/v/ - Video Games

Considering how scummy Bethesda and the entire industry is it wouldn't surprise me if there's some deals being made under the table to maintain their monopoly.

>>16624855

Nah, there is a competition and it's the ubishit singleplayer MMO games. And they're very expensive games to make, which is why Bethesda reuses the same framework for all their games and focus of improving the renderer and making new content. Their production pipeline wouldn't survive moving away from gamebryo and their current toolset.

>>16624804

>Why this genre is so low in amount games?

Because it's a meme. First person and melee combat don't mix. The only exception I can think of is mount and blade, and even then it's debatable.

>>16624900

mordhau

Because it requires effort

I was a big faggot and never played Deus Ex because it wasn't Thief. Should I go first playthrough vanilla, or are there recommended community patches/QoL mods?

>>16624866

They could at least make it stable

Gamebyro is so fucking buggy

I wish they never did creation club

Sse and fallout 4 are so stable compard to nv and skyrim

>No S.T.AL.K.E.R

>No Dungeon Crawlers

Shit list

>>16624926

>>No Dungeon Crawlers

OP specified no party-based because otherwise his point would be wrong

>>16624916

>Should I go first playthrough vanilla

Yes.

>>16624922

They're doing the best they can with that old piece of shit engine, but it's never going to be as stable as it should be because they're doing things with it the engine was never designed for.

>>16624900

You need to play Dark Messiah.

>>16624916

For your first run, use Kentie's patches (http://kentie.net/) and nothing else.

Possibly because first-person is a shit perspective for anything other than aiming guns. The world needs less first-person games, not more.

>>16625059

>(http://kentie.net/)

Why does this smell like someone's autistic school project?

>>16624900

I assume it's a depth perception issue. Isn't this something VR could conceivably fix?

>>16625271

Cause it wasn’t very good. It was a worse bioshock with the only neat idea being the recycle grenades.

>>16625271

Because Prey 2 was better. Really, Prey 2 was open world space bounty hunter game, wasn't it? It could rival with Cyberpunk 2077 today if actually was given a chance.

>>16625296

When they are going to make full fledged RPGs like that?

>>16624926

Stalker is not an rpg.

>>16624914

Bethesda never put effort in anything and shat out 9 games like that.

>>16624916

Yes, go vanilla, playing it with mods ruined my experience for the first time, because everybody was recommending GMDX, but then i stuck somewhere because of ridiculous crash bug and have to replay it all over again.

>>16624839

>E.Y.E: Divine Cybermancy

That's a good mention, completely forgot about it.

>>16624922

Imagine Gamebryo on 2021 next gen console hardware, its going to be a shitshow.

>>16625309

Ultima Underworld is what TES Arena and Daggerfall heavily taken things from, it was worth mentioning. And UU wasn't party based.

>>16624956

First person party games are weird anyway. You see through eyes of everybody, never seeing anyone else's body so you're playing as dismembered representation of 6-8 people like you're some kind of merged spirit.

>>16624839

Requiem for Skyrim actually has good combat though. If we could out these melee mechanics into Morrowind that would be my perfect game.

>>16625452

>forgot the embed and spelling

Just

>>16625467

I miss hooktube

>>16625467

Even using invidio is dumb, because the content is still hosted by Alphabet and if they delete it then you won't find it on invidio either. Use BitChute or something instead. But then you can't embed that.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/gqPesHkPqxZ5/

>>16625480

I don't miss gooktube, the owners were human trash.

>>16625484

and what did they do?

All I know is that I liked hooktube's media player much more than invidi's

>>16625480

I do too.

>>16625481

Totally forgot about them, bitchute is the better alternative.

>>16625488

The day they put ad banners in was the day google dropped the hammer and now its shit.

>>16625069

>Possibly because first-person is a shit perspective for anything other than aiming guns. The world needs less first-person games, not more.

go back to twitter

>>16625492

Oh I must have missed that, Oh well, not like it has any use anymore.

>>16625130

what you mean?

Arx Fatalis is another one.

The reason there aren't that many FPS RPGs is because RPGs require attention to detail in terms of plot and mechanics and a FPS requires attention to detail in term of 3D graphics and environments that don't look like ass and barren from a first person perspective, put those two together and you'll only get AAA or sometimes AA or some extremely dedicated devs to make an expensive game like that. And generally most AAA companies don't have much patience or like to gamble.

Fallout 3, 4,System Shock, and Kingdom's Come aren't RPGs.

There's more out there. EYE Divine Cybermancy, Gothic, Stalker is basically an RPG where stats are replaced with gear, there was that failed MMO that was kind of like Deus Ex.

>>16627895

Neocron

>>16625467

Denying views to google isn't having the slightest impact on them and is a waste of time, plus invidious has a shit ui.

>>16625271

That's like calling Dishonoured a first-person RPG.

>>16624916

Go with GMDX is you want the better albeit not completely original experience

>>16627959

8chan shows up in results of video's embed clicks on author's own channel. He will know exact thread where it was posted eventually. There is also more revenue from unique clicks than from usual watchers of the channel.

>>16628058

Who cares? We aren't some super secret club anymore. And the 100 or so clicks a link posted here might get don't add up to meaningful revenue. Youtubers only get something like $1 for every thousand views and that's only if the viewers sit through the ads.

>>16627959

Moving to another platform is a worthwhile effort though. The only way you will make alternatives to (((Alphabet))) kikery viable is by using those alternatives.

>>16624804

I usually played skyrim in third person.

>>16628354

What made it shit?

>>16627807

you left out nv

>>16625284

You're deluding yourself if the action combat is specifically what holds back the roleplaying in modern games. It wouldn't be there regardless.

>>16628366

A multitude of things. The sligthly behind shoulder view doesn't fit melee combat that well for example.

>>16625455

>>16625452

>>16628304

>>16628354

>shamelessly admitting to playing skyrim

Didn't know console gamer gurls browsed /v/

For games with customization, it wouldn't look good to only see it in first person, unless you're a girl. There'd better be a lot of mirrors to be able to see the full body every once in a while.

>>16625455

>>16625452

You wouldn't happen to have a list of recommended mods, would you?

>>16628653

It's the CoD of RPG's.

>>16628653

Modding skyrim is neat, i don't judge that.

Actually playing it is never fun though.

>>16631499

Main stream nippers don't like fpp. Dozens of fpp Jap games exist.

>>16628653

>I feel like playing skyrim today

>download all the dlc's and the game

>go through all the mods on nexus

>get the best ones again

>spend an afternoon fixing it up

>start game

>play for 30 minutes

>quit because the game is only ever fun when you have nothing to play and even then it's a pretty shit game

Plus it looks fucking ugly. Mods never fixed that for me.

>>16625286

>It was a worse bioshock with the only neat idea being the recycle grenades.

>a worse bioshock

<a worse shit

I don't respect nuPrey but it would be nice if you elaborate.

Just to say this, nuFallout closer to TES than it is to Fallout.

>>16628653

Skyrim is just too fundamentally flawed to be a good game. It's fun for a bit, sure, but it's very shallow.

>>16631499

JRPGs =/= FPSRPG. JRPGs aren't even roleplaying games, they're adventure games with leveling systems.

>>16631499

>Japan doesn't like first person perspective

And for good reason. It's a good perspective for immersion but a terrible one for video games.

>>16631863

>It's a good perspective for immersion but a terrible one for video games.

How so? They're a ton of games which work in first person extremely well.

>>16631868

It's great for aiming but terrible for depth perception (platforming), and field of view (melee combat, driving). And I say that as a fan of FPS. Supposedly VR can fix that but that's another can of worms altogether.

>>16624804

Lands of Lore series

>>16624922

>>16625032

>>16625316

Theres quite a few games running on Gamebryo (and NetImmerse). Few if any of them have the awful performance and stability issues that Bethesda games have. Civ4 is Gamebryo and runs retardedly huge mods like Caveman2Cosmos without any major issues. Anything Bethesda touches just turns to shit and even New Vegas is more stable than Fallout 3 despite being run on a version of Gamebryo that Bethesda ruined.

>>16624804

For medieval / swords n sorcery it's because they fucking suck, combat wise. The best game remotely close to this genre is Dragon's Dogma and it's 3rd person

>>16631772

The original bioshock was a good game in a year of good games. Stop being a faggot.

>>16624804

>no gone home

shit list

>>16631845

>JRPGs aren't roleplaying games

stop this meme immediately, if JRPGs aren't roleplaying games then no video games are

>>16628553

that's a bad example seeing how skyrim doesn't use that perspective when your weapons are unsheathed

>>16642603

Anon, do you what a "roleplaying" game is? A lot of "RPGs" now aren't roleplaying games, the Witcher isn't a roleplaying game for example.

Ironically, the early Elder Scrolls games are roleplaying games. You roleplay. Your character is a blank slate that you create the story to via in-game screens.

>>16635055

Bethesda basically has no programming teams, just design teams. For many years their design teams had to rely on an ancient Gamebryo toolkit before someone finally got the balls to attempt to make it less trash and the Creation Engine was born, which is still buggy as fuck but at least it doesn't crash as often.

>>16642607

>Your character is a blank slate that you create the story to via in-game screens

Why is character creation a prerequisite for roleplaying? Does that make a game like Dragon's Dogma or World of Warcraft a role-playing game?

>>16642607

I fucking hate that RPG has come to mean any game with stats and leveling systems.

I blame the Japanese for this, they didn't understand that a game where your character is per-determined and has a deep lore is fundamentally NOT a role playing game.

The entire point of role play is creating a character and playing their role in the universe. It comes from old tabletop games.

>>16642617

so then why aren't they RPGs?

>>16642621

So because you've been assigned a role to play rather than choosing one for yourself, is the game is no longer a role-playing game? If that is the case, why isn't Minecraft an RPG?

>>16642611

Relying on old outdated software has been their MO even before they used gamebryo, so it's not that surprising that they've stuck with it.

>>16642630

You know whole stupid argument how cartoons can be anime because the root word of anime is animation? Your stance is like that.

>>16624900

>First person and melee combat don't mix.

There's nothing wrong with first person hack n slash. Not every game needs to be an ARMA-tier combat simulator with an autistic 40 button control scheme

>>16642637

So by that logic is PST not an RPG? There aren't many games that let you pick your character's childhood. Are all of those not RPGs?

>>16642641

So then why isn't Minecraft an RPG, faggot? Answer the question.

>>16624839

>first person melee combat just isn't that great

It's a lot better than third-person or isometric melee.

>>16642649

Any game where you play a role, is a roleplaying game. The Minecraft protagonist doesn't really have any role, Minecraft is a sandbox. GTAV is more of an RPG than Minecraft.

>>16642653

Why can't you play a role in Minecraft? What's stopping you? I'm sure there are people who do it all the time. If anything, a sandbox would be the best game to role-play in, wouldn't it?

>>16642653

>>16642647

Did you just blow in from stupid town?

>>16642653

Think of it like this: "playing a role" basically means the same thing as "acting a part." If you aren't pretending to be a character, you aren't roleplaying. Roleplaying = acting.

>>16642659

I blew your mom last night

>>16642658

You can, but thats like role-playing in your backyard. That is simply RP not a Role-Playing GAME. The game does not roleplay with you, what you do exists in a vacuum and has 0 story ramification towards the game world.

>>16642658

>Why can't you play a role in Minecraft?

You can turn Minrecraft into an RPG, but it is not one by default

>>16642649

>So by that logic is PST not an RPG?

Believe it or not people do argue wither or not it's an RPG.

>So then why isn't Minecraft an RPG, faggot

If you go on a RP server it's an RPG, but even then not like a table top rpg. Normally you just survive and do autistic shit with red stones. Even then if pretend rp by yourself like on a RP server there's nothing really stopping you breaking your RP rules.

A lot of RPGs have:

- melee combat

- turn-based combat or at least automated combat

- cool new armours and stuff you can collect that you wouldn't be able to see in first person

- many even allow you to control several party members

I don't think first person and RPG goes too well together, so most devs just end up making a 3rd person game or something instead. Would make more sense to make games like GTA in first person, or even STALKER. They aren't really RPGs yet they kind of scratch the same itch in many ways with their open worlds and stuff.

>>16642679

Back to the OP, I'd say the answer why there aren't more Western RPGs is because they take a long time and a lot of resources to make properly. It's easier to cash in on MMOs, sports game and other stuff than spend five years combing through an incomplete jigsaw puzzle to have it release to 6/10s.

>>16642663

So then there are certain things you expect from role-playing games like "having a story" and having the ability to affect that story. But how much freedom do you really have when playing a role-playing video game? You can only affect the story in a very set number of ways because that story is completely predetermined. In the event of a game's story being procedurally generated, like say, Dwarf Fortress, suddenly the game is sandbox and not a true RPG, because the experience is not being crafted in the same way a DM would for you. Since no video game can provide a suitable replacement for a human DM, no video game can be an RPG.

>>16642667

This post is pretty close to the point I'm trying to make, when you get autistic about terminology, like X game not being an RPG, suddenly no game is an RPG for the same reasons. For example, you can say Dragon Quest isn't a real RPG because player choice is limited by an arbitrary amount, but the same is true for a game like Morrowind. Without the DM around to allow for actual role-playing, none can occur. It's just that there are some video games that are better at convincing you that they are role-playing games than others. Those games are called CRPGs.

So when someone says "JRPGs aren't real (tabletop) RPGs" it's just stupid, since it's like saying true or false questions aren't short answer questions, all the while giving multiple choice questions a free pass.

>>16642679

>since the role you are playing is not effectual on the story and setting

This is what I mean, there is no video game out there where you can actually affect the story, because the story has already been written by the time you are playing the game. Nothing you do can really affect that game's story, short of making mods of the game yourself, which is contrary to the spirit of an RPG in the first place, since mod creation means removing yourself from the role.

>>16624804

bullet sponge is shit

>>16642699

>This post is pretty close to the point I'm trying to make, when you get autistic about terminology, like X game not being an RPG, suddenly no game is an RPG for the same reasons

This is not a new revelation, most RPG forums have gone over this. In fact 'what is a RPG?' is a running joke over at rpgcodex because of shit like this.

>So when someone says "JRPGs aren't real (tabletop) RPGs" it's just stupid, since it's like saying true or false questions aren't short answer questions, all the while giving multiple choice questions a free pass.

When you get down it, the only elements that CRPGs and JRPGs generally share is having stats and turn based combat. Even then the excution is different between them. Take away the combat, a JRPG plays more like a adventure game, with CRPG you typically still have some options.

I don't even like FPS RPG, or anything realtime.

>>16642738

well thats a lie

Dead Space 3 and Mass Effect 3 were the biggest selling titles in their franchise despite being critically panned, and these are only few examples, theres tons of titles that failed critically

for good reason too, stories these "rpg"s had were horrible, Mass Effect was viable when it had Jack Wall doing Soundtrack, hired professionals to guide cutscenes like movies, had time to polish the game to perfection instead of getting rushed out of the door

its all possible these days too but AAA had decided rushing unfinished products out of door, monetizing every little meaningless aspect and firing top talent to replace it with amateurs who cost less, SO THEY COULD MAKE 100 MILLIONS INSTEAD OF 25, THATS THE WHOLE POINT

The ONLY REASON why were not getting same quality shit before is because AAA is deliberately fucking up development and monetization to make x times as much profit

they are DILUTING THEIR BRANDS ON PURPOSE AND THEN WONDERING WHY PEOPLE ARE TURNING AGAINST THEM

>>16642764

They don't owe you shit. Go make your own games.

>>16642735

RPGs were always scaled down wargames from the outset, so while you are correct that they aren't strictly speaking RPGs due to scale they are closer to RPGs than action games like say Dark Souls. RPGs conceptually were just wargames where the player had control over one character. Computer RPGs tend to let the player control an entire party since tabletop RPGs were made for a bunch of players and thus focused on a handful number of characters that complemented one another. The warrior, thief and wizard model.

So it's really just a matter of scale.

>>16642784

>>16642786

Gary Gygax, the creator of D&D when he DM'd he made campaigns in a dungeon crawler fashion. Also i've heard the game was initial designed that you weren't supposed to use the fighter classes but the mages and priests, you were a captain of sorts leading your own group of soldiers.

That being said, D&D has long evolved being more than a custom wargame creator.

>>16642821

and that means jack shit

>>16642785

>>16642779

Funny that japanese wiki on "Simulation RPGs" (like Super Robot Wars and Gundam G Gen) is also describing that genre as scaled down wargame.

Its a stat play system that SRPGs and RPGs acquired from wargames.

>>16642710

>there are different outcome to which the role you play can effect it is what defines a RPG

then why isn't a VN an RPG?

>>16642726

>turn based combat

I've played quite a few of both that don't have either

muh numbers is what defines video rpgs, that's the only thing

>>16644142

>then why isn't a VN an RPG?

Because VNs aren't games, to be more elaborate, they're just electronic goosebump COYA picture tiddy books. If you have gameplay and C&C I would say that's more closer to a RPG.

>I've played quite a few of both that don't have either

Right the action RPGs, well i've played both on each side. I was thinking more of ultima, dragon quest, final fantasy, etc. when I typed that out. Even with the action ones you can generally hash out the stats into a basic formula in CRPGs to know how much damage you'll do. It's a lot more vague in JRPGs for the most part, with the exception of mario RPGs (because they're so simple) and Fire Emblem. There's probably others, but I can't remember them right now. Also with JRPGs they reach triple digits pretty early into the game, I guess that's a spectacle choice but it just makes the number seem weightless at the same time.

>>16624804

Most RPGs are party-based, and first person RPGs require single-character gameplay.