4109b6 No.14998308
>Better gunplay
>More demons
>More on-screen enemies
>Superior soundtrack
>Higher skill ceiling
The only thing that Doom 1 has over 2 is 'muh better level design' but Doom 2 makes up for that by having the levels be more creatively designed and more fun to play.
3c1812 No.14998330
Doom 2 doesn't have bad design, neither does 1.
Doom1 has more varied looking levels.
9ea9cd No.14998516
>>14998308
I've never been able to force myself to play all the way through either of them. Duke3D and Quake, on the other hand, I've beaten many times.
7a199b No.14998540
>>14998308
As I see it, Doom 1 and 2 are two parts of the same game, just released a year apart.
fa4901 No.14998546
>>14998308
But the level design in Doom 2 is retarded, anon.
74c966 No.14998591
>>14998308
>Better gunplay
True.
>More demons
Pain Elemental was a fucking dogshit idea.
>More on-screen enemies
True.
>Superior soundtrack
False.
>Higher skill ceiling
More complicated gameplay due to vomit-tier level design and enemy placement =/= Higher skill ceiling
It's inferior do Doom 1.
4109b6 No.14998595
>>14998546
How is it 'retarded'?
ffa6f7 No.14998620
>>14998308
>dogshit level design
>porno soundtrack
>archviles
cb6670 No.14998621
>>14998595
Well, one level having a literal fucking arrow on it telling you where to go is a pretty big hint.
4109b6 No.14998639
>>14998591
>Pain Elemental was a fucking dogshit idea.
Just use the BFG on them.
>More complicated gameplay due to vomit-tier level design and enemy placement =/= Higher skill ceiling
Doom 1's level design was way more vomit-inducing, just look at Inferno. Also what's wrong with the enemy placement?
74c966 No.14998668
>>14998639
>BFG
Can't hit with with 3000 Lost Souls spamming my face in a tight corridor
>Doom 1's level design was way more vomit-inducing
Are you fucking kidding? Doom 1 was fluid like a river in comparison to 2. I marathoned both last year and the difference is abhorrent. I legitimately got stumped on Downtown for hours, how can you even defend that?
4109b6 No.14998707
>>14998621
Renember that teleporter frenzy shit from Inferno? That level still remains more retarded than anything from Doom 2.
79f269 No.14998724
>>14998308
>The only thing that Doom 1 has over 2 is 'muh better level design' but Doom 2 makes up for that by having the levels be more creatively designed and more fun to play.
What you actually mean by this (and especially the tidbit of being "more creatively designed) is that each level stands out more to you, because the differences between levels in Doom 2 are more apparent even to the untrained observer.
There is a good reason for this. Sandy Petersen's style of level design revolved more around higher level concepts and gimmickry to carry a level, rather then more low-level detail which goes into finetuning the structure, pacing, texturing, and combat encounters of a level, things Romero largely nailed in Doom 1. What this means is that whenever Petersen sat down to design a new level, he'd first come up with a central idea or gameplay theme the level would revolve around, and then build a level around that. These ideas could get pretty outlandish, so you'd end up with some borderline experimental levels such as Downtown, Barrels 'o Fun, and Tricks and Traps which forgo 'traditional' Doom level design for something more abstract.
Note that being experimental doesn't make your levels bad. You just need to have the skill to follow through on your outlandish ideas, which a lot of these levels in Doom 2 don't show. So you'd often end up with stretches of combat against oversized packs of homogenous enemies, huge wastes of unused space, or the directionless city maps where you're running around a huge map figuring out which building lets you progress.
A more general consensus is that most of the Petersen levels were interesting conceptually, less so in execution, which brings me back to relying on high-level gimmickry to carry your levels. It's a very idea guy-esque mentality to level design, where you come up with some completely out there shit for a level but don't have the technical know-how to make it really work. You do remember these silly levels, but if you actually go back to play them you'll find they're really a larger source frustration than most levels in Doom 1.
>>14998639
>>14998707
Do you want me to tell you who designed all the levels for Inferno?
f626e1 No.14998741
I like doom 2 because there's more enemies and the super shotgun, however doom 1 has better level design.
9a9b2f No.14998763
>>14998308
>Better gunplay
It's the exact same, aside from one additional weapon, which almost completely eclipses its companion.
>More on-screen enemies
That's an entirely meaningless metric. Doom isn't a horde shooter. It matters less how many enemies you fight, at a time, and more how those enemies are used against you.
4109b6 No.14998764
>>14998668
>Can't hit with with 3000 Lost Souls spamming my face in a tight corridor
Then kill the lost souls with the BFG as well you dumb fuck.
>Are you fucking kidding? Doom 1 was fluid like a river
Knee Deep in the Dead and Thy Flesh Consumed were, The Shores of Hell and Inferno were both complete shit.
>I legitimately got stumped on Downtown for hours, how can you even defend that?
I hope you're baiting. Downtown had a very obvious and linear path, I could figure it out when I was 10 years old.
f6306f No.14998780
>>14998724
>or the directionless city maps where you're running around a huge map figuring out which building lets you progress.
This is one of the two major reasons I've never beaten Doom 2. I just get bored and drop it by map 20 or so. Fucking dumbass levels all over the god damn place.
b31557 No.14998785
>the only thing doom has over doom 2 is level design
>but doom 2 has better levels
Yeah okay, enjoy Refueling Base and Gotcha. Maybe come back when you are capable of forming coherent thoughts.
Really, both games had their stinkers, but Doom 2 had far more of them, because the team literally recycled level concepts that didn't make it into the first game.
>b-but muh super shotgun
Didn't do anything except make the game easier, tbh cyber-fam
74c966 No.14998786
>>14998764
>Wasting BFG ammo on lost souls
You fucking idiot.
>The Shores of Hell and Inferno were both complete shit.
In comparison to the entirety of Doom 2, they were fine. The difference here is that intuition gets you through those chapters, not a fucking online guide.
>Downtown was linear
Thanks for outing your own bait, retard. Get lost.
c629b8 No.14998792
>Doom's most important aspect can be trivialized as "muh level design"
No. Both are good, but 1's levels were better.
4109b6 No.14998837
>>14998786
>>Wasting BFG ammo on lost souls
>You fucking idiot.
I rarely use the BFG anyways and I usually still got a shitton of ammo left.
>In comparison to the entirety of Doom 2, they were fine. The difference here is that intuition gets you through those chapters, not a fucking online guide.
You… needed a fucking walkthrough to get through Doom 2? Are you literally retarded?
>>Downtown was linear
>Thanks for outing your own bait, retard. Get lost.
How wasn't it linear?
4109b6 No.14998884
>>14998785
>>the only thing doom has over doom 2 is level design
>>but doom 2 has better levels
I meant that Doom 2's levels were good in a different way.
>Yeah okay, enjoy Refueling Base and Gotcha. Maybe come back when you are capable of forming coherent thoughts.
Both maps were fine.
>Really, both games had their stinkers, but Doom 2 had far more of them, because the team literally recycled level concepts that didn't make it into the first game.
The only level I'd truly call bad was The Citadel, the others were great overall.
>>b-but muh super shotgun
>Didn't do anything except make the game easier, tbh cyber-fam
Doesn't make it any less fun to use.
4bfd6d No.14998895
Barrels o' fun was shit, though.
Doom 2 was overall the better game, sure - but there are things that it lost from Doom 1 that could have made it better, if retained.
>>14998540
is basically how I feel overall, though. They're essentially the same, really.
4109b6 No.14998946
>>14998895
>Barrels o' fun was shit, though.
Why does everyone seem to have a vendetta against this map?
ef7e5d No.14998953
>>14998724
Keep in mind, Sandy Petesen designed levels for Doom like he designed modules for tabletop games.
7a199b No.14998992
>>14998946
It's pretty frustrating to play, especially for those who don't expect the Mancubi to blow the fuck out of them when they shoot the barrels.
4109b6 No.14999010
>>14998724
Despite this, his Doom 2 levels are still great. Inferno was shit because he was still new to the genre, Doom 2 however was the point he really came into his own.
4109b6 No.14999022
>>14998992
>especially for those who don't expect the Mancubi to blow the fuck out of them when they shoot the barrels.
How could you not expect a rocket-firing enemy to blow you the fuck out?
895d4c No.14999067
If Doom 2 came out today it would be called a cashgrab. You are not missing that much by playing just Doom and not Doom 2. It feels more like an expansion pack.
41b7a9 No.14999082
>>14998884
>Refueling Base
Ah yes, the alpha test map which had almost no doors causing almost all the monsters in the entire map to wake up when you fired your gun. My favorite part was the room filled with pointless alcoves containing nothing but bottom tier enemies and my second favorite was the insanely stupid Cyberdemon gimmick.
There is no way you aren't just being an obtuse cunt at this point. Gimmicks are objectively bad game design and you're going to sit here and pretend they're fine? What about Barrels O Fun? You like that shitstain too? Fortess of Mystery, an instant classic right?
4371eb No.14999090
>>14998308
I disagree mostly because a lot of the designs were ehh, and to say the new enemies were a good idea, I like to point to archviles and pain elementals.<
7a199b No.14999096
>>14999022
When you first play the level, you don't generally expect the mancubi to behind you, and when you finally do get BTFO, you don't like it, especially right in the beginning of the fucking level. And also, the bleachers with all the fucking Pain Elementals, Cacos, imps, and Hell Knights is a fucking pain in the ass.
4371eb No.14999105
So anyone here like final doomer mod and know of some good maps I could play with it?
Second question, do you think when we do eventually go to hell we will get the chance to have pet cacodemons I want one badly, I wonder if I need to sacrifice souls to hell in order to get one?
4371eb No.14999115
>>14999105
Forgot to add the images, fucking damnit.
636363 No.14999119
>>14998308
DOOM 2 is far less immersive than DOOM 1 is, I know it's a gameplay focused game but it's not like they didn't give a shit about immersion in the first game. In the second they just threw it out the fucking window.
312cef No.14999234
Spoonfeed me a windows compatible link.
8be101 No.14999247
>>14999090
Archviles are a legitimately excellent idea, it's just that they weren't handled appropriately. They were basically treated like any other big tough demon and thoughtlessly sprinkled in rather than used to their maximum potential.
For a purely hypothetical example, instead of just sort of tossing one at you a third of the way through the game as just 'an enemy in the level', they should have introduced one really early on when you're still building up your arsenal. Imagine: After barely fighting your way through an oddly shaped room filled with pillars that acted as cover against the various low-tier hitscan enemies and imps with your minigun, the yellow keycard is finally yours. You walk up to it, grab it, a weird enemy aggro sound you've never heard plays. You turn around and see some freaky weird tall thing ressurrecting the enemies you just killed, and a basically bossfight begins! Maybe give a mercy megasphere in the monster closet the Archvile popped out of since the player's struggling at this point.
Way the fuck more effective than just throwing one at you in a tiny room with a single imp.
Ultimately, though, that's really Doom 2's biggest problem. The levels aren't really designed around the enemies in them, you basically just get rooms with enemies and no thought whatsoever put towards how the enemies fight and how the player has to deal with them. They basically just rolled a die to see what enemies they put in any given box.
7279dd No.14999254
>>14998308
>The only thing that Doom 1 has over 2 is 'muh better level design' but Doom 2 makes up for that by having the levels be more creatively designed and more fun to play
>the levels in Doom 1 are better
>but Doom 2 makes up for that by having creative and fun levels!
742f8c No.14999303
>>14999115
I would fucking love a wad that allows you to pet, feed and train a Cacodemon like in a Monster Collecting game, then have it fight alongside you and be able to give it orders.
4109b6 No.14999309
>>14999247
>The levels aren't really designed around the enemies in them, you basically just get rooms with enemies and no thought whatsoever put towards how the enemies fight and how the player has to deal with them. They basically just rolled a die to see what enemies they put in any given box.
False
c5c72c No.14999353
>>14999309
>False
Okay, I'll bite.
But why is it false?
inb4 it's all based around THIS ONE ENEMY IN THE GAME
f7c645 No.14999377
THE ONLY THING THAT DOOM 2 HAS OVER DOOM IS THE FUCKING SUPER SHOTGUN AND THAT'S FUCKING IT. THE NEW ENEMIES SUCK DICK, THE LEVEL DESIGN IS FUCKING SHIT, THE MUSIC DOESN'T HOLD A CANDLE TO THE FIRST GAME'S STUFF, AND ANYONE WHO GENUINELY THINKS THIS GAME IS BETTER THAN DOOM CLASSIC NEEDS TO FUCKING OFF THEMSELVES FOR THEIR FUCKING SHIT TASTE
4371eb No.14999460
>>14999377
So it's good then right?
8be101 No.14999473
>>14999307
Honestly, I've been toying with the idea of making a megawad for a number of years now, it's just that if I were to do so I would need to completely redo how guns and ammo work and that is a huge fucking time investment for a project I'm not 100% sure I'd bother finishing. Accruing power and tools in videogames is inherently satisfying and that stops happening a handful of levels of the way into Doom 2. You just have all the weapons and a backpack at that point so there's no more room for growth. I'd need to design around a constant sense of progression throughout the whole damn thing and you can't get that with only 8 upgrades, so I'd need to add lots of mechanics related to incremental power growth, and that's just too much fucking up-front work.
5a2016 No.14999491
>>14998308
>Doom 2
>use nothing but the super shotgun
>shapeless levels which are supposed to be cities
>no episodic structure makes for less variety
>vastly inferior music
Doom 2 was a multiplayer game, you retrokid idiot.
5a2016 No.14999507
>>14998724
>borderline experimental levels such as Downtown, Barrels 'o Fun
A fucking box full of exploding barrels is avantgard to retrokids.
472dfb No.14999519
I preferred chex quest and Doom 64 to the originals, but they are both easier I feel.
a7eeef No.14999679
>>14999377
The SSG is cool, but it fucking rapes everything and makes most encounters way too easy. You get that shit right away and it's a weapon you should only give to players later on when you have a fuckload of tough guys on screen.
312cef No.14999680
b570ac No.15001964
I love the first one mostly out of nostalgia, e1m1 brings back a lot of good memories of taking turns playing doom with my dad. We were terrible at it but majorly fucking up and dying in ridiculous ways was all part of the fun.
a0271e No.15002009
>>14999096
>start in a room absolutely filled with explosive barrels
>notice you're standing in a particularly bright square
>no way this is a trap
fa4901 No.15002201
I wonder if Doom Eternal will at some point have you walking on top of insanely thin walls to complete the level.
06bc42 No.15002210
I've tried my best to play doom 2,but as soon as i hit like level 5 or 6 i start to get confused and lost,and just say fuck it
at least with doom 1 i could get through the first episode fine because i could find shit.
But i think it's a moot point,the gameplay of both combined is what people love about it and still think today that it's fantastic,that and the active wad community.
014817 No.15002219
File: 2da1cdfe9dd18df⋯.png (Spoiler Image, 978.04 KB, 850x1100, 17:22, 2da1cdfe9dd18dfeb3a0cd303a….png)
The best of the two games is Serious Sam.
9b0730 No.15002221
>>14998308
Doom 2 is technically just a paid content for Doom 1, they're the same game dumbass.
4109b6 No.15002508
>>14999491
>>use nothing but the super shotgun
I rarely use the SS, the reload is too slow and it's only truly effective on the stronger enemy types
>>shapeless levels which are supposed to be cities
There were only like 4 city levels ad they aren't 'shapeless'
>>no episodic structure makes for less variety
What are you talking about? There was plenty of variety in the levels
>>vastly inferior music
Subjective.
c8c807 No.15002546
>>14999307
>lots of cannon fodder and archvile(s) behind them
I've seen this done a few times
d53d47 No.15002634
>>14998884
>Gotcha
Bridges and islands in burning sea of acid piss. It's like a light version of the ultimate fuck you level, The Chasm.
79f269 No.15002897
>>15002892
shit, I messed that up again
**Doom 1 > Doom 64 > Doom 2
07538f No.15002902
>>15002790
>>>/cuckchan/ memes should stay on >>/cuckchan/
c99114 No.15002928
Fuck this pissing contest. Doom versions less than 3 are fantastic. This thread stinks.
3219e0 No.15002932
Both are good games, comparing them is retarded mostly because Doom II feels like an expansion to the first game.
79f269 No.15002940
>>15002935
shit, forgot to post the webm
4fbf5a No.15002943
>>15002902
Should have a "these webms are too noisy"
c5da35 No.15002961
>>15002957
Fuck, wrong webm
1bfa41 No.15002971
>>15002902
>girls
>nobody is morbidly obese
bd17f7 No.15002991
3219e0 No.15003027
>>15002991
>playing in 320x200 with heavy pixelation
Just use a sourceport and avoid the pain. I'm not even talking about using filters, just a higher resolution makes everything looks crisp enough. If you really want to try this "experience" where every enemy far from you looks like a bunch of pixels mashed together, use Chocolate Doom.
3bb669 No.15003078
Let's not kid ourselves. Nobody here plays Doom or Doom II anymore. They all run GZDoom Brutal Deluxe that needs a top gaming rig to play an engine that's not even as capable as Quake 2.
Kinda reminds me how the web got fucked-up, and now you need a botnet browser that sucks up gigs of ram and still freezes up when bitcoin miner malware fucks your shit. Screw this, I'm going back to old games that didn't get pozzed.
802910 No.15003080
>>15003078
You may be retarded
3bb669 No.15003085
>>15003080
Nice try fbi. I'm not falling for your propaganda. All modern shit is pozzed one way or another. Doom ain't no different.
bd17f7 No.15003091
>>15003078
>Screw this, I'm going back to old games that didn't get pozzed
>unpozzed version of the game is right there
>>15003085
>implying you're forced to play the same pozzed version as everybody else
>implying you can't play the original dos version on real hardware disconnected from the internet
3bb669 No.15003119
>>15003091
Whatever man. I'm writing a text mode engine, and that's the only way I'm going to play Doom from now on. Graphics are for plebs who can't read.
c5da35 No.15003138
>>15003072
>ZDoom has fucked skyboxes
Wait what.
1661d2 No.15003294
>>15003138
He's most likely referring to how Zdoom has support for actual skyboxes and it lets you use this effect in original Doom levels. You can go back to the original sky effect in the options menu by toggling "stretch skies"
a0271e No.15003793
Both Doom and Doom 2 are great, Sandy Peterson made shit-tier maps so just get a good map pack after you finish Knee Deep in the Dead or make it to around level 7 of Doom 2
633b94 No.15004801
>>15003119
I'd sorta wanna try it if it could somehow generate descriptions and stuff from WAD files.
bc2971 No.15004827
>>14998308
>The only thing that Doom 1 has over 2 is 'muh better level design'
Level Design and Controls are 2 of the most important aspects. So yeah, you're wrong.
324551 No.15004859
>>15002892
>>15002897
>>15002940
Why is 79f269 pretending to be 000000?
7486b4 No.15004920
The maps being garbage was the main problem with Doom 2.
I played my copy of ultimate much more.
bd17f7 No.15005699
>>15002608
How fucking underage do you have to be to think old games are pixelshit?
c99114 No.15005755
>>15003294
If you want things to look like vanilla, and you're playing GZDoom, you're doing it wrong. That's a port for playing mods.
>>15005699
>low effort trolls
>people desperate to fit in while failing to
Also there actually is a Doom mod to make everything look like pixelshit.
014817 No.15006382
>>15005755
Post that mod and turn this thread into a LOL thread.
c99114 No.15006425
>>15006382
>turn this thread into a LOL thread
No thank you. But it's this thing. Not even made as a joke WAD.
https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=58162
d923f7 No.15006438
Doom 1 campaign with Doom 2 weapons would be ideal.
316caf No.15006441
pixelshit is wannabe retro
you can make great games around old and sound design but indie actually think pixelshit will sell, its sad, because its not selling
5ea038 No.15006639
a0271e No.15006836
>>15004262
I wish Romero hadn't been too busy destroying the office and doing blow in his Ferrari to make episodes 2 and 3. Unfortunately they let a hack take over level design and the quality drop is real.
It's still a great game which is why people continue to create new content for it 25 years later.
fb9b6f No.15007200
>>14999377
>the new enemies suck dick
Isn't that a good thing?
fc94c0 No.15007255
Doom > Doom 1 > Doom 2
wad fags need not apply
c99114 No.15007440
>>15007255
PK3 fags >>>>> any Doom games.
4109b6 No.15007445
>>15007255
Todd, nobody wants your shitty game anymore.
fdd57e No.15007567
>>15006425
It's shit like this that drives me up the fucking wall
ed983b No.15011557
>>15007200
I always liked this guy's art, but I never found it erotic.
It's often quite interesting.
2d8463 No.15011573
>same graphics
>same guns
>same enemies
How is Doom 2 even a standalone game or worthy of being called a sequel at all?
ed983b No.15011595
>>15011573
There are tons of new enemies in Doom 2, though.
You're right about the guns, though. The super shotgun is great, but I really wish they added at least one completely new weapon to the game. The game is desperately lacking a decent long-range weapon. The chaingun is serviceable if fired in bursts, I guess, but it's not ideal.
c4d3e1 No.15011602
The level design in Doom 2 was ok until you reach Earth. A massive flat area with some random building scattered about is just ass.
2d8463 No.15011605
>>15011595
There are a few new enemies. It has always seemed like a full priced expansion pack to classic Doom.
75df32 No.15011627
>>15011602
Probably because when you reach earth you hit the big wall of levels made by Sandy Peterson
ed983b No.15011630
>>15011605
>There are a few new enemies
They nearly doubled the enemies. The original game had 10, Doom 2 has 18; 20 if you count the secret enemies in the two secret levels.
I'm not disagreeing with you about Doom 2 not being a proper sequel, I just think the enemy claim is BS.
6ec01d No.15012044
>>14998308
>undeniably shittier maps
>Nirvana and Map08
No can do, buddy. Most if not all maps and mods were made with doom 2 in mind, which is the only reason why I play it over doom 1.
a8b8c3 No.15012947
>>15011630
>20 if you count the secret enemies in the two secret levels
I am most definitely not going to count Commander Keen as monster.
>>15011595
>The game is desperately lacking a decent long-range weapon.
Plasma rifle, you retard.
3bb669 No.15013390
>>15011573
The doom.exe and doom2.exe are pretty much the same thing, at least for the final released version 1.9 for DOS. You can even use the super-shotgun in Ultimate Doom, if you simply add the weapon "thing" to a map, and merge the missing sprites into the IWAD. The new monsters however don't work if you try to use them (they'll just sit there motionless).
They actually started adding Doom II stuff into the common engine code around version 1.4, but that wasn't widely released (unlike version 1.666 which became very common to have until everyone who seriously played finally upgraded to 1.9 and/or Ultimate Doom). If you go back and play the oldest versions, like 1.2 and prior, they behave quite differently. You can even rack up armor way past 200% if you keep collecting armor bonuses, although health itself is capped to 199%. Another very visible difference is that the hard limits for visplanes and such are much lower. Those were all increased for Doom II so it could have much more complicated maps, but since doom.exe is the same engine, it also got bumped-up after version 1.2.
BTW, this is a fun map to play in Doom 1.2:
ftp://ftp.fu-berlin.de/pc/games/idgames/levels/doom/d-f/darkhell.zip
4109b6 No.15013415
>>15011602
I liked the city maps tbh
ed983b No.15013427
>>15012947
Try hitting an arch-vile that's far away with a plasma rifle with any kind of accuracy.
7a07d1 No.15013434
What's a doom wad I can use with Brutal Doom that just has tons of enemy waves? I want to blow off some steam.
be7767 No.15013468
>>15013434
Demonsteele, HDoom.
4109b6 No.15013497
>>15013434
>Brutal Doom
Leave.
ed983b No.15013519
>>15013510
>first image
I'd like her more if the guy who designed her wasn't such a faggot.
c99114 No.15013824
>>15012947
There really is nothing unless you're aiming at a stationary target. However the game doesn't generally require long range encounters. MAP15 is one exception (mitigated by them being mostly paper-thin hitscanners). Plutonia's MAP29 is far worse in this regard, with the ranged mancubi.
>>15013468
abort_m is the best one.
>>15013519
I can't stand any but the kawaii uguu ones.
0c816b No.15015658
Non legendary complex doom 2 is best doom with maps of chaos mod
74c966 No.15019779
>>15013497
Didn't Romero say that Doom was supposed to look like Brutal Doom if they had the tech for it in the 90's?
332782 No.15019808
>>15019779
Didn't Romero made Daikatana and married a feminist?
bd17f7 No.15019819
>>15019779
LOOK like, not play like. Also this >>15019808 but learn to conjugate
e5d320 No.15019829
>>15019808
In fairness, Daikatana on GBC was pretty good
43ca7e No.15019924
>>15019808
Daikatana wasn't as bad as it was made out to be by a lot of (((journalists))), though it was still bad. It was just an overly ambitious game ruined by feature creep and retarded AI.
bd17f7 No.15020027
>>15019994
>still not as good as the original
>literally ~2500x the disk space
>doesn't run on every single device i own
290167 No.15020073
>>15019994
Doom 2016 is like Episode 7 of Star Wars. To make up for the crappy previous installment, they tried to copy the original without understanding what made it good. Yet redditors and people who were born after the release of the original gobbled it up because "duh, it's Doom/Star Wars, and it's new, therefore it must be awesome!"
Also 64 revenants, 12 at a time.
633b94 No.15020726
>>15020073
Jokes aside who'd want to fight any more than 2 revenants at the same time, aside from the Russian Overkill guys.
7a54b9 No.15020737
>>15018893
WE ARE NOW DECLARING A STATE OF EMERGENCY ALL OVER 8CH
http://archive.is/LCZIO
THE WHO GONNA GET GOVERMENTS TO BAN PROBLEMATIC VIDEO GAMES
THE TIME IS SOON FOR THE MASS BOOKBURNING
c634dd No.15022579
>>15020726
>you need Russian Overkill guns to fight more than 2 revenants at the time
The absolute fucking state of modern doom players
c5ebb3 No.15022585
fuck the faggot mods
fuck that fucking gay jewish faggot mark in particular
03dcc1 No.15022612
>>15022585
But he was banned for racist remarks in his code, doesn't it makes him #ourguy?
c99114 No.15022636
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>15022579
Don't be so silly. Revenants are the most challenging enemy in existence!
>>15022612
I hardly give a shit about who creates a mod to be honest, as long as I enjoy it. The hate for Brutal Doom is largely for the community around it, the idiots expecting everything to work with Brutal Doom (which is why certain mods have anti-BD checks that do funny things), and that it inspired the piece of shit that was Doom 2016. The actual mod is pretty cool if you're into that.
ab1904 No.15026997
What's the best doom sourceport?
bd17f7 No.15027093
>>15022612
I believe you have the wrong mark again.
>>15026997
Chocolate Doom
33993c No.15027122
2d8463 No.15027191
>>15020737
That's not how it works.
c99114 No.15027194
>>15026997
Ask the question better. What do you want to do with it? Also this thread should be left to die now we've got a new Doom/FPS thread. >>>/v/15014738
3e5e27 No.15027212
>>14998308
>Better gunplay
SSG trash, so no.
>More demons
>Pain Elemental
>More on-screen enemies
Not bad, but not necessarily good either.
>Superior soundtrack
Wew, this has to be bait, but I'm already most of the way through. The only song I can remember from D2 is Entryway's. E1 soundtrack, perfect recall. Same with E2-E3 maps like Spawning Vats. End of episode, even the intermission screen. One of the best soundtracks of all time. The only sin is that not every level had a unique track, but neither did D2.
>Higher skill ceiling
In part due to bullshit new monsters and inferior level design.
>muh better level design but who cares about that
Play a basic fan made Duke 3D map and then play something made by Levelord, maybe you will have acquired some perspective on things at that point. Level design is half the game.
c254f1 No.15029847
Too bad all the maps are so much shittier.
>MUH LABYRINTHS AND PUZZLES
Fuck off, I just wanna walk around a cool-looking base and kill stuff.
c254f1 No.15029858
>>15020726
>more than 2 revenants
Please tell you meant to type "Archville" but had a brain fart or something. Please tell me you aren't so bitch-made you can't handle two spookers whose weakness is walking backwards while shooting.
95fba2 No.15029886
>>14998308
By today's standards, Doom 1 and Doom 2 are the same exact game.
290167 No.15029973
>>15029886
By today's standards, Doom 2 can be divided into thirty three DLCs and sold in three season passes.
c4d3e1 No.15030763
Is it true that most doom sourceports barely run on AMD cards?
bd17f7 No.15030983
>>15030763
"most" doom sourceports use software renderers, so no.
>>15030961
Remember when mark banned somebody for posting someone else's avatar and then an actual avatarfag posted in the ensuing meta thread and he didn't care?
07de5f No.15031007
Who cares and which is better out of doom 1 and 2?
Doom 64 is objectively the best game in the series.
bd17f7 No.15031017
>>15031007
dude get with the times u hipster channers, DOOM is the only doom game worth playing.
Old games are just for nostalgia bro
9c8793 No.15031109
>>15031017
Don't forget to pre-order D44M 2^2 and play Quck Champions- The Original® E:Sport™
c4d3e1 No.15031366
>>15031007
Wrong. Doom 64 Ex is the best. The original game is ass.
633b94 No.15032504
>>15031416
EX adds mouse look, better lighting effects, no anti-aliasing when up close to enemies or walls and runs at whatever resolution you tell it too.
5572bf No.15033940
>>14998308
Yeah it is. Doom 1 is a retard game.
c4d3e1 No.15033981
>>15033940
<fast monsters not enabled
c67795 No.15033990
>>15032504
still the same core game, the argument could be made it's made too easy with mouselook. Which it is. Making it worse.
af5ac1 No.15034000
A direct sequel made in the same engine with a similar design philosophy made slight improvements? Colour me fucking shocked. Any other burning hot takes for us, OP?
>>15033940
>Shit taste
>Soundless Webm
Here's your (You).
c99114 No.15034070
>>15033981
If fast monsters didn't also imply instant reaction on wake-up (read: FUCK CHAINGUNNERS WITH A RUSTY PITCHFORK) I might actually use it.
>>15033990
I feel this way about Resident Evil 4 on the Wii. However if I'm playing modded Doom, especially with harder enemies, it's fine. No mouselook is something I reserve for chocolate playthroughs.
fdf635 No.15034259
>>14998308
>Better gunplay
Don't you think that's a really god damn misleading way of saying "the super shotgun is a good addition to the game"?
29e7ac No.15034415
Threadly reminder: the best versions of Doom I and II can be played in Doom 3 BFG edition.
422a1c No.15034612
>>14998620
>porno soundtrack
That's being too kind, elevator music is what it sounds like to me.
2a381d No.15034636
>>15011602
The city level were fine aside from chaingunners in windows
>map29 of plutonia
fucking cancer aids
2a381d No.15034641
File: b9384d0fb7d7bfe⋯.jpg (Spoiler Image, 121.22 KB, 1280x1280, 1:1, 1458872687.oniontrain_hell….jpg)
>>15013510
>anime trash
I want monsters god dammit
dbfe22 No.15034695
>>15034415
The dumb censorship, especially the removal of the music from the secret levels for Doom 2 makes them the worst versions IMO
06bc42 No.15034728
>>15034641
Ah, a man of taste as well i see.
ed983b No.15034751
>>15034641
>inb4 /monster/ has an autism fit
b240a9 No.15034773
But Doom Eternal hasn't even come out yet OP.
649c51 No.15034790
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>15034415
>Censored
>Fucked up nightmare mode
>Best version
Sure, faggot
f32e3b No.15034794
>>15034751
God I want to purge that monster.
1d4c9e No.15034809
>>15034770
>>15034641
>>15034728
>>15034741
Look at all this good taste. I'm glad to see my artfaggotry may still have an audience here
ed983b No.15034840
1d4c9e No.15034854
>>15034840
huh. For all the doodles I've done for /v/-related over the last few years, I only did one sketch for Doom. Maybe I should draw more.
649c51 No.15034860
>>15034854
Draw a Pain Elemental getting brutally raped and murdered like the faggots they are.
eb9823 No.15034864
Daily reminder that DMC2 > DMC
>Better gunplay
>More demons
>More on-screen enemies
>Superior soundtrack
>Higher skill ceiling
The only thing that DMC has over 2 is 'muh better level design' but DMC2 makes up for that by having the levels be more creatively designed and more fun to play.
1d4c9e No.15034870
>>15034860
that's not very wholesome, anon.
ed983b No.15034879
>>15034854
Oh, is that you Joo?
Didn't you draw some stuff of the Wraith?
That Doom 3 Baron is a cute
1d4c9e No.15034883
>>15034879
>some stuff of the wraith
>some
I had the market cornered on fast scribbles of the wraith, back in the day.
c3c621 No.15034899
>>15030763
AMD has shit OpenGL support, so yes, that's correct. AMD cards also run poorly on eDuke3D, just to give another example.
c3c621 No.15034922
>>15034415
>using censored version of the Medkit with a red/white pill instead of a red cross because the Red Cross was butthurt for games using "their" symbol
It's not a their symbol, it's a generic symbol used to indicate health with very widespread use in hospitals and first aid kits
c8c807 No.15034932
>>15030763
I've only had problem with gzdoom, if the map is cluttered with detail.
06bc42 No.15034966
>>15034854
Draw an archvile coming out of a bath and being embarassed and inflaming an anon,but only lightly because she kind of likes the attention
f40df2 No.15034994
>>15034932
>>15030763
I usually lower the rendered resolution, disable most of the opengl features except for polygons and then turn off decals. At least i have constant 60fps. Joke mods like "retro with dithering" and "no ultraviolence" actually increased my doom performance. Also always turn off fucking shell casings in mods that add them.
a91abb No.15035004
>>15013510
>fetish faggots just slap balloon tits onto everything, increase hip size by 20% and call it a day
Every time one of you posts your garbage porn. Get the fuck out.
>>15022612
>he doesn't know that jews see everyone else as inferior and thus could be called racist period
78b642 No.15035035
>>15034883
Those threads sure were fun at first.
How about something involving the Icon of Sin? There's so little art of her.
78b642 No.15035067
>>15035035
>that fucking flag
Godammit, it never ends this shit.
2a381d No.15035152
>>15034809
>tfw I've not seen a good doom drawfag request in a year
give me shit to draw ffs
06bc42 No.15035177
>>15035152
Draw a small chested imp being worried about her size
1d4c9e No.15035258
You know, I don't mind requests when they're about things I can appreciate.
>>15034879
Notice to all demons: do not underestimate the Doom Slayer's size or stamina.
6581ab No.15035381
The biggest problem with Doom 2's level design is visual, thanks to Sandy's color blindness. On the other hand, it does give it a surreal other worldly sense.
ed983b No.15035415
>>15035258
That is cute, dude.
I always liked your art.
2a381d No.15035451
>>15035258
I want to put my face in that hellknight's butt
1d4c9e No.15035470
>>15035371
>>15035415
>>15035451
not really my speciality, thanks, and lewd, respectively.
ed983b No.15035477
>>15035451
There's a comic where that exact thing happens.
It's gay, though
1d4c9e No.15035539
>>15034966
also, happening.
a5b2b6 No.15035558
Daily reminder that Sandy Petersen, a mormon, made most of the levels and they are pretty good
06bc42 No.15035584
>>15035185
What are you,gay?
06bc42 No.15035586
>>15035539
Thank you kindly,i will be waiting with baited breath.
0d1e4f No.15035593
>>15035584
if you consider where we are, the answer should be obvious
06bc42 No.15035597
>>15035593
But how gay,is the question?
Futa gay?
Or full blown "i eat cocks" gay?
488ba9 No.15035607
2a381d No.15035664
ed983b No.15035723
>>15035664
Search for "renabu hell_knight"
>>15035539
God bless
117a30 No.15035825
got the true sequel to doom 64 right here, indie made in gzdoom 1.2, its gonna get ported to the colecovision and the dreamcast on unity soon. savior of classic FPS, coniferfirmed as kosher by adrian romero, the inventor of doom nukem and the quandary series. working title is brash bundicunt: bigkatana sky warriors, its got infinitely shit levels autogenerated by a fork of OBLIGE by starving africans plus some hand made™ levels made in SLADEBroom 0.5, soon to be ported to Sauerbraten ingame map maker.
the gameboy port still needs a little work though, but we'll get it right i'm sure
remember to fund my life on Patronizing and indienono
633b94 No.15036047
>>15035825
The hell kinda combination of shit did you do.
c4d3e1 No.15036162
>>15035597
futa is beyond gay
being attracted to a literal female with a cock makes you a subhuman worse that any manly faggot that wants to fuck men
488ba9 No.15036170
>>15035825
What in the goddamn
c4d3e1 No.15036275
>>15036256
It means you want to get dominated by a female so you fantasize about xx chromosomes having a cock because something is deeply wrong with your brain. You need to be gassed.
06bc42 No.15036346
>>15036335
Those two spooks have got something to eat (arbys)
a3482f No.15036480
>>15036346
What I wanna know is: Where's the caveman?
3bb669 No.15036932
>>15035596
Given the amount of time he had to make them in, and the editor he was using, they're pretty fucking good. I doubt anyone else would have fared as well. Romero himself didn't make nearly as many levels.
He was a pretty thoughtful guy that went beyond just "shoot and kill everything" and made the game more interesting that way. In retrospect the ideas seem obvious, but at the time everything was new.
b4cd18 No.15037779
>>15036162
Futa on female is the most heterosexual thing a man can jerk off to.
331c4b No.15037805
>>15036275
I see. Thank you, Hitler.
c4d3e1 No.15038261
>>15037779
More like the most subhuman thing a man can jerk it to. You get the chamber.
1d4c9e No.15038724
Finished. Don't worry, I'm sure anon will be fine. Mostly fine, anyway.
06bc42 No.15038885
>>15038724
dem feet man,they're crazy.
ed983b No.15039327
>>15038724
If the game is anything to go by, he'll be fine unless she does it for a few seconds.
488ba9 No.15040552
>>15039327
Or he could just hide behind a plunger.
d7f7b3 No.15040604
>>14998308
Doom 2 at base level unmodded is terrible
In the sense of levels
Doom 1 had way more thematic levels, insted of a random ass level followed by a random ass level.
However
Doom 2 as a base for modding (and subsequently doom 1) is a tresure trove for modding potential
For example, look at certain single player wads like: ancient aliens, and winter's fury
And look at deathmatch wads such as: aeonDM
ed983b No.15046268
f07666 No.15057810
>>15040604
Mods will fix it never counts not even for Doom.
c99114 No.15060185
>>15057810
You could not be more wrong if you tried. Compared to Skyrim you get total conversions that just use Doom source ports as a base and there's plenty of fun Doom gameplay mods too.
df9b6a No.15060720
369713 No.15063152
>>14998591
>>14998639
You dummies talk as though the games aren't indistinguishable from one another with the exception of a single weapon and 2 enemies
df9b6a No.15063680
df9b6a No.15063729
>>14998591
>being unable to kill a fucking pain elemental
lauffin at your life m8
2d8463 No.15067170
>>15029886
By yesterday's standards too.
It was an add on.
df9b6a No.15067470
>>15067467
woop wrong threb
54964a No.15074194
>>14998308
Dont forget the SSG
6a1b39 No.15084885
>>14998308
>higher skill ceiling
What did he mean by this?
c99114 No.15086010
>>15084885
It means fuck off and stop saving this thread from page 14 you stupid cunt.
4109b6 No.15086172
ec5e3c No.15086623
>>14998308
>better gunplay
literally one new straight upgrade gun, that broke the balance of the game and made multiplayer even more boring than the bfg spam
>more demons
and machinegunner
>superior soundtrack
the only songs i like are barrels o fun and underhalls. most songs are far more uninteresting than anything in doom 1
>higher skill ceiling
>muh super shotgun swinging with useless armors/megahealth
in fact items were so fucking useless most maps were just little squares where you spawned with supershotgun, its a pure brainless dm fest and a joke. you might as well play instagib gamemodes in (any other game). quake is a definite straight multiplayer upgrade as far as rules and skill in general, but saying doom 2 has better vanilla multiplayer than 1 is wrong
also
muh better level design
ec5e3c No.15086793
>>15030763
>>15034899
>>15034932
try just turning off the dynamic lighting. gzdoom is the only one i have problems running and this fixed it for me. opengl performance with my 10 year old gpu is not even THAT bad, i run fulltime linux and can run far more demanding games just fine. its just something with gzdooms implementation of dynamic lighting, that fixed my problem anyways
>>15031007
pseudo horror pitch black corridor shooter with boring music and time consuming but otherwise boring puzzles? yeah, fantastic! only thing doom 64 has going for it is it's excellent graphical direction
c4d3e1 No.15087548
How do I play wads with crispy doom
4109b6 No.15088337
>>15087548
>Using Crispy Doom
Why? Just use Chocolate Doom for authenticity and ZDoom for everything else. Crispy Doom is a shit source port and has massive mouse delay on top of that.
df9b6a No.15089090
y'all gay
also have an image that evokes the fuck out of Nevada
gud shit, good hell state. still has live people
ea294d No.15089104
But worse level design which ruined it
df9b6a No.15089105
File: 1c7856776fe040e⋯.png (Spoiler Image, 569.36 KB, 1280x960, 4:3, Screenshot_Doom_20180630_2….png)
>>15089104
i don't know, i think it's pretty chill
3ff196 No.15089192
Brutal Doom is the proper way to be played.
All your nostalgiafags are 90's or 00's kids that don't even played it during the original release, get a grip.
df9b6a No.15089308
>>15089192
I implore you to find better bait.
cd471b No.15089326
>>15063152
>another walking spoder
>revenants
>fatty with split fire
>archvile
>pain elemental
>chaingunner
>2 demons
your point of only one new weapon is correct but that said weapon became the bread, milk, and butter of Doom II. As much as I loved the SSG it was also what killed some of the fun for DM as many mappers decided that it was a starter weapon rather than a weapon that should have been out of spawn reach.
Though when it truly boils down to it
Doom I had better level design, both gameplay and theme wise, and within said maps were better monster placements.
Doom II felt more of a tech demo of what players could do with the new monsters and map settings etc. the SSG ruined DM balance more than anything and is generally fucking mapped as a starter weapon by retarded mappers all over the place, the mapping community has a MASSIVE fucking boner for it in DM, yet meanwhile actually treat it as if it's a stronger weapon in most single/multi-player map packs, Doom II is a mixed bag but generally all mods come out of the stem of Doom II
6ec01d No.15089341
>>15006425
Even Ace of Spades was more detailed than this shit - there's literally no excuse to this nu-voxel trash.
6ec01d No.15089430
>>15034770
This is all I have on me.
3f741f No.15089440
>>15089430
>last pic
nigger is that a fucking aeromorph?
97a22e No.15089472
>>15089430
>those Champions Online characters in pic 3
6ec01d No.15089563
>>15089472
Who's the demon on the right, then?
97a22e No.15089571
>>15089563
I don't know their names, all I know is those are costume pieces from CO honestly.
ea294d No.15089627
>>15089571
>That time a porn artist liked my cousins Champions online OC so much he drew porn of it
>It's been viewed by hundreds of thousands of people
df9b6a No.15092871
>>15035825
Mock's Not Dead
a6e0d3 No.15092889
>>15040604
What even is this formatting
Decent post tho
6ec01d No.15092936
>>15035825
What weapon/graphic packs are those?
df9b6a No.15097073
i'd upload a vid of current map progress but dropbox seems to have shit itself
633b94 No.15097429
>>15097397
Looks weird fam.
df9b6a No.15097438
>>15097429
its kinda meant to
the lava ain't natural.
the blue stuff is.
633b94 No.15097443
df9b6a No.15097463
>>15097443
you don't find lava on enceladus
but you do find whatever the hell it's cold equivalent is.
[spoilers]don't let the uac hear you call it 'cold lava' or they'll flip[/spoilers]
b24930 No.15097476
>>15097463
The opposite of lava is dry ice, that ain't dry ice.
633b94 No.15097485
>>15097476
Dry ice would be really neat if it had some sorta little chilled air animated texture around its sectors.
df9b6a No.15097499
>>15097476
dry ice doesn't quite come close to lava though
real lava is basically "concrete but retarded hot to melt shit, humanity doesn't know wtf to do with it"
except uac which somehow bullshitted it onto the planet to make use with it's cold equivalent,
it's also fiction and there is no known cold-smelting equivilent; you wouldn't call it "molten ice/ore" for instance
df9b6a No.15097506
>>15097485
yeah i dunno how one would pull that off, i know it's pheasibly doable with a warp but not sure how to make look nice
df9b6a No.15097553
also shit freezes yo
probably just throw a transparent 3dfloor
?
488ba9 No.15097804
>>15034770
>/monster/ vs /fur/
Really makes you think.
df9b6a No.15097884
>>15097804
ya wonna fokken go m8?
havin a giggle m8?
c99114 No.15098828
>>15098672
I agree. Tailor girl is a fun Doom protagonist.
633b94 No.15098847
>>15098273
>>15098280
That's looking real nice.
fccae4 No.15098918
>>15098672
>tearing shit up
"how do you do fellow nerds?"
85897d No.15099240
>>15098672
A small part of me hopes that they are just playing up the "fuck the nerds"/"rah rah feminism" because otherwise, they would be promoting a pro-military, pro-guns, death to the demon hordes movie. The other, much larger part, thinks its going to be another trash video game adaptation that is more a money laundering scheme for its producers. And when everyone is saying "die white man baby scum", this proves they are the wokest of woke, and will guarantee Wonder Woman money.
df9b6a No.15100016
>>15098847
wunderbar.
kinda wanted to make a transit tram but it might not make much sense and it would need to wait til last
df9b6a No.15100076
>>15098847
>>15100016
second map isn't as far along as the blatant e1m1 ripoff but its in the works
e8767b No.15100081
>>15099376
>cyborg scaley
surprisingly specific. Do I look on /fur/ /monster/ or /chaos/ for more?
df9b6a No.15100117
>>15100081
/chaos/ is still too normalfagshit for the likes of us
eb34e5 No.15100142
>>15089571
Its just that edgelords make nothing but demons in CO. Or furry demons.
3f741f No.15101516
3f741f No.15101520
>>15101516
*do not actually go to /fur/ please
4109b6 No.15103147
488ba9 No.15104390
>>15100081
Don't forget /xen/ and /clang/.
ea06f1 No.15108785
>>14998308
Quake 2 > Doom 2
6530fc No.15108796
>>15108785
Quake 2 gets a lot of shit but the weapons and gore are pretty satisfying. I also like the future tech aesthetic instead of the dreary Quake aesthetic. It does feel like it lacks maybe a little bit of creativity but it's still enjoyable. The music's great too.
983e2b No.15108826
>>15002219
Why does Sam have blood on him if he's fighting Kleers?
6530fc No.15108830
>>15108826
Because he was fighting kleers.
df9b6a No.15108985
I want to like The Golden Souls/2 but i am shit at platforming
gravity-retarded edition when?
df9b6a No.15109065
b04e5d No.15113492
>>15104390
/xen/ is for aliens and /clang/ is pretty against those types of anthro robots. I think /fur/ would be his best bet to find more.
4109b6 No.15113775
>>15002219
Serious Sam is not very good.
b04e5d No.15113781
>>15113775
You're replying to a post that's three weeks old anon
4109b6 No.15113790
a734b9 No.15114408
Can someone tell me if this chart is up-to-date and if there's a newer one?
4109b6 No.15114517
What are some Doom mods with this aesthetic?
6a1b39 No.15114562
>>15114517
Looks like the vanilla graphics, unless I'm missing something.
633b94 No.15114794
>>15114562
I think he means the gore, in which case Ketchup.
a09aec No.15115062
>>15114408
You're late by 2 revisions.
37cb6b No.15115488
>>15115062
Customdoom doesn't work with newer versions of ZDoom and GZDoom.
4109b6 No.15116111
b495db No.15116129
>>15116111
well what the fuck did you mean then jackass
70a135 No.15116206
>>15116129
I meant wads that have a similar scenario as the image: Fighting hordes of Cyberdemons with a rapid-firing BFG.
06bc42 No.15116250
633b94 No.15116417
ff603c No.15126168
>>14998308
I agree with all your points.
I recently beat Doom 2 on the BFG edition of Doom 3 for my PS3 and holy hell it was fun.
Doom 1 felt boring and repetive while Doom 2 offered fresh new challenges and puzzles to solve every level.
The Icon Of Sin fight is a tad bit short but it's still a 9/10 game for me overall. Only complaint IS THOSE FUCKING ARCH VILES!
Yeah yeah i just shoot them with the BFG but damn are they a pain in the ass.
df9b6a No.15131983
check the other doom thread for my super neato garbage
>>15059140
c4d3e1 No.15135976
dd82d6 No.15136822
but which one is more fun?
df9b6a No.15137242
>cool beans
nah man more like
<frozen peas
9a9b2f No.15140221
Anyone else playing through Goldensouls 2? I can't find Arid Abode's secret exit, for the life of me. I figure it's through the yellow skull door, but I can't find a way to lower the bars in front of it.
9a9b2f No.15142245
>>15141453
Thanks. I didn't think the designer would actually be a dick enough to stick something like that in those rooms.
73b81c No.15142277
df9b6a No.15142330
>>15142277
Rude.
>>15142245
yeah i find myself IDDTing to find all the big coins, some you would never find or think of (the fucking yellow crab for starters)
8777a1 No.15142487
Is it actually possible to change classes midWAD, trying to play compendium with FinalDoomer but apparently changing WADs doesn't reset your arsenal or allow you to change classes.
df9b6a No.15145126
stuck in a couple of weapons; wasn't originally going to add them; but the flashlight will be useful in any blackout levels.