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/liberty/ - Liberty

Non-authoritarian Discussion of Politics, Society, News, and the Human Condition (Fun Allowed)
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WARNING! Free Speech Zone - all local trashcans will be targeted for destruction by Antifa.

File: d18db3fcd3ae402⋯.png (134.01 KB, 500x498, 250:249, nnaw8nishsa01.png)

 No.84959

According to Robert Kiyosaki, a good measure of how wealthy you are is how long you're able to live with your current funds if you quit your job today. Does this mean most first-worlders who work and depend on wages for their survival are objectively poorer than African farmers who live off their own land?

 No.84976

File: 0017e0bd9074ef8⋯.jpg (501.7 KB, 917x1136, 917:1136, Adam Schiff is retarded.jpg)

>>84959

>Does this mean most first-worlders who work and depend on wages for their survival are objectively poorer than African farmers who live off their own land?

Not exactly, and the definition of wealth here is not really correct either, it's like if I were to tell you that the measurement of how healthy you are is how long you're able to live without breathing air, and if one even spends a little bit of time thinking about the plausibility of an African farmer being richer than the average individual of the US, he'd find the idea laughable and for good reason.

See here's the thing: Let's say you work in the Video game industry as a concept artist or perhaps some sort of level designers. Hypothetically within that general market, you'd earn around (give or take) $70,000 a year. That's a pretty good career, good prospects, etc but let's concentrate on the $70,000. So what does one do with $70,000 in the period of a year? As you can imagine, a whole hell of a lot, he might buy a new car in that period, or save up to start buying or leasing a nice house with a pool, etc etc. The point in question is; with $70,000 a year, you can live, by most estimates, a fairly wealthy life. Most people within this wage range, usually do live in pretty nice conditions. They are living wealthily.

Here comes your proposition, let's say you were to quit your comfy concept artist job for whatever reason and plan to stay out of the job market for as long as you humanely can.

Awesome! Now you're on this sabbatical to see how long you can stay afloat and just plain relax. Here's the thing: How do you want to live? You see, now you don't actually have a steady flow of income but this is assuming that you've saved a fairly good amount of money. Now you might have to downsize in terms of your home in order to afford everything else you want, you might have to sell the car (but that's if you can't afford the car insurance), in simple terms: If you plan to stay jobless long, you're going to have to forgo a lot of the things that you enjoyed while you had a job.

That African farmer must be richer than you then, right? Wrong. The African farmer objectively lives in absolute shit, you'll notice he does not have any of the things you have with your job but you'll also notice that he's not exactly without a 'job' either, as you just stated, he's a farmer. The problem for him of course, is that he doesn't actually provide that much value to others, he simply lives by whatever it is he can grow and maintain (and that's IF he can maintain it, African farmers by large are not exactly good at what they do), as such he doesn't really obtain a lot of wealth. Put simply, if you wish to gain wealth within the market, you must ultimately provide something of value to your peers in order to gain these things. If you were to stop providing goods, services, investments, etc then ultimately the general population will have no reason to pay you any money at all (unless you decide to live on charity, which is a plausibility but that's not exactly a wealthy life now is it?).

Similarly, the African farmer doesn't really provide a lot of services and as such doesn't actually have as much wealth as you do. Sure he's able to live for as long as he's able to farm for himself, but that's not exactly much of a living as you can imagine. Put simply, the keeping of one's wealth (in general) requires maintenance of market activity on some level, or at the very least, a good amount of savings.

tl;dr: No the nigger isn't wealthier than you are, he's able to maintain this living because it's not really much of a living to begin with. A good wealthy living on the other hand inevitably requires the actual provision of market services in order to keep gaining wealth.

>pic unrelated


 No.84989

>>84959

If most subsistence farmers/third worlders in general "lived off their funds" and quit work they'd die within a week or two tops. If you apply ideal conditions right after harvest, they still aren't looking so well. If you stick a first worlder in this situation during their "less-than-ideal condition" they still turn out better than most subsistence farmers/third worlders. If you ask the first worlder to live like a third worlder with their funds, they can survive for months if not years. Shit, had a buddy who backpacked through Guatemala for half a year couch surfing with family/friends and he spent an average $3/day partying it up every other night.


 No.84991

File: 4055db958fd5eda⋯.png (181.94 KB, 960x684, 80:57, ClipboardImage.png)

>>84959

>>84976

>>84989

why are American savings so low? do they not provide enough market services?


 No.84995

>>84991

Several reasons

>many have massive student loans for useless liberal arts degrees

>many are only capable of providing basic market services like flipping burgers which pay very little

>many people want to live in hip and trendy metropolitan areas like NYC which have huge costs of living

>currency inflation destroys what little amounts many Americans can actually afford to save

>there are others but those are the main ones

And to top it all off, the boomers, who grew up in the post war economic boom, have basically no savings because they are greedy pieces of shit who racked up huge government debt while saving very little since they expected the current generation to pay for their retirement.

America is still a country of huge opportunity if you want to get ahead, the problem is many of the well paying jobs require high IQ (eg engineering) or accepting a less than ideal lifestyle in the eyes of many young adults (eg underwater welding).


 No.85015

>>84991

Another thing to consider is that interest rates have been artificially suppressed to near zero for years by the federal reserve eager to give an allowance to the financial class in the form of quantitative easing. There was even talk for awhile of actually making the interest rates NEGATIVE and causing the act of storing money in a bank to result in lost money all to encourage consumer spending.

Of course anybody should still be able to put 10% of what they get in a paycheck into a bank account for discipline and security but there isn't really the earnings incentive for putting money into a savings account like there used to be.


 No.85022

>>84991

>childhood friend (21) has GED and slightly above entry level job

>still lives in childhood bedroom with mother

>house is ghetto as fuck, basically fallen to shit

>filthy, dark, pets that seem to belong to nobody that actually lives there wandering around and shitting

>spends literally all of his money on tinder thots and recreational shit

>accidentally has a kid with one of these tinder thots, spends even more money on that

>every time I see him, he has new clothes, new accessories, new gadgets, etc.

>bought a fucking motorcycle, have never actually seen him use it

>plans on buying a van and touring the country to get an athletic sponsorship off instagram

Bad parents raise irresponsible kids that blow everything on immediate gratification bullshit, which then proceed to raise even worse kids that do so even more, until shit collapses.


 No.85025

>>85022

Jesus, the first part of the story describes my shit life so well it's almost scary.


 No.85079

>>84976

Ok, lets forget the African farmer then, what if you saved up a good amount of money and quit your job as an artist to buy a piece of property to retire at for the rest of your life, where you will spend about two hours per week tending to a garden that grows all the food you personally need (not counted as work, but rather another chore that you do around the house like cooking or washing dishes), then you could live a decently comfy life for a long time without needing to provide a service to anyone or to sell your labour to others for an income, nor rely on any of their services except maybe medicine.

Maybe "wealth" isn't the right term for it, but in terms of how long you can survive, doesn't this kind of lifestyle put you above both an African farmer (who earns little and spends little) and a European concept artist (who earns a lot and has a lot of expenses)?

>>84989

I didn't mean the third-world farmer would have to live off his funds or the surplus of selling what he grows, I meant that he has to live off his own land, eating whatever he grows for himself.


 No.85086

File: 75bcc84bcdec304⋯.mp4 (2.91 MB, 540x360, 3:2, niggers try to farm gore.mp4)

File: 349cc5b4f139cfb⋯.jpg (250.01 KB, 760x800, 19:20, african are smarter than o….jpg)

File: 337e56d224bced3⋯.jpg (58.53 KB, 551x400, 551:400, white rules africa.jpg)

File: 348eb66eecb2a0b⋯.jpg (760.53 KB, 1104x800, 69:50, help afrika africa superio….jpg)

File: cbcd8692ecb2706⋯.jpg (313.49 KB, 2465x795, 493:159, a world without whites nig….jpg)

>>84959

>African farmers

reminder


 No.85100

>>85086

would humanity undergo at least neolithic revoution if humanity consisted in 100% of niggers?


 No.85136

>>85100

They would evolve to be whiter, anon.


 No.85143

Does he mean just going full NEET? Because two people with the same amount of money who quit working can have very different experiences depending on whether or not they invest that money into something that pays dividends or reinvest in themselves with the goal of getting a new job.

And subsistence farmers are by definition working just to keep themselves alive. If they aren't even producing a surplus to sell or barter at market, then they don't have any similar capital to make similar investments. A "wage slave" who lives paycheck to paycheck and barely manages to survive on that might be in a similar situation to a subsistence farmer but the farmer definitely isn't better off. A farmer producing enough from his land to sell what he doesn't need and redirect that wealth into other needs and wants is more akin to a business owner than a wage worker.


 No.85154

>>85143

He changed his definition because anons told him he was an intellectually lazy cunt. See >>85079


 No.85155

>>85154

>intellectually lazy cunt

>capitalism is just working from paycheck to paycheck to try and survive

This is why so many people choose socialism.


 No.85157

>>85155

>This is why so many failures at life choose the system that gives them free gibs

FUCK THIS FUCK YOU!


 No.85158

>>85155

Why do people think they'd be working less under socialism? The revolutionary vanguard isn't going to let NEETs watch anime and eat Doritos all day instead of serve the community at the waste treatment plant.


 No.85159

>>85157

>socialism has no free gibs, but my system sucks so bad that I literally think lying is my best strategy.


 No.85163

>>85157

They're not right in choosing socialism, but you're not really helping anyone when you talk about capitalism like it's another form of slavery.


 No.85199

>>85155

No one can enslave himself, only choose to force socialism upon others.


 No.85201

>>84959

>According to Robert Kiyosaki, a good measure of how wealthy you are is how long you're able to live with your current funds if you quit your job today. Does this mean most first-worlders who work and depend on wages for their survival are objectively poorer than African farmers who live off their own land?

No, because the African farmer still has to work, just not on the capital of others. He uses his own capital (not just land, for arable land becomes capital), but he nevertheless works.

That metric is not just weird and kinda coming from nowhere (not sure about the context in which he came up with it), it's also not strictly operable if we use the terms it employs correctly. Eating, for example, is also labor, and the farmer and the rich lawyer both starve the same when they stop eating. You kinda know what he's talking about, of course. You can intuitively grasp it. But for an economic analysis, that idea is just not worth very much, sorry.


 No.85202

>>85158

This. If anything, they'd work more, as they'd work to subsidize jobs that produce no real value, on top of working to produce shit people actually need.


 No.85459

>>85158

arent you natsoc after all?


 No.85461

>>85459

He's a leftard posting under a nazi flag so that people here would take his arguments a bit more seriously.


 No.85472

>>85459

No, I'm just an undocumented migrant from /pol/.

>>85461

Why would people on a libertarian board take a supporter of the NSDAP more seriously than something closer to them on the Cartesian graph?

It's not my fault /pol/ picked the Nazi's swastika to be their symbol. I always though Schlomo Shekelstein should have been our mascot, at least for inter-board soccer.


 No.85511

File: dd64114cee242cd⋯.png (64.01 KB, 1113x1115, 1113:1115, ClipboardImage.png)

>>85472

>Why would people on a libertarian board take a supporter of the NSDAP more seriously than something closer to them on the Cartesian graph?

We're not close to leftists on the Cartesian graph, that would nazis, who are practically in the same fucking square as Lenin, Stalin and Mao, hence why you lefty shills choose to LARP as them.


 No.85512

>tfw quit my job ten months ago

>tfw have at least ten months of living expenses left


 No.85516

>>85511

You are closer to many left libertarians than you are to German Nat-Soc, that much is certain.

Well, hate to wreck your awesome theory and delusion of perception, but I'm neither left-wing nor a shill. I just know that the socialism that people who know what it is other than a curt pejorative isn't just endless gibs with no work and Star Trek replicators.


 No.85520

>>85516

Correct. Because socialism also involves leeching off other people's success and parasitizing nationalizing successful industries for The Common Good™


 No.85522

>>85516

>You are closer to many left libertarians than you are to German Nat-Soc, that much is certain.

Read:

>practically in the same fucking square as Lenin, Stalin and Mao

You're a fucking socialist, supporting closed borders or being an edgy racist isn't all it takes to make you right-wing, being capitalist does (cry to me all about how the political compass is wrong). The only reason natsocs are tolerated here is not because anyone wants to be "close" to these retards (lmfao wtf), but because they aren't snarky and annoying moralizing motherfuckers who repeat the same old debunked Marxist arguments, if anything, they are brainlets who are here to be laughed at because they don't know how to debate for shit.


 No.85523

>>85522

>he thinks the Throne and Altar aren't moralfags


 No.85526

>>85522

>You're a fucking socialist

No, I'm not. Why do you need some windmill this badly?


 No.85527

If people have the power to cede from the economy, then that's power taken from the state.




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