/v/ - Video Games

>>16670630

Don't forget what happened in 2011. Faggots complained that Skyward Sword was too "formulaic" and wanted something new. So then Nintendo gave them something new so they'll shut up. And now, those same faggots are complaining that BotW is too different.

I swear, some fanbases are just unpleasable.

>>16670661

Skyward Sword only failed because the Wii controls were shit. BotW is terrible because it’s a mile wide but an inch deep.

>>16670649

Eh, Zelda I and II had hidden dungeons about the overworld. I like the open world meme, but the game desperately needed something more compelling than shrines to find.

I don't think it's fundementally un-Zelda, and everyone was pretty much tired of the OOT formula. Definitely could have been better in some regards, but the fact that it's a Zelda game doesn't strike me as a problem. If they can manage to make dungeons better in future entries, I'm fine with this being what mainline Zelda is from now on. We're still probably always going to have smaller games like the LA remake for that classic Zelda taste anyway.

It feels like a tech demo for their admittedly cool new engine. Considering BotW2 is apparently using the same setting that might be exactly what happened. It was a pretty awkward jump into something totally new for LoZ and depending on whether they learn from their mistakes i think the next game will either make or break the franchise.

>>16670710

Better actual dungeons and a larger enemy pool is really all I’d want for the game, and the enemy pool already isn’t too bad the further you go, but still, it would be nice to have every region have its own specific types of enemies instead of just recolors.

>>16670690

The idea of shrines was good, but they need to be less uniform. Ideally, every shrine should be a unique location. Instead of entering another shrine that looks like every other shrine in the game, you travel to the bottom of a well, or a dark cave, or a forest grove.

Now that might be easier said than done, but at the very least we can split the difference, and have half and half. Also, at least change the colour scheme of the shrines from time to time.

>>16670686

This. BotW is total shit because it has jack shit for content. The only good part of the game is exploring the world with nothing in it.

>>16670661

>>16670682

Bullshit. These faggots never played SS. Skyward Sword's controls were fine. The problem with the game was that it was pitifully easy and held your hand the entire game. It was a tutorial for what could have been a good game, if the tutorial ever ended. Every puzzle is spelled out explicitly, every objective is told to you up front, combat is obvious Simon Says bullshit, all boss attacks are telegraphed a decade ahead of time, and dowsing is mandatory in parts, so you literally have to follow a glowing line to the next waypoint.

Skyward Sword was formulaic as fuck, but so was Ocarina of Time. OoT actually gave you a chance to have to figure out a couple things on your own, though.

No

>>16670722

>Skyward Sword's controls were fine.

No.

>>16670722

>Skyward Sword's controls were fine.

No they fucking weren't you had to recalibrate that shit like every 10 minutes. Though i admit i'm biased, i never liked wagglan or touch screen controls. The whole DS Wii era was a fucking shitshow for that.

>>16670718

I agree, largely. The shrines should actually feel like part of the world. What they felt like was teleporters to single-room puzzles.

I liked the concept of mini-dungeons, but in practice, it wasn't so great. I'd prefer if they joined every 10 of them together or something, for 10 to 12 actual themed mini-dungeons with multiple puzzles that felt like part of the world.

Feels like it could have been the start of an amazing RPG and it would have been a great engine for an RPG. Instead we got some watered down, wander around the world and find shrines and towers, you can climb almost everything so there's no challenge just max our stamina, it's easier to avoid enemies as opposed to fight them shallow empty world.

Gannon boss battle was such a disappointment. I beat it and was like "meh", my friend was with me and was like "dude you just beat the game, you didn't even die or fail once the whole fight". The way I felt after beating Ganon really summed up the game. Flashy, hyped, and when it's all over you're underwhelmed. It's in this awkward spot where it's not boring enough to stop playing but it's not exciting to finish it.

>>16670722

OoT was massively more difficult that BotW. OoT had the time travel mechanic and it used puzzles based on that. BotW was easy as fuck, the puzzles were a joke, Gannon's fight was a joke. the beast dungeons were short and easy. It's not that OoT is a difficult game, it's that BotW was so easy.

>>16670730

They were too similar. And the rewards were lame. Wow, I got a weapon that will break or a quarter of an upgrade to my hearts or stamina, only 80 more shrines to go! Easy puzzles for stupid rewards.

>>16670733

And you can't even dump all of it into stamina, it caps at 3 rings. That shit pissed me off so much. They could have added magic items and a magic meter system on top of the health and stamina. Completely dropped the ball on so much shit. Game needed another year in the oven.

>>16670726

Yes.

>>16670728

Worked on My Machine™. I only ever had to calibrate once when I started the game up. Maybe you had lighting or sensor bar issues, because the game is supposed to auto calibrate using the sensor bar as you play. The game still sucked, but the controls weren't the issue for most people, it was the piss-poor game design.

>>16670726

It always worked for me.

>>16670738

I hated both the controls and the gameplay. Wagglin is total dogshit.

The game is alright but has a lot of flaws. The lack of dungeons, the empty open world, the terrible weapon durability, the laughable difficulty, etc.

However, the biggest flaw is it didn't have a hot imp I wanted to impregnate

>>16670745

Whether you like it or whether it works are different issues though.

>>16670733

I was comparing OoT to SS, not BotW.

>>16670730

Now what does that sound like?

>>16670751

It didn't work and I hated it because it didn't fucking work. Total dogshit, not sensitive enough.

>>16670738

>>16670743

The "works on my machine" people like you are absolutely worthless in arguments because you act like just because it worked on yours that invalidates criticism from others who didn't have the luxury of it working for them. Besides, even if it did work, the controls are still absolute ass along with the level design.

>>16670737

I didn't even reach 3 rings and I could climb pretty much everything I needed to skip parts of the game. But the game was easy, so after I had enough stamina and a few extra hearts, I just gave up on shrines. What was the point? They are just there to farm enough hearts and stamina so you can beat the game. And if you're not a drooling retard you don't need much.

You can eat stamina recovering food in the air or when climbing. You definitely don't need to max out stamina, just prioritize it enough until you're good.

>>16670755

I know, based on your post I think difficulty is OoT > BotW > SS. At least BotW was a step in the more difficult direction, but fuck they need to make like 10 steps towards making Zelda more difficult.

>>16670722

>Skyward Sword's controls were fine

I completely agree the controls were fine. I played for several hours at a time and don't recall recalibrating becoming an issue for anything other than the bomb bowling puzzles.

>The problem with the game was that it was pitifully easy

I replayed the game a year later in hero mode and holy shit what a difference it made. It felt like the intended difficulty.

>>16670758

You're doing the opposite thing, and claiming it was absolutely objectively broken, because it didn't work for you, when it worked for a lot of people.

>>16670759

But I wanted 8 bats of stamina so I could spin with a 2 hander for 30 seconds.

>>16670757

Maybe your hands are retarded.

>>16670733

>OoT had the time travel mechanic and it used puzzles based on that

*laughs in LttP*

>>16670763

Or maybe the shitty fucking motion controls should have been scrapped for a better control scheme.

>>16670771

Worked on my machine.

>>16670771

Gotta agree with everyone else here saying it worked. Without the control scheme the game would have to have been redesigned from the ground up. Entire dungeons, puzzles, enemies, and even that one moment during the final battle would have been impossible without it.

>>16670765

Epin reddit meme, upboated

>>16670759

Different kinds of difficulty. BotW difficulty is scalable, like level grinding in an RPG. If OOT is classic Castlevania, BotW is SotN. You can potentially make SotN a hard game, but challenge has to be self imposed.

>>16670785

The two big problems are that the game never leaves you alone to figure things out for yourself, and the sky world was pointless, and just segmented the map in too much of an artificial feeling way. Those things don't hinge on the controls.

>>16670795

>make Zelda more difficult

Does nobody play hero mode anymore? I know it's not the most difficult thing, but the DLC in BotW in hero mode was actually pretty tough.

>>16670807

I agree, but it's not like there hasn't been a large hub world in other Zelda games. Hyrule field serves the same function in OoT and to a lesser extent TP. The. castle town in minish cap.

>>16670811

Yeah, I'm not paying extra money to make the game more difficult. Why the fuck would you charge people who are better at the game, and probably longer time fans, for being better at the game?

>Hey I heard the game was too easy and that you have a lot of experience playing Zelda games

>Sorry we made this one easier because there's a lot of new fans of Zelda playing

>If you want it to be difficult you can pay us!

>>16670815

It's not so much a mechanical difference as the fact that the sky world just makes the seams too visible and takes away that illusion of adventuring in an open world. Skyloft could easily have been a town in the middle of the map like Clock Town. Wouldn't change the game much mechanically, but it would feel different.

>>16670630

BotW is a generic, bland open world sandbox with "Zelda" slapped on the box for easy money.

As far as I'm concerned, Zelda games are characterized mainly by two things:

1) Exploration. BotW did a mediocre job at this. Sure there's a huge world to explore, but >>16670682 hit the nail right on the head. It's a mile wide and an inch deep. The game fell flat on its face into the biggest pitfall of open world games: no actual content. There are only a small handful of enemies, most of which can all be dealt with the same way without any real thought. The side quests are all inconsequential filler, none of them provide you with new abilities or items that change anything about the game. The large number of collectible crafting items are largely redundant fluff, and could but cut down to only a dozen without any real loss in functionality.

2) Dungeons built around progression of character abilities. This is the real sin BotW committed. At its core, every prior Zelda game was build around the idea of continuously increasing the players tool set through new items, with each dungeon basically functioning as a massive tutorial for that new tool. BotW didn't even try. The player is given 4 tools from the very beginning of the game, and there's zero significant change in their capabilities between a 30 minute and 100 hour save file. The mechanics are kept so simple that there's no real room for any emergent interactions between them to make up for the small number, and fumbling through shrines with janky physics exploits gets old fast.

One of my normalfag friends picked up the game a while after it launched, and asked me if the game was going to open with more items and dungeons after the 4th beast. He legitimately didn't believe me at first when I told him that was the whole game

.>>16670795

That's a piss poor excuse for BotW being so easy. Most of the game's difficulty problems would be solved if Nintendo had the sense to just put a cooldown on healing and stamina recovery items.

>>16670820

I didn't even realize that Hero Mode was DLC. I thought it was part of the free update. You're right it's a shitty design decision, but hero mode and DLC still help out with the main games complaints. It shows that Nintendo is listening and might incorporate that into the sequel.

>>16670630

>is this a true to form Zelda game at heart or did it miss to many of the aspects that make a game Zelda?

>no dungeons

>instead more than a hundred shrines scattered throughout each region

>do shrine, get power

>see that mountain? you can climb it!

>divine beasts are just a glorified shrine with a boss at the end

>weapon degradation is badly implemented

>very limited enemy variety

>filled with gimmicks like cooking and temperature mechanics

I'd prefer more combat variety, fuck the niggers who will try and say that the franchise couldn't take a page from Dark Souls. It absolutely could, you're just a cum eating faggot.

>>16670833

Well, stumbling upon a Lionell in the early game is probably legitimately one of the most difficult things in a Zelda game past the early NES titles. The problem is the common RPG issue, that once you're past a certain point in the game, you've amassed so much stuff that nothing can really phase you, and you also have the get out of jail free card of grinding away problems.

It's an issue that is distinct to more open games. You can't really compare it to OOT, where every area is crafted with full knowledge of how tough the player is going to be when they get there.

Would probably have been a good idea to limit how much the player can chug healing items though, yes.

>>16670630

Yes its a true to form Zelda game.

Nintendo finally stopped fucking lying and actually did (literally) go back to the series roots in making this game.

They built up the concept for it using Zelda 1 style on the NES and coming to the conclusion that Zelda's natural progression was always destined to be more along the lines of Skyrim than all those shitty Aonuma games like Majora's Mask, Wind Waker and Skyward Sword filled to the brim with god awful boring fucking puzzles, lame as hell NPC's and uninspiring environments.

A better way to put it is Aonuma Zelda forces you to jump through hoops to get into the action (sword, bow, magic and other combat) whereas classic Zelda ie true Zelda lets you fight right away.

My only complaints about BOTW are that its too watered down a Skyrim.

It should be even more like Skyrim, meaning if you're going to have breakable weapons do it right ie the way Skyrim does it.

Also take out those shitty puzzle Shrines as those were one aspect of Aonuma's garbage/hack design placed in the game and it feels totally off from the rest of the game world which it shouldn't as BOTW should be one continuous flowing experience that melds together seemlessly but you're taken right out of that when you enter one of those shitty shrines ie most of your abilities such as wall climbing no longer work in shitty boring Aonuma shrine land.

So basically we need the BOTW sequel to leave out Aonuma's garbage to become perfect.

That means a return to dungeon combat/play with about 8 or 9 of them spread throughout the land for good measure and if they want to continue the breakable weapons arc then they need to do it properly like in Skyrim.

Also combat in general in BOTW becomes stale over time as in it feels like you're fighting the same monsters over and over again with the same moves/strategies. Nintendo needs to fix this somehow.

So other than a few glaring flaws BOTW is an A+ game.

It is to Switch what Halo was to the original Xbox ie the only reason to buy the console.

>>16670865

>Switch

BotW is best experienced on the Wii U. Prove me wrong.

>>16670848

> It shows that Nintendo is listening and might incorporate that into the sequel.

They didn't fix the shitty glass weapons, I highly doubt that, optimistic anon

>>16670758

The difference in this case is that everyone has the same machine. The only thing that was ever a little wonky about SS's controls was charging the skyward strike and even that wasn't really a problem. Everything else was perfectly fine.

>>16670869

No arguments there.

Its the best game on either console, quite honestly.

>>16670865

Nigga, just play Skyrim, at that point. Some of us like puzzles.

>>16670926

He said Nintendo went back to Zelda's roots with BotW, that just proves he never fucking played the first Zelda.

Don't feed the trolls, anon.

>>16670926

Puzzles are boring trash.

You and those like you need to go play Tetris and fuck off.

You've caused Nintendo to allow that hack Aonuma to ruin Zelda for almost two decades with that boring bullshit.

>>16670930

If you want to kill things in a fantasy world, there's a lot of choice. Why even play Zelda games at that point? Go play the Witcher.

>>16670929

You never played the first Zelda, dickhead and your hero Aonuma admits he could never beat that game.

Figures.

Its always you beta cucks and SJW's at the forefront when its time to look around and figure out who has ruined an established game series.

You fuckers ruined Metroid too with that Other M sensitive Samus emotional female garbage when she was always intended to be a silent warrior and guardian of the galaxy.

Not some whiney soap opera cunt crying over her relationship troubles.

>>16670937

>likes puzzles

>beta cuck SJW

lol. Alright, m8.

>>16670934

The Witcher and Skyrim got so popular because they filled a niche Aonuma Zelda never could that classic Zelda always filled before that hack came along.

Witcher series and Skyrim only exist because of Zelda NES, OOT and LTTP.

>>16670898

The weapon durability was never going to be fixed in BOTW through a patch. The game was designed around it, that's why the world is filled with them and they can be obtained so easily. A patch to fix the mechanic would've had to rework the drop rates of the weapons and it would've become an almost entirely different, much easier game.

I'm hopeful they'll listen to fan feedback to improve things for BOTW2 though.

>>16670939

So play them. What's the problem?

>>16670950

They got the enemies to recover health in the DLC, surely doing something similar with weapons couldn't have been that hard.

Hell, they even gave us a new boss fight, the best of the entire game, with Maz Koshia, was making the weapons not break as soon as an enemy touched them seriously that hard in comparison?

>>16670954

I do and I'll play BOTW and it's sequel too since Zelda is now back to its original style and largely away from the garbage Aonuma style that types like you prefer albeit the shitty puzzle shrines (at least there are combat shrines too in order to offset some of that boring Aonuma bullshit).

Anyway tl;dr dude just go play Tetris.

>>16670962

Weapon durability isn't a design flaw. It was there to balance out the fact that you can stumble upon good weapons right out the gate. People would be complaining the game was even easier if you could pick up a guardian sword right away, and keep it the whole game. If anything, more of the game should be designed like that. Food should rot for example.

>>16670964

I do play Tetris, a lot. Sometimes I like a combined puzzle solving and combat experience

>>16670978

People complain about the game being easy and it has nothing to do with the weapons. Other Zelda games have had the same complaint and you could use the Master Sword only.

Maybe not having those absolutely broken perfect parry and perfect dodge mechanics would help, besides being able to one shot ice/fire enemies with fire/ice weapons. You know, making the fucking actual game better.

There, some good ideas to make the game more difficult that AND have better weapons.

>>16670988

Other Zelda games don't let you wander into late game areas right off the bat and loot shit though.

>>16670990

You don't need to do that in other Zelda games, of course.

My point is that weapon durability was objectively poorly implemented. I wish it had been better, there were a lot of cool weapons I wanted to keep and never used them so the didn't break.

Everything about that game was underwhelming anyway. I only died ONCE, to Waterblight and that was because I wasn't used to the controls. After that I breezed through the game.

Weapons were only one of the long list of flaws the game had.

>>16671003

That's kind of a personal problem though. You just have to conquer that prudishness, and stop worrying about wasting weapons. There's always more of them anyway.

The one thing I might have done is put like ten indestructible weapons in very well hidden locations of the map, but generally it's better for balance that weapons operate the way they do.

>>16671006

>>16671003

I've never played the game is equipment repairable in BOTW?

>>16671009

No. The Master Sword is the one weapon you get that doesn't go away forever once it breaks.

>>16671006

No, a personal problem is me wanting the NPCs to react differently towards Link's outfits. This is an objective flaw because you're supposed to want to do the shrines or explore and find cool stuff. You know, what the game was made for. If all you're gonna get for your troubles is a cool weapon that's as strong as an uncooked spaghetti, then there's no point.

I just becomes more obvious how badly implemented it was once you play hero mode.

>>16671009

Nope

What other games did ten years ago is an entirely alien concept to Nintendo, apparently.

Actually, here's what you could do. You have NPC's hidden in the game who collect weapon types. One who likes bows, one who likes heavy swords, etc. If you can bring them one of every type of that weapon, they'll reward you with a special indestructable weapon of that type.

>>16671011

Fuck! Even Minecraft lets you repair your shit before it breaks and evaporates. Why did they think this was a good mechanic?

>>16671033

Because it's actually a good mechanic. People just don't like it because it triggers their hoarding disorders.

>>16671033

I could be a good mechanic but Nintendo can't into weapon durability so we got this absolute garbage version.

It not the only problem but it is pretty annoying, especially when you play hero mode and even the blue bokoblins require all your inventory because they got more life but the weapons remain just as shitty.

>>16671051

In that case, they probably should have rebalanced hero mode.

Should Breath of Fire V have been a Breath of Fire game?

>>16671023

>>16671036

>>16671051

Exactly how fast do things wear out? DQ Builders also had durability but in that game it seems to be balanced very well. Come to think of it so was hunger. In Builders only the lower tier stuff tended to break fast which spurred you along to wanting to make better level equipment. Good equipment took forever to run out and by that point you would have more than enough material to recraft it.

>>16671075

I dunno. Pretty quickly. But you have to bear in mind there are wepons everywhere in the game. You may as well complain about shooters forcing you to spend ammo.

>>16671075

A strong weapon lasted me two or two and half fights, depending on the enemy, iirc

>>16671086

That's not a good comparison.

It would be as if you had to drop the weapon every time it ran out of ammo.

Besides, these are incentives for exploration, for beating the120 shrines. What's the point if even the Master Sword 'breaks'?

>>16671096

But then you pick up an identically functioning weapon two minutes later.

Yes, it's more similar to the first one than all the others. It's also amazing how the game still manages to make people incredibly asshurt, even though it has been out for a while now.

>>16671100

Then that's just terrible design too.

Why have so much variety if everything's gonna break in two hits and you can pick up the same weapon so you can rinse and repeat? Why not make them more durable or repairable? Just that simple choice, to let the player repair their favorite weapons would make a ton of difference.

Again, not the only flaw but it would be one less.

>>16671107

Because then you could wonder into Hyrule Castle right off the bat, pick up a "fuck you" weapon, and keep repairing it for the rest of the game.

>>16671108

That's pretty much what you can do anyway. You don't even need that much to beat the entire game. You don't even need that much preparation to go to Ganon and defeat him, even if you decide to not beat the Beasts beforehand.

Get some ancient shields for the guardians outside the castle, or use the parry.

Fuck ton of stamina and hearty food and you're good to go. Just pick up some of those royal guard weapons at hyrule castle and you won't need much more.

Also

>having more options is bad

Christ, anon.

>>16671108

But if you required rare components to repair higher leveled stuff you could balance it around that. Besides, what happened to risk vs reward? Hyrule Castle is difficult to break into the first time playing the game so your rewards should be good and help carry you in the early game, if you wanted them to.

What's wrong with that?

>>16671115

Well, you can keep going back to raid the Castle, but that's annoying, and interrupts exploration. People are less likely to do that.

>>16671116

That's the same basic mechanic, if you think about it. Spending rare weapons becomes spending rare consumables to keep your weapons functioning.

I think what made the original stand out is the scarcity yet utility of resources. Sure if you know what you are doing then you can find secret Moblins and buy all the gear you need to win. However when you die before you can cash you will have no choice but to kill enemies for rupees and bombs. Zelda 2 is more health and MP management. You can find extra lives once, but when you die you start at the main palace until the Great Palace. So both games require mastery of the mechanics to beat the game rather than hunt for the best gear. Hell it gets to the point the game throws high level gear at you all the time to balance the leveling. If I ran out of weapons more then I would be forced to use runes more often. But I don't because I always hoard the best weapons and use them on stronger monsters.

Perhaps I would find more interest in Rupees if the game has a trade economy or at least a punishment system outside of save scumming. Like needing to invest in trade goods because dying makes monsters steal your wallet. Trade goods can be sold for profit or loss for rupees afterward. Also have a suspend save feature for handheld play while checkpoints are limited to campfires either you make yourself or you find.

I played the game with a self-imposed challenge: Naked Link, Throw Every Weapon, Save only after resting at stables and campfires on Master Mode. Things got interesting with how runes alone changed combat. Granted I died to Water Ganon because I was a shitter, but I had fun surviving while exploring.

>>16671118

There's not much to see, anyway. The views are beautiful, but most often than not, empty as fuck.

Too little content into a too bog world.

Shame, I was excited for this game, until I played it. Vah Ruta best part, yo.

>>16670682

>>16670726

>>16670728

The controls are one of those complaints where you're such a faggot and hate the game so much that you see every single element of the game as a flaw, and you blindly search out for them. The game is shit, you don't have to make complaints up.

It's like all the people bitching about BotW because Link is too feminine and has to crossdress at one point, instead of any of the myriad of actual flaws with the game.

>>16671133

Skyward Sword's not that bad. It as least had cool moments like the sand sea. I like it more than Twilight Princess, which generally just failed to stand out as anything more than a poor man's Ocarina of Time at any point.

>>16671166

Obviously if items didn't break as often or you could repair them they wouldn't put a thousand of the same weapon every two steps you retard.

>>16671167

That's basically the same difference though. There's probably a reason Nintendo landed on this particular balance. I'm sure they didn't just settle on the first thing they tried.

>>16671162

I liked TP, it had some sweet dungeons and great bosses.

I liked SS too (though fuck having to fight the imprisoned three times and that stupid water dragon, jesus christ, nintendo) I think it's a good game with some terrible parts.

>>16671166

>>16671167

This essentially addressed the issue of all open world games, where either the caves and random locations you explore give you useless shit or make you severely overpowered. You'll either have one or the other. With this, even mediocre weapons are still useful and a nice enough reward. But of course, since people bitched, they'll have to get rid of it, meaning shrines will now either give you overpowered shit and make the game piss-easy, or they'll make the items you get redundant and useless.

>>16671174

TP isn't bad, I just don't really see the point of it as a game, when you can play OOT, and OOT is better.

>>16671166

>Did people actually want unbreakable weapons in BotW?

Yes. The weapon degradation system is absolute dog shit as it is. It completely saps the feelings that you should get from picking up a cool, unique weapon when you know it'll barely get you through one fight before breaking. Loot essentially has no meaning. You fight to use weapons, break them and get more weapons.

>>16671186

Fair enough. I still like it as a separate game but I see your point.

>>16671177

So just make it more like the firs game.

Where you can go to the last dungeon but you'll get rekt until you get better weapons/stuff.

>>16671133

Maybe if I was less bodily abled then the controls would feel more challenging. The problem is you can abuse the fuck out of exploiting the AI in combat by short shaking the controller with high sensitivity to spam slash that angle. Also the game doesn't register thrusts well in my existence. And when it did register in situations where I thought I could use the thrust I was punished for it. One to one motion is a fun concept.

However I don't think the technology was quite ready. With TP on Wii I had to remind myself shaking the controller is pressing B on Gamecube. With Skyward Sword I had to remind myself that the Wii Motion Plus can only register motion a certain way: tilting and swinging. Motion plus adds a third axis so controllers can detect relative position to origin. They with wonderful on Joycons and Wii u gamepad. However with Wii Remotes even motion plus is funky and I got the black all in one controller. This could be the game accommodating the old Wii Remotes that don't have motion plus built in. All in one is miles better than whatever that dildo extender was. How you swing your sword is by angling the blade in the spot you want to swing, then swing. I get this is the concept behind katana sword fighting in Wii Sports Resort. However when using a western sword and board you need to watch your counter balance as twisting your wrist right and elbows right is how you cut as well as sqeezing the handle. You were swinging a one handed sword in a way you swing a two handed sword with too little room to change angles quickly. That's why the game has slower paced combat to accomodate the limitations of controls as much as the full retaed Wii audience (that bought iPhones to play Angry Birds and Fruit Ninja).

>>16671167

But I have runes I can use when the weapons break. Less shit weapons and more quality ones is more ideal, even without repair, because runes.

Does anyone else think that both botw and MGS 5 were basically rip-offs of far cry 2?

All 3 had:

>Minimalistic soundtrack, desolate post collapse world's, lack of large urban environments.

>Autistic attention to details, especially physics and sound engineering

>All 3 had no meaningful allies or NPCs to help you, gave a "you're on your own vibe" (especially if you don't use quiet on mgs5)

>All felt like tech demos for new technology.

What I think it ruined a little bit the experience in mgs5 compared to mine in far cry 2, was the overuse of quick travel by helicopter, far cry 2 forced you to explore the world to go to point a to point b and it was a adventure of its own.

>>16671199

Wouldn't Stalker be the first game of that type?

>>16671202

Yes? I'm not familiar with it.

(I've watched the movie though, beautiful)

>>16670950

>they'll listen to fan feedback

THAT'S THE PROBLEM

The team that works on Zelda DOES listen to fan feedback. TOO MUCH. To the point of overcorrecting and creating new problems. That's why BOTW even happened in the first place.

>>16671240

What qualifies a Zelda game, then? Is Zelda 2 not a Zelda game? Is Zelda 1 not a Zelda game? Is Link's Awakening not a Zelda game? Is Majora's Mask not a Zelda game? The 3d games are so different from LttP that they shouldn't qualify as Zelda games either.

>>16670865

a true to form 3d zelda game as far as level design/progression would be dark souls, not botw.

>>16671262

zelda set the standsrd for top down 2d. zelda 2 for sidescrolling 2d. and oot for 3d.

the progression style is what defines the game. using your logic musuo zelda is azelda game

>>16671268

But Dark Souls is just OoT, if OoT had fifty pages of edgy lore, every environment was the same, every enemy had 10x HP and the only combat strategy was rolling.

>>16671276

In that case, Zelda 1, 2 and Wind Waker are not Zelda games because they're too open and the progression is too different because of that.

>>16670630

It's a solid 7/10 game and would have received that score without the Zelda brand on it. After all the hype and the lengthy dev process it was honestly a letdown. It's still an okay game but nowhere near the praise it gets. Its strongest point is its physics engine and new powerups. Hopefully we get better use out of those in the sequel, along with some actual dungeons and temples this time.

>>16671281

Dark Souls is mechanically more of a Metroidvania in 3D, with a leveling system borrowed from Western RPGs.

>>16671174

>stupid water dragon

What? Skyward Sword didn't have a water dragon boss.

>>16671166

They could have balanced it like an RPG, where the good drops come from enemies you can't beat until you have better gear. The only enemies on the whole map that are a threat are the lynels and the guardians. 90% of the enemies you face are weak and boring.

I always compared this game to Xenoblade Chronicles X. XCX was an open world, but there were places off limits because the enemies were too strong. So you got better gear and leveled up until you could deal with those enemies. There's no progression in BotW. You can go wherever you want, and there's not much stopping you from going to the place with the best gear in the game and getting in as soon as possible. Which is why the stupid durability mechanic exists. Because there's no progression, you can get the best items in the game early and ruin the game.

The entire problem with BotW is there's no progression. All you do is make your stamina circle bigger and get more hearts. Even all the dungeons only cut the final boss's health. There's no feeling of "wow I got the hookshot I can finally get to that place I saw a while ago and couldn't get to". It's just "you can climb, go climb stuff" from the start.

I didn't feel any different 5 hours into the game than I did 30 hours into the game. There's no progression, no feeling of reward. They tried to cover up the fact that there's no progression and everything is thrown at you by adding durability so those good items you get 3 hours into the game don't float you through the rest of the game. And the progression is just artificial with cutscenes and the story. I was told BotW was awesome by some friends and I had to play it. It wasn't a bad game, but it was massively disappointing. They could have done so much more with that engine and the whole game has no progression.

>>16671281

the progression style in those games is typical and unchanged by level design.

>>16671166

Just don't put that fucking weapon in the game then or gate it properly behind a puzzle or a hard enough boss.

>>16671162

TP sucked because Aonuma was behind it and even if he were a competent developer it still would have sucked because his heart simply was not in it.

He was forced to make TP ie realistic Zelda after his Wind Waker bait and switch turd rightly bombed.

If you put an actual Zelda fan like Kozuimi behind TP's development it would've turned out awesome and been remembered fondly today instead of half the fanbase saying they liked it and the other half saying it was dog turd.

>>16671303

>Divine Beasts

>Dungeons

pick one

>>16671320

Talking about the dragon you have to help, I never called it a boss, anon.

>>16671303

BOTW needed a lot more towns, a lot more interesting NPC's, the ability to spawn a horse wherever you are as OOT did it years and years and years ago and BTW where the fuck are all the monkeys in the goddamned jungle area where you get the fruit that boosts your health?

Even LTTP on SNES's shitty engine could manage at least one monkey to help you.

Anyway yeah the game could've also used 8 or 9 dungeons instead of all those shitty, boring as fuck Aonuma puzzle shrines.

>>16671303

>If you didn't want to avoid enemies then why did you climb the mountains to avoid them you dumb nigger.

Because the enemy battles weren't worth the time and it was usually easier to completely avoid them. You could just cut out huge parts of the game and save time by not following paths and climbing instead. You can climb most of Hyrule Castle and skip a ton of shit, and it's not even difficult to do.

Why would I bother fighting enemies? I have decent gear, I could end up breaking my good gear and then replacing it with worse gear. There comes a point in BotW where engaging enemies can cause you to lose your good gear because it breaks, and the drops from beating those enemies are worst than what you had. So you spend time to get shittier gear.

>>16671552

So you're asking the game to let you do less so that you could then be given those abilities later in the game, for them to only be used for one puzzle and forgotten?

>>16671528

>muhnuma

Change the record, nigger. His track record isn't much better or worse than anyone else's. He made Majora's Mask and Wind Waker.

>>16671541

This

I hate most of what Anouma has brought to the table. I hate that Zelda being a princess was not special snowflake-y enough and he decided to make her a fucking goddess. Now there's people who think she was the first and the three goddesses where inferior to her.

Fucking hell.

>>16671552

>There comes a point in BotW where engaging enemies can cause you to lose your good gear because it breaks, and the drops from beating those enemies are worst than what you had. So you spend time to get shittier gear.

Fucking THIS

>>16671560

>He made Majora's Mask and Wind Waker.

wasn't Koizumi the one who wrote MM's story, though?

I won't comment on WW 'cause I got to the tower of gods and just dropped it.

>>16671569

>I hate that Zelda being a princess was not special snowflake-y enough and he decided to make her a fucking goddess. Now there's people who think she was the first and the three goddesses where inferior to her.

That was Fujibayashi, he co-wrote and directed Skyward Sword and also directed BOTW, which is why there are so many SS callbacks in particular (Hylia Statues, the Goddess Springs, the Forgotten Temple, etc)

>>16671584

Did he do the same for WW? That would explain a lot.

Absolutely not. It has nothing in common with Zelda.

>>16671584

SS was made before Hyrule Hystoria came out, and essentially exists solely to put every game together in a timeline. It's why SS is at the very beginning, too, to retroactively set all the events of the series into place.

>>16670649

Wrong. It has noting in common with any Zelda game at all. It's pure (((Western))) cancer wrapped in Zelda skins.

>>16671593

He directed the Oracle games, Four Swords, Minish Cap, SS and BOTW but he was a writer for Oracles, MC, Phantom Hourglass and SS. It's obvious that he really likes using the elements as themes in his Zeldas (changing seasons, dungeons themed after major elements in MC and FS, etc) so it makes sense that he would put such an emphasis on them for BOTW's physics engine

>>16671596

I didn't say otherwise

>>16671599

It has more to do with Zelda 1 than any other game in the series by far. But of course, you get to dictate what is and isn't Zelda based on what you like. A game you like is Zelda. A game you don't like isn't Zelda. I don't like BotW either but don't pretend like LttP or OoT is in any way similar to Zelda 1.

>>16670726

I almost never had to recalibrate. Played with wii motion plus.

>>16671610

Zelda 1 had NINE challenging, rewarding dungeons that could destroy you if you didn't have the right gear, it restricted where you could go at some points and the exploration was actually rewarding.

Most of you "BotW is like Zelda 1" people sound like you never played the fucking game.

>>16671603

Weird, I love half of those and the other half is a big meh for me.

Its a open world exploration game with zelda cameos.

>>16670719

> The only good part of the game is exploring the world with nothing in it.

Isn't that the only part of the game?

>>16671619

Strange, that sounds exactly like BotW to me, for at least the first half of the game. Meanwhile, I can't think of a single game since and including LttP that posed much of a challenge, regardless of gear. And the only thing that exploration gave you in any of those is hearts, serving only to make the game easier than it already was.

What restrictions did Zelda 1 have, really? Aside for one dungeon that needed the raft to access and the stepladder to get across a gap, and entering level 9?

And I can assume that Majora's Mask is not Zelda because it had 4 dungeons, right?

>>16671166

That's like saying the Goron's Sword broke Ocarina of time.

>>16671636

>Strange, that sounds exactly like BotW to me

So you didn't play the game, gotcha.

You only had to say that, anon.

>>16670865

I hate that you interspersed your bait with good points, it just means people will throw the whole argument out and dicksuck BotW.

>>16671643

There's no point, it's obvious you didn't play either game, so whatever

>anime reaction image

how appropriate

>>16671539

>though fuck having to fight the imprisoned three times and that stupid water dragon

Could've fooled me from how you worded this sentence.

Besides, I'm surprised that you hated the water dragon but not the fire dragon. Collecting underwater tadtones in a flooded forest was a pretty fun section with interesting visuals imo. Much much better than being forced to climb up a mountain in a mandatory stealth section. Fucking hated that level.

>>16671656

Sorry, was half asleep when I wrote that.

Yeah, that was pretty annoying and I never minded the tadtones (I really like that part, honestly)

What I hated was the fact that Link has helped the water dragon so many times at that point that she shouldn't need to give him more challenges to make sure he's the hero, yet she does.

The other two dragons just look at him and go "right, here's my part of the song"

>>16671655

>whining about anime

Where do you think you are you cumguzzling newfaggot?

>>16671276

Zelda Musou is unironically more of a Zelda game than BotW could ever hope to be.

>>16671302

Metroidvanias are often described as 2D Zelda games. IGA claimed not to know of Metroid and that Zelda was his main inspiration.

>>16671541

It was a neat tech demo with cool physics. Best thing you could say about the game.

>>16671753

Jesus.

>>16670760

I haven't tested my theory, but I think using a controller with a wii motion plus adapter might've been the problem. I used a newer controller with it built in and played it many times without issue. either that or the brain dead among us didn't know how to swing the sword and got upset that it didn't detect differences in small wrist movements.

like >>16670722 said, the handholding was the worst part. they could've cut out 80% of dialogue (even made fi a near silent assistant) and the game would've still been fine.

back on topic, I think botw flaws have already been discussed at length in the thread, so I'll just say I hope we get a dark world perhaps. either that or give us an expansive underground to explore. having the same overworld, while fine, would make potential customers to just buy botw 2 because it's the same game + content.

>>16671753

>CDi games have more enemy variety than BotW

How the fuck?

>>16671783

>How the fuck

Most of the enemies in both of the games just float around or shoot projectiles, really standard shit. All they needed to add new enemies was a set of sprites. Not to defend how bare-bones BotW is, but Faces of Evil and Wand of Gamelon aren't exactly technical marvels either.

>>16671707

>BOTW was just fucking that a tech demo

Well, you gotta cut Nintendo some slack. Rather than rehashing a new Zelda game based on the traditional Zelda formula, BotW was the first time they attempted this radically different style of gameplay for a new Zelda. Although rough around the edges, BotW was an experimental game where the devs didn't polish an existing formula, but had to create the foundation of how an "open world 3D Zelda" should play like from scratch.

That said, now that BotW 1 is done setting up this new foundation, I suppose that the development for BotW 2 will go a lot smoother. 2 won't feel like a "demo" because the devs can now focus more on polishing and jampacking it with content.

After all, the original Zelda 1 was rough around the edges too, but then the formula it introduced got polished to perfection with its successor. A Link to the Past.

>>16671792

>LttP

<refined

If casualizing the game to shit and turning half the exploration into busywork is refinement, then sure, but I can go without said refinement. A real refinement of Zelda 1 would be Link's Awakening, which had its own set of problems but was certainly better than LttP.

>>16671792

> 2 won't feel like a "demo" because the devs can now focus more on polishing and jampacking it with content.

And it'll only cost another 60 dollarydoos, if you were stupid enough to pay for said demo

>>16671792

>2 won't feel like a "demo" because the devs can now focus more on polishing and jampacking it with content.

But they have no reason to. All the knuckle dragging normalfags loved BotW, because they finally made a Zelda game more like Skyrim. Nintendo has no reason to change the game when it was the best selling Zelda game ever.

>After all, the original Zelda 1 was rough around the edges too, but then the formula it introduced got polished to perfection with its successor. A Link to the Past.

Nintendo of 20 years ago is dead. They're no different from any other AAA game company now, just trying to appease share holders, meet their financial forecasts, and wring every penny they can out of people by tying DLC to McDonalds toys.

>>16671813

Twilight Princess was a great game, no wonder I liked it much better than BotW

I was about to complain because I thought Dead Sword was in the "Bosses" section, then realized that's the "Mini Bosses" second row.

Wow

>>16671166

Either remove it or make it so that you can repair weapons and have them last for more than 20-30 hits.

>>16670865

>It is to Switch what Halo was to the original Xbox ie the only reason to buy the console.

Shut up faggot Ninja Gaiden Black was and forever will be an incredible game. On to your points on this game though. I haven't played it but the way you describe this game makes me think BOTW is in actuality extremely overrated by critics and even regular people that played, reviewed or discuss this game as if it is the second coming of Christ. Now I never get the impression it is bad, it is good in fact. But just not GOAT type of good.

Also I get the impression that you are essentially saying that whatever Zelda is supposed to have been was defined in the NES era and virtually all other Zelda games after that have been doing it wrong. Also makes me think you are basically implying Zelda is actually supposed to have been like the Souls games in concept. Where you really just explore an interesting world, get challenged in dungeons and have plenty of enemies to fight. That is basically the entirety of what Souls is about only Souls actually mixes things up a lot with unique weapons and magics to use.

One other point not related to Zelda. Skyrim's exploration got kind of lame to me after awhile since its the same old damn shit over and over with boring dungeons and too many enemies that are the same damn thing. Those Dragur's or whatever they are called were practically always around and it gets old. I think Morrowind and Oblivion did variety way better. Skyrim's towns are also extremely forgettable outside the main town where Stormcloak or whatever his name is resides. Besides that though Skyrim does look much better than the games before it graphically and it is still a good game as well.

>>16671569

Until Fujabayashi came along the only person that really gave much of a damn for providing Zelda any story whatsoever was Koizume.

Miyamoto wasn’t very interested in story or lore creation for the series and so Koizume literally had to fight to get as much story into Zelda as possible.

I consider his stuff canon and all the Aounuma/Fujabayashi Hyrule Historia nonsense to be retconned bullshit meant for Wind Waker tards and related millenial trash that grew up on Aounuma’s garbage to gobble up mindlessly, like a bunch of mindless ants to an opened terro cannister.

Mind you I do like the idea of Zelda as a goddess, but at the same time, I don’t like it because it is a Fujabayashi retcon rendering the original three goddesses purpose for existance null and void, but hey retconning seems to be the thing around Nintendo these days for some strange reason ie they gave Bowser completely different kids in the newer games and completely forgot his Super Mario 3 Brothers children existed at all for another example of this.

Also that Koizume probably wrote both MM and WW stories isn’t a bad thing or says anything bad about him as a developer at all.

The problem wasn’t those games stories after all but Aounuma’s shit tier execution of said stories similar to how D&D fucked up the last season of Game of Thrones.

MM= world about to end from falling evil moon= badass story

MM killed as a fun concept by shitty puzzle based Aounuma gameplay and boring as fuck overworld.

WW= Link is trapped in Kevin Costner’s Waterworld…ok, ok so not a great story but still salvageable if executed properly as a game.

Whoops! Aounuma goes and fucks it up as much as possible with horrid down syndrome patient drawing tier effort of ugly as fuck graphical artstyle complete with a hideous chibi abomination paint blotch stand in for Link…nooo thank you ma’am!

RE-JECTED!!!

Well that and the actual gameplay sucked as it was far and away too easy and I’m sure we all remember the dedicated win button.

>>16672112

>ie they gave Bowser completely different kids in the newer games and completely forgot his Super Mario 3 Brothers children existed at all for another example of this.

What? One of the major complaints of how samey the NSMB games were was that Wii, 2 and U all had the koopalings (yes, the Bowser kids from 3 and World) as the bosses. They were also added into Smash and Mario Kart 8.

It's just that Bowser now has Bowser Jr. in addition to them. Are you referring to that dumbass Miyamoto comment about how the Koopalings aren't really Bowser's kids? Because if that's what we're taking as canonical, then Mario's not a plumber either.

>>16671631

You can do some shitty copy pasted shrines, all 120 of them. There were 4 or 5 good shrines? The rest were total ass.

>>16672038

Listen bro you and I essentially agree on most if not everything.

I’m an old fag which should help you understand my mentality better I hope?

This means I’m not a millenial hipster faggot obsessed with irony or sarcasm.

What I say is basically what I mean.

I’m not playing irony games when I say stuff on here.

Like if I were to say the DOTR for Wind Waker pedophiles can’t come soon enough you have to understand that I really mean that.

So understand me clearly when I say to you now that BOTW is the best most authentic Zelda game that we’ve had in years.

Also I love Ninja Gaiden on Xbox myself but did it ever really classify itself as a system seller like say a SSBM or Metal Gear or Halo series has done for the various consoles?

Remember theres games that sell well and then there are games that become cultural phenomenons.

Was any Ninja Gaiden game ever made any kind of cultural phenomenon?

I rest my case.

You and I might like it, the game might even qualify as a sales success but its not what causes console units to fly off of shelves at warp speed.

>>16672159

>The entire post is plebbit spaced.

>I’m an old fag.

Sure.

Yes, but since they decided to port it to the switch they should have delayed it, most of the mechanics in it are criminally underused.

>>16672159

>So understand me clearly when I say to you now that BOTW is the best most authentic Zelda game that we’ve had in years.

It's not even close to the first game. Try again.

>>16672038

The way you describe the Dark Souls games is exactly how the Zelda series should be and was from its start in its first three proper games on NES and SNES.

Not saying the execution should be the same ie both games have a different feel in gameplay, but yeah Zelda was from its inception based around arcade combat and light RPG elements and only got away from heavy combat and heavy magic useage when the hack Aounuma fully took over beginning with Majora’s Mask.

Yes I know he worked on OOT but was simply one of its four total director’s and he was responsible for the elements in that game that pro Wind Waker faggots pretend they hate the most to try and make Wind Waker look better than it.

Aounuma made the hated Water Temple and all other dungeons in OOT and it was Aounuma who was directly responsible for Navi’s constant “Hey listen!” nagging/handholding.

Anyway the only reason Souls, Witcher and Skyrim were able to get so much traction is because they filled the void/vacuum that Nintendo had left by no longer making real Zelda games (at least until BOTW appeared that is).

This is also why fan games of 2D Metroid and Mario keep popping up ie because Nintendo refuses to fill this niche/need themselves.

Yeah Mario Maker is good and all but its not a true sequel to SMB3 which long time oldschool Nintendo fans have been craving for over 20 years now and the NSMB games are made half assedly by Nintendo’s B team developers and don’t count either.

Miyamoto is bitter that no one wants his shitty 3D Mario but he’ll just continue forcing it down our throats until the Nintendo shareholders get sick of losing money, tell him enough is enough and to make a real high quality 2D Mario game as they did with Aounuma and Zelda which resulted in Nintendo bringing in the Xenogears team or whatever that game was called to build BOTW’s game world.

>>16672189

This is how oldfags post millenial queer.

>>16672201

Nintendo literally built its concept from a slightly updated NES Zelda engine.

Continue to deny reality all you like but BOTW literally went back to Zelda’s roots.

>>16672218

>Miyamoto is bitter that no one wants his shitty 3D Mario but he’ll just continue forcing it down our throats until the Nintendo shareholders get sick of losing money

This is some of the most delusional shit I've read here in awhile. Your views in general are dumb as fuck.

>>16672221

-15/10; there's no bait, there's no hook, there's no rod, you're not even within 100 miles of a body of water.

>>16671800

>They're no different from any other AAA game company now, just trying to appease share holders, meet their financial forecasts, and wring every penny they can out of people by tying DLC to McDonalds toys.

And with Iwata dead, cater to commies, queers, trannies, and childfuckers.

>>16672284

I think he's too busy trying to hook the fisher hole owner's hat.

>>16672226

It went as far from zelda's roots as it possibly could.

>>16670630

New formula is great, biggest change needed is to put more of an emphasis on planning, having potion or meal effects not be instantaneous, and only allowing the player change their equipment at specific points instead of in the middle of an action, reducing the players inventory but allowing the horse to store some equipment would be a good change, that way players who come up to an obstacle will need to plan how they will tackle it instead of allowing them to change to suit the needs of their task at any moment.

At that point you can start to lather on detail, not quests or equipment or even enemies, more simulation would be good, more weapon related abilities like being able to block melee attacks with a polearm, or skewering downed enemies with a polearm. I'm not really interested in girth of quests, or enemy types if they overlap, Like like's would be nice, but you could just allow Lizalfos to steal weapons with their tounges, or crows to pick up dropped weapons and fly away with them, and you'd already be creating a more interesting enemy than a like like ever was.

When playing I didn't even care much about quests, I was more interested in spotting things in the distance and trying to figure out what they were, so more things like that would be great, not everything needs to be a king of the mountain thing, but something small like telling stories through environmental design, or scraps of paper that point to a new recipe, and a way to store and collect these recipes outside of the photo album would be great, small rewards with subjective value like this really help bring the world to life.

The main dungeon design philosophy in the game is excellent, and more larger dungeons that are interactive machines would be absolutely excellent.

I know that we will never see these changes, and people asking for more checklisted content will get their way, as well as the removal of non permanent weaponry will get their way, but it's always fun to just consider these things.

>>16671166

Why didn't they just do a copy of Monster Hunter where it loses its sharpness? So it does less damage if you don't keep it sharp or not repaired. It could also "break" and become unusable. But let's say you ignore the sharpness going red and still use it in battle. It "breaks" but you managed to defeat the enemy you used it for to kill. Now you have to take it to a smith, who fixes it but at a heafty price. You don't lose the weapon forever but you can't use it anymore if you don't keep the sharpness up and repairs up and it "breaks".

>>16672338

None of his statements are especially wrong, the problem is that he's just spewing sean malstrom blog opinions ad nauseum so he ends up saying retarded shit like >>16672226 without an extra thought of the context.

To this day I do not understand why the fuck people enjoy BoTW. It's a time sink game with a bunch of mechanics that barely function cohesively together. It's what I would play if I wanted to waste time, not actually engage and challenge myself like vidya should.

>>16672855

Zelda 2 and MM SHOULD have been new IP's though. Now we have fanboys who will play anything with Zelda in the title and a fucked up timeline.

>>16672871

The weapon system exists partially to get players to think outside the box, and use the environment and other tools effectively, also it ties into the games main theme that nothing lasts forever, which, or I guess everything fades away, although the game fails on multiple fronts with this, things like the constant cycles for the story, and then enemies that don't become more aggressive, or just hit harder, or have additional tactics, or are able to command other units more effectively, they just get more health, easily the worst decision they made with with the enemies in the game.

A weapon solution where weapons don't eventually die is pointless, ignoring the master sword, but that's entirely because it's the master sword, and they handle that shit poorly. What you would ideally do is give the player a tool that can restore durability to a weapon at low durability, but at the cost of it's maximum durability, eventually it will always have 1 use left and will break, there is no saving it, but a favored weapon can be held onto just that little bit longer.

>>16670630

It is a bad zelda instalment, a good standalone game with some successful experimentation and a bit of bad experimentation. It didn't deserve to be a zelda game, but it would probably have tanked without the brand.

>>16673014

Weapon durability isn't needed to incite players to use the environment in enemies. Dropping a boulder on a group from 500 feet away is always going to be safer and more effective than running in and taking everything down one at a time. If BotW had any semblance of difficulty (that Nintendo didn't expect you to pay extra for), there would be plenty of incentive to use the environment just because its safer than direct combat. And if Nintendo is really trying to embrace the whole open world "play however you want, everything works" meme, then they shouldn't be using weapon durability to twist players' arms into playing a certain way. If the game wants to incite players to explore and collect, repairing weapons still works for that because it's just another resource sink.

Saying permanent weapon destruction is OK because it fits the game's theme is just pathetic. Game mechanics come first, story, theme, graphics, the world, and absolutely everything else are built around mechanics. Any other method eventually leads to the AAA The Last of Us type garbage that are 30% game, 70% movie.

Zelda games have always had sense of excitement whenever you get a new item. Every players' eyes perk up when they walk into a room and see the big chest. BotW threw all that out by giving the player a grand total of 4 tools within the first 30 minutes, and never expanding on them in any meaningful way. Finding new weapons could have been the game's one saving grace, but permanent breakage negates any of that, because there's no excitement in finding the most badass sword of all time when you know it's made of paper mache and will be gone after 5 minutes of use.

>>16673306

It's not about being safer or more or less practical. It's about a player seeing a boulder on a cliff and enemies below and going "I wonder if this'll work…" before trying it out. It's almost always without fail categorically WORSE to use the environment because it's flaky, unreliable, and really doesn't do that much damage at all.

The only reason to do it is because it's fun.

>>16673306

>however you want, everything works" meme, then they shouldn't be using weapon durability to twist players' arms into playing a certain way.

If they had any brains they would have designed a number of different enemies that can only be defeated by certain tactics, like pretty much every single zelda game that came before. Instead, pretty much anything can be defeated with a sword/arrow to the face and instead of realizing this is a dumb idea they punish the player for using the path of least resistance.

>>16671387

>The fundamental progression of unlocking more meaningful abilities throughout the game is broken

but that was never originally fundamentally Zelda. In fact that linearity is what lead to the game series to start to die because recycling the payed out puzzles and dungeon was boring. That is why games like Zelda 2 and Majora's Mask where held in high regard because it broke with the shitty trend.

>>16673990

>everyone is reddit

Hi FBI-chan. Thanks for killing 8channel.

>>16673990

The idiocy genius of this post is that you can't figure out which ones are supposed to be the people he doesn't like redditors, so everyone has a chance to be angry.

BOTW should have had atleast one lousy fucking town in it instead of 4 villages.

>>16674082

Instead of bothering with whining about what it ought to have been, now that we know we have a DIRECT SEQUEL, let’s whine about what we want the sequel to be, but which it will never be because doing so would be too much fun and make too much sense.

For example, I (would have wanted) BotW2 to include a rebuilding mechanic. We can pretend that Hyruleans were trapped in their two little towns and at their stables (somehow never attacked or whatever) by the constant regeneration of enemies. Now that Calamity Ganon is gone, they can actually start to rebuild. Hyrule Castle is devastated and likely doesn’t have resources or “funding” of its own anymore, but that’s not really relevant. I want Link to be able to clear out a region, go tell someone about it, and the next time you’re there, you see those people setting up camp and starting to rebuild ruined houses. You can do rupee quests to help them get supplies or whatever, and eventually entire towns are brought back to life, including Hyrule Castle Town. Eventually enemies are actually CLEARED OUT of an area for good, because people are living there and it’s defended now. WON’T HAPPEN THOUGH.

>>16674094

We only have a teaser, which does start on the right track with a dungeon. Really scary as balls monster in a dark cave. That's pretty damn zelda.

Should've been a new nintendo IP but nintendo is too scared to do this or even use an IP that hasnt been touched since the Famicom days

>>16673306

The problem is that no matter which route you take, you lose. If you add unique dungeon items like in previous Zeldas, they are going to be throwaway, bonus bullshit, perhaps needed to get two or three korok seeds and nothing more. And if they were mandatory to finish the story, immediately, you throw away the whole premise of going wherever and doing whatever you want. I like the idea of being able to beat Ganon within an hour or so of starting the game if you're good enough. It's an open world game with actual fucking freedom. You implement mandatory dungeon items and you might as well have Wind Waker - it's big, open, empty, boring, getting places takes half an hour, and there is no reason for it since you're going from point A to point B anyway, so it might as well be a hallway.

There is a way I could see implementing this, however. I don't think there's anything wrong with making areas harder, full of tough enemies and brutal if you're unprepared - as long as it is possible to beat it if you're good enough, and it's not an invisible wall until you get the magic hookshot or whatever other bullshit you need. For weapons, as long as repairs are demanding (and not piss-easy like everyone in this thread seems to want), sure. Perhaps needing to go to a forge or something like that, and needing a lot of materials to repair one - the more damage, the more materials you need.

To not break the game, good weapons need to be put behind difficult shrines/dungeons. Since weapons don't break anymore, they all need to be unique, and an easy way to diversify ten nearly-identical swords would be to, one, make them look different, and two, give them some unique attributes - one perhaps does way more damage against a certain type of enemy, and another has a small chance of setting the enemy on fire or some shit. The important thing here would be to make it so that weapons could still break. Not as easily as BotW, but still possible to break. It would be good encouragement to repair weapons, and would also fulfill the idea of experimentation, as you'd be forced to use something else when your weapon's close to breaking.

This would also mean that the game would have to be much, much harder than it was, and that's not really a problem either.

The essential problem is that you need to give the player hundreds of weapons and they need to be unique every single time, to get the player excited. It's a lot of work, but not unreasonable for BotW2, considering how much that game is supposed to be reusing from the first.

>>16674094

Interesting how, for all the "BotW is not Zelda" posts in this thread, opinions like this get a free pass. That sounds as far removed from Zelda as fucking anything can be.

>>16674143

What the fuck is Splatoon?

>>16674090

>When your "paragraph" is 1-line long then you're a retarded illiterate redditor.

Projection has gotten cliche. I just said that what you wrote was reddit spacing you dumb nigger, but most of the thread isn't that.

>>16674094

I want to have a harem of wives. Paya and Riju a cute. Bitch princess won't let me.

>>16674146

I think there can be two things done with weapons of a same class: Form and material type. The material is the base of the weapon's innate properties: durability, sharpness, elemental damage, etc. The complication of weapons will come from it's form for properties in combat.

But first: What is a weapon classification? A weapon classification is a group of weapons that share similar fighting styles and moves. Since my idea is melee weapons being as interchangeable as items in combat I have the following classes: Dagger, One-Hand Blade, Two-Hand Blade, One-Hand Hafted (axe and hammer), Two-Hand Hafted, Spear, Staff, Buckler, Shield, Tower Shield, and Unarmed. Yes, I'm classifying shield as a weapon because you can dual weild spiked bucklers and smash if you want. Each of these weapons have a moveset by pressing the corresponding weapon button with how you move. zR deflects with a shield. If no shield is present you parry. If you have no weapon to parry, you grapple. You can also grapple after a successful parry.

But those are clearly different weapon forms. Why not call classes forms? Simple: Not every weapon in the class has the same combat properties. An example would be a White Sword, which is an all-round 1H broadsword vs a Gerudo Scimitar, a slashing weapon. When you thrust (Forward Attack) with a scimitar your attack is slower and easily parried. Also the move doesn't impact your enemy and deals less damage than slicing. Compared to the White Sword when you thrust, the quick attack will hurt the enemy quite a bit forcing them to backstep. You can then follow up the opening with a slice. The scimitar is an agressive weapon that can easily knock away small shields, sidestep, and killslash. Scimitar works great with a dagger to get in quick stabs, which scimitar lacks, at the expense of some mobility. White Sword is best paired with a shield as it's more defensive. It can be used two-handed like a longsword when you put away your shield. These two weapons are the same class but their forms give them different advantages and disadvantages in combat.

Repairs are possible with forges that are limited. Though keep in mind the more you repair a weapon the higher chance it's max sharpness and durability will decline. Eventually you will have to scrap your weapon as it becomes to impractical to repair. You can throw it to dispose of it or you can scrap it for materials.

Also how fun would it be to reforge the Master Sword into a completely different weapon: Like the Master Spear or the Master Hammer?

>>16674256

see you took the simplest system in BotW and turned it into a clusterfuck that took you 4 paragraphs to explain.

>>16674267

That "simplest system" probably has more than four paragraphs describing it in Nintendo's design document

>>16674291

How obvious is it that this botw sequel will be the same map but with more calamity goop covering it?

>>16674355

Still waiting on Skyward Sword HD

>>16674365

Nintendo isn't following a trend. they've always done this with Zelda.

>>16674365

There was no real need for it, but it's grown on me. It'll be nice to play the game with more than two buttons to work with.

>>16674417

The fact that the trailer took place in an underground cavern makes me think they're going to develop a whole subterranean world to compliment the original map.

>>16674267

If the system is too simple then players will get bored quickly. Keep in mind most depth is for the players to figure out on their own. In practice it's more complicated to explain than play.

How to use weapons is easy. First, equip weapon. Then press Y to attack. Press zR to block. How you attack is like in Ocarina of Time except more in tune with your steps. Step forward, backwards, left, right, or still with left sticj and you get different attacks. A one-handed sword will swing differently than a one-handed hammer. That's classes. And if two swords look different and swing the same then some swords are better at thrusting while others are for slicing. That's forms.

The material is the difference between a Wooden Sword and an Traveler's Sword. Both have similar durability. Wooden Sword is made from Lumber, a shit striking material better for building and firewood. It's cheap but always degrades when repaired. Wooden swords are sold to children as toys thus their cheap price and abundance. Traveler's Sword is made from Iron Ore, much more rare than wood but abundant enough to be common. Iron is a material easy to repair. However Traveler's Sword is a weapon so the price is triple to that of the Wooden Sword. And you maybe restricted from buying one. So you may have to contract a blacksmith to forge a weapon.

Already with material quality we can see examples of game depth through scarcity and rarity on the drop side. For a player playing the game for the first time iron is better than wood. Does the player have to know the ins and outs of the materials starting out? No. But the player does learn these materials over time the more they work with tool creation and general use.

If you want to keep the durability system for weapons and crafting then you need some depth to make it interesting. Otherwise take disposable weapons out and just have the usual infinite use Zelda tools.

Honest question here. How long before link is black? It WILL happen.

>>16674512

I would guess they're not going to bring back the same shrines, so a big interconnected underground zone could be the replacement. You could even write it into the plot that the Shrines all crumble away, and the holes left in the Earth are the entrances that lead you underground.

>>16674363

Would their pride allow them to rip all the waggle bullshit out?

>>16674525

Nope. Waggle is still required.

>>16674525

It would be quite hard to make the game work. A lot of the game is built around full motion control.

>>16674525

>>16674562

>Twilight Princes gets a Wii Port

<"OMFG CAN YOU DO WAGGLIN BULLSHIT IN IT?!"

>Uhh, sure… here we'll mirror the whole game so link seems right handed.

<it sucks

>make SS from the ground up support the (intended) 1:1 swordplay

<works 95% of the time, by which we mean inferior to a button press and not as lightning responsive as the game requires of you

It's really a victim of waggle retards in the first place.

>>16674618

It was a fun gimmick for one game. Don't know why people are so allergic to motion when it's well implemented.

>>16674631

I felt it was fine for SS. You had to be more deliberate and Girahim was a very enjoyable character.

>>16674643

The Ghirahim fights were really fun, along with a few others like the Ancient Cistern boss. You couldn't do that stuff if it was just button presses.

>>16674291

I don't think BotW's issues are because of its freedom. It one of the most likeable aspects of the game. The biggest blight of the game aren't the Blights, but the fucking difficulty of it. Once you get a grip of the controls, there is no reason to not go to the end and beat the shit out of Ganon because literally the best gear of the game is all located in Hyrule Castle. Even with modest gear, beating the four Blights is laughable.

Speaking of Hyrule Castle, the design of it is embarrassing. It should start off as extremely streamlined and nearly impenetrable, but optional routes, compartments, and equipment would be revealed by new runes, which would be collected from several dungeons across the map. Eventually, what was once a linear dungeon is now a labyrinth, and each time you enter something new is there for you. The map size is fine by the way, and shrinking it down wouldn't have to involve any sort of resizing to begin with. Fast travel would either have to be removed until late-game, attached to some fixed point like a gate, or have a certain radius. I'd probably have something like the last option if at all. This would force players to be far more considerate about where they go, what they want to do first. I'd include a postman like the runner from OoT that would let Link give updates to quest-givers all over the map as well and return the rewards. Having something like Tarreytown be this grand thing shown at the end would be really cool.

Now for things that'd I'd like to see. I would definitely like some kind of greater weapon variety in the sequel, but I'm not sure if you could do much with it. Definitely a rope weapon like a whip and and grappling hook with both behaving similarly but with different climbing and combat effectiveness, maybe some new kinds of bombs or make it so the bomb rune can contain different kinds of items (different types of Chuchu jelly would give the respective effect, filling it up with Octo balloons would give a chance of being able to attach them to an enemy so they'd fly away like Peace Walker, some sort of material could be used for a smoke bomb,) but I don't know if there'd be much else. Rather than weapon variety, different kinds of armor have different effects on how you use the weapons and movement tech. Like, the Shiekah armor would improve movement speed, allow for acrobatic movement, being able to vault with polearms, and swing around with the grapple hook/whip more effectively.

For a companion, I'd probably do a fairy again, except it'd actually be a fairy like Tinkerbell rather than just a ball of light and she'd have a crush on you that would become more evident the more you played. Wolf Link was kind of a dull addition and I never used him.

>>16674988

It honestly looks more like she'll be attacked by Mummydorf and Link will have to deal with whatever that ghost had did to him.

Maybe the ghost hand will be the new companion?

>>16672895

>None of his statements are especially wrong

Saying Dark Souls became popular only because Nintendo has failed to make "real" Zelda games is not only exceptionally wrong but completely inane. Souls became popular because of a confluence of several factors, including a lack of challenging games on the market and the over saturation of narrative railroading. Soul's novel approach to PvP and co-op was another big factor. None of those things have anything to do with Nintendo or Zelda.

>>16671166

I think any game with weapon breakage to the degree that BotW has should have a stand-by side-arm like a short sword or a straight sword, something that's better than the weaker shit but worse than the really good, high level shit. Really, Sekiro did Zelda better than most of the recent games have been;

>Main character with his sword, that's his main damage dealer, gathers side arms that are designed to exploit certain weaknesses and have specialty uses

>tons of enemies with unique weaknesses that aren't required to be exhausted, but are definitely worth while to exploit for the sake of fun

>section to section you have your standby enemies, the weakest grunts from the beginning showing up as late as the endgame, but each area also has their own set of enemies with a unique style that is reflected with a set of combat arts you can obtain

>your enemy and goal is clear to you the moment you start the game, there's no strange side path that you are required to go to, there is a linear and straight shot through the whole game

>tons of secret sidequests for filling up your healthbar, in fours even

>the game isn't open world in the sense of an empty plain with caves splintered along, but you can constantly move back and forth through the world you've explored, looking through the nooks of all the areas to see where on your path you can dig into to find hidden bosses or secret shortcuts

Sekiro did a better job making a zelda title since after twilight princess.

>>16673985

zelda 2 is the best 2d rpg and the fact that it hasn't been remade or redone in 3d is a travesty

>>16675063

No, anon.

What if they go full FFVII remake and get rid of the healing prostitutes and change the RPG elements?

>>16675073

The modern game industry was a mistake, FF7 wasn't even that great.

>>16675075

All true but they didn't need to make it even worse with so many changes.

Sage because offtopic.

>>16674988

Can we put Zelda in cute outfits finally please?

>>16674365

>ff7

>art

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

pure cancer

>>16675116

I want to play dressup with both Zelda and Link and watch them be mortified by the frilly bullshit I force upon them.

>>16675090

>>16670661

I think the actual point is people will either hate something for being different to start or love something for being the same until they realize the flaws that come with the similarities or the actual good that comes from things being different. I loved TP from when it came out and I was looking at it with mostly fresh eyes, as someone who played a bit of zelda 1 and didn't enjoy it, played a lot of zelda 2 and never got anywhere, played assloads of OoT to the point where I did a 24 hour runthrough to beating the game 100% on an ungodly number of times beaten, and MM which I beat 100% once and never started a new game because I was able to just run through all the dungeons as many times as I liked, the side quest challenges being mostly trivial. I never played windwaker, but from what I've seen of it, it has what looks to be the problem that I had with SS, which was too much vehicle to get to the next part of the game, which is a problem that comes with making a map that tries to invoke a sense of largeness without taking into account the fact that your world map will either need to be condensed or you end up with so much free space that even if you splice hidden encounters in the nooks you get things where you can accidentally sail around them or the secrets are mostly meaningless to the player. OoT, Zelda 2, MM, TP, and even Zelda 1 all had a very direct path to the ending that wasn't hindered by the size of the map; everything was laid out and tested to be just the right size to feel like a lengthy adventure, but not so long that the player is slogging through an ungodly amount of dry space until the next refreshment of gameplay. It's fine that Hyrule has gone from being the size of a state to being around the size of a smaller/mid-sized country, but I think you lose a lot of focus on what the main concept of the fun of zelda is when you implement these trashy modern design elements of making every world completely open with no amount of linearity, or else your game will be called "narrow corridors: the game"

>Narrow corridors

the game presents these areas to you in such a way that despite being on a path that you choose, you're reminded that it is still a video game that was designed to be very straightforward. The problem that comes with open world is that you either have to plan for a player coming from literally any angle or make it so that there is so little care and effort put in that the player can just go in from any angle and it will be the exact same fight. In souls, the levels were designed for you going forward, and in some small instances, backwards, but those were the only two options in the first place, requiring you as a player to not only move around the area to get the better options with fighting enemies, but to also plan how you were going to fight individual enemies, since the game was very merciless about being dumb and fighting any more than 2 slightly strong enemies.

>chose which linear path to go on

The ending will always come at the end, the choices you make in the story never really matter, so I don't get why people complain about whether or not you're going straight forward to gameplay or if you're choosing which of 5 branches you're attacking first. OoT's level design was made in such a way that you can't progress unless you have the item from the last dungeon, so you necessarily could only move through the game if you beat each dungeon in order. Dark Souls has no hindrance items beyond the kiln and the fact that you need to collect all the souls before you can get to the last area, but if you got a key at the end of every boss that told you to go directly to a certain boss next I don't think there would be any big deal about it. It's cancerous to say, but if BotW was more like DS in level design, as far as the path forward is concerned, I'm sure it'd be a much better game; this isn't saying it should be a dark souls rehash, we don't need any more of those, but even something like Sekiro also follows a zelda style of level progression where you can go to a new area but won't get past it unless you get the key to the critical spot in the area for progression. BotW is way too open and it gives too much choice to the player, turning the game more into a time waster and collectathon rather than a Zelda game at the core.

Open world games aren't even terrible, you just need a vision for what the actual fuck your open world is in service to, like MGS V making literally afganistan and africa with outposts that had rotating security that made running directly in without being pumped full of lead a trial

TL;DR news flash: FROMsoft knows how to make a good RPG and made a Ninja Zelda game that BotW and most of the other newer zeldas could take a page out of for linearity

>>16675147

I'm hoping for a leafy fairy bikini dress for Zelda. I know it'll never happen because tumblr ruined video games.

>>16673306

Safety and effectiveness isn't the point, it's about how players interact with things. they use the term open air to describe the game, and the weapons system is part of that, to inspire moments of originality, it's completely intentional and works towards the games goals, your weapons breaking isn't a flaw, since you always have some way to deal damage, or can simply flee, or you can be direct and take what you want, if you want to kill something you should PREPARE for this. These are intentional gameplay elements, and they work as intended.

Game mechanics do come first, I already explained why they do this mechanically, and backed it up with developer statements, the themes of the game are part of this, and it all ties in. Breaking weaponry isn't bad, the problem is that enemies scale poorly

Red 13hp, Blue 72hp, Black 240hp, Silver 720hp, gold 1080hp, the scaling for basic enemy types health pools is the problem here, enemies should scale tactics and aggression, not health, but tactics is something hard to work through, a Silver Bokoblin should command other Bokoblins to work together, but they don't.

"sense of excitement"

Out the window that goes.

>4 tools

The game has more than that, a lot of functionality from former tools has been folded into equipment as well as the player, the bow is a staple tool in Zelda games but you don't count it even though it's used regularly in puzzle solving, the deku leaf while limited use is used for puzzle solving in multiple occassions but that isn't counted either. They are certainly lacking tools that's for sure, but a lot of tools lack mileage in even former zelda games, with too much overlap. For Breath of the Wild they should have at least made these extensions.

>camera can see the truth giving it the functionality of the lens of truth

>Add in the grappling hook allowing the player to hook onto beams, dangle from beams, steal equipment from enemies, create a conductive line between 2 points, grab items from a distance

>allow cryonis to form stone platforms in lava, allow cryonis runes to be set that form quickly when stepped over allowing enemies and the player to be flung into the air

>>16672338

>nothing wrong with WW ass ugly down syndrome graphics

Have you started HRT yet?

How many children have you fucked up to this point sicko?

>>16675090

Don’t mistake a hodge podge of random trannies and queers/pedophiles on the internet as “The Zelda Fanbase”.

All the Aounuma games sold like shit save for TP (which he was literally forced to make to rectify the Wind Waker fuckup) whereas BOTW and all pre Aounuma Zelda ie classic Zelda sold/sells like gangbusters.

Remember the true Zelda fanbase majority which is comprised of millions of people do not all post on these little faggot/tranny/pedo filled message/image boards so their thinking isn’t warped by mental illness, hive mind culture or fear of being banned for expressing their true opinions on what they like in Zelda games.

They vote with their wallet and again its consistently against Aounuma’s garbage.

The idea of some massive divide in the Zelda fanbase only exists in the twilight zone realm of the shiternet.

>>16672924

>MM should of been a new IP instead of bastardizing the Zelda franchise with its puzzle based hackery/faggotry.

There. Fixed it for ya.

Zelda 2 contrary to dumb shit millenial queer opinion was not at all “the black sheep” of the Zelda family.

The game sold like crazy upon release to the point people literally were driving to other states to try and get a copy.

It was pure Zelda gameplay through and through as it was arcade combat mixed with light RPG elements ie heavy usebof magic and even XP gains, nary a boring puzzle to be found.

No wonder Aounuma and his pedophile fanbase hate it so much and its never been given the remake treatment.

>>16675040

You’re basically agreeing with me you dumb as fuck millenial reactionary tard.

Souls succeeded you said because no other games in the market were fulfilling its niche.

No shit.

Nintendo as I said abandoned Zeldas true formula for years in favor of Aounuma’s garbage.

Naturally Souls picking up that formula and making it, its own resulted in success since people were hungry for the true Zelda style gameplay Nintendo was no longer interested in making.

You’re butthurt because you think I am against Dark Souls being a success.

I’m not.

I only pointed out to you why its a success you pathetic little shit filled diaper having millenial tard baby.

>>16675492

>Souls succeeded you said because no other games in the market were fulfilling its niche.

Dark Souls and Zelda aren't even in the same genera or niche you enormous boy tossing faggot.

>Nintendo as I said abandoned Zeldas true formula for years in favor of Aounuma’s garbage.

Aounuma did literally nothing wrong.

>Naturally Souls picking up that formula and making it its own resulted in success since people were hungry for the true Zelda style gameplay Nintendo was no longer interested in making.

ARE YOU FUCKING STUPID? DARK SOULS AND ZELDA ARE NOTHING ALIKE.

The ONLY Zelda games that can be considered in the least bit like the Souls games are the ones that Aounuma made, not the classic ones. And BotW is nothing like the classic Zelda games either.

>All the Aounuma games sold like shit save for TP

Yeah I hear that Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask are wildly unpopular. Oh wait.

>which he was literally forced to make to rectify the Wind Waker fuckup

If WW was so bad then why did it end up with two direct sequels, huh? Didn't think about that did you dumbass.

>Remember the true Zelda fanbase majority which is comprised of millions of people do not all post on these little faggot/tranny/pedo filled message/image boards so their thinking isn’t warped by mental illness, hive mind culture or fear of being banned for expressing their true opinions on what they like in Zelda games.

Want to know how I know that you aren't from here and don't belong here.

>>16675439

>>16675447

>>16675482

>>16675492

Nice quadruple post faggot. And stop reddit spacing.

>>16675482

>The game sold like crazy upon release to the point people literally were driving to other states to try and get a copy.

Stop. Repeating. Shit. From Malstrom's. Blog. You. Fucking. Retard.

>>16675530

well, he gottem on the reddit spacing

>>16675482

>its puzzle based hackery/faggotry.

Zelda's always been that dipshit. And OoT's gameplay was essentially the same outside of the time mechanic. Quit baiting.

>>16675090

>WHAT DO YOU RANT? lol

This whole thing is a ridiculous strawman. What actually happens is that when a series goes on for so long, and has so many iterations, the fanbase naturally gets split. You make a new WW, you'll please the WW people but the OOT people wont be happy. Make a new OOT, you'll please the OOT people, but the ALttP people wont be happy. You can't please everyone, because people aren't all the same. I'm so tired of hearing this shit. Stop being fucking dumb. Jesus.

>>16675492

>Souls succeeded you said because no other games in the market were fulfilling its niche.

Yeah. The niche of being a good Castlevania game.

>>16676066

>What actually happens is that when a series goes on for so long, and has so many iterations, the fanbase naturally gets split.

Nah, the newer games are just worse by objective standards. SS being the worst we got.

>>16676082

>The niche of being a good Castlevania game.

DS isn't even partially Castlevania. Holy fuck Mr (42) stop fucking posting already.

>>16676027

Puzzle gameplay goes back to the original game, though it was more rudimentary. Figuring out that you have to feed Dodongo bombs is a puzzle.

>>16676091

>Figuring out that you have to feed Dodongo bombs is a puzzle

You figure the same thing out in OoT. You also figure out how to kill the bosses in MM. What's your point?

>>16676086

Zelda

>big overworld

>separate dungeons

>gameplay structured around finding new weapons that double up as keys that open new areas and solving puzzles

>enemies often have some kind of puzzle element like figuring out you need to feed

Dodongo bombs or shoot Gohma in the eye

>no RPG leveling mechanic

Castlevania

>singular interconnected dungeon

>gameplay mostly about finding the next big thing and killing it

>weapons are there to make you stronger or to augment your particular play-style, not to help you bomb rocks or shoot switches

>enemies are big dudes you have wail on until they die, for the most part. Puzzle mechanics minimal

>RPG leveling mechanic

Seems clear to me which of these closer resembles Dark Souls.

>>16676098

That puzzles are an intrinsic part of the Zelda formula. What's your point?

>>16676171

except the swarthy man was the one getting cucked for like 10,000 years

he wasn't even in breath of the wild my guy wtf you talking about

>>16676171

Link is a child. They tend not to be bara daddy bears.

>>16674423

It's literally doing what Skyrim did with Blackreach but with a DLCquel.

>>16676104

That Zelda II should have been a new IP.

>>16676103

>one of these things is more like the other so it's completely the same as some 3rd thing

Not really no.

>singular interconnected dungeon

Dark Souls isn't a singular dungeon, it's a world with many NPC's and options and isn't linear like the first Castlevania games.

>gameplay mostly about finding the next big thing and killing it

So were plenty of NES and SNES games. Not comparable really.

>weapons are there to make you stronger or to augment your particular play-style

So what you're saying is Dark Souls is exactly like Megaman? And the weapons are upgraded by saving up a form of currency. Not by simply discovering new abilties.

>enemies are big dudes you have wail on until they die

The word you're looking for is tank enemies or bosses. Again, they are common as fuck in many games. Dark Souls or Castevania are not unique in this.

>RPG leveling mechanic

Ok so you're talking about the later games then? Even so you're defeating your own argument here by simply stating it HAS an RPG leveling mechanic, a common thing in MANY games. Dark Souls has to many unique elements to be compared to Castlevania. The fact that it's in 3D should be enough to tip you off to that fact. Dunno why you're being so retarded.

>>16676253

I didn't say Dark Souls was just Castlevania. But it's more Castlevania than it is Zelda, and yes I'm talking about SotN Castlevania, obviously, though you could argue that the weighty feel of the combat also pulls from the slow and deliberate whipping in the early games.

Most important thing to take away is that Dark Souls has structurally very little in common with Zelda. I mean, there's "dude, swords" I guess.

If you want a decent game in the vein of The Legend of Zelda that isn't just Skyrim with a Nintendo coat of paint slapped on it then you should check out Alundra.

>>16676288

Everytime anyone makes an uninformative video game comparison, it is comparing a game to either Zelda, Dark Souls, or Skyrim.

>>16674146

>removed

So why would you want the same game over and over? Keep the soul, transplant the heart. No one said anything about a nation-builder mechanic being the game. I want it as a reward FOR the game. Do the dungeons. Go on quests. Run around the world. And with the spoils of your victory, you rebuild the nation of Hyrule. What were you doing with all those rupees, etc. in previous games? Nothing. This at least gives them purpose.

>>16676171

I agree with you, but keep the soyjack shit off my board.

>>16676216

You forgot to mention that Nintendo of America doesn't even market some of it's more interesting games. So they're obsessed with the same Mario, Zelda, Pokemon shit. While games like Custom Robo Arena, Sin and Punishment 2 and Wonderful 101 get the shit hand. I understand that there's marketing budgets and all that, but when there's such inconsistencies within the company one has to wonder what the fuck is going on. The only reason Splatoon and ARMS sold were because of the online tests, if not for that then Nintendo of America would send the games out to die.

>>16676343

Hopefully that'll change now that they have new leadership. They did spend a good amount of time pushing Daemon X Machina and Astral Chain at E3.

>>16676288

I played Alundra almost 20 years ago so I barely remember, and I know I didn't finish it then. I watched the video, but I'd like to hear your own opinion on the game. Based on the video it's a much better 2d zelda that fixes basically everything wrong with the original. Much better combat and movement, puzzles that continue to incorporate old tools and mechanics throughout the game instead of dropping them after the dungeon they are introduced in, and a much more involved story rather than a barely thought out excuse plot. The video is too much praise though so I want to hear a second opinion.

>>16675183

Imagine being this scared of someone calling out "reddit spacing" that you decide to undermine the concept behind paragraphs altogether.

You need to lurk for two years.

>>16676351

I hope so, but I'm unsure. Additionally I wanna bring up. That in the last march indie direct, a bunch of clique people like Tim Schafer and Rami were featured. And there was the announcement of the indieshit Zelda game. I know it was right before Bowser came in, but even so I'm kinda worried about NoA. Either way we'll see what the future has in store.

>>16676375

reddit spacing is a shit meme

>>16676403

If you want to define "reddit spacing", you should define it specifically as one sentence or less per line for 2 or more lines in a row with a double-space in between. If either consecutive lines has 2 or more sentences on it, it's probably just good formatting. Exceptions can exist but it's better to be overly strict than overly broad in the definition.

>>16676259

>I didn't say Dark Souls was just Castlevania.

You called it a good castlevania game. I interpreted from >>16676082 to literally since I could barely read the post you replied to since it was so fucking shit.

>Most important thing to take away is that Dark Souls has structurally very little in common with Zelda

I forgot the other retard in this thread existed, my bad. If it weren't for the reddit spacing I would have assumed you were the same person since your ID hex color is almost exactly the same.

>>16676453

At this point I would rather we just go back to grade school and keep paragraphs within a 4-6 sentence structure paragraph then break. And only space if the topic is entirely different or you just want to piss people off.

>>16676470

Hyperbole. It pulls from a lot of classic games. The closest thing you can compare it to is Castlevania. There's also some WRPG stuff in there, which again has nothing to do with Zelda.

>>16676494

>The closest thing you can compare it to is Castlevania

Ehhh, barely. I would compare it closer to Megaman if you removed health items outside of the E-tanks honestly. Besides that I literally just stated I read your post more exclusively since I didn't quite comprehend the post you replied to fully.

>>16676510

Megaman has straight linear stages. Dark Souls has a world made up of interconnected passages and junctions, which is more of a Metroidvania thing.

>>16676517

>Megaman has straight linear stages.

With a lot of areas to get bonuses and explore in the later games.

>Dark Souls has a world made up of interconnected passages and junctions

True, but you can essentially just warp from place to place once you beat the boss in the area. Kind of like the lord vessel. Plus Dark Souls was more about limited health and pushing it to the end with limited said arsenal. Which is often what you do once you get to the wily stages.

>>16676510

>>16676494

Wait are we talking about Classicvania or Igavania here?

>>16676552

>are we talking about Igavania here?

>>yes I'm talking about SotN Castlevania

>>16676259

>>16676384

It is and only the newfag millenials keep regurgitating it.

This was actually started by oldfags on regular game message boards (not image boards) a long long time ago and the reason was people were getting more and more pissed off at posters who would create huge topic after huge topic that was essentially one gigantic wall of text.

So the entire idea behind the spacing was to make things easier to read and it was NEVER EVER complained about until millenial shitheads got old enough to use their mommy and daddy's computer and start repeating the same "le reddit spacing" garbage meme about it copying off the original millenial tard who first came up with the asinine idea that it started with reddit (since they have no creativity they just say what they see their fellow millenial tards repeating and as a result we have all these false attributions and redefinitions these days of terms that were already settled long ago ie so called "reddit spacing" never started/originated on reddit and the word "salty" never meant "anger" among the online world, before millenial tards came along all the word meant was that you were an extremely tough son of a bitch. Now its been changed and gayed up by children born in 1990 or the year 2000).

>>16670649

you stupid fucks forgot these games came with manuals

>>16671824

I want more wizrobe porn since you can look up their cloaks

>>16678279

Are there female wizrobes?

>>16670933

>forced to go through an extended tutorial before you're allowed to access the rest of the world

Useful and don't last 30 minutes, then it's all up to you.

>dungeons have almost no combat, all non-boss enemies die in one hit (most combat encounters are optional in general)

This is not true. The damage meter is fucked up, but it was some godd enemies like the big bokoblings and the lynel.

>can run straight to the final boss after completing the Great Plateau, the four divine beasts aren't required and just cut Calamity Ganon's HP in half

>vast majority of the content is optional

I like this.

>>16672002

I know that people have successfully modded assets, but can you modify the game's coding yet with Switch?

>>16678926

I have actually done "reddit spacing" through copying and pasting text where for some inexplicable reason it was duplicating newlines and adding the gap between quote and post. Not happening now though, it may be browser-dependent, or something.

The other case of excessive newlines is because you're dealing with a narrow posting box (especially those running sub-1080p) and it can make you break the text up more so it's not just a wall.

>>16678360

"Reddit spacing". Also known as standard formatting used in all modern word processors.

>>16670933

>can run straight to the final boss after completing the Great Plateau, the four divine beasts aren't required and just cut Calamity Ganon's HP in half

it's obvious when people talk about this that they didn't actually do it. you have to fight the additional divine beast bosses if you choose not to clear any of them first.

>>16680686

>>16679046

8ch specifically allows far too much horizontal space for text. Even that huge ass screenshot text box isn't even a full line. If I were to put this text into Wordpad it would be onto the third line whereas on 8ch it doesn't even fill one.

>>16681099

>I fucking loathe screencaps that don't obey basic readability rules.

I don't know why niggers always seem to make screencaps or info dumps 4,000px wide but it fucking annoys me too.

>>16678908

>but it was some godd enemies like the big bokoblings and the lynel.

Now enjoy fighting them a dozen more times. Would barely call them good to begin with.

>vast majority of the content is optional

>vast majority of the content is cutpasted*

Fixed

>>16677806

Stop Reddit spacing, faggot.

>>16694688

For the amount of time the game wastes your time alone it's not worth playing. The motion controls were shoehorned into every facet of the game to annoying levels doesn't help either. Skip it unless you just wanna gawk at the art direction and Grooce.

>>16694688

I remember watching an artist draw and he had it on in the background. I didn’t have a Wii so I couldn’t play it but it looked fun.

>>16694688

if you have a wii go ahead and download. I assume you already have it cracked. If not then no, it's not worth it.

>>16694688

Checking those eights. I would say no to that, unless you have the option to grab it like >>16696051 said. You'd be better off grabbing hyrule warriors really

>>16694688

Yes, but just go ahead and play it, because the less you know the better. The desert zone is consistently the best.

This guy made quite a good breakdown of the strengths and weaknesses of SS vs BotW. Don't watch if you don't want to be spoiled, obviously.

Is it possible to play Skyward Sword using a traditional gamepad with a gyroscope and accelerometer through some configuration or is it too much of a hassle?

>>16696996

PC is the best way to play hands down. You'll also need a gyroscopic gamepad, so you'll want a Dualshock 4 (or 3 if you want to emulate PS2 games because it has analog face buttons and bumpers)

>>16697034

I haven't looked much into it but given the state of emulators historically I highly doubt my system could do it and be playable.

>>16697065

What you got a toaster?

>>16696996

Emulate it or otherwise play the Switch version, it looks and runs better.

>>16697067

r3 1200, 1050ti, 8 gb ram

>>16697070

Don't really have enough interested in what games the switch has besides that to justify a purchase. Maybe if the lite gets hacked and goes on sale but now, I don't really think it's worth it.

>>16697106

GPU might hold you back a bit, but I think you could get 30fps at 1080p, which is better than both the Switch and Wii U. I would play around with emulating it before dismissing it entirely. Just follow this video guide.

>>16697137

Oh, that isn't too bad, I'll see what I can do with it. When I looked into it before I remember seeing like double my system specs ram wise for recommended settings and people with better systems than mine struggling to get bing bing wahoo running decently so I thought it'd be impossible.

>>16696950

People have done it. I can't tell you how well the game plays like this. It would probably interfere with parts that require more delicate motions.

>>16696996

I just beat it and was pretty happy with it, but it’s best to know the shortcomings before you play it.

>enemy pool is very small and only becomes okayish towards the end

>there’s variety to the gameplay but it requires hunting down shrines to get it. Some of the challenges are better than others

>bite sized “”””temples”””” but there’s a neat gimmick where you sort of control the temples

>weapons are going to break so never get too attached

>final boss is neat, but pretty darn easy if you do everything the game has to offer

And for all the negatives, I still really enjoyed the game. It was particularly fun hunting down the shit I needed to upgrade my armor particularly the dragons. All in all I’d say it was a strong 8/10. Definitely had enough substance there that kept me enjoying it. If they fix those gripes in the next game it’ll be a 10/10 in my book.

>>16670630

It would suck either way.

>>16697429

I had a lot more fun with the Champion's Ballad expansion. It has the best dungeon in the game, though you have to go through some stupid shit to get to it, and a far better boss fight than Calamity Ganon.

>>16697574

I’ll have to get it. Going to run through TP and SS as those are the only two Zeldas I haven’t beaten at this point, then I’ll pick up the DLC.

I suppose by the time I’m done with all this the Link’s Awakening will either be out or be just around the corner.

>>16697606

Also

midna sure is curvey and looks extra nice in the HD version

>>16697643

>pov

Noice

>>16678908

>This is not true. The damage meter is fucked up, but it was some godd enemies like the big bokoblings and the lynel.

Dungeons have little enemies you mongoloid. Have you even played the game?

>can run straight to the final boss after completing the Great Plateau, the four divine beasts aren't required and just cut Calamity Ganon's HP in half

>vast majority of the content is optional

>I like this.

You're very autistic anon.

>>16698704

>midna getting LINKED.com

I love this

>>16704961

When I was naive I bought the game pre-order. Was the only time I ever did so because the art style and premise sold me. The cool thing was that I got a 25th anniversary disk with the full OST on it in the case. Shame it ended up being more worth while than the game itself.

Even so the OST isn't to great. I would put any 3D Zelda up against it. It's just bombastic orchestra shit after a while.

>>16704976

So far there's been a few songs that have stood out pretty well. Fi's theme is extra nice.

>>16705092

There's definitely tracks I enjoy. Buy n Large I can only remember maybe 3 of them though after 100% the game 3 times, which was a few years ago.

>>16705092

I really liked Gate of time.