/) but IDs change regularly due to the monthly hash-refreshing and independent IP-changing. On another board I had my ID change mid-thread twice across a few days because of what I assume is my dynamic IP and the 8chan hash changing. I'm sure the meidos know about this, which is part of the reason why post-specific displayed IDs aren't publicly displayed on /a/.
No.756259
>>756257
>twice across a few days
No this is talking about single IDs showing in the same day. Nearly half of the thread being single post comments that contribute nothing besides someone saying >it's shit
No.756261
>>756256
> The problem here is that it was taken way too far and shat up an entire thread because of it
One thread isn't unreasonable. The bump limit is low, so an argument that burns through one thread isn't all that much. The debate seemed to die down on its own between 175 and 200 replies in this case. I think in cases where a contentious issue like that has dominated a thread it's better to let it run its course, and start fresh on the next thread. That gives you a hard cutoff for when the discussion is over that you don't get by simply shutting the debate down and trying to continue the thread as if nothing happened, and doesn't leave people dissatisfied the way artificially ending it would.
No.756264
>>756233
After quickly scanning that thread I'm almost positive the same guy was posting in this thread and that thread. He just keeps talking about NTR and how not self-inserting makes you a normalfag. ID is 34de90. The only difference is that in that thread he uses a bunch of non-/a/ images with his posts and here he doesn't use them, probably to avoid being banned. But he even uses the same "netori netorare netorase" image in this post >>>/v/13761109 that is posted in >>755996. Also compare >>>/v/13764390 and >>755982.
No.756266
>>756264
I'm not convinced. If you look at those two /a/ posts, there's a certain trend of grammar errors (which I would attribute to ESL) that aren't present in the /v/ posts you linked. And none of his posts in that /v/ thread have him calling someone a retard, while both of those /a/ posts do, which suggests the /a/ posts were made by someone with a difference preference in insults. The sentiment behind the posts isn't unique, nor is the image they used original, so since the actual writing style differs I think it's either coincidence or influence, and not outright the same guy.
No.756270
>>756266
I was more struck by the strange coincidence of having someone in another thread arguing about both of the things that were being argued about on this thread. But you're point about the images is a good one, since the one on /v/ and the one on this thread have different names. I also found someone else posting the same image, so you're probably right.
No.756273
>>756227
Most of the points I would have liked to make were already made by others like >>756232, >>756245, or >>756241. But here's my two cents.
I don't think we need a concrete rule of any kind. At worst (e.g., if it turns to shit-flinging, especially across multiple threads) I think meidos should use their own judgement and deal with it on a case-by-case basis.
Plus, this wasn't nearly as bad as the usual shit. Both parties kept on the topic and, for the most part, avoided getting into side issues, that's the number one rule of all arguments. It's when you get dragged into side issues and shitposting that arguments become harmful.
As >>756261 mentioned, even the worst arguments die once the thread hits bump limit, and we can start anew. If it carries into another thread, it's time for meidos to step in.
No.756278
>>756227
Maybe a warning, it's not like liners are actually listening to each other anyway. It's just each of them repeating their positions forever.
No.756329
You know, I feel a sense of satisfaction seeing the Nagatoro thread turn into such shit. I imagine her reading /a/ hoping to see people talking about the new manga and she sees that nobody's paying attention to her and talking about NTR instead, and she starts crying. At this point, my penis comes out.
No.756332
>>756329
>You know, I feel a sense of satisfaction seeing the thread I shitposted in turn into such shit
Isn't that what shitposters always do?
No.756341
>>756227
>hyper-aggressive posting style
Some people just get like that in heated arguments, I don't think it's because they're crossboarders, though I'd venture that kind of person is more likely to also be a crossboarder.
No need for anything particularly concrete, just a general "No fags allowed" rule would be plenty, besides it doesn't really matter what the rules are, if most everyone would agree someones being a massive fag, I don't think it really matters what the person is banned for, as long as he's banned.
I really don't see how this could qualify as NTR, but having some lengthy debate about it is stupid, people make up their opinions on something as they read it, once they're made, and in this case I assume most people have already read it long ago, they obviously aren't going to change just because you're spouting one form of sophistry or another.
As for Nagatoro itself, I enjoyed the first one because it made me angry in a good way, there was catharsis, and it felt pretty unique, but the rest weren't very good. The manga could be good or bad, depends on whether it becomes extreme Takagi-san or "If you let me kick you in the butt I'll go to the beach with you". Sadist tsunderes can be sort of fun, and I like the visual style.
No.756357
>>756227
When you have a situation like this, with the thread turning into tangentially related shitflinging with no end in sight, but not quite breaching board rules, you could do END OF RINE, make a post that bans discussion of the specific topic for the rest of the thread. I don't think anything of value would've been lost if the second half of the NTRposting could not have been made due to that kind of interruption.
No.756361
OP here.
I merely walked away from the thread 30+ posts in, then i come back two days later and i find an orgy of autism about "muh fetish honor this" and "muh fetish dishonor that", next time, you either chill or I'll report your flamer ass into oblivion >>756227 .
This >>756329 is the funniest post in this thread, and that say's a lot.
No.756392
>>756227
How about you remove this shit entirely because posting about a shit manga like this is literally shit-posting?
I haven't posted in this thread once but I also think this is some disgusting cuck shit and I can't take it easy when people like this shit in the same board as me. Stop liking what I don't like.
No.756408
>Thread derailed because of some chucklefuck(s) thought that bullying = NTR
HOW
No.756409
>>756408
>How
The entire thread has been taken up by explanations of why that is an NTR scene. You don't need to ask for the discussion to start again.
No.756410
>>756227
I want to say that, you janitors shouldn't ban shitposters too much
A little bit of shitflinging keeps the board healthy i suppose
>>756409
You're right
I might as well be quiet until the rest of the pages gets translated
No.756438
>>756410
>A little bit of shitflinging keeps the board healthy i suppose
Out of all threads to say that you choose this one?
Nice way to give a poor reflection of your opinion.
No.756444
>>756227
I'm with >>756357 on this, just one post saying 'knock it off' would suffice to quell it, or easily expose the likely crossboarders. I don't think it's such a frequent issue that it needs a specific rule.
That said, if it were in my hands, I would be merciless to anyone who insists something entirely non-sexual is <unpopular fetish>. The only purpose such posts serve is baiting and shitposting. There is no discussion to be had from that sort of opinion, just an elaborate back and forth of
>you're wrong
<no you
>no you
as demonstrated here, interspersed with the occasional "cuck" to emphasize how disingenuous the poster is.
No.756454
>>756444
>something entirely non-sexual is <unpopular fetish>
That isn't what happened here though. NTR can very easily happen in entirely nonsexual content. You can have NTR in a manga that doesn't have anything more risque than hand-holding.
Dismissing everyone you disagree with as "baiting and shitposting" is how you end up with places like /pol/.
I genuinely think that the scene in question qualifies as NTR, and I at least was posting in good faith to argue that stance. If people get so upset at being disagreed with that they assume everyone who does so can only be doing it to rile them up, that's their problem. Calling for bans on the grounds that you consider someone else "too wrong" will completely destroy any ability to have a debate. At no point in this whole thing did I even consider suggesting that those saying it's not NTR should be banned as shitposters denying an obvious truth.
No.756462
This seriously isn't an issue of "baiting" and "taking the bait", saying it is is too easy, it's a cop out.
It's a lot of arguing, between people unwilling to concede their points. The posts get really grating and huge because people are fucking shit. Reading the whole discussion I get a feeling that the dumbasses making the "hyper-aggressive" posts as the head meido called them are barely ever replying to the people they disagree with, they're mostly talking to themselves. Points that have been made keep being repeated without being acknowledged by the other side and that just snowballs out of control.
No.756508
>NagoToRo
<NTR
I rest my case.
No.756645
>>755886
Wasn't that other dude her brother or something? It's been ages since I read.
No.756649
>>756645
>It's been ages since I read.
Clearly, and not just Nagatoro. That was stated multiple times.
No.756688
>>756684
Really gets your noggin joggin.
No.756747
>hurr NTR
She's an extremely sadistic tsundere. The fucking point was to make the guy think she had a boyfriend when she hadn't to set up the whole "I don't have one, you're the only one for me" thing. It's the damn opposite of NTR; instead of pretending to like him only to reveal that she's cheating she pretended to be "cheating" in order to reveal that she didn't have anyone else.
Sadism, by the way, isn't NTR and arguing that it is, is fucking stupid. NTR could be a particularly shitty form of sadism but that doesn't mean all sadism is NTR. All X are Y, but not Y are X and so on.
I can't believe this shit actually went on for this long.
No.756763
>>756747
You know I just noticed, Nagatoro's blushing is like a S thermometer totally unrelated to her expression that you can use to infer Senpai's face. The only thing is she gets maximum blush at the end of the first book when she gets confessed to and at the end of the second book when Senpai forgives her, while she really doesn't seem very happy at all to actually introduce her "boyfriend".
Nagatoro really is maximum tsundere.
No.756765
I think everyone has said what they wanted to at this point so I'm going to call it here. There's a few things I'd like to draw everyone's attention to. I've been poking around a bit and while I don't have proof that the shitflinging was spawned from /v/, it sure seems to be in line with their MO. For example, have a flip through https://boards.4chan.org/vg/thread/194928659 and ask yourself if this is what you want /a/ to look like. Personally I can't think of many things I'd want less. It's not something we'll allow, it is going to stop whether we get there with a soft touch or a hammer rampage.
My preference is that no moderation be required to resolve this, but instead anons tell our likely crossboarders to knock it off the instant they try to start it up again. However, my prediction is that the legalistic mindset present in those doing the arguing is going to make that impossible - these are not people who are trying to make the board a more fun place to be, these are people who want to prove some inane point at all costs. >>756454 notes his concern that intervention would 'destroy any ability to have a debate'. Well, in this case maybe that's what we want. What sort of poster comes to /a/ and thinks "Right, time to win arguments and prove myself right!"? That's /v/-tier logic. It's shit. I am putting this thread on autosage now, feel free to make a new thread and we'll try this again. Be aware, depending on how things go we may be publicly executing everyone who even mentions NTR en masse. It will be a bloodbath and /ameta/ will light up like a Christmas tree. Again, we would prefer that those in question understand that they need to calm it of their own accord, but we are also prepared for the other alternative if need be. Lets see how it goes.
Post last edited at
No.756769
>>756765
>we may be publicly executing everyone
End me, Meido-dono.
No.756771
>>756765
>linking to halfchan
No.756773
>>756765
>Well, in this case maybe that's what we want
Just go case-by-case. It does not happen that often, and sometimes autistic arguments can produce something of value, ie Mousou Telepathy threads.
No.756776
>>756769
>What sort of poster comes to /a/ and thinks "Right, time to win arguments and prove myself right!"?
More than you think and the number keeps increasing.
No.756777
>>756773
I think more important than that, only step in if it's actively reported, i.e. the community at large wants it gone. And yeah it was more because it was happening in this thread where it had fuck-all bearing on the topic.
No.756780
>>756765
>I am putting this thread on autosage now, feel free to make a new thread and we'll try this again.
Can you delete this thread instead?
No.756781
>>756771
That is how bad things degraded.
No.756782
>>756777
I want to kick the bottom of that can when she's taking a drink.
No.756784
>>756780
What's the point in posting a threat if you're going to delete it right afterwards?
No.756799
>>756781
Still, if the head meido can link to there, then what argument can you make against it? This was a mistake.
No.756800
>>756784
Maybe you have a hostage plan but you're too shy? heh
In all seriousness what is the point of keeping this thread up? Just let it stay up so people can see Meido's last post then delete it. Or just post meido's post on /ameta/ so other people can see it. Whatever we win by leaving the meido's post here is outweighted by letting this thread stay.
No.756815
Imagine being so retarded you misunderstand how a sadist girl and masochist boy fit perfectly for each other and start spewing some stupid shit.
No.756821
>>756799
I think you got me wrong. I was getting at is the meido linked it as a do you assholes want everything to look like x not as a have a freeforall with doing that.
No.756823
>>756821
No, you don't get me. I know why the meido did it, but now anyone can link there as a warning.
No.756825
>>756765
>ask yourself if this is what you want /a/ to look like
I don't want /a/ to look like a hugbox where disagreement is banned either. Communities where every post must always be positive are shit. Complete shit. If that's what I wanted I'd be in the Batoto comments, or on Reddit.
>Well, in this case maybe that's what we want. What sort of poster comes to /a/ and thinks "Right, time to win arguments and prove myself right!"?
That's a huge misinterpretation of what I said.
I didn't come in to this thread to fight. People disagree, it happens. And when it happens posting arguments to back up your side is only reasonable. When people misunderstood my own or even others' points, I tried to clarify. And in the end I understand why the other side thinks what they do even though I disagree. The huge line-by-line posters on either side appeared to have been banned under current rules anyway, and when the rest of us saw that neither side was going to budge the conversation ended on its own before the Meido post. Neither I nor, I'm sure, many of the other participants had any intention of continuing in the next Nagatoro thread or spreading into other threads. It was one thread, and in a couple days in will be far enough down that nobody will see it that isn't looking for it, and in a week or two it will 404, assuming it isn't deleted before that. Threads that get like this aren't a common occurrence, so I don't want to see the ability to have legitimate conversation put at risk because of them.
There were some low-quality posts here but I think this is an overreaction and I'm honestly concerned about what it will do to conversation here. This is the only place where I regularly post, not just on 8chan but on any imageboard or forum, and I don't want to see it become a place where we have to worry about getting banned just because some of us disagree with each other. That won't make the board "a more fun place to be" by any means.
No.756838
>>756825
Shoo, shoo. Why are you speaking about "HONEST ARGUMENTS" when this thread was anything but? You are a liar.
No.756853
>>756838
I'm speaking about honest arguments because that's what I was trying to have, and what appears to be getting lumped together with the worst of this thread and prohibited.
Essentially everything I posted related back to three core questions: what kind of relationship is needed to allow NTR, what difference it makes if it is only fake NTR, and whether people would take the same side in a different work that they weren't invested in like they are in this. I consider all of those to be honest, valid, and relevant points. And the exceptions to that were either to explain another's position or to make an aside comment that wasn't intended to be part of the argument.
No.756854
>>756853
>I'm speaking about honest arguments because that's what I was trying to have
And what I have capted is that you are not intelligent enough to process the opposition's arguments, and therefore not able to have an argument.
Shut up.
No.756859
>>756854
I'm not sure what makes you say that, unless you're misattributing some of the other anons' posts to me. I understand their arguments, I just don't agree.
No.756868
>>755725
Worst case is what 3DPD would do.
She's just a different kind of tsundere that would completely melt once pregnant.
No.757077
I don't want to restart the debate (if anyone is even still in here) but I want to concede one point that was made against me: I should have read the whole series before I started posting, not just the bits I thought were relevant.
If I had, I would have known that she explicitly said she would go out with him before the controversial scene, meaning the debate on their relationship could have been avoided entirely, and that was half the argument.
So while I stand by my position, and still do not think I was wrong to make the manner of posts that I did, I do want to apologize for not having had information I should have which would have let us dodge much of what happened. If I had known, a hundred posts of subjectiveness could have been replaced by one concrete answer. For that, sorry.
No.757212
>>756765
There's literally no reason for this to spawn in any other thread because there's usually no reason to bring up NTR, but the moment it does, you already have a shitstorm in your hands and there's nothing you can do about it. I like bullying and stuff, but this scene is just masochistic and borderline NTR. Yes, at the end it's not, but in the second you read that part you know it's kinda wrong. Regardless, it is justified to be discussed.
>ask yourself if this is what you want /a/ to look like
Against NTR, sure thing, I'd love the damn thing to dissapear from the face of earth, but the first 2 posts you see are "NTR is good", and even when it is baiting, no one was baiting about liking NTR itt.
>What sort of poster comes to /a/ and thinks "Right, time to win arguments and prove myself right!"? That's /v/-tier logic
>Let's not discuss things because why argue? Let's just rejoice doing nothing
Gee, no wonder /a/ feels dead at times.
>>756825
>I don't want /a/ to look like a hugbox where disagreement is banned either. Communities where every post must always be positive are shit
This. This is why you go to forums, not to imageboards. People here doesn't need to be nice about things that can be discussed to death and that otherwise would be just banned elsewhere.
>Neither I nor, I'm sure, many of the other participants had any intention of continuing in the next Nagatoro thread or spreading into other threads
This, but now I want to do it just to shit things up. See? This is what happens when you intervene, as this anon said, shit just went quiet without any help. Thread was pretty much dead at that point mostly because I was banned for a fucking lying emoji.
Here is the thing, without the discussion, this thread wouldn't have break 100+ posts, not so quickly anyway, and would have died pretty quickly until the translation was released, and then it would have died again without reaching 150+.
>>756854
>processing the opposition argument is accepting it without saying a thing
>Your argument is not valid if you still disagree
This is what happens when you spend too much time in the hugbox. Also, how the fuck do you even know what that anon posted about?
No.757294
>>757212
>Here is the thing, without the discussion, this thread wouldn't have break 100+ posts, not so quickly anyway
That would have been an improvement, yes.
No.757421
>>757294
I bet you also believe the board is comfy because it's slow.
No.757431
>>757421
If he does he's not wrong. Any slower would be bad, but somewhere between the current average speed and ~1.5 times that is a good range. I definitely wouldn't want it to be as fast as /v/ or /pol/.
No.757615
>>757431
Why? You wouldn't be able to take the pressure?
No.758027
>>756765
Nepfag remains retarded.
No.758476
>>756765
Just information, but it's /tv/ who are the crossposters. They linked to this very thread.
https://8ch.net/tv/res/964672.html#968944
No.760019
>>755958
>"it's not NTR for another guy to be her boyfriend if she's tsundere”
How about this then:
“It’s not NTR for a Tsundere to lie about having a boyfriend to try to anger and drive off the protagonist and for the protagonist to not believe her and continue pursuing her and for the audience to be informed about the ruse from the get go”
Or are you gonna continue to be a hypersensitive beta who gets angry about media he’s never actually read himself and gets defensive when informed he’s wrong because otherwise that means admitting he’s a trend-following normalfaggot sheep that needs to be told what to think?
No.760025
>>757077
You are a retarded nigger and don’t deserve forgiveness. Leave and never come back.
No.760026
>>760019
>to try to drive off the protagonist
>for the protagonist to not believe her
>for the audience to be informed about the ruse from the get go
Are you sure you're talking about the same thing as the rest of the thread? Because none of those are what happened in that chapter of Nagatoro.