/tech/ - Technology★

>a ui which can be toggled on and off

>this is supposed to be bad

LibreOffice is designed so normies can move from using Word without thinking about it. This is hardly "suicide watch" tier.

>>1028404 (OP)

>has shit ui with ridiculous menu structures

>let's jump on the ribbon bandwagon instead

lmfao

I don't mind the interface so much.

>>1028409

*MICROSOFT OFFICE FAGS ON SUICIDE WATCH

I've used earlier versions of Libre Office, and it was a nightmare. Unintuitive, complicated, bloated, and lacking features. Looking for options in many different places. Hope they fixed it. I'm going to check it soon.

>office software

cattles lmfao

>>1028409

B-but cat-v t-told me that f-features are bloat...

>>1028404 (OP)

FUCKING HELL

IS THIS FUCKING OPTIONAL AT LEAST?

>>1028404 (OP)

jesus tap-dancing christ these fad-chasing fucktards.

LITERALLY NOBODY LIKES THE OFFICE UI

ALSO THE REASON NOBODY USES LIBREOFFICE IS BECAUSE ITS COMPATIBILITY IS SHIT.

>updating software

updates break shit

>>1028409

based and reasonablepilled

>>1028449

>>1028460

You do realize that this is an option that you turn on and off.

>>1028449

Try reading before jumping to conclusions, it'll help you out alot in life.

>>1028460

At least it can expoort to PDF for viewing. As far as editing goes, MS Office isn't even compatible with itself. It's such a fucking headache sharing between versions because they've obfuscated it to shit.

>>1028526

>>1028552

It's developer time that was spent on implementing something that literally makes the product worse.

>>1028559

If you're using Office on Windows 10, which statistically, you are, the OS can print to PDF, which makes the idea of integrating it into the product kinda dumb.

>>1028566

Your subjective opinions just make those developers laugh because you have no connection to how they conduct themselves.

>Libbie still not the official mascot

Why would I care about this software's changes in UI when it does not catter to my special needs.

>>1028566

I'm using GNU/Linux, and it can print to PDF, so I don't know why you even bothered making this statement. Exporting to PDF is important if you want to send a resume to someone online and you don't want MS' shitty compatibility to fuck your formatting on their end.

>>1028434

cat -v also think that pipes are the pinnacle of computing.

unpopular opinion: ribbons are kinda good because they force UI devs to think twice about what their fancy new button is actually useful for

>>1028603

You shouldn't be transferring document editing formats in the first place if your document partner has zero need to edit the document. PDF is the reliable standard for exchanging invariant documents.

Calm down, faggots. It's not default.

It's just not experimental anymore and is supposed to help you when you install Linux on your grandparents PC who only ever used MS-Office.

>>1028642

PDF is bloat and unsafe. All applications that used Ghostscript were affected by a bug that allowed for code injection through post script just until some months ago. It's like swiss cheese and everyone knows it.

The format was meant for printing and I wouldn't use it for that either unless I have to because printing from the software gets you better results.

Printing from a printer is a fucking meme too. Why force the printer to have hardware for anything more than placing the dots on the paper?

>>1028672

>PDF is bloat and unsafe.

PDF is an incredibly widespread and popular format, so if you want to replace it you need to come up with a really good alternative.

>>1028404 (OP)

I don't mind this. As long as the barrier to enter GNU/Linux gets lower and more people adopt it.

>>1028679

SVG exists and works. Document formats can also embed fonts.

>>1028697

SVG can contain Javascript, newfag.

>>1028699

If you don't open it in a browser it won't be run

>>1028699

On nanochan 2 you can post svgs and the js won't be run either because of the security policy of the site.

>>1028697

SVG is pretty good for fonts and certain images, but pretty bad for general content.

Also, it is fundamentally an image format and not a document format, making things like text highlighting a lot harder

>>1028713

What about odt then?

* supports freely placable multiline text

* supports all kinds of image formats

* can print it on any PC with an office suite

There is no fucking reason to use PDF these days.

And a PDF book scan is no better than a folder of jpgs.

not to mention svg is supported too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDF

>The Portable Document Format (PDF) is a file format developed by Adobe in the 1990s to present documents, including text formatting and images, in a manner independent of application software, hardware, and operating systems.

I'd say the exact same about .odt.

PDF uses an outdated font representation format, a scripting language to be interpreted instead of being parsed and image encodings specific to the format. It's the definition of bloat.

It's like writing a javascript to generate a page instead of generating the page on the server and sending the finished page to the client.

>>1028718

odt is not designed with immutability and long term archival in mind, while the pdf specs include both of those.

If you notice, pdfs are not exactly popular as editable documents, and for good reason since they are crap at it.

>And a PDF book scan is no better than a folder of jpgs.

Right for quality and disk space, wrong for usefulness.

Much saner to treat the whole book as a single file rather than splitting it in one file per page.

>>1028727

>It's like writing a javascript to generate a page instead of generating the page on the server and sending the finished page to the client.

Ironically, in some cases it's better to let the client generate parts of the page dynamically rather than generating a million different variants on the server.

Classic use cases include frequently updated lists, large lists with many possible sorting methods, configurable layouts...

>>1028743

That's why you have cbt (tar) or cbz (zip). Nobody sane uses PDF for raster images only.

>>1028727

The OpenDocument format was created as a alternative to Microsoft's formats, like doc

PDF unlike doc/odt is a binary document and it does have a free alternative that, apparently, no tech autists even remember, DjVu

>>1028825

I know but that's for scans and so on.

If you make documents yourself there's no reason to convert to it.

And books should be digitized into small epub ebooks instead of shitty pictures of text.

>>1028743

>Much saner to treat the whole book as a single file

How? And even if you're argument was good, zipped images are nothing new. See >>1028820

>>1028743

>generating a million different variants

>implying you have to save and manage them on the server

Dude you just get a request to your script, generate the respond and send it. Script ends and it gets deallocated.

>sorting methods

No problem. Look at piratebay.

>Ironically, in some cases it's better to let the client generate parts of the page dynamically

WRONG That's the complete opposite of what the browser is supposed to do and thus slow as fuck. Generating elements with kikescript, ordering lists over json, letting the server generate an extra json, parsing the json, ordering the data etc. all takes eternity.

You could have just send it in the correct order already in place in the fucking HTML. It's 10x faster and if the exact same view is requested often (like the start page) you can just cache it.

>>1028838

*sorting the data

And that's another big point: If you generate the pages on the server you can cache them instead of having to handle the exact same requests over and over again.

On the client side the same is true for external CSS because the client doesn't need to read the same fucking text again and again and the server doesn't have to send it again and again.

>>1028526

>>1028552

I literally asked the question so I wouldn't jump to conclusions you dumb fucks.

>>1028678

why so many pics of libbie telling me to die ? where is loving libbie ?

>>1028913

>where is loving libbie

in an alternate timeline where the mascot contest was honestly run.

>>1028838

>How?

Because a book is usually treated as a single entity and its pages are usually treated as ordered in a specific way.

Keeping the pages as files goes against both of those, you can work around it but it's better to not create the problem in the first place.

>WRONG

Memeing won't change reality.

>>1029015

>Memeing won't change reality.

(((Avoiding an explanation.)))

>you can work around it

>problem

How is the default alphanumeric sorting of every file manager a problem? Just name them 01.jpg to 83.jpg (don't forget the 0 padding). It works and if you don't like it you can zip it up and call it a cbz. Which I already mentioned in the post you're responding to.

>>1028946

Libre != Gratis

What's so bad about the ribbon? I use it all the time and it's very convenient. Happy to see it in LO, I wouldn't have to go back to Office as much for complicated documents.

so essentially this

https://n3t.host/mumble.html

>>1028702

Oh yeah, the average normalfag knows not to open SVGs in a browser. Nigga normalfags don't know what SVGs are

>>1029210

> ribbon done well

That's like saying "cancer done well". Why is paste literally three times the size of copy or cut? Why are some icons stacked horizontally and some vertically? Why is the menu bar tabbed? Ribbon is a horribly clustered interface that tries to be both retard-friendly with big shiny labelled buttons, and at the same time heavy-use friendly by making an entire toolbox available. These are two audiences on opposite ends of the spectrum, you cannot serve both at the same time.

>>1028404 (OP)

Finally a properly organized selection of settings. It only took 15 years.

>>1028460

>install mscorefonts

>remove 99% compatibility issues

Is this too difficult?

Also why aren't normie distros (mint/Ubuntu) including ms fonts and unrar by default when you select the "install proprietary software" option?

>>1029208

This would only be acceptable on a touch screen. If you have a mouse which can right click this ribbon is useless as fuck. But then again, KDE has their shitty toolbox on desktop corners by default too.

>>1029210

>done good

>has clipboard menu

>>1028409

This, don't forget to sage when you reply to shit tier threads.

The mods aggressively pruned the CTS labs / Intel vuln threads but leave this shit up. Makes you think.

>>1029217

You're a contrarian, we get it already.

No one is interested in how nothing will ever make you happy.

>>1029217

>That's like saying "cancer done well". Why is paste literally three times the size of copy or cut? Why are some icons stacked horizontally and some vertically? Why is the menu bar tabbed? Ribbon is a horribly clustered interface that tries to be both retard-friendly with big shiny labelled buttons, and at the same time heavy-use friendly by making an entire toolbox available. These are two audiences on opposite ends of the spectrum, you cannot serve both at the same time.

>muh size

>muh coherence

I'm not a winfag but there's a reason their customer experience improvement programs can do the statistic and maths for that. I've never come across something as organized as that on any Linux program.

Also the keyboard shortcuts are still legacy that back when I used it I just double clicked the ribbon so it hides everything and even removed the menu bar itself.

>>1028429

They did fix nearly all of the compatibility issues, but the rest is a matter of opinion.

Try the latest version, and see for yourself...

I can't get this to work. Are they using the Qt5/KDE5 plugin in the screenshot? I've reset my user profile, enabled experimental features, and yet no cigar.

I really liked the Microsoft Office's non-flat Ribbon interfaces. (Office 2007 and 2010).

The cancer is not Ribbon, but the flat/low contrast design. Visual separators should be an essential part of this.

By the way the Ribbon interface design license is only free for "applications not competing with Microsoft Office products." So copyright strike is coming soon I guess.

>>1029210

The only problem I have with it is that you can't customize it. I'd like the ability to expand or remove them, for example I've never used a UI button for copy/paste before in my life so it's just wasting space there. The text below the sections is also useless for anyone with more than 3 braincells, and anyone who's used the program for longer than 5 minutes. Furthermore you could be able to drag sections to reorganize them and drag them into different tabs.

For MS paint I'd like to be able to expand the brush size panel so you can switch brush size in 1 click, and selection options so you can toggle transparent selection. You could make the color swatch selection scalable so you can drag it to become wider and have space for more colors.

>>1029217

>spergin rebuttal (g as in virgin)

>complains about software that they probably don't even use

>literally complains 80% of the time IRL

Found the pathetic, otherwise well done for baiting me!

They better keep this fucking cancerous shit an option only.

Good the more normalfag friendly it get, the more mainstream it will get.

Having the same thing as Office without needing to download GBs, less bloat, not needing to pay a subscription or crack it seems like a great thing. Way to gather attention even from schools and Unis or small companies.

Deserves a formal mention to Libbie

>>1031747

LibreOffice is not primarily meant to edit OpenXML documents, so legally speaking they are not competing with Microsoft Office.

>>1032455

What's troff?

>>1033095 troff (/ˈtiːrɒf/, short for typesetter roff) is the major component of a document processing system developed by AT&T Corporation for the Unix operating system. troff features commands to designate fonts, spacing, paragraphs, margins, footnotes and more.

I updated my LibreOffice to try this, and now I can't figure out how to turn it back off after tabbing it. How do I set it back to how it was?

>>1033206

Nevermind, I figured out how to turn it back off. Under the "view" tab, you must click "menubar" to view the menubar again.

Why is it that contrarians and revisionists are suddenly claiming that the ribbon ui was a good idea?

>>1028409

>a ui which can be toggled on and off

Which is what Word should have fucking done in the first place.

>>1029205

>I like Ribbon toolbars over dropdown menus

Honestly, it depends on the application. For Word, it definitely made sense. Not so much for Access, Excel, or power point.

However, it should have absolutely been fucking optional.

I want to see them do a version of Outlook though

that would be awesome

they did the rest of the office suite already

>>1033212

Everybody who wasn't a boomerfaggot or the kind of drone that put "Microsoft Office 2003" on their resume as a significant skill thought that the ribbon was a good idea.

So, which are you?

>>1036242

>redditspacing

no need to reply, all your credibility is lost.

>>1036263

How ironic for you.

>>1033212

I've always thought it was a good idea. The latest 0365 Outlook has a preview mode that makes it pretty minimal but is easy to bring up. They've kind of attempted this before but this is the most refined it's been where you don't also need a second bar with commonly used commands

>>1032455

This but with Geoff (GNU troff)

>>1029228

>Also why aren't normie distros (mint/Ubuntu) including ms fonts and unrar by default when you select the "install proprietary software" option?

Because they're not necessary you inbred fuck. The Liberation family of fonts is metrically identical to the Arial, Times New Roman and the monospace one that nobody uses. For Cambria and Calibri there is Carlito and Caladea. For Comic Sans MS there are a billion replacements, including Comic Relief.

The problem with compatibility goes way beyond fonts. LibreOffice simply cannot render complex MSO documents properle because they're closed standard. It's a pain in the ass to port MSO documents to LO, especially Excel and PowerPoint ones.

>>1032399

>complains about software that they probably don't even use

So you tell people that dogshit software is good and that you should use it, and then get butthurt when people tell you otherwise?

>>1028404 (OP)

Nice, Libre office has the ribbon now.

>>1028404 (OP)

That's nice, but it's still shit.

>>1036780

Unity is shit and has no business on any screen larger than a netbook.

>>1029217

>Why is paste literally three times the size of copy or cut?

First off, it's not literally three times, it's four. Second (and I shit you not), this button is actually two buttons: the big icon on top allows you to paste, while the other below will open a dropdown menu. Here's where it gets hysterical: the dropdown menu contains three items: paste (which does exactly like the big icon above, for those of you who like to do in two clicks something they could have done in one - or with a shortcut), special paste (which opens a window for more options), and paste as an hyperlink (which could be moved to the extra window). In short, that button is four time the size of its neighbors so they could add a dropdown menu that serves no practical purpose and could just open a window instead.

>>1029201

Literally this. You can get some great reactions from people when you show them even simple LaTeX templates.

Of course your average office drone doesn't know either Office or LibreOffice so it makes no difference what they use.

>>1028429

Anyone got screenshots from earlier versions? Very curious the evolution of the UI, especially in V1

Time to move to Apache OpenOffice bois, the true successor to IBM Lotus Symphony, with no ribbonshit