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File: b555c6c52a4c716⋯.png (27.54 KB, 253x170, 253:170, b555c6c52a4c7163daa7c73cf2….png)

ef0a29 No.15177737

What's the appeal of grinding in games like MMO's or RPG's (more often than not, JRPG's)?

If I were given a choice to not have to worry about grinding to get a 'key item' or if I had to grind in order to get that key item, I certainly would go with the former, but I feel like I may be alone on that opinion since video games which require you to grind have become so common and even preferred in some cases.

In any case, I just have to ask why grinding continues to be a 'thing' in certain video games, and just why do some people put up with that shit? In an MMO, I can sympathize a little bit more with grinding since, surely, it makes it so not everyone is always at an equal level and that people who put the work in will be rewarded as such, but the problem is that grinding isn't unique to MMOs, and are also common in RPGs.

For me, grinding gets boring at about the 10th time, and it really makes the game I am playing feel like a chore. Why the fuck would I play a game if it is so taxing on me that I lose any and all enthusiasm because of some asinine quest? Yeah, I get a little bit of a dopamine rush when the item I've been looking for finally drops, but is it worth the hassle and headache? I think not.

Going back to the topic of JRPGs, it could be that grinding is as prevalent as it is because Asians have insect-like mentalities and don't mind droning on for hours a day doing repetitive shit. But that's just my own speculation.

What do you think about it?

3389f4 No.15177757

Promise of being OP/ebin/flashy things, and then the sunken cost fallacy justifies to keep going.


1e3e9d No.15177798

>>15177737

>I feel like I may be alone on that opinion

That is because you are a retard. This is a very commonly expressed opinion, and I wish all grinding was gone forever.


65043b No.15177805

>>15177737

People are more comfortable with what they are familiar with, and grinding games exploit this by making the appeal of the game nothing but flashing lights and increasing numbers that hook the player indefinitely because even though they don't enjoy playing the game more than other games, they find it easier to pick up due to its familiarity and harder to put down due to the fact that it can never be finished. You can never have the biggest numbers in this game, there are always bigger numbers to get. It's like potato chips where they're easier to prepare and eat than something like sirloin steak, and since they don't actually make you full addicts can eat them indefinitely. This is why you should avoid anything described as "comfy" like the plague, it is a trap that will leave you permanently unsatisfied and will rob you of things far more fulfilling and worthy of your time.


ef0a29 No.15177809

>>15177798

But people keep grinding as if they have no other choice, hence my confusion. You feel that way, I understand, but do you refuse to play games featuring grinding? If not, you're only encouraging more games with the 'mechanic'


d53cf5 No.15179083

Games where you can optimize the grinding to level up a lot faster than you normally would really tickle my autism bone.

Disgaea is good for this.


1c6160 No.15179191

File: 2b0390f1ca353bc⋯.png (555.47 KB, 807x475, 807:475, umlhazts6m2y.png)

Grinding is fine if the combat mechanics are fun. I could grind all day in a game with Grandia's battle system.

>>15177737

>Going back to the topic of JRPGs, it could be that grinding is as prevalent as it is because Asians have insect-like mentalities and don't mind droning on for hours a day doing repetitive shit. But that's just my own speculation.

Yes, that is your own dumb nigger speculation. In the time it took you type that sentence, you could've just done some basic ass research instead. Pic related.


ef0a29 No.15181915

>>15179191

>basic ass research

<it's just some no-name slant trying to explain his motivations

Kek.


67c4d9 No.15181957

>>15177737

You can't really explain appeal. If you don't like it, play other game genres. I'm sure there are many other genres you don't like aside from games where you have to grind


c214fa No.15182024

>>15177737

>why grinding continues to be a 'thing'

Are you mentaly ill? Do you want a "skip every action I did before" button?


11fb95 No.15182056

>>15181915

> Creator of one of the most well-known and influential video game series of all time, with almost as many copies sold as the Legend of Zelda series

> No-name

How does it feel to be retarded and have no perspective?


6d6f0f No.15182135

File: 7608755a15fc455⋯.jpg (50.74 KB, 600x723, 200:241, gendobot.jpg)

>>15177737

If someone's "grinding", it means they've hit a point where they need to get shit and farm shit in order to progress. This shit should be avoided in design. Most RPGs give you enough tools to progress past boss points if you don't skip fights, or work on mechanics that discourage grinding.

Some examples include Valkyrie Profile's Hard Mode where everyone starts at level 1 and there's equipment that adds level up bonuses that increase the strength of the character or add points to an objective so that when you release those characters you can appease your boss.

In Final Fantasy X the only grinding needed is once you hit the bonus dungeon and enemies vastly outstrip you, but you can get "Overdrive => AP" equipment to powerlevel into other characters' skills and stats to pass through, or just use out of the box tactics to proceed and at this point you can customize an array of equipment to deal out status effects and protect against certain statuses to proceed. This is where the game tosses the "Character A is good at beating Enemy A" pattern, and now you have to figure out how to deal with the new enemies that don't fall into the former categories and throw crazy gimmicks at you.

This is where grinding becomes "fun", because it's not just fighting enemies over and over again, it's creating a plan to efficiently get you from point A to point B in as little time as possible using the game's mechanics against itself and "breaking" the system you've familarized yourself with.

There are sections in EVERY RPG with a bonus dungeon circa 2011-ish and down that do this. The real shit always starts postgame. Hell Disgaea, a game you might be familar with, is based entirely around exploitation grinding, the first one was about exploiting the Item World, the second one had exploits that allowed you to steal a middling level 9999 character from a previous lt beaten story level to carry your characters up to that level, etc.

Now none of the games YOU are referring to have this sort of grinding. What you're thinking about is

Skinnerbox grinding

This is a sort of grinding that should not EXIST. It doesn't even have much of an appeal, but the point of it is to attract people with addictive personalities, people who are prone to addiction mentally. It's meant to attract whales. Whales being a marketer code for "people who pay 10,000 dollars on a phone game because they're mentally ill." IE the big fish you want to hunt.

TL:DR

DON'T PLAY MMOS OR MOBILE PHONE GAMES IN THE MODERN ERA.

NOTHING THAT IS "FREE TO PLAY" IS FUN IN THE SLIGHTEST.

IT IS MADE TO BE ADDICTIVE THROUGH SMALL AWARDS AND BEING BARELY FUN.

IT IS NOT MEANT TO ENTERTAIN YOU.

That's the answer you wanted and needed. Grinding is shit. You got confused because the games you played before the modern era used grinding as a tool to force you to find a better way to proceed, be it through skill at low levels or efficiency in resource gathering, to test you, not to hook you.


292c5d No.15182156

>>15182135

Grinding shouldn't be a central mechanic but its a good way to bridge a skill gap for players more on the rpg side of action-rpg games. If a certain section or boss is too hard you go back and grind a bit to get stronger, but if you're good enough you don't need to grind.


6d6f0f No.15182188

>>15182156

pretty much, yeah.


ab4367 No.15182240

>>15182156

>>15182188

The main problem is when people win by grinding, but then think that the only way they could have won is by grinding, and take that attitude into every other RPG they play. As soon as the option to take it dumb and slow shows up they scream "FUCKING GRINDING I SWEAR THESE GAMES FORCE YOU TO DO IT" without realizing that it's really their own fault.


ef0a29 No.15182324

>>15182135

You had me up until you mentioned Disgaea. That game and Etrian Odyssey are so terrible with their grinding. I'm surprised so many people here defend them when it's so lazy. Not to mention that for many bosses and segments in either game pretty much require you to look up a guide of some sort, completely removing all fun from the game.

> didn't use this character setup and level it up throughout the game? You lose and theres nothing you can do about it nanana boo boo

>>15182024

Uh yes, retard? If i've mastered something in a video game, theres no point in me playing it again and again ad nauseum. That's not gameplay, that's filler to justify the price tag


8bdc75 No.15182456

>>15179191

That still doesn't explain why it's so fucking boring. I guess the journey isn't a thing in the Insular Chink mind.


b58666 No.15182457

>>15177737

people like watching numbers go up. thats the entire reason idle games exist.

>ooh my numbers are going up fast, im so efficient and productive.

>look how for ive come after all this work, ive improved at something for once in my life


f27cfc No.15182477

>>15177737

IMO people like grinding because it makes you feel productive, there's really no other reason

the shiny carrot at the end is just a reason to grind, which is necessary for the productive feeling you get from doing it


c214fa No.15182597

File: 7506aba0e0f36e0⋯.jpg (105.61 KB, 1024x683, 1024:683, 7506aba0e0f36e068ddf5b3adf….jpg)

>>15182324

>Disgaea. That game and Etrian Odyssey are so terrible with their grinding.

Christ


8ba6d4 No.15183017

>>15179191

But you could be try, try, try, trying while actually having good gameplay at the same time. But RPGs never care about that.


6d6f0f No.15183756

>>15182324

Are you fucking retarded?

Disgaea's easy as shit, and Etrian Odyssey's difficulty comes from it's dungeon design and FOE patterns, not the bosses. The bosses are a DPS race with gimmicks, and Disgaea's bosses are "if you have higher stats you win" + whatever the stage gimmick is. You obviously have never played or researched the games.


ef0a29 No.15183778

>>15183756

>the games good if you conduct enough research to write a thesis about it

Kek




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