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WARNING! Free Speech Zone - all local trashcans will be targeted for destruction by Antifa.

File: 6ee861a386801dc⋯.png (3.4 KB, 543x271, 543:271, images.png)

 No.74482

I may sound crazy, but Cuba needs freedom, so anyone from the gulf coast pick up as many guns as possible and sail to Cuba so we can bring Democracy, low taxes and economic freedom, be ready #freecuba #cubalibre

 No.74484

First we get huge quantities of rifles guns boats and yacht's and sail to Havana on possibly a life mission, and once we arrive in Havana we attack government buildings and giving guns to local cubans and storm all buildings


 No.74485

We seize government houses and radio, newspapers and the, this may fail miserably, but with the right strategy we can win, I recommend reading sun tsus art of war


 No.74487

>>74482

How do we stand up to their mysterious sonic weapon?


 No.74489

We Need to figure it out


 No.74490

We also could ask for us gorvernment support


 No.74492

How can we recruit enough soldiers?


 No.74499

>>74482

Cuba needs markets, not gunslingers. It's like you faggots didn't learn the first dozen times you tried that.


 No.74504

File: 60eff3052870709⋯.gif (927.16 KB, 480x320, 3:2, 37b35eaa45261486b10377b73d….gif)

Fucking bay of pigs 2.0 motherfucker.

Go and kill off all of the population and take the land over faggot Batista.


 No.74531

File: c3ee341abaa5ffb⋯.png (166.4 KB, 320x304, 20:19, ClipboardImage.png)

>>74482

President Castro, I'm CIA.


 No.74546

>>74482

why democracy?


 No.74646

>>74546

I guess because most people tend to conflate democracy with freedom.


 No.74688

>>74504

See you on the beach 🌴


 No.74689

File: 3fd12e8e8f92013⋯.jpeg (20.79 KB, 600x500, 6:5, oh-my.jpeg)

>>74504

>Go and kill off all of the population

I love stereotypes


 No.74699

>>74689

Of course you do like that 100 gorillions


 No.74933

>>74504

why was not batista liked in cuba?


 No.74937

>>74933

I'm no expert on Cuba, but judging by how well communist narratives usually hold up, I say it doesn't matter how good or bad he was. Communists create tyrannies in the popular conception where none are, and they create popular support in the narratives when none was available to them in reality. These sleazy, lying scumbags are enemies of truth and would be proud of it were they not delusional enough to believe their own lies.


 No.74941

>>74937

You can't deny that a majority did love Fidel and organized into militias. There was support for them by Cubans but that's mainly due to them being Landowners, Mafia, Casino, and apart of crime syndicates and Prostitution rings.

If there was so much support for batista as toi imply then why didn't the bay of pigs succeded?

Many of the people working under Batista was working their asses off. When a large majority of the landless citizens were granted with free land and power to toil over it and grab the profit over it they tend to support Castro.


 No.74964

>>74941

>You can't deny that a majority did love Fidel and organized into militias.

I can't because I'm no expert on Cuba, as I said above. Or rather, I can deny it, but not very plausibly. Likewise, you probably cannot plausibly claim it, unless you are an expert on Cuba.

>If there was so much support for batista as toi imply then why didn't the bay of pigs succeded?

Because marching against a state army isn't easy, even when you have vast popular support? I thought that one was a no brainer. Armies have a greater recruitment base, as they are not persecuted and can offer better financial incentives, whereas militiamen have a far more unstable and insecure position and will have to be ideologically motivated.

>Many of the people working under Batista was working their asses off. When a large majority of the landless citizens were granted with free land and power to toil over it and grab the profit over it they tend to support Castro.

See, that's what I simply don't believe unless I'm handed good evidence, or at least until it's substantiated more. I was also told that Russians revolted against the Tzar because they were all living under medieval-esque conditions and were literal serfs, then I found out that serfdom was abolished over a generation before any revolution happened. Most of the time, these narratives are backed with the fact that revolutions happen as a response to oppression, but that's simply not always true. There's little proportion between oppression and resistance. I think I made a whole thread about this, not too long ago.


 No.74966

>>74933

>why was a brutal dictator with extensive ties to the mafia not liked

gee I wonder


 No.74983

>>74964

There's little proportion between oppression and resistance.

How so?

I think I made a whole thread about this, not too long ago.

Link?


 No.75001

>>74482

>getting rid of a form of oppression by imposing an other


 No.75082

>>74983

>How so?

Several approaches show this. You can look at the social and economic standing of actual revolutionaries, for example. Trotskys family were landowners; Stalins father owned a shop; Lenin was an official and part of the lower nobility; Che Guevara could afford to study medicine and travel abroad; Pol Pot and Ho Chi Minh could both afford to study in Paris; Castros family was a reknown philanthrope in his village who sponsored a few buildings; and so on. Why, if there is a link between oppression and resistance, does the resistance come from the least oppressed portion of society?

Another is to compare societies that saw revolutions with those that didn't. Pre-revolutionary France was one of the richest countries in Europe. Other, poorer countries saw no comparable revolts, hence why the French Revolution is so infamous. The Iranian Revolution, likewise, happened in a country that saw some political oppression, but probably no worse than the US or Great Britain at times, and yet in the latter, the oppression of, say, the Japanese or the pacifists during WW2, is all but forgotten.

And yet another, related approach is to just look at how people actually fared in these countries that saw revolutions. Both Russia and France, contrary to the popular narrative, had no serfdom back when their revolutions started. Likewise, the US wasn't an underdeveloped nation at all back when it started the War of Independence. Iranians had a lot of freedom under the Shah, and exiled Russians under the Tzar were mostly moved far away from society but otherwise left largely alone. Russia also had a fairly equal distribution of Land, and so did Vietnam before the Commies fucked it over.

The best thing to do is to take all these in consideration. Ask yourself which strata of the population revolted, if the country really did so much worse than contemporaries that were more politically stable, and if it did bad at all.

>Link?

Was on another board, I remembered.


 No.75103

>Russia also had a fairly equal distribution of Land, and so did Vietnam before the Commies fucked it over.

Got any sources to back that up?


 No.75104

fuck off cunts

cuba is a nice place


 No.75105

>>75104

This, they are also privideing aid to the Chicago south side while the government is negligent.


 No.75112

>>75105

>hey are also privideing aid to the Chicago south side

source? I'm being sincere about this because I never heard that before


 No.75116

>>75103

Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn, Leftism, Pages 146:

>Nor should one have wrong conceptions about the agrarian situation. At the time of the outbreak of the Revolution in 1917 the peasantry owned nearly 80 percent of the arable land, whereas in Britain more than half of the fertile soil belonged to large estates. (Yet Britain had no violent agrarian movement and Russia had.)


 No.75123

>>75105

How nice of them. They can't use that aid to improve the conditions of their own people?


 No.75132

File: 12c70c2fa336f3d⋯.png (834.47 KB, 840x630, 4:3, ClipboardImage.png)

>>74482

Bomb them with money.


 No.75133

File: 8c31083d06a4ce4⋯.jpg (76.75 KB, 750x501, 250:167, cuban embargo.jpg)

>>75123

They are helping them with reducing infant mortality, which is already way lower in Cuba. Besides, improving relations with the USA is probably the best they can do at the moment. Let's not forget that the USA's genocidal embargo and terrorist networks trained and protected in Florida are a significant cause of their poverty. Of course the real question is: can the American Empire be convinced to cease their crimes against humanity?


 No.75137

>>75133

For once I agree with leftists even if your reasoning is shit. The US embargo is what has effectively kept Cuba as a socialist shit hole for so long, and open trade would be the fastest track to freeing their markets and starting a civil war when Cubans can buy nice things that aren't hand-me-downs nd their government panics/tries to stop it.

Honestly that should be war policy for any free market nation dealing with commies/socialists: provide jobs/nice shit/humanitarian aid, and constantly remind them that they could have all this and more on their home turf if they just got rid of their oppressive government.


 No.75147

>>75137

The cheap prices of its commodities are the heavy artillery with which it batters down all Chinese walls, with which it forces the barbarians' intensely obstinate hatred of foreigners to capitulate.


 No.75149

File: d2514aa8005a4c1⋯.png (141.5 KB, 450x320, 45:32, ClipboardImage.png)

>>75137

>>75147

Smuggle money into the country. >>75132


 No.75174

>>75133

>which is already way lower in Cuba

Actually, it is higher due to higher abortion rates. They do not include abortion in their statistics.


 No.75176

>>75133

>who cares if the rest of the country is shit, at least they have good healthcare


 No.75198

File: 2529d8d9211571f⋯.jpg (341.42 KB, 800x600, 4:3, e0f5df160c203535bdab6b973a….jpg)

>>75174

>Infant mortality rate (IMR) is the number of deaths per 1,000 live births of children under one year of age. The rate for a given region is the number of children dying under one year of age, divided by the number of live births during the year, multiplied by 1,000.

Nobody includes abortions in infant mortality rates, nor do they count miscarriages or stillbirth. I know it's embarrassing for you but the USA is in many ways a very backwards country.


 No.75208

>>75198

That's because Cuba aborts any babies that would carry genetic disorders. It's a good way for them to inflate their statistics, especially seeing how much of America still holds onto Christianity.


 No.75210

>>75208

That's like saying it's not fair to compare statistics of dental problems in the USA with Europeans because Europeans regularly brush their teeth.


 No.75211

File: cd8c65db341921c⋯.gif (2.88 MB, 250x255, 50:51, cd8c65db341921cc76d528a1eb….gif)

>>75116

>Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

>not even a historian

Where did he get that statistic


 No.75212

>>75211

Not sure if he formally studied it, but does that matter? I don't think Marx nor Engels formally studied economics.

And yes, there is a source in the book, but I'm on my phone and you can download it just as well. Giving you a page number is more than almost anyone else on a chan would've done.


 No.75214

>>75198

Read between the lines, nigger. Cuba aborts babies forcefully for pretty much any genetic defect pre-birth to keep that number low. The civilized world has the healthcare systems to take care of these children/help them live fulfilling and productive lives. This site wouldn't exist if Hotwheels had been born in Cuba because the government would have forced his abortion.


 No.75216

>>75210

No it doesn't you fucktard. One is state-mandated, the other isn't.


 No.75218

>>75210

That might be valid if Vermin Supreme was president, but even ignoring that you're being an edgy little cunt, brushing your teeth isn't mandated by the state.


 No.75224

>>75218

Are you claiming that the Cuban state is mandating abortions?


 No.75226

>>75224

When a doctor not recommending abortion is grounds for imprisonment in Cuba, you tell me. The Cubans have one of the highest abortion rates in the world/had THE highest abortion rate in the world back in the 70s. They hide most of the abortion statistics under the guise of "menstrual regulation" which can be performed up to 5 weeks into pregnancy on-demand from children as young as twelve. The state propaganda enforces the idea of abortion as a means of contraception, has quotas, and imprisons doctors who speak out about it. It was documented in the 90s by doctors working undercover that when children were born with birth defects, Cuban doctors would suffocate the child with a paper sack/pretend the child was never born so they wouldn't have to list it in their statistics. You can't even claim it's about contraception in Cuba when Chile has enforced similar contraception programs (aside from abortion) and has a relatively low abortion rate.


 No.75232

>>75214

Hotwheels said in a post a few years back that he'd rather have been dead than born a cripple.

>>75226

Isn't that a eugenics program?


 No.75235

>>75232

Hotwheels was drunk as shit and shitposting on /pol/ that a world with eugenics might be happier. I was in that thread. Was still leaning towards paleocon with some libertarian tendencies at the time.


 No.75237

>>74482

Freedom to whore yourself out to rich gringos in casinos, brothels, resorts and sugar plantations? No thanks. Cuba does ten times better than all the other capitalist shitholes in the Caribbean.

>democracy

Cuba has a grassroot democracy bub

>low taxes

lmao, Cuba has practically no income tax because it's a socialist economy. DPRK has zero taxes and weed, why don't you move there?


 No.75238

>>74484

lmao, have you seen the recent CIA leaks? They tried that multiple times already, turned out no Cuban wanted to do that


 No.75242

>>75235

Didn't Hotshit say he wanted eugenics so that no one would give birth to mutants like him anymore?


 No.75253

>>75237

>DPRK has zero taxes and weed, why don't you move there?

This has to be some level of bait right? It's an authoritarian rule over there.


 No.75255

File: 014536a1c67a70d⋯.jpg (133.35 KB, 900x493, 900:493, multi_photo_2017-10-31_dn4….jpg)

File: 6593298601d59c0⋯.jpeg (37.77 KB, 479x307, 479:307, images (1).jpeg)

File: 872a1def1d351c5⋯.jpg (231.54 KB, 900x548, 225:137, multi_photo_2017-10-31_dn4….jpg)

File: 899949d313205b5⋯.jpg (166.38 KB, 900x555, 60:37, multi_photo_2017-07-29_dn3….jpg)

>>75253

I'm 100% serious. Capital and the law of value are authoritarian. Both personally, as it enforces the rule of an elite few over the means of production enforced by a police apparatus, and abstract as in the value form and the production of commodities.

In the DPRK, the productive forces are owned by the Korean people and produce according to their needs and necessities. It has a workplace democracy so enterprises are democratically managed. Councils and proletarian democratic institutions ensure a people's democracy. There is unemployment because the labor market is abolished. Living spaces and consumer items are distributed amongst all citizens according to quantity and quality.


 No.75257

>>75226

This, guys?

>>75232

>Hotwheels said in a post a few years back that he'd rather have been dead than born a cripple.

There's plenty of healthy people who would say they rather would've never been born, and plenty of cripples that would disagree. Hasn't Hotwheels converted to Christianity a while back? That might have changed his mind a little bit.

>>75237

>Freedom to whore yourself out to rich gringos in casinos, brothels, resorts and sugar plantations? No thanks.

Better to whore yourself out in gulags, I guess.

>Cuba has a grassroot democracy bub

Yes, it's trash, exactly.

>lmao, Cuba has practically no income tax because it's a socialist economy.

People get robbed bad enough already, even without the income tax. It's kind of the purpose of socialism to rob people.

>>75255

>In the DPRK, the productive forces are owned by the Korean people and produce according to their needs and necessities. It has a workplace democracy so enterprises are democratically managed. Councils and proletarian democratic institutions ensure a people's democracy. There is unemployment because the labor market is abolished. Living spaces and consumer items are distributed amongst all citizens according to quantity and quality.

Which is why so many refugees risk their life leaving the country? It's always like that. The Vietnamese crossed the ocean on rafts to escape the vile red hordes. The GDR built a wall and then set up a killzone to prevent people from escaping. North Korea might just as well seal itself into a giant glass bubble, it's so isolated. Because Red Vietnam, the GDR, and now North Korea are such fun, happy places? Fuck off.


 No.75258

File: 0e0db11e4d5033a⋯.jpg (59.06 KB, 800x530, 80:53, Part-HKG-Hkg10184726-1-1-0.jpg)

>>75257

>Better to whore yourself out in gulags, I guess.

What's the prison population of Cuba in % compared with the US? Get fucked yourself.

>Yes, it's trash, exactly.

Why? What's so bad about people democratically managing their communities and workplaces? It's surely less alienating than being a cog in the capitalist machine. Go there and talk to people.

>People get robbed bad enough already, even without the income tax. It's kind of the purpose of socialism to rob people.

Robbed of what exactly? What did people have before the Cuban Revolution? Again, an AnCap defending the property or a few casino and plantation owners over the vast majority of the population.

>Which is why so many refugees risk their life leaving the country?

Because South Korea is objectively the richer country with a great access to modern consumer goods, video games, fashion, etc? Besides North Koreans often get promised gold and honey in South Korea, which obviously isn't true, a few want to go back:

http://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/e_northkorea/799215.html

https://archive.fo/4E6mS

Of course, if the sanctions on oil would end, North Koreans could actually have a diverse diet, run all their factories and leave power on. However, these links also debunk the notions are North Koreans are not allowed to leave. They do travel to China, Vietnam, Indonesia, etc. - if you want North Koreans to see the world tell Western countries to lift their travel ban. If you compare them to another country with the same GDP, a short look at their general living standards and capabilities proves that socialism is the superior system.

>The GDR built a wall and then set up a killzone to prevent people from escaping

First off, the FRG tried to deliberately drain them of brain power and labor power, secondly it was totally normal to get a certification to leave the country in the GDR, most applications were granted. Was it much easier for an American citizen to travel to the USSR? I would expect not. The GDR was not necessarily worse than the FRG, it had a higher growth rate. It just got fucked over with reparations and didn't get the Marshal Plan gibs.


 No.75266

>>75258

>What's the prison population of Cuba in % compared with the US?

Boy, you bring this shit up again? As I told the ansoc that did it last time, we don't support the prison state in the US, nor is the prison state in any way a capitalist or libertarian invention, so your tu quoque entirely misses the point.

>Why? What's so bad about people democratically managing their communities and workplaces? It's surely less alienating than being a cog in the capitalist machine.

If they don't own the damn thing, then they have no business democratically managing the damn thing either. You don't get something for nothing, not in nature, and not in society, unless you're a parasite.

>Go there and talk to people.

One of the most fulfilled guys I know is a worker. Turns out he really enjoys fixing things. Is he still a prophet of yours, or do you only accept the Revelation from workers that agree with you?

>Robbed of what exactly? What did people have before the Cuban Revolution?

Freedom.

>Again, an AnCap defending the property or a few casino and plantation owners over the vast majority of the population.

Where did I say that the property of the small guy may be violated at will? Or do you imply that there were no property owners in Cuba, except for rich capitalists? If so, back this claim up.

>Because South Korea is objectively the richer country with a great access to modern consumer goods, video games, fashion, etc?

And why can't the north compete? It used to be more developed than the south in the past.

>Of course, if the sanctions on oil would end, North Koreans could actually have a diverse diet, run all their factories and leave power on.

North Korea had half a century to build healthy trade relations with Russia, China, and dozens of other communist states. In that time, it easily could've created a powerful economy, if communism was working properly. That did not happen. Half a century of communism and capitalism being at a stalemate, so that capitalist countries could not just cut off North Korea - which has a wide border with China and a decent coastline - from its communist allies, and you're telling me it's embargos that are to blame for the plight of North Korea?

>However, these links also debunk the notions are North Koreans are not allowed to leave. They do travel to China, Vietnam, Indonesia, etc.

Not really. They don't show that this is not just a special privilege granted to a few. Or at least the first link doesn't, the second one isn't working. The one functioning link is not contradicted at all by the accounts of refugees that I've read.

>if you want North Koreans to see the world tell Western countries to lift their travel ban.

The western world takes in refugees from North Korea, but wouldn't allow travellers? Yeah, sure.

>First off, the FRG tried to deliberately drain them of brain power and labor power, secondly it was totally normal to get a certification to leave the country in the GDR, most applications were granted. Was it much easier for an American citizen to travel to the USSR? I would expect not.

They shot people trying to cross the border. The FRG didn't. You're telling me they did it because the escapees had no valid certificate? They shoot people over missing certificates and that's supposed to exonerate them? Can't you come up with better apologetics?

>The GDR was not necessarily worse than the FRG, it had a higher growth rate. It just got fucked over with reparations and didn't get the Marshal Plan gibs.

Yes, for almost fifty years. Rain always falls on the communist, I know that already. Bad harvests cause famines in Russia and China, but no dust bowl would ever happen in America.


 No.75269

File: 99ece9ef8d172bc⋯.gif (521.36 KB, 480x228, 40:19, 29399e2623c9118117313a2b22….gif)

>>75255

>In the DPRK, the productive forces are owned by the Korean people and produce according to their needs and necessities. It has a workplace democracy so enterprises are democratically managed. Councils and proletarian democratic institutions ensure a people's democracy. There is unemployment because the labor market is abolished. Living spaces and consumer items are distributed amongst all citizens according to quantity and quality.

TOP KEK! Are you a newfag? You're not fooling anyone with that bs propaganda.


 No.75281

>>75258

>What's the prison population of Cuba in % compared with the US?

Perhaps you forgot about the criminal exodus from Cuba in 1980? Also, why would Cuba imprison dissidents and it is far cheaper to banish them or have them killed?


 No.75376

>>75212

I can't download the Anti-Com propaganda piece right now, it would be easier if you just give me his citation.


 No.75389

>>75376

Alright, got access to my harddrive now. Here's the footnote:

>Cf. N. S. Timasheff, "On the Russian Revolution," The Review of Politics, Vol. 4, No.3, July 1942, also citing Sir Bernard Pares, The Fall of the Russian Monarchy, London, 1939. Writes Timasheff, "The Russian peasants had received at the time of the liberation of the serfs more than half of the arable soil of Russia, namely 148 million hectares (versus 89 million which remained the property of the landlords and 8 million which were the property of the State). Half a century later, on the eve of World War I, the situation was quite different. Only 44 million hectares were still the property of the landlords, the rest, as well as about 6 million hectares of State land had been bought by the peasants." (p. 295) It should be mentioned here that one hectare equals about 2.5 acres. The agrarian situation of Russia before the Revolution can also be gleaned from the article on "Russia, the Agrarian Question," in Encyclopaedia Britannica, 13th edition, vol. 31, pp. 402403.


 No.75392

>>75389

Thanks, I guess I'll look more into it.




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