/v/ - Video Games

San Francisco is famous for using long hard sticks to smack guys like you around.

>>13660321

>Spears are the truest warrior's weapon.

While generally true on a practical and historical level, swords are still the ceremonial and status symbol weapon. They're popular because they're the mark of a hero.

>>13660361

All the shit bait posting aside you're right. Spears were the mainline weapon for many armies, but there's no prestige or mystique behind them, they're common weapons for peasants. Where as Swords are often linked with nobility and what not.

Still fuck that, I'd rather have a spear if I'm actually having to stab some one to death who also wants to kill me.

>melee weapons

just use bows or guns, fags

>>13660372

Yeah, and anybody intelligent fighting you would know to negate your reach advantage and then you'd get fucked because you wouldn't be able to use anything but the haft and the pommel to deflect, and little chance for that. Spears/pikes/halberds etc are very much infantry staples.

>>13660411

>heero

>faggot who doesn't even use swords

>>13660425

>implying

Even the HEMA fags have this shit figured out, man. No substitute for proper swordsmanship

pleb vs pleb the pleb with the spear will trump anything shorter than the spear every time if you're going by a tip tag system. I was in a tournament of arms of sorts and the only guy who could best me with a sword+ short sword combo was a guy who had trained with them extensively and knew how to parry properly.

Everyone else got POKED. Unless you know how to parry or have a big shield you're gonna get poked. In real life this will usually be pretty rough on you unless you have some thick ass leather armor or plate mail. At that point you're not longer going by a tag system anyway. If I'm going up against plate I'd want a war hammer with a spiked back.

>>13660379

The general lack of warhammers and picks in RPGs where heavy armor is common really irritates me

>>13660442

Barring you having combat experience, without a doubt they've a far better handle on this shit than you.

>>13660372

>but there's no prestige or mystique behind them, they're common weapons for peasants.

It wouldn't be prestige or mystique, but you could certainly romanticize them that way.

>>13660473

I'm kinda sad that I'll be leaving Texas soon. I'll no longer be able to open carry swords :(

I'm gonna see if I can lobby for open carry swords when I move.

>>13660472

I'm not saying their tactics aren't effective because they are, but pole weapons don't require as much training to use effectively, kill just as easily and offer the benefit of range. All that plus the fact you're rarely fighting truly one-on-one on a battlefield full of hundreds of screaming, dying people and chaos it's not just as easy as using a just use this technique from a fighting text to negate your opponent(s)' range.

There's a reason simple pole weapons were the mainstay workhorse weapon of nearly every army for centuries.

>>13660472

You can't be fucking serious - shit like battle of nations is an absolute joke and you effectively look like vid related minus the fantasy

>>13660489

>Open sword carry

Any one else reminded of That Guy in highschool who wanted to join the Marines and carry a sword or some other weeb shit

>>13660513

That's a pickaxe for mining human innards

>>13660519

Instead of the middle finger do you bite your thumb at people?

I used to know a japanese guy that was hardcore into kendo. Once, he showed me a video of a match between a female high school naginata (a polearm with a curved head instead of a straight one) practitioner vs. a high ranked male high school kendo team. The girl beat every single guy they threw at her. Toward the end, when the kendo team had sent out their strongest fighters, who were able to score hits but still not win any match, you could hear the anger in their voices.

If a random naginata girl can beat an entire of good male sword fighters on technicalities, it sounds like proof to me that polearms are the ez mode weapon for faggots. Winning because of "muh range" when you are an objectively inferior fighter is nothing to be proud of.

>>13660493

Yeah, but essentially you'd hand them a bunch of pikes, rank them 3 files deep and hope they held against the other army. If we were talking efficiency I'd simply arm them all with crossbows instead whatever the Church said, and give them all arming swords for close quarters against anybody who didn't turn into a pincushion. If we're not talking full-fledged battlefield, then spears instantly lose their utility.

>>13660526

How can you be an "objectively" inferior fighter if your "superiors" can't beat you?

>>13660526

If someone brings a gun to a swordfight, that makes it a gunfight and you the retard who brought a sword to a gunfight.

>>13660526

>Winning because of "muh range" when you are an objectively inferior fighter is nothing to be proud of.

In a war situation, who gives even half of a shit? You're some random peasant who has to fight in a war, not a noble. If you get to pick between being proving you're the most skilled peasant on the battlefield and staying alive, which do you choose?

>>13660561

I advise you to read properly what you quoted. I said if you didn't have battlefield conditions - i.e advantage of dudes on each side of you as invested in holding the line as you, archer bank providing support etc, but instead dealt with most anything else (skirmishes, bandits catching you by surprise, whatever) THEN the utility of the spear falls apart. Do you want me to explain why, if it's not self-evident to you?

>>13660537

>Crossbow

>efficiency

The reason the Church didn't like them wasn't because of how efficient they were. They're not. Reloading them is slow and/or strenuous as fuck. The reason the Church didn't like them is because they punch holes through armor. They used mechanical advantage to allow for the weapon to store more potential energy than conventional bows. Their stopping power was unheard of other than things using gunpowder.

You still needed to defend your crossbowmen with some kind of melee weapon or they'd either get shredded in a charge or have to stop firing to defend themselves/fallback

>If we're not talking full-fledged battlefield, then spears instantly lose their utility

Depends on how skilled the polearm user is. There's entire fighting techniques/martial arts built around various polearms.

Real life fighting isn't rock paper scissors. One weapon/technique/style/whatever doesn't always guarantee victory over some one.

>>13660587

>That screencap

>That date

>Those post numbers

What is that, a few days after 8/tg/ was created?

>>13660536

I wish I still had the video. It was obvious toward the end that naginata has a great advantage. The kendo guys had to make incredibly risky, daring moves just to score a point, and clearly outsmarted and outskilled her on numerous occasions, yet she still won by playing conservatively in a way that any of the kendo guys could have pulled off easily if they had studied naginata, which they never would because (as I understand it) naginata is competitively irrelevant in comparison.

>>13660545

>>13660551

>>13660558

>>13660561

>>13660569

The premise of this thread is that spears/polearms are the true warrior's weapon, and swords are for faggots. I don't disagree with "lol polearm meta play2win" but that's shifting the goalposts.

It's a FUCKING GIRL beating an ENTIRE TEAM of boys. If that doesn't set the alarm bells off in your head, I don't know what will.

>>13660526

Lucernes and naginatas do shit on everything else

>>13660579

>they punch holes through armor

Which is a great freaking equalizer however you put it, as better half-plate and full plate come into play over time. And I'm not saying have the entirely of your levies be crossbowmen - if I could drill them to get their reloading times down to 45 secs- 1 min, they'd be worth their weight in gold when backed up by a standard pike formation to keep the idiots off.

>>13660606

>It's a FUCKING GIRL beating an ENTIRE TEAM of boys

Still haven't accounted for the possibility that maybe they sucked.

>>13660513

Dark Souls has war picks but the moveset is fucking awful

>>13660617

You kind of hit the nail on the head.

Swords are romanticized since it requires skill and finesse since you're up close. The fact they were used more by nobility (more metal as oppose to a spear tip or mace head) probably helped.

Two skilled sword fighters is entertaining to watch.

But if you have the choice and it's life or death- stab the fucker. Sort of matches into the self-defense rule of "finish it in 5 moves. If you can't- run." It's easier to pull off those 5 moves when your out of you foe's reach, and he has to dance around your weapon.

Were axes/maces any good at breaking the spear?

>>13660603

Okay, let's take a 1v1 for the sake of argument. Are you assuming that a dude with a brain is going to stay where he can't do jack shit cause his opponent with a spear has greater reach, and just parry the hits as they come along till he screws up cause he WILL screw up and gets fucked? At least in my case, I'd make it a priority to close the gap as fast as possible so that the other dude is stuck using the haft to deflect and backtracking to get back in his comfort zone. If I screwed up, I'd just back out of range and wait for a chance to get under his guard again.

>>13660355

gays*

>>13660513

Assassin’s Creed 2 & Brotherhood

>>13660649

Can you parry with a spear? It's doable, but I'd have though it'd be tricky.

>>13660622

>clearly outsmarted and outskilled her on numerous occasions

accounted for

>girl vs an entire team of boys

Life is not an anime or a gender neutral tumblr-bait cartoon. By puberty boys have immense advantages over girls in strength, dexterity, reaction times, and every other physically relevant trait you can think of. The average man is stronger than 99% of women. You can start lifting for a few weeks and easily overpower female bodybuilders that have put years into it. For a girl to beat an entire team of boys in their prime, they would either have to be a statistical anomaly of faggotry, or the game was rigged. I really don't think my buddy would have sent me a video of bad kendo guys without telling me, and especially he wouldn't lie about the video being infamous with kendofags.

I used to keep a tally of how many JRPG main characters didn't use swords as their favored weapon, and the list was pretty small. From the top of my head:

>Atelier Iris: Eternal Mana (staff)

>Legend of Legaia (unarmed)

>Tales of Legendia (unarmed)

>Tales of Xilila (unarmed, Jude only)

>Illusion of Gaia (flute)

>Terranigma (spear)

>Wild Arms (gun, staff)

>>13660606

Define for me then what the "truest warrior's weapon" is because that sounds like a rather ambiguous term.

If the criteria we're using is effectiveness than I would say the spear/polearm/halbred. At least up until bows/guns star appear that let soldiers reach further. If the metric is style then I suppose the sword is more elegant in that it's not as lanky as a pole weapon. Style alone sounds like a real faggy way to determine what the "truest warrior's weapon" is though.

>>13660649

In your example it sounds like a the skill handicap will be the determining factor. Assuming both fighters are of equal skill the polearm fighter will have the advantage unless he fumbles terribly. If the fellow with the shorter weapons is better trained and competent with his parry ability it's not impossible for him to gain advantage in the polearm fighter's comfort zone.

Even if I was competent with a short sword + buckler or guarding sword I still wouldn't be to eager to take on a pikeman. I'm sure with the training I could learn the movements to counter him but it's not a fight I would to have. I'd rather retreat and attack him when he had no effective way to reciprocate. Assuming 1v1 and we're playing in an arena with an out of bounds I'd lose every time unless I got courageous and attempted the parry.

I did lose to such a fellow in the tournament I was in but he was fairly well trained with his parry. I only managed to get him when he wasn't using his guarding sword and was instead using a boken only.

>>13660688

A lot depends on the length of the spear. The longer the spear the less it can be used for individual combat/self defense and the more it has to be used in formation. A short spear, barely longer than you are tall would be VERY effective for parrying, exactly the same as a quarterstaff.

Oh, Terraria is also an option. But spears kinda suck early on for melee. Swords do more damage, but Spears hit at range, and have knockback. Great for groups of smaller enemies. Big enemies and bosses tend to be immune to knockback (but you hit them multiple times due to their size).

The end-tier weapons can do great stuff. Only other "melee" weapon are thrown weapons like boomerangs/chakrams, hammers, and Yoyos.

>>13660704

>Define for me then what the "truest warrior's weapon" is because that sounds like a rather ambiguous term.

Why don't you ask OP that question?

>>13660709

Life is not an RPG.

>>13660688

nice digits

He was referring to the guy with the sword parrying the spear man.

>>13660713

A full length spear can actually be quite unwieldy unless you're using it to poke/stab at someone. You can kinda "pool cue" it to some extent but if you over extend and they push your tip into the ground you have to be quick on the back step because they'll be on you before you know it. If they're good at parrying you're pretty much toast if they get inside your stabbing range.

From my tournament- What I found effective was "faking" certain pokes. I'd feint several attacks and attempt to get my opponent to take the bait and follow through with the actual point poke once they over extended or attempted to parry in the wrong direction.

The guy who beat me was good at reading my tells and he always countered my true poke.

>>13660733

Ladies first.

>>13660737

So does a decent swordsman in a 1-1 fight and his parrying be on equal footing with a spearman? Or would the swordsman need to be extremely good and the spearman crap (not feinting- just stabbing wildly) to make it equal?

>>13660749

Learn to fight with finesse so fighting like a warrior becomes second nature? Trick them out with a dodge/feint then turn the fucker into ribbons like a wolf with a rabbit.

>>13660756

That's the trick with the spear. There's not too many different way to use it. Assuming it's not a halberd you're basically working with one very long pointy stick. I can't swing it, I can only stab. That somewhat limits what I can actually do. Going in as a full pleb all you really need to know is to stab the guy you're fighting with the pointy end. In this way you're probably going to feint by accident since your feint and your main killing poke are almost identical ( and tricky to distinguish for an unskilled soldier). Knowing this information it's easy enough to mix things up and create little combos of feints and stabs.

Here's the rub- Seeing as how the actual part that I kill with is only a small fraction of the weapon's size I have to be very careful if I'm going up against a skilled swordsman. My combat options diminish drastically if he can stick my spear in the ground or deflect it into the air.

If we're using a tag system I'm basically dead if I have no secondary weapon. In my case I didn't carry one since I knew if they got through my spear I was fucked anyway with their sword and guard sword combo. I basically had no training with swords. That and carrying extra stuff adds to your overall weight. Unlike video games it's not a good idea to lumber into battle carrying 4 or 5 different melee weapons. You just slow yourself down and get winded faster.

I did manage to best one guy with a bokken but it was through dumb luck and not real skill IMHO. Fights seemed to take longer with swords since I couldn't just poke and win.

>>13660513

I think Mount&Blade has this

>>13660825

No, war is almost entirely about winning. Not the same. A war and a warrior can exist for completely different reasons.

>>13660800

You'd go down a storm on /tg/ friend.

IIRC, one of the Soul Calibur games had a girl with a spear and a short sword (albeit she wielded the spear in one hand, and a short sword in the other). Sure you are fucked once you lose a spear, but an off-hand dagger at least gives you something if you can't run.

>>13660950

There was no way for me to hold it effectively. Basically it was a "bring what you can carry" to the fight. I could have slipped it into my pants awkwardly but if the spear got parry'd I'd have maybe .5 seconds to react before I got tagged. That means I have to draw the parry blade and effectively guard in less than a second. Nevermind the fact I wasn't trained at all with swords and fighting a guy who specifically trained with them. That's also assuming I figure out my spear has been effectively parried since it can take a moment for me to realize my spear has been parry'd in the heat of a fight.

I figured I'd cut my losses and lose the extra weight rather than awkwardly fumbling a blade that I had no experience wielding and would probably be too slow to draw with anyway.

That and he was one of my last fights of the day. I was burnt up, aching and wobbly on my feat. At that point my only option was the poke. Even if I wasn't running on empty he was damn good with parry and he probably could have out skilled me at my best unless I got a lucky poke in. I will say I bested him earlier in the day when he wasn't using his guard sword and relying on the bokken only. He paid attention though and didn't make the same mistake again in our rematch.

>You'd go down a storm on /tg/ friend.

what does that mean?

>>13660996

That combo is what countered my spear. Although technically his secondary was a sai which is actually more adept at countering spears than a dagger/short sword I'd say.

>muh pointy stick

>literally a peasants weapon

>weapon of choice for niggers

I can see why you like them.

>>13660749

Do I see an 8-sided star of Chaos on his shoulder?

>>13660345

Pike and shot

>>13661010

>what does that mean?

You'd get along with them.

>>13660702

>Final Fantasy IX (dagger)

>Suikoden (staff)

>Suikoden II (tonfa)

>Suikoden III (dagger) Hugo is the canonical flame champion heir

>Suikoden V (sanjiegun)

>Any Super Mario RPG (unarmed/hammer)

>Xenogears (unarmed)

>Fire Emblem 7 (greataxe)

>Parasite Eve (guns)

>Pretty much any Shin Megami Tensei and spin offs except for Persona 3, 4 and SMTIV IIRC

>Growlanser 2 (scythe)

>Eternal Sonata (baton)

>The World Ends With You (crazy shit)

>Earthbound (bat, yoyo)

>Blue Dragon (shadow)

>Xenosaga (high-tech shield like thinguie)

>Chrono Cross (weird looking monk spade)

>Dark Cloud 2 (wrench) though the main girl uses a sword

>Shadow Hearts (unarmed)

>Trails in the Sky (staff)

>Most other games in the Atelier series

The list is quite big if you stop to think for a minute.

>>13660321

>tfw no spear with 5 ft long handle and 5 ft long blade

I wish there was a vidya that actually had different reasons to use different weapons and shit, imagine using a fucking pike in the middle of a tiny cramped dungeon.

YOU CAN, ITS SUPER EASY BECAUSE VIDYA LETS IT HAPPEN ALL THE TIME AND THEN BALANCES PIKE AND POLEARMS WITH LOW DAMAGE INSTEAD OF UNWEILDLYNESS

>>13660321

Agreed. Swords are a nobleman's weapon. They aren't effective against armor, because that's literally the point: they're designed to be used against armored nobles, to hurt them a little bit so that they can be captured and ransomed later. Swords are also useful against peasants, who are usually unarmored.

They're not a serious tool of war. They're not a warrior's weapon.

Spears are pretty good, but only if you're fighting in groups. Otherwise, an axe is your best bet. You have the blunt force trauma that can go through armor, but you still have a blade, giving you an advantage against unarmored opponents and utility as a tool for cutting.

True warriors carry a spear and shield for fighting with their comrades, and an axe for up-close fighting.

>Ctrl+f

>no Onimusha

Anyone who didn't think of this game should kill themselves right the fuck now.

>>13661183

enjoy using your crappy boom boom stick in the forest and dying of elements

>>13661188

>some shitty metal balls in the club

>some retarded spiked club

No, I will take my macuahuitl and cut you in half with a single blow, shitter.

>>13661189

Every warriors have a sword though, either as main weapon or a sidearm.

>>13660321

Anon you're sure gonna love Nioh.

>>13661206

Some do. Many don't. Roman legionnaires, for example, only had a shortsword. Their primary weapon was always a polearm. But this was before high-quality steel armor, so the sword wasn't yet an inferior weapon against an armored opponent. The sword remained in use mostly because of the intertia of ritual and class connotations.

>>13661109

You can use a variety of weapons in any mainline SMT, barring Nocturne, which is fists and magic.

>>13660650

Enjoy getting face-fucked by a mace during the reload when you miss.

>>13661238

>Not carrying a backup weapon.

>Using a crossbow in single combat, instead of at the rear of a formation.

You're half-right. Crossbow > all, but only in groups. Much like polearms.

>>13661219

I'm pretty fucking sure the roman legionnaires had their gladius as their main weapon, as the pilum is frankly meant for throwing, not a main weapon.

>>13661203

>macuahuitl

>cutting anything in half

LMAO. That shit is just an overrated wooden club with glass shards. Not to mention it's shape prevents it from cutting anything reliably anyway. It's a shit tier stone age weapon used an an equally shit tier stone age "civilization". You're probably a mexinigger too.

>>13661268

Are you going to paddle their bottom anon?

>>13661295

The point of the pilum was mostly to pierce the enemy's shields and weigh them down, so they couldn't effectively block the legionnaire's gladius.

But even so, most games use heavy plate armor, not the light segmented metal or leather armor of the Roman era. The sword's usefulness continued to decline with the advent of better metallurgy and armor construction.

>>13661300

>wooden club with glass shards

>implying volcanic rock known as obsidian is not the sharpest material on the planet

Perhaps your pointy stick is a shitty stone age weapon. Take it and shove your up your ass, nigger.

>>13661305

I can spank your bottom, anon. With the obsidian pieces.

>>13661327

>implying volcanic rock known as obsidian is not the sharpest material on the planet

It's not.

>>13661327

>I can spank your bottom, anon. With the obsidian pieces.

B-but I've been good daddy!

See how good that spear does you when you’re fighting in an army and you drive it through one soldier, then another soldier sneaks up behind you and chops your head off while you’re pulling the spear out of the first soldier.

Spears are good with 1-on-1 battles, but in actual warfare, on a battlefield? Nah.

>>13661360

You have it exactly backwards. In war, spearmen fight in a row, each defending the other's side with their shield. This was such an effective technique that it made cavalry effectively useless in combat during the Renaissance.

>>13661343

Explain why they're used for scalpels, then. They're the sharpest and have the least chance of infection in surgeries - that's why they're used in medicine, dear torfag.

>>13661348

Tell that to the macuahuitl, anon.

>>13661374

>Scalpel blades are usually made of hardened and tempered steel, stainless steel, or high carbon steel; in addition, titanium, ceramic, diamond and even obsidian knives are not uncommon.

>usually made of […] steel

Also, "sharpness" isn't an intrinsic quality of a material in the same way that hardness is.

>>13660513

to this day battle brothers is the only game i've ever seen where a pick is actually effective against heavy armour. to the point where if the enemy is wearing mail or plate your pick guy is actually dealing 2x damage to his armour

>>13661268

can't you bludgeon people with swords too?

>>13661526

well, big ones

You are all tremendous faggots.

>>13661536

They're the shitskin munchkins.

>>13661659

Isn't it more like (1) swords do less damage, but are highly accurate, (2) axes deal heavy damage but have shit for accuracy, and (3) lances are the happy medium, as far as Fire Emblem games go?

That's how it always seemed to me, at least.

>>13661696

Most of the time sword users end up hitting twice against most enemies so they do more dmg anyway.

>>13661766

Martial arts in general are glorified dancing with willing partners, with pretty much no relationship to actual fighting.

>>13661188

A macuahuitl is functionally more like a shitty sword than a club. It's heavier than a normal sword and has no thrusting point, but ultimately it's designed to cut along its length.

I just punch people in the face to death

>>13661841

That's retarded.

>>13661845

This thread is mostly about shitting on swords, so I'm not sure where you got that idea.

>>13661876

The classic Indiana Jones technique.

>>13661072

That's a bar mace.

>>13661787

Don't get me wrong nothing wrong with that, it think it's a neat idea to challenge oneself this way. I'm talking about cunts that during a game or a dance willingly deny themselves the best avaiblive option and expect some sort of recognition for it like it's a medal of honor and get pissy if they don't get it.

>>13662001

*Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with martial arts or people that challenge themselves this way…

accidentally pressed send

>>13661962

These all just look like cat dicks to me. I have never seen a cat dick.

>>13662001

I see what you're saying. Yeah, I completely agree with that.

>>13660321

So you're saying you prefer long, hard poles?

>>13662062

Too front-heavy to use like a spear. You couldn't grip the center of balance, since it's in the blade.

>>13662064

>Swords can be useful against armor, you jab the point in between gaps in the armor

If you're that close, you should just use a stiletto.

>or you use the pommel and beat your opponents head in with said pommel.

If you're in position to do that, why not just use a mace?

Swords aren't good against armor. Just because you can use them in that role doesn't mean they're a good fit for it.

>>13662114

>Drawing of a guy with bare hands.

>Half-swording with bare hands.

This is a terrible idea.

>>13662126

If you don't do it right it can be, yes. Mostly dangerous if it's the enemy's sword, but your own much less so.

If you have proper gloves it is 100% a non issue.

>>13662127

The drawing he posted doesn't have a safe area above the handguard to hold, like the sword in your image.

>>13662139

I'll take your word for it. I wouldn't do it without gloves, but I'm also not a HEMA autist. so maybe I'm wrong.

>>13662142

Your point is moot because it was a thing that was done with the swords with the grips and/or with gauntlets.

>>13662161

Read the thread.

>>13662190

I was not pretending to be retarded. Calm your tits.

>>13662216

I think bullying is the standard response.

>>13662240

Thank you.

>>13660513

Put a spike on the top and stick it on a pole and you've got a mean polaxe.

Also, glaives are the best polearm, fight me.

>>13662282

What exactly do you mean by "naginata-style glaive"?

Also, that's a pitiful excuse for a sword-catching hook in your image. (I was going to call it a billhook, but I don't know if that's the proper term or not.) Also, that blade is too curved to be an effective piercing weapon. It's only good for slashing.

A good glaive can pierce, slash, and catch enemy weapons.

>>13662324

thats not a sword catching hook nigger, can't you see its a key holder

I can't post images because TOR, but the left-most glaive in the image here is the best type of glaive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glaive

>>13662342

Fair enough.

>>13662355

Most games do that, unfortunately. I wish there were more where you just lowered your weapon when you're up against a wall. Most just keep showing it, which breaks the illusion and makes your gun look like a toy.

>>13662376

>Having keys.

Joke's on you, I'm homeless.

>>13661121

no one will ever try to take his wand again

>>13660321

Spears are literally simplistic noob weapons. Good for peasants with minimal training because all you have to do is stab. Any Swordsman with half a brain can take out some smuch with a spear. Even in groups greatswords are a counter to pike formations.

>>13663066

>Any Swordsman with half a brain can take out some smuch with a spear.

What makes you think this? If I can stab you at a greater distance than you can stab me, then, all else being equal, I win.

>>13663147

Because all spears can do is stab. If someone knows how to counter a basic thrust then you're fucked. Swords have a higher skill ceiling.

If two people with no training of relatively equal strength fight each other, one with a spear and one with a sword, the guy with the spear will most likely win. The spear is easier to use than the sword. But if both people are highly trained, then the guy with the sword will most likely win because his weapon is much more versatile and effective than a spear. There is only so much you can do with a spear and it has a much lower skill ceiling. Distance is only one advantage that can be negated as long as you know what you're doing with a sword.

>>13663326

>Because all spears can do is stab.

Glaives and similar polearms can slash, too.

>Distance is only one advantage that can be negated as long as you know what you're doing with a sword.

That guy talking about a bunch of kendo-ka losing to a naginata-ka seems to indicate otherwise, and they were all (apparently) trained.

>>13661189

Did anyone in history ever seriously use an axe as a weapon? I doubt it.

>>13663476

>Did anyone in history ever seriously use an axe as a weapon?

Yes. Frequently. Along with scythes, knives, pitchforks, and other tools that happen to be viable in combat. There are axes that are specifically designed to be combat weapons, and axes that are specifically designed to be thrown at enemies.

>>13663411

>Glaives and similar polearms can slash, too

Well those aren't spears, those are Glaives and Polearms. Glaives can have an okay slash but most polearms have very weakening cutting that is often hindered but the tip of the weapon. They still can't perform the wide range of parry's and cuts a sword can.

>hat guy talking about a bunch of kendo-ka losing to a naginata-ka seems to indicate otherwise, and they were all (apparently) trained.

First, we don't know anything about the skill level of these people, second a naginata isn't a spear, third kendo as a combat style isn't meant for real combat. It's a heavily regulated form of sport fighting. If that girl was trained in a form of real combat and not a sport combat, she'll have an advantage. HEMA is an example of something that is much closer to real combat and much more effective. Put her up against someone trained that way she'll have a much harder time. But maybe this person is some prodigy, in which case she could pick up pocket knife and decapitate someone.

>>13660606

>It's a FUCKING GIRL beating an ENTIRE TEAM of boys. If that doesn't set the alarm bells off in your head, I don't know what will.

The question is - did those boys only practice against swords?

>>13663476

i realize this is just one fag's experience, but i used to be pretty seriously into SCA combat groups and can't speak for anyone else but axes are fucking useful as all hell in "battle" and i'd rather have one than a sword 100% of the time, although having one of each is the best combination i can think of. axes have a ton of impact and a strike with one of those is just devastating, and you can use the curved head to hook an enemy's shield, pull it towards you and run them through or bash them. they're a great weapon for controlling your opponent, and even if you have just one and a shield you can basically run the fight, keep them off-balance and dismantle them

feel free to bully me for being such a larping faglord

>>13663476

like spears they're easy to manufacture and easy to train some one to fight with. Also serves many uses outside of the battlefield.

>>13661327

>>13661343

>muh obsidian is sharpest thing on earth

And most fragile. I bet it wouldn't get through a gambeson which is literally just padded cloth. That's right, CLOTH, fucking CLOTH stops your shit tier wooden club dead in it's tracks. Fuck of spic and take your shit tier stone age paddle with you.

>>13661406

>>13660513

>>13660803

Mount&Blade is a good option. War of the Roses is quite satisfying and visceral to use weapons like warhammers because it annihilates tin cans, but it's also unreasonably difficult to actually do well because it requires accurate usage of weapons. For example if you use a weapon like a warhammer or halberd and hit someone with anything but the head of the weapon it does fuck all. This wouldn't be a problem if it didn't have M&B style camera and movement, where players use only their torsos to swing weapons which is fucking retarded, so players dance around each other and once again spamming swings with a two handed sword is the easy and effective option. Ironically Dark Souls is one of the few games to get this correct, attacking with a melee weapon requires all of your body to be done correctly and attacking should result in you being briefly "locked" in an attack animation. Of course the weapons and attack animations themselves are quite unrealistic in DS, but the principle is what is ironically missing from so called "realistic" games like WotR and M&B.

>>13661374

The macahuitl is a wooden club with obsidian shards stuck in it. It's a spiked club, dude. The obsidian will break off of the wooden club before you ever penetrate any meaningful form of armor. Steel weapons are actually maintainable. They are hard and sharp enough to penetrate armor when designed properly, but also malleable enough to not break after prolonged use and can be bent back into shape by a weaponsmith with little effort. You don't need a weapon sharp enough to be a scalpel to kill people.

>>13664711

checked but you also forgot to mention war of the roses is fucking dead and p2w kike garbage by paradox

>>13663476

Lots. You almost always want to use it with a shield though. Some exceptions exist like the Dane axe and the Sparth axe. Usually once you get to that point though you would also want to have a point on your long stick, makingn it a polearm.

>All these faggots forgetting the pollaxe was a popular knight weapon during the medieval period

Once armor became advanced enough to discard mandatory shields, the race for the choppiest choppa was on.

>>13661268

Is the handle a dildo?

What sort of faggot would even use that shit?

>>13662087

This has got to be bait.

>>13665511

>Also it's spelled poleaxe not pollaxe for future references anon

Not true at all. Poleaxe was what it was later known as and it was always spelled pollaxe.

>>13666985

Not fastest, just bumped last.

>>13667151

>baiting

5/10 you got me to reply twice

>>13661546

>Every FF with a main character, except 9

Did you forget FFVII Buster Blade It's not a practical sword but it is a sword

>>13660526

You do realize that what you described is the specific reason that naginatas are the traditional weapon of women martial artists in Japan, right? It's literally the closest thing you can get to equalization between combatants of opposite sexes without resorting to firearms. Someone good at a naginata is going to annihilate jobbers using knives, swords, and other close quarters bullshit. Even if you don't know what you're doing, you're still going to have a chance to survive, just on account of having a weapon that's superior for the job.

So why the fuck would anyone use a weapon that wasn't a pole arm? Well, kendofags aren't going to do shit against that sort of thing, because of their inferior weapons. But a big ass claymore in the right hands can be used to do something that you can't do in mock combat - removing the bladed tip. That's the primary way that two-handed swords were used, and for a very good reason. Cleaving through lines of pikes is pretty much the only thing you can do against that sort of attack.

Swords or maces will also be a lot more effective against armored combatants than pole arms, depending on the situation. Polearms are great against mounted knights - but even then, mounted combatants could still break formations just using the fear that if they went down, a mass of horse flesh was going to crush the dipshit holding a pike.

As for swords:

>>13661546

>Importantly, the trope started long before video games. Almost every sword-and-sworcery book after Lord of the Rings uses a sword as a major plot device, to the point where even back when David Eddings was writing the Belgariad in ~1980 he used a sword for the main character because it was already a trope.

This is something even older than that. Swords are a big thing in ancient legends, particularly those of Europe. The sword is the symbol of heroism, and there's a damn good reason that it's the most common weapon for fantasy heroics. It's iconic, and over time, it's only become more iconic.

Something like a spear works much better as the image of peasant weapon - and thus, polearms are also fairly common to see, since they represent a sort of peasant hero. Of course, since the Hero's Journey typically involves a progression, you're going to see that transition from spear to sword quite a bit. Sometimes very early on.

Also:

>David Eddings

My nigga. Though you are critically forgetting that the most important weapon featured in the Elenium is actually a spear.

>>13660321

>Fuck your swords!

He says with an image of a sword on a spear…

People carried and used both pole weapons and swords simultaneously, comparing the two is like trying to compare handguns to riffles, of course the riffle will have more range and power, that doesn't mean a soldier will refuse to carry and use a handgun because he already has a "superior tool" or that someone will win against a guy with certain weapon just for having a "superior weapon", that's just stupid, both kill the same and are used according to circumstance.

>>13667480

I think a lot of the sword's mythicism also comes from the transitional age between the bronze age and the iron age. Bronze couldn't be forged into a sword with the length and shape of the swords as we know it without using a whole lot of mass. A lot of unearthed early bronze age era swords were more like long narrow daggers and later they were shaped solidly like the khopesh or falcata. However bronze is a softer metal where you literally have to work its edge by continuously pounding it to get the edge to harden and compared to iron swords, would seem to lack in toughness and hardness. If an army still largely armed with bronze weaponry met with an army armed with iron weaponry, it would end with a slaughter where the bronze weapons were consistently defeated and destroyed. Spearheads made of bronze already use much less metal than a bronze sword. An iron sword thoroughly demolishing a bronze spearhead like in the legends wouldn't be weird, but through IRL tests, we already learned that even a well made steel blade with keen edge, trying to cut through the shaft of a polearm in someone's hands is actually a really hard task. I suspect the legends of the swords began when iron swords consistently destroyed bronze weaponry.

>>13667878

Go look up some swordsmithing videos. I think the sword's legendary status comes from the fact that it was hard to make and took days of labor and tempering, followed by days more of sharpening and polishing before a smith could even start putting on all the absurd little flourishy, artistic bits on it. This made swords expensive, but it also made them works of art.

A smith could shit out a few dozen spearheads and smack them onto some poles in a day, but a truly good sword was an investment or labor and effort.

>>13667854

>highly trained and skilled fighter

>gets defeated by flab just for having le "seperior wopon"

Besides, if you really are a master swordsman chances are you also know how to propperly use and counter long pointy sticks.

>>13667903

also see

>>13663613

>>13667903

The methods for swordsmithing as they are today didn't truly come in existence until quite recently. We as a species have been making swords for close to 8000 years minimum. I'm actually familiar with the history (and legends) surrounding early east asia effort in iron smithing, particularly Japans, where smiths were prospecting mountains after mountains looking for the purest meteoric iron deposits to make "an undefeatable sword that would cut through anything". In those days, it probably meant consistently defeating bronze weaponry or being able to cleave through bronze short swords for example. Bronze swordsmithing is actually a wonder on its own. The amount of work needed to make bronze harden up by compressing it is actually quite astounding

>>13660537

no, cortez conquered an entire civilization with some pikemen

>>13660414

Not necessarily. You can always change your grip to turn your spear into a short range thrusting weapon. Spears are very versatile, there's a reason why they're so prominent. Still, swords are the king. A lot of people underestimate just how intricate swordfighting really is, and how effective you can be with swords when properly trained.

Of course, firearms make them irrelevant. But back in the day, it was all spears and swords, really.

>>13668631

<shoot the blade to deal more damage, as the blade shifts up and down compared to shooting the damn person

I like it for the wrong reasons

>>13669068

>>13667405

Is Cloud just a worse Guts with blonde hair? Because I just realized the pose Guts is doing in that pic is also the pose Cloud switches to after his sword spinning thing at the end of every fight in FF7.

>>13660321

"Swords are for faggots", he said while tightly gripping the long shaft of his spear, the feel of its firm hardness calming his mind.

>>13669548

1 and 3 look like they go on top of an orthodox christmas tree

>>13667096

Quarterstaffs are the worst. They don't have a large payload at the top for effective use as a blunt weapon. They don't have a point for piercing. They don't have an edge for slashing.

They're just sticks.

>>13667798

>comparing the two is like trying to compare handguns to riffles

I agree. Rifles, like polearms, are objectively the superior weapon. They have more power and reach. The only benefit of a handgun is that it is light and small, which is only useful if: 1) you're not planning on fighting, or 2) you need to conceal your weapon. Handguns are not battlefield weapons.

>that doesn't mean a soldier will refuse to carry and use a handgun

The vast majority of professional armies don't even issue handguns to frontline soldiers. It's almost exclusively the weapon of an officer whose job is not combat.

>>13660513

Diablo 2

I hear a hipster.

>>13660321

Yeah but swords are cooler.

>>13683085

Ooh what game is th

>Ubisoft

Nevermind.

>>13683250

It's a shame too, since the armor detail and weapon artwork are excellent. Oh well, I'm hoping that it will rebound like Siege did. Season 4 is going to get dedicated server support but I'm not sure if it'll solve anything.

>>13661268

How did these evolve into fraternity paddles?

>Turns out the spear quite consistently defeat non-plate metal armor

Spears have reach, but in any constrained situation turn almost useless. Swords(most designs, concurrent with spears) are the jack-of-all-trades weapon; they do decently in any situation, but never excel in anything.

>>13660321

You're comparing a side-arm to a main battlefield weapon. Besides, if you know how to use a sword, you know how to use a spear so why not just use fucking both because you can carry both, because hey, it's a side-arm!

Or if you want a main battlefield weapon sword, get a fucking greatsword/montante/bidenhänder. Though, it's also a fucking polearm, essentially.

>>13660406

That's a terrible axe. As in poorly designed, not fearsome.

>>13660442

HEMA isn't larping, it's literally just learning how to kill people with medieval techniques without getting killed yourself. Broken arms and legs are dime a dozen in tournaments which allow ringen/abrazare.

>>13660526

Kendo is a sport, which not only uses a weapon which is shorter than most one-handed European swords, also extremely discourages the use of blocks. You're supposed to get a clean hit or get hit cleanly in kendo, it has fuck all to do with anything resembling swordsmanship.

Also, throwing a bunch of guys who have never faced off against a weapon long than their arm against a fucking polearm and expecting them not to get picked off at range is fucking ridiculous. Binding and entering against a polearm is a skill in and of itself, which kendo doesn't even have an equivalent technique to is even more stupid.

Also yes, longer is stronger. That said, yari > naginata 10/10.

>>13683250

I would recommend it (at this point in it's life) IF you can grab it on a sale. If you can find a crack to try out the combat, please do. The combat is what's fun about it, because of the guard stances and combos.

>>13683085

>actually a halberd

Gonna historyfag on this one.

I don't see halberds, I see something that looks like a voulge, and one that's similar to a bardiche. While the two are very similar, halberds tend to be much longer, have an extra long spike, and while not required the blade area is generally "lumpier"/"more vestigial" in the sense that it is less distinct.

>>13660649

Spears are superior in a 1v1 if you are fighting unarmored and without shield. Just a pain to carry around.

>>13664408

Only post of value in this thread.

<The Spear Virgin

>Overcompensating for length.

>Shoulders weighed down with wood and failure.

>Unwieldy in close quarters.

>Used by peasants and savages.

>Goes home to his cold,empty stone shack.

<The Chad Swordsman

>Noble lineage

>Confident stride

>Expensive heavy armour

>Close range lets him go eye to eye with his enemies and intimidate them with his steely determination.

>Glamorous weapon used by heroes in fiction for millennia afterwords.

>Goes home to his noble manor and loving wife.

Also, the manliest swords in existence are rapiers.

Swords were mostly a status symbol in the old days. Bows and spears were the main weapons, having a sword meant you were either a really successful powerful warrior or a really rich nobleman.

Anyway, they're both shit weapons who kneel before crossbows and bows who carved out the largest continuous empire in history which and then later guns which created the largest empire ever.

>>13689165

>Get with the times.

YASSSS QUEEN

IT'S [CURRENT YEAR]

Honestly I like swords more because you need skills to use it efficiently, fucking spears are just stabby shit that gets fucked up when the enemy goes past your spear tip. Sure, a wall of spear is quite impenetrateable especially if it's fucking phalanx meme, but you're probably fucked when fighting one on one. Also, spears definitely would be widely used because that shit requires hardly any training, cheap to produce, and is efficient in numbers.

>>13689165

>first pic

>it's vz58

>ak47.jpg

I fucking hate you and I hope you get banned.

>>13689709

Zweihander, greatswords, and claymores are all I can think off.

>>13669824

Why, you truly are a rapscallion, a blasted Spanish dog. A Frenchman I bet! Do you not know the sophistication, the class, the elegance of the quarterstaff? It is a gentleman's weapon, unlike the savage barbarism which is the sword or the pike. I have justification when I say this, I truly do: your father must have been beaten by a man wielding such a superb weapon as the quarterstaff! Yes, and I bet he came back bruised, bloody, and broken inside. Truly that should be cause enough for me to wield the quarterstaff, the fact that it has caused to continental simpletons so much grief over the years.

>>13660321

SPears are amazing weapons… for massed infantry in formation. For a single guy using one on his own like you'd do in a video game, they'd be next to useless realistically. The effective range of a spear is however long the pole is. If you've got a bunch of other guys stabbing at anyone trying to draw close, you're a near-impenetrable wall of pointy death, but if you're on your own, you get one good stab before your enemy can close the distance and your weapon's long range becomes a liability.

Maces / Morningstars > Swords and Polearms tbh

>>13688464

>He is using the long stick he has like it's supposed to

A staff is not a spear, retard.

>not that a highly trained individual will be at complete disadvantage against a retard with a spear JUST because of the spear, which is a pants on head retarded idea.

Which is why I assume you're trying to attribute it to me, when I did not say that. Fuck off.

Anyhow, Skallagrim is a fucking moron and I hope he gets hit by another car.

>>13684912

>An axe is garbage because it has no defensive value

No it did have a whole school of defensive combat while the round shield was still around, but once we moved on to kite and later heater shield which did not have proper round edges, that school became obsolete.

>>13689709

>Is there a European equivalent to the Nagamaki?

A war scythe or a short glaive?

>>13660489

In some places it's legal to OC a sword, but not a gun.

>>13660497

You can open carry swords in Wyoming, but you can't concealed carry them.

>implying Yukimura or all other Samurai on horseback didnt also use Katana/Wakizashi/Tanto incase they got disarmed

OP is faggot

>>13665511

>metal armor everywhere except shitty lether for his most crucial bit

GYA

>>13692303

Why can't the ogre just jump on and over the table?

>>13692287

>>13692303

To be honest, with those janky controls, Exanima might not be a bad survival horror.

>>13692326

>Exposing yourself to potentially slipping and tripping

Most fights IRL doesn't devolve into a jackie chan action scene.

>>13692339

The controls take a while to get used to because they're so different than pretty much any other game, but they're actually pretty tight and solid once you understand them. Doesn't stop your character from acting like he's drunk as fuck all the time, but the controls are much better than they seem when you first try the game.

>>13692353

It's a video game, not an IRL fight. IRL fights don't have orcs in them either.

>>13692602

Still doesn't mean we need acrobatic orges of all things.

>>13692614

You don't need acrobatics for that. An ogre could also just use the table as a smacking weapon or push it aside very fast.

>>13684912

Isn't a swordbreaker more useful than a buckler?

>>13692625

Pushing it aside is much more practical (which is basically what the orge did for the bench anyway) but the orge trying to wield a table when the orge can just pummel you to death with his bare hands just fine is just pushing the limits of believably.

Even IRL, improvised weapons when a fight breaks out is pretty rare unless you have handy things like bottles, soup ladles and boiling pots of hot soup lying around that can seriously maim or harm someone. Otherwise it usually devolves into a fist fight. or someone holding a chair up to go lion tamer on his opponent without the jackie chan shit of entangling someone with a chair and then pinning him on the table.

>>13692657

Ogres themselves are pushing believability in the first place. We also do not know if the table is reinforced somehow, and you're giving far too little credit how sturdy a good table is. If you want to get the whole IRL fight in there, an ogre doing anything to the table would scare the living shit out of anyone going 1v1 against one, especially in a cornered state with just a table between you and it. A table it probably can take and swing at you or away before you can react properly.

>>13692287

What if he would retreat to a narrow passage?

>>13692683

>implying taking up the table doesn't need time

>implying the table being swung around doesn't cause momentum which makes it slower compare to just pushing the table out of the way and having the orge go ape on you

>implying in your scenario the anon wouldn't had just legged it when the orge was messing with the table

>Little credit on how study a good table is

A good table that is sturdy also potentially means a heavy table and people don't just start wielding furniture as weapons for the simple reason that they're unwieldy.

>A table it probably can take and swing at you or away before you can react properly.

>See orge coming

>Not legging it

Anon, you're the one pushing the believability here, not the orge.

>>13692718

A sturdy table does not need to be heavy by any means. The right choice of wood and securing bolts can make remarkably light table that can take ages to break by brute force. Especially considering ogres are more often than not superhuman in strength. As it is a fantasy setting, who the fuck even knows what anything is made of.

And anon wouldn't leg an ogre when he is busy shitting his medieval pants with brown sauce because a fucking ogre is swinging a table at you.

Then again, fantasy setting. God killing catgirls every time you bring real life shit into a fantasy setting and all that shit.

>>13692759

Yeah I know about the dead catgirls and all, but we still have to extrapolate from what could plausibly happen from what we know and translate that into the context of "what happens if I give one of the combatants the strength of a silverback gorilla instead" and not "dragon come and destroy everything, the end" which makes for an uninteresting premise but something I have expected from modern games writing.

>And anon wouldn't leg an ogre when he is busy shitting his medieval pants with brown sauce because a fucking ogre is swinging a table at you

The problem with that assumption is that judging from the gear anon has collected by the time the orge ended him, he really shouldn't be acting like it's his first rodeo because in the game the orgre isn't even considered a boss or miniboss

>>13692966

>That's hooking

No it isn't. The basis of round shield era combat revolved around the round shield with the axe (when used) kind of resting around the rim as the follow up weapon for a strike while the duels were still mostly about the shield to shield combat. Basically in the absence of a sword like balance, the axe was instead in the ready position on the shield and when the opportunity came to use it, the axe was easily accessible for a strike as it's already held in the ready position thanks to rest the shield rim provides. That said, the same technique is actually much easier to practice using a sword since balance becomes less of an issue and you can just leverage your sword's pointy bit on the shield rim instead.

>Manuals for axes

Probably doesn't exist for axes as nothing viking was written down as far as martial arts goes, but most of the axe techniques we claim are used today are reconstructed from the descriptions of techniques used in duels/holmgangs and battles from the sagas.

>>13693018

You're talking about making the V-wedge with the shield and the weapon, right? That's not an axe-specific technique, though. That's just like the basic stance with anything held in the right/main hand.

And compared to a sword, it is worse defensively because axes are generally shorter, so you can't find&bind an opposing weapon or shield as easily. But yeah, I thought you were talking about the hooking due to mentioning the shield-shapes.

>>13693277

Oh I mentioned the shields not because of shapes, but because centre grip shields got phased out when the kite shield got introduced and only got popular again when the buckler became a thing.

>>13693298

Well, you can still do the wedge with a forearm grip. It's just that you can't do both sides and you lose a lot of range.

>>13660526

or maybe she was just really good

>>13660526

things to consider

>Kendo is the dipshit sports version of kenjutsu, like olympic fencing is to hema, so the dudes were severely limited in terms of technique

>The dudes probably never sparred against a spear but even if they had, kendo doesn't allow the full range of movement a person can squeeze out of a sword

>The girl might have been more skilled, and considering it's a 1vs1 match, the weapon differences and that kendo practicioners are only allowed to use like 4 different movements or are disqualified, it only proves whoever threw that combat session was a moron.

>>13694930

How about you take the retard hat off and try to say whatever it is you're trying to say, again. Preferably in a coherent and readable manner, as well.

>>13695124

It's worse than that. I talked with a 3 dan extensively once and it was quite enlightening. Good kendo means that when the opponent attacks, you don't block him, because when either of you do get a hit in, it looks nicer. And the rules keep degenerating, further and further as they train for specific maneuvers which give you points, rather than being functional techniques.

>hold shinai forward

>push with the back foot, with none of the rest of your body moving

>lift yourself and blade up with the push and then fall on top of their blade, performing a kiri-otoshi by virtue of having a stiffer grip since the sword hasn't been moved

>tip hits opponents arm = kote strike

<in reality they barely even grazed and at best they might be able to perform a tiny pull-cut in that position

Guns are for real bros.

>>13698829

Remember, it's not even a sport. They ban specific, effective and new techniques if they don't fit in with what "kendo" is supposed to be. It's also a pyramid scheme in terms of how they operate with payments.

That said, the rules within kendo make sense and you will see progress quickly and reliably as long as you listen to what they tell you. Still fucking retarded.

Yeah

no u