[–]▶ No.56449[Last 50 Posts]>>56454 >>56456 >>56464 >>56528 >>66818 >>67105 [Watch Thread][Show All Posts]
People are starting to talk. I know it's rude to bring up a lady's age, but by the most generous estimates they should be in their early 30's. Assuming they age like normal humans, they're facing some tough decisions.
Reimu has to produce a successor as shrine maiden of paradise. If the Hakurei bloodline is needed to maintain the Hakurei barrier, then she should think about having a daughter real soon. Aunn would make an ideal babysitter, and I almost feel like she was put in place by a higher power to take care of the Hakurei child while Reimu goes out and resolves incidents.
Unfortunately, Reimu doesn't seem like the type to fall in love with a man, though I suppose that could be mitigated by having a dreamlike one-night stand with (You) and she could forget about the disgusting episode.
As for Marisa, she doesn't have any job, title or group putting pressure on her. Divorced from her family and her mentor long gone, Marisa's adventures are motivated almost purely from her personal desires: adventure, stealing stuff and competing with Reimu. Now she has a new desire: not dying.
Just as Komachi had foretold, Marisa is starting to think about death. In both ULiL and LoLK she was warned that her mission could potentially be deadly. That worried look on her face in th15 wasn't just meme'd to heck. It was also a character shift from someone who had cheerfully whistled past the graveyard for so long. Marisa definitely looks older and more apprehensive in th16.
Some theorize that Marisa may become a youkai in the future to avoid such a fate. Okina could have granted that, but Marisa turned her down. Why? Does she not want to be anyone's underling? Does Marisa want to stay human forever? Narumi might just be the statue that Marisa and Alice put a hat on, and seeing that she essentially created life may have stirred something in her she never felt before.
They humans of Gensokyo might just stay young girls forever, like most 2D franchises do. ZUN has answered questions about Reimu's age, though, so at least he's aware of the situation.
____________________________
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▶ No.56454 >>56456 >>56458
>>56449 (OP)
>I know it's rude to bring up a lady's age
That it is, shame on you.
>but by the most generous estimates they should be in their early 30's
But whose estimates again? We've had about 16 games, right? Only 11 of which are canon. So lets say that reimu at her youngest possible age in EoSD was like, 8, and her oldest age was maybe twelve or 13. Same goes for marisa as she isn't a youkai yet. The passage of time and reimu/marisa's age are facts that had eluded me, but I would think it's safe to say the gap between each game is just about a year. So that's 11 years between each game.
At their youngest (which I'd argue could possibly be as young as 17) they'd be 19, and at their oldest be 24.
bottom line is they're legal
>Unfortunately, Reimu doesn't seem like the type to fall in love with a man
How so? Wouldn't really consider it impossible.
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▶ No.56456 >>60032
>>56449 (OP)
>>56454
All games are canon.
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Gensokyo_Timeline#Present_era
EoSD took place during 2003 and HSiFS took place during 2017.
So Reimu and Marisa both are at least 25 years old.
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▶ No.56458 >>56459
>>56454
It seems like the Touhou games take place right around the time they're released. Regardless, ULiL definitely took place in 2015, what with Sumireko and all her [current year] tech. Alternative Facts in Eastern Utopia was an even more on-the-nose commentary on current events.
As for men, Reimu showed early on she swings the other way. You can doubt the PC-98 games all you want but this is a good clue as to how she leans. Also she executed a man for purposely becoming a youkai while she's let other ladies get away with far worse crimes. I don't think she gets along well with men at all.
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▶ No.56459 >>56460
>>56458
Actually in this one, Reimu thought that Meira was cute male.
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▶ No.56460
>>56459
Must've been lost in translation. Maybe there is hope!
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▶ No.56464 >>56473 >>56489
>>56449 (OP)
Reimu biting the dust because the Hakurei mikos only have a limited lifetime for one reason or another (my favorite theory: the powers of the Hakurei shrine simply are too much for any human body to handle for longer periods of time) actually is a comparatively common theory in fanworks. Of course, ZUN could easily circumvent this by introduces something that rejuvenates Reimu (medicine from Eirin? Some other McGuffin?):
Marisa is another case because ZUN only needs to snap his finger to turn her into a biologically immortal magician. She technically already is one of the most powerful entities in Gensokyo, at least as far as Danmaku is concerned.
Personally, I'd be mostly interested as to whether or not Yukari would cry her eyes out over Reimu's grave. She already has a sort of teasing mentor status in canon, but I always liked to believe that, after the premature departure of Reimu's mother, Yukari developed maternal feelings towards the young miko and has repeatedly shielded her from harm - even if her modus operandi means that both Reimu and the player remain blissfully unaware of this. I can almost see a scenario where Marisa, desperate and drunk after the death of Reimu, accuses Yukari of shedding crocodile tears because she supposedly sees the Miko as nothing more than another "tool" (like Ran) to advance her plans - only for Yukari to give Marisa a resounding slap on the face that sends the witch flying backwards in a pirouette. Because Yukari cares about, loved Reimu. Just as she did her mother, and the mother of her mother.
This all being said, I agree that the question of a potential father figure is troubling. Even if the people from the human village were largely ignorant about the fact that Reimu regularly hosts parties for man-eating Youkai, she still would be seen as a kind of creep given how far away she lives from the human village, and how much her own powers differ from that of a baseline human. Conversely, I could imagine Reimu often dreams about being an ordinary girl or young woman rather than a living anti-Youkai weapon.
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▶ No.56473 >>56474 >>56475 >>56505 >>56511 >>59960
>>56464
I'd imagine Reimu to be a very lonely girl before the friends she made with the other girls in the series. Would be really difficult for her to find someone to be with.
One possible solution for a potential suitor would be the village organizing an arranged marriage with a suitable person. Presumably someone of a good/strong bloodline. Not exactly the happiest solution, but it has to be done.
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▶ No.56474 >>56476
>>56473
Source on that image? Is it part of a comic involving said scenario or just a one off?
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▶ No.56475 >>56489
>>56473
> Not exactly the happiest solution, but it has to be done.
At that point, I'd prefer Yukari pulling some stranger from the outside world into Gensokyo to do the job. Or (sorry, I don't have the image), Yukari doing lewd things with some random villagers only to open a gap into the reproductive tract of a certain someone.
Although, Reimu making love to someone only to violently push him away and telling him to GTFO afterwards does have its own appeal.
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▶ No.56476 >>56478 >>56489 >>56495 >>56527 >>59960
>>56474
It is, actually. Just got done reading it. It's way too sad!
https://danbooru.donmai.us/pools/2777
Translation peters out near the end though.
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▶ No.56478
>>56476
Just finished it aswell.
Damn, I wasn't prepared for suffering.
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▶ No.56489
>>56476
Damn, that one hurt.
>>56475
>>56464
There is also chance for Reimu to become hermit somehow instead.
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▶ No.56495
>>56476
>That one again
I never asked for these feels to return.
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▶ No.56496 >>56497
Who says that they'll even grow old? Reimu barely eats anything (she even resorted to eating grass once) and yet she's still biologically functional, and it isn't out of scope for Marisa to find something to expand her lifespan without abandoning mortality.
Cirno's probably going to get fucked, though...
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▶ No.56497 >>56499
>>56496
>(she even resorted to eating grass once)
>once
>Cirno's probably going to get fucked, though...
are fairies even mortal?
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▶ No.56499
>>56497
Fairies aren't (they just respawn so long as their environment remains intact), but that's because they are personifications of pure lifeforce, with limited individuality.
Cirno, on the other hand, has developed enough individuality and power that she is at danger of ceasing to be a fairy and becoming a Youkai instead. Which means that she could die and no longer respawn.
>(she even resorted to eating grass once)
Source? As far as I know, the entire "poor shrine maiden" thing is largely fancanon, and even then it's mostly played for the laughs (and the occasional lewds).
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▶ No.56505 >>56511
>>56473
arranged marriage doesnt have to be unhappy one. people worked like that for thousands of years without problem, concept of romantic love is quite a new one.
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▶ No.56511 >>56514
>>56505
>>56473
I'm sure people can "learn to love eachother", but I can very much understand either side of the equation feeling "weighed down" by an arranged marriage. Really, when you think about it must feel unnatural, having your partner being chosen for you, even if you're raised from birth knowing about arranged marriages.
I mean, just look at all the stories that revolve around people trying to break out of arranged marriages. It would be nice to see stories or examples of them working out nicely, though.
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▶ No.56514 >>56527
>>56511
Personally, I only see this working in master-slave scenarios where the female expects the male to rape her seven days to Sunday, but he actually turns out to be a gentle giant that may or may not treat her better than her own parents.
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▶ No.56527
>>56514
>but he actually turns out to be a gentle giant that may or may not treat her better than her own parents.
Yeah, sorta like in Part 7 of JoJo.
Though I did read a manga in which the scenario of one of the side stories was that the man ran away from the marriage, but after wandering for years, he realized that he really did love his wife. It was cute.
>>56476
Ah, sad, heartwarming, then heartrending. A great read. I'd love to read the epilogue, but I'm afraid I'm not a moonspeaker.
kinda funny how the man has literally zero input throughout the course of this
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▶ No.56528 >>56531
>>56449 (OP)
Normally the next miko isn't the daughter of the current miko. Since a miko is married to the kami, it wouldn't be normal for her to share her bed with another. In very old times, however, a priest would provide the god's semen while possessed, preserving the marriage between the miko and her god while letting a direct bloodline continue.
It would make sense to think that this is roughly how Reimu was conceived. There's no noble family that could provide daughters afflicted with shamanistic sicknesses, so Reimu's mom probably had to do that herself while still being the miko. How Reimu has no ties to her father's family suggests that some dude was possessed by the shrine god and has no memory of ever sleeping with Reimu's mom. That divine semen thing would also explain Reimu's superhuman powers.
It wouldn't be a huge problem to use someone from the human village, since even if Reimu remembers the dude's face, she isn't going to visit the village too often for it to be too much for her. Of course, the easier alternative is to have some loser from the outside world get possessed. Men are gonna have dreams of impregnating Reimu anyway, so it's not gonna make the news.
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▶ No.56531 >>56540
>>56528
so you are saying that suwaku is futa?
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▶ No.56540 >>56541 >>56543
>>56531
I don't know how you arrived at this conclusion, but I would prefer if this stay like this.
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▶ No.56541 >>56543 >>56577
>>56540
Not that fairy, but I came to the same conclusion.
<Kami impregnates miko
<Hakurei shrine has a goddess
<Sanae descended from Suwako
<Suwako is a girl
In any case, I'm not sure where you got the idea that mikos are married to their shrine's deity. They're not nuns. Plus there's nothing that implies Reimu has divine blood in her like Sanae does.
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▶ No.56543 >>56544
>>56541
Fairy, you answered to not that same fairy.
Only >>56540 was my post.
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▶ No.56544
>>56543
I meant that I wasn't the fairy you were replying to.
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▶ No.56577 >>56582 >>56590 >>56592
>>56541
>I'm not sure where you got the idea that mikos are married to their shrine's deity.
From Shamanism in Japan by William P. Fairchild (1962) (https://nirc.nanzan-u.ac.jp/nfile/457):
Originally the shamans [i.e., miko] did not marry earth men because they married their guardian spirits. When they began to marry earth men, the first night of the marriage was the spirit's right night. The initiation ceremony often included a marriage ceremony, uniting the shaman and the guardian spirit.
The guardian spirit isn't the kami of the shrine, but typically a Buddhist deity.
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▶ No.56582 >>56591 >>59961
>>56577
so byakuren is futa too?
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▶ No.56590 >>56599
>>56577
So even though that once was the case, it isn't any longer.
Also I recall reading that the ying yang orb as a Hakurei treasure, and that only a blood member of Hakurei clan could use it. Not to mention that the Hakurei clan tends to the Great Hakurei Barrier. Both of these imply that blood related descendants are required.
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▶ No.56591 >>56592
>>56582
Byakuren is a Buddhist nun, not a shinto miko.
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▶ No.56592 >>56594 >>56599
>>56577
>>56591
>Originally the shamans [i.e., miko] did not marry earth men because they married their guardian spirits.
>[...]
>The guardian spirit isn't the kami of the shrine, but typically a Buddhist deity.
ergo, as there is only buddhist deity in gensokyo, byakuren has to be the one that impregnates reimu
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▶ No.56594 >>56604
>>56592
Contain your futafaggotry, fairy.
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▶ No.56599 >>56606 >>57264
>>56590
You misunderstood. Miko still married their guardian spirits in the initiation ceremony. They were also allowed to marry an "earth man", but the powers of a miko partly come from her necessary marriage with the spirit (the other part is training). Can'd do without that, ok? The end point of this practice was only the 1873 (Meiji 6) ban on ecstatic practices. The Hakurei never took the ban seriously, which is proven by Reimu's ability to host gods in her body, so it makes sense they still marry a guardian spirit, too. And they created the barrier in Meiji 18, anyway, so they haven't had to deal with any bans.
>blood related descendants are required
Nobody ever implied anything that would contradict this. Not that it's wrong to tell about it.
>>56592
Isn't Byakuren just some Buddha-flavored magician? Deity means a god or a goddess or a nature spirit and other things like that. A Buddhist deity would be someone like Bishamonten or some Buddha.
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▶ No.56604 >>56605 >>56606
>>56594
I don't know if the babysitter will let me.
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▶ No.56605
>>56604
<misread that as furfagotry
<welp, that horn looks nice
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▶ No.56606 >>56607
>>56599
Byakuren actually used black magic to make herself immortal after the death of her brother scared the hell out of her over her own mortality. She only reformed later on when she began to envision friendly relations between Youkai and humans (which really is a stupid idea, given that the former actively require the terror of the latter to exist).
>>56604
Is this what Aunn looks like when she gets srs?
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▶ No.56607 >>56621 >>56623
>>56606
They need belief to sustain themselves; terror is just the easiest to do and it's a very strong emotion. Honestly if they kust had scholars write dissertations and observational data on the physical phenomena of youkai rather than discover the necessity of belief and doing everything in their power to disprove their existence, they would be a common sight these days, and with the modern trend of romanticization, they would be pretty friendly too.
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▶ No.56621 >>56639
>>56607
The thing with occult and paranormal phenomenon is that they mostly happen out of sight.
At least out of Gensokyo.
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▶ No.56623 >>56639
>>56607
I see what you mean, but at the same time, there is no real reason for Youkai to get friendly with humans. It's like asking a farmer to respect his cattle as his equal.
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▶ No.56639 >>57264
>>56623
Unless Youkai and Gods are the same thing.
Youkai exist thanks to fear and Gods thanks to faith in them. Minus Hina for latter.
>>56621
Plus they only happen for these people who already believe in them.
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▶ No.57264 >>57274 >>57278
>>56599
>The end point of this practice was only the 1873 (Meiji 6) ban on ecstatic practices.
I'd like more information about this.
>>56639
It would be quite a trip to see commentary on consensus reality, chaos magic, or other modern reflections on belief from someone with a bit more skin in the game, as it were.
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▶ No.57274 >>57275
>>57264
Agreed, but I doubt ZUN would write about something like this.
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▶ No.57275 >>57276 >>57277
>>57274
ZUN has already written about how fake news has affected Aya's reporting. Meme magic may just be right up his alley.
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▶ No.57276 >>57277
>>57275
>inb4 Suwako suddenly gets a massive surge in power thanks to Pepe/Kek
>Meanwhile, the Lunarians go full Moonman
>And Reimu really becomes as poor as she is in the fancanon.
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▶ No.57277 >>57280
>>57275
Now I remember it.
Was it that about that image with Miko wanting to build a wall around village and make youkai to pay for it?
>>57276
1. She is powerful already. She is a god after all.
2. Didn't they went full Moonman already in LoLK and earlier when they made exterminatus on moon fairies?
3. Her donation box was always empty. With Mamizou filling it with leaves few times.
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▶ No.57278
>>57264
Basically, because the government wanted to set up an European-style state, they needed a state religion. Shinto was chosen but of course it couldn't work as it was then, a native religion. In fact, the idea that there is a Shinto religion only emerged in the Edo period (1603 - 1868), authored by Norinaga Motoori (the inspiration for Kosuzu Motoori, lived 1730 - 1801) and other Kokugaku ("native studies") scholars of that time.
Anyway, to turn Shinto into a "proper" religion (which later got the name State Shinto), every shrine was registered and put under the control of the Bureau of Shrines (those that weren't registered lost all funding and died out). Also, ecstatic practices, that is, shamanism, was banned. You can't tell someone who's in trance what to say, because it's the kami speaking, and that's bad for totalitarianism. By cutting of the communication between men and gods, the Meiji state turned the shrines into patriotic places instead of spiritual ones. That basically means that personal and communal experiences of spiritual or otherwise mystical happenings were put under a ban so that no-one would get any ideas. The reason they didn't ban Shinto altogether is that it would've been politically near-impossible, and because state Shinto had a function of telling about the emperor's divine origin and of ritualizing patriotism.
That kinda killed their native faith, and now what's left is the power spot bullshit Kanako laments in Symposium of Post-mysticism.
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▶ No.57280 >>57281 >>57287
>>57277
1. I was thinking of "Pre-Great Suwa War" tier of power.
2. They didn't make exterminatus on moon fairies. What they tried to do was to relocate the Lunar Capital to Gensokyo precisely because they couldn't deal with the moon fairies. But also because they knew that this act would destroy all life in Gensokyo, and that the Gensokyans hence would send out their heroines to deal with the fairies and Junko.
3. Yukari regularly slips some coins in, IIRC. Reimu also gets money or at least other rewards for (presumably) Youkai extermination missions she does for her.
As for the Great Wall: Yeah, except Miko's original text was about banning sweets because they were bad for your teeth or something.
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▶ No.57281 >>57282 >>57283 >>57284 >>57287
>>57280
Isn't it weird that ppl bitch about politics in games all the time these days. Then ZUN took it further than most devs and put [CURRENT YEAR] political memes in his work and the fandom mostly gave a collective shrug.
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▶ No.57282
>>57281
because touhou fanbase is made from cool people and Zun made it subtle and not in your face.
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▶ No.57283 >>57284
>>57281
It is one thing to make a small, lighthearted joke about political events, and one thing entirely to use your video games in order to push your political viewpoints
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▶ No.57284
>>57281
Along with >>57283 most fans of touhou are Japanese, as in, not American. So their reaction to it is the same as any other country outside the US with the jokes.
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▶ No.57287
>>57280
1. Oh. It would be nice to see her attempting to fight against Kanako to regain her territory.
>Inb4 Touhou 17 is about war between various Gods.
2. I am sure they still did, somehow they needed to make Moon into pure land to live for that crazy amount of time.
I didn't played LoLK yet and I am kinda scared to even try it.
3. So Reimu being poor was just a meme?
>>57281
Major difference in mind between West and East.
Also that jab was very subtle and really funny.
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▶ No.59960
>>56476
>>56473
I hope someone translates the end before I die, I need to know what happens!
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▶ No.59961
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▶ No.59989 >>60003 >>60043
http://danbooru.donmai.us/pools/13083
Azuma Aya (WaHH artist) seems to have shared our concerns. This doujin got me shook, not only because of how heartfelt and touching it is, but it almost seems like a call-out that's meant to get ZUN's attention.
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▶ No.60003
>>59989
>A tiny amount of retribution for fortune teller.
At least it's something I guess.
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▶ No.60032 >>60038 >>60147
>>56456
>Reimu is a christmas cake now
I like the idea of that.
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▶ No.60038
>>60032
Looks like the Hakurei bloodline is safe after all.
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▶ No.60043
>>59989
>Older Marisa
I'm strangely okay with this. Also, thank you for sharing that doujin. It was a good read.
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▶ No.60147
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▶ No.66784 >>66786 >>66820
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
Welp, ZUN has responded. Skip to 3:20 for the terrible truth. Looks like Gensokyo has Springfield time.
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▶ No.66786
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▶ No.66818
>>56449 (OP)
Reimu is not mentally ill.
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▶ No.66819 >>66820 >>66822
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▶ No.66820
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▶ No.66822 >>66835
>>66819
Years pass but nobody from the main cast gets older or die.
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▶ No.66835
>>66822
Oh, as in the Simpsons. I figured what it meant, but I didn't make the connection.
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▶ No.67105 >>67139
>>56449 (OP)
how do you know being around all those youkai hasn't slowed down their aging?
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▶ No.67139
>>67105
Just being near Youkai probably would not have that effect. Although I suppose it would be a child's play for Eirin to produce drugs which reverse or at least significantly slow down aging.
Not to speak of the Hourai elixir, but I doubt that Eirin would willingly repeat that mistake once more.
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