/k/ - Weapons

you already made a thread you fucking idiot

>>621174

>black eggs

>nubian America

seriously, wtf am I reading?

>>621184

Panels from a comic called Planetary. Issue "Ruling the World".The rest of it is not this good. These two panels are a flashback used to take a drive-by hit on H.P. Lovecraft.

The United States was in no way isolationist. It was already quite involved in WW2 even before war declaration as proven by foreign aid to the Soviet Union and to Nationalist Party-led China as well as volunteers.

>>621216

Isolationism was stone cold dead by WW1.

>>621216

Actually American Lend-Lease was not going directly to the USSR until 1943. The UK was however selling some of the lend lease equipment received from us to the reds because muh eternal Anglo.

No. FDR was doing everything he could to drag the US into the war. He simeltaneously campaigned on keeping America out of the war while meeting with foreign leaders to get America in it.

The better question is what would have happened in Zangara shot him instead of the mayor of Chicago.

>>621226

>FDR

He hardly helped things, but he was just walking down the path Woodrow Wilson set out for him. And if we're being completely honest, it was the other Roosevelt that really got us got us started with that interventionism shit, but people like to give him a pass because of memes.

>>621226

>FDR was doing everything he could to drag the US into the war.

He went so far as to say the attack on Pearl Harbor was a complete surprise when it wasn't, and information was withheld to make losses more severe. That crippled bastard fucked us over.

>>621229

If you really want to blame someone, blame Grover Cleveland for involving us in Hawaii, or William McKinley for involving the US in war with Spain. Or hell, depending on how far you want to go with this, blame William Seward for buying Alaska, or Thomas Jefferson for making the Louisiana Purchase.

>>621267

All defensible actions under the Monroe Doctrine and justifiable by Manifest Destiny, however. Hawaii is a little shaky in that regard though.

>>621174

Nah, probably would have still shipped materials to the USSR, leading to Hitler's buttrage and declaration of war. Maybe Japan gets out of it in better shape.

>>621229

Memes AND Conservationism.

>>621269

Hawaii was a strict and obvious security purchase. It was either that or let the Brits have it. And that would have been just a little too far.

>>621174

>isolationist

I'm given to understand that the United States just wasn't getting involved in the war, and had comparatively permissive immigration policies before and between the World Wars, and retained fairly open trade policies even after the World Wars. If this is the case, this suggests that United States' foreign policy would be more accurately described as "non-interventionist", rather than "isolationist", as isolationism indicates a concentrated effort to separate one's nation from the outside world in terms of economic, population, and cultural exchange. I got the same public school history lectures as everyone else, but in retrospect the idea that the US was isolationist seems suspect, based at least on my current understanding of the policies at the time.

Hell no, if Japan hadn't have attacked Pearl Harbor then someone would've just set up another Lusitania incident.

>>621272

That's the meme. No one will criticize the man because "le based nature tough guy, speak softly and carry big dicks XDDD"

>>621324

real talk, are you le sourkraut mutt spammer?

Just wondering why all of you seem to come from Germany or if it's still just you

>>621309

Eh, I’d say national parks and the pure food and drug act counterbalance the Roosevelt corollary. Sort of like how old lefties who think Richard Nixon is the devil at least admit that the Environmental Protection Agency and the policy of Detente were still good.

I'm just confused as to why we these threads haven't been merged.

The us provoked pearl harbour

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Orange

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_note

The US had designed a detailed plan with a number of measures to provoke Japan into hostilities. They implemented them one by one, and it appeared the plan was successful.

>>623659

>the fact war plan green is a thing proves the US is going to annex Mexico

>>623659

Yeah, the US also provoked that war with Canada because of plan red.

Also

>be nip monkeys

>attack China

>attack France

>attack Britain

>attack Holland

>US imposes sanctions considering they're currently supporting those nations in Europe against Germany, which Japan knew

>"GRRRRRRR NO! YOU CAN'T DO THIS! BANZAI DA SHIPS!"

>>621226

This.

>>624030

You are going emotional and try to put judgement on countries actions like you in court or something.

US went on pass of confrontation with Japan and you don't need 170IQ to figure out that may lead to war. War? Fine. Bu then don't call yourself isolationists. Also US with one hand sanctioned Japan but with another hand didn't make efforts to increase operational readiness of the military and dismissed sings of Japanese coming strike. Its like US were asking for such strike (and they did) because its perfect excuse to break isolationists political standing).

>>624205

If you liberated Indonesia from eurocucks how comes they are still muslim?

>>624228

I guess only an anglo believes in a liberation of colonies and then not doing anything in order to lose his empire, whiteness and become a totalitarian shithole where pakis rape kids while police beats up parents who have the audacity to not want their kids raped (^:

>>624228

>Viet-Minh

wow why would a pro china pro communist group hate japan

>AFO

who

we had the burmese, javanese, wang jingwei, taiwanese, korean and filipinos fight along side us in ww2 willingly

siam even allied themselves with us

>declaring war over a bit of paper and not the economic sanctions

imagine being so retarded you equate what is basically telling a country you will go to war with them as a simple piece of paper

Tojo never wanted to attack pearl harbour but he was forced, his wife's diary confirms that

"I believe the Great Asian War should have been fought by Indonesians for the independence. If we had arms, we would have fought against Dutch, but Japan did for us. It was such an extraordinary war."

- Mohammad Natsir, the former prime minister, 1946

"It was thanks to Japan that all nations of Asia gained independence. For Mother Japan, it was a difficult birth which resulted in much suffering, yet her children are growing up quickly to be healthy and strong. Who was it that enabled the citizens of the nations of Southeast Asia to gain equal status alongside the United States and Britain today? It is because Japan, who acted like a mother to us all, carried out acts of benevolence towards us and performed feats of self-sacrifice. December 8th is the day when Mother Japan – who taught us this important lesson – laid her life on the line for us, after making a momentous decision and risking her own well-being for our sake. Furthermore, August 15th is the day when our beloved and revered mother was frail and ailing. Neither of these two days should ever be forgotten."

- Kukrit Pramoj, the former and the first civilian prime minister in Thailand, 1973

​

"All South East Asian nation had overcame great challenges and succeeded. We no longer need to suffer from the inferior complex we once had for centuries. We now believe we had proven our powers, which are given from the Japan's power. If Japan didn't show us what we could, the world today would look different. The north would have been richer, while the south would be even poorer. The European impelialists in the north would have been colonizing the world forever."

- Mahathir bin Mohamad, the current prime minister of Malaysia, 1992

>>624237

blame holland for keep fighting, if they didnt the javanese would have had control

>>624317

>pro china

>viet minh

wot. The Viet Minh fought the japs because they wanted independence, nothing more, they absolutely despised the Chinks and completely allied themselves with the Russians during the Sino-Soviet split as a result. Ho Chi Minh supported the French return in 1946 simply to keep the chinks out.

>who

Burmese anti-Jap resistance group

>hull note

>basically telling a country you will go to war with them

No? It was a threat of further economic sanctions at most, it didn't mention war or military action at all..

>be nip monkeys

>america sends you a letter telling you to stop attacking everyone

>"GRRR, FUCKING ROUNDEYE, WE SHOW THEM!"

>attack the US

>get nuked

>"m-muh piece of paper means they were gunna declare war on us first, despite there being no evidence of that being the case!"

And even if the note was a threat of war, which it wasn't, you could've I dunno, maybe stopped attacking everyone like America asked?

>quote from a jap puppet proves that Japan's invasions were "liberation"

Yeah, just ignore people like Sutan Sjahrir and Amir Sjarifuddin, who were even supported somewhat by puppets or collaborators like Sukarno.

Japan's invasions removed the colonial powers, and then the allies removed the Japanese occupiers but were too bankrupt to re-colonise, leading to independence in many nations, but that doesn't mean that it was Japan's goal or aim. Japan had no intention to liberate and give independence to all of the countries it was invading, it just happened as a by-product of Japan getting BTFO.

>>624237

They've always been hajis. The muds didn't just go westward to wreck shit, they also went east too.

>>624327

Viet minh was founded in china and reformed into the ICP

>Ho Chi Minh supported the french

thats the point

>Burmese anti-Jap resistance group

never heard of them, the burmese helped us fight you

>No? It was a threat of further economic sanctions at most, it didn't mention war or military action at all..

no it wasnt

>On November 26, 1941, Hull presented the Japanese ambassador with the Hull note,[6] which, as one of its conditions, demanded the complete withdrawal of all Japanese troops from French Indochina and China. Japanese Prime Minister Tojo Hideki said to his cabinet that "this is an ultimatum."[7]

>And even if the note was a threat of war, which it wasn't, you could've I dunno, maybe stopped attacking everyone like America asked?

yes lets pull out of manchuko and let them be ruled by the chinese instead of their independence, lets allow the KMT to slaughter japanese settlers in china

>quote from a jap puppet proves that Japan's invasions were "liberation"

how are any of those people puppets

>Japan's invasions removed the colonial powers, and then the allies removed the Japanese occupiers but were too bankrupt to re-colonise, leading to independence in many nations, but that doesn't mean that it was Japan's goal or aim. Japan had no intention to liberate and give independence to all of the countries it was invading, it just happened as a by-product of Japan getting BTFO.

we literally gave manchuko an emperor

>>624317

>we

Your students aren't "we", ESL-sensei.

>>624595

>posting a boomerpost unironically

>muh war crimes

Let me know once war crime tribunals require evidence for conviction and then we can discuss the subject.

>>623659

Nipanon, it was a bad idea to attack the US no matter what they did. They were years ahead of you and had a much more powerful military.

Imagine if we went up against the US today? We'd get fucking crushed.

>>624654

What was the alternative?

The US would've attacked us, that was the Chinese strategy, to lie about Nanjing to get the US involved because they knew they could not win alone.

>It was considered necessary to lie to it [the United States], to deceive it, to do anything to persuade America. . . . That was the only strategy of the Chinese government. . . .

>>624657

>What was the alternative?

Not attacking the most powerful country on Earth? They wouldn't have gotten involved had you not attacked them. Do you really think they gave a fuck what the Chinese told them?

I know you guys are sensitive over WW2, but for the love of god stop acting like you were blameless victims.

>>624658

and let them attack us?

>They wouldn't have gotten involved had you not attacked them

thats not true

>Do you really think they gave a fuck what the Chinese told them?

yes they did which is why they imposed sanctions and why americans were in nanjing

a us diplomat even went to nanjing

>I know you guys are sensitive over WW2, but for the love of god stop acting like you were blameless victims.

what do you think about germany?

>it's a Japan acts like it dindu nuffin episode

get nuked fagit

>>624658

That worked really well for germany, so well that Americans dressed up as Germans and attacked themselves.

>>624660

Get turned into brazil, mutt.

>>624659

>yes they did which is why they imposed sanctions and why americans were in nanjing

They put sanctions on Japan because it was invading other countries.

>what do you think about germany?

We weren't blameless in the war at all, no matter what NEETSocs will claim.

If we did not invade Poland, Hitler would have been able to hold some kind of peace with the rest of Europe and the NSDAP might even still exist as a legitimate party.

>>624663

>They put sanctions on Japan because it was invading other countries.

so america did care

that also doesnt explain why they sent diplomats to nanjing

>>624664

>so america did care

Not enough to invade, what did you think the result of bombing the US would be anyway? Did Japan think America would sit there and take it up the ass? You cannot twist this into a logic process where Pearl Harbor made tactical sense, it was almost entirely Japanese hubris.

>>624665

except there was the hull note

>what did you think the result of bombing the US would be anyway?

obviously war with them, but war was inevitable

>>624657

>What was the alternative?

I don't know, but attacking them certainly wasn't a good idea.

Not even Hitler was suicidal enough do that, and taking into account Germany's military was much better than yours.

>>624667

so there was no alternative

if you know you are going to have to eventually fight a country why not use surprise to your advantage

>>624668

What about the alternative of just not declaring war on one of the most powerful nations in the world?

>>624670

and let them declare war on us?

>>624672

>implying they were going to do that

>>624672

You seriously overestimate how much the US cared about Japan.

>but the diplomat!

Diplomats aren't a rare and valuable resource. The US has thousands of them and they're sent out to do things all the time.

>>624673

they were

>>624675

And how are you sure of that?

>>624676

orange plan and hull note

>>624674

yeah they clearly didnt care at all which is why the orange plan and the hull note exists

>>624677

>muh orange plan

The US has war plans against pretty much every country on earth, doesn't mean they're actually going to invade them. Look up the list of US colour-coded war plans.

>hull note

The Hull note wasn't a declaration of war, it wasn't even an ultimatum either, when Japan offered a counteroffer to the Hull plan, the US wrote up their own counteroffer to said counteroffer and was about to send it, but Japanese war plans against the US were leaked. so they cancelled it.

>On November 20, 1941, Nomura presented Proposal B, which offered to withdraw Japanese forces from southern Indochina if the United States agreed to end aid to the Nationalist Chinese, freeze military deployments in Southeast Asia (except for Japan's reinforcement of northern Indochina), provide Japan with "a required quantity of oil," and assist Japan in acquiring materials from the Dutch East Indies.[3] The United States was about to make a counteroffer to this plan, which included a monthly supply of fuel for civilian use. However, President Franklin D. Roosevelt received a leak of Japan's war plan and news that Japanese troopships were on their way to Indochina. He then decided that the Japanese were not being sincere in their negotiations and instructed Secretary Hull to drop the counterproposal.[4]

The US would have pandered to Japan and given you free fuel, but you sperged out and attacked them instead, leading to you getting nuked. Great going.

>>624679

>The Hull note wasn't a declaration of war, it wasn't even an ultimatum either, when Japan offered a counteroffer to the Hull plan, the US wrote up their own counteroffer to said counteroffer and was about to send it, but Japanese war plans against the US were leaked. so they cancelled it.

yeah lets just withdraw our troops

>The US would have pandered to Japan and given you free fuel, but you sperged out and attacked them instead, leading to you getting nuked. Great going.

>believing wikipedia

tojo himself never wanted to attack the us, he was forced

>>624681

Withdrawing troops is a better alternative to having your entire country destroyed militarily, economically and culturally as well as being irradiated.

>he was forced

By what?

>>624682

by the hull note

it was more than just withdrawing troops it basically meant the death of japan

>Even contemporary historians could think that 'as for the present war, the Principality of Monaco, the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg, would have taken up arms against the United States on receipt of such a note.

>Withdrawing troops is a better alternative to having your entire country destroyed militarily, economically and culturally as well as being irradiated.

this is why your people surrendered

>Their purpose, therefore, in going to war was largely dictated by security

-Douglas McArthur

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanaka_Memorial

Roosevelt himself has wished for "extermination of the Japanese"

>>624705

Is that true? FDR sounds like one fucking evil son of bitch.

>>624706

yes its true, he had a bias against japan and was pro china

he said this about the chinese

>I always feel familiar with them

>>621226

This.

>>624766

>This is much better considering nuances if US internal politics

do you really think americans of all people would do something about their president going to war with a country?

they have done it so many other times and no one cares, both parties do it too

>Bad plays of warmongers could means that they would lose popularity, elections and war goes away.

because warmongering has been something americans are against

>Ignore burgers even at the cost of casualties

so let us be attacked by america and not fight back?

>This is the message for US voters.

us voters always vote for the same party, both parties are puppets of judea

>>624979

>US was divided 50 - 50 on interventionism topic

>US was already divided and conquered

>Implying americans had anything to say after federal reserve act

>>624977

>hiding flag

ni hao チャンコロ

>>624979

>Of course they do. US was divided 50 - 50 on interventionism topic.

and you think those people would have done anything?

look at how many americans want to get rid of trump

but they cant do anything as they dont have the power

the ones with the power wanted the war

>>625116

>look at how many americans want to get rid of trump

>but they cant do anything as they dont have the power

Really? look how all his initiatives are shot down. He cant even stop Mexicans from crossing the borders and soon all his staff will face "subpoena cannon" and then jail for treason. Biggest enemy of US are Americans themselves.

Now compare this to support of Bush warmongering initiatives after 911 false flag.

>>625289

Trump is being cockblocked by the deep state (and his own idiocy and narcissism). If the same deep state wanted to end immigration from there they could set up the necessary policies, or at least stop the president (whoever he might be at the time) from letting any more of them in.

>>625289

yet he is still the president

>Now compare this to support of Bush warmongering initiatives after 911 false flag.

that just helps my point, the americans didnt do anything about bush or obama

>>625384

>yet he is still the president

Whose presidency goes nowhere. America is divided and therefore weak. Pearl Harbor and 911 were acts which united America.

>>621219

You're joking right? It was dead before that, it died with the USS Maine.

>>621226

>The better question is what would have happened in Zangara shot him instead of the mayor of Chicago.

Hopefully, Huey Long and Monsignor Charles Coughlin would be elected President and Vice-President. Every man would be made a king, the Fed would be destroyed, and we would have an actually neutral, if not somewhat Axis-aligned, America.

How is having a military base in the south pacific isolationist?